If an Organization REFUSES to disclose attendance info, there is only one reason why they won't.

@rebeccabibliotheca

10 ай бұрын

That is such a great point!!

@samsmom400

8 ай бұрын

They won't let you record the services like other churches, what does THAT tell you?!?

@krismurphy7711

8 ай бұрын

@@samsmom400 Well, that I understand. I grew up in the Church. They believe that meetings are relatively special/sacred. But, I do agree that if you are willing to say something, it should be viewable for all to review.

@samsmom400

8 ай бұрын

@@krismurphy7711 I'm ExMo. I went back once after I left the "church" maybe about 8 years later and just after I had surrendered my life to Jesus. It was really weird. I actually took notes. Each speaker talked about the reason why "we" were put on this earth was to baptize the dead. It was in a ward in CA, not the one I escaped from in FL. It felt so godless and empty. While it seemed familiar, I couldn't believe that I used to listen to all of that and think it was true. "Sacred, not secret", I remember. No, the Lord wants EVERYONE to come to Him. There's nothing too sacred for His children, that really doesn't make any sense. Everyone is His creation, but only those who believe in Jesus Christ are His children. "Believe" has a completely different meaning then most people know and understand. If you are in the Mormon "church", you don't "believe".

@krismurphy7711

8 ай бұрын

@@samsmom400 I find myself defending The Church and TBMs from time to time…this will be one of them. Good, active Mormons are good Christians. They just happen to be burdened with a lot of add ons which really dont conflict with Christianity in making them less Christian. The Temple Ceremonies I think are a complete fabrication. I hate the idea of secret handshakes and passwords and ridicule the very idea, BUT that is an add on. All Members, as you know, accept baptism and take the sacrament each week. This is 100% Christian and baptism is one of the few To-Dos that Jesus did. They do focus on “work for the dead.” But that is 100% charitable and does mirror baptism at least. Overall, Mormons DO more than most Christians. Is it necessary or from real revelation, I don’t believe so.

Thank you Simon Southerton for not mincing words, telling things as they really are. I have been hurt by the church, and I am glad when there are declining numbers. I had been in scouting, and in young men’s presidency’s, and other youth callings for 19 years of my adult life until I got so burnt out, I had to ask for a release from my youth callings. Only to be released from my calling and then shortly after the church discontinued the young men’s presidency callings. I was immediately called into the bishopric, to continue working with the youth. I love the youth, but I was so burnt out from camping all the time with them, and doing weekly activities in a small branch where I was basically doing all the work. Then I was shunned and ridiculed for having some concerns. I was actually chastised by general authorities, for asking a question. I quit going to church at the beginning of 2022, and I am so glad. - Rodney Huckaby

@brettpinion4233

10 ай бұрын

Evidence for Book of Mormon in ancient America- none Evidence showing Book of Mormon is a 19th century religious fiction below: No wheat, no barley, no goats, no steel found in the Americas, no metal smelting furnaces, no metal armor, no temples, no steel swords, no skeletons of these warriors, no graves, no cities (it would be impossible for a city the size of Zarahemla to leave no trace), no cattle, no chariot parts, no Nephite coins (listed in book of Alma as being used for a thousand years), no Jewish relics from supposed jews, no metal plates like Nephites supposedly had, no artifacts whatsoever, no Nephite "reformed Egyptian" writings; and no evidence the book of Mormon "prophets" ever existed. There is zero archaeological, anthropological, topological, linguistic, or DNA evidence to support the Book of Mormon. It would be impossible for highly advanced civilizations (Jaredites, Nephites) with millions of people to have vanished off the face of the earth. The whole face of the land had become covered with buildings” (Mormon 1:7) “Two million Jaredites slain” (Ether 15:2) 38 cities are catalogued in the Book of Mormon, along with iron, steel, brass, metal swords, breast-plates, shields, armor, or chariots. Yet, not one item mentioned in the Book of Mormon has ever been discovered in America. The Book of Mormon speaks of sheep, swine, goats, wheat, barley, silk, and elephants-even though they weren’t brought to America until centuries later by Europeans in post-Columbian times. Again we see that Joseph Smith was thinking about things in his current day as he was fabricating the Book of Mormon. CAN WE TRUST OUR HEARTS as to book of Mormon since there is no evidence? Maroni chapter 10:4 says: "he will manifest the truth of it unto you" But: THE BIBLE WARNS YOU about trusting your own heart. Jeremiah 17:9 "the heart is deceitful above all things". Proverbs 28:26 "He that trusteth in his own heart is a fool." Please don't be a fool. The entire belief system and premise of Mormonism is based on a false claim the Bible was corrupted and "plain and precious parts" were removed by early Christian translators sometime after the apostles had all died. This is a very dangerous claim to make against the word of God, especially since God promised us his word would never pass away and would be with us forever (Isaiah 40:8; Psalms 100:5; Matthew 16:18, 24:35; 1 Peter 1:23-25). An Objective Test of the Bible and Book of Mormon The Claim: In the Book of Mormon, the prophet Nephi has a vision the Bible was corrupted after the 12 apostles preached it and after the formation of the “great and abominable church” (1 Nephi 13:26-29). Most Mormons believe this to be the Catholic Church which was formed early in the 4th century. Nephi claims this church was founded by the Devil to lead souls to hell (1 Nephi 14:3). So let’s objectively examine both the Bible and the Book of Mormon to be fair and test if any have errors. Bible: The earliest Dead Sea Scrolls have been historically dated by three different dating techniques to as early as 350 BC. Included in this discovery was the Great Isaiah Scroll, which is the oldest known complete copy of the Book of Isaiah and is dated to approximately 200 BC. Study the dead sea scrolls which are over 2,000 years old and see if they have Joseph Smith's uncorrupted version. They should if Joseph Smith was correct and the bible had been corrupted over time but, no they do not. They are the same today as they were over 2,100 years ago with only minor spelling or punctuation differences. Joseph Smith was wrong. The bible had not been corrupted. “You are my witnesses,” declares the Lord, “and my servant whom I have chosen, that you may know and believe me and understand that I am he. Before me no god was formed, nor shall there be any after me.” (Isaiah 43:10) If Mormonism is true, then God could not make the claim that there were no gods before him, for he was just a man at one point; nor could he claim that no gods would come after him, for that is the goal of every member of the LDS church. The new testament has not been corrupted either. Take for example John 1:1 a very important verse than Smith changed to make Jesus a created being. A papyri known as the Bodmer Papyri which is almost 1900 years old of the book of John. (this papyri was written not long after the apostle John would have died and it shows joseph smith changed the book of John, not that it got corrupted later as he alleged) John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God. ΕΝ ΑΡΧΗ ΗΝ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ ΚΑΙ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ ΗΝ ΠΡΟΣ ΤΟΝ ΘΕΟΝ ΚΑΙ ΘΕΟΣ ΗΝ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ I post this in love. The manuscript and archeological evidence for the bible is the greatest of anything in antiquity. I pray that you know the real Jesus, real peace, love and true salvation. "But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed." Galatians 1 One is a Jesus who is not eternal and was the spirit brother of lucifer in pre-existence & a God the Farther who was once a man - an exulted man. The other is the eternal Word, the Alpha and Omega- Jesus, by whom created all things, seen and unseen. And a God the Father who says the He alone is God, nor any god before, not any god after. There is no way for the Biblical account of Jesus to arrive at the account of the Book of Mormon. Mormons have been taught that the bible was corrupted. I hope to open eyes that God is much greater than the humanoid that you have been told about. He is the creator of all creation not just this solar system. Jesus said all scripture shall not fade away but many wolves and false prophets will come and try to add to the word. It pains my heart to see mormons fall for the lie that Satan first told Adam and Eve that we can be like the most high. Genesis 3 Joseph Smith sold the same lie. Another lie, a Temple like Solomon's Temple built in America does not exist. 100% impossibility as we would have some remains and there were no Levites in the Americas to serve in the temple so it would have been against Jewish law which book of mormon says were kept. If you study the bible you know this. Mormon's own the Hill Cumorah yet they do not excavate it because they know there is nothing there from previous digs. An excavation would be a grand embarrassment and would prove the religion is a lie. It did not happen. Look at Mormon Chapter 8 the evidence for it does not exist and evidence would exist if it happened. Why did Joseph Smith condone polygamy as an ordinance from God (Doctrine and Covenants 132) when the Book of Mormon had already condemned the practice (Jacob 1:15, 2:24)? Why did Brigham Young teach that Adam is “our Father and our God” when both the Bible and the Book of Mormon (Mormon 9:12) say that Adam is a creation of God (Journal of Discourses, Apr. 9, 1852, vol.1, p.50)? If Brigham Young was a true prophet, how come one of your later prophets overturned his declaration which stated that the black man could never hold the priesthood in the LDS Church until after the resurrection of all other races (Journal of Discourses, Dec. 12, 1854, 2:142-143)?

@mikelawlor1533

10 ай бұрын

How did you get to meet General Authorities?

@brettpinion4233

10 ай бұрын

Know the Jesus of the Bible and know his peace instead of the works doctrine of Mormonism where you are trying to become a god. Bizarre as we are all broken sinners in need of a savior. “…To a professional historian, for example, the recent translation of the Joseph Smith papyri may well present the potentially most damaging case against Mormonism since its foundation. Yet the ‘Powers That Be’ at the Church Historian’s Office should take comfort in the fact that almost total lack of response to this translation is an uncanny proof of Frank Kermode’s observation that even the most devastating acts of disconfirmation will have no effect whatever on true believers. Perhaps an even more telling response is that of the ‘liberals,’ or cultural Mormons. After the Joseph Smith’s papyri affair, one might have well expected a mass exodus of these people from the Church. Yet none has occurred. Why? Because cultural Mormons, of course, do not believe in the historical authenticity of Mormon scriptures in the first place. So there is nothing to disconfirm.

@mikelawlor1533

10 ай бұрын

@@brettpinion4233 tell us about yourself ? Are you saved ? If so by the speaking of tongues or not ???

@brettpinion4233

10 ай бұрын

​@@mikelawlor1533 John 3:3 Jesus answered him, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again[b] he cannot see the kingdom of God.” 4 Nicodemus said to him, “How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born?” 5 Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 Yes, I am born again and trust in Jesus for my salvation. I pray that all my words show love for all and I repent of the times they do not. 1 Cor. 12:30 Do all have gifts of healings? Do all speak with tongues? Do all interpret? 1 Corinthians 13:1 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. The human body is made up of many parts, all with different functions, yet there is a basic unity throughout the body. So it is in the church which is Christ’s body. All believers, without distinction, are introduced into and united in that body through the baptism of the Spirit. The same Spirit dwells within each one (12-13). Many parts make up the body, and all are necessary for its proper functioning. Those without more obvious gifts should not think there is no place for them in the church. In the body of Christ, as in the human body, each part has its own special task (14-20). God has so designed the body that no matter how important one part may be, it cannot function properly without dependence upon all the other parts (21). People with more obvious gifts should not look down on others. Certain parts of the body may appear at first to be less important, but the body cannot do without them (22). Other parts of the body are less presentable, but they are the parts we clothe more attractively. Just as there is harmony between the various parts of the body, so there should be in the church (23-25). In addition, there should be unity. When one part of the body suffers, the whole body suffers; when one part is honored, the whole is honored. There is no competition (26). It is clear, then, that all Christians are part of the body but their gifts vary widely, from the more important gifts to the less important (27-28). All gifts are necessary, but not everybody can do everything (29-30). Christians should desire the higher gifts, but there is something greater than even the highest gift that all, whether great or small, can have, and that is love. Paul will explain what he means in the next chapter (31).

Having worked for LDS Inc., one of the first things I began to notice was that most every measured metric was worse in reality than it was on paper. So IMO, even the data here is more optimistic than what’s really happening.

@Mustardmanor

10 ай бұрын

Agreed. I think reported statistics are probably nicer than reality.

The Prophet has no clothes.

@rogerbrunt5918

9 ай бұрын

Hahaha 🤣

I have enjoyed every presentation I've seen Simon do. His calm, collected and minimalist style is much appreciated alongside the obvious expertise he brings to a range of topics. Thank you Simon from an atheist, Nevermo Pom 💛💚

@rebeccabibliotheca

10 ай бұрын

Agreed! Simon is just wonderful! We hope to have him on again!

When I joined the church in the 70's, the bulletin used to have the previous weeks attendance in it.

@Max_Johnson

10 ай бұрын

Interesting....

The church was the subject of at least 95 percent of every major conflict within the house growing up. My mom has allowed the church to have major effect on every relationship in her life from her grandma all the way to her youngest grandchild. It's mind blowing because she is an unbelievably intelligent, capable, accomplished woman but when it comes to the church she is absolutely a fool and completely brainwashed.. I had a therapist at one point explain to me that church was my moms drug her addiction and it made so much more sense to me then.... She is absolutely under the influence every Sunday and she is absolutely affected if she doesn't get her fix working at the temple at least once a week... Fortunately she has backed off on trying to push the church on us grown children but the fact that none of us have a testimony or anything to do with the church absolutely has a major impact on her opinion of us and has profound impact on her ability to have sincere relationships with us... My oldest sister will not allow my mother to care for her kids unattended because she is not capable of respecting our wishes and keeping her religious beliefs to herself and not try to impart them on the kids.....

@somebodytookmyname1

9 ай бұрын

Oh I’m sorry. Tragic for you and your family. Good that you gained insight and some healthy distance even though there’s no solving to these problems ..with fundamental disagreements on what matters most in life.

@Themanyfacesofego

6 ай бұрын

If someone has an addiction of any kind, we have to just take a step back and, sadly leave them to it. We can be kind, but we have to take care of ourselves.

@karencoates2487

3 ай бұрын

Her “fix!” 😅 A fine word for folks who are so invested in the church…something that can't be proven. Sometimes, it can't even rationally be discussed with others.

If you listen to the UK people that just had wards collapsed and stake’s eliminated and the church had planned it for several years but the Saints only found out the day it was announced. Hearing the heart ache was painful.

@brettpinion4233

10 ай бұрын

Evidence for Book of Mormon in ancient America- none Evidence showing Book of Mormon is a 19th century religious fiction below: No wheat, no barley, no goats, no steel found in the Americas, no metal smelting furnaces, no metal armor, no temples, no steel swords, no skeletons of these warriors, no graves, no cities (it would be impossible for a city the size of Zarahemla to leave no trace), no cattle, no chariot parts, no Nephite coins (listed in book of Alma as being used for a thousand years), no Jewish relics from supposed jews, no metal plates like Nephites supposedly had, no artifacts whatsoever, no Nephite "reformed Egyptian" writings; and no evidence the book of Mormon "prophets" ever existed. There is zero archaeological, anthropological, topological, linguistic, or DNA evidence to support the Book of Mormon. It would be impossible for highly advanced civilizations (Jaredites, Nephites) with millions of people to have vanished off the face of the earth. The whole face of the land had become covered with buildings” (Mormon 1:7) “Two million Jaredites slain” (Ether 15:2) 38 cities are catalogued in the Book of Mormon, along with iron, steel, brass, metal swords, breast-plates, shields, armor, or chariots. Yet, not one item mentioned in the Book of Mormon has ever been discovered in America. The Book of Mormon speaks of sheep, swine, goats, wheat, barley, silk, and elephants-even though they weren’t brought to America until centuries later by Europeans in post-Columbian times. Again we see that Joseph Smith was thinking about things in his current day as he was fabricating the Book of Mormon. CAN WE TRUST OUR HEARTS as to book of Mormon since there is no evidence? Maroni chapter 10:4 says: "he will manifest the truth of it unto you" But: THE BIBLE WARNS YOU about trusting your own heart. Jeremiah 17:9 "the heart is deceitful above all things". Proverbs 28:26 "He that trusteth in his own heart is a fool." Please don't be a fool. The entire belief system and premise of Mormonism is based on a false claim the Bible was corrupted and "plain and precious parts" were removed by early Christian translators sometime after the apostles had all died. This is a very dangerous claim to make against the word of God, especially since God promised us his word would never pass away and would be with us forever (Isaiah 40:8; Psalms 100:5; Matthew 16:18, 24:35; 1 Peter 1:23-25). An Objective Test of the Bible and Book of Mormon The Claim: In the Book of Mormon, the prophet Nephi has a vision the Bible was corrupted after the 12 apostles preached it and after the formation of the “great and abominable church” (1 Nephi 13:26-29). Most Mormons believe this to be the Catholic Church which was formed early in the 4th century. Nephi claims this church was founded by the Devil to lead souls to hell (1 Nephi 14:3). So let’s objectively examine both the Bible and the Book of Mormon to be fair and test if any have errors. Bible: The earliest Dead Sea Scrolls have been historically dated by three different dating techniques to as early as 350 BC. Included in this discovery was the Great Isaiah Scroll, which is the oldest known complete copy of the Book of Isaiah and is dated to approximately 200 BC. Study the dead sea scrolls which are over 2,000 years old and see if they have Joseph Smith's uncorrupted version. They should if Joseph Smith was correct and the bible had been corrupted over time but, no they do not. They are the same today as they were over 2,100 years ago with only minor spelling or punctuation differences. Joseph Smith was wrong. The bible had not been corrupted. “You are my witnesses,” declares the Lord, “and my servant whom I have chosen, that you may know and believe me and understand that I am he. Before me no god was formed, nor shall there be any after me.” (Isaiah 43:10) If Mormonism is true, then God could not make the claim that there were no gods before him, for he was just a man at one point; nor could he claim that no gods would come after him, for that is the goal of every member of the LDS church. The new testament has not been corrupted either. Take for example John 1:1 a very important verse than Smith changed to make Jesus a created being. A papyri known as the Bodmer Papyri which is almost 1900 years old of the book of John. (this papyri was written not long after the apostle John would have died and it shows joseph smith changed the book of John, not that it got corrupted later as he alleged) John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God. ΕΝ ΑΡΧΗ ΗΝ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ ΚΑΙ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ ΗΝ ΠΡΟΣ ΤΟΝ ΘΕΟΝ ΚΑΙ ΘΕΟΣ ΗΝ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ I post this in love. The manuscript and archeological evidence for the bible is the greatest of anything in antiquity. I pray that you know the real Jesus, real peace, love and true salvation. "But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed." Galatians 1 One is a Jesus who is not eternal and was the spirit brother of lucifer in pre-existence & a God the Farther who was once a man - an exulted man. The other is the eternal Word, the Alpha and Omega- Jesus, by whom created all things, seen and unseen. And a God the Father who says the He alone is God, nor any god before, not any god after. There is no way for the Biblical account of Jesus to arrive at the account of the Book of Mormon. Mormons have been taught that the bible was corrupted. I hope to open eyes that God is much greater than the humanoid that you have been told about. He is the creator of all creation not just this solar system. Jesus said all scripture shall not fade away but many wolves and false prophets will come and try to add to the word. It pains my heart to see mormons fall for the lie that Satan first told Adam and Eve that we can be like the most high. Genesis 3 Joseph Smith sold the same lie. Another lie, a Temple like Solomon's Temple built in America does not exist. 100% impossibility as we would have some remains and there were no Levites in the Americas to serve in the temple so it would have been against Jewish law which book of mormon says were kept. If you study the bible you know this. Mormon's own the Hill Cumorah yet they do not excavate it because they know there is nothing there from previous digs. An excavation would be a grand embarrassment and would prove the religion is a lie. It did not happen. Look at Mormon Chapter 8 the evidence for it does not exist and evidence would exist if it happened. Why did Joseph Smith condone polygamy as an ordinance from God (Doctrine and Covenants 132) when the Book of Mormon had already condemned the practice (Jacob 1:15, 2:24)? Why did Brigham Young teach that Adam is “our Father and our God” when both the Bible and the Book of Mormon (Mormon 9:12) say that Adam is a creation of God (Journal of Discourses, Apr. 9, 1852, vol.1, p.50)? If Brigham Young was a true prophet, how come one of your later prophets overturned his declaration which stated that the black man could never hold the priesthood in the LDS Church until after the resurrection of all other races (Journal of Discourses, Dec. 12, 1854, 2:142-143)?

seems to be a waist of money when it should have been focused on the poor and needy, just like it says in the bofm they love their ornate buildings more than the poor.

The church is sure shrinking in San Diego. Many chapels closed here, not even enough aaronic priesthood to do the sacrament. The church is a sinking ship

True Believing Mormons that go to church will take this as awesome news. They are now in the most elite class that will definitely make it to the celestial kingdom.

LOSING A LOST TRIBE! His book is a must-read!

Simon's scholarship was one of the important sources of truth for me as I made my out 15 years ago. It's good to see him again here. Thank you, Simon, Rebecca, and Landon, for illuminating the truth!

Let's end this cult!

@charlesmendeley9823

10 ай бұрын

The way to go is to remove their tax exempt status in the US. this would be it.

I dont need cell phones or leaks--just go try and find a parking spot on sunday. NO problem. It used to be a challenge esp for stake conference, no problem now. That is very telling. I hadnt been for a while and decided to go because of an invite and I was shocked at the # of parking spots. Great presentation, always love Simon, and appreciate the hard work that Rebecca and Landon put into their podcast. Always quality. Thank you

@rebeccabibliotheca

10 ай бұрын

Love the anecdotal evidence! I admit, every Sunday when I'm driving around I check for the number of cars in the LDS churches I drive by! Thanks for watching!

@samsmom400

8 ай бұрын

I check their parking lots, they aren't even half full. Years ago (preCOVID) cars used to be parked in the street.

Dr. Southerton's DNA research was the main factor in my discovering the truth over 20 years ago. I'm so happy he is still doing good works and helping others to find the truth about Mormonism. Thank you!

@mormonishpodcast1036

10 ай бұрын

Simon is great and we hope to have him on again!!!

@theatreguy1850

10 ай бұрын

It's just too bad that his claims as far as the DNA evidence against the Book of Mormon has been disproven. 😥

@theatreguy1850

10 ай бұрын

@@mormonishpodcast1036 if you do you might want to have an objective critical thinking person double-check his claims before you have him on again. 😉 You know just to make sure that he's not sharing information that is a decade out of date like with the DNA evidence.🙂

@timhazeltine3256

9 ай бұрын

​​@@theatreguy1850Absolutely wrong. There is no substantive evidence the Pre-Columbian inhabitants of the Americas were descended from settlers from Europe and/or the Levant. There is no archaeological evidence for sustained (beyond the short term occupation of the Norse in Maritime Canada) old world to new world contact or settlement before Columbus. Finally, the concept that refugees from the Levant created the New World's complex cultures is racist because it implies Native People's were intellectually incapable of creating complex societies on their own.

@theatreguy1850

9 ай бұрын

@@timhazeltine3256 I am talking about his claim in the 2000s that the Native American DNA is 99.6% East Asian.This evidence was used to try and disprove The Book of Mormon by saying that there was no Israel DNA in the Native Americans. But this was later disproved and we now know that a third of the Native American DNA is from Europe and the Middle East. I'm not exactly sure what your comment is talking about but maybe you could explain it a little further. 😊

As an example of membership vs attendance, myself and my brother (both baptized at 8 yrs) 60 plus years ago, are on the membership rolls though I joined a different church ages ago. Both my brother and I have repeatedly asked , even demanded various LDS visitors to remove our names from the rolls. Imagine how many people don’t go, haven’t even thought of the church etc that are still counted as members. Even my dad who died 35 years ago may still be on rolls (110 yrs is the magic age number to be removed-didn’t know that). Just so weird.

@Fatfinger4378

10 ай бұрын

Exactly. I have MANY extended family members that are Mormon in name only. Baptized at 8 and undoubtedly still on the rolls but haven't had anything to do with Mormonism since they were kids. This includes two of my three siblings, both my parents, and at least 10 cousins and their kids that were baptized at 8 because their grandma and grandpa insisted. All completely moved on and not Mormon in any way, but still counted as part of that oh so impressive 17 million number.

Simon, I greatly appreciate your comments at the end of the interview. I completely agree that the church is an institution that destroys families. I don't think this gets discussed enough. I also revel in seeing it's decline. So if that makes you evil, I guess we'll share stories when we get to outer darkness. 😉 Nonetheless, the decline of the church means more and more people will be spared the trauma in the future. Rebecca, thank you for your happy demeanor! Seeing you smile all the time is really comforting.

@haroldwhite5761

10 ай бұрын

I agree 100%. I have deep mormon heritage and can testify as to the mental illness and psychopathy rampant in my family lines from mormon generational trauma. I revel in the church's decline because it gives Utah a better chance to heal and hopefully better separation between church and state here. Outer darkness is a great position from which to explore the universe, I look forward to it!

@mormonishpodcast1036

10 ай бұрын

There will be a lot of us in outer darkness with Simon but one things for sure, we’ll all know where Rebecca is because of those bright shiny teeth and that big bright smile!!! Thanks for the comment!

Part of what is driving the decline in Asia is that the US no longer has the positive image that it once did (in the 1970s-1990s). The decline in America's image results in a decline in the image of what is perceived to be an American church.

@mormonishpodcast1036

10 ай бұрын

I think that is telling. Are people converting to the church or western culture? Great insight!

I have access to activity numbers for Canada. In this country we are at 15% active members compared with the official church membership. Alberta is slightly higher in terms of activity rate. However Alberta is losing active members in the last decade. The biggest worry currently among leaders is youth. Some wards do better than others at youth activity and retention, however the active youth are a small percentage of total membership numbers.

I’m in South Australia and just going by our normal 10% of Australian total we should have about 15,000 Mormons in this State. I’m 70 years old and I don’t know any Mormons at all. We had 2 missionaries call on us on about 1974 and no doorknocking since then. I’ve seen a few of these guys in the streets over the years but they are few and far between. We even have a temple here in Adelaide sitting on some prime real estate.

Great podcast! When I was still a believer, they made me ward clerk., responsible for counting attendance and reporting the data to SLC. It struck me, that only about 30% of the total number attended. I loved the last part of the podcast also. The trinity of stupidity, JWs, scientology, and ziontology.

Fellow south Aussie doing us proud!

I love that you brought up Wicked the Musical. Listening to it post Mormonism gives it whole new meaning. Joseph and the Wizard are one in the same. The song Wonderful about a mediocre man who told lies that people needed to believe in. And that he got propped up by people who grasped onto lies they needed in that moment.

@mormonishpodcast1036

10 ай бұрын

That musical really resonated with me as the whole post Mormon experience! Thanks for the comment!

Nigeria = The Center of Online Cons in the World?

It's what one would expect from an MLM posing as a religion for tax purposes

The South Korea/Japan ward closures may be related to a large number of US Military servicepeople that has declined as some of the US bases there have downsized or closed.

Great episode! Fascinating numbers. Simon might be interested in Brazil and Mexico Official Census reports, which show self-reported adherants to be drastically less than what the LDS Church claims... (like 80% less, which roughly matches the numbers he reports in other places). Extrapolated, 17m members worldwide equates to perhaps only ~2m *active* members.

@samsmom400

8 ай бұрын

That's good news!

@Themanyfacesofego

6 ай бұрын

This is wonderful news. And ' self- reported adherents' might not actually even attend the church. Attendence could be even less!

@samsmom400

6 ай бұрын

@@Themanyfacesofego I know that where I live, the parking lot that used to be full-isn't. It has a scattering of cars.

Simon is a smart dude. I was inspired by his exit story. LDS attendance claims show deep narcissism, a holy lie. Other churches of similar size are much more honest "in all their dealings."

This was happening at a ward I visited in Salt Lake City: Ward A Sacrament meeting, then Ward A and Ward B combined "second hour" classes (Sunday School, YW, primary, EQ, etc) then Ward B Sacrament Meeting. I asked why they don't just combine wards? They were told that it would mean too few wards to for the Stake to remain open.

@jamestrek2570

10 ай бұрын

How long ago was this?

@getwilde

10 ай бұрын

@@jamestrek2570 We visited there seven months ago.

Interesting analysis. Cell phones and the internet!!!! In addition to the pandemic, I retired from my civilian job and had "too much" time to investigate "truth claims" of the church. Started with the infamous Wilcox fireside opening the "lack of trust" door, leading to careful examination and disappointment with the Gospel Topics essays and the easy dismantling of so much that is demonstrably false.

I have watched the growth as a critic from the outside for over 45 years. I watched them put up churches in remote places in Alaska 25 years ago. More recently I moved back to eastern Washington where they have built numerous churches and temples over the past 20 years. New churches in the Pacific Northwest appears to be as a result of migration to the area, not necessarily do to new converts. We have gone to many temple openings over the years and more recently the one in Moses Lake, WA where the majority of those who attended were "white and delightsome" which suggests that they are not making many Hispanic converts. We were at the temple opening at Richmond, Virginia a few months ago where there is a large black population yet most of those who attended the open house were white folk. When we show up with signs exposing Mormon doctrine they often call the police, then later when we are still there, someone from the church will come out and say us drawing attention to the church is helpful for them. So why do they call the cops?

@lukegraven7839

10 ай бұрын

Keep up the good work!

@sjenson6694

9 ай бұрын

Part of that is to launder money to real estate and their own construction companies.

@lukegraven7839

9 ай бұрын

@@WatchingwaitingG2D all you do is criticize and don’t bring anything of substance. he’s right you’re wrong. They launder money and are collapsing as we speak.

@lukegraven7839

9 ай бұрын

@@WatchingwaitingG2D you’re not even original. It’s well documented JS is a charlatan - he even cried and apologized to his first wife’s dad he’s a fraud and can’t see/divine anything out or rocks. But of course you can’t I guess this needs repeating to you : rocks don’t talk.

@timhazeltine3256

9 ай бұрын

​@@WatchingwaitingG2DYour comments are contrary to the Christian concept of humility.

And they only have $125 for the year for single adult activities. I spend more than that taking the lady out to dinner when we were together or my ex wife.

Another way they could gain membership, besides doing charitable works, is stop tithing AND give a monthly grant for every stay-at-home mom, based on how many minor children she has, say $2,000 per child. Plenty of women would like to be stay-at-home moms and would join up just to have that life. And women already in would be more inclined to stay put. It is possible to literally buy members. That's a devious maneuver, but, hey, this is Mormanism so it would be right at home.

@mormonishpodcast1036

10 ай бұрын

Actually, that’s a pretty good idea! The government gives tax credits for child daycare why couldn’t the church give tithing credit for stay at home moms? Of course I think they might stop encouraging such large families if they did! Lol. Thanks for the great comment!

@jessedewell

9 ай бұрын

They would only gain members who are draining funds instead contributing funds. That is not a formula for success... There is already a very large number of people who join in developing countries because they recognize the benefits and resources available for those affiliated with a very wealthy western organization and have very little if any interest in attending and contributing

@samsmom400

8 ай бұрын

​@@jessedewellit takes a lot of spending to drain the funds of BILLIONS of dollars.

They have to spend those billions somehow. Temples bolster the status quo.

@charlesmendeley9823

10 ай бұрын

The first thing an increase in temples does is to encourage non Mormons to look up the temple ceremony online (channel NewNameNoah). And then laugh about the "bakery convention". 😂

Thanks for having Simon on your podcast. I always enjoy what he has to say!

@mormonishpodcast1036

10 ай бұрын

Ha ha! Always do what Simon says!!! He is great we want to get him on again!

Truth will set you free...

It’s my understanding that the church doesn’t like membership pushes in poor countries because these people cannot afford to pay tithing. I don’t understand Nigeria being so “hot”.

@radybay9088

4 ай бұрын

It gets the numbers up, and shows diversity

0:10:10 The future growth of the church is Africa, in particular Nigeria and Ghana. Sadly, the LDS church is using those population to boost growth. I wonder what the chart will look like if Nigeria metrics was removed from the church's population data. Very interesting. Thanks Mormonish & Dr Simon Southerton

@randyjordan5521

10 ай бұрын

There's a video clip out there from several years ago in which Gordon B. Hinckley (IIRC) was in a meeting where he said that the church gets a lot of its growth numbers from third-world areas like Africa, but get very little tithing. I think it was the book "The Mormon Corporate Empire", published back in the '80s, which estimated that the church gets 92% of its revenue from the US and Canada. That money funds the new buildings and missionary efforts in third world areas.

@haroldwhite5761

10 ай бұрын

I wonder how the situation with the coup in Niger has affected missionary work, church operations

@othersheep5491

10 ай бұрын

The church has come for their gold fillings, tithes, and required offerings. Strengthen God’s children through unnecessary sacrifice and suffering. Why does this feel wicked to me? Every time I look to the prophets, it’s SO much worse than I thought.

I was elders quorum President just a few years ago and my budget was about 50 dollars a year

Simon is a mine of trustworthy information.

@Themanyfacesofego

6 ай бұрын

A gold mine.

The Q-15 better call Kenny Loggins, cause they’re in the Danger Zone!

From this, I can deduce there is a big difference between and intellectual conversion and a spirtual conversion.

Interesting data! When I talk to friends from several other non-pacifica churches here in NZ there are VERY FEW under 40s in the congregation. Where as our ward has a lot of young children, as in the church we are still having 3-5 children per couple. In my household there are 6 people, 2 devices.

There’s a reason they had to start their own department in order to deal with all the people leaving the church and removing their membership. Like all religion, it’s dying.

It's more difficult and a much larger ordeal requiring significantly more effort in order to get ur name officially removed from the rosters than is required to get your name on the rosters.. Heck, in some cases not even abusing children is enough to get ur name removed from the rosters....

Rebekah thanks for a fascinating conversation, do you have a list of suggested books for learning about the truth claims fallacies?

If you want an accurate indicator if the church is continuing to grow or is shrinking, look at the number of subscribers to Ex-Mormon KZread channels versus pro-Mormon ones. For example: Mormon Stories---187k subs. Mormon Discussion---14k subs. Pro-Mormon channels: Saints Unscripted---70k subs. Cwic Media---32k subs. FAIR---30k subs. Ward Radio formerly known as Midnight Mormons---16k subs. Mormonism with the Murph---2.7k subs. 132 Problems---2.6k subs. Hemlock Knots---2.3k subs. Obviously, a lot more people are more interested in hearing the Ex/anti-side of the issues than the "faithful" side. 20-30 years ago, the influence of ex/anti media such as the Tanners etc. was tiny, compared to the church's PR machine, its apologists, and its missionary force. That has all turned around. Rank-and-file Mormons are no longer reticent to consult the internet for info, and the more they learn, the more of them leave.

I love what Rebecca said. Youth Conf in summers meeting kids, stake dances getting kids out of groups, friends in the ward… gone and ward split. My daughter in law joined for her friends but that all ended. I wanted to stop her but couldn’t.

My more honest TBM friends have commented about the decline of attendance. I know in my neighborhood, wards that had two meetings pre COVID, now have joined forces for one meeting just to look like they are still relevant.

I think the number of church pings is likely accurate because all the manuals etc are in the church apps. You need your phone at church.

Great show.

I can relate to Simon’s experience of reconciling with the loss of belief in my sleep. I watched a science documentary and the smooth tones of Morgan Freeman’s voice talked about the meaning of life and that’s it’s up to us to decide. I had a severe bought with cognitive dissonance and anxiety. I felt like an elephant was on my chest. I woke up in the morning having lost all belief in God.

@somebodytookmyname1

9 ай бұрын

That’s interesting. Impressed that you could share such pivotal change in this concise comment. Your cognitive dissonance has resolved, yes?

@samsmom400

8 ай бұрын

Jesus is real. He really is. He's a relationship not a religion. I'm exmo and now I'm a follower of Jesus Christ. I don't go to church, but I watch different pastors on KZread. Jack Hibbs is good, he's got a great sense of humor.

And they just keep building temples.

@eneyeseekay

10 ай бұрын

They have no other choice since they won't be honest and upfront about the biggest problem in the Church. Elder Holland even lied and said the staggering growth, double digit stakes every week was the biggest problem in the Church. He just couldn't admit how pathetic the real numbers actually were.

@charlesmendeley9823

10 ай бұрын

I think there is evidence that the massive temple construction is solely done to boost Nelson's ego. There are episodes on Rameumpton ruminations (EP 57,58) discussing this. Up to Nelson, temples were built according to membership numbers in an area. Since Nelson, they are built because Nelson announced them, with no connection to objective numbers.

@sweetafton5655

10 ай бұрын

I live in North Idaho and there are definitely droves of Mormons leaving California for the PNW, so migration has got to play a roll in why temples are going in here.

@Max_Johnson

10 ай бұрын

They've gotta try to somehow give the illusion of growth.

@charlesmendeley9823

10 ай бұрын

@@Max_Johnson It's actually very similar to Scientology. Their version is called "ideal org scam", where the boss builds their "wards", which are more like classrooms, but most of them are empty. Then, everyone feels ashamed that their org is empty and not working, when in reality this is true for every org on the planet. It's all a scam.

At 19:32. I was at an academic meeting of religion professors back in the 1990s. Rodney Stark predicted the LDS church would have much greater numbers by 2023 than it does. Of course the 1990s saw huge growth globally and there was little indication this would end.

@randyjordan5521

10 ай бұрын

A lot of the church's growth over the last few decades can be attributed to the fall of the Soviet Union and other oppressive regimes, and American religions being able to move into those areas.

Cheers to Simon and too all of you. I appreciate this information. Thank you!

@mormonishpodcast1036

9 ай бұрын

Glad you enjoyed it!

Every time I Drive past the Christies Beach Chapel In Adelaide South Australia on Sunday during meeting times the car park is very empty compared to what it was a few years ago.

I was a nurse missionary for another denomination in Nigeria. Because they are ancestor worshipers and traditionally polygamists who also have concubines, LDS is a perfect fit for them. At the time I was there, they were giving cars to bishops. That was in the 1980's.

Luv u guys ❤🎉🎉🎉

I believe that I went on a mission to share the church culture I had lived in for 19 years. What do young men and women go on missions for now?

Something that you are missing when talking about Asian countries is the population collapse. South Korea being one of the leading countries with this demographic problem - which is undoubtedly contributing to the decline in membership.

@mormonishpodcast1036

10 ай бұрын

I hadn’t considered that. Do you know the decline in the general population? It would be interesting to compare that to the decline in the church’s numbers to see if they parallel each other.

Lds is corrupted now. So sad

Growing up in the 70's, in my ward, after the clerk went around counting people, he would put the attendance percentage on the wall, near the hymnal numbers. I remember it was consistently in the low to mid 40's.

@mormonishpodcast1036

10 ай бұрын

Wow and that was in the 70’s. Must be much lower than that now so that supports the cellphone numbers. Thanks for commenting!

Do you think the church includes people who weren’t baptized until they were already dead?

@mormonishpodcast1036

10 ай бұрын

No but they do keep you on the rolls until you are 110 years old if they don’t know where you are so that is a lot of dead people on the rolls! Thanks for watching!

@timhazeltine3256

9 ай бұрын

​@@mormonishpodcast1036Well, that strategy could further enhance membership figures by raising the threshold to 150 years of age.

Are Tongans still taught that they are Lamanites?

@mormonishpodcast1036

10 ай бұрын

I think they have dialed it back but they don’t correct it so most still believe that they are.

@sarak6860

10 ай бұрын

How sad.@@mormonishpodcast1036

@rogerbrunt5918

9 ай бұрын

I wonder if their skin is any whiter 😂 I’m Polynesian and I woke up long ago

Amen brothers and sisters

Great data, extremely interesting. No different than a corporation trying to make numbers look good.

I’m basically a member by having a member ID # only. I used to be there every Sunday & attend what RS I could. I’ve, for almost a year now started looking elsewhere and that was brought on due to our Stakes believing it was ok for them to make big changes without ever speaking to the members about it. There are several other reasons as well. I’ll never bad mouth the church because that’s what brought me back to Jesus & I’m thankful for that. However, doing so much research on my own since the Lord woke me up at the beginning of this year. I’m finding many things that I do disagree with. The Lords Will shall be done regardless of what they do. I can’t abide by men I don’t even know telling me where & when and who I can go to church with. I live approximately 50 miles from the church building I’m supposed to attend-and now with people I don’t even know & have no connection with. We have 1 temple in Las Vegas & I’ve served there. They can’t even keep that one temple full of either workers or patrons and now they’re building another one on the west side of Vegas. I’m sorry but that makes no sense financially to me. 🙌🏼🙏💕

I think Nemo the Mormon was called to the London temple.

@maxinekennedy5888

10 ай бұрын

That was a unique situation arranged outside the normal "calling process". Nemo explained why on his "Mormon Stories" episode and it only put his local leaders in the UK in the best possible light.

To address the issue of too few youths in a ward/branch, what the church does in Asia Area (which includes Taiwan, Hong Kong, China, Monglia, India and Southeast Asia) is that starting this year, it has the young men/women of two wards sharing the same meetinghouse meet for the young men/ young women class ( the same thing happens to the Elders Quorum or releif society meetings and Sunday School) toghether and each ward/branch still has its own sacrament meeting. I don't know if this is the case in other parts of the world.

Taking the money and putting in temples, they’re sitting on $135 billion or $150 billion. How much money did they need lining their pockets for retirement. They just bought 390 some thousand acres up in the panhandle of Florida.

Just before I had my name removed a month and a half ago from church records. And I’m a single adult above 32 or whatever L O L and I think in priesthood quorum, we had a total of 15 Right around that number. But we had 158 single adults above 35 inactive members. And wanted nothing to do with the church I went around to at least 30 of them. And that’s what they were saying, and we only have one ward in our building. I don’t know about couples they just gave me. The list of single adults

@brettpinion4233

10 ай бұрын

Evidence for Book of Mormon in ancient America- none Evidence showing Book of Mormon is a 19th century religious fiction below: No wheat, no barley, no goats, no steel found in the Americas, no metal smelting furnaces, no metal armor, no temples, no steel swords, no skeletons of these warriors, no graves, no cities (it would be impossible for a city the size of Zarahemla to leave no trace), no cattle, no chariot parts, no Nephite coins (listed in book of Alma as being used for a thousand years), no Jewish relics from supposed jews, no metal plates like Nephites supposedly had, no artifacts whatsoever, no Nephite "reformed Egyptian" writings; and no evidence the book of Mormon "prophets" ever existed. There is zero archaeological, anthropological, topological, linguistic, or DNA evidence to support the Book of Mormon. It would be impossible for highly advanced civilizations (Jaredites, Nephites) with millions of people to have vanished off the face of the earth. The whole face of the land had become covered with buildings” (Mormon 1:7) “Two million Jaredites slain” (Ether 15:2) 38 cities are catalogued in the Book of Mormon, along with iron, steel, brass, metal swords, breast-plates, shields, armor, or chariots. Yet, not one item mentioned in the Book of Mormon has ever been discovered in America. The Book of Mormon speaks of sheep, swine, goats, wheat, barley, silk, and elephants-even though they weren’t brought to America until centuries later by Europeans in post-Columbian times. Again we see that Joseph Smith was thinking about things in his current day as he was fabricating the Book of Mormon. CAN WE TRUST OUR HEARTS as to book of Mormon since there is no evidence? Maroni chapter 10:4 says: "he will manifest the truth of it unto you" But: THE BIBLE WARNS YOU about trusting your own heart. Jeremiah 17:9 "the heart is deceitful above all things". Proverbs 28:26 "He that trusteth in his own heart is a fool." Please don't be a fool. The entire belief system and premise of Mormonism is based on a false claim the Bible was corrupted and "plain and precious parts" were removed by early Christian translators sometime after the apostles had all died. This is a very dangerous claim to make against the word of God, especially since God promised us his word would never pass away and would be with us forever (Isaiah 40:8; Psalms 100:5; Matthew 16:18, 24:35; 1 Peter 1:23-25). An Objective Test of the Bible and Book of Mormon The Claim: In the Book of Mormon, the prophet Nephi has a vision the Bible was corrupted after the 12 apostles preached it and after the formation of the “great and abominable church” (1 Nephi 13:26-29). Most Mormons believe this to be the Catholic Church which was formed early in the 4th century. Nephi claims this church was founded by the Devil to lead souls to hell (1 Nephi 14:3). So let’s objectively examine both the Bible and the Book of Mormon to be fair and test if any have errors. Bible: The earliest Dead Sea Scrolls have been historically dated by three different dating techniques to as early as 350 BC. Included in this discovery was the Great Isaiah Scroll, which is the oldest known complete copy of the Book of Isaiah and is dated to approximately 200 BC. Study the dead sea scrolls which are over 2,000 years old and see if they have Joseph Smith's uncorrupted version. They should if Joseph Smith was correct and the bible had been corrupted over time but, no they do not. They are the same today as they were over 2,100 years ago with only minor spelling or punctuation differences. Joseph Smith was wrong. The bible had not been corrupted. “You are my witnesses,” declares the Lord, “and my servant whom I have chosen, that you may know and believe me and understand that I am he. Before me no god was formed, nor shall there be any after me.” (Isaiah 43:10) If Mormonism is true, then God could not make the claim that there were no gods before him, for he was just a man at one point; nor could he claim that no gods would come after him, for that is the goal of every member of the LDS church. The new testament has not been corrupted either. Take for example John 1:1 a very important verse than Smith changed to make Jesus a created being. A papyri known as the Bodmer Papyri which is almost 1900 years old of the book of John. (this papyri was written not long after the apostle John would have died and it shows joseph smith changed the book of John, not that it got corrupted later as he alleged) John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God. ΕΝ ΑΡΧΗ ΗΝ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ ΚΑΙ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ ΗΝ ΠΡΟΣ ΤΟΝ ΘΕΟΝ ΚΑΙ ΘΕΟΣ ΗΝ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ I post this in love. The manuscript and archeological evidence for the bible is the greatest of anything in antiquity. I pray that you know the real Jesus, real peace, love and true salvation. "But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed." Galatians 1 One is a Jesus who is not eternal and was the spirit brother of lucifer in pre-existence & a God the Farther who was once a man - an exulted man. The other is the eternal Word, the Alpha and Omega- Jesus, by whom created all things, seen and unseen. And a God the Father who says the He alone is God, nor any god before, not any god after. There is no way for the Biblical account of Jesus to arrive at the account of the Book of Mormon. Mormons have been taught that the bible was corrupted. I hope to open eyes that God is much greater than the humanoid that you have been told about. He is the creator of all creation not just this solar system. Jesus said all scripture shall not fade away but many wolves and false prophets will come and try to add to the word. It pains my heart to see mormons fall for the lie that Satan first told Adam and Eve that we can be like the most high. Genesis 3 Joseph Smith sold the same lie. Another lie, a Temple like Solomon's Temple built in America does not exist. 100% impossibility as we would have some remains and there were no Levites in the Americas to serve in the temple so it would have been against Jewish law which book of mormon says were kept. If you study the bible you know this. Mormon's own the Hill Cumorah yet they do not excavate it because they know there is nothing there from previous digs. An excavation would be a grand embarrassment and would prove the religion is a lie. It did not happen. Look at Mormon Chapter 8 the evidence for it does not exist and evidence would exist if it happened. Why did Joseph Smith condone polygamy as an ordinance from God (Doctrine and Covenants 132) when the Book of Mormon had already condemned the practice (Jacob 1:15, 2:24)? Why did Brigham Young teach that Adam is “our Father and our God” when both the Bible and the Book of Mormon (Mormon 9:12) say that Adam is a creation of God (Journal of Discourses, Apr. 9, 1852, vol.1, p.50)? If Brigham Young was a true prophet, how come one of your later prophets overturned his declaration which stated that the black man could never hold the priesthood in the LDS Church until after the resurrection of all other races (Journal of Discourses, Dec. 12, 1854, 2:142-143)?

1:00:10 "Almost down to tithing levels." ~Landon

Re cell phone usage. Most people I think have scriptures etc on their phones so I find it hard to believe cell phone use would not be widespread.

More Temples = Better Activity Rate? = More Temple Recommends = MORE TITHING or STABILIZING TITHING

How do you resign and get excommunicated?

@brianrosenlof388

10 ай бұрын

Lol, I had this exact same question! Genuinely curious about this.

@sweetafton5655

10 ай бұрын

Sour grapes on the church’s part. So childish.

Its bad, my last ward closed after i left... and my socal stake used to among the biggest in socal... HUGE now its on life support, they had to expand its territory to in order to build a Spanish branch (adding this unit would keep the whole stake from being closed) and those Spanish members were already happily in their own Branch in another stake and got so pissed, they mostly stopped going, or continued going to their old branch

Maybe the combination of information coming on the internet and the fact that the second coming did not occur in 2000.

The 2018 changes were seen in the UK as a sign of the need to be more efficient (because of falling numbers). I felt really sorry for already over burdened bishops.

REMEMBER.... At Best, the ACTIVITY RATE in The Church has always been ONLY about 50%.

Agree with Rebecca re brunch. Definitely a killer blow for church attendance 😊

"I WAS IN THE POOL!"

And that’s why it’s actually the membership I believe. And quite a few other are thinking about the same thing 5 to 7,000,000 active members worldwide.

@fernandoramirezlugo2972

9 ай бұрын

I'm an active member of the Church. I know these videos are mostly watched by ex-mos, or anti-mormons. But I think 7 million active members is way too much. There are probably about 17 million members on the records world-wide, but I think there are roughly 3 million "active " members in the whole word.

@johnkauffman1191

9 ай бұрын

@@fernandoramirezlugo2972 Well, if you say so I will give him the church. The benefit letter might be more. I just got my letter. Church records Maybe a month ago maybe a little longer I don’t know haven’t been paying attention. But they said get a hold of the bishop or the stake President if I wish to re-join. I’m like I went and took my name off I was planning on re-joining.

A lot of conservative members moved out of California during and immediately following the pandemic as well. I'm sure that's not all of it, but it might be a quarter of the decline, those people moving to the Intermountain West.

@maxinekennedy5888

10 ай бұрын

So they should be showing up in the data there. Are they? Is that where all the "missing Mormons" from all over Europe are as well? 🤣🤣

@samsmom400

8 ай бұрын

My EX sociopathic, schizophrenic, pedophile, wife-beating, con-artist, TEMPLE RECCOMMEND CARD CARRYING husband dropped dead, that was at least 3 personalities right there.

Shrinkage?

@davidjanbaz7728

10 ай бұрын

Mormon god( HF ) does have a physical body so it's probable ! Dr F. Stavrakopoulou wrote [ God : An Anatomy] agrees with her interpretation of Isaiah 6:1 as God's Gigantic dick appearing in the Temple. Both R total fictional and Fringe scholarship but appropriate for Mormonism.

The Church exagerates its Australian membership by 250%. This I believe, is based on people who IDENTIFY as Mormon. But, if we look at attendance figures it would be worse. For example it seems, based on attendance in The U.K. (14.7%) ( not self identification on a census) the Church has an exageration figure of about 700%.

Simon, you look great, mi mate. I miss talking to you . When might we work together again? I try to keep up on BoM genetics.

The churches with the biggest building loss. Acts 17 - 24 god does not dwell in man made building. The louder they talk, the less their content is worth hearing.

After the lockdown we started meeting every other week, those with ladt names A-L one week and the rest the next for several months. I haven't always attended because my mom has no spleen and catches anything we bring home. We would do sacrament at home and report to the Bishopric.

lol. that title. haha

My ward is unique in that attendance numbers are returning to close to 2013 levels. We get in the last two months about 120 people, up from 50 a year ago. Most of these new people are Spanish speaking members. This is because my government is allowing Mexicans to immigrate with little effort.

Looking for show notes????

Who normally would be staffing temples?

@NerdyGirlLiveLove

9 ай бұрын

Elderly

I didn’t need the internet to stop attending. My missionary did it for me. Reached out to them and ghosted me. I thought she might have been interested in my reading her body language. She ghosted me. I truly get it if I may have misread things or her feelings had changed. But to simply ghost me even before the topic of romantic interest had come up is simply mind boggling. A simple happy thanksgiving went ignored. My own missionary I spent 6 week’s working with treated me like this. Now 10 months later it has still effects me. My self confidence has been destroyed and feel deeply betrayed.

Why was he excommunicated in 2005 if he was already resigned in 1998 while serving as bishop?

@user-og2wt3le4j

10 ай бұрын

They tried to use trumped up charges of an affair. He told this story on Mormon Stories podcast.

@drtwmurphy

10 ай бұрын

Simon’s book, Losing a Lost Tribe, came out in August 2004.

@sweetafton5655

10 ай бұрын

@@user-og2wt3le4jthat still doesn’t answer the question of why they ‘excommunicated’ him when he was already resigned.

@user-og2wt3le4j

10 ай бұрын

@@sweetafton5655 That's because if they have already issued a letter for a church court or an investigation has been started, you can't get away by just resigning your membership. The church court will still take place. It sounds illogical, but then again...

@sweetafton5655

10 ай бұрын

@@user-og2wt3le4j did you use the word ‘logical’? Lol

Should definitely see Dr. Longos brief on some very convincing ties to the Seminole and Semitic. Just because the world was transversed many times throughout ages and he stumbled across the rumours of the time. For me doesn't legitimize his claims but just shows where he most likely got his ideas.

@brettpinion4233

10 ай бұрын

Evidence for Book of Mormon in ancient America- none Evidence showing Book of Mormon is a 19th century religious fiction below: No wheat, no barley, no goats, no steel found in the Americas, no metal smelting furnaces, no metal armor, no temples, no steel swords, no skeletons of these warriors, no graves, no cities (it would be impossible for a city the size of Zarahemla to leave no trace), no cattle, no chariot parts, no Nephite coins (listed in book of Alma as being used for a thousand years), no Jewish relics from supposed jews, no metal plates like Nephites supposedly had, no artifacts whatsoever, no Nephite "reformed Egyptian" writings; and no evidence the book of Mormon "prophets" ever existed. There is zero archaeological, anthropological, topological, linguistic, or DNA evidence to support the Book of Mormon. It would be impossible for highly advanced civilizations (Jaredites, Nephites) with millions of people to have vanished off the face of the earth. The whole face of the land had become covered with buildings” (Mormon 1:7) “Two million Jaredites slain” (Ether 15:2) 38 cities are catalogued in the Book of Mormon, along with iron, steel, brass, metal swords, breast-plates, shields, armor, or chariots. Yet, not one item mentioned in the Book of Mormon has ever been discovered in America. The Book of Mormon speaks of sheep, swine, goats, wheat, barley, silk, and elephants-even though they weren’t brought to America until centuries later by Europeans in post-Columbian times. Again we see that Joseph Smith was thinking about things in his current day as he was fabricating the Book of Mormon. CAN WE TRUST OUR HEARTS as to book of Mormon since there is no evidence? Maroni chapter 10:4 says: "he will manifest the truth of it unto you" But: THE BIBLE WARNS YOU about trusting your own heart. Jeremiah 17:9 "the heart is deceitful above all things". Proverbs 28:26 "He that trusteth in his own heart is a fool." Please don't be a fool. The entire belief system and premise of Mormonism is based on a false claim the Bible was corrupted and "plain and precious parts" were removed by early Christian translators sometime after the apostles had all died. This is a very dangerous claim to make against the word of God, especially since God promised us his word would never pass away and would be with us forever (Isaiah 40:8; Psalms 100:5; Matthew 16:18, 24:35; 1 Peter 1:23-25). An Objective Test of the Bible and Book of Mormon The Claim: In the Book of Mormon, the prophet Nephi has a vision the Bible was corrupted after the 12 apostles preached it and after the formation of the “great and abominable church” (1 Nephi 13:26-29). Most Mormons believe this to be the Catholic Church which was formed early in the 4th century. Nephi claims this church was founded by the Devil to lead souls to hell (1 Nephi 14:3). So let’s objectively examine both the Bible and the Book of Mormon to be fair and test if any have errors. Bible: The earliest Dead Sea Scrolls have been historically dated by three different dating techniques to as early as 350 BC. Included in this discovery was the Great Isaiah Scroll, which is the oldest known complete copy of the Book of Isaiah and is dated to approximately 200 BC. Study the dead sea scrolls which are over 2,000 years old and see if they have Joseph Smith's uncorrupted version. They should if Joseph Smith was correct and the bible had been corrupted over time but, no they do not. They are the same today as they were over 2,100 years ago with only minor spelling or punctuation differences. Joseph Smith was wrong. The bible had not been corrupted. “You are my witnesses,” declares the Lord, “and my servant whom I have chosen, that you may know and believe me and understand that I am he. Before me no god was formed, nor shall there be any after me.” (Isaiah 43:10) If Mormonism is true, then God could not make the claim that there were no gods before him, for he was just a man at one point; nor could he claim that no gods would come after him, for that is the goal of every member of the LDS church. The new testament has not been corrupted either. Take for example John 1:1 a very important verse than Smith changed to make Jesus a created being. A papyri known as the Bodmer Papyri which is almost 1900 years old of the book of John. (this papyri was written not long after the apostle John would have died and it shows joseph smith changed the book of John, not that it got corrupted later as he alleged) John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God. ΕΝ ΑΡΧΗ ΗΝ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ ΚΑΙ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ ΗΝ ΠΡΟΣ ΤΟΝ ΘΕΟΝ ΚΑΙ ΘΕΟΣ ΗΝ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ I post this in love. The manuscript and archeological evidence for the bible is the greatest of anything in antiquity. I pray that you know the real Jesus, real peace, love and true salvation. "But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed." Galatians 1 One is a Jesus who is not eternal and was the spirit brother of lucifer in pre-existence & a God the Farther who was once a man - an exulted man. The other is the eternal Word, the Alpha and Omega- Jesus, by whom created all things, seen and unseen. And a God the Father who says the He alone is God, nor any god before, not any god after. There is no way for the Biblical account of Jesus to arrive at the account of the Book of Mormon. Mormons have been taught that the bible was corrupted. I hope to open eyes that God is much greater than the humanoid that you have been told about. He is the creator of all creation not just this solar system. Jesus said all scripture shall not fade away but many wolves and false prophets will come and try to add to the word. It pains my heart to see mormons fall for the lie that Satan first told Adam and Eve that we can be like the most high. Genesis 3 Joseph Smith sold the same lie. Another lie, a Temple like Solomon's Temple built in America does not exist. 100% impossibility as we would have some remains and there were no Levites in the Americas to serve in the temple so it would have been against Jewish law which book of mormon says were kept. If you study the bible you know this. Mormon's own the Hill Cumorah yet they do not excavate it because they know there is nothing there from previous digs. An excavation would be a grand embarrassment and would prove the religion is a lie. It did not happen. Look at Mormon Chapter 8 the evidence for it does not exist and evidence would exist if it happened. Why did Joseph Smith condone polygamy as an ordinance from God (Doctrine and Covenants 132) when the Book of Mormon had already condemned the practice (Jacob 1:15, 2:24)? Why did Brigham Young teach that Adam is “our Father and our God” when both the Bible and the Book of Mormon (Mormon 9:12) say that Adam is a creation of God (Journal of Discourses, Apr. 9, 1852, vol.1, p.50)? If Brigham Young was a true prophet, how come one of your later prophets overturned his declaration which stated that the black man could never hold the priesthood in the LDS Church until after the resurrection of all other races (Journal of Discourses, Dec. 12, 1854, 2:142-143)?

Nemo had an anxiety problem, so that is why they called him to the temple for his mission

I go to church to hear the Word and learn about Christ, when you take HIM out,you have NOTHING. That's the difference between followers of Christ (Christians) and Mormons. Mormons talk all day long about social programs and every single thing EXCEPT Jesus Christ. It's stunning. And frightening.

@shawnjensen3896

6 ай бұрын

I believe what you say is true with some people, but you can’t include all mormons many Mormons are devoted to Jesus Christ and talk of his gospel quite a bit. I get your point though.

It’s taking an excruciating long time to make an obvious point. Oh! So more people go to church Christmas and Easter. Who would have thought

The Jews are a people more than a religion. High immigration from Muslim and Hindu countries explains why they are increasing in the US. Christianity as a whole is having a terrible time in the West. Especially among young people. Latter-Day Saints are keeping their religion higher than most, if not all, other Christian denominations. This podcast is biased and not honest. PS Africa and countries like China and Iran are where Christianity is booming. The Nephites apostasized before Christ came in the Book of Mormon. While the Lamanites started to embrace him instead. This same pattern is happening now where the West is rejecting Christ, but previous non-Christian nations are embracing him instead.

@brettpinion4233

10 ай бұрын

Evidence for Book of Mormon in ancient America- none Evidence showing Book of Mormon is a 19th century religious fiction below: No wheat, no barley, no goats, no steel found in the Americas, no metal smelting furnaces, no metal armor, no temples, no steel swords, no skeletons of these warriors, no graves, no cities (it would be impossible for a city the size of Zarahemla to leave no trace), no cattle, no chariot parts, no Nephite coins (listed in book of Alma as being used for a thousand years), no Jewish relics from supposed jews, no metal plates like Nephites supposedly had, no artifacts whatsoever, no Nephite "reformed Egyptian" writings; and no evidence the book of Mormon "prophets" ever existed. There is zero archaeological, anthropological, topological, linguistic, or DNA evidence to support the Book of Mormon. It would be impossible for highly advanced civilizations (Jaredites, Nephites) with millions of people to have vanished off the face of the earth. The whole face of the land had become covered with buildings” (Mormon 1:7) “Two million Jaredites slain” (Ether 15:2) 38 cities are catalogued in the Book of Mormon, along with iron, steel, brass, metal swords, breast-plates, shields, armor, or chariots. Yet, not one item mentioned in the Book of Mormon has ever been discovered in America. The Book of Mormon speaks of sheep, swine, goats, wheat, barley, silk, and elephants-even though they weren’t brought to America until centuries later by Europeans in post-Columbian times. Again we see that Joseph Smith was thinking about things in his current day as he was fabricating the Book of Mormon. CAN WE TRUST OUR HEARTS as to book of Mormon since there is no evidence? Maroni chapter 10:4 says: "he will manifest the truth of it unto you" But: THE BIBLE WARNS YOU about trusting your own heart. Jeremiah 17:9 "the heart is deceitful above all things". Proverbs 28:26 "He that trusteth in his own heart is a fool." Please don't be a fool. The entire belief system and premise of Mormonism is based on a false claim the Bible was corrupted and "plain and precious parts" were removed by early Christian translators sometime after the apostles had all died. This is a very dangerous claim to make against the word of God, especially since God promised us his word would never pass away and would be with us forever (Isaiah 40:8; Psalms 100:5; Matthew 16:18, 24:35; 1 Peter 1:23-25). An Objective Test of the Bible and Book of Mormon The Claim: In the Book of Mormon, the prophet Nephi has a vision the Bible was corrupted after the 12 apostles preached it and after the formation of the “great and abominable church” (1 Nephi 13:26-29). Most Mormons believe this to be the Catholic Church which was formed early in the 4th century. Nephi claims this church was founded by the Devil to lead souls to hell (1 Nephi 14:3). So let’s objectively examine both the Bible and the Book of Mormon to be fair and test if any have errors. Bible: The earliest Dead Sea Scrolls have been historically dated by three different dating techniques to as early as 350 BC. Included in this discovery was the Great Isaiah Scroll, which is the oldest known complete copy of the Book of Isaiah and is dated to approximately 200 BC. Study the dead sea scrolls which are over 2,000 years old and see if they have Joseph Smith's uncorrupted version. They should if Joseph Smith was correct and the bible had been corrupted over time but, no they do not. They are the same today as they were over 2,100 years ago with only minor spelling or punctuation differences. Joseph Smith was wrong. The bible had not been corrupted. “You are my witnesses,” declares the Lord, “and my servant whom I have chosen, that you may know and believe me and understand that I am he. Before me no god was formed, nor shall there be any after me.” (Isaiah 43:10) If Mormonism is true, then God could not make the claim that there were no gods before him, for he was just a man at one point; nor could he claim that no gods would come after him, for that is the goal of every member of the LDS church. The new testament has not been corrupted either. Take for example John 1:1 a very important verse than Smith changed to make Jesus a created being. A papyri known as the Bodmer Papyri which is almost 1900 years old of the book of John. (this papyri was written not long after the apostle John would have died and it shows joseph smith changed the book of John, not that it got corrupted later as he alleged) John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God. ΕΝ ΑΡΧΗ ΗΝ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ ΚΑΙ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ ΗΝ ΠΡΟΣ ΤΟΝ ΘΕΟΝ ΚΑΙ ΘΕΟΣ ΗΝ Ο ΛΟΓΟΣ I post this in love. The manuscript and archeological evidence for the bible is the greatest of anything in antiquity. I pray that you know the real Jesus, real peace, love and true salvation. "But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed." Galatians 1 One is a Jesus who is not eternal and was the spirit brother of lucifer in pre-existence & a God the Farther who was once a man - an exulted man. The other is the eternal Word, the Alpha and Omega- Jesus, by whom created all things, seen and unseen. And a God the Father who says the He alone is God, nor any god before, not any god after. There is no way for the Biblical account of Jesus to arrive at the account of the Book of Mormon. Mormons have been taught that the bible was corrupted. I hope to open eyes that God is much greater than the humanoid that you have been told about. He is the creator of all creation not just this solar system. Jesus said all scripture shall not fade away but many wolves and false prophets will come and try to add to the word. It pains my heart to see mormons fall for the lie that Satan first told Adam and Eve that we can be like the most high. Genesis 3 Joseph Smith sold the same lie. Another lie, a Temple like Solomon's Temple built in America does not exist. 100% impossibility as we would have some remains and there were no Levites in the Americas to serve in the temple so it would have been against Jewish law which book of mormon says were kept. If you study the bible you know this. Mormon's own the Hill Cumorah yet they do not excavate it because they know there is nothing there from previous digs. An excavation would be a grand embarrassment and would prove the religion is a lie. It did not happen. Look at Mormon Chapter 8 the evidence for it does not exist and evidence would exist if it happened. Why did Joseph Smith condone polygamy as an ordinance from God (Doctrine and Covenants 132) when the Book of Mormon had already condemned the practice (Jacob 1:15, 2:24)? Why did Brigham Young teach that Adam is “our Father and our God” when both the Bible and the Book of Mormon (Mormon 9:12) say that Adam is a creation of God (Journal of Discourses, Apr. 9, 1852, vol.1, p.50)? If Brigham Young was a true prophet, how come one of your later prophets overturned his declaration which stated that the black man could never hold the priesthood in the LDS Church until after the resurrection of all other races (Journal of Discourses, Dec. 12, 1854, 2:142-143)?

@timhazeltine3256

9 ай бұрын

What?? Your comment about Jewish people and their faith or lack there of, is ignorant at best and anti-Semitic at worst.