my reaction to the animation in this show was to say "wow they really did an incredible job with the lighting, what tech did they use?" then I looked it up and the tech they used was this highly technical and advanced technique called painting it all by hand. There straight up was no digital lighting.

@silver9wolf6

11 ай бұрын

Haha, the compositing in this show is insane! Have you watched the behind the scenes documentary?

@alexandresobreiramartins9461

10 ай бұрын

All CGI is overestimated. This show was incredible. Also, talk about an outlier! Strong female characters, diverse cast, gay relationships, and nothing on the nose, no preaching to the audience, just good storytelling! Who would have thought?!?

@billyrussell7789

4 ай бұрын

@@alexandresobreiramartins9461i think its a great rebuke of the whole “go woke get broke”. No one likes preachiness in any media about any topic, political or otherwise. But there’s nothing inherent to minority characters preventing you from telling truely incredible, compelling stories when you go through the effort of… writing them

"He's not mad about it. It's a great dad moment. He does, however, die." Is one of my favourite line deliveries from Red that I've ever heard.

@thegoblin2004

Жыл бұрын

I'm not trying to be a dick, but Red was the one that said it

@matthewgilpincom

Жыл бұрын

@@thegoblin2004 OOPS. Corrected. Thanks for pointing it out!

@thegoblin2004

Жыл бұрын

@@matthewgilpincom no problem

@starflameburnsbright

Жыл бұрын

Agreed. It's tied in place with "Give me this movie Hollywood. You cowards!"

@Campfire_Bandit

Жыл бұрын

+

The girl who voiced powder was about 12 at the time (I think) She did the crying scene in one take, the producers didn't think it was necessary to do more They also turned to the other voice actors and said that's what you've got to match' That kid might have a good VA future ahead of her

@sharodnowshadabdullah3598

Жыл бұрын

Mia Sinclair Jenness was undoubtedly the best find from Arcane's already incredible cast.

@alexandresobreiramartins9461

10 ай бұрын

Remarkable!

@swiftlymurmurs1825

8 ай бұрын

She was cast really young but I think by the time they actually got around to recording she was already a fair bit older, like 15 or so

@ShyyGaladriel

5 ай бұрын

I wish her the best.

@carlosbermudez537

3 ай бұрын

10….she was 10yo.

The fact that there even *is* a memorial statue to Vander says a lot, I feel. Silco took over right after Vander died, so who put it up? They'd need to have his say-so at the very least. If he truly no longer loved Vander, he'd never allow it.

@U.Inferno

Жыл бұрын

I was showing it to my sister and through Episode 3, Silco repeatedly tells Vander how despite it all, despite everything that tore them apart, he can't help but respect Vander. He says to him twice that he still respects him

@skazwolfman8622

9 ай бұрын

I am absolutely certain Silco commissioned the statue himself and justified it to his supporters by spinning it as an appeasement to the people who were still loyal to Vander's memory. He might even have believed his own bullshit for a while.

So basically, the theme of Arcane is: *Love is both enduring and undoing to us all*

@karlwilker579

Жыл бұрын

Silco outright says it.

@indifferenthomosapien7673

Жыл бұрын

‘’Is there anything so undoing as a daughter,’’

@chriscortez2036

Жыл бұрын

@@karlwilker579 What I find hilarious ironic is that if Silco was a 1-dimensional villain who sold out Jinx for Zaun’s independence, Powder would have survived & moved on happily with Vi and the council wouldn’t have been bombed. Because Silco wasn’t a clearcut villain, the heroes don’t get a clearcut happy ending.

@whiteeye3453

Жыл бұрын

It's called reality and morality grey

@commonviewer2488

Жыл бұрын

​@@whiteeye3453 Some people are that heartless to sell out their own child. Not Silco apparently.

Honestly if you told people 5-10 years ago that a League of Legends based show was an award winner and an overall great and emotional show, they’d probably laugh at you. The people who made Arcane deserve a lot of credit for their work.

@DoubleRBlaxican

Жыл бұрын

I believe the story was always there. Their animation and lore were part of the reason I kept playing. Honestly the game was the worst part about it, especially ranked.

@duarteribeiro2558

Жыл бұрын

​@@DoubleRBlaxican i would say the problem is really the ranked players(the toxicity)

@bradleyogilvie8869

Жыл бұрын

@@DoubleRBlaxican oh yeah for sure. I haven’t played the game myself but I’ve seen enough on KZread to know that they’ve been planning Arcane for a long time. Still, Arcane’s quality was probably a surprise to most people who didn’t know much about the game’s lore.

@VivaLaDnDLogs

Жыл бұрын

If you tell people that *today* they might still laugh at you. It's why every review opens with "y'all, this show is good, SERIOUSLY".

@ConnorNotyerbidness

Жыл бұрын

@@VivaLaDnDLogsi laughed when i heard this show was good. This? League of legends? Really? Then i watched it I needed therapy after

Arcane is one of the few shows I legitimately call adult. Not due to its rating, but because so much of the character drama REQUIRES you to understand extremely complex motivations that often are in conflict with each other.

@helenanilsson5666

Жыл бұрын

Honestly, in that sense it is way more adult than many live action shows written specifically for an adult audience. Because like Red said, there are easier ways to create conflict and we're all conditioned to accept playground-style conflicts between adults in fiction.

@AmerZAC

Жыл бұрын

​@@helenanilsson5666The entire notion that animated works don't deal with adult issues and that it takes a live-action adult-oriented show to properly show them is a misguided one and honestly needs to die as fast as possible (I'm not saying you said that, just that it's a common point of view). Plenty of great pieces of art beg to differ. I feel like anime has been doing "adult animated series/movies" (as in, those dealing with themes commonly perceived as adult ones) for a good while now with much less stigma of being "for kids" in the East, even despite most of anime being made *for teenagers*. Works such as Monster, Berserk, Serial Experiments Lain, Mushishi, Grave of the Fireflies (or most of Ghibli's works, really), Fullmetal Alchemist, Death Parade, Perfect Blue, Paprika, Violet Evergarden, Aoi Bungaku... Western animations also did several great works - BoJack Horseman, Samurai Jack, Castlevania, Inside Job, Arcane itself, Invincible, Love, Death + Robots. Hell, Puss in Boots: The Last Wish was surprisingly adult (and a great movie in general). People need to stop thinking that "animated = less serious". If anything, it gives the artists more freedom.

@codmv2

Жыл бұрын

@@AmerZAC None of the shows youu listed have more depth than a teenager would get. Samurai Jack, really? Like all of those shows maturity caps out at like 16 years of age, tops (barring people who stay as manchildren).

@gwen9939

Жыл бұрын

@@codmv2 Just because a teenager could follow the plot and understand what's going on doesn't mean they'll be able to fully resonate with deeper themes. Most teenagers can follow Miyazaki's movies and even a few could understand that these are commentaries on war and the relationship between humans and nature, it won't resonate the same as it will with an older audience, and an audience that's the same age as Miyazaki who experienced cold war tensions directly will spot sentiments even deeper than that. It's not at all a controversial to say that many of these shows deal with *emotional* themes that are lost on a younger audience. I don't agree with every example but I agree with a lot of them. Being weirdly elitist about media is never a good look, and if you truly want to talk about what is truly emblematic of teenage behavior, it's the incessant need to prove you're "better" than someone else, either by artificially lifting yourself up or by putting others down. Teenagers(or as you also included, manchildren) are the only ones that concern themselves with what counts as "cringe" and fail to see any value besides what condemning something would say about their own social image. Once you have a superiority complex about an academic subject like media analysis you're guaranteed to miss 90% o what the subject is truly about.

@codmv2

Жыл бұрын

@@gwen9939 I'm not being elitist. I just just think that it is very clear that people who enjoy animated media and are insecure about it will extoll or invent its mature qualitties to convince others and themselves of the refinment of said media. Which, funnily enough, is elitist, as it comes from a feeling of superiority and inability to accept that they are enjoying a simple thing.

The knife-twisting and tragic irony gets SO much worse the more you think about it. Literally just a few minutes before the shooting started and Vander got kidnapped, Vi told Powder that she didn't need to be a fighter because one day she'd make her explosives work. You realize that, in Powder's mind, getting her bombs to work represents validation and acceptance from her family. She imagines a day she won't be the scrawny younger kid who everyone else but Vi wants to leave behind, and instead is trusted to go along on jobs with the others. Then she finally gets her wish, one of her bombs finally works, she gets all of a minute of "this is the greatest day of my life," which then immediately becomes "this is the worst day of my life" when she realizes the people that bomb was supposed to win her approval from were instead killed by it. Not too hard to see why she has severe mental issues as an adult 😅

@Daelyah

Жыл бұрын

It's impossible for me to not want to hold Jinx, offer consolation and help her heal...but after she's resurrected with Shimmer, the chemicals only worsen her mental instability-and even that cannot justify her attack on the council to Caitlin, or any other Piltover citizen, which is why that attack undoubtedly will be what sparks all-out war between Zaun and Piltover. My heart breaks so much for her and Victor the most... And, speaking of the latter, I'm estimating that once the next season comes around, he might be progressing even closer to his war machine form, after Jinx's strike...

@Squeekysquid

Жыл бұрын

@@Daelyah Yeah he's already on a ticking clock, and an explosion does a pretty good job of speeding up that (dead)line.

@alexandercandicedad1355

Жыл бұрын

Success = trauma?! Spicy!

@sailordaigurren8225

Жыл бұрын

The scene with Powder having a full on breakdown, screaming and throwing her monkey and hitting herself in the head out of rage and frustration and pain was really, amazingly powerful. As a father, I've definitely seen my son go through things like that, especially before we got his ADHD under control, and it really hurt to watch.

@stonecat676

Жыл бұрын

Vi being entrusted with being a secondary caretaker in their found family is also detrimental to them all, as Vi has her own desires and struggles with power and loss and her sense of self - and primary social language - is very much defined by violence. But the nuance here is that she also grieves her loss of innocence - and literal parents - in the form of Jinx/Powder. The paradox is Vi wanting Powder to be sheltered from the madness of the world but also putting emphasis on sequestering power and their own place in said world through violence. But we all know, this all circles back to class and how the City of Progress can only "progress" is thru the cannibalism of the undercity.

The whole "I understand now brother" part is also about how Silco "never understood/forgave him for making a deal with Piltover" and now he gets that it was to protect the children.

@kenjibacha2699

4 ай бұрын

And a funny/ironic/tragic thing is that it literally one of the same children Vander stopped for.

On the 'exile the princess' - 'exile the daughter' pipeline, it could also be read as Ambessa going "Okay sweetie, time for an object lesson on why this doesn't work." and then she shows up in piltover to Mel absolutely thriving and has the audacity to be all shocked pikachu face about it

@zaya.juniper

7 ай бұрын

love the way u phrased that

10:10 Vi doesn't just stagger off, she sees Powder's blood on her hands and goes somewhere she can cool off without hurting anyone. She never for a second considered abandoning her, even at her angriest

@Daelyah

Жыл бұрын

However, Jinx may never see it that way; as far as that whole situation is concerned, Vi never came back to her. Silco found Powder in a vulnerable state, and became the most important person to her during the formative years that followed. She'll still miss her blood relation, but there's permanent trauma that Jinx can't properly heal from in this dystopian setting.

@Luke_Danger

Жыл бұрын

If anything, Vi did the mature thing. She realized that she was past her rope, so she walked away to stop herself from hurting Powder further. In any other situation, that would have been the right thing to do as well. Problem was, Silco had enough men left afterwards and was in the mood to hunt for survivors rather than get out of dodge, and Marcus was right behind her to chloroform, kidnap, and imprison without trial. Not that Vi would have been able to do much at that point, but she absolutely tried.

@KingOpenReview

Жыл бұрын

​@Luke Danger Ironically, Marcus very likely saved Vi and Jinx's life.

@Notmyday2009

Жыл бұрын

​@Daelyah Jinx already had serious abandonment issues since her parent death. Jinx think that when she was left behind she was being abandon. This is where her objection to prove herself useful is tied to her abandonment issues. Vi left so she got her bomb to work. She prove herself and was punish for it. Is why in part she so quick to jump to the nearest person for warm (The recreation of Lucifer fall [painting] was a Lil on the nose but it was neat)

@Firefight_

Жыл бұрын

I love how this show has such a profound fanbase

I actually kind of appreciate that they had given a release window later this year, but then came back and said "Actually, it isn't going to be ready. You're going to have to wait a bit longer for it." That kind of restraint on the creator's part for one, and that level of respect from the executives for two is... honestly pretty remarkable.

@pressplayulysses

Жыл бұрын

It sucks that big time companies don't have this restraint. They always need to have a very short deadline. Everything's rushed.

@Joawlisdoingfine

Жыл бұрын

I would rather wait for amazing content than a constant shit storm

@animationdude9

11 ай бұрын

@@Joawlisdoingfine this is my mentality while waiting for invincible to get a second season

@LuneWatcher

10 ай бұрын

​@@animationdude9well hey good news haha

@ceinwenchandler4716

8 ай бұрын

Yeah. It's disappointing that we won't see it sooner, but if they need more time to make it good, they should take that time.

YES, god I love how silco doesn't seem to understand Vander and after taking care of jinx he is fully willing to give it all up just for jinx

@ehdrake

Жыл бұрын

That legit got me in all the feels

@RocketSlug

Жыл бұрын

Especially because Vander gave up on the dream of Zaun (his betrayal of Silco) in order to take care of Vi and Powder. Silco now fully understands why Vander made that choice and can't stay mad at him anymore or consider it a betrayal, which makes it hurt all the more

@gwen9939

Жыл бұрын

Silco is an actual successful sympathetic villain without losing what makes him villainous, and it's not just in the "he has things he cares about", but also in that the show doesn't shy away from the audience being allowed to agree with his motives. I also love how they reversed what has essentially become a trope of displaying the villain as being very physically powerful compared to the heroes whereas in Arcane it's Vander who is built like a brick sh-.. a toilet.

@jaeded2391

Жыл бұрын

"How could you give up everything like that" *has a daughter* "Oh... shit okay I get it"

@Vi_Vi_1

Жыл бұрын

"is there anything so undoing as a daughter" is freaking poetry, and within the context of the scene it's so good it hurts

My fav Heimerdinger scene is when Jayce and Victor are showing him their new tech and its all like lasers and mechanized arms, things that are CLEARLY weapons but which they describe as revolutionary new tools... and Heimerdinger is like "ok great, let's never use these again"

@orsolyafekete7485

Жыл бұрын

And the thing is, they genuinely don't see them as weapons. I don't remember the exact details, since I watched the show when it came out and never came around to rewatch it (will totally do after this though), but when Vi goes to Jayce to "Yo, let's beat up Silco", and asks if they have any weapons. To that Jayce goes "we don't make weapons, we believe in peaceful progress!" "What are those over there then?" "They are mining tools" "No dude, those are totally weapons" "Sh*t, you are right." THAT'S when he realizes. I don't know how they managed to make the genius inventor and shrewd politician a total himbo, but I love it :D

@dandelionthief3979

Жыл бұрын

@@orsolyafekete7485 yes!! They're so innocent and eager when they're showing Heimerdinger, and he's just like... *raises eyebrows* coolcoolcool can't see how this could go horribly wrong AT ALL! 😅

@matthewmuir8884

Жыл бұрын

@@orsolyafekete7485 Even more than that, because they weren't designed to be weapons, they aren't as effective at being weapons compared to a hextech device that's purpose-built to being a weapon, as Jayce's hextech hammer shows. Jayce isn't nearly as effective a fighter as Vi, but he fared equally well because his hammer was an actual weapon.

@ichhabekeineahnung2462

Жыл бұрын

A hammer is a tool and a weapon, depending on perspective, after all

@youngjellyfish8694

Жыл бұрын

Even though he never says those exact words, what he does say basically boils down to that anyways without even realizing it due to the mental disconnect he has about the value of the short amount of time human lives have since he is so ancient. He says "obviously there are a few kinks to iron out and screws to be tightened, but give it a decade of careful research, it will be ready!" and then when Viktor is shocked about this, heimerdingers response is just, "oh, don't worry my boy. it zips past you in the blink of an eye." Heimerdinger treats a decade like something teensy and inconsequential in the long term, but for obviously any mortal, that is a significant portion of people's lives. Viktor has even less than this. He's sick, and even before he finds out that he is terminally ill, he has always been pretty aware, either consciously or subconsciously, of the limited time he has in his life to do something to actually change the world and help people, or at least get his ideas out there enough to where he is remembered by someone more than just Jayce... (kinda a shame that Jayce seems to struggle a bit with that already, lol) That scene is so good tbh. You get the feeling of understanding everyone in the situation, since while its obvious why heimerdinger would have concerns, you also understand why Viktor is so desperate to get his ideas out there and help the people of Zaun, even if some of those ideas need a lot more fine tuning than he probably has the time for. The first thing i'd think of if I were him is to find some sort of way to get a good ass air filter or something.... big shinny lasers are cool too, though.

It is important to mention that Warlord Medarda only turns up in Piltover because a new player in her home nation (heavily implied to be Swain, another champion in the game) is ruthlessly and very successfully killing off his political opponents and consolidating power. Warlord Medarda has turned to her daughter for help because she's afraid. Edit: Blue, please give us a Detailed Diatribe about architecture in Arcane.

@kamikazelemming1552

Жыл бұрын

I really hope we get Swain in Season 2, even if it's just a view of his back and a single line of dialogue.

@ChimeraMK

Жыл бұрын

@@kamikazelemming1552 And that single line: "Cacaw"

@johnymustacio

Жыл бұрын

well actually she turns up because of the hextech, the problems with her nation had already been ongoing for quite a while

@chrishaven1489

Жыл бұрын

SPOILER.......(probably, idk) If it is Swain, then that heavily implies that Mel's brother was a member of the Black Rose, LeBlanc's organization

@matthewmuir8884

Жыл бұрын

@@chrishaven1489 That would make a lot of sense, as Mel's brother was described as preferring political manipulation over direct conflict.

What's also interesting is Heimerdinger's issues with normal human time spans. He's clearly one of the most reasonable and well-meaning authority figures, and his long life means he has personally experienced history that humans might forget and are doomed to repeat, but he's unable to take immediate action. Take a few more years to test new Hextech? Victor maybe only has months left to live, let alone years. How to resolve the tension with the undercity? Well it cannot wait because it's about to turn violent right now. And then he is absolutely flabbergasted of Ekko's new little town that really drives home his long cushy life may have made him a little out of touch. Still, he seems like a very well intentioned person, and I hope season 2 shakes him out of his shortsightedness

@Danchamp07

Жыл бұрын

Wouldn’t it be ‘longsightednesses’?

@kylepessell1350

Жыл бұрын

Heimerdinger is a greatly respected figure in both Piltover and Zaun. Yordles in general are highly enigmatic and isolationist with only a handful ever leaving Bandle City. It's worth noting that Heimerdinger is the only member of his species in Piltover and who knows how long it has been since he's even seen another yordle. He's probably pretty lonely and sacrificed a lot for his new home.

@j.f.fisher5318

Жыл бұрын

Also, in the theatre enjoying the show instead of scheming so he doesn't have the political connections to protect his position

@liamnehren1054

Жыл бұрын

I would say that stems from him just not being very wise and mostly focused on his inventions. He probably should have looked for a few more of his kind who liked politics to handle that aspect of it and left the city to them. He is also super traumatized by some magic which was used as a weapon hundreds of years ago and since he never studied magic, can only tell people how scary it can be... which everyone knows in that world, which is partly why they want it so badly. If he had instead studied it and identified all the pitfalls, found counter measures and included them in science books etc, the two techs which are ripping apart the order of the city, namely whatever makes Viktor into a cyborg and then an android and the drug probably would have been considered obviously a stupid thing to do or just stopped easily. Hell if his hundreds of years of research into magic had resulted in healing magic, then Viktor wouldn't have been driven to the point of forgoing safety.

@rence234

Жыл бұрын

Its like unused facet of the "immortal" trope

Vi and Jinx's relationship felt so refreshing. Vi holding on to hope for Jinx despite hearing the worst things about her is so heartwarming.

@WolfBoy-om6dw

Жыл бұрын

I haven't seen Arcane but from what I've heard Vi and Jinx's relationship Is really good

@KingsBard

Жыл бұрын

​@@WolfBoy-om6dw Well yes but actually no

@uhoh7545

Жыл бұрын

@Wolf Boy really good at ruining _everything_

@gwen9939

Жыл бұрын

@@WolfBoy-om6dw It's good in that it's done really, really well. Which is really important since it's basically the centerpiece and focal point for the whole show.

@jacoblamb8460

Жыл бұрын

I'm sorry I have to disagree. Vi is the villain of the show specifically because she can't see her sister for who she is. She gets hung up on idealized versions of Jinx that never existed and repeatedly hurts her because she won't look her in the eye. To quote What could have been "Why don't you love who I am?"

If Blue wants to do an architecture deep dive for Arcane, I'm definitely here for it. There have been a number of animated properties more recently that are clearly using architectural aesthetic to help tell the story.

@McJethroPovTee

Жыл бұрын

ohhhh this this i want to see his take on the architecture and how the different lifestyle between Zaun and Piltover contributed to the building styles.

@Fighterpilot555

Жыл бұрын

Blue, get on this you beautiful nerd

@asmilingvoid9093

Жыл бұрын

i really hope he does i REALLY want to hear about piltovers architecture for an hour

@beets_and_rice

Жыл бұрын

this!!

@bzzzzzzzzzz2075

Жыл бұрын

I would LOVE this, so much

One of my favourite descriptions of Jayce is a nerd who wants to just do science but people see the jawline and shove him into politics. I really appreciate how it shows how even if you can learn to play the game, some people just aren't fit for it. Mel and Jayce are one completely different levels and you get the sense that Mel knows just how wrong it is for him, but wants to protect him.

@hajnahortobagyi690

9 ай бұрын

she is the one who pushed him into it tho... and later got sad abaut it

@Sootielove

9 ай бұрын

@@hajnahortobagyi690 Yeah, duh. When you get emotionally closer to someone, you're more upset when you've put them in an uncomfortable spot, even if it was for their protection and personal power. It's basic relationship development

@hajnahortobagyi690

9 ай бұрын

@@Sootielove yeah I just took issue with the idia that she did this because of protection, yeah later she got more protective over him but at the begining it was purely a power grab, so she can put some one in power that she can controll and later he won her over with his trusting and honest nature wich she was not used to

@animeotaku307

5 ай бұрын

@@hajnahortobagyi690I don’t think it was completely mercenary. While I’m sure Mel was partially motivated by her own interests (and Piltover’s), I think she pushed Jayce into politics because she genuinely thought it would help him. She was aware of his frustrations with the lack of support Heimerdinger was giving him and likely thought that putting him on the council and giving him allies within it would help him achieve the things he wanted to (which would be good for Piltover and her).

@hajnahortobagyi690

5 ай бұрын

@@animeotaku307 But what he wanted to achive is to help pepole, she wanted power and money and that whas what she continued to push for after he became councilor, yes she was anoied at heimer but it was because he was bad for buisness and when the oportunity arose for a power grab with jayce when things got instabel she took it. The point of her arc is that first she thought of Jayce as a way to achive her goal, a tool, but then grow atached to him because of his open and honest nature. Insisting that she cared abaut him all along with not much evidence if you lisen to what she is saying weakens her arc. She didt even know he and viktor where close, you would think if she cared abaut him she would pick up on that.

46:15 "Me and my family are simple people, *in our factory* we made hammers" -Actual Jayce line, delivered without a hint of irony. Also Jayce "It will help the honest worker from the Undercity" "The honest worker", not the Undercity in general, he looks down on them, if paternalistically rather than fully negatively.

@Azzabackam

Жыл бұрын

Holy shit, I never thought of this in this light. The story does such a good job of positioning him as an underdog against the Council, I never thought about how privileged he is. He sees his factory boss family as "good, honest, working class people" despite being higher on the social totem pole than those people.

@tonydanatop4912

Жыл бұрын

Real “Small loan of a million dollars” energy 😂

@TheMightyBattleSquid

Жыл бұрын

@@tonydanatop4912 He totally would've gotten a small loan of a million dollars from Cait's family lol

@stevenhedge2850

Жыл бұрын

@@TheMightyBattleSquid actually he DID. they were his patrons before jynx stole his crystal

@niccoloparker3548

Жыл бұрын

I disagree. Jayce gave me upper middle class vibes or a middle class guy with good connections. Essentially, If Jayce was really wealthy than why did he need Catilyn parents patronage. Jayce does not have a dad currently, so it's just his mom and him. Also a person can have factories, but still just be middle class or upper middle class, depending upon the size of the factory and what they produce. For example, I have relatives who have a single small factory. We are in a third world country. Their like middle to upper middle class. The overall point does stand that Jayce is obsessive and idealistic because of his upbringing. He had the good fortune or connections to Catilyn. Jayce gives me the vibes of a full on scholarship student who got a full scholarship to like rich kid high education and made some connections there. Vicktor would be an equivalent of a child raised in poverty. Heck most people in the undercity strike me as barely above put poverty line to put it generously.

Adding onto this theme, y'all kinda dismissed Heimerdinger, but he does tie to this theme as well, just on a more macro-level than the other characters. Because he loved the city of Piltover as a whole; he talks about it's history and it's purpose all the time, and he's considered-even in Zaun-as the "Father of Piltover." And, like Warlord-Medarda, Piltover makes Heimerdinger weak, and the city (characterized by Jayce and the council) eventually turns on him and betrays him, and he ends up in Zaun. But he never stops loving the city he built. So yes, very interesting theme overall. Just something I thought was noteworthy. Great video as always! ❤

@PheonixEnforcer

Жыл бұрын

I have to boost this take, it is so correct! Heimerdinger and Jayce have a weird pseudo-parental relationship. Heimerdinger thinks that Jayce is brilliant and mentors the Piltover firebrand. But in the end, Jayce pushes back against the care and guidance and ends up being the reason Heimerdinger loses everything.

@gokbay3057

Жыл бұрын

He is also blinded by the City. Like the musical performance. While all the Councilors are off in private boxes doing politics he is in the common seats, utterly enthralled by the performance. He is like this with the City itself as well. The shining glory of the City of Progress blinds him to the suffering Zaun is going through.

@RuneGrey

Жыл бұрын

Even crazier is that for being the grand old man of the city, Heimerdinger is by the standards of HIS people incredibly young. He's not got anywhere near the experience of other Yordles, but he has a strong sense of responsibility and a huge helping of PTSD from what happened back in the last huge magical war. So to all of these people who are literally mayflies to him, he's this ancient fount of experience and wisdom, but he's also a young Yordle who has Seen Some Shit and Does Not Know How to Process it. The things that deeply concern him he is unable to view through anything other than his personal lens, which operates on a timescale that Jayce and Victor can't sympathize with because it is literally longer than their lives. For them, that sort of development timeline is a legacy project they'd never really see to completion. For Heimerdinger, it's waiting a couple of months to make sure everything is up to snuff and ready to go. As mentioned in another comment, Heimerdinger has the problem of human society and culture moving *far* too fast for him. He has difficulty contextualizing the problems in Zaun because the conditions there change so quickly that it's hard for him to focus. People make new and amazing things so quickly that he's being bombarded by them one after another, and his view as the father of the city is too high up for him to really be able to take it in. It's why I think that his budding friendship with Ekko at the end of the season is probably going to help give him the grounding that he needs. Ekko ultimately having the sort of make every second count mentality that is the utter opposite of Heimerdinger will be an interesting relationship to see develop.

@Duiker36

Жыл бұрын

@@RuneGrey HeimerdingerxEkko the true OTP.

@Squeekysquid

Жыл бұрын

@@Duiker36 Bro I just can't wait to see some dong bombs and turrets. I also wonder how they're going to do Ekko's first rewind, cause anyone who has played the game, and seen the show, knows it's gotta come. Jayce, Vi, and Jinx have most of their kits from the game. I just wonder how that stuff is all going to play out narratively.

I always saw Vi walking away from Powder as even more tragic because when you see Vi’s facial expression after yelling at Powder, there’s this realization that she’s hurting her sister and she has to step away and regain some composure before she does more things she’ll regret. I don’t think for a moment Vi was ever going to leave Powder, but Powder doesn’t understand that (she’s a neurodivergent kid after all) to her, Vi just smacked her, shouted at her, and walked away. And it’s in those fragile moments that the dominos for the whole show get stacked. If Vi finished her cry, got up, and went back to Powder which she seemed fully intent on doing, this tragedy wouldn’t have happened. Which is why it’s so knife twistingly painful when it does.

@redpanda6497

Жыл бұрын

Where was that confirmed about Powder?

@mellemadswoestenburg1296

10 ай бұрын

​​@@redpanda6497 don't think it's been confirmed but it does seem likely. She had panic attacks and hallucinations before she met Silco. We saw that after Vi and the others left her behind to go save Vander. So she already had problems with her mental health. What she accidentally did to her family just cranked it up to 11.

@redpanda6497

10 ай бұрын

@@mellemadswoestenburg1296 That's mental illness, not neurodivergency (I hope I wrote it right ).

@mellemadswoestenburg1296

10 ай бұрын

@@redpanda6497 i think you did. It's a long word so i wouldn't blame you if you didn't. Those aren't technically mutually exclusive. I'm autistic and i had a lot of extreme panic attacks and hallucinations in my rough years. I guess it's because of that. I'm doing way better now though.

@redpanda6497

10 ай бұрын

@@mellemadswoestenburg1296 Thanks, English isn't my first language. That doesn't stop me from trying though. I understand that by the way, it can coexist, especially because you can be excluded if you're low functioning and that can cause a lot of emotional pain which is the doormat for more serious problems, but they aren't the same thing. Just both of them has something to do with the brain.

Every time I see an analysis of _Arcane,_ it's coming from a completely different angle, yet still absolutely resonates. That, my friends, is a sign of good writing.

@jujuoof174

Жыл бұрын

Exactly.

I feel like it’s a theme that Caitlyn is going to explore in season 2 as well. Caitlyn clearly plainly deeply loves Vi but is going to have to reconcile with the fact that the woman she loves wants to save the person who killed her mom

@beeaggro2593

Жыл бұрын

Oh yeah, Caitlyn is getting dragged into this theme hard. The self violence of romantic love

@psychopomp5636

Жыл бұрын

Do we know that she will die? a lot of important people are in that council room, and I don't think that they will kill Jayce and Mel so quickly.

@bjams77

Жыл бұрын

@@psychopomp5636 We don't know, but the dramatic juice is just sitting there waiting to be squeezed.

@willowarkan2263

Жыл бұрын

@@psychopomp5636 It might suck from a meta perspective, but Mel dying might be the cause of Jayce hating Jynx personally.

@ichhabekeineahnung2462

Жыл бұрын

As far as I can predict Jayce and Victor are the easiest to save from a meta perspective and a story one. Either of them could magic hand wave some shield. My money is on victor, which could also reveal his magic blood hybrid thing. Everyone else 🤷‍♂️. Also I was suprised to hear Mel is not a League character. If didnt play the game

I absolutely love Silco's moment of "you've infected me with emotions and I hate it"

“It’s not a mental illness if youre doing it on purpose” 27:01 SENT ME, that’s a perfect summary of how Jinx tries to cope with everything. (EDITED) Also! Your comment on Jinx like, hurting herself with some of these seemingly outward destructive behaviors, I think is validated a lot in the show. She shoots a raven in the arcade shooting gallery area, and she's often thematically associated with ravens (the Ekko vs Jinx fight scene showing a firefly vs. a raven, and the raven feathers on the Jinx chair in the tea party scene), so yeah, there's a lot of her hurting herself with her behaviors.

@liz6237

Жыл бұрын

Also, I realized watching that Warlord Medarda exiling Mel is the part that shows what happens if you DO cut off someone- “just stop” didn’t work for them either! So you have some characters clinging to their loved ones and then these two show the aftermath of an attempted clean break, and how that still failed in the face of the unbreakable bonds of love! It’s great, a fantastic contrast to the more focused Powder & Vi dynamic of desperately trying to reunite as loved ones

Silco's dying words created the most grotesquely beautiful moment I think I've seen, and really cemented this show for me.

@vdate

Жыл бұрын

For those who were wondering, "I never would have given you to them. Not for anything. Don't cry. You're perfect." (I'd forgotten the exact diction myself, and after I looked it up I figured others have to have had the same experience.)

@rustkarl

Жыл бұрын

It was so… perfect in its own mangled way.

@seanbirtwistle649

Жыл бұрын

when silco does everything in his power to stop jinx from listening to vi you immediately assume he's manipulating her. but he recognizes that vi bringing up the past is killing her, that there's no going back. vi loves powder, but silco loves jinx. its absolutely heartbreaking in hindsight

The thing that makes the ending of Episode 3 work so well in my mind is that everything leading up to that was very clearly hitting coming-of-age-story beats. - Powder's the runt of the litter, she tries her best but keeps screwing up, she overhears people saying she's worthless, but her sister assures her that she's valuable and loved. - Their adopted father gets kidnapped by a mean businessman; Powder's sister gets everyone together to rescue him, but when Powder tries to come too, she's told to stay home - it looks like she's finally been rejected by everybody. - This is the "false defeat" part of the story arc, followed immediately by her having this dramatic realization about how something she did might be useful, actually, as long as she's smart enough to use it to her advantage! - Powder goes in secret to help with the rescue mission, bringing along this new bomb - she's taking a risk, but she knows in her heart that she's going to save the day! - She's going to arrive when all hope is lost! Her bomb is going to work! She's going to save the day! Everyone is going to admit that she's useful, actually! So when we're watching from Vi's perspective too, and we see that they're actually doing just fine when Powder shows up, we get this creeping feeling that something is very, very wrong. (And part of the reason that Silco turns into such a good surrogate father figure for Powder is that he _validates_ her. That desperate need to be told she's "useful, actually" is the basis of their entire relationship - she keeps causing more and more chaos, Silco keeps taking advantage of that chaos, and she keeps hearing and seeing that all she needs to do to help her new family is to be herself. In another show, Jinx going rogue to steal the hextech gemstone would result in her boss getting mad at her for taking risks and drawing attention; Silco instead sees the gemstone, knows it's valuable even if he doesn't exactly know what it is, and he goes from being mad for other reasons to being thrilled that Jinx is in his corner. He tells her she did a good job - how often did she get that as Powder?)

@j.f.fisher5318

Жыл бұрын

Also, we see in episodes 1&2 that Silco admires monsters. More generally, he sees monstrous power as something aspirational.

@helendocherty6324

Жыл бұрын

Another added irony is that if powder had failed everything would have worked out perfectly. Yes, the gang was about to escape, but Vi and Vander were still injured, Claggor had only just gotten their escape route, and Hulked out Decard was moments away from breaking down the door. The monkey bomb had actually succeeded in confusing Decard for a moment, and had it not gone off probably would have been a good distraction to buy them time. Another twist of tragedy that if the bomb had not gone off (the very thing she was called useless for) it would have been exactly what they needed.

@fandemusique4693

Жыл бұрын

​@@helendocherty6324 alternatively, if she had just put one gemstone.

@naheleshiriki5496

Жыл бұрын

Even if the bomb didn't go off, they still all would have died. Everyone was so heavily injured that they wouldn't have all been able to run from the monster. It was a loose loose situation.

@jujuoof174

Жыл бұрын

Great analisis honestly

Riot: We need the characters to be compelling enemies any ideas Average writer: We could have them hurt each other Fanfic: We could have them love each other Aracne: Why not both?

@conejitorosada2326

Жыл бұрын

They literally saw the Hurt/no Comfort tag and went with it

@jasonutty52

Жыл бұрын

Gotta love ancient spider silk tapestries filled with writing advice. So helpful sometimes.

@aweirdoandaphone4135

Жыл бұрын

You did it! You broke down Arcane down to its bare essentials!

Even the relationship between Silco and Sevika is interesting. The lines "Were you tempted?" "Not for a worm like him." Shows that they have a deep loyalty going on as well.

@estherm6839

9 ай бұрын

I thought the opposite. 'Not for a worm like him' implying that she might have done it for someone else?

@JacklynBurn

9 ай бұрын

Yeah, as someone who really likes Silco's whole deal, I think Red and Blue's take on him as someone who turns on people is a bit misguided. After all, it wasn't just at the end when he respected Vander, when he kidnapped Vander he explicitly said that he still had respect for him. He believed Vander's "betrayal" was actually good for him, and was trying to bring Vander over by tying him up and giving him Shimmer (things went sideways from there, which is why things changed). His speech to Finn and Sevika in that scene was fundamental to that idea, that he cares about loyalty a lot. That said, they also understand there's a line. Sevika says "not for a worm like him. But there will be others," because she betrayed Vander when he started slipping up and no longer kept the City's interests in mind, and she's giving Silco the warning that she believes in loyalty like he does, but if he continues to make the mistakes he's been making, there'll be someone who convinces her to turn on him. Their bond isn't as unbreakable, because it's built on ideals rather than love. Sevika cared about Vander, but when he chose his kids over the city (in her eyes), she stabbed him in the back. She stuck with Silco because he was able to put money where his mouth was during the timeskip, but sees he's faltering in a similar way when it comes to Jinx during the course of the show. But while Finn tried to play to her thoughts on that, Silco's monologue showed her that he didn't share her ideals, and was just another Chembaron looking to take over the show for money, instead of an independent Zaun.

@roryschussler

9 ай бұрын

​@@JacklynBurnRight. I think the KZread essay "The anti-arc of anti-Vi" does a pretty good job of examining her character. It fits with the theme about bonds of love. What happens if you have no bonds? You see humans as replaceable. That's a major theme for Sevika. Vander didn't do what she thought should be done, so she helped replace him. She refused to replace Silco, but made it clear she only did so because she still found him useful and could change her mind if he didn't get it together. She kicked off Jinx's paranoia about Vi leaving her for Caitlyn by saying "Looks like she replaced you." Like most characters, her theme is reflected in her character design, with her arm. So along with the theme of love, the message she sends is that without any bonds to tie you to another human, you'll become someone who sees other humans as cogs in a machine that can be thrown out and replaced without concern.

It's interesting to consider that the "Points Minigun at Vi" moment when compared to Jinx shooting the airship ruffian is significant in how each character's reaction to Powder/Jinx confirms different sides of her personas. In each scene, she was frozen in the moment of decision/recognition, and when the street girl ran, it was confirming the Jinx persona as someone who Vi ran away from. When she points the gun at the real Vi, Vi doesn't run, and in fact steps closer, confirming the Powder persona as someone Vi cares deeply about.

@kingsly2275

Жыл бұрын

Oh yeah for sure if real vi tried to leave she would’ve shot her for sure

I kinda disagree about Caitlyn not playing into the core theme. She and her mom have a subtle thing going where Cait is never quite what her mom wants her to be, but her mom can't stop loving her, and Cait can't stop pushing her mom to see her point of view

@sophiemcdoogal6691

5 ай бұрын

It’s more her fathers love that is shown than her mothers. Her mothers is more concern, which I suppose is it’s own kind of love

The thing that shocked me the most about Arcane is realizing that Singed of all people is lowkey the most important character in League Lore

@MarioKonga

Жыл бұрын

Yeah, and Arcane doesn't even show the single most important thing he's done in the lore of League.

@TheDakkaman

Жыл бұрын

At this point I'm doubting there's much 'low' to that key

@CaptianTwug

Жыл бұрын

Wait what? How? What does he do in lore?

@sinitall

Жыл бұрын

@@CaptianTwug Shimmer, helping Viktor with the hexcore, saving Powder's life albeit it in a brutal way that leaves her even more mentally scarred, Shimmer. Shimmer and chemtech are hugely important and he's behind it

@MarioKonga

Жыл бұрын

@@CaptianTwug The most important thing in the lore is that he made chemical weapons for Noxus (the nation Mel and her mommy come from) which get used on entire villages in Ionia (another nation). This kickstarts or influences the stories of a TON of different champions.

Still think one of the best scenes in this show is Ekko vs Jinx. The whole time Ekko was so adamant on having to end Jinx, but in the final moment where he could’ve ended it all, he froze cause he saw Powder.

@shinypooka

Жыл бұрын

It's beautifully animated too.

@inkchip7351

Жыл бұрын

Timebomb what could have been

@fionn2220

Жыл бұрын

I agree but to nitpick for a moment i don't think he "saw powder" i think its more like he realized Jinx is Powder. Its a less a matter of him realizing innocence is still locked away in her psyche and closer to him understanding that Jinx is more complicated and layered than her battle persona and theatrics make her seem, that his best friend never actually left rather than that she "surfaced" for a moment if that makes sense.

@cyberpunk-2O77

Жыл бұрын

Maybe I'd like that scene more if he didn't have massive plot armor.

@matthewmuir8884

Жыл бұрын

@@fionn2220 I agree. The main failing of both Vi and Ekko was that they saw Powder and Jinx as separate people when they're the same person. In Vi's case, it's a failure to recognize who her sister is now and wrongly believing Silco brainwashed her, while for Ekko, it's clearly a coping mechanism; he has to see Powder and Jinx as different people. When he reminded her of the game they used to play to get her to aim predictably, he also reminded himself that Jinx is Powder.

“He didn’t even haggle”is another running theme for Jayce. Ekko traded and got the info from Jayce offscreen at the beginning of the show. That’s why the gang goes to his house. Ekko says he didn’t even haggle and so does Silco.

With the ekko jinx fight, I do want to point out that her grenades have teeth and are shown to use those to grab onto others throughout the show. Her not planting it on ekko makes it read much more as a suicide (or at least a murder/suicide) than if she was still in full monster mode against Ekko. Definitely adds more to the dynamic when ekko can't kill her because poweder is still there, and then powder tries to kill herself possibly for similar reasons.

@gokbay3057

Жыл бұрын

Oh yeah, she was totally ready and accepting of dying there.

@Daelyah

Жыл бұрын

My roommate who watched the show with me speculates that Powder died on that bridge; the person that Singed brought back was finally, completely Jinx, who had to reconcile with the people and memories of a past life that brought her to that point. She's so chemically altered, in that dark resurrection, that even if the "tea party" in the end of the last season had gone any different, Jinx would've still come out as having moved on from being Powder. We're both pretty sure that with having the Powder and Jinx chairs, she was trying to convey to Vi that Powder was gone; it was only Jinx, now, and there was no going back.

@rogerogue7226

Жыл бұрын

@@Daelyah I understand that reading, but i'm going to have to disagree hard. The whole point of Jinx is that she doesn't care, that she's the loose cannon with no inhibitions. Jinx doesn't ask if they're still sisters. Jinx wouldn't be so able to have her trauma triggered. The only reason that dinner went down that way is because she can't ever be rid of Powder. "Jeesh, even i'm not that crazy."

@bzzzzzzzzzz2075

Жыл бұрын

@@rogerogue7226 idk I disagree with both of your readings (tho they're valid) to me, powder is jinx, they're inextricably linked. What we call powder is just jinx being vulnerable/having a conscience/not playing up the persona. There's a reason why there's so much disagreement on 'when powder died' and that's because she can't. Not unless jinx dies. Powder IS gone in the sense that the past is gone, in the sense that there's no longer a girl who calls herself Powder. But she's also still right there, running drugs, killing firelights, doing terrorism, shooting up silco with shimmer. Powders just not a good person anymore, and the jinx/powder dichotomy is just how she, and the people around her, try to reconcile that. The problem is, that paradigm is not good for her, and it's not accurate to her experience. It's a coping mechanism at its best. After all, what we call Jinx is driven by the exact same things that drive powder, has the same hobbies, same aesthetic impulses etc etc. jinx wants affection, security, to be useful, and powder also always wanted those things. There's no clean line between what 'jinx' wants and 'powder wants. Like, silco took in Powder, powder leapt into his arms. Of course powder loves silco. And Jinx loves vi, jinx was made by VI's encouragement, jinx hallucinates Vi, and she stabs silco with the injector because she's mad that he kept her from Vi. I've heard some interesting other takes on the powder/jinx dichotomy that I've found appealing though. And it's usually jinx, not as the sadistic freak to powder's angelic innocence, but as a protector(sorta how we see it in the enemy mv). Eg: 'jinx' is powder's ability to do stuff, where before she was helpless and useless and messed everything up: now jinx deals with problems and threats in her own destructive, cunning way. In this take, 'powder' actually comes out most around Silco, surprisingly. Because that's where jinx is most vulnerable and open. I think the best arguments for when powder died though, are episode 3(when her innocence died) or slowly, as she developed into Silco's elite enforcer and took up her new monicker. Ye, just my 2 cents, have a good day

@rogerogue7226

Жыл бұрын

@@bzzzzzzzzzz2075 I don't think we disagree, actually. I agree that "Jinx" and "Powder" are the same person. The different names are just useful names to distinguish between different paths, different attitudes, that the same girl has. Not unlike Vader and Anakin, same body, same memories, same mind, just a different MO. The distinction in how they look and act is just so large, and the conflict between the two "personalities" that different names are helpful to keep track of them, in story and out.

As a league lore fan i have to say this: Arcane was the best thing that ever happened to me and lore fans in general. Riot forgets some characters exist, then gives some of them great setups with no payoff. Arcane gives me hope that we'll get more compelling series that build on the great stuff that is there. (to be clear, there is also some bad/problematic stuff but i'm not getting into those here) I also kinda hate it when people say ''I can't believe that a League of Legends series was this good!'' because the lore team were doing all they could despite being trated like trash by Riot Games and still wrote great stories that showed us a glimpse of the world of Runeterra. Their work was the foundation for Arcane and i hate that their passion and hard work is being ignored.

@KalasenZyphurus

Жыл бұрын

The lore team is great, absolutely masterful at creating characters, even with heavy constraints like with Seraphine. The problem is that they are only really allowed to create characters, and very rarely get to write stories involving them past their release. There was the Burning Tides event, where Miss Fortune apparently kills Gangplank and takes over as pirate captain, with Gangplank returning reworked. The most recent is the Sentinels of Light event, which went over... less well. But the lore team still did some good with Thresh, even under the constraint of "make his face less of a floating skeletal mask and more of an anime boy." The other games and media set in Runeterra are really letting them flesh out characters, the best example of which is Arcane.

@aptalsandvic5355

Жыл бұрын

@@KalasenZyphurus ughh the sentinels of light event. It was truly impressive how successful it was at ruining years of buildup and hype. The only reason Arcane is s great as it is was that the writers were allowed to make it as good as they could possibly do it. I don't think any writer at Riot would put goddamn Rengar, Olaf or Pyke into that storyline if they weren't forced by the higher ups.

I think the interesting thing about Silko is he really doesn't stop caring about Vander. Like when Jinx kidnapped him he was reminiscing and seemed to almost have an epiphany. If she had been a few minutes later things could have gone very differently

@ConnorNotyerbidness

Жыл бұрын

Something nobody ever talks about as well is Vanders statue Silco definately had that built Statues of himself wasnt vanders style Look at it, its clean and new looking. Theres grafitti and trash everywhere, yet not the statue Silco definately had it built and keeps it maintained Despite everything He still cared for Vander

@gokbay3057

Жыл бұрын

@@ConnorNotyerbidness Even if Silco didn't have it built he definitly at least let it be built and then let it stand.

@Kris-wo4pj

Жыл бұрын

@@ConnorNotyerbidness he atleast had it built but i think the community had it mantained even tho Zaun was worse condition wise under Vander he was still beloved by the community(also there wasnt a horrible drug issue that causes both a better ecnomic market but also makes the already large crime, death and air pollution rate even higher in a few short months/yrs of Silco's death) if Silco wouldnt have someone killed for defacing it then the people of Zaun would.

@edanridge3023

Жыл бұрын

Also I think a great moment was when he was talking to Finn about loyalty when he says “now I’m forced to share the air with parasites like you who leach off their legacy” I always thought he’s talking to sevika but he’s referencing vander

@Duiker36

Жыл бұрын

He basically needed Vander to be safely dead before he could start to acknowledge that Vander had a point.

One thing I love about Arcane is that when Silko is sat debating with himself over giving up Jinx, he's talking to a statue of Vander. "They always betray us, we need to let them go" But yeah sure get your emotional catharsis from his visage, you've let him go. Sure.

@chrisk1039

Жыл бұрын

I also liked that on top of that scene it was very likely Silco who had that statue made and maintained, likely AFTER Vander had died. The statue is clean, unlike the surrounding area, and Vander was a barkeep who lead a failed rebellion against the overcity. Not a ton of people who would want to erect a statue in his image. Sure he ran the underground for a while but he doesn't strike me as the "build statues of himself" type, especially after becoming an adoptive father

@matthewmuir8884

Жыл бұрын

Silco isn't debating with himself in that scene; he had already made up his mind that he was going to protect Jinx and that he was never going to hand her over to Piltover. Silco forced himself to believe long ago that the only way to achieve independence for Zaun would be for him to stop at nothing to achieve it; for there to not be a single line that he won't cross if it means creating the Nation of Zaun, and yet, when there's finally a way for him to get Zaun's independence, he can't do it, because he found a line that he won't cross: betraying his daughter.

@Duiker36

Жыл бұрын

What @matthewmuir8884 said. Silco wasn't going there to wrestle with himself. Silco was going there to *concede Vander's point*. Silco went there to say, "I was wrong. I'm sorry for that now."

@thomasraines1396

Жыл бұрын

@@Duiker36 that’s why he “pours one out” for Vander and offers him a little toast I think.

"I have abandonment issues. Oh F-,Same hat" -Red 2023 I honestly like how they did arcane, and instead of just saying: "vi is going to mysteriously disappear because LMAO" they actually made a better choice to build up her character and make her more of a badass than just magically making someone appear.

@shadowzombie2864

4 ай бұрын

@@arcaedion4798 tbh, riots lore for a lot of their old champs (as far as I know) hasn't ever been updated to a more modern representation of their character. It's just, "new model, same lore" and it kinda makes no sense. Like Vi being a badass in arcane compared to: "bonked head, forgot she was underground badass and now is pretending she's a cop is the most boring lore I can have.

"He's not mad about it, it's a great Dad Moment, he does however die." Possibly the best thing I've ever heard, please excuse me while I go lie down until the laughter stops.

For Ekko vs Jinx, I thought that the reason she pulled the pin on the grenade was because she realized she was at rock bottom & thought she should end things & maybe take her childhood friend with her so she wouldn't suffer anymore. She thought she lost everyone, saw that her childhood friend still somewhat cared, & couldn't take it anymore. Dark take, but I think it also contributes to why she did what she did at the end of the fight.

One thing I love about the Powder-Jinx this is how well they did the "as a child she was weak and a liability to everyone" to as an adult she is frighteningly hyper-capable and strong but is so mentally fractured she's still a liability

Important detail aspect about the love between Powder/Jinx and Vi: The blue smoke. For context: When going off to rescue Vander, Vi gives Powder a blue smoke flare, to activate whenever she was alone and Vi promised to come and find her. Jinx kept it after everything and once she activates it, Vi actually finds her, which is how they first meet after years. Here is the important part: In the time-skip, while apart from eachother, having split after Arc 1 Catastrophe-Rescue, they both get tattoes and they both have blue smoke. Now Jinx always had that but Vi had a mechanical tattoo in the game design. In Arcane however, she has that mech-skeleton tattoo, but there is blue smoke between it. Obviously they didn't plan this, they didn't collaborate. They both chose to keep the blue smoke because it was a connection, because of the promise "I will find you." Jinx got the smoke because she still loves Vi, still hears and sees Vi, Vi is keeping her going. And she kept the flare maybe because there was a small part hoping that, if activated Vi would come to her. Which she did. And Vi got smoke tattoos because she also remembers the promise. Because she also loves Powder/Jinx, if she saw the blue smoke, which she did, she would drop everything and go there. Which she did. Neither could forget or let go of the promise, so both chose to keep the motive and ink it upon their bodies.

@Daelyah

Жыл бұрын

Another detail that I missed, thanks for that. It will definitely help further with a fic idea I have-in which Jinx finds love in a partner who accepts her for her, and it becomes one of the few moments she is calm and peaceful. I've been wanting to make the theme song for that fic "Suteki Da Ne," which was a bittersweet love song from Final Fantasy X. One interpretation of the lyrics has the lines: "Clouds, like a voice that we all recognize/ Carry the holding future," and later on, "Clouds are the future that cannot be attained." I wanted to play off of those lines with Jinx-with her powdery, smoky clouds tattoo-having accepted the loss of a reality that could never be again, the one with those she used to call family; and, just like the hero Yuna from FFX, is trying to enjoy the moment she has with her lover, even while believing it would be impossible to hold onto them forever. And with the allegory of dreams in the song (which hurt even more, when you consider how FFX ends), it feels fitting for Jinx as she struggles with all of her own dreams and illusions. Hell, there is a chance that she may view her lover as a "gentle illusion," to correlate with the song; someone that she doubts even exists, but she welcomes them regardless for some reprieve from pain. The song works even better for Lightcannon, because having Lux in the mix can make the lyrics of Suteki Da Ne weave into the fic more: "Moon, on the sky as a trembling heart / Shown on the glass unsteadily. Stars, shedding tears in an overflowing stream / I see the night all around me." "The moon filled with night as it flowed through your heart / Such faraway reflections. Stars, ripe like tears, like fruit falls from a tree / I wipe my dreams off the nighttime." The tragic love alone in that song just feels like it could fit so well for Jinx, in a scenario where she's allowed a moment of happiness with someone again...even if she believes it's all another dream.

@jasonco2

Жыл бұрын

I’m going to ruin this for you by letting you know that the blue “smoke” is more likely the blue “cloud” from her monkey bomb exploding. That moment, her floating weightless as she finally created something that worked, defines her. Did it kill her father and family? Yes it did. That’s why she’s a jinx, that’s why she IS Jinx; and Jinx wears tattoos marking the times her Jinx-ness has harmed others she loved. Game spoilers: Jinx has always had both blue cloud AND mini-gun bullet tattoos. Vander died to the blue smoke, Silco died to the bullets. Her tattoos are, in a way, both times she was “born”. That first night, with the loss of Vander; and the tea party, with the loss of Silco and (to a degree) Vi.

@kingskelett6265

Жыл бұрын

@@jasonco2 but then why does Vi have it as well?

@jasonco2

Жыл бұрын

@@kingskelett6265 She doesn't, Vi's tattoo's depict gears, steampipes, and other assorted parts of industry including steam/smog. However, even if she did have blue smoke in her tattoo, it could just as easily represent the same explosion and not the flare. What's more, even if it did depict the blue flare, just because Vi made the choice to include the blue flare smoke does not also mean that Jinx made the same choice. Especially when you consider that the flare had not yet been lit and thus could have been a symbol of disappointment/sadness just as much as hope/happiness. In the end, only Riot really knows why they have those tattoos.

@kingskelett6265

Жыл бұрын

@@jasonco2 Vi has the blue smoke in the series. In the original game model she hasn‘t. Here is the main issue I see with saying it is the explosion. Number 1: Why would either of them depict something that was so horrible, especially Jinx. Remember she had a full trauma response when seeing the hextech sparks in the air, I don’t think even she would want to remember that every day. The flare smoke at least has a bit of hope that her sister would come back. Vi would also not want to remember all the time of how Powder killed 75% of her current family. Secondly, there was no blue smoke at the big boom. None. I doubt Vi even saw much blue because it happened very fast. There was blue sparks and maybe a bit of lightning but no coloured smoke. The original design for both of them kinda has to be ignored here, because they have nowhere near the level of meaning and background as Arcane versions have. Originally, I would assume that Jinx‘s tattoos are to contrast Vi, as most of their design choices contrast each other.

10:10 In defense of Marcus at that point, he really wanted to save Vi, probably out of guilt for getting Grayson killed. It's been confirmed that he was ordered to kill Vi by Silco, but he didn't want to do that so he kept her in Stillwater Hold, bribing even the warden to keep her there.

@LuneWatcher

Жыл бұрын

Oh right interesting, so was Silco even lying to Jinx? He probably didn't know, and was just telling her what he thought was true.

@bloodbrawler1438

Жыл бұрын

@@LuneWatcher Yep. If you saw and heard how Silco reacted to news of Vi's return, he doesn't sound like someone who knew of Vi's confinement.

@neonal18

Жыл бұрын

@@bloodbrawler1438 The exact exchange was Sevika: “It’s the sister. She’s back.” Silco: *quickly spins in his chair to face her with a stunned look* “From the _dead?!_ “ Then later in Marcus’s house he’s like “Oh, it seems like Vi didn’t make it on that _trip_ her father went on; isn’t that sad?” He’s letting Marcus know then and there that he now knows he didn’t kill Vi. He definitely spent the timeskip thinking Vi was dead.

@ritzexists2201

Жыл бұрын

I laughed when Marcus died. He put a grieving teenage girl in prison for no on-record reason, where she was apparently beaten regularly. There are so many ways he could have "protected" her. It's such an unfathomable decision. Nothing the show did after that realization could make me like him.

@bloodbrawler1438

Жыл бұрын

@@ritzexists2201 I feel like in any other place, prison or not, that isn't Stillwater Hold, Vi would successfully escape, go after Powder, and get herself killed because most of Zaun is now siding with Silco. Marcus had to really bribe the warden, mind you, to keep her in that island prison.

i feel that the scene where Jinx is experimenting with the hextech gemstone and just in the zone is the happiest we've ever seen Jinx, ever. Powder had a sense of happiness, but it was a very natural, in the sense that it's hard to truly make a 10 yo cry. This is Jinx's epiphany, where she is blazing her way to enlightenment, and this makes it all the happier given what has happened to her and what happens to her later.

9:00 - okay, this “only overhearing half the conversation” trope is good and all, but is it bad that I want to see a version where the eavesdropping character hears the entire conversation and understands the context and what everyone means - and STILL gets hurt and angry, because it doesn’t matter what the intention was, the other people shouldn’t have been talking trash!

It wouldn’t surprise me if Vi gets amnesia later on and Jinx, having finally decided what she wants, becomes a lot happier in her anarchy. 25:05 What makes it even worse is Vi tries the whole “snap out of it” thing on Jinx by reminding her of her family, but Vi doesn’t realise Jinx doesn’t derive strength from them and that they act as her demons and nightmares and constant reminders of her guilt and grief... but Silco can see it clearly, and he moves to shoot Vi not necessarily to kill her (at least not exclusively) but primarily to protect Jinx.

@ethanstyant9704

Жыл бұрын

I remember someone pointed out that when they were kids Vi made monsters and when Powder got too scared she would chase them away and in Jinx's breakdown Vi reminding her of everyone makes the monsters again

@SwordTune

Жыл бұрын

It would surprise me very much if they kept the amnesia lore. Amnesia is overused, cheap, and easy.

@ChimeraMK

Жыл бұрын

I just accepted that the game and the show are two different worlds/stories sharing the same characters. So I don't see the amnesia thing coming. Like game Ekko has this dialogue to game Jinx "I had a crush… until you started talking to the gun." Which is already in conflict to the show.

@chrishaven1489

Жыл бұрын

@@ChimeraMK The show is an adaptation of the lore. It's fundamentally no different to the distinction between the Harry Potter movies and the Harry Potter books

@ChimeraMK

Жыл бұрын

@@chrishaven1489 And not everything from the game's lore is gonna be in the show. Like how Vi got her gloves rescuing people from a mine. It's not gonna be like how Harry Potter has only some differences between book and movie. It's more like Batman adaptations: same characters but different events.

Before meeting her mom Mel entertained the idea of building a hextech weapon but after she understood her relationship with her mom she chooses peace

i think the cool part about arcane is that it's so well written that any semi major theme in the show is so well written and intertwined that you can't really pinpoint an exact major theme, pick another theme in the show and you'll get the same amount of depth of exploration about it and somehow it still feels coherent and well paced

@MsFeyCreature

Жыл бұрын

Right?! It's about the terrible power of love and also its about class struggle and it's also about the dangers of suppression and denial and its also about the reckless pursuit of progress and.....

Something worth pointing out is that while Vi SAYS they're still sisters and acts like she doesn't care what Jinx has done, it clearly DOES affect her. Vi desperately wants to believe they can go back to the way things were, that she can love her sister like she used to, but seeing what powder has become... she's in denial. She knows deep down that Jinx is not the same girl Powder was, and never will be. They can't undo what's been done, the things SHE has done. Vi does still love her, but not in the same way because Jinx is not the same person anymore, and it's Jinx who realized it before Vi did. That's what she meant. She knows that Vi is in denial, that Vi won't be able to reconcile what Jinx has become, and that things cannot be the way the once were. Vi is frightened by Jinx's actions, her instability. She may say she doesn't care what Jinx has done, but when faced with the reality of Jinx's tea-party from hell, how could she not be disturbed?

@JacklynBurn

9 ай бұрын

For sure, and a core part of that they didn't mention was the cupcake bit. They mention the part of Jinx's speech at the end where she says "I thought you could still love me, even though I'm... different," and say that Vi *does* still love her, but they don't seem to understand the disconnect in that. After all, just moments before that speech, she directly murdered Silco, and yet forgave her with his dying breath. That's the stick that Jinx has to measure love by, and she sees that even if Vi loves her, she loves the part that used to be Powder. She fears the part that's Jinx, and that fear of who she is overpowers the love of who she was. The bonds of love may be unbreakable, but are not unassailable. Despite showing time and time again how wrong the characters who say "break off these ties" are wrong, it also shows how when things go too far, you *do* have to cut out those toxic people, even though it'll hurt like hell. Mel has to cut ties with her mother, and Noxus, because she'll never be able to accept peace if she accepts Noxus' way of life. She'll always have love for her mother but entertaining her will only hurt her more. In that same way, Vi will likely have to cut out Jinx in season 2, because Jinx has outright stated that she can't be anything other than who she is now. And trying to be together will hurt her more, and hurt more people.

@j.f.fisher5318

6 ай бұрын

The other side is, even if Vi can't lover her sister "like she used to" that's not the same as that Vi will "see you're not that girl anymore and turn her back on you." Vi's still willing to work it out after being in front of a burt of Jinx's minigun fire. That line was just Silco's selfish and destructive manipulation. If Vi and Jinx left and went on adventures they'd learn a new way of being family.

@Cecilia-ky3uw

5 ай бұрын

@@JacklynBurn What really broke me was Silco's embrace. It lit fires and froze me, it perturbed the Gods, tumbled down mountains, put into motion the greatest of waves. Yet all somehow very calmly. The metaphorical stick was something I've thought about. What if one day I killed someone. Would society ever accept me, would my family accept me? Of course, Theseus' ship and maybe I'm dying at every moment, but I like to think that I'm still 'me', and that loving 'me' is what I think of as a true form of love. So 'me', not me.

It's interesting how Sevika sort of plays with the broader theme of "bonds of love" by rejecting the concept of love altogether in favor of an ideology. Plenty of characters struggle between the two - Marcus, Caitlyn, Silco, Vander, and Mrs. Medarda are all dedicated to some political idea, whether it's law and order, the independence of Zaun, or warlording. But all of them ultimately run up against a situation where their idea conflicts with someone they love and care about, and love always sort of wins out. But Sevika pretty clearly has no love or even strong concern for any of the characters we see. She's just utterly dedicated to Zaun. She switches sides from Vander to Silco. She decides not to switch sides from Silco to Finn, but she makes it very clear that she's *only* not betraying Silco because she thinks that even with his weakness caused by Jinx, he's still a better hope for the undercity than Finn would be - but she absolutely would betray Silco if another leader who is actually better came along. It also contrasts Vi, who's the opposite - someone who has no real ideological concern about anything.

One of the great Jayce/Caitlyn scenes that kind of ties in to this theme was in the beginning right before time skip. Jayce has the status of being "adopted" by Caitlyn's family--they're really just his patron, but he and Caitlyn have this really good brother/sister relationship. Something I really wish they could have spent more time on. Anyway Jayce does his illegal science/magic stuff and gets kicked out of the science academy. So of course Caitlyn's family disowns him. And there is this scene where he is at the fence at her family's estate and they are like just having this big brother/little sister talk, and it does come up that her mother is all like he's not your brother anymore... and Caitlyn doesn't flat out defy her mother, but you can tell that her bonds with him weren't broken. Of course, sadly, this is immediately uncut by Jayce Hextech being proven viable and him becoming one of the most important people in the city. Still.. they would have lost nothing by not including that scene which is why I am so glad they kept it.

"it's not a mental illness if you're doing it on purpose" is my favorite line ever

I like that they didn’t try to make any of the characters impossible to deal with. Pretty much everyone in the show feels like given the right circumstances they could have a place in the world where they’re happy and things are fine. If Piltover let them have independence and stoped polluting/over policing them Silco could be a really fair ruler and if Silco was more trusting he could even help Jinx and Vi restore their relationship. It would just take a lot of forgiveness and understanding and patience but the potential to be great is in all of them.

@Duiker36

Жыл бұрын

I think it's a stretch to say the Silco we saw could've been a good "ruler". Maybe the Silco who fought with Vander could've, but we never see him. This Silco chose to put a boot to the neck of his co-revolutionaries. But agree about the others.

@gljames24

Жыл бұрын

🎶What could have been... 🎶

@ataraxia7439

Жыл бұрын

@@Duiker36 That is super fair, maybe a good member of government to have around who still has proper checks and balances put on him is more realistic lol

@Tan12

Жыл бұрын

Silco could have been a good and passionate ruler if Zaun had gained independence and economic equality BEFORE he began resorting to dark methods during his and Vander's attempted revolution, after that point he was probably too far gone ethically.

The writing in Arcane is just absolutely top tier. There's quite literally nothing I hate about it; hell even the things we're most likely supposed to hate I just can't. This show is one of my main motivations when I write because I want my own writing to be on this kind of level of good

Another point I'd like to mention is that the writers specifically cited dualities as a major running theme in the story. You touch on it in the relationship web, but I love looking at it as how you can examine nearly any character pairing as some kind of foil to each other or a similar, parallel relationship

I remember Brandon Sanderson mentioning that Arcane is what he considers to be grimdark, because no good deed goes unpunished, and everything any character does ends up destined for tragedy. But oh boy is this sweet, delicious, melodramatic tragedy

@funnyaccountname5763

Жыл бұрын

I think what makes it not Grimdark is the very prominent themes of love all in this video.

@gokbay3057

Жыл бұрын

@@funnyaccountname5763 Existence of love does not make something not Grimdark.

@MsFeyCreature

Жыл бұрын

I'm not sure what definition of grimdark we're working with here, but the label that seems most natural to me is just classic tragedy: a hero is undone by his tragic flaw. As I understand it, a grimdark setting assumes everyone is bastards and the world is bad. The world and people in Arcane don't strike me as naturally evil or cruel, but prevented from reaching their potential by that tragic flaw.

@airplanes_aren.t_real

Жыл бұрын

​@@MsFeyCreature grimdark: pessimist setting with pessimistic protagonists Tragedy: optimistic characters undone by a pessimistic setting

@Squeekysquid

Жыл бұрын

@@airplanes_aren.t_real I know this is a bit off the subject, but I feel like saying more than just in my head. My one issue with some grimdark stuff is it focuses so hard on the dark, and less on the grim. Like a lot of it tries too hard to be so depressing and miserable that it becomes hard to even get into the story because it's such a drag. Then you get grimdark fans that get pretentious about it. Claiming that because it's dark it's automatically more mature, and intellegent than other works. Sometimes it just comes off as edgy shlock that's trying too hard. Like films that try so hard to be high art, that they just fail to deliver. Or films that miss the mark, like Watchmen.

They touched on this already, but I wanted to try to phrase it in my own way. I like to call Jinx's portrayal "Insane, but not irrational." Jinx's reasoning may be based on a skewed perspective of the world, thus resulting in wrong conclusions, but there is clearly rational thoughts behind her plans.

@Tracker947

Жыл бұрын

Insanity has a way of turning the rational against you. Otherwise, it would be easy to deal with.

I appreciate that Red found her own theme in arcane and not just from watching the cascades of arcane analysis videos on KZread already. I've absorbed every one of Schnee's videos on arcane and every one of them adds another reason why this show is in a league of it's own (pun perhaps intended) from big things like the writing of good female and male characters to little things like the motif of smoking being a metaphor for power in the show. It's all just so wonderful and i was very happy to watch this detail diatribe and oggle at arcane all over again.

@cortneylane200

Жыл бұрын

Yes! Another person who watched Schnee :)

While watching Arcane I was literally thinking about the trope talks on tragedy and grimdark. The story feels like it plays out like a tragedy, with the notable absence of a clear protagonist and a fatal flaw. You could argue Jinx is the protagonist and that her deteriorating mental state is her fatal flaw, but first off that's really icky for mental health awareness purposes, and Jinx generally plays more the role of antagonist. You could even argue that her fatal flaw seals everyone's fate when she still calls herself Powder, and it's her desire to prove herself that is her flaw, but that sells everyone else short. Generally, it feels more like a tragedy played out on most fronts. Silco's flaw is his inability to let go of his ambition, Jayce's flaw is his recklessness causing more trouble than they cause, Mel's flaw is how she can't let go of her family's ways and values; and rather than one protagonist charging towards a tragic fate, unable to change their ways in time, it's many layers of tragic characters tripping each other up, and even those that learn from their mistake and/or grow as characters end up taking actions that seal the fate of the entire city. On the matter of Grimdark, I feel like the show doesn't count, but it nails the grim atmosphere. Almost every important character has redeeming qualities, and you'd love to see most of them get a good ending...but they won't. But even amidst the rapidly worsening situation, there are glimmers of hope. My favourite bit of the finale is a shot of Ekko and Heimerdinger discussing science. The implication is that Heimerdinger will learn to live more in the present to help people, and that Ekko will make the breakthrough that turns him from the leader of the firelights into the time-breaking hero we know from the game.

@singtothesilence

Жыл бұрын

The city is the tragic hero.

@gwen9939

Жыл бұрын

I feel like it's hard to talk about Arcane as fitting any kind of overall trope, really. Especially for greek tragedies that are the ones that deal mostly in fatal flaws, it's because they wanted to communicate some kind of hubris or undoing at one's own hands, deserved or not. Arcane doesn't really do that. It in a lot of ways has very humanist themes. It depicts a tragic character doing destructive things as a result of mental illness, but we were there from the start and understand the trauma and fragmentation her mind was subjected to at a very young age, and the symptoms of her mental illness being displayed as yearning for her sister and guilt over causing the death of her friends are shown as very sympathetic symptoms to the audience. These are very human emotions resulting from severe trauma, and us understanding that Powder was initially a very sensitive child helps us understand how mental illness can sometimes manifest from the perspective of the person suffering from it, instead of treating mental illness like some weird, alien thing that allistic people can't relate to as is often the case. And I feel like you can do the same for Arcane's other themes, like how it portrays oppression, poverty, the ruling class, revolution, the pursuit for progress that turns into a grab for power, fear of mortality... because it has very human characters central to each conflict there are less "these things happened like this because that's how these things usually go in fiction", and becomes better at portraying the strong social currents happening and the character motivations they end up inspiring. Also, this isn't me saying tropes are bad and Arcane is better for avoiding them(which I don't think it does btw), just that the respect and empathy shown for the characters helps the show avoid having to lean on tropes.

@natahliazaring5291

Жыл бұрын

If you wanted to use the lense of a "classic tragedy" to look at the show, you'd cast the "tragic hero" as the city and the fatal flaw as "the exploitative system otherwise known as capitalism." But yeah the fact that the show doesn't single out *a specific character* to be this is definitely to it's credit.

@MsFeyCreature

Жыл бұрын

I would say that Jinx' fatal flaw is her fear of abandonment. It pushes her into reckless action either to secure love and loyalty or to hurt people before they can hurt her. I mean the flaw is often something that isn't inherently monstrous, but just an example of human frailty and fallibility.

@Duiker36

Жыл бұрын

No, the show isn't grimdark. Grimdark *wallows* in its darkness and uses that bleakness to murder any sense of meaning. Whereas the show is painful rather than dark. It goes some dark places when Jinx is clearly a casual murderer, but that's it. It's not interested in indulging in that: it's shown and then it's not important. As for tragedy... yeah, this show is too complex to be a tragedy. More importantly, a tragedy requires the tragic hero to recognize all that they've lost after their fatal flaw been exploited; the writers had a season 2 in the wings and they knew it. I agree with @MsFeyCreature that Jinx's fatal flaw is actually her fear of abandonment. I would have phrased it as "disbelief that she can ever be loved", and if she cannot be loved, she'll settle for being feared. Vi's fatal flaw is her loyalty: mostly her loyalty to Jinx in the face of everything, but also her loyalty to Caitlyn. Jayce's fatal flaw is less his recklesness and more the thing behind it: naivete; Jayce is convinced that everything can be solved if you assert yourself strongly and directly, and every time he does this, he mostly fails forward. This is what makes him different from Vi. They're both straight-shooting punchy people, but Vi has your back, whereas Jayce puts himself out front. Jayce does better when he thinks things through, but Vi has *already* thought it through.

There is still apart of me that hopes that Arcane becomes it’s own thing

@AngryHomunculus

Жыл бұрын

I feel like it's already it's own thing by just existing, but I get what you mean; I play League, TFT and Legends of Runeterra, and anytime Vi shows up, I can't help but notice the complete disconnect between her characterisation in-game, and her characterisation in Arcane. For example one of Vi's in-game lines is "Vi stands for Violence", which is a far cry from her in-show me line "... And then a real monster showed up, and I wasn't there."

@chandra_creator

Жыл бұрын

it basically is, lots of people including myself who don't care about LoL at all (minus occasionally watching someone like tbskyen talk about the lore)

@charliericker274

Жыл бұрын

It is it's own thing, they are doing a season two at least.

@KingsBard

Жыл бұрын

​@@chandra_creator omg same

@uria3679

Жыл бұрын

@@charliericker274 I mean like separate from the game

Happy to hear Blues takes on the Class struggle/warfare themes of the series and I'd love to hear about the Architecture stuff. There's whole pieces to write about the complex ethics of Silco's liberation movement and the messy complexity there (drugs are bad and killing the Undercity but revolution resources doesn't come free and he lacks the voluntary support Vander commanded.)

@matthewmuir8884

Жыл бұрын

Another interesting facet of Silco's attempt at revolt is this: Silco and Vander both learned the hard way that direct conflict against Piltover will be a complete loss for Zaun. When Vander points this out in episode 3: "Even with your monsters, you won't beat Piltover", Silco says, "I don't need to beat them; I just need to _scare_ them." Silco's plan was essentially to use Shimmer for an elaborate bluff, and when Jayce offers a parley to discuss peace terms, Silco thinks Piltover's finally fallen for the bluff: that Jayce is offering peace because he's scared. But, as Jayce points out during the discussion, he isn't afraid because he's fallen for Silco's bluff; he's afraid because, as a result of his brief time in Zaun, he _sees right through it;_ he knows Zaun stands no chance and that Piltover's council couldn't care less about the damage that would be done to Zaun.

What's even better is the fact that Vander is almost certain to come back as Warwick, (basically a chemtech werewolf) and this theme can be explored even more with Vander as a monster actively trying to hurt the people he loves due to monster stuff I guess

I honestly feel bad for Jayce. You call him a himbo and he kind of is one but is also genius. He is just getting pulled in so many directions so fast he doesn’t know what to do. I mean the timeframe post time skip isn’t clear but at most maybe a month passes? My point is between suddenly running security of the city, playing politics as a newbie, keeping up his inventing, hoping his friend won’t die, starting a new relationship, stopping a rebellion, and worrying about his not sister that he is very busy. There is an old quote that fits Jayce to a tee. Sometimes there are decades in which nothing happens and sometimes there are weeks in which decades happen and this case every thread of the greater plot of those decades in weeks circles Jayce like a noose.

I noticed the same theme in Caitlin in the way she wanted to be a warrior and her mother wanted her to be a diplomat. They even try to sabotage her military career to take her out of the fight. That applies to the parent/child dynamic as well

@Duiker36

Жыл бұрын

Yup. I have a theory now that Mel's story was originally written for Caitlyn, but they realized the mom would work way better as a Noxus reference, so they created a new character for her. That's also why Caitlyn in Episode 1 is basically crushing on Jayce, but that goes nowhere and Jayce and Mel end up hooking up: it was supposed to be Caitlyn until they went in a different direction and focus for her. Caitlyn has a type: people who cut through the political bullshit her mom cares about.

I've never felt so vindicated with the confirmation that Jinx is Vi's sister. it was more than 5 years in the making for me. edit: just to add to the topic I just really love how the characters feel like real people. and the way it use and subvert tropes in a way that is really really well thought out. Red and Blue mentioned jinx and vi still being sisters, when a typical show would just go the easy way and make them enemies. With the jayce-mel-viktor polycule, you'd think, oh no they will split up and all that. or that one misunderstanding and their connections are split, but again like the title of this diatribe, the connections can't be severed. The scene with Mel and Jayce's night together, and Jayce leaving for Viktor, was already something unexpected. Mel actually forgiving and understading why Jayce had to leave her, like you see her lighten up and not become angry.

@matthewmuir8884

Жыл бұрын

How do you feel about the fact that Warwick the werewolf is Jinx and Vi's adoptive father? (Vander is Warwick)

@McJethroPovTee

Жыл бұрын

@@matthewmuir8884 i havent had an inkling but when I heard the line hound of the undercity, i immediately said. "warwick????"

@matthewmuir8884

Жыл бұрын

@@McJethroPovTee I see. I didn't pick up on that immediately since I've never played League of Legends, but the more I learned about Warwick and when I saw people saying that Vander is Warwick, I started noticing.

@yuricecconi561

Жыл бұрын

Are Jayce Mel and Viktor a polycule? I didn't really get a romantic vibe between Jayce and Viktor, and I don't think Mel and Viktor ever spoke a single line to one another. Is my gaydar is malfunctioning? I only got bro vibes between Viktor and Jayce. Like for example the scene where Jayce leaves the bed because something happened to Viktor, idk that just feels like something anyone would do if their bro was in mortal peril. I personally would do the same for my bro. I agree though that it is refreshing that Mel is understanding over Jayce leaving, rather than starting some kind of pointless feud for petty drama.

@McJethroPovTee

Жыл бұрын

@@yuricecconi561 the polycule was just a joke. tbh.

Honestly, the part where Silko and Jinx get together was what got me hooked on the show. Both of those characters had fantastic animation that conveyed so much, but I could not get over all the SIDE CHARACTERS watching their evil crime boss hug a little girl and look at each other wondering what the hell he is going to do... like, geez, the attention to detail was so impressive as well as the animation and acting.

@gokbay3057

Жыл бұрын

That moment is something I would love to see some more exploration of tbh. Like, not literally that moment but the aftermath. All these criminals having to become uncles/aunts/older siblings to this kid because their evil crime boss adopted her. Post-timeskip Jinx had mostly found her place and was butting heads with Sevika but I really wonder what her relationship was with Silco's crew early on. Would be darkly hilarious to me if these random criminals ended up being more accepting of Powder/Jinx than Mylo.

I am so hyped for this. Arcanes' depiction of sisterhood and what it means to be/have a daughter does the concepts justice in a way very few stories do.

And that's why Fiddlesticks' unique interaction with Jinx is "JINX! ALL YOUR FAULT! ALL YOUR FAULT!!"

@matthewmuir8884

Жыл бұрын

And if Swain collects Jinx's memories: "Faces, fading in the flames... it was all her fault".

Hextech and Shimmer both *literally* stem from unbreakable, painful loves. Jace, who fell in love with magic when it saved his mother. Sacrificed his education, his patronage, his best friend, to publicly declare himself devoted to this thing he loves. When he’s tried by the council for these illegal experiments, he has no concrete proof or application for his love. He’s definitely motivated by pride, but it’s not pride for what he’s accomplished so far (basically just Cool Theoretical Stuff) but pride that he is working to give more people access to this thing he loves (magic.) It’s why he and Viktor are so in conflict in the show about the success of Hextech: they love different aspects of the process. Jayce is in love with magic (and by extension, the controlled magic of Hextech) and sees the societal love of hextech, and its use as THE WIN. To Jayce, bringing literal Hextech to every individual is great, but he’s in love with the wonder of magic: not what it actually does. Viktor, however, doesn’t have inherent love for magic, or even hex tech. It’s why he feels uncomfortable going on stage to celebrate hextech during Progress Day. Viktor’s love is for seeing people made better by technology, and for seeing the ease and joy it can bring to their lives. As someone who had to INVENT a way to make himself mobile (through building accessibility devices as a kid) INVENT his own fun (since he couldn’t participate in other, highly mobile undercity activities) Viktor sees technology as a vector for human joy and opportunity. This is actually why seeing Rico the glowing lizard in pain from The Doctor’s attempts to save it so traumatic. Viktor learns that science, the source of all of his positive experiences, can also be used to create incredible pain. As such, Viktor seeing Hextech as being unrealized, unfinished. He’s not content with it being impactful: for Viktor it needs to tangibly improve quality of life to be successful. This is one of the reasons Viktor’s scene running along the water is so joyful. This is the first time in this mans life he has been able to run, but just as important; this is the first time he gets to see Hectech make someones life viscerally better. He’s running for himself, but he’s also running for all the kids in the undercity this technology will be able to help. In summary, Viktor and Jayce’s conflict stems from loving the same thing in different ways. Jayce loves what hextech is, while Viktor loves who it could help. When their split happens, it’s going to be because these loves and the deep feeling they have for each other become incompatible. [This comment has gotten insanely long, so going to keep shimmer briefer lol] Silco made shimmer because of love. I love him as a character because Silco’s primary motivation is basically “altruism at any cost” which is so freaking cool and I have never seen before. Silco could just rule the undercity as it is like the other chembarons. He clearly lives a nice life doing so, having access to every luxury the undercity can provide. However he risks instability, useful subordinates, resources and facilities to develop shimmer as a weapon to break the stranglehold the upper city has on the undercity. When he talks about shimmer, he never talks about improving his power: only of destroying the power of Piltover. Because Silco loves Zaun, and he believes that any means used to help the city escape its overlords are justified. Lastly, and with the least solid evidence, it’s implied that Singed (the doctor) began research on Rico, which lead to the creation of shimmer, because of his daughters disease. It’s not 100% confirmed, he just talks about how he once had a daughter while saving Jinx and ends up being able to save a girl close to death with the tech he developed. Anyways, just interesting that the major Mcguffins in the story are both literally created through unbreakable love.

"Don't play League Of Legends" I'm sorry guys, its far too late for me Also the Arcane fandom is so enthusiastic about the relationship between Cait and Vi that I sometimes forget how incredibly tragic the show actually is

@McJethroPovTee

Жыл бұрын

dont touch rank. coop vs ai is fine. aram is fine. if you dont care for ranks and hierarchies and all that, you dont need to play ranked.

@Duiker36

Жыл бұрын

Man, I miss playing Co-op vs AI for fun. One time, half our team disconnected and the AI was breaking down our inhibitors so I was like, "Hold the base," and soloed two inhibitors to save the game, because the AI isn't smart enough to deal with that kind of cheese. Never would've worked against real players, who would've just sent two people back to crush me.

@blackroses96

Жыл бұрын

@@Duiker36 Nowadays, you get people getting angry because of some "kill steal" while playing Co-op VS AI. On easy mode. On Wild Rift. Yes, this is a real thing that happened and I saw myself. Yes, I was disappointed.

I think there's something to really be said about how refreshing VI is the kinda defacto main character. Just imagine a show where Vi is also this schemey type that using more subterfuge methods, and suddenly the entire dynamic would just flop into a terrible slog. Her straightforwardness and candor to wear her heart on her sleeve makes her occupy this space as the only one to really get stuff done timely and effectively. In contrast, all the plots of the more secretive are hampered by things getting in the way. Silko has to keep the under city in line and maintain his relationships above as well, and Echo is basically running his gang there to foil Silkos plans, yet both have extreme difficulty with Jinx coming from the top rope with the explosive terrorism chair. Jayce starts off really straightforward too which leads to his and Victor's big invention, but comes to embrace Mel's way of doing things and both of them are so deep in over their heads that it only really gets resolved after Mel has a mother induced crisis of consciousness and finally says plainly "We need to stop sticking our fingers into the Zaun pie". Man this show is great. If LoL had half as much care put into it, I feel like the game wouldn't be regarded as the radioactive gatcha toxic waste spilling into the gulf of mexico it is.

37:32 I feel like it is worth noting why Warlord Medarda is *really* here. Her son got assassinated in Noxus. Mel is her only remaining child. While she's here to get weapons and it is the reason she claims to be here, it is to PROTECT both of them from Noxus. Her insistence on getting Piltover to do what she wants because it serves as a convenient excuse to be in a position to protect Mel.

I admire any show that is willing to commit to the bit of the Power of Love, because in any grounded context it should be, frankly, slightly horrifying. Love is at its core an escalation, and absolute love is escalation without end. Love is the way out of a hellish situation for so many of these people, but it remains the very thing that drags just as many back in.

Silco is the kind of guy to stand at the edge of a really tall bridge just feeling the wind like he’s about to jump then get scared shitless when he slips a little

Maybe the real trauma was the loved ones we lost along the way 😔💔

@balabanasireti

Жыл бұрын

Boring

@mm-kk6nt

Жыл бұрын

​@@balabanasireti fair

@Daelyah

Жыл бұрын

​@@balabanasireti Yo, but in execution, that's pretty much the jist of Arcane, and one of the biggest selling points of the show.

@mm-kk6nt

Жыл бұрын

@Daelyah I mean the idea IS boring, because it's been done before. It's the execution that really elevates it in my opinion

@Duiker36

Жыл бұрын

@@Daelyah The entire point of this video was that the trauma was the loved ones we didn't lose along the way.

I love the fact that from the very first scene it's established the relationship Jinx and Vi have and how Jinx already has mental issues, she do not cry seeing her parents dead, what hurts her is seeing her sister cry. It established that Jinx's only window toward the world is through Vi and when she's not there anymore things go very bad very quickly

"Break a hot lady out of prison and have a fun time with her, use my signature for it" That's the best summary of Jayce and Caitlyn I've ever seen lmao honest bro move

@Cybernaut551

Жыл бұрын

Shrek's plot in a nutshell.

One of the things that also helps this theme work is that the "villain" of the season was systemic issues, not just one singular person. Silco acted in that role plenty, but ultimately it was the system that created him that's the villain. And it's similar on the Piltover side - the council often fills the role of villain in the series, but it's not really any specific councilperson. And that allows characters to be meaningful and complex and not take the easy route because they don't need to be a cartoonish proxy of the system on their own. It's a real democratization of villainhood.

@Duiker36

Жыл бұрын

Fans put far, far, far too much weight on villains. It's not the fans' fault, but villains are basically easy-mode storytelling and it's really basic when a story has a clear hero and villain and most good stories are good *despite* that dynamic. Like, the worst part of Black Panther was easily "and then Killmonger went full-villain". Villains are really great in fairy-tale type stories, like the recent D&D movie, but they're terrible when you want nuance and deep exploration of anything human.

Red: The writing with the bonds of love is so dramatic and great Blue: We live in a society

Time for an hour of Red and Blue gushing about a show they like (or don't like) and I am here for it!

Thing about Jinxx's tea party is that Vi really can't accept who Jinxx has become. Vi may love her unconditionally, but she only ever sees Jinxx as Powder. Silco however, accepts Jinxx as Jinxx while loving her unconditionally. And Jinxx killed him. I think Jinxx embarrassing her second identity and rejecting Vi is Jinxx realizing that she would never receive true acceptance from her sister. Jinxx killed the only person who would accept her. At that moment, Jinxx clearly feels more alone than ever.

@ShadowSlith789

Жыл бұрын

jinxxxxxx

@crow457

Жыл бұрын

@@ShadowSlith789 jinxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

@j.f.fisher5318

6 ай бұрын

Loving someone with severe mental illness especially tending toward violence and self harm is _hard._ at the same time, Vi calling her sister Jinx is triggering her memories of the most shameful part of the worst day of her life. Vi should say, "you know what, I'm going to call you sister from now on" or something like that. But seriously Vi has been in front of a burst of Jinx's minigun fire. There's no neurophysiological way she isn't fully aware of _exactly_ what Jinx is - even if it terrifies her. But she's willing to walk into those flames to make it work. By contrast, Silco may love Jinx but ultimately he only accepts that part of her that is a monster because he loves monsters so much, and uses incredibly destructive and harmful manipulation to get her to conform to his expectations. Narratively though, Jinx is the MC so the rest of the characters are set up to benefit her character development. So she's faced with two people who love her, one for her innocent side, and one for her monstrous side.

The writing is so much dramatically better than the vast swath of other shows and it came out of nowhere

It can not be overstated, just how important the voice acting was to conveying all of this. It was immaculate, Powder's wailing cries when her bomb kills everybody were so chilling. Every VA pulled out all of the stops, the writing was fantastic, but the voice acting was transcendent.

I like that they don't just sidestep the issue that tear every other 3rd act "oh they're enemies now" pair apart. Misunderstanding? Talk it out. Horrible accident and years of festering anger? Never stop searching. Madness and diametric opposition? Try, despite it all. They take every reason to be torn apart and refuse, endlessly, they refuse to be torn away from eachother. But... In the end, they *ARE* enemies, they are opposed, and they will HATE.

"The hatred doesn't replace the love, it just makes it inescapably painful." summed it up, perfectly. I always see dynamics where the villain used to be a friend, or even a family member and because of how they act you get the sense that even before the villainy, the characters weren't that close/were always rivals or at least always on strained terms, (I.E Scar from Lion King) and that can work, but what happens in Arcane is just gut-punching drama throughout.

It’s worth noting that the kid that gets bodied during the raid is actually the child of one of the chem barons, the one that comes to Silco’s office with the smug bugger. She also tries to take down Zaun’s best chance at a worthwhile bargaining position out of revenge for the death of her loved one.

@landofthehazymist

Жыл бұрын

Dam rlly adds to “is there anything so undoing as a daughter”/the whole power of love thing

I adore jinx's writing so much. It's such an honest depiction of how trauma can magnify mental illness. And like red said -- Vi doesnt have to excuse her bad choices in order to love her.

I don't know if this parallel has been made before, but there's a similar look between Vander and Silco that Ekko has to Jinx. It's in episode three when the two men are fighting and Vander's eyes soften from what I remember, like Ekko does, when he sees how Silco is looking at him. I believe it goes with the theme since Vander can't stop seeing Silco as his brother, he can't breaking this bond even though he's hurt his kids

If you guys haven't watched it yet, you guys should definitely watch Bridging the Rift which is the documentary about making Arcane. It's really good and shows how much effort they put into the show.

Blue: I know everyone said they wanted that neoclassical architecture video but it did not do well so I won't do it again Also Blue: Imma put in just enough teasing about a detail diatribe about Arcane's architecture.

I would watch the architecture diatribe too, just FYI. Blue could absolutely start a "Fictional Architecture" series and I'd slurp it up.

@starboards

Жыл бұрын

I'd love one about Magic the Gatherings Ravnica block too

@wolfdragonotaku2827

Жыл бұрын

2018 She-ra architecture details

@puppyDawg128

Жыл бұрын

Oh 100%. The series that comes to mind for me is LotR- compare how homey the Shire feels to the oppression of Mordor, etc.!

Here's what is very interesting about that scene with Jinx and Ekko. What you said about her trying to kill him being a form of self-harm rings very true, but moreover, it is literally self-harm. She sustains way more damage than he does and almost dies. That scared expression of Powder... I think it might've been an attempt to end it all, even. She never explicitly displays any suicidal ideation, but... I dunno, I just go that feeling from that scene.

@SirEriol

9 ай бұрын

I don't think _she_ has enough perception of her self to have suicidal ideation. Neither Jinx nor Powder is entirely alive, Powder being a painful memory _she_ can ignore and Jinx being a lie that makes everything "easier". _She_ only thrives by avoiding the reality of her turmoil, and thinking about how much _she_ hates her life would mean having to choose. Bring Powder back and accept there's nothing that could fix this, or embrace Jinx and have nothing to live for? It's a choice she avoids until life's no longer asking. _She_ doesn't even choose in the end, her demeanor implies that Jinx is just what's left behind. It's almost like resignation to her fate. That moment with Ekko, the only one who's accepted she _is_ Jinx and still recognized Powder within her... I believe that's the only chance she ever gets to see herself as a whole, that somebody else recognizes her for who she is, and I do believe the grenade was an attempt to kill both herself and Ekko in one go. Almost like "I never stopped and asked myself if I wanted to die because I'd immediatly know the answer". And if she kills herself with Ekko, that would be resolution, right? She's ending everything she hates and loves within herself, accompanied by someone who hates and loves her in return. Powder wouldn't be alone, and Jinx would still go out with a bang. That smile is a very complex sort of understandment. Powder wants to go back. Jinx wants to leave everything behind. The two of them cannot have a genuine conversation. Neither of them want to be here. And _she_ is well aware of that. She just tries to ignore it for as long as she can, until she is unable to do so. [And given that her lore is being obssesed with bringing Vi down, it seems that nothing has changed. "How can Jinx and Powder coexist? Just mix their motivations, that'll solve eveeeerything"].

about the part where Jinx and Ekko are fighting and Jinx sets off the grenade, I've always read her expression in that moment to mean that she's seen that Ekko can still see her as Powder, he didn't hate her in that moment, she wasn't a monster, she was still his friend, and she decides that she is satisfied with that. She doesn't want to keep hurting and pushing away the people she cares about and for a brief moment she sees that someone she's hurt so much still cares about her and she decides that *that* is the thought she wants to die with, she decides that Ekko's expression when he sees her as Powder again is the last thing she wants to see. She sets off the grenade so that she can die as Powder and not Jinx.

Im not at all a league fan, cant stand it tbh. But when this show came out it felt like every youtuber i watched was talking about it I figured if im gonna have to put up with them talking about it week after week at that rate, i should watch it I was so blown away. What an intensely emotional experience Afterwards i felt the need to look up what happens to these characters and found out theres a cutscene in a league spinoff game where Vi and ajinx reconcile- its really small, just jinx bringing her doll to vi and vi says what are sisters for as they hug. Really small and simple I was SOBBING because i didnt realize how much i needed that. That catharsis that in the end they reconcile for even just a Moment destroyed me

Haven't watched this show, but the way these bonds of love are described here really reminds me of the way this trope plays out in Yakuza: Like A Dragon. The protagonist grows to hate the main villain for everything he's done, and yet... He's still his brother, and he can't stop loving him despite that hatred. He bends over backwards trying to reconnect with and redeem someone who really doesn't deserve it because the poor guy couldn't stand losing his only remaining family. It's part of the overarching theme that it's never too late to start over from the ground up, so long as you have people who still believe in you. It works really well because it brings up so many conflicting emotions.

Holy shit an ARCANE detail diatribe?!! YES! YESS!!! That’s insane!

Oh Arcane. Asking the question of "but would mortal enemies work better if they STILL loved each other, and their hatred for the fact that they do just made them even more bitter?" The answer yes, holy shit yes. I stopped playing lol like 8 years ago, but kept following related lore channels because their short stories and backstories honestly could get really interesting. Them branching out to other media has me both excited over cool stuff and filled with dread by the temptation to return.

I do think that the wizard that saved Jayce and his mom was Ryze, which is funny since the whole plan Ryze has is to lock away rune magic because of the tragedies that it caused, and to keep it from ever happening again. Jayce, on the other hand, only seems to see it through the childlike eyes of "This saved me, what other good could be done with it?". It all seems that, with the hextech cores, Jayce may have inadvertently made a new version of the same runes that Ryze has tried to lock away for good reason.