The local church should certainly have the highest role in raising up preachers of the Word.

@darrenjohnson2912

2 жыл бұрын

Nothing could be more true! I’m sick of seeing pastors die without a successor.

@wolkenpower

2 жыл бұрын

Oof

@slash4216

Жыл бұрын

This has been my biggest belief and I can't get a position in my church because I don't have a degree.

@repentorperish1386

Жыл бұрын

​@@slash4216 and thats a shame

@Blessingsuponyou

8 ай бұрын

Agreed but preachers and pastors here, complain they dotn get the funds to sustain them, yet they have no seminary degrees

Very good. Loved when he said getting a degree in seminary isn’t like getting one in a secular school. Just bc you graduate seminary doesn’t mean you have a right to lead God’s people.

@AnHebrewChild

2 жыл бұрын

He said "feed my sheep," not "lead my sheep." (He leadeth me) (the Lord is my shepherd)

@JD-rx2kh

2 жыл бұрын

@@AnHebrewChild right but realistically there are still leaders in the church. Hebrews 13:7 makes this clear when the author says to remember your leaders and imitate their faith. Also, Paul told Timothy to a point leaders in all the churches he would start. Yes, Jesus said feed His sheep but he also said Peter would be the rock (leader) that the church would be built on. Whole counsel of the Bible my friend, not just one text. Blessings!

@AnHebrewChild

2 жыл бұрын

@@JD-rx2kh I hear what you're saying for sure. The contents of the above back & forth broaches a big topic but one I'm convinced Jesus' church would do well to take seriously: Protestant-Ref doctrines of the priesthood (& brotherhood) of all believers. Semper Reformanda, or we might do more excellently to say Semper Purgans ie purifying. The words of the Lord are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times. I love Jesus' instruction on the point of the minister in ministry. Ye know that they which are accounted to rule over the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and their great ones exercise authority upon them. But so shall it not be among you: but whosoever will be great among you, shall be your minister: And whosoever of you will be the chiefest, shall be servant of all. For even the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many. God-the-Son is so very clear. "For his word was with power." It's our muddleheaded minds that, concerning church polity, make things so complicated. In any case, nice reference of Hebrews. From the time I became a believer, that book was always one of my favourites. Blessings to you too!

@loveppl6999

2 жыл бұрын

AMEN

Fishermen and tax collectors will do.

@MrBerean14

11 ай бұрын

They learned directly from Jesus. He was the perfect teacher!

@gonchalo95

8 ай бұрын

​@MrBerean14 yet it was to their benefit that he would leave for the Helper to come.

@BigDan21.

5 ай бұрын

True, but even still it was a 3 year apostleship directly from God himself, who hand picked them! I don't know about you, but I'd rather have this experience than all other schools combined!

@bryanpeed5334

4 ай бұрын

Nailed it😆🙏

@jenniferbloomingdale6359

2 ай бұрын

♥️

I’ve been preaching for 43 years, have several degrees, and glad I put forth the effort to attain them. That said, none of them were necessary to be able to preach. True, Godly mentoring is far superior to any academic pursuit, e.g. Jesus and the twelve, Paul and Timothy, et al.

@macarari

2 жыл бұрын

David, I cannot compare myself to you BUT I can tell you! I have been to churches that are truly from God and you can really feel his presence BUT lack knowledge plus theological aspect, you can really see them suffer to some extent because of it. On the other hand, from personal experience I did a seminary for about a year and a half; in all honesty, even it wasn't a lot. It has done tremendous difference in my life. I have been able to talk to people on matters (based on what I learned ) with more wisdom vs if I didn't have it. (I'm currently looking for a place to enroll so I can continue)

@darrenjohnson2912

2 жыл бұрын

Amen🙏🏿

I have been Pastor now going on 23 years, thank God I had a great mentor Dr L.K. Jones who Pastor 36 years in one Church ⛪️. Dr Jones always said God is the one that calls a person to Preach and Pastor

@sonnyh9774

Жыл бұрын

Sadly, most churches and pastors don't act as though they really believe that as they will push out or fire other ministers who they don't think fit well on "their" team.

@jamesgorham7125

Жыл бұрын

@Sonny H You are right, but don't forget that some Pastors are carnal minded and not following Jesus, the Bible says you will know them by their fruits, lifestyle

@jamesgorham7125

Жыл бұрын

You got that right and I agree 👍 💯, there are many carnal minded Pastors and Leaders in the Church ⛪️ that will one day answer to God for their actions especially how they treat God's people, the people belongs to God.

@toma3447

6 ай бұрын

If you guys are reading this comment I really need help. I’m education major. I really want to be a teacher. But lately there has been so much confliction in my life. God spoke to me. He said my plan isn’t his plan and that i will teach even greater things. And everywhere i go people keep asking me if im going to do ministry and i even got invited to teach Sunday school. Im afraid and absolutely torn into pieces right now. I feel like I’ve been swallowed by a giant whale. Why me?

@bryanpeed5334

4 ай бұрын

​@@toma3447-Psalm 27:14- Wait on the Lord! Be of strong courage and He shall strengthen your heart. Wait, I say, on the Lord!! -Ephesians 4:6-7- Be anxious for nothing but in everything with prayer and supplication and with thanksgiving, let your requests be made known to God. And the peace of God which surpasses all understanding will guard your hearts and minds in Christ Jesus. I've lived a painful, wretched life. God saved me 3 years ago and the scales fell from my eyes. I believe whenever someone has a crossroads in their life and they aren't sure what to do the only thing YOU can do is let go and trust our God Who governs everything. He has a great plan for you on HIS time. And if you are "forced" to make a decision like moving or a career decision then start to pursue it with faith. If it ends up being wrong, don't stress, God will course correct you, even if it comes in the form of chastisement. Rejoice, for if you are truly saved then what will be will be and you will be alright by the end. Remember this is a marathon not a race and sometimes we just have to endure with the knowledge that Jesus didn't sacrifice Himself for nothing, he does have glorious things to reveal to each of His children for His purpose. God bless you and I hope this helps in the name of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. 🙏

A whole new field for me. Close to retirement and taking seminary classes after being a public servant for so many years. This is very good insight.

I dont think there is such a more serious, more important, role or responsibility than that of a Pastor. Sometimes I really believe men jump into it too quickly without understanding its seriousness. I mean just reading the pastoral epistles makes it clear. I truly believe if the roles of Elder/Pastor are filled with biblically qualified men. Its a foundational necessity . God honoring and God will bless it.

@darrenjohnson2912

2 жыл бұрын

Well said!

Great counsel and advice from pastor doug.... Whose wants to start a Pastoral Ministry....

Doug's approach and methods are by far the best among institutional churches that are not Anabaptist in nature. I very much respect the things he spoke about here.

I like listening to Doug Wilson. He is often times - as he very much is in this video - fair, thoughtful, and articulate in the answers he gives.

Thank you brothers. This is encouraging and helpful. God bless.

This is so spot on!

Thanks very much for those good Words of Wisdom and Encouragement on preaching the gospel 🙌. The key is being born again and call by God. Must also be a person of prayer 🙏

@aneforeffort

Жыл бұрын

Nailed it!

@jamesgorham7125

Жыл бұрын

@@aneforeffort Amen Amen Amen 🙏 🙌 👏

There is much wisdom here. Having attended four different evangelical seminaries for various degree programs, I can state categorically that most of my fellow students, at the time, had no business being there. Almost none of them had ever shared the gospel with anyone, let alone led them through making a confession of faith. Almost none had ever lead even a Bible study. Some had helped out in children's Sunday school. Most had no prior significant theological reading. None of them knew, let alone had actually tried to help, someone in crises. In fact, most of my compatriots were men who sincerely loved the Lord, and had no clue as to what they would do for a life's work. Since they took their faith seriously, their family and friends recommended seminary; and usually, they came from families where Grandma or Grandad was willing to foot the bill for a graduate education. Upon graduation, because they had contacts within their denominations, they managed to find work; and as long as they made their congregations happy (by not making any waves), they would move up the chain of empty pulpits, until the Peter Principle kicked in... I have examined many such men at Presbytery over the years and long ago determined that the sad, sad state of the American church can be traced directly to how we prepare our ministers. So once again, Mr. Wilson has nailed it. Would that more would heed his counsel here.

@blacksheep_77

3 жыл бұрын

Well written response brother.

@IkeCreed

2 жыл бұрын

Dang, all those degrees and qualifications and you never learned to humble yourself. You should check out the fruits of the spirit.

@therealkillerb7643

2 жыл бұрын

@@IkeCreed Never learned how to read other people's heart in order to judge a stranger's character either.

@IkeCreed

2 жыл бұрын

@@therealkillerb7643 clearly

@junky802

Жыл бұрын

Worth the read

Very helpful as usual!

Preach the word. You dont need a call from the ppl. God brings the ppl, you just need to preach, practice, and know what youre preaching.

@AnHebrewChild

4 жыл бұрын

imabeast7 yessir. And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart, Praising God, and having favour with all the people. *And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.*

@michaelsanders7484

Жыл бұрын

It’s a great indicator however. How do you know if God has called you to be a preacher? Well, what does Gods people say? How do we find out are spiritual gifts? By using them in service to each other. If I say my gift is teaching, but nobody is edified by it, my gift is certainly not teaching lol. If I say I am to be a preacher, but nobody else thinks so, well, that’s cause enough to re-examine.

very wise words

such great advice!

finally ... some HONESTY about this question

this was great insight...i wish i lived in Pastor Doug's city to study under him, found out about Postmillennialism from him (which is a crucial conviction in my heart) so he's become a top 3 pastor in my book! Love his approach. Does anyone happen to know of any Pastors or Churches in Miami, FL that are similar to Pastor Doug's POV/style? I really want to get serious with my theological walk under a mentor similar to Doug's approach...

Many people say I should be a pastor because of the way I speak. They say its amazing and even I am amazed on how I can preach. I tell them unfortunately I am not qualified according to the requirements and rules set by man. I can not preach in a church, i even find myself preaching to pastors and once i was meant to be a the next pastor for a small town church. Again, the rules set by Man and the US Mystery Babylon the great will not allow me to to be so. I proclaim I am qualified and worthy to be a pastor......YHWH grants me this and man gets in the way like the Devil. I hold nothing against them and move on. The existing pastors shall preach and I to see my mission still. Bless you in the Name of the Word of Life thy Authority who is in Spirit and live forever.

I like Old Doug .

This is out-of-this-world and Im just shaking my head watching this wondering why no one hasn't come up with this before. Aside from the student loan debt theres so many other problems here and I think they all stem from an model thats been used thats nowhere found in Scripture and thats the parachurch ministries (in this case traditional seminaries). Canon Press, NSA, Logos School, and all of Doug's work is done through the local church-Christ's Church. Churches should be finding young men who have that calling then working with them through an internal church program for a mini-seminary and having them go alongside senior pastors for elder meetings, counseling sessions, visits to hospitals to see ailing church members, and things like that. I can see God blessing Christ's Church and even Moscow, Idaho to a certain extent.

@SimpleManGuitars1973

4 жыл бұрын

Go listen to Voddie Baucham talking about "youth ministry" and you'll see a lot of what seminaries are doing.

@grantarmbruster6591

4 жыл бұрын

The AG church has had Master's Commission for many decades

@nickspitzley8539

3 жыл бұрын

The reformed churches are sadly missing this.

I believe I am too quiet to be a pastor. I appreciate this none the less. Much wisdom here. I am way ahead of myself if I wanted to be a pastor. But thanks for the video.

I still remember two tenants of my sister and brother in law. They lived in a basement two bedroom apartment with two small children. Both the husband and wife had just finished MDiv degrees and were living a mountain of student loans. Both had no full time pastoral positions. I heard they eventually went into other careers just to survive financially.

Hello Dr.Adam Everett here from Scroggins Texas greetings

The opening starts off with Doug acknowledging and recognizing a very profound paradox with the current system. Most positions require a seminary degree and most seminaries require a secular bachelor's degree. Biblically, teaching and being able to rightly divide the word requires training and Doug recognizes this. I wish he would recognize the fundamental issues with seminary as seminary does jot adequately address the problem. Jesus says GO OUT AND MAKE DISCIPLES. Not STAY PUT. There is a fundamental call to train people in places where the knowledge is lacking. This is precisely the issues with the current seminary system. It's so expensive because the seminaries are generally located in expensive neighborhoods and the expenses go into the cost of living for the professors and overall cost of the building and operations. So at the root, seminary requires poor men to be able to afford travel and provisions along with cost of education in order to be trained. This should not be so. The same poor men, no matter how devout, are generally overlooked while more well off men from who knows where have more weight in getting pastoral positions in their hometowns. The current seminary system is deeply flawed. Doug makes some good patchwork trying to justify the system but I don't think this is exactly how it works. Nobody was referring the man is ACTS 18:26. And even more, the training came to him. GO OUT AND MAKE DISCIPLES. Seminary professors/teachers should be willing to travel to instruct individuals where they are. But that would require sacrifice on part of the teacher, no one wants to do this. But to whom much is given, much is required. The pain and grief of trying to enter into ministry is absolutely staggering. More competition than any other profession in the history of mankind. With so much competition you would think that there would so many men teaching accurately, when that just isn't the case. You can hardly talk to your neighbor concerning scripture because, YOURE NOT THE PASTOR and YOURE UNEDUCATED; much less can they get a paid position. No, I have given that up completely. It doesn't exist. And seminary is a roadblock to anyone wanting to be a faithful minister while a stepping stone for unregenerate men to get these positions and teach anything they want. "But seminary teaches Greek and philosophy" Yes, for the sole reason of proper exegetical analysis of scripture. A perfect understanding of church history is largely unnecessary. Example: Seminaries have this perfect history available and people still walk out with a degree while remaining unregenerate. This is because the act of regeneration is the act and will of God. Perfect knowledge of church history just is not necessary for a pastoral position. For example: I make things out of wood, I am a carpenter. I'm very capable of performing a great range of tasks beyond some men, and can handle myself on a jobsite, but at the same time, I will be learning for the rest of my life and someone is going to come along, hopefully my son, and expand on the skills I have learned. I wouldnt have the occupation I have nor the skill, if I wasn't able to start out somewhere. And to be sure I moved from California because of their idolatry of education. Being "uneducated" lands you in a gutter no matter how skilled you are. And if you are a white christian, you're in a bigger gutter because taking advantage of the government just isn't what you believe in. Businesses require that you be able to back up your claim of experience with a paper trail or referral. Churches do the same. Why not back up the experience with demonstration? I've done this. To my own demise. "I'm sorry but it still is this way" The paper is much more than the skill. And not many men want to invest anything in the untrained without payment. The less risk the better says corporate greedy America and the seminaries have adopted the same views. And this is the big issue with seminary.

@josephkueber6945

2 жыл бұрын

Im coming from a local church that is looking for me to be on staff one day. Your explanation of this is amazing. Thank you for your insight.

@michaelsanders7484

Жыл бұрын

Sounds like you have a problem with big seminaries. I’m not sure there the issue, and they are reasonably affordable, it just may take longer than 4 years if you have a family. But there are plenty of smaller seminaries and institutes that can provide a good education and training, and there’s nothing wrong with that. Honestly, it just sounds like your angry at it, and because you don’t like it, nobody else should like it or use it. Times change, but the principle of training/education is all throughout the NT. I’d argue that the apostles had the best seminary education haha. While it’s not a biblical requirement, I’d wager 99% ought to get a formal education before trying to shepherd the flock.

Get a marketable undergrad degree while also being involved in your local church and reading your Bible plus theology books. You will have a way to earn money if ministry doesn't work out and you'll learn just as much as someone who went to Bible college.

There are some good seminaries that integrate studies with church life and discipleship of the seminarian. Unfortunately, nearly all of them are found exclusively in the U.S.

@lucasbackus

2 жыл бұрын

Please name these seminaries you speak of. Thank you.

Oh yeah, Wilson is a good person to endorse

MINTS, Miami International Seminary, look it up.

Anyone with a knowledge of scripture and a suitable voice for Speaking to a group of people can deliver a gospel message If course it wont save unless god himself draws them to him!

Do you keep the Sabbath or the Catholic Sunday?

What if we can’t move to Idaho?

Please i need help on how to get in your seminary

Preaching is a gift from God. You cannot just decide to be a preacher on your own. You must be called by God. People who become preacher through school are called "dumb dogs" in Isaiah 56:10 and 11.

I'd like to hear more about the differentiation between preacher and pastor here. Pastors, elders, bishops, etc should also have the qualifications to preach by definition. Preachers who are single are not Pastors by definition. I hear a lot of cross terminology used just about everywhere these days.

0:36 What is the difference between systematic and biblical theology? Can you make a short clip on that? 9:39 Interesting. 10:47 EXCELLENT, comment.

@kennethstandridge1205

Жыл бұрын

Systematic theology arranges religious truths and applies them for today. While Biblical theology applies the Bible in its redemptive, historical context. Many preachers today like to preach strictly systematicly, but it's clear that a healthy mix of both is needed from the pulpit.

Go to a church where there is a lot you can learn, not a lot you will have to give; where the Word is preached to the highest degree and God is honored. Amen If no seminary degree, surround yourself with like-minded people who are wanting to do the same thing!

Most seminaries today are not meeting these qualifications anymore. But from what I observed, experienced, and been told, there are pastors in my area who gained thst position because of nepotism; and that without a formal theological education. I've personally been told by a handful of pastors and elders that all my seminary education proves is that I'm arrogant. Go figure!

@JH324

Жыл бұрын

Sounds like they are ignorant, foolish or jealous. I wont attend a church without a educated pastor.

Our Lord Jesus Christ determines who are pastors. Ephesians 4:10-15 KJVS [10] He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.) [11] And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; [12] For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: [13] Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: [14] That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; [15] But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ: A true pastor will not teach the doctrine of man but the doctrine of God.

@blacksheep_77

3 жыл бұрын

Glad you thru this verse in! Very accurate!

Hi sir my name is moses I am tabala player I want becom paster so after 10th what i want study plz any suggestion plz🙏

@5:48 “have a beer with the guys...” did I hear that correctly?? 😳

@bereanbarnabas3355

3 жыл бұрын

Yes

@Airic

Жыл бұрын

did Jesus not turn water into wine? why is everyone tripping out about having a beer during Bible Study?? smh.

I mean it makes sense but the problem is if I want to preach I’m either going to have to have a lot of money for school or live most of my life in debt.

@nappyboyhooper1626

4 ай бұрын

I believe if God is calling you somewhere, he’ll make a way. I am in a similar boat.

Jesus did not pick his disciples from any theological education institutions though there were many to choose from at the time. C. H. Spurgeon and D. L. Moody did not attend seminary. I believe Pastor Wilson should have stopped at 1st Timothy 3 and Titus 1. One of the major benefits of the reformation was to break the barriers between clergy and laity and getting God’s word into the hands of the common people. Nearly every church in America requires their pastor to attend cemetery, oops, I mean seminary. Pastor Wilson is a wonderful teacher and I thank God for his bravery in leading others to follow Christ during these tumultuous times.

Christian Leaders Institute is excellent. Online, free or very affordable. Qualify academics.

How about a commission from God? 1 Corinthians 12:28 And GOD HAS APPOINTED in the church first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healing, helping, administrating, and various kinds of tongues.

@AnHebrewChild

4 жыл бұрын

Rodd Graham "a commission from God." Amen good sir. kzread.info/dash/bejne/X3uIlo-KZ6mzcrA.html This whole video is AWESOME, and to your point, especially 19:00 - 21:55 Cheers

I lost him after he said he goes into meetings drinking beer

@albertbootle6854

6 ай бұрын

I thought I was the only one who heard that 😮😢

Spurgeon didn't go to seminary!

@franklinbumgartener1323

4 жыл бұрын

Very few of us are Spurgeons.

@johnwarren3789

4 жыл бұрын

But he started one

@thereisnopandemic

4 жыл бұрын

The Apostle Paul went to seminary. Saint Paul> Charles Spurgeon

@1689solas

4 жыл бұрын

@@franklinbumgartener1323 Spurgeon was just a man.

@WasLostButNowAmFound

4 жыл бұрын

@@thereisnopandemic Seminary? no no. Paul went to be taught by the teacher of teachers.

Could you share more on what is Grey fire? Who is pastor Doug? Where is he from? Dont know much about Canon KZread but I am new and would like to know more

@Chirhopher

4 жыл бұрын

Check him out then Bro. There is much content, and they are/he is out of Moscow. In the U.S. lol

It’s a mixed bag, but most seminaries today are incubators of atheism. Even the “best” of them. They can literally destroy faith. They are steeped in secular psychology, and REQUIRE such studies to graduate if not an undergraduate emphasis. I grew up in such a culture, so I’ve seen it firsthand.

Genuine question: what is the real world value of original languages, and particularly taking the time to learn them, as opposed to being proficient in the practice and grounded in the foundations of the highly accessible original language tools available today?

@jbambrick1

4 жыл бұрын

For a normal pastor that is - not a a scholar, apologist etc

@Chirhopher

4 жыл бұрын

Sure, great question! So, if you begin to study Koiné Greek, for example, you will see that it is much more than learning the definition/s of a word/words. There is how those words interact with each other, their relationship between them, Exegesis - drawing out the context, nd graping the flow of the text. A computer cannot do this for you. Certainly, We can grasp the flow of the text in our fluent language, but not in the original, and they may well be quite different, as often happens. One example i might give is the Promise: raise a child up in the way he should go and when he is old he will not depart from it. Now, learn it in the Language of the Manuscript and you may come up with a different meaning. Such as, training a child up in his own way, and he will not depart from it! A Promise, still; but, one is a Promised Curse and the other is a Promised Blessing. Those who look at the HOLY Scriptures and want to call ourselves a "servant" of CHRIST, usually see a Promised Blessing. We who look at the HOLY Script seeing the word "doulos", and want to call ourselves a slave of CHRIST, can come back with either (as both could be True with zero contradiction), as you see i have. i hope this helps a little. But, there are many reasons! Even picking up the Holy Text and being able to read it, rather than depending on an Authority outside of It to Translate for Us!!) May GOD Bless n Keep You in The HOLY n BELOEVED KING, YHWH YESHUA.

@Chirhopher

4 жыл бұрын

@@jbambrick1 shouldn't Pastors be scholars of their realm!) Scholar -specialist in a particular branch of study.

@somber_soul

4 жыл бұрын

Because a tool in the hand of an unskilled person is a useless tool.

@jred7

4 жыл бұрын

What is the role of pastor? He is a Shepherd. He needs to take care of the flock. Anything beyond that is bonus. At the same time, I encourage all Christians of all languages and backgrounds to learn the original languages. One way to do it is to introduce it to the liturgy. It helps minimize translation disputes and it promotes the sense of brotherhood among Christians.

Every man who leads in his household must endeavor to vigorously study theology. If u visited every puritan era household, the men of the house likely had a better understanding of the gospel than most seminary trained or otherwise preachers of our day. U dont need to be smart as I am sub part in intelligence but i am confident in my ability to "defend the gospel" .

@Psalm144.1

2 жыл бұрын

Well, true, but the Puritan clergy all had their theology degrees. And they were brilliant.

Pretty sure this question was answered in the Bible already. Do we really want to add to that?

But do these people who want to go into ministry at any level even ask God for permission and the right way to do it. Where is the Holy Spirit in this?

@blacksheep_77

3 жыл бұрын

Well said...for sure.

@IkeCreed

2 жыл бұрын

What? We don’t need permission, he tells all of us to go out and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation.

It’s the local church’s job to raise up and train pastors, not academia...especially considering the route most Christian academia is going.

From what you claim, the majority of pastors and preachers are disqualified. The majority of pastors in this world have not spent one day in a seminary or Bible college. If formal training is so essential, then why is the American church going down in a ball of flames, when one considers the great number of the seminary-trained pastors/preachers in the US?

@CHURCHISAWESUM

2 жыл бұрын

That doesn't logically follow at all. There are dozens of reasons for that that don't relate at all to seminary training, that doesn't mean seminary isn't necessary.

@JH324

Жыл бұрын

Churches are going down hill because people wanna be entertained and that's why there is a downfall of Biblical churches. Most of the Churches that are growing are uneducated seeker sensitive churches.

I think we are way off the mark with the biblical requirements to be a pastor.. nothing in the scriptures command you to go to a for profit school to take expensive courses.. should be an awful lot of discernment and discussion with prospective seminary students

I've had two very bad, prideful pastors. Neither went to seminary.

Seems like decent answers that follow the western/greek methods of education. God can use it and has. But how long do we go before we start following the model that Jesus set forth? How many pastors would be willing to have a small group of men who are gifted by the Spirit with the role of pastoring follow them around every day for three years? If these two men "Did what Jesus Did" then they would pass down what they know. They would teach the youngers how to learn, how to study. They would teach the languages. AND they would be in their lives, and vice versa, and the character issues would get addressed. Discipleship is really the missing element. Pastors don't "need" seminary. They need discipleship after the manner of Jesus' commitment to the 12. Look what they did as a result...they changed the world. But alas, how many men of God would do this for younger pastors? I haven't met very many. In fact, I have only met one.

@philagon

3 жыл бұрын

Is there a group actively modeling this today?

@blacksheep_77

3 жыл бұрын

@@philagon I said above that I have only known one. This is not true so much. I have met others. You can tell them by their communities. If the community lives together in all things you might be close. They will most likely be called a cult or be accused of such things. Jesus was accused of such things as well. He brought a "new and living way". It challenged everyone, including his own disciples. If you find this group pay attention. But keep in mind that the pastor's role is not to gain a following. It is to funnel people to a mature way of walking with Jesus and the Father of Heaven. Pastors should be like John the baptizer. "I must decrease and he must increase". A pastor holding on to church growth models is someone to be wary of. A pastor that has seen many disciples called to the fields and who has many who have left to follow Jesus into their own work in the kingdom is a pastor you want to look for. You want to pay attention to the pastor who is unafraid to confront and to challenge and to send out. You want to pay attention to the pastor who is not above getting on his hands and knees to wash another's feet for that is true shepherding. We must train with full expectation that the person being trained will be called to leave and plow in another field. Pastors are trainers for the killing fields of the kingdom of G-d. They are trainers of those who think with the Spirit of God and the Word. They are trainers of those that will do the works of Jesus and the Father because they have become one with Jesus and the Father in fulfillment of John 17. Become this pastor. Be this pastor. God will bring the few that need to learn from you. Those few will also have a few and soon there will be more people that are serious disciples of Jesus. Any pastor worth their salt wants this more than anything...including a master of divinity degree.

Simple answer; did John, Peter, or Paul have seminary degrees? No, they did not but they most certainly had the word of God.

@JH324

Жыл бұрын

Would you go to a doctor or lawyer without a degree or even a plumber or mechanic? Why wouldnt you want the most qualified teacher for the most important part of your life.

@kennethstandridge1205

Жыл бұрын

I get what you're saying, but I really cringe when people use this as their excuse. The disciples sat under the teaching of the Son of God for 3 years. Let's not act as if they were just untrained. They had God as their professor. Paul is not a good example either, because he was a member of the Pharasees at one point, and very skilled in the word even though he misapplied it before his Demascus road experience. So these men were very trained. Is a "degree" necessary? No, but is training? Exstensive training? Yes. In this video, he is not claiming that someone just jumps up and preaches. He actually said that is not what you should do. However you do t have to go to seminary. The church should be training those who want to be in the ministry.

@jankoekemoer6034

11 ай бұрын

The problem with western pastors is the lack of sound theological training.

I think this answer neglects God's calling and equipping. I don't disagree with the need for academic pursuit as far as it pertains to knowing God's word, but it pastoral ministry extends far beyond the scope of academics. We have reduced ministry to academics and that is not what God gave us.

@celinamilian

4 жыл бұрын

It has led to high mindedness, half of the time I am saying get to the point. The Lord wasted no time at all at correcting you. I don't want to be buttered but to be battered by the Truth

So many of the called are sacrificing their families for purpose of getting a degree. Shame on churches who demand this type of worldly requirement. Retired pastors, pastors and elders, American churches are dying in drives because we aren't raising up men with training and theology within the church! This education should be free to those that can discern the next generation of preachers. As a pastor, God has called you to be a servant. Please serve by discipling the next generation of those who are called. Please. Remember, you will stand before God and answer to the failure of feeding your flock.

I have to say, I do not agree with the premise of the "musts" - "I think a pastor must. . ." No it is not necessary for a pastor to "must have an understanding of the biblical languages". Certainly it can be helpful, but a must is adding to the necessity of a call from God. God does not require ANY education, only the power of the indwelling Holy Spirit. How many pastors in 3rd world countries are well versed in the biblical languages? We have so americanized christianity that we cannot look past our traditions.

@CanonPress

4 жыл бұрын

Paul taking years to study before returning and beginning his ministry was not "Americanized Christianity"

@bryceferguson9762

4 жыл бұрын

@@CanonPress Cannonizing Paul's experience into service for Christ as an example for everyone to follow is exactly what I'm talking about here. How many years of training did the disciples have when Jesus commissioned them to go cast out demons and heal the sick? How much training did Barnabas or Timothy or Titus or Elijah or Jeremiah have before God called them to minister? God calls men to different paths and to assume everyone God calls to minister to his people must have the same formal education is the essence of tradition. Understand, I have a formal education. I have a working knowledge of the biblical languages. But do I think it is a MUST to have a proper exegesis of a text? NO. That power comes from the Holy Spirit. I have met many formally educated men who have an extensive knowledge of the biblical languages who couldn't explain what John 3:16 means. My point is not to knock education. I love learning. But using "must" is authoritative and adds something to a call that God gives. Point of order. Call to serve and minister comes from God. If God has called you to minister his word, you should WANT that kind of education. I am not advocating ignorance or saying an education is not beneficial. To not desire to learn from others is also an unbiblical model. The man that God has called will also be sanctified. A part of that is desire to have a deeper knowledge of God, including but not limited to an understanding of the biblical languages.

@CanonPress

4 жыл бұрын

@@bryceferguson9762 the apostles had a better education when they were called than the majority of americans do when they leave college.

@bryceferguson9762

4 жыл бұрын

@@CanonPress Paul was trained as a Pharisee. Matthew was a Tax Collector (presumably needing some type of education). What kind of formal education did Peter and Andrew have when Christ ordained them to cast out demons, cure diseases and proclaim the kingdom of God in Luke 9? They had been with Christ for only a short time, certainly not enough time for a seminary degree. They were fisherman in their teens (Peter probably in his early 20's). It is ridiculous you are continuing to stub your toe on what I am saying. My only assertion is that the man God calls to proclaim his word from the pulpit 100% of the time by necessity, need not a degree or understand Greek and Hebrew to properly, under the power of the Spirit, proclaim the truth of God. It is utter nonsense that this is a difficult assertion because it is not the degree that gives authority, it is GOD! I don't know how I can be any more clear.

@blacksheep_77

3 жыл бұрын

@@bryceferguson9762 very well articulated comment. I think defining words is so very important and "must" is a good word to discuss. I think of Elisha asking permission of Elijah to go back and sacrifice and say goodby to his family. Elijah maintains a hands off approach, concluding that Elisha already had an ongoing relationship with God or God would not have chosen him. "Do what you want...what I did I do other than throw a carpet on your back?" The implication being that the teacher recognized that the calling was from God, not him. There was no dictation of commands, of "musts". Elijah obeyed God. Elisha obeyed God too. Simple. I very much agree that if the church of the west builds anything it has to be applicable for all believers across the globe. Education systems are not always applicable across cultures. The Spirit is. I believe seminaries exist so edcucated people can talk to the educated unbelievers. Western educatio is of zero importance to a believer in the deserts of northern Mexico. Having the Spirit of Revelation that can make the Bible in Spanish come alive for them is important. I think it is time to leave off demanding common standards that have nothing to do with the simplicity of being called by the Spirit of God to care for people. Did Jesus cast out "the many" because he had a degree? Did he heal the leper because he went to seminary? Did he stand in wisdom before the pharisees and undo their plots because of some educational background? Did he impress Pilate because he knew the intricacies of Greek and Aramaic and Roman culture? No...He did those things because he was first and foremost connected to His Father by the Holy Spirit. There is a story coming out of Iran now...A man has a visitor come to him ( a being made of light, in his words) and this visitor asks him to write down the words he gives him. This happens over the course of time day after day. A western believer meets this man and the man tells him the story and shows him the manuscript he wrote. It's the book of John in it's entirety! No seminary, no advanced degree. Only the humility to obey the work of the Spirit.

So.... To summarize, the answer is "Ordinarily, yes." I agree.

@Chirhopher

4 жыл бұрын

Doug said, NO! But, more importantly, JESUS and the Apostles don't agree with you. Holy Scripture, GOD Speaks on this. That is by no means a qualification.

@CanonPress

4 жыл бұрын

Yes. I think very early on he summarized best with, "No, but I do think you need what a seminary offers."

@franklinbumgartener1323

4 жыл бұрын

@@CanonPress Right. So in other words the answer is "Ordinarily yes." (I'm a CREC minister by the way.)

@franklinbumgartener1323

4 жыл бұрын

@@Chirhopher Jesus and the Apostles are against seminary education? Do tell!

@CanonPress

4 жыл бұрын

@@franklinbumgartener1323 Cheers!

He forgets the Holy Spirit is the ultimate teacher and God so ordained that to be the case because God does not minister through the mind but through the born again spirit.

@honestb1216

2 жыл бұрын

I agree. Paul was not taught by a seminary but the Holy Spirit.

No. But you should know the Word.

@celinamilian

4 жыл бұрын

But the word is written on your heart. You can know the Bible intellectually but live it not in the Spirit.

@jesuschristsaves9067

4 жыл бұрын

Intruder True. I’m in total agreement. Many people have sought intellectual supremacy and have deserted the Spirit.

@celinamilian

4 жыл бұрын

@@jesuschristsaves9067 See how most of these preachers never deal with real problems. But tend to out-explain what Jesus said.

Wish it wasn't so expensive and it really is required in today's world, when the market is flooded with pastors. Not having a seminary degree disqualifies you automatically. You reap what you sow. And I'm talking about the crumbling evangelical pyramid.

I believe if a person is called to pastor seminary is not necessary. Does he need to be an academic. No in my opinion. However, the pastor should 1. Know and understand the bible 2. Have a good foundation and understanding of doctrinal beliefs 3.Have the support and resources through his church and others I could go on and on but I'll stop here. I pursue biblical studies in the academic world for personal reasons. To me the answer is no it is not necessary but I believe it is helpful

@averyparks179

4 жыл бұрын

How will this pastor come to your 1st and 2nd points (which I agree with), if they are not academics and love to learn things of the Lord? I agree with your points, but cannot get along with your original statement. The call to the pastorate is the call to labor in study WITH the Lord, for the sake of his glory and for the feeding of the people of God (sheep).

@jred7

4 жыл бұрын

If someone is called to be a neurosurgeon I sure hope they get the necessary education and training!

@averyparks179

4 жыл бұрын

jred7 we are called to be surgeons of souls. It must be our life’s work.

@jred7

4 жыл бұрын

@@averyparks179 what? I think your confused. I was replying to OP

@averyparks179

4 жыл бұрын

jred7 I was agree with you! Lol sorry I wasn’t clear.

Not necessarily John 14:16 is in charge

Can you teach preachers not to be coveters?

How do you have a curriculum that comes even close to equipping a man to preach the word in a college. With all the knowledge that can be obtained by average church goers today preachers who are really knowledgeable are ineffective. The Holy Spirit uses whom he will. Most clergymen today come from colleges that form systematic theology which is coming from either skepticism or dogmatism. Sadly either way people think their system of theology is just fine. Unwaveringly as they go, stifling the truth many times

The students don't know

All you need is to start a church in your own home and pay tithe to yourself.

I waited, to be married to complete a Bible college degree (30)...ended up marrying in my late 30 (38)..it was a disaster

No as long you can read the bible is all you need

@Xenotypal

2 жыл бұрын

this kind of thinking has caused many problems in Christianity and has contributed to Christianity having the reputation as being backward and ignorant.

Per Scripture Jeremiah said "cursed" be the man who trusts in a man. In the Gospels Christ said let "No man" deceive you. Christ also spoke of the Comforter, helper and that "he will" teach you. God does not dwell in handmade temples folks, hypocrites do... Verse >> Psalms 118:8-9 KJV😮

No. JESUS never required intellectualism to be a pastor.

@CanonPress

4 жыл бұрын

our new series will be Ask TheCynicogue.

@TheCynicogue

4 жыл бұрын

Lol if you wish

@JH324

Жыл бұрын

@@TheCynicogue he did require Commitment

You really can’t teach someone to be a man of God in an academic way. Really only God can bring someone to maturity in Christ. One does not need to read “systematic theology” or any “theology”, but the Bible, and yes there is a difference. There are many theologies out there and some are not so good. If you just focus on reading the word hours a day and praying hours a day, your theology will be correct. 1 John says we have “an anointing from the holy one and need not that any man teach us.” A strong prayer life is necessary to have any power and to see the manifestation of the spirit in your ministry. A minister should “devote himself to the ministry of the word and to prayer”. This is his job as outlined in the book of acts.

@honestb1216

2 жыл бұрын

I agree.

When I have brain surgery, I don’t want the candy striper who has worked at the hospital for years doing the surgery. Give me the educated one.

501c3 is the tax code need

No you dont need a seminary degree, but you should Im of the opinion that alot of American preachers dont have a problem with being educated with wordly degrees, but funny when it comes to seminary its not necessary

Obviously any man called and outfitted for the Pastoral office must be recognized by the church as to whether or not they are truly qualified. Seminary is not a biblical Institution. Anyone can learn Hebrew and Greek on their own. The church ought to prepare men for the Pastoral office for free as part of the ministry. The necessity of a college degree prerequisite to seminary is unbiblical. Wilson has the right idea generally speaking. Freely you receive freely give. If a pastor is to receive double pay then he ought to be active in training men within the church as part of his ministry! If not he is overpaid and not living up to the call! Academic degrees do not make a man of God! Academia is of the world not of God. In itself it is not sin but certainly not ordained specifically by scripture even if God has used it for His own glory which He has. There is no biblical office of Professor. The Apostle Peter wrote the lowest grade of Greek in the NT. If scholarship is so necessary rather than a cursory working knowledge of even Greek To be a competent man of God let's say then Peter missed the mark. Some of the Greek in the book of Revelation is very poor and yet it is still infallible scripture and the word of God. Perhaps John did not actually write his gospel but rather dictated it to another person far more skilled in Greek than he probably was? There is nothing which detracts from John being the inspired author of the gospel attributed to him because he used or was aided by someone more proficient in Greek then himself. Or perhaps the gospel was revised and edited in its finalization by better linguists. How would John or Peter learn to read and write in a language unfamiliar to them? There were no colleges or seminaries available for them obviously. If Apostles can learn Greek without attending a institution of higher learning then anyone can learn Greek or Hebrew without paying a fortune to a professional institution today.

Please don’t listen to these people but rather listen to the Holy Spirit. And if you haven’t heard from the Lord, then you are not called! Don’t waste your money going to school! If you’re not already ministering on a regular basis, you’re likely not called! Is not about preaching in front of people.

Really…..it’s just the same principles as the world…..if you obtain a Degree or Masters in Divinity, plus counselling then Churches will definitely consider you. It’s all about having that fancy certificate framed on the wall. Really…..the Apostle Paul was the only one with a Masters……the rest of the disciples was hit and miss.

Twelve minutes? This question should take all of twelve seconds to answer, or the reading of one bible verse (acts4:13)... "Now when they saw the boldness of Peter and John, and perceived that they were unlearned and ignorant men, they marvelled; and they took knowledge of them, that they had been with Jesus." Concerning Hebrew & Greek... John Bunyan knew neither and yet of "the tinker" Dr. John Owen said, "If I could possess the tinker's abilities to grip men's hearts, I would gladly give in exchange all my learning." I like Doug a ton, but I gotta say.. sometimes these "ask the pastor" type video formats... irk me.

@AnHebrewChild

4 жыл бұрын

I do really appreciate what he says at 3:55-4:40

@AnHebrewChild

3 жыл бұрын

@@Charles.Wright That would be an interesting argument. I'll be on the lookout for it. It's probably good, tho, that _you_ "don't really feel that way", seeing how David tended sheep, Amos farmed figs & wheat, and John the Baptist's seminary was 'remote learning:' miles into the desert. JESUS: "when the Spirit of truth is come, he will guide you into all truth." "The Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things." cheers & blessings :]

@AnHebrewChild

3 жыл бұрын

@@Charles.Wright meant to include this: "THEY had been with Jesus." Jesus says, "I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you." We also are with Jesus.

I can assure you that many will look at a non-degreed candidate as worth less....not worthless, but worth less.

@johnwurfel2862

2 жыл бұрын

Is this not the son of Jessi? Yeah, that's a common theme.

I guess fishermen and tax collectors are unqualified?

@OSleeperTactical

4 жыл бұрын

Three years with the best teacher in history as their personal instructor is an ideal seminary.

@jamessheffield4173

2 жыл бұрын

@@OSleeperTactical I guess we need to find some good carpenters to teach future ministers.

No you dont, all it does is teach you to soften up what God commands, pastors are to cry aloud (shout) spare not, lift up thy voice like a trumpet. You become weak minded going to college. What you need to do is be in a good church that isn't afraid to speak the TRUTH and learn to read the bible on your own, not be a novice, nor a sensitive nancy. be MAN. get married, have multiple children, and prove to be God fearing man of God 1 Timothy 3 King James Version (KJV) 3 This is a true saying, if a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work. 2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach; 3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous; 4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity; 5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?) 6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil. 7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.

John boutist will never got a chance in our times

I know More Holy People that do not have the degree. Jesus did not preach in the church only. No Wonder Church's are struggling to find "GOOD" People.

Your selling hope

Seminary degree? LOL. No. Be called by God. He will prepare you.

Jesus didn't have a degree............just saying!

@JH324

Жыл бұрын

Jesus is the son of God

Actually, I think a seminary degree is probably the least valuable as a pastor. You need a well-rounded education including High Sciences, Humanities, philosophy, and everything in between. Pastors have to go back to being intelligent and not just flippy about Bible verses. The Bible was written for very intelligent people. You have to step up your game.

Shouldn’t a doctor get a medical degree before starting a practice? Therefore it’s ridiculously dangerous for a pastor not to be certified to teach because he could get the message wrong and injure the body of Christ; the church.

This is a man-centered idea that has nothing to do with God’s calling. One does not need a degree in secular theology to be a pastor