Thanks to Octopus for letting us be some of the first media people to come film here, if you want to learn more or signup go to octopus.energy/blog/heat-pump-revolution/ if your not an octopus customer check out my website for the best deals around and find a link to split a £100 signup with me evnick.com/energy

As well as long commentary, why couldn't we be taken around these two houses to see the internal design of radiators fitted in each room that would give a realistic view of what would be needed to provide a comfortable temperature to live with and how hot water would be provided.

Great video - it’s a shame so many properties are still being built which will need retrofitting very soon.

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

Indeed! It’s time we stop fitting gas and start fitting heat pumps it’s also time all New builds are 3 phase as standard to help local grid balancing

@edc1569

2 жыл бұрын

We should at least be installing wet heating systems that can be converted to heat-pumps, target a 45°C flow temperature, install a hot water cylinder, your gas boiler will be operating at peak efficiency and the conversion to heat-pump will be no drama.

@JoeFoster

2 жыл бұрын

Just down the road from me a large housing association has built new flats. Each one has its own boiler it would appear. They appear to have made it incredibly difficult to it heat pumps (you’d have to have one of those boxes on every flats wall, and it’s three stories high. It’s to be frank, a bit criminal if I’m right, I hope I’m not

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

@@JoeFoster other solutions for flats can be put in, one may be waste heat recovery, or central bore hole and a shoebox heat pump

@davideyres955

5 ай бұрын

It’s a shame that so many houses are built without really insulating and MVHR systems. It should be mandated as minimum requirement to build. It annoys me that we have a technology like aerogel insulation that is about twice as good a PIR but is not promoted by government where we could see massively efficient houses that don’t even need heating as the thermal efficiency could be enough to trap the heat from appliances sufficiently to heat the rooms. My issue is that I don’t have any space near the house to put a heat pump in. It would have to go at the bottom of the garden behind the garage some 15 odd meters away from the house. Doable but not as efficient as it would be next to the house.

Hi Nick. I stopped using my gas boiler for heating two winters ago, we live in a three bedroom semi in Kent England. We got installed two Air 2 Air systems fitted for £3000, these heat our house in the winter and can cool it in the summer. They just draw the cold air in, compress it and warmer / hot air comes out, they look just like an air condition unit to you and me, no radiators or hot water being pumped around the house, one unit used four units out, simple took two people one day to install.

Great job guys very informative

Great video, be interesting to see how fast they can move the industry forward and what can be done to simplify the installation process to get it down to a more affordable price. Hopefully you will be able to do an update in a couple of years time showing the progress.

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

Couldn't agree more!

We’ve had an ASHP for almost a year now. Our house has both UFH and radiators. Half the house is super insulated with UFH; the other half has double glazing, bog standard attic and cavity wall insulation and double panelled radiators. Not surprisingly, the optimal weather dependent calibration curve is a compromise because the heat losses vary significantly between the two sides of the house. Nonetheless, our winter COP is still approaching 3.

This just reminds me when the government pushed for Solar and loads of companies jumped on the bandwagon. It’s not a “one size fits all” and the video perhaps needs to highlight this. Instead it talks about a “Utopia”, and the industry needs to set the standards now to stop the many cowboys who I’m sure will enter this market based on “hype”. We definitely need to move in this direction but in a controlled way

It is good to see Octopus are training engineers and developing new methods for installing electric heat pump systems. What annoys me is the Government want to phase out gas boilers, yet are happy to allow 200,000 houses to be built each year heated by gas boilers which will all have to be retrofitted later. Talk about trying to fill the bath without putting the plug in! All new build houses should be fitted with heat pumps, solar panels and EV charge points. Much more cost effective than trying to retrofit later.

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

Agreed Macolm the ban at 2030 however will force developments to meet this but agreed should force now for new builds

@edc1569

2 жыл бұрын

Worse they are all fitted out with combi's where are we going to put all these water cylinders!?

At first I thought of Richard Ayoade when he visited the Tiny House with Jimmy Carr on Gadget Man, but these houses are much bigger . In my area (Southern Ontario) the new housing developments use Natural gas forced air for heating/hot water (gas fireplaces for decoration too), possibly gas appliances too, but also have Air Conditioning units. All new underground electric utilities. It would not a problem to increase the electrical load a bit for each house. Our Utility is busy expanding the electrical supply to the village because of the growth.

The term 'Engineer' is really abused in the UK.

Interesting video about heat pumps thanks. Sad to say I can't see heat pump prices coming down or heat pump usage going up to match gas boilers in the near to medium term without greater subsidies and price management. Subsidies have the unfortunate effect of encouraging heat pump manufacturers and installers to inflate their prices. I know this because I insisted on a detailed cost breakdown for my heat pump installation. I was lucky enough to get mine while the previous RHI grant was available. The all up cost of my 11.2kW installation (which replaced a 22kW boiler) was £15k, less a grant of £9k payable over 7 years, so cash flow is an issue. Frustratingly the new reduced grant of only £5k will take us a big step backwards unless manufacturers and installers dramatically reduce their prices! To really sell heat pumps one needs to focus primarily on the greatly improved performance and the astonishing reduction in energy usage, not de-carbonisation. My new heat pump has more than met our heating requirements, even down to many degrees below zero, yet consumes only around 4,000kWh pa compared to around 21,000kWh pa by my previous gas installation. That is potentially a huge game changer in terms of reducing our dependence on fossil fuels from unpredictable sources, and to help us get to net zero. The government must manage the price of gas so it increases faster than electricity

@stephenbrown4615

Жыл бұрын

Just got a quote from Octopus for a 5 bed detached house and after the BUS %k grant is £6100, so they have succeeded in driving prices down, much better value than other retailers charging 10k + after the grant and always looking to add on extras

That’s assuming that one can afford both the cost and disruption in fitting this technology. I can, but I’m sure there are lots of people young and old with large mortgages that would find it prohibitively expensive. The vast proportion of our housing stock is very old and poorly insulated, then there are all the apartments to consider both private and council. It’s a huge task that I believe will take tens of years or more to resolve and I don’t think heat pumps hold all the answers.

Talking about the actual expense of fuel vs. artificially cheapened. In Canada, the cost of gas heating in a small cottage style bungalow(one floor) is about 95-115 quid per month.

All the explanations given in this video are correct and well worth switching away from Gas to renewable electricity supplied technologies but one other main reason to is for Energy Security. We won’t be at the mercy of Russian politics in future if we can support our own energy needs if we use these technologies to heat and cool our houses and businesses but also running EV’s instead of relying on oil to refine from other volatile countries like Russia, Saudi etc. Small outlay for huge possible savings but definitely helping the Climate and pockets at same time. Well done Octopus Energy. 🐙 💚🙏👏👏👏

@wobby1516

2 жыл бұрын

That’s assuming that one can afford both the cost and disruption in fitting this technology. I can, but I’m sure there are lots of people young and old with large mortgages that would find it prohibitively expensive. The vast proportion of our housing stock is very old and poorly insulated, then there are all the apartments to consider both private and council. It’s a huge task that I believe will take tens of years or more to resolve and I don’t think heat pumps hold all the answers.

@kinross24

2 жыл бұрын

@@wobby1516 some will qualify for Green Deals and grants

@eliotmansfield

2 жыл бұрын

And pray tell me what CCGT ‘gas’ turbines run on - pixie farts? Just because electricity isn’t burning gas at the point of consumption - it’s still used heavily in the winter when we need the most energy

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

Eliot as you say we run lots of CCGT gas turbines and thats increased more as we more to juggle renewals on the grid due to quick start ups and that spinning energy however it will be reduced over and over again.

Anyone know much about the Vattenfal hot flow heat pumps? They are not yet available but if the article I read was true, they produce outflow water hot enough to work traditional radiator systems. So potentially you just replace your existing boiler when it fails.

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

These unit won’t have great co efficiency running hot your also find lots of houses can run heat pump with minor tweaks

@mrhignettshorses

2 жыл бұрын

@@NicolasRaimo True, but there are millions of homes needing upgrading for current heat pumps to work. Don't let the perfect become the enemy of the good.

First! Heat pumps great for suitable homes. Proponents of heat pumps need a reality check though. We need to know: How many existing homes can use them How many cannot use them How many can use them with costly modifications. Are there enough installers How good is the surveying and what performance guarantees are in place? Are there enough builders to improve the house insulation, lower high ceilings etc.. Is CO2 build up a concern? Are there enough actual heat pumps to meet demand Energy and resource cost to manufacture the heat pumps Can households afford this as many household have no spare cash, being permanently in debt living month to month. Are they guaranteed to work in the depth of winter. Summary: In the right house fine. Otherwise..be worried and very cautious.

@hughmarcus1

2 жыл бұрын

Definitely Jeremy, In lots f areas of the UK & Ireland air source just isn't suitable. The other big factor is the pumps themselves. As a leading heat pump engineer said to me recently, "Most air source heat pumps are little more than glorified air con units" He showed me the unit his company sold. It was massive & a totally different design to most of what's on the market. I asked him directly, if there's a choice would he recommend either air or ground source. He replied "If there's land available, no question, its ground source. He explained the issues around icing up in the winter etc. The other thing that's not being addressed is the sheer inefficiency of our housing stock. You are frankly testing the laws of physics if you think a ordinary heat pump can run steel radiators in an older brick house that's got a lot of heat loss. As I'm typing this, I hear the Octopus rep trotting out the old (very tired) comparison with Scandinavia & their colder climate. What he either doesn't know (or isn't saying) is that although the air in northern Europe is colder it's also much drier. The issue isn't the coldness is the amount of moisture in the air. Unless you've been in those countries you don't understand.

@xxwookey

2 жыл бұрын

@@hughmarcus1 Yeah he did gloss over the wet/dry air thing (and quite a lot of other details). But it still works here if you pick the right kit. You just lose some efficiency. On average the GSHPs in the 2013 EST study were only 15% better SPF(h4) (all pumping and ancilliary energy included). I'd love to see all our terrible buildings retrofitted to 50kWh/m2/y or better, but it's probably more effective from a decarbonisation POV to just put loads of ASHPs in and retrofit at our leisure (even though people could have much smaller heat pumps if the retrofit was done first).

The reason why these two houses were built inside another building was not discussed. If they were solely for training then they could have been built outside like any other house. I understand that Octopus wanted to create a controlled test environment for heat pumps

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

Idea is to train Engineers on all aspects of heat pumps these houses being inside means no matter the weather they can be trained all year round

I sat and worked some figures out, each radiator in my home is roughly 1.7 kw so if I have to double them each one would be 3.4 kw, so 13 radiators x3.4 is 44kw output needed to maintain my heat. They claim that it’s 3kw output for 1kw going in so rounding up needs 15kw per hour to run so that’s two systems to generate this , cost over 25k install , and this is a quote I had but the missing part, they have to run 24/7 to run so 15kw per hour at .20 per unit of electricity so that’s £3 per hour x24 hours running £72 per day, £504 per weeks 2k per month so five months average heating 10k , so how do I save here compared to my current gas of £500 for the same period and £300 for electricity?

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

Hey Dazza not all systems would need bigger rads, also the first port of call is to insulate the home to modern standards.. the rads need to maintain a 30kw flow rate it’s cheaper as 3kw power in gives 9kw power… they do large and systems and small systems ones in this example will do an average 3 bed home built in 1990 as they are insulated to a good level

I have doubts about those two houses being 48% of the housing stock. Maybe so in the South of England. Check the stats for housing stock in High Peak. BTW 10mm is one of the microbore sizes. I'm very interested in xSHP, but having looked at both I think G wins over A (for x) technically. Of course W is better but most of us don't have a lake or river running though our garden.

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

Hi robin they are a mix of housing stock so microbore and insulated between the 2 they make a mix of that amount of housing stock

@robinedwards218

2 жыл бұрын

Hi Nick, Perhaps a stone built house would be a good addition, probably address 50%+ of Northern housing. The stuff that really needs sorting.

Have you considered every home in the uk running electric without restrictions like load limiting appliances.

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

National grid already said they can deal with all cars going electric they can also deal with homes doing the same, don't forget heatpumps can store heat in tanks to be used later so can flex with the grid which is what octopus will be doing

I beg to have a difference of opinion on the relative costs of Elec & Gas. Elec prices in this country are disproportionately inflated due to the price of Gas. Given that now in Jan 2024 the amount annually of sources of Elec are around 40% renewables - (Wind, Solar, Hydro, Nuclear, Geo Thermal) then it is wrong for Ofgem to link the price of Elec to that of Gas. The True cost of Elec to the consumer should reflect the blend of sources and should be more like 18p to 20p per Kwh. I can't believe that UK Gas is being subsidised as mentioned in the Interview. The price for Natural Gas is mostly based on the International Market Price. If anything Ofgem is currently charging way over the odds for gas as 1 Therm is equiv of approx 29Kw so at 71p per them - that should be a base price 2.5p per Gas Kw rather than the current 7p+.

@12:02...ah, the good old days when you could heat a house for £30 a month, those days are gone - £30 a week more like for winter 2022.

Yes fantastic figures but are they reality in winter months. Also can i fit your heat pump straight into my home replacing the boiler. Do your heat pump can give me between 60 to 80 degrees heat like my boiler supplies me. Or will I need to spend thousands before a heat pump can be installed. Can my very large homes single phase supply 2 ev chargers 1 large heat pump. As well as my other equipment.

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

Hey Gino, Octopus will be targeting homes firstly that are like the 2 examples we see built... newish building stock with hot water tanks and good level of insulation, requiring maybe only a couple of rad upgrades... Next will be older house stock to boosting levels on insulation so you don't need such high flow temps to run the system. I used to run my gas boiler at temps your suggesting turned it down to 40c and saved 18% off my gas bill and my home is just as warm just requires it to run for longer but longer running has resulted in paying less and making the boiler not work as hard see my video here for tips on cutting your gas usage kzread.info/dash/bejne/iJ-tzqeecqXLoqg.html

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

PS a 12kw heat pump is 12kw of HEAT not 12kw of grid so co of 4 means its about 3-4kw of grid

When they say "similar to gas boiler"... how much is that? on average?

@NicolasRaimo

Жыл бұрын

typical gas boiler replacement £3000-£5000

This efficancy everyone keeps on about is not what it seems on paper. It's the winter that the problem and a standard heat pumps temperature is lower than a boiler. But new high temp heat pumps could be the real awnser to a straight swap over

I've been told retrofitting my home with an overboard wet underfloor heating system with a heat pump might cost me a ton more in electricity than it would with gas. I'm intrigued how this would be the case 🤷‍♂️

@NicolasRaimo

Жыл бұрын

Who’s told you that a gas boiler fitter

@davidw717

Жыл бұрын

Is it true though that a heat pump could cost more to run? @@NicolasRaimo

@NicolasRaimo

Жыл бұрын

@@davidw717 without knowing what your paying for electric or how old and leaky your house is it’s hard to say but if your in an insulated home rule of thumb is 1kw electric = 4kw or heat so if you pay 35p a unit in electric divide it by 4 so just under 9p a kwh of heat your boiler will be 1kw of gas in for at total best 90% efficiency so a loss of heat from 1kw so 0.90kw or heat so if your paying 8p for gas it be same price

The control cards look as though there is plenty to go wrong !!

A few points of note.. 1) What you failed to address is that the average property in the UK is not insulated anywhere close to that of a Scandinavian building so just simply replacing the gas boiler for a heat pump would cost you way more in electric than what you would be currently paying for gas, also in terms of initial outlay... 2) The guy just brushed over and gave a typical wishy-washy politician style answer when asked about the cost of one of these things. 3) IMO, it would be far more beneficial to look at retaining the heat you have rather than finding a more a efficient way to produce more heat to account for what you are losing through your house... So for me personally, I will be riding out my gas boiler until I can afford to get an enerphit retrofit (or equivalent) done and not even need a heat pump. Then I won't be having to fork out for ever increasing bills to heat my home.

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

1) they are not failing to address they plan to target homes that are well insulated first and then moving to harder houses further down the line like boosting insulation 2) he said after grant it be typical cost of a boiler replacement that’s not brushing over it some homes will need updated rads some won’t 3) yes they agree the point is if someone gets a failed gas boiler this means there default decision won’t be fit gas again as we move to 2030 and zero emission

@mrmuds8624

2 жыл бұрын

@@NicolasRaimo you didn't address points 1 and 3, but with regards to 2).. he said that he hopes to get it to parity with a gass boiler install in 2 years time, so that means if I needed to replace replace my boiler with a heat pump today, including the government's 5k contribution, it would e considerably more? He didn't even give a ball park figure. His assumption that the costs will come down overtime is on the basis of economies of scale, but if it's costing considerably more people aren't gonna buy them and the costs won't come into parity for a long long time. What I'm trying to say is, Octopus has an incentive to push these heat pumps as they still want you to continue using electricity. I would much rather the government give me 5k towards getting an enerphit retrofit on my house.

@eliotmansfield

2 жыл бұрын

@@NicolasRaimo But you just dumbly suck the PR piece that he’s pushing rather than challenging him on the data. (i’m an octo customer btw). Agile yesterday never went below 31p - with gas at 5p your blessed heat pump would need to produce 6x more energy - which in the winter is closer to 2x

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

@@eliotmansfield wholesale market current is nuts you only need to turn TV on for that… agile is a wholesale tracker…. The gas price and most peoples electric is capped at the ofgem price cap 🧢 This price cap will increase by over 50% in April so expect gas as high at 10p. There is also a levy as mentioned on electric inflating it’s price where gas is made to look cheaper

@eliotmansfield

2 жыл бұрын

@@NicolasRaimo Agreed - but with Electricity at 30p and gas at 10p which is probably where we will end up - your heat pump needs a cop of 3:1 which they don’t produce when it’s cold. As a country we should focus on heat loss ready for heat pumps [to improve] because even with gas, you would be burning less of it.

The question I’d have, probably more for our government is, why are houses still being built with gas boiler installations, if this is the road we all need to go. It beggars belief that buying a new house now mean I’m caught out for a large bill in a few years time to change it all to a new heat pump system.

Does anyone still use the agile tarrif?

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

Few people do, and remember it’s a wholesale tracker you may find everyone be paying agile rates soon

@mrhignettshorses

2 жыл бұрын

@@NicolasRaimo True, but the vid did seem to be implying that using it and a heat pump would be a good idea.

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

@@mrhignettshorses correct they plan to use variable speeds on motor of the heat pump to varry cost expect more info soon

Will it work with micro bore

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

They are working on some solutions for this, but likely won't be ready till 2023

Interesting. So why would Octopus need me to disconnect solar thermal and several other bewildering conditions before I would go ahead?

@NicolasRaimo

10 ай бұрын

They have set conditions they want for first installs so its easy and repeatable for engineers the longer they do heat pumps the less restrictions will be in place. Not heard about them asking for solar thermal to be removed however

@lawrenceharris1819

10 ай бұрын

@@NicolasRaimo They tell me its a condition for the MCS grant that water is heated by the pump. Bewildering contradictions!

@NicolasRaimo

10 ай бұрын

@@lawrenceharris1819 they mean a condition of the BUS grant so that’s not them causing the issue it’s the way government grant is done. Basically they can do it with your solar thermal but you won’t get the £5000 grant so add 5k to the quote

@lawrenceharris1819

10 ай бұрын

@@NicolasRaimo Yes, I understand. The real problem is that the quote was a one-liner: quote=£xxxx. Nothing else! The two other quotes list every item and the cost of installing it. Not even the HP itself was mentioned, just its installation.

By the time the house is properly insulated and prepared for ASHP it will be a lot cheaper to run on gas too. Until the UK stops generating electricity from gas you just can’t get out of it.

@NicolasRaimo

Жыл бұрын

Gas generator powering the grid right now is 16% of total demand 6000mw wind is 41.4% 15300mw

"Isn't gas really cheap to buy?" (12m10s) Well, that didn't age well

@NicolasRaimo

Жыл бұрын

haha difference just over a year can make

Those markets aren't subsidised, they just aren't penalised, you're advocating to artificially increase the price of gas to households who simply cannot afford to pay

@PabloTBrave

Жыл бұрын

Of course they are , the channel is like that, everyone should buy a new EV and we will price out and persecute ice cars, this ideology only work if you can afford to replace your car In the first place Otherwise it's gleefully administering great suffering on the poor advocated by the well off. .

Heat pumps and the installation is far to expensive. Takes years to payback the setting up cost. Also the maintenance cost is higher than gas boilers if you can find an engineer to come out. Except in very cold weather they are more efficient than gas boilers but the electricity to run them still has to come from somewhere This mainly comes from gas powered generation! So the overall efficiency taking into account gas generation and transmission losses is no better than using gas boilers.

Convince me with real life installs and costs of installs

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

April 2023 first installs booked

Who would have anticipated the massive rise in fuel prices since this video was made? As a side issue, some local authority areas are experimenting with hydrogen technologies in domestic settings, including Fife's H100 project. In the project’s first phase, the hydrogen network will heat around 300 local homes using clean gas produced by a dedicated 5 MW electrolysis plant, powered by a nearby offshore wind turbine.

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

Even with price rises heat pumps make sense 1kw in 4kw out and sometimes even 5 or 6... If you then realise you can alternate the heat pump with cheap electric it just saves more money... however lets do it at current prices 7.5p for gas per kwh 30p for electric per kwh On this a heat pump is same cost to run, however I can get 7.5p electric at night between 00:30-4:30 meaning the average cost comes right down, then add in the fact I can self generate power via solar and store that solar in a battery or store hot water in a tank it just makes MORE and MORE sense

No one seems to have mentioned noise levels. Imagine a row of terraced houses each with AHP’s running 24/7. They will get noisier over time too as motors wear & fans vibrate! Electric is so versatile for powering electronic equipment, motors etc,….whereas, gas is useful for heating only!

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

Didn't mention the noise levels as all the heat pump they had running made no noise, in fact I didn't believe they where on till I put my hand Infront of them, both the ones in shot are powered on

@MrBinabanana

2 жыл бұрын

People who moan incorrectly that ASHPs are noisy also seem to forget that gas boilers have motors, fans and pumps in them as well, which wear and get noisy. If you neglect any mechanical equipment, it becomes a problem.

Not all properties can have heat pumps, the most important fact is heat loss if you cannot bring your home up to the requirements you will always need a heat generator like a Gas boiler, Hydrogen boiler or an electric boiler, they have to be careful not to penalise the homeowners that cannot have these units and will always have to pay higher tariffs. we are struggling to produce enough electricity and we are still burning coal and gas to produce it, more electric cars and higher demands for home heating being by electric we need to find another way of producing enough this maybe nuclear power stations 🤔.

@NicolasRaimo

Жыл бұрын

EVs will be the solution not the problem with v2g

Research 🧐 centre without real world testing ie it’s not open to the elements, the talk about Scandinavia comes up all the times with heat pumps but there homes are designed for a heat pump and insulated as such old stock ie old homes here don’t have that and when you insulate everything to the hilt you have to take care of ventilation that’s a lot of pipe work and cost to detailing with the heat recovery side for the ventilation.

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

Hi Darren, reason why they built these 2 homes as these 2 houses equal 48% of UK housing stock and at launch in April they will start with the first 20% of Uk housing stock so houses ready for heat pumps now, meaning no extra work needed…. They will then move on to the next challenge level and so on the plan is to work up in stages. There’s another part of the centre and test homes in real world that octopus already use

@DTech101

2 жыл бұрын

Hi @@NicolasRaimo the heat pump isn’t the end of converting a house like that mines a 1960 cavity walls insulated. But one the rads will be too small like a lot of properties and most new places are running something like 10mm pipes to the rads and I hear flow is important to the heat pumps. I’m just not sold on the tech for my home, think the best thing the government could have done was made a grant for solar and battery as a lot more homes could definitely have it and that would make a big green hit along with lowering demand for the grid and also lowering bills

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

@@DTech101 that’s why octopus are looking at the easy homes first.. and moving up in levels their next challenge they have some of the boffins on is microbore pipes ;)

Maybe it's an age thing but how can you test and prove the tech if the testbed, the house, is not built in the real world, surely it has got to be outside?? I appreciate it's a nice training environment but no good if you are trying to prove something works. Also, I don't remember 1970's houses having double glazing as built.

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

They are not testing heat pump tech works that’s proven, they are testing new methods of installing them

@PeteMulv

2 жыл бұрын

@@NicolasRaimo I watched another video on this new facility, CEO of Octoplus, who said they were used to test the tech. Also, how can you prove an install works correctly without a real-world environment. I have nothing against the tech I just wish they would be more honest about where it will work.

Sort of skirted around the cost to run a pump. Think you maybe a bit shocked if and when you get one. There not that cheap!

@NicolasRaimo

Жыл бұрын

No we didn’t we mentioned the cop of 4 to 6 and that means 1 kw in 4kw of heat out.. meaning basically 400% Efficiency… gas at best is 90% so cop of less than 1 you can work out the cost based on your price of electric and gas

Using water to transfer heat is extremely inefficient. Heat pumps are perpetuating this myth. Let’s see Octopus talking about infrared etc. Octopus are bound to get involved in all this as they sell more electricity.

@NicolasRaimo

Жыл бұрын

Heat pumps are more coefficient than infa red and with flow rates or 30c water is pretty decent. They do have infa red projects for places heat pumps won’t work

This has disaster written all over it, let’s train inexperienced gas meter fitters to fit heat pumps🙈. I employed a metering engineer years ago, he didn’t have a clue about heating or plumbing systems, all the gear and no idea as they say. Even the units in this training centre aren’t installed correctly, wish I could add photo screen shots to these comments. Have a look at the antifreeze valves behind the Daikin heat pump, they’re touching the rubber foot of the heat pump, should be 150mm off floor level. If they can’t even get this right in training room, those engineers have no hope. Can’t wait to see the actual on site installations, this will definitely give heat pumps a bad name. The only way to train installers is on site in real life jobs working for real customers, not a 2 week crash course, in a £10,000,000 training centre. Also how does he think he can drive the price down to gas boiler cost in 18 months and without the BUS grant. The equipment cost more than a complete gas boiler install and will not change for many years.

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

Heat training centre Martin… lots of the points have been installed with faults for engineers to find and locate idea is to challenge and teach. I touched octopus on the price of the units and said you couldn’t do this without making your own they smiled and said this is true

@martinperrin1178

2 жыл бұрын

@@NicolasRaimo I’m sorry but they can’t use that excuse to incorrectly install equipment, if an engineer has never fitted a heat pump before how would they find faults, the unit I was talking about was one installed on their new houses not in one of their training test bays. I think it’s great that more engineers will be trained, but this is certainly the wrong way to do it, these engineers need some plumbing experience first. Can’t wait to see homeowner post of forum groups of their poorly installed heat pumps from octopus energy.

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

@@martinperrin1178 they will be training them from different skill sets plumbers will be a shorter training set than say an electrician

@martinperrin1178

2 жыл бұрын

@@NicolasRaimo my main rant is, that Octopus Energy need to learn how to install heat pumps themselves first before passing on bad installation practices to other non skilled engineers. Thank you for making the video. 👍

I love all this tech but your all. Bonkers, I have an ev and it gets used so I will not want to export any of car car battery, you must be talking about retired people who never use there evs. I cannot even think when I could sell some or use some. I live rural and my car needs its charge ready for full use. And as far as battery's and solar homes need to be 3 phase to fully ulilise 12kw plus of solar pannels as single phase is 4kw. In winter my 8 kw system would not top my 5kw battery up fully. What we need is 12kw plus solar pannels to make full use of free power. Summer lighter nights its fantastic in this case you need 13kw and more battery storage to really take advantage. Summer is bliss for solar, even charges 2 evs free. I like this subject but its the cost to family's that to have this tech that's the issue. I will add that new homes are being fitted with 3 phase as standard in some counties do that's a great start. My payback on all my equipment is another 3 years away and if my third battery fails now I can blow that out and I have had inverter failures within 7 years and they were not cheap oddball brands. Its the payback that sells a system but its great if it works past all warranties but in lots of cases they don't. Which leaves struggling families with huge expenses. Manufactures and new home builders should be given grants from the goverment to make all new homes partially off grid. Asking the average hard working families to pay for solar, battery's and heatpump is a big ask. Also the manufacturers who promote solar systems heat pumps and back up battery's should give them all a 20 year no quibble exchange for new warranty. Most manufactures of solar inverters give 5 and 10 year warranties but some have crafty small print conditions like they will exchange for a refurbished unit but the warranty is only until the original is finished and it can take months to exchange.

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

Am not retied but my wife has a 50kwh battery in her Ev, only drives 30 miles a day... so most that battery isn't needed... if i can charge from the grid at 7.5p and then discharge and be paid 45p... why wouldn't I... its already happening regular with OVO and Octopus both finishing the trails for mainstream

Funny how all these so called experts brush over the kilowatt size of the heat pump. say a 5kw would be like running 3 kettles thru the cold period

@NicolasRaimo

Жыл бұрын

5kw heatpump would produce about 20kw of heat.... 5kw isn't a large amount of electric either and also the pump wouldn't be running flat out 24/7 its speed and input would vary

@kensteeplejack

Жыл бұрын

Sowie 1959. The heat pump output is 5kw, but would only be using 1.5kw typically. half of an electric kettle.

The problem is that they install the boiler is and than say goodbye and leave you with non balanced system. More than 80% . There are loads of video's how to balance you're radiators and increase the efficiency of a gas boiler. This is wat you have now so fix that first before the same thing happens with these stupid heatpomps. Carbon emissions and gasshortage solved just by doing some little tweeks.

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

Biggest reduction in boiler running cost was in my last video and that’s reducing flow temperature

Small point. These heat pumps are inside a building. They will never be run at ambient temperatures close to or lower than freezing. Any results from this are utterly meaningless and totally inapplicable to the wider U.K. housing stock.

@NicolasRaimo

Жыл бұрын

Small point... This is a training centre to train engineers on how to fit them... However octopus to run "lab" check test on these and in fact put a tent around one of the heat pumps and made the air in the tent -15c and it worked FINE

trying to figure out the POINT of this video

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

Trying to figure out the POINT of this comment

Heat pumps..... No thanks

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

Huh

Give us figures of real life installs please talking means nothing

@NicolasRaimo

2 жыл бұрын

3-5k after grant which is same as a boiler replacement, they hope to get to this price without grant as mentioned

Too much British. Tone it down a bit, just too imperialist.

And then Russia invaded Ukraine.

You are so mislead! EV’s do very little good for the environment today. Mining Nickle and Cobolt does huge environmental damage when mined and the batteries are really difficult to recycle. Not to for get most of the rare metals are mined in the Republic of Congo using child labour. Also how is most of the worlds electricity created today? Cole and oil are the big contributors. So not really environmentally friendly!

Is this video for information on heat pumps or an advertisement for Octopus Energy?

@NicolasRaimo

Жыл бұрын

I didn't get paid to do it so not an advert but same time I do admire what they have done and found it interesting content