Yeah mine is an 03 and since owning it I've become familiar with the twin cam. Those shoes and the Pressed crankshaft should have never left the factory that way. To top it off I've got the first year they took away the Timken bearing on the crankshaft. The more I learn about the big twins the more I appreciate the Sportster engine.

I have a 99 Road King with 20K miles on it. I just opened up my cam body and checked both chain tensioners. They had hardly any wear on them at all. I buttoned it back up and will check it again in 10K miles. Time to ride!

I have personally harassed my friends warning them of this serious issue. Some listened but most did not. That was until my buddy Mark's engine crapped out on his Night Train and it cost him thousands. Thanks for posting.

@KevinBaxter

4 жыл бұрын

thanks for subscribing and watching. definitely a serious issue. Hope your friends listen to ya...lol.

Great video. I bought a used 2005 wide glide. I have had to replace the fuel pump and lines. I also had hd put in the hd auto tensioner after seeing videos like this. The old tensionee they gave me looked ok, but better safe than sorry. Thank you for the video. I bought this bike to get back into riding after 20 + years of not riding, lost a leg to a bad ceash long ago. Thanks for the info.

Those tensioners are the sole reason I went from a twincam to an evo; And the fact that the cam chest area in general is the weakest point of the whole engine. That's not to say that twincams are junk. With all the proper maintenance, you can easily put over 100k on them. I did that with my 03 dyna that I bought new. There's just less maintenance drama with an evo. That's just my perspective though. Great stuff, Kevin.

@KevinBaxter

3 жыл бұрын

You hit the nail on the head sir. The cam chest and crank are the weakest point of the TC...well...and M8 really.

I built my 2006 fxstsi in 2007 from a 88” to a 95” and it performs extremely well with what I did, of course the dyno tune was extremely important ... just shy of 100ft pds of torque starting very early and dropping off at about 4500 rpm but coming on at 1800rpm... been real happy and ride this bike hard, it’s fun to ride, I too use ams oil but I change it every 2000 miles... did complete motor over haul at 58,000 miles. My tensioner where still in great shape... replaced with a plastic clear one that solenberg performance came out with in Sellersburg Indiana... we will see how they hold up but I believe key is keeping the oil clean. Thanks for good tech tips and sharing your knowledge. God bless and merry Christmas.

Just had the work done on my 03 Fatboy with 33k miles. Caught it in a nick of time. Thanks for the vid.

Harley should of had a recall on all these bikes ! Shame on u Harley Davidson! I will continue to ride my 92 fxstc since I’ve owned it for life !

I know this is a few years old but thought I would add. I have an 06 RK which I love. It has 36K on it. I just put cams on it this past summer. Went all in with the Fueling plate, updated tensioners, oil pump and push rods. My tensioner pads where original. They had wear - nothing like the video, but wear. I guess its because I don't ride like an ass. I love the TC motor. Has it's faults - but obviously had a really good run between '99 and '16.

yup - I did my tensioners on my 2006 Nightrain last winter. Started checking them at 20K then replaced the plastic tensioners at 50K. I was one of the lucky ones. I think in 2006, Harley used a different composite material on the tensioners and the chain seems smoother than some of the others I've felt from previous years. Almost 3/16" of material was chiseled out on both the inside and outside. Seeing that I got 50K out of the stock set and I plan on doing an 88 to 96 bolt on in a couple of years- I decide to buy some time, get in and get out and just change the tensioners with a new set of spring loaded shoes along with new inner cam bearings. I'll do the pump, cam plate and hydraulic upgrade when I do the bolt on. I'm NOT doing gear drive - if you don't have a runout issue now- you WILL later on. I don't need those gears crashing into each other. Kevin- you got a great channel - thanks for making all these vids. Ride safe everybody.

@CPerreault

2 жыл бұрын

I have an '06 Deluxe with 50k on the dial and the outside tensioner is barely used. The inside one has a bit more wear but still seems good although it's hard to see the bottom of the tensioner.

I have replaced the tensioners twice on my 01 flhtc. Around 360 bucks for parts each time. Parts guys always look at me like I'm crazy for not updating it. Scheduled every 30k. Just over 82k on bike.

@KevinBaxter

3 жыл бұрын

Nothing wrong with that sir.

@garychandler4296

3 жыл бұрын

@@KevinBaxter To me, there is. I replaced my stock tensioners under $60 plus a gasket for,the cam chest and two for the exhaust pipes.While I was in there anyway, I added cam bearings and Andrew's 21 torque cams and it became a new machine! This at a bit,over 30K. I do understand that we all don't wrench, but if time and knowledge are possible, it's really worth it! Kevin is right inasmuch as you just can't ignore it. An old school rule is, if the sounds,of the bike change, there is SOMETHING WRONG!!! ALWAYS check out strange noises.

Checked out my 06, they lookt good but i updated it with a billet camplate,hydro tensioners, and high vol oil pump. Gear rotors in old pump lookt like new, so i assume nothing ever self-destructed before i bought it(only a year agol) super quiet motor.

Great info! Thanks for posting!

@KevinBaxter

4 жыл бұрын

Thanks Rob!

Ok, so I can't find any help anywhere, I have a 99 tc88 it has a screaming eagle plate with the hydraulic tensioner even with the tensioner taken off the tensioner side of the chain is really tight, the right side of the chain is really loose. Any idea?

Going to upgrade my m8 cam, cam plate and oil pump. Guess I should just go with a gear drive cam and be done with an oil pressure tensioner. Some things about HD pisses me off.

About to replace my front one only as the rear looks to be fine. Can I just remove the C clip and pull out the spring tensioner and replace? Or do I need to do anything else if I’m only doing the front one? 05 Wide Glide.

I have a 2000 Fatboy (I bought it new) with an unmodified 88B. I have 54K miles on it. The outer tensioner looks to be about half worn. I don't know about the inner tensioner. The outer tensioner is easy enough to replace. If I wanted to go to gear drive but the pinion runout was too much, could I replace the cams with gear drive, but keep the outer chain drive?

I’m looking to by an older harley. I had heard that a 99 to 02 twin cam 88 ran on a timkin style crank bearing. First of all is that true and for an old guy that’s going to ride pretty normal , does that make a difference in reliability ? Would probably change the cam and cam plate and so forth would be the most I would do. Thanks.

Hey..just brought home 05 TC softail 19k miles..previous owner put everything chrome on it. I'm going to look at the cam..I already ordered new tensioners. Going to upgrade csm bearings...going to run same cam..I'm going to save push rods. Want to see top end and just do it like that. I have a 96 softail going to replace cam bearing and lifters in that bike...anyway like your videos....I'm looking forward to these upgrades on these bikes...I'm also leaning towards an open primary on the 96......well that's about it.. Mike

Great video man.

@KevinBaxter

4 жыл бұрын

Thank you sir!

Hey Kevin, Just bought a 2011 Street Glide with 20,000 miles with a 96cu motor. I was just wondering your thoughts on this motor and any recommendation for up keep on this bike. Not made of money LOL. New to this channel

Replaced went to gear drive my 05 with 48k best thing ever done new cams etc also

This still active? I just bought an 11 FLHTK and I was told it was time to change the tensioners for 1500 bucks. I am not a novice wrencher, but I tend to learn as I go. I'd like to do this myself, am I crazy? Should I upgrade the oil pump or anything else while I am in there?

What about a 1998 road king classic? What problems do I need to worry about with cams? Thanks

Please help I need the tool to remove the tensioners the one that does it without removing the cams

i bought my 03 FLHRCI with 29,000 miles. I did a cam right away. both shoes were worn almost all the way through and cracked in half. Put a Andrews 37G cam.

If your twin cam has a 5 speed it has the spring tensioners, 6 speed used hydro tensioners

🇦🇺 great vid, Kev

@KevinBaxter

4 жыл бұрын

thanks

When do you need to change the actual chain ?

My '02, FLHTC bought in '01, now has just under 60K miles, always Amsoil, has just now started making noise in the area of the cam drive. I have been looking at some of these videos, and fear that this is what I will discover when opened up. The bike is now parked. So far oil pressure is normal, things are just noisy.

@KevinBaxter

4 жыл бұрын

Amsoil here in everything as well. Yes..park it until you can get in there. Good luck

That was the only reason I never bought a H-D with the twin cam engine. Hoping the M8 doesn’t have the same fatal flaw. 💥

@toddgittins5692

2 жыл бұрын

Twin Cam is a better setup. I've owned both. Bought both new, so no Huckleberry stuff done, before me. M8 is a grenade, waiting to go off. Oh course, anything can be made right, with enough $.

My back one was about to explode on my 2005 with 10,571 miles. But my valve seals let go first.

@KevinBaxter

3 жыл бұрын

glad it didnt let loose.. bud.

@fogit4668

3 жыл бұрын

@@KevinBaxter me too. It would have cost even more to fix it. As it was it cost about $3,000 making it into a gear driven cam 95".

I appreciate your videos

I've unfortunately got a (handme down) 2000 road king FLHR with 37600 miles. Have had this bike for a few years and only recently been told about this problem. Can't afford a shop to look into this or fix it. I'll be tearing it apart soon to see if I'm lucky enough that it's been converted to gear. Fingers crossed. And if it hasn't ill hopefully be able to do both tensioners myself. Gonna go the "easy" route by cutting the push rods and installing adjustables so I don't have to pull the rocker boxes.

@KevinBaxter

4 жыл бұрын

Good luck! Fingers crossed. Other than the tensioners, 2000 to 2006 were great years for HD. I wish I had some of my bikes thru those years back.

@toddgittins5692

2 жыл бұрын

If it's a early 2000, cam bearing issues.

I've got 52,000 miles on a 2002 Harley Deuce that I bought new. I check the tensioner every 10K or so and I haven't seen much wear. I'm guessing because I've run Mobile One since after the break in period even though the dealer told me it would void my warranty. And, I haven't replaced anything else on the bike with the exception of normal wear and tear items. Oh, I had to pull the injectors a couple of year ago and sent them in to be cleaned and checked.

@buellfuel2001

3 жыл бұрын

I have an 2004 Deuce but it has a carburetor

@michaeloneill5961

2 жыл бұрын

Got the same bike similar miles needs tensioners done soon

I had mine replaced, but there must be a reason HD skipped that part writing the service manual. NO word in there about chain tensioners. Could it be making profit from the customers?

@KevinBaxter

3 жыл бұрын

i believe they expected them to last longer than they did....that's all. dont think it was intentional. the average owner rides 3500 miles per year and is in the hobby for 5 years....so most of them lasted 2 or 3 owners down the road.

What are your thoughts on upgrading the oil pump to one with more pressure and flow ? Seems logical if you have to go in anyway and probably just switching the cam plate to S&S or Feul would be best ??

@KevinBaxter

4 жыл бұрын

The pump is about more than just pressure and flow. How the oil is routed can change too depending on manufacturer. Also...more pressure isn't always good. That's misunderstood. Adequate volume and pressure is best, more isn't always better. Too much can cause problems. If changing the plate, I would recommend changing the pump as a set.

@johnready630

4 жыл бұрын

@@KevinBaxter OK , thanks !

@garychandler4296

3 жыл бұрын

@@KevinBaxter Kevin, what could go wrong with more? I see the bigger pumps, the Bailey springs, and the tension pins to put in the stock spring, of which I've been running for a few years now. Cold, 60 lbs, a couple miles and she drops to 50+. Cold idle around 50, hot, about 20. Just seemed like a good idea at the time, and no blown gaskets yet.

There are a few dif. upgrades available for this issue, what upgrade do you recommend, and how much should the cost and labor be?

@KevinBaxter

4 жыл бұрын

budget plays a big part. if you havent watched it yet, have a look at the video i did on chain vs gear drive cams. if in the budget, and the crank has .003" or less runout, gear drive is a winner. next option, converting to hydro plate, tensioner. There are several kits available if youd like to give us a call to discuss.

I am new to this channel and really enjoy it thanks. I am 68 and have been riding since 1972. I just recently bought a 2000 Road King classic with 943 miles on it. I have had it serviced but I am concerned about that cam chain tensioner, the bike is completely stock. What would you recommend, hydraulic or gear. By the way this is my first Harley, I prefer older bikes. Thanks for your channel. I live in Oklahoma and ride around.

@KevinBaxter

4 жыл бұрын

Welcome aboard! Thank you. With only 943 miles, it wouldn't tell you that you must do something now. Most of the time, they are good for 15-20,000 miles give or take. That being said, if in the budget and crank is straight, gear is the way to go. If the crank is more than .003 runout, hyd plate is a great alternative.

@donald2106

4 жыл бұрын

Kevin Baxter is the hydraulic tensioner that Harley has a good alternative. I bought this Harley for cross country because of comfort. I am retired and have a lot of time on my hands. The other bike I have Kawasaki 900 Beats me up on long trips. I’m talking 5000 6000 mile trips.

@KevinBaxter

4 жыл бұрын

I would go the S&S or Feuling route...far better than the HD unit for MANY reasons. If youd like a price, give us a call at 6782269651 and we can ship a kit out to you. Thanks.

@toddgittins5692

2 жыл бұрын

Go gear drive, if the run out is good and you're gonna put as many miles on, as you say. Light use, run it.

So 99’ to 06’ were specifically mentioned and at one point “and a couple years after” was mentioned. I have an 08’ Electra Glide and was wondering if the problem was fixed by Harley after 06, or do I need to check my bike as well? 11k miles, just bought it. Thanks in advance

@KevinBaxter

3 жыл бұрын

I would have to re-watch the video to figure out what I meant by that....HD went to hydro tensioners in 2007. Those last far longer than the 06 and back spring loaded. with only 11k, i dont think there would be a reason to check yours. at 30-40,000, maybe.

@mattcacioppo2502

3 жыл бұрын

Kevin Baxter thank you Sir! best Harley content I’ve seen on the Tube for sure! I’m a new owner and really appreciate the knowledge. Just watched your new video on the cracking cylinders. I’ll continue to watch, thanks again. Cheers from Alabama.

I am not a fan of just replacing the tensioners. The springs themselves can be a weak link when they break, ask me how I know. I personally like the Screamin Eagle 07 and up cam plate and oil pump kit to use on the earlier models with conversion cams from Andrews Products. S & S also makes a camplate and oil pump to convert to the latest design and so does fueling. I prefer the cam plates with the bronze bushings for the cams to ride in, it goes against my grain to use the ones that ride on the parent metal.

Anyone know what it would typically cost to fix a motor such as the one in this video?

@KevinBaxter

4 жыл бұрын

depending on the collateral damage and what's pulled out of it, could be from $1500 all the way up to several thousand. Hard to say without tearing one down and checking.

@garychandler4296

3 жыл бұрын

@@KevinBaxter Yup, many reasons us old school riders are also wrenches! That manual IS a bible!

How long does the B motor counterbalance chain last in them ...

@KevinBaxter

3 жыл бұрын

Great question Jon. Cant really answer that one. I've seen them last a very long time and dont recall seeing many failures over the years.

I'm just fact checking with you and asking another question along these lines. I've heard of riders removing the tensioners and not having any at all on the chain successfully for many miles. Have you heard of this? And with that I wonder if this could be done with a chain modification, shortening then adding a half link coupler or something like that? I realize for the later style you would have to plug the ports to the hydraulic tensioners.

@fperez2287

3 жыл бұрын

Btw, I bought new 2000 FLHT in Sept. 1999, changed the oil and filter every 2500 miles, picked up a tar rock between transmission case and rear drive belt at 25,000.went to dealer to pick up belt and parts man asked if i had my cam chain tensioners looked at. After changing my belt I hesitated and then thought id better have a look, pulled the cam cover they were paper thin. I bought the screamin eagle hydraulic kit with plate and pump. changed it all in my garage and put another 20,000 on it before going to a gear set, nothing wrong with the hydraulics, just lost faith. put another 31,000 on it and traded it for a 2016 Ultra.

@KevinBaxter

3 жыл бұрын

I had a viewer that was adamant about doing this. So much so, I got tired of reading it. It was only the 2nd time in the history of my channel, that I blocked someone because I will not run the risk of my viewers (family) taking bad information to heart. I would like to invite you to email me directly. Kevin@protwin.com. I will explain to you why that is NOT a proper solution. Period. To be blunt, its foolishness.

@firegrunt03

2 жыл бұрын

Yup, i heard of that “you dont need tensioner crap too today” foolishness indeed.

@KevinBaxter

2 жыл бұрын

@@firegrunt03 have a look at this video i did on the subject kzread.info/dash/bejne/lnWX0ZiaZJCYns4.html

Do a gear drive be done with it

Hydraulic tensioner isn't a guarantee of longevity. I've changed totalled tensioners on bikes with less than 25k km on.

@charleshendrick7266

4 жыл бұрын

This is a first time hearing a complaint like that.. Good advice... thanks a lot.

@toddgittins5692

2 жыл бұрын

Yep. Go gear, if you're gonna upgrade. You are 100% correct.

Harley Davidson as much of a icon brand they are they never should have gotten away from the gear cam EVO. Or they should have gotten a contract with s&s for their gear cam kits. HD knew and corrected it slightly in the Milwaukee 8 and permanently in the revolution max engine if they expand it to all models in some form beyond the Pan America & Sportster S.

What brand of lifts do you have there?

@KevinBaxter

4 жыл бұрын

A combo of Handy and K&L. Our K&L are the electric over hyd units. Super nice but pricey. Get what ya pay for.

My 01 road king great at 20,400, shot at 41,000

What about a 2015 are they more reliable? And how many miles do you say they last?

@KevinBaxter

3 жыл бұрын

they had their issues as well, but after 2007 and up, the tensioner issue was pretty much resolved by going hydro instead of spring.

@carolinarider5237

3 жыл бұрын

@@KevinBaxter ok thanks. I didnt even know my had a hydro Tensioner lol 👍😁

Young man.. I am currently looking at an 06 EG with 26000 miles on it. The bike is currently on its 2nd owner. According to current owner he has not been in the cam chest. He also tried to tell me that the 06 had the hydraulic cam plate so no worried (?). Is there a good way .. say.. listening to the sounds from the camchest with a stethoscope or whatever to assess if there is a problem going on in there? I am really intent on buying this bike.... with it going of course straight to a shop to open her up and upgrade right away... knowing full well the damage that can be done if this issue is ignored. I have that in my budget...What I don't have is a complete teardown and rebuild of the engine. Also.. wondering if he is being truthful or not (been burned before).. I figure if he has been in the cam chest at all he put it back together using the the quicky pushrods... which change out the cover tubed and the clips. Measurement wise. what should I be able to see with these old eyes on the pushrod cover tubes? I am nowhere near a bike shop or I would pop in there and measure one myself. Another option might be buying him a brand new oil filter and taking the one he has home for examination... if he would go for it.. hah And just for grins.. .what part of the USA are you in. I am not above shipping a bike to get it worked on by a competent shop. Some of our local shops can be iffy. Thanks. And please you and yours stay well during these COOTIE19 times.

@KevinBaxter

4 жыл бұрын

Cootie19...funny! lol. First I've heard that. Back to the bike...if it's stock, it certainly will not have a hydro cam plate. The 06 Dyna did, but no other models. There isn't a way to check without going in and actually looking. Dont let this deter you from that bike. 2006 was a fantastic year. I have repaired fewer 2006 models than any other. Im NE of Atlanta...about halfway between downtown ATL and the South Carolina border in a town called Winder. Have a look at my "how to buy a used bike" video. It may give you a few more tips. Thanks.

@charleshendrick7266

4 жыл бұрын

@@KevinBaxter Thanks bunches for getting back to me. Indeed.. you are not so far as to be out of reach to do the proposed work on this bike. At 26000 miles I would be hesitant to put many miles on it before taking a peek inside that cam chest. Looked at it again to day and did notice rusty areas in the upper part of one cover tube..like the chrome was scratched telling me somebody has possibly peeked in there before. Preference is the gear drive setup like I had installed in my 01.. but if run out was funky at least go to the hydraulic camp plate. I have seen your "used bike" vid and very well done. I had not thought of plug reading.. but that is brilliant.. one can get a good idea of what is going on in that engine using the in-depth indicators you showed. Sounds like u have a PHD in HD for sure. Thanks again for the reply and having such an informative channel we can rely on.. ME

@KevinBaxter

4 жыл бұрын

Thanks for the kind words sir. When you get ready, let me know and we can take care of it for you. All the best.

Thanks for the video Kevin. Ive got an 05 Fatboy that has 15K miles on it. I havent looked at the tensioners, but plan to soon. Ive thought about upgrading to the hydraulic tensioners, but cost is a factor. I hear that other companies are offering replacement pads that are of a different material that lasts alot longer than the stock HD pads. Do you know anything about this? Thanks and have a Merry Christmas.

@KevinBaxter

4 жыл бұрын

Good idea sir. Thanks for watching. Gear drive or hyd conversion are much better options than the spring style. Have a look at the dual piston hyd tensioners if you convert. We have them...so does Zippers and S&S I believe. Stock ones have been known to stick.

@KevinBaxter

4 жыл бұрын

And Merry Christmas to you too!

@roncoburn7771

4 жыл бұрын

I put in Teflon tensioners I’ve put 10,000 miles on them so far no wear at all

WHY CAN'T YOU RUN YOUR ENGINE WITHOUT THE TENSIONERS AND JUST BLOCK OFF THE OIL ON HYDROLIC TENSIONER WITH A GEAR BLOCK OFF PLATE ? 103 TWIN CAM. THANKS KEVIN, LOVE ALL YOUR SHOWS. JERRY

@KevinBaxter

3 жыл бұрын

There are reasons you shouldnt....I've seen this question come up enough times, that I will address it in an upcoming video.

Should have been RECALLED 🤙🇺🇸

Still an issue with the 08' 96 cu?

@thomasborger6548

2 жыл бұрын

No, the 07s and later were upgraded with the hydraulic tensioners.

66K miles on my 2004 Softail that I've owned since new. Might check the tensioners over the winter.

@KevinBaxter

3 жыл бұрын

That would be a good plan. 04 was a good year for HD

@jacjlandis2743

3 жыл бұрын

I bought my bike with 40,000 and did some upgrades and luckily I caught mine just in time it was barely holding together. I upgraded to the hydraulic cam support plate and oil pump by screaming eagle

@rkt88403

Жыл бұрын

@@KevinBaxter 71.5k miles and figure I would get new tensioners and tools to do the job on my bike finally. I was expecting bad stuff when I pulled the cover off but although there is some wear, everything looks real good. Now I'm committed to the job.

Often I wonder, am I the only guy on the net that thinks the MoCo should have used a neoprene or nylon WHEELS with softer springs, instead of depending on pieces of plastic sliders? Seems like a no-brainer to me.

@mikecross1402

Жыл бұрын

i often wonder same too.

I’m hoping that’s my issue.

@KevinBaxter

3 жыл бұрын

And that's ALL of your issue. Fingers crossed for you.

@LonesomeNomad137

3 жыл бұрын

Mechanic says my bikes not getting ⛽️ fuel ⛽️. That sucks. But I guess it could be worse.

👀👂 👍👍👍👍👍

I have 50k on my original tensioners., I have checked them twice. Its all about how you ride your bike. I also get 10k out of rear tire.

@toddgittins5692

2 жыл бұрын

It's the chain. It ain't got a thing to do with how you ride. If you get a chain cut with fresh dies, they are smoother, less wear. Old dies, rougher cut, more wear. SMF'NH