Hope you all enjoyed! Let me know your thoughts

I like how they were after legacies apparently so they mess with thorn armor and make them stronger

I guess they did this for the upcoming autoaxe and melee buffs they're working on 🙌

@TYRYT

2 жыл бұрын

That is pretty much the reason yes! As I said in the video automatic melee weapons like rippers or the upcoming auto axe were pretty broke my powerful with thorn armor - just a overdue course correction on bethesdas part

@michalkuna1994

2 жыл бұрын

@@TYRYT how is that possible that Mr handy buzz blade belongs to two-handed weapons but when I use it on my character it uses only one hand. 🤔 however ,it is pretty powerful with electromode especially my aa fss blade

@mrkilljr.8743

2 жыл бұрын

@@TYRYT better times will come

@giantpunda2911

2 жыл бұрын

That auto axe better be darn amazing given how hard nerfed Thorn armour has been and to a lesser extent auto melee weapons in general.

@michalkuna1994

2 жыл бұрын

@@giantpunda2911 even now after nerf i do pretty good with my aa fss blade ,against bosses with fully optimized build it still does a good amount of damage

As always, great video TYR! Thanks!

Thanks TYR, great info.

I assume it's a bug but scouts life 4 seems to increase the duration of bleed out, and critical shorts apply all bleed out damage at once instead of overtime

I don't really notice as a full health melee build, everything I punch either dies or has a sliver of health left and the bleed still finishes them. I didn't do the stack thing on bosses but it was fun fucking with people in PvP

Nice vid, ty for it btw, but one error I'd like to address(someone else prob has already) but your calc's are a bit off. Unless you mean a single hit and walk off. It would be moire like 320dmg / 10 seconds (IE as long as u keep re-applying the 5second talon and bladed dot, and the thorn each 10) Not a huge difference but it still is there

@TYRYT

Жыл бұрын

No error, I explained it exactly as it works off of a single hit.

I am having a wonderful time running around in my thorn armor. I did notice that getting bashed with a weapon doesn't seem to deal any damage back. It has to be a legit melee attack from an enemy. I get bashed as much as I get meleed.

thanx very much for your vids.

I was already in the process of switching my unarmed explosive build to thorn armor but now i think its time to start maining it for a bit to get it done. Bc this has to be nasty in pvp.

Is thorn better with ur melee build or secret service?

Thanks for the clear explanation! What would the perfect 3 star Thorn armor set be?

@ieatbatteries_2615

Жыл бұрын

uny/ap/* for pve and ass/ap/sent for pvp

I dunno about other people but it seems like they are trying to make a good attempt at balancing the game which I am all for, this would be a perfect opportunity for them to balance Legacies alongside the explosive buff side effect they received.

@TYRYT

2 жыл бұрын

I agree wholeheartedly

@chubsrage3281

Жыл бұрын

Or just remove legacies they say they cant change them but bruh they nuked legacy shotguns but buffed legacy gatling plasma lol

I’m probably saying something stupid or impossible but with legacy’s can’t they have an item checker then a legendary checker and if the two don’t match like Gatling plasma with explosive just add like a confetti legendary affect to it automatically so the weapon is just a confetti cannon not doing any damage

I run a nasty bloodied stealth one handed melee build using a plasma cutter and secret service armor I'm gonna upgrade that build to thorn armor once I re craft an unyielding set and my tank build is on my solar armor

I thought it was nerfed but I busted my old dusty set out and this filthy thing absolutely Molly wops ANYTHING. It’s not a compound increase but a flat damage increase. For someone like me who loves slapping mobs with melee, it’s absolutely a buff and it’s so fun lmfaooo i one shot EVERYTHING except bosses or mini bosses. I like the change.

What about Scout's life magazine that extends bleedout time by 100% does that make it double the amount of bleed time=double damage?

@TYRYT

2 жыл бұрын

Bleed out time refers to you being downed. You know those times when you don’t die and just lay in the ground waiting to be revived. That gets extended.

@naxxy00

2 жыл бұрын

Oh I always had this confused and thought it works with bleed damage 🤦‍♂️ thanks for explanation😆

I am going to try this with the new pint sized slasher knife w sacrificial blade mod 🍻

talons and bladed mods will actually do 50 and 20 bleed damage respectively because you can activate them twice in the time that it takes the bleed effects from the armor to stop so you really do 420 damage. Nice

How is this „Thorn Armor Defence“ working? When someone attacks me than those guy is getting some damage?

Completed my unyielding thorn set (2 parts sentinel!2cav!!omfg) I am loving just running around like mad holding down attack with bloody ss buzz blade. I get way more exp than when I felt compelled to kill everything I targeted

The cost to craft the armor should be reduced it's way too expensive or add the ability to reroll the armor

Super late to the discussion, but I wondered how (or if) the Scouts’ Life 4 magazine (100% longer bleed out time) would effect the stats. Would you really be dishing out additional bleed time, and if so, are you actually reducing the damage per second if the damage is limited? Would something overrule/negate that? I guess I’m just trying to figure out if it’s helpful or detrimental. Thanks!

@TYRYT

Жыл бұрын

That bleed out time on the magazine is referring to your player being knocked down ready to be stimpaked and revived

@nitekrawler455

Жыл бұрын

@@TYRYT many thanks man, that makes sense.

First time iv seen this armour I tack it it doesent work for assault rifles ext ext?

I was just thinking why doesn't the Deathclaw Gauntlet and Talons work together as it would make sense as Its similar to the other gauntlet then is the question why doesn't it also inflict 🩸 as it's a super sharp set of claws hence why it's so effective just a thought.

I wonder what the DMG would be with the Sacrificial Blade machetes lol

@TYRYT

2 жыл бұрын

Not much more, that adds 3 poison damage if I remember correctly… since memory’s have poison resistance then that will be lower unfortunately

So twisted muscles doesn’t help this with melees?

rip bleed

I would still say this is a major nerf to Thorn Armor. Even before the nerf it wasn't doing as much damage as a good Commando build or a good Power Armor build. So to decrease the damage even more with Thorn Armor compared to what it was is a nerf and not helping balance melee build with other build types. I understand not having it be an infinite stack but it still needs to be more than just 5x damage. Needs to be at least 10x if not more. Yet they keep buffing legacies with the last couple of patches.

@TYRYT

2 жыл бұрын

I understand - but thorn armor ISNT the sole proprietor of one’s build, it’s an add on, an extra, a bonus to slightly increase a melee builds dps. If it were any more powerful then you wouldn’t need a melee build at all, just use bleed.

@JarlJohan

2 жыл бұрын

@@TYRYT I see wat you mean BUT the Thorn armor is an absolute bitch to grind for because it needs both legendary crafting materials and vault steel, plus it CAN NOT re-roll! You have to make a new piece every time. In addition to being a pain to grind for its defensive stats are not that great in comparison to bos or secret service. It use to be worth the grind and the lower defense to get that extra bleed dmg. Not anymore. New players probably wont be interested in getting it now and old players are salty all that grinding might not have been worth it.

It's a good balancing act but not sure it's worth the gold grind and the RNG legendary rolling. Still, great analysis as always, Tyr!

@TYRYT

2 жыл бұрын

Yeah I’m not sure if it’s worth it either tbh. It’s some good extra damage tho Cheers mate

I assume the duration is refreshed with each punch, right?

@TYRYT

Жыл бұрын

Yes

Thanks Tyr but if you factor in how much of a grind/server hop chore a decent set of Thorn is to get and the fact it’s poor defensively compared to secret service etc this still feels like an unnecessary nerf. The SBQ for example (according to wiki) has a health pool of 32767 HP so without stacking that’s a lot of swings! Not everyone wants to min max or be a food build and Bethesda seems to keep pushing people to a heavy gunner build probably to sell PA skins in atom shop lol

@TYRYT

2 жыл бұрын

Yes, it would take 86 swings over a duration of 14 minutes to kill the queen with purely bleed damage But if you add that damage on top of an optimised melee build ( like mine ) then that’s a huge dps increase on top of my already punishing strikes. I feel it’s in a good spot personally, not too op and not too weak - serves its purpose as a nice build buffer

@ericterry3512

2 жыл бұрын

Too bad you can't climb on her back and get her in the sky.

I'm on the fence tbh, still think there need to be adjustments to melee good info tho👌

@TYRYT

2 жыл бұрын

Absolutely agree, adjustments to melee need to come

I used Thorn primarily for pvp. Pvp wise it's been nerfed to the ground. RIP 💀

Tyr, these number in theory are fine and all and you demonstrated that they're fine with trash mobs. However, what's the result like with tankier enemies like all the acronym creatures - MLK, SS, ISS, SBQ etc? I mean there are plenty of examples of weapons that can perform just fine with trash mobs but are worthless against any boss-type enemies. Does thorn with unarmed also fall into this category?

@TYRYT

2 жыл бұрын

Well obviously it’s not that great against bosses, the queen has 32767 health and you can deal a maximum of 385 pure damage over a duration of 10 seconds so it will take you 86 punches to kill her purely by bleed damage over a duration of 14 minutes But that’s still extra damage you can pack on top of your melee or unarmed build - it’s literally free dps increase It’s not too weak or too powerful, I feel the damage is in an alright spot for the moment for what it is.

@giantpunda2911

2 жыл бұрын

@@TYRYT Thanks for the response. Appreciate it! Hope Bethesda keeps working on balancing builds. It'd be a shame if this was the best that melee could expect in terms of build power.

thorn is the only thing i grind for because end game shit

My best melee weapon is a guantlet and my armor is Secret Service. Using shock pads on guantlet seems much better than the blade. Should I switch to Thorn and the blade? How big is the difference?

When hack n slash activates, will that hit cause bleed?

@TYRYT

2 жыл бұрын

Sadly no, I tested that a while ago

I want a bloody Katana with bleed damage

@TYRYT

2 жыл бұрын

I do too!

@Kwispygod

2 жыл бұрын

Rivers of blood intensifies

Bethesda needs to buff the F4 Assault rifle! Give it a flat +20 fire rate boost to all of it's Receivers or something.

It's lame, almost all meta builds kill faster than ten seconds. the fun of old thorn was stack and walk away, it never approached commando/h gunner ttk.

I consider this a big nerf to my thorn build and since you can’t reroll the armor pieces to get the effects you want I may move away from the thorn armor onto something else

Does bloody mess perk buff the armor bleeds?

@michaeleldridge5224

Жыл бұрын

For that matter does the perk that buffs damage vs glowing enemys

@michaeleldridge5224

Жыл бұрын

My plasma cutter bloodied build already 1 shots 2/3 of the game but If I can integrate the bleeds from this armor I'll be able to smash on anything in game without much trouble I know the lack of range sortof makes melee inferior but it's still so much more fun to play for me and stuff like thorn armor is the cream of the crop when it comes to maximizing overall dps Before I start rebuilding hundreds of thorn armor chunks in search of that 1 set of unyielding I hope I get my bloodied faster swing speed +1strength roll on my extra cutter

This is unfortunate, melee is fine when mobbing, terrible against bosses so the bleed stack was nice

Thorn armor is huge balance problem, but legacies are perfectly fine. Joke aside beth, please fix legacies.

Im not early am I??

@TYRYT

2 жыл бұрын

Right on time

This is a very shitty effect. I could just kill whatever it is I’m fighting by swinging again.

@TYRYT

2 жыл бұрын

If it’s a weak enemy sure. Tough enemies get their hp drained quite a bit, it’s a nice DPS increase if you look at it logically

it didnt infinate stack. it was a 10 sec duration.so top most possible useing a rpm weapon was roughly 12-20 ish at max pls stop calling it infinite lol so 50x20 so possable 1k

@TYRYT

2 жыл бұрын

Yes it literally could infinitely stack. The patch notes bethesda wrote LITERALLY said that this was unintentional and they changed it. The RPM or hits per second that you could get off in the ten second period for one person are irrelevant…. Multiple people could hit the same enemy and stack of far beyond what you just stated…. It could stack infinity with no cap.

Legacies are fine the issue is that there’s nothing exciting in the game. U ruin legacies u destroy the game. Everyone who has one will peace out.

@TYRYT

2 жыл бұрын

Incorrect. Don’t let the door hit you on the way out squirt

@gettinhookedtv1761

2 жыл бұрын

You must be ignorant if you think destroying legacies wouldn’t make people leave. People want new additions to the game. The veterans are tired of the same repetitive crap thats the bigger issue. If u don’t see that you clearly are a little slow. Btw no one likes a little keyboard warrior acting tough kiddo…

@sirvilhelm3569

Жыл бұрын

Like 5% of people?

Automatic melee weapons aren't even usable the damage pathetic 🙄 at no stage of the game were they viable weapons without a massive buff

@TYRYT

2 жыл бұрын

Just wait until they balance automatic melee weapons with the Pitt

Why does everyone yell "NeRf LeGaCiEs!" when they should yell "Buff other builds!"?. Just look at pistol builds, melee builds, shotgun, rifle (except stealth builds) and the list goes on. Hell, they still didn't fix flamers barrel issue!

@TYRYT

2 жыл бұрын

People are yelling both.

@dakotasnyder7111

2 жыл бұрын

I hope they do well on making melee better they seriously need a buff, as is at queen you dont see any hp dropping fast enough unless you're bloodied andnit shouldnt have to be bloodied to see health go down noticeably with 1h or 2h weapons

@giantpunda2911

2 жыл бұрын

You say this as if they're mutually exclusive. You can "nerf" legacies (you're actually fixing a bug) as well as buff builds that desperately need it.

@AakuKanasta

2 жыл бұрын

@@giantpunda2911 I'd call it not a bug but a variety, we have crusader pistol don't forget that bad boy

@TYRYT

2 жыл бұрын

The crusader pistol is not powerful by any means lmao are ya serious dawg

God, what a flawed logic, what is the point of min/maxing a damage when it WAS already effective and not OP? So you take a good damage, make it inferior and get players to try to min/max the ruins? And the so called balancing? Poorly done balance only meant making everything the same, they ain't giving these armor away for free, why take away fun factors for no practical reasons? Game is supposed to be fun or is that a hard to grasp concept?

@TYRYT

Жыл бұрын

Yes unlimited damage was so balanced, oh how flawed my logic is.

@stephen876

Жыл бұрын

@@TYRYTPlease, we both know this isnt the thing that killed bosses in 20 secs, it's not OP, so stop trying to claim this is some overpowered damage. This so called balance killed the armor set and that is why no one is running this anymore, those min/max? While cares if the whole thing is useless and sub par compared to others sets by a large margin? This nerf is the whole mentality of taking away other people's piece of cake instead of trying to achieve a piece of your own (as in other playstyles), ignorantly selfish at its finest (by those who complained).

@TYRYT

Жыл бұрын

@@stephen876 I’m not oven going to read your reply, just respond to let you know you are very salty and should probably go outside at some point. You sad little human x

imagine "balacing" a PVE game getting rid of all the fun in the game LMAO

@TYRYT

2 жыл бұрын

Have you ever played any other online pve games like this? Balance is the name of the game - some games get nerfs and buffs twice a week, borderlands, destiny, eso ect ect

LeGaCiEs. Y’all cry too much, they’re not going anywhere and they’re not getting nerfed. Not when people pay real money for them and Bethesda gets a kick back.

@TYRYT

2 жыл бұрын

This will age poorly and I can’t wait