So, it turns out that KZread just turned off the polling feature, because nobody was using it... Let me know down in the comments what you think we need to change about the way we dive because of infections in the comments below...

@aurelienbloch

4 жыл бұрын

you could make a strawpoll.me?

Coming from a country with relatively low cases, my currents thoughts are; - the chance of an OOG situation is low, and - the chance of me and my buddy/partner diving while C19 positive is low, and - the OOG (if it does happen) has a worse likely outcome than the C19 infection (if it does happen) So the numbers look best to not stress too much, donate where needed, and go safely from there. Safely would, however, include grabbing details of the diver who donated to you so you can keep in touch about any illness over the next few weeks, and also to donate a 6-pack or two in thanks for saving your butt.

I plan on diving normal long hose primary donate, and I'm not particularly worried about it. In order for there to be an issue, all of these things need to be true. a. A diver needs to run out of air b. The person donating gas needs to be infected c. There is enough viral load transmitted through the regulator (which has been filled with [salt]water and then purged during the transfer) for infection to happen I think the likelihood of all three of those things happening on a dive are very very low. That said, I would still confirm that anyone I dive with is okay with me using that setup before planning a dive with them. And if there is an out of gas situation with primary donate, the person who was out of gas should quarantine for at least 3 days and then get a COVID test. The person who donated their primary should also get a test. If both of those come back negative, then everything is good to go. If you live in a place that doesn't have the testing capacity for that, then you may need to make a different decision. I do think that training needs to change. With a secondary donate, no real change is needed, except that you can only do air share drills with one other person, and you can't switch to your own secondary at any point. For primary donate training, I think a simulated air share is fine. The muscle memory for the person donating will be the same, and the person who needs the gas will take the regulator so as long as they know how to purge it and breathe, they'll be fine. So if they can switch to their own secondary, they can receive someone else's.

Just found your channel :) - Glad to see you're still doing videos - always loved your stuff on Simply!

Definitely good points to keep in mind. A couple of months ago, just before my country went into lockdown, I went on a dive where one of my friends ran out of air. He grabbed my primary while I switched to my octo. There were increasing covid cases by then, so we were naturally worried a little, especially after my friend fell sick a few days later (just regular flu thankfully). But after the dive, we both didnt self quarantine, but just were more careful for the next two weeks, self monitor for any symptoms, not going out/meeting people unnecessarily, don't share food, wear masks, etc. So I don't think we need to change the way we dive exactly, but good to discuss with the others diving with you, especially if you don't really know them, to know what everyone's comfort levels are, and come to an agreement on what to do in an emergency (just like running through the other emergency protocols during the dive brief).

I can’t tell you the right way of doing things, but I can say what I’ve seen. In most technical diving circles most people are selecting option 3 with a modified-modified S drill, being that we show the long hose is free vs doing an actually doing an air share. During training air shares are typically gone, NSS-CDS instead has the donated reg clipped off on your left D-ring to simulate the air share.

I'll take a DM course next month and swapping the gear with another diver while sharing one regulator (no octo) is part of the skills. I can't imagine we are supposed to do this under these circumstances. Generally, I guess it's reasonable to avoid any kind of using the same reg in training, buddy check etc., but forget about Covid in a real-life emergency.

As you already said, predive i usually check my equipment for my own safety, which means i have both of my second stages in my mouth. I am not quite sure, but using a desinfectant afterwards in between going into the water will very likely not get rid of all coronaviruses in my regulator. under these circumstances i think diving solo in a buddy team might be the best option in recreational diving. in order to do so, you should plan your dive as safe as possible: no deco dives, cold water configuration with two independant first stages, conservative gas planning. Remember, you can still breath from free flow. I think some divers just need some more training to feel comfortable underwater.

For training, avoiding sharing 2nd stages is I think a good idea in general, even pre-covid and post-covid, because it is done repetitively, and with equipment that I doubt was fully sanitized each time (at least pre-covid). In real diving, the certainty of dying on the spot beats the risk of maybe dying a few weeks later. The same can be extended to rescue breaths. That said, in real diving, in single-gas setups, avoiding to share 2nd stages is feasible and should be done, preferably with people taking a little better care of their octos. For diving with multiple gases, where putting octos on all the tanks could easily get chaotic, primary donate would probably have to stay and all participants implicitly accept that risk.

This is a lot information, our PADI instructor from owd sent us some of the updates yesterday and it is quite a bit.

Diving is a sport where you put your trust in your buddy for 100%, so ICE I keep on doing this. Currently I train and dive with my wife, so no trust issues and Covid problems. We both have basic, single tank setup. Whenever I dive, I always perform my own checks with the Exception of the alternate airsource, I leave that for the buddy check. I am concidering to switch to long hose, so I am looking forward to the future. Diving with my better half......no problem. Diving with another buddy...... We count on trust, risk assessment ( what are the chances if you plan your dive and dive your plan, and how big is the chance that you are really infected) and common sense... Anyway, with an alert level of 50 infections on 100.000 persons!! There is (in my opinion) more panic and stress than really necessary. Stay healthy and have fun dives!!

My thoughts are: It should be a secondary donate to try and reduce the risk but in all honesty if it's a real life emergency then the present emergency takes priority over a possible virus problem later on, you're also likely to be pretty close when surfacing in a real life emergency as the person being rescued could need additional help.

I dive sidemount for my own doves which deals with my own issues of out of gas. If sidemount more widely used there would be less issues when it comes to gas sharing. Maybe it should be standard to use two independent gas sources for a dive. Be that a pony clipped off or proper sidemount. Both options would make divers more self sufficient and reduces the need to share gas even more. When I am diving in a mixed team i am only diving with someone in my immediate bubble so I am currently not worried about gas sharing When I'm teaching/guiding I have gone back to a standard short primary and 36" secondary that is disinfected.

I pretty much do most my diving with the same buddy, using the "standard" hose routing opposed to long hose primary donate. (That said I may be moving to long hose after having moved to bp&w from bcd) Pre covid he would check my octo pre dive, as I would check his. I don't see any reason to change, he is the only person that breaths off my octo pre dive and in a ooa situation and vis versa.

I have a question for your QA videos: What do you do whrn you are thirsty on longer tec dives? What is your setup? Do you have a camelpack underwater with you?

I am a Sidemount diver. Currently, my set up is two independent tanks each with it's own regulator setup. One has a short hose and necklace and the other is on a long hose to donate. During the dive is switch between both tanks at regular intervals. If a buddy needs air they get the long hose. So, now I wonder if I should add another hose to the right (long hose) tank for me and leave the long hose fo donating only.

@shane8779

4 жыл бұрын

as an instructor when I dive sidemount I have an extra 1.2m hose that act's as my long house and I also have my standard 2m hose clipped off to my d ring but I use an o-ring between the hose and the boltsnap so it can easily be broken away to donate in an emergency. when.i dive single tank backmount i also use a 2m hose but it's the short hose on.the nacklace that i use for.my primarily.this way I unsure that it least one reg has never been.in.my mouth and I buy a big bag of cheep 1 dollar mouth pieces and give it to my student after the course.

I am thinking that this video applies not only to the dive training industry but also to those divers that mostly rent equipment when traveling. Now we will have to think twice when on a business trip and wanting to take the opportunity to go diving.

Hi Mark, great to see you back on KZread! I'd have a question for your next Q&A: I'm considering buying my first set of regulators. I'll also be diving in colder water, so this is a factor to consider (need two first stages). A shop near by sells the complete sets from Dive Rite including two XT1 and two XT2. What is your opinion on this brand as well as these specific models? Is the brand Dive Rite popular around the world (in case I neeed to get something fixed while on holiday)? Thanks a lot, Fabian

I can see the issue with training, as highlighted by others below. I think a pragmatic approach as detailed by each agency and the likes of DAN is worth implementing in these cases. I'm due to dive for the first time since CV19 this weekend. I'm fortunate in the my dive buddies will be my daughter and my son who live with me. As such, I'm fully aware if their current situation and feel on that basis in an OOG situation there would be no issues for any of us. As others have said, rather be alive and potential of CV19 than the other option. Still planning on disinfecting our kit and keeping socially distant whilst on land. I've also spent an eye watering amount of money kiting all 3 if us out with regs so that I don't have to hire these, and have any niggling doubt in the back of my mind.

Depth by drowning? Or ill from covid. In emergency donating any reg would be more than acceptable in my eyes. That person would only then need to isolate for 3 days after the dive incase of covid interaction, as they would start showing symptoms, Would be my thought. Training on the other hand is different, I would suggest the drill would be done as normal , except you would continue breathing from your own regs, whilst hoping buddy reg in gloved hands. Not heard any cases of covid passing through large bodies of water yet, so being under water is probably safer atm. Kit hire shouldn't be allowed unless can be disinfected, which in case of regs would mean a disassemble which isn't practical. Tanks should be wiped after filling with disinfectant wipes. So much information out there. Keep safe and enjoy the diving.

@SaltyPirate71

4 жыл бұрын

"Death", maybe?

@mechanikos84

3 жыл бұрын

Did you fill your SCUBA tank with disinfectant wipes? Just joking, but wheren't all divers told not to dive if they feel ill or have a cold, let alone C-19... Dive with buddies you can trust, so you know their safe second (wasn't in anyones mouth for ages) is germ-free.

In my opinion its fair to say atm dive only with people you trust 100% there is a real low risk of the need to share your gas. For my part the only dives i do atm are with well trained people and no 3rd wheel buddies or newbies. In my opinion this is a manageable risk and tbh i am no expert on the subject but if iam for example for around 20 min in the water should the bacteria be washed away.? Anyways i think i will redo my gear configuration from primary donate to something else, but it sucks for twins.

@KimonFrousios

3 жыл бұрын

Firstly, no, bacteria won't wash away in water without soap and rubbing. They have methods of clinging to surfaces. Besides, it's not like the water doesn't already have bacteria, protozoans, etc already living in it and that will get in the 2nd stage cavity as it floods. Secondly, SARS-COV-2 is a virus, not a bacterium. Very very different thing. Trust is complex. You can trust someone for one thing and not for another. More than trusting them as divers or having your back in a pub brawl, you need to specifically trust that they take social distancing and hygiene seriously.

How about a video on reg cleaning would be a good follow up to this subject. If you donate via your octo would giving the free flow button a press not be be enough to check it you smell and taste from your own primary?

@SafeDiving

3 жыл бұрын

Reg cleaning video should go live next week on the Scuba Diver Magazine Channel kzread.info/dron/koJu-OVU7qc-xbWozSMRKQ.html Purge button on the octo; sure, but it doesn't check the exhaust valve isn't stuck, and in cold environments it can freeflow. Slim chances of both of those but I like to check

@markgardner8881

3 жыл бұрын

That’s where experience pays off I would Never have thought of that and look forward to seeing video enjoying all of your stuff thanks Mark

i say it should all be taught and discuss the pros and cons of each emergency procedure for divers safety that being said in my personal opinion i think we should all just move on with our lives because much like time, life doesnt wait for anyone and if we spend all of our time in fear of what may or may not happen then are we even living at all? i understand both sides and not saying one is more correct than the other but at some point much like everything else in life we just have to learn to accept certain risks that come from living

Good channel Mark. Personally I will still continue with my longhose in an out of gas situation, and if the choice is between drowning or facing the risk with Covid-19 while using a safe method of sharing gas... simple choice. If the day comes when I dont want to take that risk I will do1 of 2 things; solodiving only or quit diving. Is there any right or wrong here? I think that every one must make up their mind about whats right or wrong and then ask themselfes: ”is it still worth the risk?” / greetings from Sweden;)

My .02 is go with the standard ugly ass yellow "safe second" secured on a necklace to keep it out of the mud and sand. (Don't get me started on octos and gauge consoles dragging all over the reef) Because it's still what 90 % of certified divers were trained to look for in an emergency. Test then disinfect your octo before the dive. And remember that in an out of air emergency, 100 people out of 100 will want to accept an octo to avoid drowning and worry about C19 afterward. All we can do is the best we can do ...reasonably.

hmm... out of air or catching a disease, what has higher risk?... Cvid risk, in divers age range, is less then participating in London street traffic. If this continuous we soon will have to sign Buddy disclaimers...

IMO, total non-issue. You are probably 10,000 times more likely to become infected or infect another person whilst NOT diving, ie on your way to the dive site, on the boat, in the car etc than when diving. Especially in salt water, where you are surrounded by a couple of million gallons of a highly toxic (to bacteria) substance. Most divers are probably not going to be vunerable (health wise, because if so, you shouldn't be suba diving anyway!) so a smal number of infections is not a issue.

@complicatedmechanics9599

3 жыл бұрын

The other fact: OOG is dangerous enough to do not care about possible infections.

Even if you catch it, the harm is so minimal.

@SafeDiving

3 жыл бұрын

I've heard the worst case is death... Studies have show that it can cause damage to your heart, lungs and other organs if it hits you bad, which are quite important for scuba divers. I'll do my best to steer clear of COVID