The term "reset" is exactly what is happening in 2022. It's also a reset of brands and brand value. Instead of fewer automakers with large market share we are going see a lot more brands each with smaller shares. The other reset is the idea that ICE cars are difficult to make reliable and the legacy brands had a huge advantage over smaller ICE auto makers. With the move the EVs no automaker has that reputation to fall back on (possible exception Tesla). Everyone is going to be evaluated on reliability and quality starting at zero now. Consumers may also think EVs are not as difficult to make and have fewer parts to fail so reliability is no longer as much as a factor in buying decisions. It doesn't help that getting a license plate for an ICE car is expensive and difficult in some parts of China pushing everyone to switch to EVs.

@_PatrickO

2 жыл бұрын

Companies like volvo and gm are just rebranding chinese EVs, that is the future for any western legacy brand that wants to "survive". VW is gearing up to do the same thing with the chinese plant that they recently bought a majority stake in. VW is trying to keep control of their chinese factories to try to stay german, but even they will have to downsize their non-chinese factories unless they can gain traction by mimicking tesla's manufacturing philosophies. VW will likely just hang onto one factory in europe and the rest will have to be made in china for the foreseeable future.

@machtschnell7452

2 жыл бұрын

EV are just data recording devices fot governments. Must not have an autonomous population.

@OlJackBurton

2 жыл бұрын

Tesla doesn't make all that reliable/dependable/quality EVs despite having the most "experience" with them along with Nissan and GM. That is, EVs are not necessarily any easier to make reliable than ICE cars, especially in things not related to the "powertrains". The build quality in Chinese built Teslas compared to American built ones is considerably in the Chinese' favor (almost Lexus like panel gaps) considering their far greater experience in modern manufacturing. Not to mention that modern EVs are incredibly complex, far more complex than ICE cars of even 5 years ago. There are so many things that can break or not work properly. Don't think consumers will be forgiving of cars that don't work, especially when they're currently more expensive than the average ICE car, and if there many more other reliable EV options. The average EV buyer in the US is not going to be younger than the average new ICE buyer, just because of financial reasons. The difference is that GM, Geely/Volvo/Polestar/Zeekr and Hyundai/Kia (who probably make the most reliable and best built EVs of the current legacy automakers) have much more experience with manufacturing cars and quality control in general. Likewise, the Chinese manufacturing know-how is not something that can simply be exported or transferred. Despite their extremely high prices, Lucid and Rivian (and Tesla too, ranking 27th of 28th brands in "reliability" according to Consumer Reports) have already had tons of quality issues compared to say Hyundai/Kia (Niro and Kona) or Polestar. The US and European startups are not likely to be competitive with the cauldron forged Chinese startups (only 1-2% long term survival rate)...

@ronalwoods3181

2 жыл бұрын

reset applies every day

@davefroman4700

2 жыл бұрын

Disruption is a better word. Every successful technology in history has experienced an exponential S curve of adoption by our societies. Furthermore 99% of businesses in history have failed to survive technology disruptions in their industries. History is littered with their failures to recognize the trends fast enough to allow them to pivot. The bigger the ship? The harder it is to survive. Demand for the old product drops off precipitously ahead of production of the new technology being able to meet demand. All I see when I look at the OEM's today is billions in stranded assets.

BYD was already exporting commercial vehicles to the world. Mr Dunne was wrong to say that BYD was a company that has not arrived

@macioluko9484

2 жыл бұрын

Yes. There’s a good reason why W Buffet has a huge stake in BYD… and it has nothing to do with “cheap labour” but rather insane growth prospects. Leading to asymmetric returns.

@johnsmith-cw3wo

2 жыл бұрын

@@macioluko9484 they don't seem to run to India that much, and the wages are 5 times lower in India,

@macioluko9484

2 жыл бұрын

@@johnsmith-cw3wo The moment India creates a market for BYD, they will be there making vehicles. As will all the other automakers.

@johnsmith-cw3wo

2 жыл бұрын

@@macioluko9484 there is a market for many things in India, but the investments are very low compared to the size of the country. (I guess the bureaucracy and corruption don't help) - China 1,514 billions, India 367 billions. You have countries way smaller like Vietnam who got 318 billions.

@macioluko9484

2 жыл бұрын

@@johnsmith-cw3wo Yes. Absolutely. The investments are low in India for now, as the risks are high. Lower the risks (aka corruption/bureaucracy) and the market will appear.

BYD has been expanding their fleet offerings for quite some time in Brazil. There are talks on signings up dealerships , and a few takers are talking. And the newsfeeds are coming strong on model imports . American brands don't stand a chance.

@buravan1512

2 жыл бұрын

is BYD selling EV's in BRAZIL?

@eugeniustheodidactus8890

2 жыл бұрын

Do you think there is a market for Tesla model 3 and Y in Brazil ?

@showcaseSampa

2 жыл бұрын

@@buravan1512 They are basing their local operations out of Campinas, SP. They started out with fleets, and I've spotted their own delivery vans on Sao Paulo's curbside, bearing a DHL logo. They are going to fleets, installing their charging stations at these fleets depots, and now the buzz talk is about recruiting candidates for franchised dealerships. In time they will be in full force, but unlike Chery Automobile Co. Ltd., which opened up a plant here just to see going iddle, and eventually settling with a Brazilian Partner, the Grupo Caoa, which alredady manufactures and distributes Hyundai in the entire country ( they run assembly plants and dealerships ), successfully at that. BYD passenger models are spotted in country by the specialized press, which is basically a way to plant the brand and create a level of awareness and expectations amongst consumers. I do not think they run a plant here, but give it time, and they will. Ford pulled back their operations and became merely an importer ( closures in Sao Bernardo do Campo, and Camacari Bahia, and Taubate means all Ford vehicles are now imported either from whatever little they run in Argentina and mostly Mexico ). The Europeans ( Stellantis/Fiat/Peugeot/Citroen, VW, and Renault ) are staying put. Toyota shut down its historical plant in Diadema, SP, but expanded capacity in Sorocaba SP and Indaiatuba SP. Honda remains in Sumare SP. GM , under the Chevrolet brand, still runs plants in Gravatai, RS, Sao Caetano do Sul, SP, and Sao Jose dos Campos, SP. Hyundai, under Caoa tutelage, runs plants in the State of Goias, and a plant in Piracicaba SP. Land Rover has something, maybe CKD, in Rio de Janeiro by Resende or nearby. Mercedes Benz only makes trucks in bus chassis at their plant in Sao Bernardo do Campo, SP. Most of their production is outsourced . Nowadays, most of the sheet metal stamping is actually done by outside contractors.

@dxelson

2 жыл бұрын

@@eugeniustheodidactus8890 ofcourse there is, but brazilians are not that rich, lower cost BYD EVs are much more appealing, atleast for now. Wait until Tesla releases the 25k model. However they are suply constrained that it isnt hteir priority right now, maybe in a few years.

If the Detroit OEMs have been so heavily involved in the Chinese auto market, how could they have missed the EV paradigm shift so badly?

@williamcrowley5506

2 жыл бұрын

Same way they missed the Japanese car invasion, hubris

@eugeniustheodidactus8890

2 жыл бұрын

@@williamcrowley5506 Cocaine and scotch !

@jeffreybond6491

2 жыл бұрын

ANSWER: Head in the sand approach... !!

@pikachus5m166

2 жыл бұрын

Cultural differences. GM did have a hand in the production of Chinas best selling EV, the Wuling mini, a car that would not sell in the US where F150s top the sales charts, but would in the EU where compact cars are the norm.

@lifes40123

2 жыл бұрын

Not thinking decades ahead.

Excellent discussion. Couldn't have asked for better participants. Asking Tu an entrepreneurial question at the end really put him on the spot. All this reminds me of Mr. deLaurentis (sp?) comments many years ago about China using foreign tech to boot strap their industry. All very true. Since I am not in the industry and hence have no skin in the game (also Canadian so very peripheral), I am looking forward to perhaps a different corporate viewpoint with new Chinese branded cars. Love the choices that I hope will be coming.

This was a great discussion, and very sobering for the outside-of-China auto makers.

BYD already passed VW as the number 2 highest volume global EV brand now. The writing is on the great wall here.

@laohu5511

2 жыл бұрын

That writing on the wall is in Chinese so maybe not everyone gets the message.

@johnsmith-cw3wo

2 жыл бұрын

@@laohu5511 need leaders like Trump to ban all chinese cars in western market... just crush them all like he did with Huawei.

@Ruteger100

2 жыл бұрын

Golf c art cars sold by BYD are fine in China. But will not sell in The west. That is the writing on the wall you should read.

@gadgetgasspoll2923

2 жыл бұрын

@@Ruteger100 LoL golf cart 🤣 Have you seen all of their cars

@saintkamus14

2 жыл бұрын

I lol'd

Good perspective of the Chinese auto market and how it is changing.

Excellent video, highly knowledgeable interviewees! Thank you!

Great interview John. Thanks!

For those unaware of VW's issues with their Infotainment software - I can tell you as an ID.3 owner - it's awful, if you want connectivity, interactivity and a fast touch-screen. In the past, with the traditional VW owner, software hasn't really been a problem. ICE vehicles software has always been a bit poor. People quietly complained but nobody listened. Well Tesla blew that situation apart. EVs are moving towards being robots on wheels, and those old days are over. You simply can't put an uprated bit of ICE Infotainment in an ID.3 [or any other ID Series car, like an ID.4 - they're all identical] and call it a day. Consequently, VW are now promising Tesla-like OTAs, and at a similar frequency of update. I've had 3 updates in my 12 months of driving my ID.3, which made small improvements, but not to the really important things like Driver Assist, Navigation and Voice Control. They're all still extremely poor overall. It's a nice car, but the software desperately needs to improve much more. Hopefully it will in the coming months.

@gegwen7440

2 жыл бұрын

Andy you have just answered your own question (hope all you like) It will take them years & the opposition have running shoes on not VW clogs.

@davidbeppler3032

2 жыл бұрын

But how does the door slam sound? That is the important part. Not safety, infotainment, range, or price. Door sound. Period.

@thejake8099

2 жыл бұрын

And yet Telsa, gets to continually make updates to their UI w/o complaint..Tesla's first vehicle was out for sale in 2009...and who'd have thought they'd still be making updates to their vehicle software or maybe they stopped in 2009 🙄

@ramblerandy2397

2 жыл бұрын

@@thejake8099 There's a gulf in quality between VW's software and Tesla's superior product. There's absolutely nothing wrong with improving it in updates. Teslas have become better cars after purchase, which was a factor that was unique to them, until the first other car maker started doing proper OTAs too. So please don't try to invent a Tesla negative here. The issue is VW's poor software.

Michael Dunne ( and Sandy Munro) has been ringing the alarm bells about the Chinese cars industry,since the early 2012-13 here in Autolinedaily, unfortunately Detroit has not been listening, BYD is going to end up like the Toyota of days gone by, Mark my words , Geely with its many brands and a very smart CEO/: Chairman is going to be like GM or VAG ..

@chrisbraid2907

2 жыл бұрын

What’s the bet that GM are hoping to get every Chinese EV manufacturing company to make them Cars to sell in America … I wouldn’t be surprised .

@Dogman3690

2 жыл бұрын

Correct it's been some time OEM's been dragging there feet now they have to play catch up which will never happen!

@bangikram4193

2 жыл бұрын

@@chrisbraid2907 . .s. mollllplo

both guests are excellent! 🏆

The fact that we aren't talking about Ford, GM, Stellantis ...........troubled waters ???

@johnsmith-cw3wo

2 жыл бұрын

GM at least have the partnership with Wuling, and they sell like crazy... Ford and Stellantis have jack squat.

MEANWHILE IN DETROIT, GM CEO MARY BARRRRRRÁ confirmed the companies commitment to retrofitting all 1998 8cl. models with state-of-the-art Fax Machines

In the early 1900’s Detroit had an extremely large number of small automakers and only a few survived would not be surprised if the same happens to the Chinese companies. One book which covers many of them is "Lost Car Companies of Detroit" if anyone is interested in that area.

Excellent topic and very well informed guest speakers, bring Sandy Munro as guest more often as well.

There is a GWM factory in Port Elizabeth-South Africa

both guests are super knowledgeable!

Mr. McElroy, I was hoping you hadn't just disappeared, or worse, something had happened to you. I miss my schedule of various car shows on the PBS channels . I am glad to see you are still around, even though you seem to dislike TSLA, almost as much as your friend Gary.

I would have appreciated more commentary on Tesla in China.

@mickzed6393

2 жыл бұрын

Tesla will have the same problem in time. China is just using them as a catfish. Have a look at the new BYD seal. Makes the M3 look so ordinary, especially inside and it's cheaper. Supply capability is Tesla's main BEV strength atm. In say 5 years when China is at full domestic and export supply................

For those interested in learning more about the Chinese brands they're talking about & what Tesla is doing in China, Tu writes a weekly newsletter & co-hosts a podcast called 'China EVs & More' where he goes into greater detail about what's happening in China and how it'll affect Europe & the US markets.

Tesla has pushed this traditional market hard to new technology and capability.

informative video

Thanks

There's an element left out of the conversation on why Chinese cars are doing better in China. Nationalism. Chinese are encouraged to be loyal to their own homeland brands.

@Alex-ig2xr

2 жыл бұрын

You are completely wrong. Chinese don’t use money to prove they are loyal to their country. If you go to any supermarket in China, all you see are P&G, Coca Cola, Yum brand products. Nationalism is the last thing on their mind. Chinese only started to buy Huawei cell phones after Trump put them on the map.

@ubuu7

2 жыл бұрын

Tesla is doing well though so there is clearly more than rank nationalism going on. For myself I have zero loyalty to US brands in California. If a Chinese ev maker wanted to sell me an ev that looked phenomenal with beautiful materials and displays that don't looks like they were strip mined off a color graphing calculator to save on costs I'd jump on it. Look at what kia released in the ev6 design vs VW. The ev6 looks as good or better than any audi or bmw.. Us brands with different "tiers" of brands want to keep segregating the good stuff. When new companies come in with reputation to coast on and go out of their way to offer more beauty and range for my money, I'm going with them. If I can get something that looks better than a lyric for 48k why would I spend over 60k there? And on down the line.

@tontolinification

2 жыл бұрын

Yeah like Buick

@temur72

2 жыл бұрын

The Chinese brands have improved drastically and prices are lower. They have more interior tech than cars in the US outside of luxury brands. Great Wall in the last two years has introduced great designs

@johndonaldson5126

2 жыл бұрын

Generations of Americans also bought cars out of brand loyalty. It's natural. Too bad brand loyalty is rapidly shifting away from American cars.

Nio made 26k Q1 22 - Tesla 68k March of 22. The Nio battery thing is not smart, IMO Very Good Video!!

Over 1 year later ,KZread vlogger Alex of E for Electric is still waiting for an OTA UPDATE for his VW id4, yeah that is how behind VW is in Software and Connectivity, and one reason Herbert Diess said Tesla has something VW don't have, that was in 2017, around the time of the mod3 release.

The CEO's of GM, Ford and Chrysler are overpaid to know these things and should be fired.

I'm waiting for BYD to come to America. We will have to see how long it will take western companies to catch up on the EV market.

@fredhearty1762

2 жыл бұрын

They won't catch up... the ship has sailed.

@garyh.8082

2 жыл бұрын

@@fredhearty1762 Now if we can just get that electrical grid and infrastructure in place to accommodate the increased demand to charge these electric vehicles.

@fredhearty1762

2 жыл бұрын

@@garyh.8082 Yup, that's an issue. Solar plus wind plus batteries (SWB) is now cheaper than existing coal and fossil gas fired plants, so the financials are now favorable... and most new installations are SWB. But a push is needed.

@monkeyking-self-proclaimed7050

2 жыл бұрын

BYD have been here in America for almost 2 decades. They build buses here. Their car however may not take off as fast here because we don't have the same infrastructure for it.

@neilabernath5862

2 жыл бұрын

Tesla needs competition. l heard they won't let independent mechanics work on their cars.

Little things can also make a big difference in some markets. Just the fact that Tesla has a Karaoke and legacy auto makers don't can put them at a disadvantage. That's just ONE thing.

@wizzyno1566

2 жыл бұрын

Karaoke? What are you talking about?

@frankcoffey

2 жыл бұрын

@@wizzyno1566 It's a sing along application. Tesla even sold a set of hand held microphones for it and even at $200 they sold out instantly. Legacy auto doesn't have that and won't. This will cause young people in China who don't yet own a car to want that feature when they get ready to buy one.

@joeking433

2 жыл бұрын

@@frankcoffey Yeah, that's something I always wanted in my cars, karaoke! Hahahaha!

@wizzyno1566

2 жыл бұрын

@@frankcoffeyfair enough.

This was the plan from the very beginning for non-indigenous brands in China. They were going come in, teach indigenous brands how to make cars through joint ventures, those indigenous then would market their own products, and take over the market. It was predicted decades ago and now that time has come. Why is anyone surprised in the slightest? The plan has matured and what was predicted has occurred. It’s like being surprised the sun rises in the morning. Greed caused the foreign brands to ignore the handwriting on the wall as long as they were making money. The day of reckoning everyone predicted is upon them and they act as if an unforeseen dynamic is at play.

@dxelson

2 жыл бұрын

LOL wrong. its the EV revolution. It levelled the playing field. A reset, a start from zero. China still cant compete with ICE vehicles, however the new tech EV vehicles is a whole other story.

Hey John, Keep up the good content. I consider you mainstream Detroit auto thinking and perhaps your direct focus on EV has actually helped the Detroit OEM (try to) commit to a future strategy. Perhaps they can survive. Personally I am all in with TSLA with side bets on BYD and NIO. I still drive an old V8 Ford Mustang so I hope they survive.

@zdme4864

2 жыл бұрын

Sadly the sun has set on western legacy autos including German Luxury leadership. Tesla BYD and Nio in China, Europe and the USA… and maybe Toyota Ford might be around to wave 👋 good bye … and attend the funerals of GM / STELLANTIS ( Chrysler ) ! The writing is on the chips!

Wow, this kind of discussion has taken on a whole new tone and "reality check" in the last year or so. 2022 is the oh..$h!% moment for legacy auto makers.

@brunoheggli2888

2 жыл бұрын

Its more a political thing!

@frankcoffey

2 жыл бұрын

@@brunoheggli2888 There is some stark contrast in leadership. All the way from Mary Barra "everything is fine, we are leading" to Jim Farley, "we get it, and we are going to change and have a plan". Investors are watching and are not as dumb as they look.

@brunoheggli2888

2 жыл бұрын

@@frankcoffey They are doing good,i would start to with production in India Indonesia Vietnam and Africa!It needs time but there is no big future in China anyway!The Population is ageing to fast and shrinking, the realestat matket is crahing and they have no rigjtts there!And for me personaly,why should i buy a car from a crazy Dictatorship who want to make Taiwan China again!So i oay a little more for a non china car!No problem My next Phone wont be a Xiaomi anymorw to !

@brunoheggli2888

2 жыл бұрын

@@frankcoffey And if the war in Ukrain is over we have to build some carfactorys more in Eastern europa to!This guys just always talking about the next 5 years and how china is sucessfull!China is to exoensiv in the long run and i would plan for the next 20 years!

@brunoheggli2888

2 жыл бұрын

And the people from China also buying more china brands because crazy nationalist propaganda!

TESLA best seller ev in China

Petroleum is a strategic military reserve. EV cars can be powered from home rooftops solar PV. Big 500klm battery is not needed for most daily drives. So 10 smaller batteries are cheaper and lighter and more EV cars can be built. Bigger batteries can be fitted latter...

It's so refreshing to find a group of people that don't have their head in the sand, that realize that legacy auto is getting disrupted in China. Most "regular" people I talk to are under the impression that legacy auto will simply switch to EVs in a few years, and will overtake Tesla as if it was that easy. All while not even realizing that these Chinese EV manufacturers are also surpassing legacy auto, because they don't even know they exist.

@1313hyme

2 жыл бұрын

@Kamus - I agree with you. It's like the arrival of Japanese car again. US Auto would say who cares! They're cheap, low quality, and rust all over - no worry. The Chinese? They're cheap, low quality, can't innovate, and they copy - no problem. However, the reaction from the cosumers on the arrival of Japanese cars were ok.... With the arrival of Chinese cars, it would be 'Holy shit! That car is neat!' This time the US Auto starts at the lower food chain and will have to copy the Chinese technology to compete. Example, BYD Blade battery that don't explode or catches fire, Huawei's 5G/6G driverless, ....

@suntan8655

2 жыл бұрын

This is similar to the mobile phone industry. They pretty much jumped into 3G, followed almost immediately into 4G. No legacy technologies like land lines, AMPS, GSM etc to deal with.

Future BYD's premium brand, Xiaomi, Baidu and Nio, Xpeng Li EVs would be most interesting !

China used foreign brands to come in and teach/stimulate home market and then expand OS. Job done. Tesla was allowed in on it's own, to fast track BEV. The Catfish effect. We all know China want's to be car King through BEV. Look out Tesla, when it's job done.

@wingkeeho5864

2 жыл бұрын

Telsa is following Nokia, Samsung and Motorola in China.

@chaoxiang513

2 жыл бұрын

@@wingkeeho5864 Why can't be the Apple of EV in China?

Chinese brands are transitioning to world class level much faster than Korean & Japanese brands did. All makers should do more with software updates & options, even if it's not OTA like Tesla.

John, So when TESLA comes out with the Model 2 and because of very little R&D @ $25 k: it will be all over for Legacy Automakers... Here is how TESLA will accomplish this: by stealing a page from 1970 AMC, with The Hornet ingeniously shorted to a Gremlin sub compact car... Tesla's Model 3 has newly developed one piece mega casting front and back sections, body in white, forming a skate board platform, with a structural battery pack in between...VW'S Compact lD 3 current width is 71.2" and TESLA Model 3 is 72.8" width, so very similar vehicles and tire size and wheel offset, could dial width in even more, justified by a smaller weight vehicle... 😀

Tesla and Byd are the new big boys say bye to ice OEM's! Hooray!

I can’t believe there’s absolutely no talk of NIO XPEV OR LI

@johnsmith-cw3wo

2 жыл бұрын

you did not pay attention - LOL

5 products (models) and total sales

Were at the stage the industry was at the beginning 1900s. lots of companies figuring out the ICE play. Now were in the same situation but with EVs. The few winners will come out at the end. Legacy companies need to reinvent themselves in a new world of electrification in order to survive the competition. China has a leg up because they are starting with a clean sheet at the beginning of electrification. These companies will start become profitable once this revolution becomes the norm.

Elon Musk's occasional superficial pro China tune will change the moment Tesla starts to feel the heat from local brands in the China Market.

Also, as much as I like Autoline daily they have to realize that Detroit is not the center of the universe when it comes to auto making. NEVER UNDER ESTIMATE YOUR OPPONENTS.

I live in a suburban area of the city where I live you guys should see all the foreign cars theses people are buying right here in America I think 85 thru 90% driving Toyota Nissan and Honda Hyundai Kia and this is 2 or 3 cars to a family even the children are driving foreign made cars so that’s a lot of money going to China

Tesla is inspiring the Chinese, not only in ownership but also in their process … one of the best things that the CCP has allowed happen in China …

Just shows how idiotic some are - LITHIUM EVs cannot exceed a max production of 3 Million cars annually - There ISN"T ENOUGH LITHIUM. Few Li EVs were produced until the last 2 years. The price of Li is up 1,000% 80% since Jan 22; so the demand by EVs is far outstripping LI supplies and it won't get better soon. There are 1 billion cars and 80 million sold a year - Lithium based EVs WILL NEVER make a significant dent in those figures. A totally new chemistry is required to change this equation.

byd looks like a winner

The coming revolution in autonomous cars will make car ownership irrelevant. We ought to be discussing the fall out from this new trend. Car ownership maybe practical if ur living in the boonies, but in large urban areas, autonomous cars will dominate the landscape. Will see how the future unfolds.

I listened to the whole thing. Sounds like it is Tesla and Chinese companies only in China. Go Tesla!

@randomstuffwithnofluff7472

2 жыл бұрын

I wouldn't be cheering too much, with the CCP pushing nationalism so much, Tesla will soon be pushed out also.

@davidbeppler3032

2 жыл бұрын

@@randomstuffwithnofluff7472 Ok. How will that help China? Losing Tesla is not an advantage. You think taking the factory would make China strong? Sure, but the current Tesla factory in Shanghai is sad compared to the one in Berlin. Maybe China should take it too? But wait, the Factory in Texas..... that one is better than the one in Berlin. I guess China could settle for 5 year old technology and ignore the advancements Tesla will make in the next 10 years. But that would be very bad for China. I think you are confused.

when you offend your cust n still hope they will buy from you..

LFP BATTERIES ARE KILLING ALL AUTO MAKERS THAT DON'T USE THEM. EDIT: 50% CHEAPER LAST MILLION MILES.

@ubuu7

2 жыл бұрын

Is that you Viking?

The Chinese market is going EV , and is currently 40% of sales. For China this is a huge control over incredible air pollution. And the foreign auto players are lagging on the EV side. Tesla, BYD, SAIC, Geely, Great Wall .....and they will be selling in the US by 2025

What about Tesla???

Yep that’s right we really don’t need Americo car manufacturers we can just import all the cars we need from China and Japan

One word...EVs is what changed!

The best selling EV has no connectivity.

@smasher19831983

2 жыл бұрын

So true, I don't understand this need for connectivity. Just looking at cellphones and smart devices (Apple reduced the battery size over the air to "save" it, smart devices that bricked because the over the air update was a mistake, etc) I don't understand why this crap concept is pushed in our faces.

Whoever makes the best EVs will WIN!

EV car is the only logical soution to stay in the car business. For car energy consumption, Gasoline price is about 4X to 5X than the electricity cost.

The speakers are being very restrained in their replies. The CCP sees electric cars as the opportunity to leapfrog the largest OEMs in the world. First they got them to transfer their technology, expertise and quality control systems in order to build their own industry. As was discussed in the interview, older Chinese perceived foreign brands as aspirational while younger and far more nationalistic citizens are increasingly leaning toward their own brands. The largest market in the world is changing rapidly and with the central government favouring their own companies, we can expect to see several foreign brands abandon the Chinese market in the coming years.

Didn’t GM announce that they were forming a new Chinese market brand above Cadillac?

Why do the Chinese EV stocks suck so bad?

@johnsmith-cw3wo

2 жыл бұрын

panic... not economics... fear China will ''pull a Russia'' and invade Taiwan.

Toyota won’t be sleeping during this period of time, you’ll see 🤔🚘

@OKFrax-ys2op

2 жыл бұрын

@@manle2337 Japanese are experts in that sort of field

@npc2480

2 жыл бұрын

@@OKFrax-ys2op have you’ve seen the Sony phones? Terrible.

@OKFrax-ys2op

2 жыл бұрын

@@npc2480 I haven’t, just keeping my old Apple 🍎

I keep hearing China is in trouble. Looks like at least the Chinese auto industry is thriving.

What's wrong w/ ICE? Nobody talks about how EV is worse for the environment and not recyclable

@npc2480

2 жыл бұрын

With electric vehicles you have instant torque, quiet cabin, no oil changes, no transmission fluid changes, no timing belts or chains to worry about, don’t have to worry about bad alternators, bad starters, power steering fluids or pump to replace, don’t need to worry about blown head gasket or rod bearings going bad, etc etc. and with gas prices at about $4.50 a gallon, it’s a no brainer.

Deals with a devil usually end up with you being in trouble.

@Zhujac

2 жыл бұрын

Evil spread hate and lie😃😃😃

Guys, as things develop with Taiwan over the next 3 years expect Tesla to be effectively banned in China either by direct government action or by consumer boycott.

@HTeo-og1lg

2 жыл бұрын

Tesla has just signed with BYD to produce their model 3's battery pack. The scale and innovative vectors that BYD represents is truly amazing. Even Elon has completely changed his view of BYD as a vehicle company recently as its R&D is second to none.

@npc2480

2 жыл бұрын

Tesla will be fine in China as long as Elon stays neutral when it comes to Taiwan.

This is the fate of greedy... tax payer money shouldnt be spend on saving those big companies..

@rtriplett3135

2 жыл бұрын

Does this also include all of the subsidies afforded the petroleum industry? For transparency, I drive a Tesla AND I own an oil and gas company (a very small one).

@rtriplett3135

2 жыл бұрын

Does this also include all of the subsidies afforded the petroleum industry? For transparency, I drive a Tesla AND I own an oil and gas company (a very small one).

@longsho2796

2 жыл бұрын

@@rtriplett3135 nope.. big company moved their factories to china i mean...

@johnsmith-cw3wo

2 жыл бұрын

@@longsho2796 not the oil industry

LOL 51% 49%...

Drill baby drill

The market size is full of people who earn less than 600 dollars a year. Not potential customers for expensive EVs. Were talking about 1/2 the population. BYD is selling fleet vehicles that sit under bridges until they are able to acquire the government subsidies. Undriven cars are parked on hillsides collecting fees for the companies. Where are the spare parts for Chinese cars? Do you trust the batteries the y supply with the cars? Are the tires made in china. All of these factors spell doom for Chinese branded cars in the free world.

If legacy automakers don't move away from away ICE vehicles, they will turn to fossils just like the dinosaurs.

@randolphtorres4172

2 жыл бұрын

It’s to late.

@williamegler8771

2 жыл бұрын

@@randolphtorres4172 T-O-O Don't discount legacy automakers. They are fully capable of designing engineering and manufacturing competitive EV's and can produce them at a lower cost. Not everyone can afford a Tesla or Lucid. Also people have some degree of brand loyalty and the comfort of maintenance and repair as well as sales provided by a established dealer network.

@joeking433

2 жыл бұрын

Well, duh, I'm pretty sure they're going to transition to EV's for they've all said as much. Smh.

Another factor is that nationalism has been on the rise in China for no good reasons. Xi’s getting his 3rd term or not later this year can play a major factor. China may be the biggest fish in the ocean but there are so many others when it comes to investing. The risks may not be justified.

Mind Begs the Question: NATO,Corporates capable to Boycott Russia over Ukraine/Petro Dollar NATO,Corporates not capable to Boycott China over Concentration Camps?

Monkeys are smarter than "analysts". Chip shortage is what causing sales down, not what the stupid analysts think.

I am an old fashion guy. I am still sticking to my gasoline car. I will stay away from EV. Cars are only means of transportation, why do you need so many connectivity? you are watching movie, calling your friends while driving? Not to say of the cost when owning the car, can you afford to let your EV fixed wh

I think GM is doomed. They just can't seem to make cars anybody wants any longer. If Chevy is failing in China GM will lose profits from that brand that need to be funneled into EV cars. The Bolt has been put back into production but sales are low. GM is too large, with too many employees, union pressures, and the company has decided to maintain the corporate structure with ICE and EV in one package that is going to kill innovation. Ford has a chance because they are willing to push forward into electrification. Honda is struggling, killing off some of the better models and forming partnerships to hold onto the brand loyalty. Toyota is suddenly pushing their BZ line of cars. I can't get enough data regarding the percentage of BZ cars that is actually Chinese rather than Toyota. The whole automotive world is being turned up-side-down. I fear America is about to see only one car company survive which is Tesla. All of the companies are throwing features into the cars to grab market share. The big question is who is gong to own the middle price range of $25-30K.

Who didnt see this coming in china?

Tu Le is so wrong on so many levels. He mentioned all those SOEs without mentioning one of the largest one, Chang An. Also he didn't know one of the best selling EV coming from China sold internationally is MG, which is from a SOE called SAIC. One of the best selling EV brand inside China, Aion, is also from a SOE called GAC. Tu Le loves hyping Geely when in fact Geely's Zeekr EV brand only sold a few thousands EV per month, while Aion sold over 10k EVs per month. Why is the so called Sino Auto Insights keeping forgetting about MG, Aion, Chang An, Wuling brands which are all from SOE auto makers???

Also I think it has to do with politics. Western countries were bushing China in the daily bases for about the last 10 years. Chinese people are very patriotic to their government. It can be some resentment to western brands.

Greatwall are SHIT . I’ve owned one .

I think Gm will survive but not sure about ford and chrysler. I think someone will buy them out but very scary.

@joeking433

2 жыл бұрын

I'm worried about Tesla, too. They just don't have enough models out to compete, it seems to me.

@aurelio-reymilaorcabal9669

2 жыл бұрын

@@joeking433 Tesla has no debt , the biggest automaker by MCap,Elon can raise Cash w/ a tweet,GM is # 1 in Mary Barras dreams and the UNIONS UAW halls , and of course US President Joe Biden Dem Party.

@joeking433

2 жыл бұрын

@@aurelio-reymilaorcabal9669 Mary Barra could kick King Elon's ass with one hand tied behind her back! ;)

@aurelio-reymilaorcabal9669

2 жыл бұрын

@@joeking433 Mary Bitch will lead GM to BK #2😅🤣😅😂LOL

@aurelio-reymilaorcabal9669

2 жыл бұрын

@@joeking433 Tesla earrings beat again and margins was 32+%, Please ask Mary Bitch what their margins are on its Dolts.

Have to find electricy to power the future. Electric cars too expensive already, long way to go for power supply. Better public transportation, services, interesting city's most people what to live in.

The whole world auto market will surely be EV market. Those old auto companise cannot compete with Chinese EV company eill be out from the market. Coming soon !

VW failing. gM failing, Ford failing too? who is winning? Seems only Tesla.

Fiat-Chrysler brands were never that great in China. Ford did better but not as good as GM whom had a JV with SAIC (owner of LDV and MG). GM is on the wane there now which is a problem for them given that they have withdrawn from most global markets outside of America.

The Chinese government is running out of money. The Chinese EV auto makers are heavily reliant on the Chinese government. Will the USA and the EU allow Chinese auto makers into their market?

@windsong3wong828

2 жыл бұрын

Brain dead observation.

Electric vehicles are great but I wouldn't put all my pennies into One bank account with them. With all the rare earth materials involved to make batteries then seems how China has that market cornered it's always good to not rely on solely one technology. The infrastructure is not even close to ready if everybody went out and got an electric car right now. But they are pretty cool... Toyotas new bev lineup will up the ev car segment.

"O CHILDREN OF MEN! Know ye not why We created you all from the same dust? That no one should exalt himself over the other. Ponder at all times in your hearts how ye were created. Since We have created you all from one same substance it is incumbent on you to be even as one soul, to walk with the same feet, eat with the same mouth and dwell in the same land, that from your inmost being, by your deeds and actions, the signs of oneness and the essence of detachment may be made manifest. Such is My counsel to you, O concourse of light! Heed ye this counsel that ye may obtain the fruit of holiness from the tree of wondrous glory." Baha'u'llah (The promised one of all ages) “O army of God! Beware lest ye harm any soul, or make any heart to sorrow; lest ye wound any man with your words, be he known to you or a stranger, be he friend or foe. Pray ye for all; ask ye that all be blessed, all be forgiven. Beware, beware, lest any of you seek vengeance, even against one who is thirsting for your blood. Beware, beware, lest ye offend the feelings of another, even though he be an evil-doer, and he wish you ill. Look ye not upon the creatures, turn ye to their Creator. See ye not the never-yielding people, see but the Lord of Hosts. Gaze ye not down upon the dust, gaze upward at the shining sun, which hath caused every patch of darksome earth to glow with light”. （Abdu'l-Baha, Selections from the Writings of Abdu'l-Baha, p. 73） Dear friends! Alas, a thousand times alas, that
a Revelation so incomparably great, so infinitely
precious, so mightily potent, so manifestly
innocent, should have received, at the hands
of a generation so blind and so perverse, so
infamous a treatment!
"O My servants!" Bahá’u’lláh (The promised one of all ages) Himself testifies,
"The one true God is My witness! This most
great, this fathomless and surging ocean is
near, astonishingly near, unto you. Behold it
is closer to you than your life vein! Swift as
the twinkling of an eye ye can, if ye but wish
it, reach and partake of this imperishable favor,
this God-given grace, this incorruptible gift,
this most potent and unspeakably glorious
bounty."
 
 ~ Shoghi Effendi, The Promised Day is Come, p. 15

Foreign automakers who wanted a piece of the China market are out of time. 5-10 years ago, Chinese cars were a joke, but they've been paying attention and taking notes, and at this point, they don't need the Americans and Europeans to make cars for their domestic auto market (although the majority are still not good enough for export). The upside? The Chinese have been copying American and European designs and processes, and largely ignoring what are usually superior Japanese ones that would be more fitting to that culture and market, simply because the Chinese and Japanese have a VERY rocky history, which is an understatement. China is still a good 10 years off from being world class, especially if the state-owned Chinese companies still have too much state influence.

Chinese automakers are mature to produce equivalence competition. Also US “Anti Chinese” policies targeting Chinese companies ~ US companies market would be affected and will decline. Also, with a rapid technological improvements n fast turnaround of the Chinese manufacturing prowess, US/EU r slow to react n response to tech~ this is where, Chinese EV r pioneering. Future is China EVs conquering market dominance.

When I see I will worry about Tesla…Tesla is all I see on the roads so not worried

EV's have their place but ICE's will never die = Energy Density...

@ColinFox

2 жыл бұрын

ICE *must* die -- the climate can't afford it any more.

@aurelio-reymilaorcabal9669

2 жыл бұрын

Keep Smoking those⛽ Gas fumes

@seemoretoys5944

2 жыл бұрын

@@aurelio-reymilaorcabal9669 You saying it get you high? What are you, a huffer?

@johnsmith-cw3wo

2 жыл бұрын

@@aurelio-reymilaorcabal9669 by the end of the decade, most EV will have longer autonomy than a tank of gas.

Yes, you can buy NIO! I don't buy Chinese EV. I will never buy Chinese car......

I just googled several ev's mentioned in the show... sedans only...including a lucid...they all basically look the same...All cars are just so similar...wind resistance, current fashion...etc....attractive but the same...cars are "woke" no individuality anymore in general.

@benjaminsmith2287

2 жыл бұрын

There's no such thing as a "woke" car. People need to stop using a term when they don't understand what it means. In terms of cars, they've looked similar for a long time. Aerodynamics are shaping the sedans so there are certain similarities.

@desobrien3827

2 жыл бұрын

@@benjaminsmith2287 Whatever!!!

$60k for a Chinese EV? Hahahaha!

@aurelio-reymilaorcabal9669

2 жыл бұрын

A Chinese Hongqi cost more than that, it looks like a RRoyce, is pure EV, The Chinese will have the last laugh, today nobody laughing @ Hyundai and Kia, they were jokes from 1984 to 2000, my friend had a Pony and a coworker had a Stellar,You probably never heard of those Hyundais.

@joeking433

2 жыл бұрын

@@aurelio-reymilaorcabal9669 The Chinese will never succeed in the West. They need to stay in China to make it, and even then some Chinese are saying that only 1 in a 100 Chinese EV companies will not fail! Who wants to buy an EV from a Chinese company when 99% of them are going to go bankrupt???

@johnsmith-cw3wo

2 жыл бұрын

@@aurelio-reymilaorcabal9669 Korea is not communist (except North) it will be different. Need leaders like Trump to ban all chinese cars in western market... just crush them all like he did with Huawei. no matter how good and affordable they are. - and with no communist competition, our lord and saviour Elon will take Tesla TO THE MOON !!!!

@longmarch2668

2 жыл бұрын

You have no clue

Have you seen the BMW i4?? Wow! It's killer! I can't see anyone but the Chinese to choose a Chinese EV over a BMW EV.

@aurelio-reymilaorcabal9669

2 жыл бұрын

I4 is an EV in a ICE body,BMW is a dying company, kind of a walking ZOMBIE , they just don't know it yet, current profits are from ICE, " Ultimate Driving Machine" is long past its due date, today CONNECTED CARS are the thing.

@joeking433

2 жыл бұрын

@@aurelio-reymilaorcabal9669 No one wants a "connected car"! No one gives a shit about that but nerds like you! LOL! Most people just want the same cars they love made to be less polluting in EV form. Smh. I would LOVE a BMW i4! I'd buy it LONG before I'd buy a Tesla with all their inherent problems especially when it's so much harder to get service for a BMW compared to getting service from Tesla which doesn't even have a repair shop in some states!

@teohck7630

2 жыл бұрын

Looks can be deceiving. Substance is what you should be looking for and talking about.

@aurelio-reymilaorcabal9669

2 жыл бұрын

YOU haven't got a clue,and Germans have got no clue about CONNECTED CARS and Software,a year after the VW Id series cars were introduced, owners are still waiting for OTA updates, like VWs CEO Herbert Diess says , "Tesla has something we dont have".

@joeking433

2 жыл бұрын

@@teohck7630 I've had BMW's and they're "the ultimate driving machine"! Tesla is still working out the bugs in their little cars, still trying to get the fit and finish acceptable.