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15:04 "You might have been hurt but it doesn't mean we shift the truth to accommodate our hurt" - Even outside of the context in which it was said, that hit me right in the guts.

@The_Dream_Space

3 ай бұрын

Facts!!!

As a black 45 yr old divorced woman, my heart is filled with joy to hear the type of new age husband's that speak on this podcast ♥️ ❤️ 😊. There is hope

@The_Dream_Space

Ай бұрын

Indeed there is Thanks so much for watching :)

I am grateful to God that my parents have been married for 29 years +.and it always brings me joy that they are my first point of reference when it comes to being and staying married, it just humbles me

@The_Dream_Space

3 ай бұрын

That's dope hey... It's these kinds of stories that keep us going hey... Praise the Lord for your folks and we pray for more years together 🙏

2:45 already powerful. I often think that I'm crazy or political when I talk about representation. But to see people who look like you living out the faith is the most powerful thing ever. 🙌

@The_Dream_Space

3 ай бұрын

💯 Amen Moruti

Thank you very much for this podcast. It is so beautiful to watch black South African men being so vulnerable. So wise and insightful God bless you!

Wow...Big up Guys..Its so beautiful to see men discussing men stuff.

@The_Dream_Space

3 ай бұрын

It has to keep happening! Thanks so much for watching 🙏🏾

I think I agree missmpho. It is an over-generalization and simplistic to assume that apartheid is to blame for the breakdown because facts don’t bear that out. The Black family was actually stronger during Apartheid both in the cities, villages, and reserves. History teaches us that those who lived in the reserve working on farms before industrialization hit in South Africa, they used to live with their families on the farms (the vast majority). Zakes Mda wrote a lot on this and explored Black family life during that time. In the cities, the same thing was true. Biko and friends were not exceptions to the rule and the vast majority SASO students came from two-parent homes. We actually start to see the breakdown of the family in the late 1990s - after apartheid. The argument that it was apartheid that broke the black family structure is more an assumption not on facts. I see why some people who argue that assume the consequences of certain policies of Apartheid. There is a well-kept record of facts regarding the sociology of black life during Apartheid. I am open to chat about this. But the Apartheid has be a default way of thinking about our problems as blank people. It is more of a fallacy if anything.

@tsheporathiayabonservant9130

3 ай бұрын

Excuse the typos!

@torcheverblazing4594

3 ай бұрын

I disagree, I think the history of black family structure in this country cannot be spoken of without including the impact of Apartheid. Not to say that there weren't any good family structures in certain areas in the country (especially in self-sustaining rural settlements) but industrialization brought about the normalization and glamoirization of migrant labor, which is an oppressive strategy to break families down and you see it throughout history in how they many regime's used it. And it may seem as though the breakdown of family homes started in the 90's but that's just when the ROI started being noticeable. Migrant labor was the replacement of slavery, and came with the benefit of not having black families still remain together as men were seen as martyrs in attempts to dehumanize them or emasculate them. And they continued to breed and that quickly became a problem because in slavery breeding blacks were profitable but outside of slavery that would now prove to be a threat against the Apartheid regime. Removing black men from their homes for extended periods of time was very strategic and was a tried and tested war tactic which is a long term investment for the oppressor. And also, we don't blame Apartheid blindly, its not just an attack on black men (test it was in SA) but an attack on men in general, the devil cares not for color but for the distraction of the family structure the way God intended it to be. There is a global attack on men that i think we don't pay enough attention to... Men are ordained by God to be leaders of households, same way that if you mess up the parents you will mess up the children, of you mess with the man you mess with the whole family structure. Its easier to go for the men... But i digress as this is a very complex and highly spiritual issue that is multifaceted... Hope i made sense

@davidkobedi9615

3 ай бұрын

I like the ROI point because that is precisely what happened in the 1990s. Tshepo, I disagree with your stace, bro. But I'm too lazy to type stuff and give links to some research form Wits and UCT in various disciples that attest to this.

@The_Dream_Space

3 ай бұрын

Dope insights bafo!!! We are definitely going to pick this one up!!!

We appreciate you guys for this and a big shout out to your honesty

Such a great conversation brother!

@The_Dream_Space

3 ай бұрын

Thanks brother!!! This was certainly a dope one hey!!!

I love how you are so selective of your words.

I genuinely think we blame Apartheid WAY TOO MUCH. We are adults. We are aware of the consequences of our actions. You will find a fatherless person who knows the pain of the absence of the father well CONTRIBUTE AND CELEBRATE the practice of deadbeatism. 30 years AFTER APARTHEID we still blame it. I CANT WAIT FOR HUNGANI NDLOVU 🥰🥰🥰

@davidkobedi9615

3 ай бұрын

That's an interesting take because if you look at other countries in Africa, things are a bit different. Fathers are present. I do think migrant labor and the spacial planning and displacements of people had massive impact on the state of the family here in South Africa. But I'm interested to hear why you say we blame it too much.

@missmpho.

3 ай бұрын

@@davidkobedi9615 Yeah but They came back during December or holidays and were there (Or they should've...now making it their problem...not the planning). I am struggling to understand how apartheid impacted black men character of not taking care of their kids and wives specifically? After 30 years of freedom and our own personal experience how does one make a conclusion not to be there and not desire a family.

@torcheverblazing4594

3 ай бұрын

It took mor than 1 generation to change the behavior, it was very intentional. Its the art of war, the damage is generational, the behavior is passed down. The absence is learnt and not necessarily taught. We grew up seeing our mothers and not our fathers, and also it was not demonized, it was praised... The "coming home in December" became a badge of honor, it was more than justified it was encouraged, hound kids grew up wanting to be "maghayisa", they were groomed to be migrant laborers and obviously that means being absent from all other responsibilities in the home other than provision... Raising children moved from being the fathers role to being the mothers role.. So 3 generations later its now demonized to not be "there" for your children, but when i grew up a man who was present And in the home was not "working hard enough" and not being a good leader of his home, and i grew up aspiring to be a good leader, now the definitions a being corrected but the action/behavior is reflex, its a burning desire which was founded on "doing good", the narrative was to make migrant laborers to look like hero's so that the male children idolize them and grow up to wanna be like them (which in reality means you are aspiring to all the byproducts of this hero status, one of which is being absent, and relinquishing some of the most important God-ordained responsibilities as a Husband and Father... ) so even after seeing that this is not the way, finding your way back is not as simple as we make it, if it was, it wouldn't take generations to set it in motion, it needs way more prayer than debates if you ask me (and even that praying, men have outsourced that responsibility to women, which also needs to be fixed urgently)... debates will try make sense of spiritual things... The war is not against flesh and blood...

@missmpho.

3 ай бұрын

@@torcheverblazing4594 Yoh Thank you so much for explaining this so well. I now fully understand 🤎

@The_Dream_Space

3 ай бұрын

Definitely agree that every individual has capacity to make different, healthier and better decisions and they should be held accountable for that...And there is truth which we'll pick up in an episode, that we are not who we are apart from where we come from and that should be given room to be explored earnestly!

Don't gate keep share this page on your WhatsApp and WhatsApp groups

@The_Dream_Space

2 ай бұрын

please do!