The charging handle is the earliest h&k style handle I have seen. It even has the notch.

@losos1

3 жыл бұрын

Satisfying though

@matthewvitorino7579

3 жыл бұрын

@@losos1 2 1

@dbmail545

2 жыл бұрын

I was thinking about how much this resembles the H&K delayed blowback action.

@DrSabot-A

2 жыл бұрын

Do we call it the Weird-Springfield-Based-Prototype-Gun-Slap?

@jd_the_cat

2 жыл бұрын

@@DrSabot-A Yes

I know you often say gun design is an iterative process and that all the things we use today are old inventions, but I didn't expect I'd ever see an old timey version of the HK G36 folding charging handle.

@calebreutener870

3 жыл бұрын

Almost looked like an ar bolt catch. If this has last round hold open it bet it was the exact same.

@The_Viktor_Reznov

3 жыл бұрын

Not only it is an HK G36 folding charging handle but also you can HK slap it.

@micahreid5553

3 жыл бұрын

@@calebreutener870 It does If you look a little tab extends forward and would get hit by the follower when t is a the way u. Exact same profile as on an AR

The presence of a leather buffer and so many stock reinforcements seems to suggest this thing recoiled like a hammer.

@ulissedazante5748

3 жыл бұрын

The idea is kind of a G3 on steroids: no piston, brute force on the bolt, much less delay than the rollers, and a big mass moving. It would kick like a mule, I guess.

@Journey_Awaits

3 жыл бұрын

Maybe they were making work out equipment from surplus guns

@samsonsoturian6013

Жыл бұрын

You don't have enough stopping power unless you risk breaking a recruit's shoulder

Given how dangerous this mechanism is, the inventor probably cut off the stock and mounted it in a clamp so he could fire it remotely with a lanyard just in case it totally blew up in his face!

@christopherreed4723

3 жыл бұрын

That's what I decided once Ian got to where the rifle was in it's development. An early prototype, like this probably was, doesn't need a shoulder stock, because nobody is ever going to shoulder it. It will only ever be fired from a clamp, and a shoulder stock would just get in the way.

@egg5474

3 жыл бұрын

It doesn’t look poorly built enough imo, although that bolt doesn’t look too reliable to run reliably and with wear maybe a premature ejection problem

@justarandomtechpriest1578

2 жыл бұрын

@@egg5474 because all prototypes have to be crude We dont know if this was v1 or v10

@Superabound2

2 жыл бұрын

@@justarandomtechpriest1578 no one said it was crude. But by definition a prototype is not a production model and should be distinguished as such to prevent it from entering distribution or being used for other purposes. A rifle of this design without a stock is not likely to be picked up and fired by anyone other than it's intended operator

@beargillium2369

2 жыл бұрын

@@christopherreed4723 atf says if you can't shoulder it then it's a pistol, so there ya go 🤠

I never knew the US had such a large Elbonian-American population inventing firearms back in the day.

@ostiariusalpha

3 жыл бұрын

Now you know, and knowing is half the battle.

@ericvantassell6809

3 жыл бұрын

there was an evil collaboration with the vulgarian-american community based on the fact that they hated the slobovians more than each other

@Etherman7

3 жыл бұрын

There was a large wave of Elbonian immigrants just before ww1, and the Army, knowing their history of Firearms manufacturing, started their policy of sending Springfield rifles for experimental designs just to help the Elbonians out.

@angeleaterstudios1004

3 жыл бұрын

Elbonians? Aren't those the guys who invented Elbow Grease?

@jrsharker23

3 жыл бұрын

@ThatOneGuy89 south of vulgaria, west of slobovia

So here's what happens after you have watched enough of Ian's videos- you end up knowing just enough to come up with all manner of theoretical alternative operating systems, such as this one, and then invariably Ian comes along a couple of months or years later and shows you that yes, it might be possible, yes it has been tried but here is why it was shit.

@Dreams_Of_Lavender

3 жыл бұрын

I made an SMG version of this that was visually based on the Ribeyrolles carbine years ago, lol. Didn't know it was a thing until today.

@nosuchthingasshould4175

3 жыл бұрын

@@Dreams_Of_Lavender made?

@Dreams_Of_Lavender

3 жыл бұрын

@@nosuchthingasshould4175 "Made" as in created a concept model in Blender. Not "made" as in created physical prototypes.

@eisenkrieg553

3 жыл бұрын

I wouldn't say they are shit designs but simply limited by technology at the time. The working principal of this design just needs to be figured out and this guy simply had trial and error, not high speed cameras and other tools in order to perform any diagnostic checks. Plus it was stuffed inside of an unwieldy form instead of a typical assault rifle.

@CptJistuce

3 жыл бұрын

@@Dreams_Of_Lavender Color me disappointed.

When Ian explains the mechanism of a firearm : 100% on board with understanding how it works. When I see any gun firing : "Wow, it's unexplained magic !!!"

@Ezekiel_Allium

3 жыл бұрын

Honestly the AK is the only gun I see in action and I'm like "yeah, I know how that works actually" Most other guns I understand in theory but I squint a little and theres a lot I dont get

@gerrymandarin6388

3 жыл бұрын

Blowback is easy enough, it's literal weight and spring force that's holding the cartridge in place. Direct impingement uses gas from a fired cartridge to rotate the bolt. Now, roller delayed blowback is... Hard.

@ianfinrir8724

2 жыл бұрын

@@gerrymandarin6388 Recoil operated is similar to Blowback but the barrel moves with the bolt. Short Recoil: The barrel moves half to length of the cartridge before the bolt travels the rest of the way. In Long Recoil, the barrel travels the full length of the cartridge.

@tomaspabon2484

Жыл бұрын

@@gerrymandarin6388 Blow-forward and rotating-barrel, short-recoil are both reliant on the bullet's friction on the barrel. It's a simple enough concept, but I'm still amazed that it works.

@shala_shashka

Жыл бұрын

This is how I feel about both firearms and cars lmao

the period of time for this gun sounds a bit like what the 80s and 90s were for personal computers, lots of people throwing ideas at the walls and seeing what stuck.

@SolyomSzava

3 жыл бұрын

Yeah, except it's "what doesn't blow up" instead of what sticks.

@chaseman113

3 жыл бұрын

*seeing what stuck... together?

You can theoretically lock the bolt open. My mind: You can theoretically HK slap it!

@homeopathicfossil-fuels4789

3 жыл бұрын

There are so many things you can HK slap and I do it at every opportunity because it feels so good to do.

@DanknessArising

3 жыл бұрын

fuck, you beat me too it lmao

@MTMILITIAMAN7.62

3 жыл бұрын

I am guessing you're my age, and you grew up watching the action movies of the 80s and 90s, when the HK Slap was the most bad ass thing you could do. Slapping that bolt home on an MP5 was even cooler than racking the slide on a pump action shotgun. You always knew a helicopter was about to be shot down or an alien was about to die.

@homeopathicfossil-fuels4789

3 жыл бұрын

@Sichael Mender Well, as a gun girl I can confirm that a slap to the hind is the perfect way to make sure I am loaded. :)

@johncage3025

3 жыл бұрын

@@homeopathicfossil-fuels4789 Wow 😳, lol

business in the front, party in the back

@rodrigobarreto1947

3 жыл бұрын

The mullet of rifles

File this under “Weird evolution of a 1903 that I didn’t know existed”

@Dapstart

3 жыл бұрын

are you who you say you are are you who you say you are

@ericvantassell6809

3 жыл бұрын

@@Dapstart all your base are belong to us

@ericvantassell6809

3 жыл бұрын

no can do. already filed under "stuff I didn't know I needed"

@bobroberts2371

3 жыл бұрын

@@ericvantassell6809 Oh look, it's a proto Shockwave. . . . .

@maverickfox4102

3 жыл бұрын

The Brits did the same thing with their Lee Enfield SMLE Mk3.

I love all the weird semi-auto operating mechanisms built on M1903 rifles. The primer actuated one was also quite bizarre.

"Oh god, we're in the hands of engineers"

@userJohnSmith

3 жыл бұрын

Jurassic Park reference I think. I'm an engineer in a completely different field. I can no longer whatch that movie because the engineering of the park is so bad it's unbelievable. Those weren't engineers building that place, they were scientists pretending to be.

@thishonestgrifter

3 жыл бұрын

If it ain’t broke you haven’t tinkered enough.

@heikkiremes5661

3 жыл бұрын

Always have been. D:

@tortron

2 жыл бұрын

@@userJohnSmith a scourge on this earth. Pretendgineers

This is just the strangest thing - so glad you gave us the details AND the background!

@deucedeuce1572

3 жыл бұрын

I can't even figure out how the bolt could have been made. (The lug slot in particular).

@cnlbenmc

3 жыл бұрын

Sorry I had to disrupt your 420 likes.

For a hand-made one-off, the workmanship is extraordinary. Beautiful work!

wtf is this beautiful monstrosity

@vincentcathcart8950

3 жыл бұрын

@@slaughterround643 uqywwy

Fascinating as always. But I hope KZread is paying you extra for this one. They ran adds pretty much every minute of this video.

@timdinch5598

3 жыл бұрын

Why not just use youTube Adblocker.....What's an advert?

@Chartruse5

3 жыл бұрын

As of Dec 2 I think a new policy went in place where youtube can claim ad revenue from a demonetized video and make out with 100% of the profit. It's obscene.

@braden1986

3 жыл бұрын

Ian's already said he has adverts turned off, so as ZiggyDoes mention, this is 100% money going to Alphabet rather than any going to Ian

@thefunkosaurus

3 жыл бұрын

On any video: Start video. Skip opening ad (if possible). Drag play marker to the end of video. When video refreshes, replay video AD-FREE!!!

@wingracer1614

3 жыл бұрын

@@braden1986 That's Inrange, not Forgotten Weapons. This channel has not been demonetized.

The HK slap is the equivalent of someone saying your joke louder and getting all the credit

Springfield 1904 prototype: (has a unique charging handle) H&K: Write that down, Write that down!

This system seems kind-of like a linear version of lever-delayed blowback, where the "lever" is the bolt head with the locking lug and cam-way, that is forced to rotate and unlock as the breachface is pushed back slightly and forces the pin to travel along the cam-way. Like the FAMAS and HK roller-delayed guns, would probably work properly and consistently with a fluted chamber, but that technology apparently wouldn't be developed until several decades later.

@4991Ares

3 жыл бұрын

I'd call it impulse delayed: breechhead (?) delivers impulse to bolt carrier, is then halted by the bolt, bolt carrier continues rearward on impulse alone and unlocks the bolt. A Newton's cradle, but clearly more fun.

@jeffthebaptist3602

3 жыл бұрын

Yes it's basically delayed blowback. The cartridge can blow the bolt head back a short distance and get the carrier/buffer moving before the bolt head bottoms out on the main bolt body. That buffer then has the energy to cycle the system. Kind of reminds me of Pedersen's hesitation lock system only with a rotating bolt instead of tilting bolt.

@dravidiantommylinson3880

3 жыл бұрын

All of you are wrong lol yes it is a delayed blowback, like a CETME rifle, using a high-pressure rifle cartridge. The closest thing this resembles is easily a CMMG rotary-delayed blowback system, where the inertia from rotating the bolt is the "delaying" force. Although, I will say yes, this does look like an enlarged portion of half an HK roller-delayed system.

@discerningscoundrel3055

3 жыл бұрын

@@dravidiantommylinson3880 It's the same hesitation lock operating system as the Pederson - the bolt is allowed to move a very small amount, which sets the bolt carrier in motion (a slide, in the case of Pedersons Remington 51) which then opens the bolt after some delay. However, the locking mechanism is a rotating locking piece. It differs substantially from the CMMG, as it features a small movement of the bolt, then a stop, then a subsequent movement. After the initial movement of the bolt head, it unlocks in a similar way to gas operation or straight pull bolt action, with the bolt carrier unlocking and providing motive force to the bolt. By contrast, the CMMG system does not involve any stop and restart in the movement of the bolt head, instead the bolt head is allowed to move back, but to do so it must move an additional mass faster than itself, slowing the initial opening, but not the rest of bolt travel. The CMMG can be grouped with lever and roller delay systems in that they all rely on a bolt body having to move faster than the bolt head to slow the initial opening, whereas hesitation lock is somewhat weirder. It's difficult to clearly explain hesitation lock systems simply because they are so unfamiliar.

@emuriddle9364

3 жыл бұрын

Maybe a Twist-Delayed blowback?

Here I was foolishly thinking I'd be going to bed

@icecoldfire25

3 жыл бұрын

Same...

@d3734

3 жыл бұрын

Why are u going to bed at 8 am 🤔

@MootingInsanity

3 жыл бұрын

@@d3734 Some of us work nights

@threeleafclover6003

3 жыл бұрын

Goodnight!

@nousernames444

3 жыл бұрын

Don’t lie all of us that work nights know he posts when we should be going to bed lol

Rube Goldberg, Weapons Engineer, strikes again!

@fnorgen

3 жыл бұрын

If you ever have to chose between paying patent royalties for a sensible design, or patenting your own back asswards, bizarrely complicated design, always chose the latter!

@lairdcummings9092

3 жыл бұрын

"Weird" keeps the lawyers at bay!

I absolutely love these old hand made prototypes. Even the failed prototypes show amazing craftsmanship and skill

Interesting gun although the lack of shoulder stock reminds me of a Tanegashima matchlock...

@PhilipFear

3 жыл бұрын

The stock was cut when the prototype moved on to the next stage.... Then it became a Ref. Model of development travel.....

@michaelbaker8284

3 жыл бұрын

@@PhilipFear And it probably was never very safe to fire.

@honeybadgerfacts3871

3 жыл бұрын

Just tell everyone it's a pistol. Specifically the ones you don't like.

@bobroberts2371

3 жыл бұрын

@@michaelbaker8284 Oh look, it's a proto Shockwave. . . . .

@widgren87

3 жыл бұрын

@@bengal2441 Now I feel like an idiot... I tend to forget match and wheel locks and default to flint...

Last time I was this early, we didn't need all these newfangled magazines in our weapons! If we needed to shoot, we'd place our rounds down the muzzle! Who needs to carry extra?

@abohachuk4765

3 жыл бұрын

Literally every sane person.

@MootingInsanity

3 жыл бұрын

>not switching to needlefire ok boomer

@boomstick1584

3 жыл бұрын

Are you a muskateer??? My old 50 cal. stainless Remington 700-ML, probably the most dependable deer 🦌 killer. Every shot has hit the intended deer and dropped him in his tracks. Even with a 7mm Magnum, you have a runner sometimes....

@andrewjb05051998

3 жыл бұрын

Fudds gonna fudd

@boomstick1584

3 жыл бұрын

(he probably just placed an order for a dozen 30 round magazines)

I guess this could also be classified as an Inertia-Operated, this is very weird and possibly unsafe, I expect the rifle to really like ripping cases

Isn't this essentially the same as a hesitation locking system on the Remington model 51. The bolt rotates instead of tilting but the idea seems the same.

@discerningscoundrel3055

3 жыл бұрын

That's my immediate thought on the matter as well. It seems like a concept that ought to have received more investigation than it has, given that the original Remington 51 seems to have been well liked - if something of a market failure due to cheaper competition - and the .45acp 53 was rated pretty highly based on early testing, but turned up just a little too late to compete with the 1911. On the other hand, I gather the recent revival of the 51 was an utter disaster, although I have no idea to what extent that was a finicky system, poor quality control, or the combination of the two.

@SolyomSzava

3 жыл бұрын

@@discerningscoundrel3055 The similar system in the Remington model 51 works reasonably well due to the much smaller chamber pressure of the ammunition (about a quarter of the 30-06). Also, it is a civilian weapon, where environmental conditions are rather mild, compared to battlefield conditions. I suspect reliability was a problem, not only due to manufacturing tolerances of the ammunition, but also the thermal expansion effects messing with the operation (and this is a prototype, for a series production rifle, tolerances of the rifle, and wear from long-term use would further reduce the reliability).

@discerningscoundrel3055

3 жыл бұрын

@@SolyomSzava Yes, I can imagine the pressure of 30-06 will have presented something of a challenge, especially as this was decades before fluted chambers were a thing.

@ScottKenny1978

3 жыл бұрын

@@discerningscoundrel3055 not that long before fluted chambers. The AVS-36 had them. (Predecessor to the SVT38/40)

@LenKusov

3 жыл бұрын

@@SolyomSzava I mean, there were other high-pressure delayed-blowback guns being made at this time, it's not a difficult problem to solve - modern ones use fluted chambers, guns of that era just required oiled/waxed cartridges to extract properly. This also looks like the actual chamber is longer than the round is, so case-head separations are unlikely, but ripping the rims off cartridges probably WAS an issue if you ran un-lubricated ammo.

If I remember correctly, this type of operation is sometimes called "hesitation lock", and is conceptually similar to Pederson's Remington 51 and 53. I can only assume there would be issues with the very high pressure initial extraction, but giving the design some primary extraction, as the rotating bolt design does, might help. It might have benefitted from a fluted chamber, too, although I don't know when they were actually invented.

Love the simplistic trigger group. It really easily shows how sear and semi-auto disconnects work.

And once again the sheer POWER behind that tiny little explosion in a gun's chamber blows my mind! I was already surprised how little of the travel on a long stroke gas piston actually happens under pressure before the gas is vented, but this is such a tiny little kick against a bolt face that is already enough to make the bolt cycle all the way against its recoil spring (even if it doesn't do so reliably) and if I was a gun designer then this kinda stuff would never have to to my mind!

@notgraham.7215

3 жыл бұрын

That tiny little explosion isn't tiny relative to the amount of space it's contained in. Sure, outside of a chamber the blast radius would be like, an inch or two for most intermediate calibers, but remember, that's crammed into a .30 cal hole

@thomasa5619

3 жыл бұрын

Well let’s do some (really rough) math: 30-06 has 60kpsi max pressure. (Bolt thrust of about 4.5 metric ton) Say the bolt head only travels 2mm? (About 0.080 inch) I’m just guessing based on that Ian kinda showed us [The difference between max and min SAAMI spec is 0.51mm] A force of 4.5 ton applied on a distance of 2mm is approximately 90 joules or half the energy of a .22lr. Those 90ish joules are only used to unlock the bolt (against friction on the locking lug and case head, I’m including that at the end as a note) Using 90 joules and vaguely guessing the bolt carrier weighs 100g (3.5 ounces) [half the lightest of AR15 bolt carriers] The bolt carrier is thrown backward at 40 meters per second (130fps) The camming surface appears to be about 3/8 inch? I’ll use 10mm. So the bolt carrier is travelling 10mm backwards at 40m/s The bolt unlocks 2.5 milliseconds after ignition? Once the bolt unlocks the whole bolt/bolt-carrier/bolt-head share momentum/energy and would be travelling around 20 meter per second or 48 miles per hour. Plus any residual gas pressure left in the barrel which at this point is well below 10k (not enough for me to worry about personally, however I will note that being nearer to 6k, the thrust provided by residual gas would be comparable to 2x 22lr’s at once) My estimations also suggest 20-100 joules of energy is lost in friction between the locking lug and receiver (steel on steel coefficient of friction is vague) Once tuned right with consistent ammo the recoil shouldn’t be too bad

@notgraham.7215

3 жыл бұрын

@@thomasa5619 you: "some really rough math" Also you: *writes a complete dissertation, thus completing your PhD in science having previously majored in ballistics *

@thomasa5619

3 жыл бұрын

Not Graham. I estimated like 3 different measurements using “gun jesus’ finger” as a reference ignored several aspects then randomly decided “once it’s tuned it’s probably cool” It should do the job. But it’s still rough. I just enjoy math

@notgraham.7215

3 жыл бұрын

@@thomasa5619 gun Jesus fingers are an official unit of measure, and you can't convince me otherwise.

That is some gorgeous machine work for a prototype...

With a name like that, I imagine that you are able to mount this on your head and fire away.

@stormthrush37

3 жыл бұрын

Oh, so it's Gunther's skull gun from Deus Ex, eh?

@Jarumo76

3 жыл бұрын

"No. I wanted orange. It gave me lemon-lime."

@claudiaborges8406

3 жыл бұрын

Nah you use willpower to shoot it

@benjaminbreeg6214

3 жыл бұрын

"Why does this gun not have a trigger?"

@claudiaborges8406

3 жыл бұрын

@@benjaminbreeg6214 you shoot it with the force

Its gonna be good when Ian says I think in the intro

Ian knew we were gonna make fun of the "forgotten" m2, so he pulled out the mystery prototype rifle

I'm not quite sure why, but I love the charging handle on this thing.

@jesusgotthatdrip4552

3 жыл бұрын

Same

@hailexiao2770

3 жыл бұрын

It's an AR that you can HK slap, and that is awesome

Explains why there’s all the Springfield variants in BF1

The man loves an experimental automatic rifle

This reminds me a lot of the Winchester Model 50 shotgun, which actually has a moving chamber. The Model 50 is a tilting bolt system operated by the chamber that moves back just a fraction of an inch. The mechanism looks kind of like a barrel insert. I doubt it would work for a high pressure rifle round, but it works perfectly fine in a semi-auto shotgun. I have my Grandfather's Model 50, and it's broken a lot of clay pigeons and killed a lot of ducks. The mechanism (and the foot long recoil spring) absorbs a lot of recoil making it more comfortable to shoot a lot of clays. (Designed by David Marshal "Carbine" Williams!)

They really tried everything with self loading rifles

@MrJohndoakes

3 жыл бұрын

It seemed like that almost anything could work.....and then it didn't.

@hailexiao2770

3 жыл бұрын

People apparently *really* hated the idea of drilling holes in barrels back then. Once they got over that mental block everyone quickly settled on gas operation.

Whoever designed this must be really freaking smart. Just seeing the mechanics is so interesting and cool

I've these kinda homemade attempts at technological improvements. It just shows the type of passion some people have to make things simply because they have an idea.

This video is the epitome of why I love your channel, a bit of history, background, teardown, the mechanism, amazing stuff

Reloaders nightmare. Brass destroyer.

Short-stroke-blow-back-rotating-bolt....?

All that machine work, and you end up with nothing but casehead separations.

It is informative videos like this that made me a big fan of your channel. Thank you.

I love those weird experimental rifles! Thanks for showig Ian :D

Thank's so Lot for the Transcription , Amazing rifle Springfield of 1903...with his special part with the Hamer fire

Great video Ian. Love your knowledge and stories about the history of the Frankenstein donor gun years.

Such a fascinating era for firearms. Feels like traveling back in time. Thanks gun jeezus 🙏

Truly a Forgotten Weapon. Thank you Ian for this nugget of a historical and developmental piece. Great video as always.

This is what happens when an American finds out he's half German and is a gunsmith.

@notgray88

3 жыл бұрын

not enough gears for it to be german

@prussianblue3144

3 жыл бұрын

@@notgray88 But the H&K slap

@alexanderuhlig818

3 жыл бұрын

Why not...

This one really lives up to the channel name. 10/10 thanks Ian.

I had wondered if a system like this existed. Thanks for this video!

My steampunk story writer gears are beginning to turn rapidly

@Metal_Tao

3 жыл бұрын

Go for it bro!

@Taistelukalkkuna

3 жыл бұрын

*DO EEEET!*

@sillylittleowlguy2392

3 жыл бұрын

Fuckin’ go for it

@thishonestgrifter

3 жыл бұрын

Embrace thy destiny brother!

@Saturnus_Ouranos

3 жыл бұрын

@Paul Putter Steamin’ DO IT!

Well designed for its time. I love seeing how those experimental selfloaders were hand fitted and dovetailed with such close tolorances

Love the insight into the reasoning for weird features.

Looks very similar to the rifle in the video Ian made"Experimental Primer-Actuated Semiauto Springfield 1903" this headspace system is very interesting

I was thinking that this is very similar to the primer activated designs, and I’m glad you mentioned the differences.

And I thought I knew about every type of firearm action. Always informative content.

I'm glad you showed the dis-assembly. I need to clean mine.

Crazy army brass was probably hoping to repurpose all those 1903's, as in the trapdoor conversion.

@jalpat2272

3 жыл бұрын

well as far my antebellum historical knowledge, they were pretty much the same persons.as people who asked trapdoor conversion.

I gotta say for something designed with pure insanity the fit and finish for a prototype rifle is actually pretty impressive and some elements of it look genuinely slick like that charging handle and mainspring retention. I absolutely love this era of guns where people threw so much at the wall to see what would stick and just went nuts, Thanks for bringing us this awesome content Ian!

Man this kind of experimental stuff is always a favorite of mine on Forgotten Weapons! Whenever it came from it's always refreshing to see these out of the box ideas, even if they ended up being mostly impractical. Who knows when these old impractical ideas might come back thanks to new advances.

Think the stock was sawn off becasue they didn't want someone firing it from the sholder? Maybe they thought it was unsafe to do so?

@ineedlean

3 жыл бұрын

The inventor was tinkering with head spacing. No need for a stock for shooting/storage if he’s using a string to pull trigger

@owenmerrick2377

3 жыл бұрын

My thoughts exactly! It is a prototype, and tinkering with the headspace mechanism...who knows what goes flying.

@davidlamppert9093

3 жыл бұрын

Same thought here, a cut-off stock would be easier to fit in a vise contraption for remote firing.

Whoever made this thing was freaking awesome. Someone should’ve gave him a job.

What a bizarre, fascinating design. Thanks for sharing!

Would be great to see a video about the Walther P 88 pistol here one day. It seems to be a forgotten Weapon.

Jiisus, 7 ads on a 18 minute video 😳

@yahyamusseb

3 жыл бұрын

Idk i don't have any ads

@watata1t

3 жыл бұрын

@@yahyamusseb it's not a jabb att Forgotten Weapons , some other channells have spoken upp about youtube putting more ads on theis videos

@greyhoundTex

3 жыл бұрын

@@watata1t Exactly. I've noticed that content KZread doesn't like has way more ads now. Some of the political stuff has ads every 3 or 4 minutes on some videos. I assume it's an attempt to get people to get annoyed and not watch?

@joshuaeah

3 жыл бұрын

Why aren't you using Adblock

@scooterdogg7580

3 жыл бұрын

not good considering its demonetized , ian isn't getting any revenue from ads on his channel KZread is

Didn't Krnka experiment with something similar in the late 1890ies? As I recall, it didn't work properly so he re-worked it into a primer-actuated design (that also went nowhere).

@AndreasMarx

3 жыл бұрын

Hmm, I may have been mixed up - Krnka did patent both primer-actuated and headspace-operated rifles, but the dates on the patents I found are the other way around - primer-actuated first (Nov1,1900), then headspace (Oct8, 1908).

@AndreasMarx

3 жыл бұрын

NVM, found the original source - in Danzer's Armee-Zeitung 45/1901, "Kaisertreu" (i.e. Krnka himself) states that primer-actuation was a fix for headspace-operation; specifically the "unavoidable" case head separations. Admittedly, his anonymous writing makes it somewhat unclear whether that's from Krnka's own experiments or just "common knowledge."

Rotating bolt delayed blowback?

@ScottKenny1978

3 жыл бұрын

Hesitation lock. The bolt moves, then stops, then moves again. *Very* freaking weird.

@ScottKenny1978

3 жыл бұрын

@@jaysonbrockman998 not like the CMMG version. CMMG style, once the bolt starts moving, it doesn't stop until it is all the way back. I mean, yes, it's sorta blowback operated and it has a rotating bolt. But not really.

That's right up there with the Pederson device, IMHO-John in Texas

I just love it's two-piece bolt and locking bar. Sort of a vertically-oriented version of the Chassepot/Gras/Nagant-style horizontal locking bolt/safety lug/bar assembly...😏👍

Wow! A lot of creative energy has been put into firearms over the years.

Not only is this a really cool firearm, but I have to say that the video quality looks improved from previous videos. Did you upgrade your equipment, or is it just that I'm watching it on a more capable device today? Great content, as always!

6:39 "Stock looks really good other than the...the butt stock end being cut off for some reason" +30% Sprint to Fire Time -15% Hip Fire Accuracy

That trigger group kinda resembles that of the trigger group from a 10/22. Lol

@7.62nagant7

3 жыл бұрын

Or even a sks the way it drops out

Great video! Thanks

I love this concept so much

A lot of work and thought went into this!

The controls on this feel really ahead of its time

This is a strange design. Clever, but wow it seems dangerous.

There are so many nice ideas here that, even if the system didn't work, I wish some company had bought the developer's IP out or worked with them to make something practical. Young may not have been another Browning but he was still a genius and deserves a better legacy.

This system reminds me of the Remington Model 51. It's similar in that the case slightly slides out of the chamber which give inertia to the unlocking mechanism.

A folding charging handle... nice! But it seems like the lug at the back might be subject to wear due to recoil force and twist against the lockingsurface.

It is awesome. More conversions like this one.

At 3.33 there is a mention that a standard 5 shot floor plate spring and follower will fit. The 20 shot Trench or aircraft extended mag would have also fit if they were developed by 1914 when the barrel was made.

If there is an original serial number on any of the parts maybe there are records of who the Springfield Armoury sold it to.

That weapon was made with love, I can tell.

The stock looks like it was cut so the bolt can be removed, otherwise it looks like the lugs would prevent the removal with a stock.

Thanks Ian. That is an interesting be it impractical design.

This seems similar to the Remington 51 pistol where the breech face moves just a tiny bit and then stops while a whole bunch of mass continues rearward until it unlocks the breech.

Weird, I love that charging handle, though.

I like it, it's like a tappet system but without the gas and the tappet is the bolt face.

The coolest part about all these funkified one off Springfield conversions is that .30-06 ammo is still available to shoot it.

When I was a kid, studying.....or mostly thinking about full auto rifle operation.... I was thinking of a button that the bolt presses when closing, and the actual gun trigger was only operating a disconnect. The button pressed by the bolt moving forward was the actual mechanism trigger. Ehh, it would have definitely worked, and my kid brain was probably just solving problems & relabeling parts backwards...but the mechanism would work. I don’t think I’ve seen a full auto set up exactly this way.

I love these videos about guns that have interesting ideas that maybe didn't work well or which were superseded, but which show us the process by which developers and inventors would try out new ideas, they're very interesting.

Francis K. Young or whoever built this, not only was a serious thinking man (engineer) but one hell of a machinist /metal worker. Ian, thanks so much for the presentation.

Back around 2009, I saw one of these 1903 self loader rifles at Guns and Ammo in Moss Point Mississippi. The old guy that owned the shop let a friend and I check out the rifle.

that's crazy. The front locking lug reminds me of the mosin-nagant 1891 bolt lug (with possibly a Schmidt inspired cam). Interesting to see that in a semi-auto mechanism.