You see those warriors from Hammerfell? They have curved swords,CURVED....SWORDS.

@rachdarastrix5251

9 ай бұрын

Hmm, imperial sword, scimitar. Same stats, imperial sword sells for far more... Well, guess that dictates which one I will use.

@The_child-catcher

9 ай бұрын

There it is.

@jonslade17

8 ай бұрын

Hey, someone had to do it

@Chraan

8 ай бұрын

@@rachdarastrix5251 That's easy, you will use a bow because you become a stealth archer.

The most obvious benefit of curved swords is using them while on a horse. Less chances of a sword getting stuck after a cut and consequently being pulled out from your hand while you're driving past the target. They didn't remove piercing potential and a whole second cutting half of the sword for nothing for centuries.

@PJDAltamirus0425

9 ай бұрын

Curved blades have a easier unstocking themselves in a target compared to straight blades. Everything else can be varied. Where you safely strike depends on blade geometry and target on the body. Straight swords can have curved edges, even very curved edges, then there curved hilts which changes things again. It is hard to see in a model or cutting pool noodles sense those targets don't grip things like clothing and meat does.

@roguepoet6645

9 ай бұрын

Exactly!! That's why so many cavalry used curved swords. With good hilts to hold the hand in place better. A Long sword, arming sword, falchion, messer, katana, will just get pulled right out of a riders grip. Glad someone mentioned this

@mansfieldtime

9 ай бұрын

@@PJDAltamirus0425 I'm not convinced that is what happens. Personally I believe the curved blade design redirects the shock momentum to travel up the blade to the tip instead reverberating though the whole blade. Meaning the mechanics transfer energy away from the grip but also reduces damage. Still, I would rather be able to hold my sword then have a numb hand... either way, I have now way of testing any of this, it's just my theory.

@mansfieldtime

9 ай бұрын

@@roguepoet6645 I think it's more mechanical. But I have no way of testing... the result is the same it's just a more scientific explanation. I think.

@Ranstone

9 ай бұрын

I have never seen a medical or physics source to confirm this. I've heard it all my life, but when asked to explain it, people just revert to spouting nonsense about draw cuts and "slashing motions" with not a single equation, or classified mechanical principle. If you want to explain it using one of the 3 classes of levers, I'd be more open to the idea. Not saying it's wrong; just saying there's a disturbing lack of evidence for something so colloquially thrown around.

Heavily curved (e.g. scimitar) from horseback was also essential, as flat sword at speed would run the risk of dismounting you, or making you abandon the sword. I also think the curved blades were used so they did not get stuck as often in softer targets. When heavy armor became the norm, then they saw their decline.

@simonfreeman8233

9 ай бұрын

the usual famous exception to that is when you look at swords used by the likes of the wingged hussars the koncerz and the palasz both straight edged swords used very effectivly on horse even the szabla husarska didn't have that much of a curve to them

@gabesmith8331

9 ай бұрын

I'm sure you've heard of sabers before, they were used throughout medieval times, even into the 19th century.

@aethulwulfvonstopphen8013

9 ай бұрын

@@gabesmith8331not everyone wore armor

@sidecharacter7165

9 ай бұрын

Curved blades also hit at a similar angle each time similar to an axe if curved properly, like a cavalry sabre. Take 2 plates and try to make them hit at a separate angle to see what I mean.

@GuitarsRockForever

9 ай бұрын

It is an advantage, but not essential. There were straight swords used for cutting from horse back. However, certainly curved swords would work better.

I remember some ancient military show (History Channel, I think) with R Lee Ermy where he was comparing a katana and a broadsword. During a cutting test, he swung the katana over the shoulder and down onto some leather armor making a really deep gash and following through. With the European broadsword, he stood sideway and swung the blade from his hip upward into the armor making a dull thud and minor cut. His katana slice did a full arc starting from behind his back, the tip ending by the ground. With the broadsword, it traveled maybe 2 feet start to finish. Crap like that is why people say curved blades are always far superior.

@PJDAltamirus0425

9 ай бұрын

Oh yeah . I remember that. That show was crap on several levels . Ermy knows guns but he sucked with swords

@h0m3st4r

9 ай бұрын

@@PJDAltamirus0425 I agree. And later, he did the same thing on "plate armor" which I can only assume was made of tin foil.

@tomatopotato1136

9 ай бұрын

That’s history channel for you :/

@reliantbelial2341

9 ай бұрын

​@@tomatopotato1136i remember seeing shad reacting to this video

@TheRealAnarchrox

9 ай бұрын

Lee Ermy doesn't know shit.

Who here would like a series reviewing unique weapons? Personally I'd love Shad's thoughts about swords and other weapons like the Egyptian Khopesh.

@admirekashiri9879

9 ай бұрын

I don't think he is interested in covering swords that aren't European or Japanese. Which is fine mind you best to stick to what you know and what you're passionate about.

@oldminerhro1934

9 ай бұрын

I think Shad analyzing the kopesh, getting into the materiel used to make it, and way it was used in combat would be interesting.

@noway6633

8 ай бұрын

​@@admirekashiri9879he's done other things before. And once you know blades you know blades. It's not like it coming from Egypt means you somehow are no longer knowledgeable

@admirekashiri9879

8 ай бұрын

@@noway6633 Really, other non-European or Japanese things like what? And I get what you mean, but certain weapons and blades, if you don't know the culture behind it, can lead to the wrong conclusion, such is the case with many African blades..

@MiguelMedV

8 ай бұрын

@@admirekashiri9879 If you don't know the culture behind a weapon just do research then 🤷🏻‍♂️. No excuses, there's no reason why he shouldn't review other weapons...

Whos here before the skyrim jokes.

@Odinson224

9 ай бұрын

Curved penises, big curved penises. Wait I think I quoted that wrong.

@Tam_Miri

9 ай бұрын

Right!? 😂 that is too hilarious!

@shalltearbloodfallen310

9 ай бұрын

Have you seen those warriors from Hammerfell? They have Curved SWORDS Curved SWORDS!

@myownmusic8182

9 ай бұрын

Technically, nobody who responds to you is here before the Skyrim jokes, since you just made a joke related to Skyrim... Why are you booing me, I'm right?

@Odinson224

9 ай бұрын

​@@myownmusic8182Buzzkiller boo.

Like most people, I used to think the Katana was the coolest thing. Until I seriously attempted to learn to cut properly with one. It's more difficult than mastering a proper golf swing. So now, I have a staff that I just use to whack things with.

@tabull8180

9 ай бұрын

Golf swing on other hand is surprisingly easy on casual or semi-casual level. Looks way harder than it is.

@Modighen

9 ай бұрын

"The Archchancellor polished his staff as he walked along. It was a particularly good one, six feet long and quite magical. Not that he used magic very much. In his experience, anything that couldn't be disposed of with a couple of whacks from six feet of oak was probably immune to magic as well." - Terry Pratchett

@thedyingmeme6

8 ай бұрын

Monks be like

What a cool technical review! Had me thinking about geometry and their effect on engineering principles... It's neat to have your perspective I terms of both; the historical knowledge, and the practical experience across differently blade types... 10/10!

What about swords with curved hilts versus swords with straight hilts? Which sword hilt has the better grip?

@thegreenxeno9430

9 ай бұрын

This guy is asking the real answers

@TheSteam02

9 ай бұрын

@@thegreenxeno9430 the what 💀

@doctorsketch7476

9 ай бұрын

@@TheSteam02 the real answers. You wouldn't get it.

@benkayvfalsifier3817

9 ай бұрын

This comment needs to be pinned 📌

@AlyssMa7rin

9 ай бұрын

Especially a Sword that has no weight in the blade ;) ;)

The Kilij has been my favorite sword for a while. The look, the function, the location it was used. I mean Winged Hassar. That is some stylized uniform.

@h0m3st4r

9 ай бұрын

My fondest memory of the kilij is watching Vaclav Havlik use a forward-weighted custom kilij allegedly based on one used by Vlad the Impaler to utterly butcher a pig carcass.

@ayhanfedai5013

9 ай бұрын

i didnt know hussars use kilic sabers look like kilic maybe yea but kilic ? i know they inspired from Turkish akincis and helmets they use looks Turkish/Turkic but swords too ?

@ham00d53

9 ай бұрын

@@ayhanfedai5013they used Kiliç and modified them into Szabla which has a different hilt and guard

@mansfieldtime

9 ай бұрын

@@ayhanfedai5013 I didn't mean the hussars used kiliji... though they used a variant, the history of the area is fasinating.

@mansfieldtime

9 ай бұрын

@@h0m3st4r I remember that as well. I liked the design well before the TV show but didn't know the name till watching Deadliest Warrior. I first saw the kilij in a history book about Vlad's cavalry. Then learned about the Hussars.

New subscriber and loving it! Been a fan of forged and fire for years now. One thing they always pointed out with a heavier bellied curved sword is the weight behind the belly pushing more penetration through the object.

Welcome back to your homeland, I'm glad you had a safe journey. I need to up my game with swords. Maybe an Albion?

@hha8356

4 ай бұрын

😮

As big of a fan I am of Katanas I'll always favor the Longsword

@raicattivo

9 ай бұрын

My my sir you’ve really picked the hottest take to have here 😂

@TihetrisWeathersby

9 ай бұрын

@raicattivo comes from playing too much Kingdom come deliverance

@raicattivo

9 ай бұрын

@@griffinmckenzie7203 it’s a little thing called Sarcasm

@raicattivo

9 ай бұрын

@@griffinmckenzie7203 what sorta mf says “my my sir” in regular speech?

@Enaccul

9 ай бұрын

​@griffinmckenzie7203 He also had the laughing emoji at the end of the sentence so I assumed it was a joke or sarcasm, effectively the same as putting the /s but for people who aren't on reddit that much or use the /s symbol.

Would love to see Shad try out Zoros three sword style from One piece

@fullstackweebdev4855

9 ай бұрын

That would be awesome. Would love to see him try anime-style swords like Zangetsu and Yoru too

@kaiper9982

9 ай бұрын

Killer B 7 sword technique from Naruto?

@devincaswell4116

9 ай бұрын

Look up go ask shogo, Zoros.

Initial bite you get from curved sword is very significant against soft material. You can see this when cutting things like Tomatoes, clay, jelly and such. once you get slightest cut in soft object the rest of the cut is very easy. If you don't get that initial opening you are more likely to squish soft material instead of cutting it. It is a lot like why it is easier to stab something with a sharp point of sword then it is to cut with it. You just got to get the very small tip in and rest of sword will just follow through.

@DH-xw6jp

9 ай бұрын

"Hand me my saber Martha, it's time to cut the Jello."

Great video Shad, learned a lot! 🙂

Cool. Looking forward to watching this through

Loved the blade ratio part, it was literally my first question! Well Done!

Best channel for us Medieval geeks

This is Thrand! Excellent video I might do a reply to this one but for the most part this is 100 percent accurate but I may be able to add to it a bit from my experiences.

Great video as usual shad!

You see those warriors from Hammerfell?

Excellent assessment. Definitely have experienced much of what you're discussing in my own test cutting.

People can debate all day what a curved or straight blade does… but as Shad actually shows once again: the proof will always be in the pudding of picking them both up and actually striking. A certain Loporite approves of my analogy.

@Ranstone

9 ай бұрын

Which is what ancient man did. Ancient man did not talk about angle of attack and center of drag vs center of mass. I think to fully understand this, we need to get back to the human senses, or jump straight into pure mathematics. I'm very tired of rank superstition being quoted, like how "Curved swords are better on horseback because a straight sword will deliver more shock to the wielder." Especially when many heavy Napoleonic cavalry swords were straight.

@MichaelJohnson-mt6ey

9 ай бұрын

@@Ranstone Agreed. Roman cavalry used straight swords as well, to great effect.

@anderporascu5026

9 ай бұрын

Butthurt fan kids will argue curved blades are superior till their finally adults. Oh the eternal debacles of these fandom communities who will battle out their point every which way till someone relents and somehow miraculously proves they are right.

@bobwilliam2634

9 ай бұрын

​@@MichaelJohnson-mt6ey But don't you think it's odd that during late antiquity Romans, Sassanids, Arabs,.etc all throughout the Middle East, North Africa & Eastern europe, all used straight swords on horseback. But in the following centuries, under turkic and mongolic influence, the curved saber began to be favored heavily on horseback. Even the late eastern roman horseman favored the curved saber. This is an honest question, I have no clue on the actual benefits of one or the other, I don't test swords and I certainly don't ride horses, I just think it's an interesting inquiry. There most be some reason, other then culture quirk, that so many diverse people began to adopt the curved sword. (?)

@Catman_CM

9 ай бұрын

But, the proof is not in the pudding. The proof of the pudding is in the eating! In this case, the term proof is using the less common definition of "to test", e.g. "The Proving Grounds". Which, in my opionion, our mutual chinchilla friend would be far more interested in "proving" his puddings :3

I really like this video, I'm actually glad you covered this topic. One thing you should take a look at is curve swords in cavalry

In my experience cutting water bottles and pool noodles I've found the best one hander is a viking sword. Need a good oval grip for edge alignment and keep it very sharp, but yeah they work great.

Thanks Shad! Can't believe I get all this for watching a couple adverts!

Thanks for a great informative and technical review.

I like to picture myself sitting in an inner bailey for a demonstration or next to an experimental blacksmith’s shop in the shade of the castle walls when learning from Shad and the team or Tod Cutler! Great info as always!

Thanks as always Shad!

This is interesting, because what I always understood to be the benefit of a curved sword is actually the point pressure argument. I always thought people where talking about point pressure when they were talking about curved swords being better at "cutting" but I see the difference now that you point it out.

Thank you so much for the demonstration of how you will actually grip a sword and where you cut with it.

The cutting edge is force manipulation, so a fully bent blade like a shamshir, only has a tiny piece of the blade in contact with the target at any time, therefore the entire force of the cut, is focused in on that small contact point, the same way a toughened glass breaker works, or a thrust with a pointed blade. it is a small surface area. The straight sword has the same force multiplier but over a wider area if the target is not circular. There's a minor bonus to having a curved blade, but with enough knowledge of a straight blade you can counteract it. Plus a straight blade is usually longer, so you'd gain that extra bit of reach too.

I have that story up I mentioned where the idea of tachi being primarily for slashing is relevant. It's about a nobleman slaying three bandits singlehandedly in a sword fight around the year 800 A.D or so in Japan. Enjoy. Also, Shad, keep up the good work and I consider myself blessed to belong to the same church despite being on the other side of the world.

@briancall5819

9 ай бұрын

I hope there are more stories like the newest one coming. Everyone here is a fan of swords after all.

I think there is a lot of nuance missed by using generalized "cut". Cut can be a chop, a slash or a pierce. Curved blades are better at slashing. Straight blades are better at chopping, The angle of the tip of the blade determines how good the weapon is at piercing. Longsword/Broadsword is better at chopping and piercing than Katana. It doesn't mean that Katana cannot pierce OR chop. It can but it is a better slashing weapon than "straight" swords as there is a functional trade-off.

@shinjiikari1021

9 ай бұрын

I thought that more tip heavy katana would chop better, as you chop with axe

@arnijulian6241

9 ай бұрын

Forward/reverse curved blades like a cleaver, Kukri or kopis =hacking chopper lad. The more iconic backward/orthodox curved blade=mounted cavalry side arm. I could go to great length about this massive topic but all single edged blade with a curve slight or extreme are just sabres for Dao means sabre & the Japnese Katana evolved from the Chinese Dao. Cruciform European blades are=universal. Triangular Blades Longsword like blade are not specialised in anything particularly but can do everything with a greater internal structure hence why they can be used like crowbar/fulcrum/lever in combat. In time mind late middles age blades & renaissance blades specialised into the thrust hence Dress sword & rapier=Thrust. Complex thrust hilted sword 1 handed can be as long as 51 inches with full length of arm that about 70 inches. Reach is everything in combat & trust me a (swept hilt side sword) of western Europe in 1400's will wide the floor with any melee weapon outside of Europe. What cam later in Europe is sword wise even more advanced incomparable to the world! Mind the age of pike & shot made the sword a rarely used weapon let alone by the 1600's when the pike & musket was fused into one by the bayonet. By the 1800's only sailors, pioneers-sappers & officers used sword for the most part. Only way I could see swords possibly returning is in boarding warfare in spacecraft for firing guns in a paper thin craft is a quick way to get yourself & everyone killed.

@zekeolopwi6642

9 ай бұрын

He's talking about slashing mostly, and his first point is that with a stronger curve, yes curved blades have a better slash. HOWEVER, the katana and two handed falchion do not have a strong enough curve to merit that advantage. I'm shocked people think that about the katana specifically when we know the curve is just a side effect of the hardening method.

@zekeolopwi6642

9 ай бұрын

​@@shinjiikari1021Katanas aren't TIP heavy though so much as just BLADE heavy, so it wouldn't benefit so much from the heft as say a leaf bladed sword, a kopis, etc. which actually have more mass specifically at the tip.

@arnijulian6241

9 ай бұрын

​@@zekeolopwi6642 Agreed! Katana on occasion are arguably slightly more tip heavy then the average blade but what most Japophiles don't realise real is Katana have blade taper even if not as much as other blades it handles nothing like their flat 'wall props'. Uchigatana being the specific name for a Japanese katana as in Japanese Katana means any single edges blade/sabre. Some Uchikatana have top blade presence while others have have the opposite as it depends on the blacksmiths incentive & swordsmen's personal request. I like a Blade with real hacking presence that Uchikatana would not deliver what I desire. On a seperate note a real falchion is nothing like a katana though a German Langmesser is somewhat. A real falchion if made correctly is more akin to giant cut throat razor as the tip is only about1/32nd of inch which is less then millimetre. & the blade edge is a fairly similar thickness with only the spine being thick 1/8'' to a max a 1/4'' just above the hale on the spine. A katana has a some armour penetration but a (falchion) without a thrusting tip have minimal penetration if non though great against fabric armour & flesh. If a decent sharp tip it would work well against gap in Armour especially the visor. You have to be a bit of sick pup to use a real falchion!

Plus, the angle you described on curved blades seem to reduce binds and the shape itself eases in retreating the blade by slicing, still pulling "down", while the straight sword is much more about pulling back. At least that's how I imagine it never having touched an actual sword😢

@Gainn

9 ай бұрын

It's also easier to off-balance someone who has a straight blade if they try to bind you.

Just like in women, curves matter!

Shad continues to show the truth about the different types of swords out there.

Another Ingenious one... About angle of attack, Matt (scholagladiatoria) mentioned chronicler seeing janissaries training by swinging theirs shamshir swords in front of the wall while they knee is rested against that wall...

I think that the best curbed sword is the rhomphaia. The way it cuts through whole boars like they were made of butter(in forged in fire)is AMAZING. But it curbs FORWARD.

This is a super misunderstood topic on the internet and I’m glad you finally cleared it up for me.

For Halloween you guys could discuss what sword work be the most effective on zombies

Even before seeing this full video, my armchair gut instinct had been that swords with shallow curves would be more effective during a draw cut vs. a hack. However, the insight regarding the subconscious change in the swordsman's stance to encourage draw cuts more often hadn't occurred to me and I love having the chance to learn about that! Also, the science about the flattening of the surface as the blade makes initial contact leading to a slightly more efficient cut with a slightly curved blade may add up over the course of a day of battle, be it adventure or war.

Ahh, glad the short actually had the link. I hate it when videos say there's a link in the description, or elsewhere, and then it's not...

Only partway through but I'd argue its not 'the length of time of surface contact' that is of import to a curved sword. I'd argue its the 'larger angle of effective use' on a curved sword than a straight sword. As in you could have the same quality of a cut, assuming all other factors identical, when angling the sword, while staying inline, up/down relative to the point of contact through a cut. Random numbers in use for an example but if a straight sword cuts with the same quality with a cutting angle range of 10 degrees before the cut quality decreases but a curved sword might have a cutting angle range of 20 degrees for the same effect. *edit* I realized a term for it. A curved sword allows for maximizing the ability to follow the tangent of the blade properly on a cut.

Havve you seen those warriors from Hammerfell, they have curved swords. Curved! Swords! Hold Guard

Seen those warriors from Hammerfell? They've got curved swords. CURVED. SWORDS.

This is my first time seeing a Shad vid. I've only seen him on FNT. With the background behind him and the table in front and what he's wearing I feel like there is a big group of kids sitting cross legged in front. I get Punch and Judy vibes. I found that humorous.

Great Video

You see those warriors from Hammerfell? They have curved swords. Curved. Swords.

Hey Shad! Huge fan. Could you potentially comment or make a video on the Barong Machete, specifically in regards to the claim that it could cut through the barrel of a rifle? As someone with a basic understanding of metallurgy and physics, this sounds impossible. However, multiple sources (found via google) claim that this weapon was able to destroy a firearm, regardless of the fact that shearing the barrel in half wouldn't render any gun inoperable. Thanks for your work in dispelling weapon myths!

If I don’t see the Skyrim meme I riot

i had my video on x1.25 speed for a full minute and thought shad was just really wound up

My heart says yes, curved swords are better but reality says: depends on what material your trying to cut or thrust if your so inclined to do so and the user.

@Grasshopper567

8 ай бұрын

My heart says yes curved swords are better. But my body says ouch a cut

@smievil

6 ай бұрын

think curved swords are prettier which to me, would be the most important feature

While I do personally favor a straighter blade, I'm not one to dismiss the pros and cons of either option. I feel a straighter blade with two edges is more of a versatile weapon overall compared to a single edged and curved blade but hey. Everyone's got their preferences.

There's more to it. 1) cutting: flesh and bone can be chopped through rather easily, but even a T-shirt can stop a dull blade. I'd say that slicing is mostly relevant because of the clothes we wear. 2) getting stuck or damaging the blade: chopping is more likely to cause unnecessary stress on the blade and when you hit a hard, flat surface, a slicing hit will cause less damage to it. 3) combat dynamics: having an offset tip makes thrusting a very different skill and disengaging from a bind or how you parry incoming attacks becomes quite different with curved blades.

Concerning auto-alignment. With a highly curved sword, the center of balance is actually behind the spine of the blade, meaning that when the sword is accelerated during the swing, the edge will want to go forward. It's sort of like when you attach a stick to a rocket to stabilize it. The center of balance is now below the rocket nozzle which will make the center of balance want to drag behind the rocket, while the nose of the rocket goes forward.

@WJS774

9 ай бұрын

It's not quite that simple because the centre of mass is so strongly dominated by the heavy elements in the guard and hilt. The inertial resistance during the swing, that's going to be much smaller than the effect from the reaction force when you hit the target. That is going to be further away from the imaginary line the sword would follow if it were straight than the inertial force from the centre of balance. And with a longer lever arm, the torque is correspondingly stronger too.

@barryf7253

9 ай бұрын

@@WJS774 I think it has more to do with "feeling" where that center of balance is rather than it just aligning by itself.

@kylebooth2528

9 ай бұрын

The center of gravity being below the center of thrust on a rocket doesn't actually matter as long as it's inline with it. It's very common to misunderstand this to the point where it has a name, the pendulum rocket fallacy. The stick lowers the center of pressure the same way fins do. I agree about the sword thing though. Having the pressure on the blade near or behind the center line of the handle will definitely help line up the blade. I think Shad's example of holding the blade and handle and expecting it to rotate is oversimplified. There should be a torque on the handle, and when it's just resting the weight of the tip will keep it from aligning. Plus it might not auto-align if the curve isn't pronounced enough, but it will be easier to hold alignment as it meets resistance.

@barryf7253

9 ай бұрын

@@kylebooth2528 Fins work to stabilize a rocket only when it's moving through air. But putting the center of mass behind the exhaust nozzle stabilizes its direction of motion. Leaving it ahead of the exhaust nozzle will make the rocket want to spin. It's like trying to balance a pencil upright on your finger rather than dangling it from its tip.

@WJS774

9 ай бұрын

@@kylebooth2528 That's a passable analogy here too, if you equate the resistance from what you are cutting to the drag force, and assume that the pivot will be about the axis of the hilt. Then the stability depends on if the centre of drag is behind or ahead of the pivot point.

Correct me if I’m wrong but I thought the slight curve on a katana was the result of the blade being quenched after deferential hardening. I thought it wasn’t necessarily planned, just the way the blade cools at different rates due to the clay on part of the blade.

@Candlemancer

9 ай бұрын

Yes, the curve just happened naturally in the transition from double edged (jian-like) to single edged Japanese swords. And they probably kept it because it looks better and didn't impact the effectiveness

@StevieB8363

9 ай бұрын

@@Candlemancer IIRC, you are correct: it was just a natural result of the process, not intentional. And a while back someone (can't remember who,) raised that point, and said that the curve of a Katana wasn't enough to have any real impact on its cutting ability.

@dariovirga7711

9 ай бұрын

Yes and no. The differential hardening does create a curve, however the swordsmith could still adjust the curvature, even post quenching (Sorinaoshi).

i mentioned this before on another video, but i always thought that curved swords are faster to draw as oppose to a straight blade of similar lenght. another thing i woul like to see you guys test, are curved sword wth faux back edges and their ability to go around shields vs straight edge swords of same lengh

@ExtraBrightMind

9 ай бұрын

I'm quite surprised that it didn't get mentioned. The curved blade design is so obviously more ergonomic for drawing the sword that anyone who played with toy swords as a kid shouldn't have much difficulty remembering that.

I wanna see you guys react to some of the great movie swordfights. Inigo vs Wesley has to be one for sure, but the others would be left to you!

When mounted, the curve lets you present the point directly to a footman, so you can more reliably thrust if you're stationary. At speed, less likely to get hung up. And, easier to draw. That two handed falchon is still sexy as hell.

Bro you gotta do another video on For Honor, I think it would be super entertaining. The game has been out and changed A LOT since you last took a look at it and has a super broad range of historical martial arts in it's roster now. There's both good and bad in terms of historical realism, but the knight faction alongside the relatively new chinese faction in particular are incredibly good. Love the vids, keep it up man

I'm still looking for one of these sword youtubers to consider the possibility that curves swords actually "auto-align" due to the resistance of the blade when it strikes a target, rather than during the swing beforehand. It would make a hell of a lot more sense than the disingenuous theory that people are debunking, lol.

@dallenhumpherys7911

9 ай бұрын

Skallagrim has said that he doesn’t think that the auto-alignment thing exists, Schola seems to believe in in, and Shad may have also talked about it in previous videos. People do talk about it, but there seems to be some disagreement on the matter.

@meepdhctdjsh

9 ай бұрын

Yea, but the issue is that when you're holding a sword with enough grip so it doesn't slide out of your hand when you swing, it'll stop that from happening. No amount of "automatic edge alignment" said swords give you can compensate for a lack of skill.

@huldu

9 ай бұрын

I think when it comes to sword design in general people were using what they had always been using. I doubt the first thing they thought of was how good something was, they had a selection of weapons and they picked what they liked to use or that they were good at. It's not like they had internet or had much information at hand to begin with. It boils down to what was available in the region you lived in. At most you might have run into a trader that told tales of fancy sword types that he came across.

@timlowesmusic

9 ай бұрын

By the laws of physics, yes, it does happen. But edge alignment is one of the first things you learn when training to fight with bladed weapons, it doesn't make a difference for anyone who has had any training with a sword.

@mansfieldtime

9 ай бұрын

If you think about it, ALL sword will "auto-align" when cutting. It's the path of least resistance. I don't know if a curve to the blade will help more but while in the target, a curved blade is in contact in strange ways.

I too love curves...great video shad!

Hehe my grandma was like "Is he catholic" I said no. Its funny

Other factors affecting cutting ability: Friction. A more highly polished blade will provide less friction on a cut as will a sword that's oiled vs a completely dry one on certain materials. Friction is also reduced if the blade has a narrower profile. Mass: A heavier blade will generally cut better against a heavier target if swung at the same speed, edge type etc, as it delivers more force.

Great video.

I was just watching a Melanie video. She said you were canceled by Matt, who bowed to the wokies. I don't know what's going on but I came here to subscribe. I've been watching Matt for years and I'm not surprised that someone from academia would fold.

This is a very useful topic.

Good job on the Lotus Eaters.

4:20 Pitnt? Never heard that before, but I wanna use it now KEKW

i love that there's still a dent in the castle from when he went beyblade mode in that greatsword video lol.

Interesting to see such shallow cuts with the Katana. At the dojo I train at, we try and "lead with the tip" of your sword to maximise distance and minimise your opponents chance to react to the attack.

I’m fairly certain that the largest benefit of a slightly curved sword, is that one edge is cheaper than two.

As a white scars enthusiast. Im very interested in this vid. I heard they have curved swords, curved swords.

Never thought about that

I'm actually gonna be putting a video up next week about an ancient Japanese story that addresses the idea of curved swords (in this case a tachi) and how using them for thrusting was actually considered somewhat unusual. I'm assuming that once katanas came around which were far less curved, then thrusting became more common, but during the late Heian/early Kamakura period, thrusting was largely reserved for spears. Should be an interesting discussion.

I may be wrong but I thought that the katana isn’t initially made curved, it starts off straight and curves during the differential hardening process. So perhaps the katana isn’t curved because curved swords are better, but because making a straight differentially hardened blade is almost impossible.

@thekaxmax

9 ай бұрын

nope, made curved. Note that there are katanas where the edge is on the inside of the curve, and there are double-edged katanas. And the amount and location of the curve depends on usage and local styles, not individual to each sword or all consistent.

@TheSteam02

9 ай бұрын

You can absolutely make a straight-bladed diff-hardened sword. Just forge the blade in a recurve form initially and then just go with the process. Do it right and the sword will bend "back to straight."

@WJS774

9 ай бұрын

@@thekaxmax I've _seen_ katanas being made, they are straight until the quenching process.

@thekaxmax

9 ай бұрын

@@WJS774 Found the reference for that. It's not from the forging process but from the quenching and the difference between edge and back. Adds strength to the blade, that prestressing. Curved blades normally come from the forging. But most blades aren't differentially tempered. So yeah. But reverse-curved and double-edged katanas do exist. Gives me the impression they are showing off, not for real use.

The contact surface area would have its greatest affect against something with an outer surface that is harder than its middle. such would be apparent with something like a man covered in armor where the armor is a hard outer shell with a soft fleshy middle.

you should try the parabolic quarter radius curved shamshir and tegha ! the best cutters you d ever see !

Also congrats of the imperious larp sword, it is awsome!

As an aside, interestingly enough as Tachi and Katana developed and evolved throughout history so did the degree of curvature and where that curvature began and ended on the blade. Ofc some of those design elements came down to the individual smithery who forged the blade and less so designs popular at the time, but it is interesting to know that when katana were actually used in times of constant warfare it would be more typical to see them with a higher degree of curvature and that curvature would begin closer to the tsuka. Then when times were more peaceful the degree of curvature as well as where that curvature began is more reminiscent of what we see in modern katana.

@StevieB8363

9 ай бұрын

I have no expertise in this area, but if what you are saying is correct, that does raise a couple of questions. Firstly, in times of relative peace, the sword fighting techniques would have probably graduated toward "fencing" rather than "killing." Scoring a hit would have become the key focus - and a straighter sword probably has a greater chance of doing that. But if you look at the combative side, things change. It's not about who can score a hit first - it's about who can do the most damage. And IIRC, the Samurai had lacquered bamboo armour - which probably means that a slashing attack had more chance of breaking through than a chopping attack with a straight blade. Just my 2c, I would be happy to hear your opinion. But the arms vs armor thing has been going on for centuries, and I'm sure that the men who actually used these things in combat would have rapidly found out what worked - and they wouldn't pay good money for a weapon that didn't do the job.

@karukurokami

9 ай бұрын

​@@StevieB8363The curvature of Japanese swords tended to be affected more by "trends" and the individual smith than combat. There's quite a diversity of curvature in every era of Japanese swordmaking - ranging from nearly straight blades to extremely deeply curved, almost like a section of a circle's outline. It is worth noting that the earlier Tachi tended to generally be more curved than a typical katana, though, but they were also longer swords. The profile of the curve also varied but again, this was largely due to the individual styles of smiths and swordmaking schools. A correction on the armour - while indeed lacquered, most Japanese armour was in fact iron or even steel. There are many myths about both the scarcity and quality of iron in Japan, but there was certainly no shortage of it for weaponry. Understandably, then, swords are not very effective against full samurai armour, and much like in Europe one would have to try going for weakpoints and unarmoured areas, or otherwise use a weapon that can pierce through gaps or through the armour. Swords in Japan were more of a status symbol right from their first appearance in the yayoi era, and were carried as a sidearm, rarely ever being used as the primary weapon of a samurai (you would most likely see either the Yumi or Yari as the main weapon, depending on which era you look at) If you want to read a book that goes into great detail on Japanese swords I would recommend "The Art of the Japanese Sword" by Yoshindo Yoshihara, an accomplished Japanese swordsmith. It is truly fascinating stuff

@StevieB8363

9 ай бұрын

@@karukurokami Thanks for the info. My comment was based on Shad saying that swords tended to be more curved during times of more war, and less curved in times of relative peace. So my perception was that the further removed from actual combat you are, the more likely you are to develop styles/systems that don't reflect reality. But from what you have said, it seems that wasn't the main influence. And call me ignorant, but until now I had never heard that the samurai used steel armour - every source I have read/watched said it was lacquered bamboo/wood. I assumed that this was due to the fact that Japanese smiths used charcoal instead of fossil coal and thus couldn't achieve the high purity necessary for hardened steel. I read that was the reason they folded their sword blades - to even out the impurities. Perhaps I'm wrong about that too? I'm happy to be educated here, so I hope you will reply.

@karukurokami

9 ай бұрын

@@StevieB8363 As an aside before I reply: in general, I would take Shad's statements (and really most medieval weapons youtubers') with a pinch of salt - they are enthusiasts, not experts, and often quite opinionated. That's not to say you need to be an expert to comment on a matter - I am not a qualified historian either - but your area of expertise and ethics towards the accuracy of information are very important if you are educating people. In my case that expertise lies in blacksmithing and historical technology, so I try my best to educate others on that where someone with less knowledge on the topic might have misconceptions. To answer your questions: The shape of weapons can be influenced by many factors, and not all of them are hard-rooted in "logical" considerations. In Japan culture played a major part in the evolution of swords, almost overshadowing pure combat considerations, whereas in Europe it was somewhat the opposite (hence the sheer amount of different designs and weapons overall being less treasured as items) Regarding the armour, firstly, I wouldn't at all call you ignorant, there is an immense amount of misinformation in the mainstream media about medieval weaponry in general, and particularly about Japan. To answer this misconception as well as why steel was folded, I'll quickly explain how steel was actually made back then. Every culture aside from the chinese primarily used the same method with minor variations in specifics, namely the bloomery method. By using a large charcoal smelter (in Japan known as a tatara), a large amount of charcoal would be burned at high temperatures, and occasionally ore (which was usually iron sand in japan) would be thrown on top, followed by more charcoal. This results in a reduction reaction that turns the iron oxides in the ore into usable iron by removing the oxygen from it. This molten and semi-molten iron, along with impurities like silica and other metals in the form of slag, end up at the bottom of the furnace as a spongy mass. This mass is known as bloom. To create steel, suitable pieces of the bloom are broken off, and forged flat. This bloom has very variable carbon content and many slag inclusions, so this is where the refining step comes in. Pieces of bloom are stacked, heated until they are hot enough to weld together, and then hammered so they get welded. Then it gets folded back onto itself, and the welding step is repeated. This can be repeated up to 20 or so times, and each time you weld, slag (and with it impurities) is squeezed out. The Japanese variation of this technique is the most famous, but this is how all steel was made worldwide until blast furnices were invented. The chinese invented blast furnaces in the Han dynasty so they had other techniques, but generally speaking, there is not much fundamental difference between steel made in Europe and steel made in japan, for example. It was largely similar in quality. I hope this answers your questions, I'd be happy to elaborate further if you have additional questions

@StevieB8363

9 ай бұрын

@@karukurokami Thanks for the history lesson! So basically it sounds like everyone had crappy steel until the blast furnace, and had basically the same way of dealing with it. The one big question remaining is: "Why have I never seen a picture of a samurai in steel armour? Or even seen any mention of such?"

Hey Shad! Only just Subbed and I came here to comment whilst watching your video on "mall ninja weapons"...I haven't watched this particular video yet but my standpoint on weapons is thus - they get you killed. In three ways; either you brought a decent weapon to a fight with shitty training, or they brought a shitty weapon to a fight and know how to use it, or no-one really knows how to fight and somehow a person ends up sparked out before three days in bed then the morgue. The scariest weapon, I think, is the broken bottle. I ripped my leg apart on broken glass and the damage it can do is genuinely horrifying. Real fast, real deep and real hard to stitch back together. Anyway, I'm off back to Mall Ninjas,

As much as I like sabres, I'd probably choose a longsword or arming sword if I actually had to fight.

As enjoyable as this is I have a strange sensation of deja vu! I must be living it the Matrix. 😉 Now, I am fully aware I might have seen something similar before on another channel, or Shad could have covered some of the topics or similar topics BEFORE. Which is more probable than me living in dearly fear of Agent Smith huh? 😛

Look at that, Shad flying from England to Australia just to shoot a vid and then back to England to look at castles. Dedication.

@j.v.7451

9 ай бұрын

Plus, he willed his hair to grow back out!

You see those warriors from Hammerfell? They’ve got curved swords. Curved. Swords.

Another point i've only seen one person bring up regarding benefits of back curves is that when slicing a target, more of the blade passes over the same area which results in it cutting deeper into the target, i can link a demonstration if anyone is interested in seeing proof of that

the one biggest advantage of outside curved blades is that they have lesser chances of getting stuck. If you have tried hacking branches of trees, you'll find that curve blades will push away the branch if it fails to cut through. I am guessing this goes true as well for human flesh and bones.

Could there be a psychological aspect to this, you see a curve and you try an emulate that curve with your cut which unwittingly causes a better form (if you are capable)? Also you look at the cut you have done and you allow yourself to see a better cut. Edit - Shad semi went there at the 10 minute mark. I should really finish a video before commenting.

Straight swords are a must for human to human combat. If your sword is curved significantly (scimitar) it limits your fighting style and options immediately.

Those warriors from Hammerfell seem to favor them.

Have you guys done anything about using scythes as weapons, if not I would definitely love to see it because I've never understood them being used as weapons.

seems like the next test is all gonna be about chop motions with a rounded/curved axe vs straight axe -- onto flat mildly hard stratum. the move is hacking, but as it meets the material and begins to shift it or spread it -- more microcut instances occur.

How about circular swords?, infinite cutting length!

I think at some point a bigger curve would convert a cut to a chop.

Has anyone ever considered that it may just have been aesthetic? The Katana and Kriegsmesser just look dope.

I have some considerations about this topic: - At even reach of the weapon, a curved blade has longer slashing surface than a straight blade. - The curved blade, due to its form, hits with less cutting surface on the average cases, this means that applies more pressure on the cut and so has better chopping capacity. (This is the reason why guillotines had a 45° angle from the point of impact instead of being directly parallel, because that causes the blade to have more slashing surface and impacting with less surface at time during the cut, so better chopping). - Curved blades having the features described before makes them better at cutting compared to straight blades and even better if used mounted on a horse, because thanks to the momentum and strength of the mount you won't need to use a lot of strength to strike but you could just evaluate the thin of the blade to slice through your target with a longer and more effective blade. So, in conclusion, why West Europe used straight swords and the East of the world instead preferred (on the majority of cases) curved bladed swords? The reason I think is on the quality of the armors, when you fight against heavy armors the cutting capacity is the first being countered, so you want to have other options when you find yourself in that situation, one great option is the thrust, because the armor is useless if you can find a gap where you can thrust through; the other option is the bludgeoning damage, that usually damages what is behind the armor and can crush it with enough strength so is really good for that... Now, if you are an European knight you want to be able to cut unarmored or light armored guys and at the same time to thrust through other heavy armored knights like you, so you will probably end on a straight sword as your backup weapon (lances and spears where the main weapons all over the world for melee combat). Instead if you were a noble samurai mounted on a horse (or a riding Nomad), with less protective armors and a ton of unarmored peasants, than, you would probably preferred a curved blade with heavy slashing potential as your backup weapon.

Thank you for this video, Shad, I greatly enjoyed watching. I am not really convinced in regard to the angle of attack with a straight sword. As the density of air is way lower than the density of the target, the hands (and thus the handle) will travel on, drawing the blade through the target anyway. There seems to be no need for a steeper angle at the beginning. If it is a dense target (e.g. multiple tatami) , the angle will become more shallow accoring to your nomenclature, if the person follows through with structure and energy. If the target is not very dense (e.g. pool noodle), the angle does not become shallow in the same degree, but the cut will succeed anyway because it is just easier to cut. Draw cuts thus automatically occur. Cutting with these premises, the cut can be done with extended sword instead of artificially withdrawn one, which is usually preferable in a tactical fighting context but also to enhance the velocity of the cutting section of the blade. Is there something I am missing here?

The reduced surface area of a sword when it makes contact is a huge part of its effectiveness. Think of all the things that add up to reduce surface area: Thickness of blade, the sharpness of the edge, the kind of grind, the dispel taper, the bevel, the type of tip. Since surface area highly effects penetration as a basic rule, you can see that adding the reduction in surface area with a curved blade, when combined with the others I mentioned, compound with each other and is indeed a benefit for slashing. However, I think when armor that reduced the effectiveness of slashes came about we saw the transition to thrusting based forms of weapons become dominate. Still the same principles of reducing surface area, but this time to a point instead of an edge as the main focus. And a straight applied force is easier to keep in line to transfer the energy behind the point than a curved one, which is more likely to roll out of line.