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@sangay9361

5 жыл бұрын

Voices of the Past could you please give the source?

@sangay9361

5 жыл бұрын

raspoutin thanks

@LDuke-pc7kq

4 жыл бұрын

Pure history p**n😍 thank you! I love your channel! SPQR

@LDuke-pc7kq

4 жыл бұрын

Aslag 2nd wife of King Ragnar would be a great one

@o2golfconsistently

4 жыл бұрын

Thank you for sharing. This is excellent!

First couple of sentences: "if I've lost, I'm glad I lost to you" Man what a boss

@papayaman78

4 жыл бұрын

@Tracchofyre fakenews

@papayaman78

4 жыл бұрын

@Tracchofyre bruh. I remember so and so. And so and so told me. Im not saying youre lying but...

@Darkblender5

4 жыл бұрын

@@papayaman78 The way I understand it is that they didn't really just hang out, but Hannibal was part of King Antiochus III's court. Antiochus was ramping up for a possible war against Rome, and he wanted Hannibal around for advice. Scipio was sent to to the Seleucid Empire to act as an ambassador, so the two met in court and talked for a while.

@redcrown0694

4 жыл бұрын

10:30 and Scipio Africanus called BS to Hannibal’s Respect and Peace Deal. The Real Boss.

@sincybhoy1

4 жыл бұрын

Tracchofyre my arse

To these arguments, the Roman commander made the following reply : "Nuts!"

@lLIBER4TORl

3 жыл бұрын

R.u.s.e?

@ZacStoneProductions

2 жыл бұрын

@@lLIBER4TORl WW2. General Anthony C. McAuliffe's response to a German request of surrender

Wow Hannibal must have spent the last five years of the war just memorizing that speech.

@zarni000

4 жыл бұрын

not to mention Scipio and his interpreter must be some geniuses to memorize it in one hearing to pass it on to Livy......

@jckdnls9292

4 жыл бұрын

@@zarni000 they both had someone who typed really fast, like in the court rooms

@masterarthius8752

4 жыл бұрын

Or, due to the lack of information overflow, such critical onformation was more memorable.

@FingerinUrDaughter

4 жыл бұрын

@@masterarthius8752 "information overflow" back then was literally anything more complex then "plant da seeds" for most of the population. for soldiers it was anything more complex than "stand here and move a spear back and forth" and for generals it was anything more complex than simple chess, and most of them were shit at generaling too.

@masterarthius8752

4 жыл бұрын

Humans nowadays are dumber than our ancestors from 2200 years ago on average. Due to information shortage, absorbing new information was much easier and thinking was much clearer back them.

"Prepare for war, as you have been unable to endure peace." Those ancients knew how to turn a phrase.

"The greater a man's good fortune, the less he ought to count on it."

You Brits were born to narrate these ancient histories. Love this shit

@Arslan28933

4 жыл бұрын

@dank worm Oh no! No!

@daviddedominici1705

4 жыл бұрын

They do so much you'd almost think they'd been involved in it.

@taroman7100

4 жыл бұрын

The Romans were most impressed with the oratorical skills of the Celts. They promoted schools in Britain which overshadowed those in Greece.

4 жыл бұрын

@@taroman7100 really? source?

@zarni000

4 жыл бұрын

@@taroman7100 BS

Hannibal: I surrender Scipio: *no.*

@jba.9385

4 жыл бұрын

Can U don't

@polarbear1935

4 жыл бұрын

Lmao Scipio should have tried to accomplish what Hannibal did, not a chance and where was Scippy when Mr Barca was laying waste for 14 years?

@beo2t6

4 жыл бұрын

@@polarbear1935 kicking Carthage's ass out of Spain

@joeb6642

4 жыл бұрын

Would you not have said the same if you saw Hannibal do to your home what he did to his

@polarbear1935

4 жыл бұрын

@@beo2t6 o yeah that was their business after all they did ,what hipocrites lol. That was only a power play because Carthage was getting too powerful and Rome hates all strength in others

Hannibal: "Eyyyyyyy bro... listen we're not so different, are we? Come on mate, it's me your old friend, your buddy, your pal hannibal. I'm sure we can resolve this over a cup of tea, no? :)" Scipio: "nah"

@budibausto

4 жыл бұрын

Yeah, Romans were more into wine than tea.😅

@Skadi609

4 жыл бұрын

@Holden Mcgroine I don't think Hannibal invaded Rome. He stopped before.

@Fredreegz

4 жыл бұрын

This is a retelling of a conversation that occurred almost century before Livy was even born. And remember, this is Roman imagining of a meeting between a legendary hero and his legendary nemesis of Rome. Of course Livy was going to paint a scene of Hannibal basically grovelling at the magnificence of the Roman national hero who had beaten him. Take ancient history with a pinch more salt than they sprinkled on the ashes of Carthage.

@Kaeseman

4 жыл бұрын

@@Fredreegz nope, it's how it happened, I was there and when scipio was done with his speech everyone stood up and clapped.

@markdelgado7130

4 жыл бұрын

@Holden Mcgroine it's bullshit. No conversation took place. History is written by the victor

"It is easier to regret the past than to learn from it." +1

Jeez apparently Hannibal had a fully prepped speech ready to go for this talk

@joshf6666

4 жыл бұрын

I think at this point he knew that a semi-unfavorable peace would produce a far better result than continuing the war. Peace would have been a win for Carthage, not for Rome. I'm sure he spent quite some time considering how he could manipulate Scipio, who was fairly inexperienced but with many long-term political ambitions, into taking a safe triumph and switching his focus to solidifying his new position at the top of the Senate hierarchy. It's well-written too - however, in the end, the gambit failed.

@henrikandreason7261

4 жыл бұрын

@@joshf6666 Good assesment.

@mgway4661

4 жыл бұрын

This has definitely been embellished and dramatized by history

@TheHeavyModd

4 жыл бұрын

@Phillus Kissus "people had a good memory back then" lol that'd not true at all, their memory was the same as today's people. Maybe worse actually, since nowadays you need to learn much more large concepts and ideas even as a child at school

@dafuqmr13

4 жыл бұрын

@Phillus Kissus "people back then" "people nowdays" you sounds like a historian indeed, who played Assassins Creed, a 15 years old boy.

Please people, take this with a huge grain of salt, this is Livy, a ROMAN who lived 200 years after Zama.

@58LewisK

5 жыл бұрын

Ha. Salt

@ashraftarabishi831

5 жыл бұрын

I thought when i was listening to this that it sound like a bullshit💩💩💩

@richardmullins2534

5 жыл бұрын

Thanks for the heads up. I loath bs

@Artur_M.

5 жыл бұрын

Even if this is indeed a complete "bs" invented by Livy, it still tales us what he and by extension other Romans of his time thought about their history and long defeated great enemy.

@moviejose3249

5 жыл бұрын

Why not both Hannibal and Scipio were very well educated and each would of clearly remembered what they said on such a monumental occasion. Dont forget each lived on. The words of such great ones would of surely been remembered for 200 years. This was a monumental battle in the near history of those times.

i love reading Livy, his skill in literature makes everything so dramatic and puts things into perspective, its such a joy to listen to.

@matthew92604

2 жыл бұрын

Livy is the father of all youtube history videos. He even had the same knack for recreating/falsifying history to sound more appealing to the audience haha.

Tbf Hannibal is a master statesman, he has 20 years of experience from convincing tribes and boosting the morale of his multi-cultural and multi-lingual army + he had a high degree of education before the second punic war so it would be pancakes for him to make speech like this especially when the existence for the empire he protected his entire life is in stake

@stuka80

7 ай бұрын

How anyone can still put Napoleon over many such distinguished and brilliant generals is beyond me when you see how bad his tactics and strategies in the 2nd half of his career is. His way of war relied on brute force more than anything else which cost massive casualties and only succeeded due to the high quality of his army in training, experience and morale in comparison to his enemies, an advantage that dwindled as the wars dragged on. As Wellington noted in Waterloo when the French were relying on sheer brute strength rather than guile and subtleties; "he is nothing but a pounder" The man is so massively overrated by the youtube military enthusiasts its now ridiculous.

This entire conversation (while entertaining) is an invention of Livy. No one will ever know what those two men said to one another

@Xanixade

4 жыл бұрын

@nymersic We "just" don't "know". Because we disregard and ignore the fact that the Romans, back then, where unimaginably more cultured than today's greatest "historians". Looking back on Homer and how he successfully reproduced his works orally for years and years, barely forgetting any verses, we should surely disregard any kind of what a Roman culture meant back then for the sake of barbarisation and sacrilege of our human history. Just because our commercial culture says so.

@nohbuddy1

4 жыл бұрын

@@Xanixade What

@morgott13

4 жыл бұрын

@@Xanixade we also forget that rome was an empire built on trust. being a liar was looked down upon by roman society at large evidenced by the penalties for lying. most people don't understand that.

@Xanixade

4 жыл бұрын

@@morgott13 i dont really think so. They were very cruel and their council were too plotty, killing themselves over anything. Death was an easy thing and too few could get to get a hold of power. Their political games i dont think it compares to the ones today.

@morgott13

4 жыл бұрын

@@Xanixade you don't have to think about anything. the history of rome is recorded. we have contemporary sources

I love these voices of the past particularly this one. However, Livy the Roman ‘historian’ was born 143 years after this supposed conversation. It is very doubtful that any record of this conversation was kept. Like most ancient speeches or sayings, they are added to and embellished by later writers. It is perplexing that more people know Hannibal than know Scipio. Scipio was never defeated, conquered Carthaginian Hispania, routed Carthaginian armies right and left, took the Carthaginian capital of Carthago Nova In two days, whereas Hannibal traipsed up and down Italy for 16 years and never took Rome. Not sure who comes off the haughtiest--I think Hannibal since he has his back to the wall.

@TheRealOAFs

Жыл бұрын

Hanninbal didn't attack rome for reasons still not explained

@seraphx26

Жыл бұрын

@@TheRealOAFs Hannibal could not have taken Rome and he knew it on some level, Cannae is around 250 miles away from Rome, even if Hannibal force marched his army for ten days straight at 25 miles per day, his army would be in no shape to fight and the Romans would have held them off. Rome had strong walls and an adequate garrison with which to defend them, Hannibals greatest move was not directly attacking Rome.

@dinsel9691

Жыл бұрын

Scipio was defeated. Scipio was with the Roman army when they were surrounded by a smaller Carthaginian force and destroyed. This remains one of the few instances in human history where a numerically inferior force, surrounds and destroys a larger one.

@kingbearslug97

Жыл бұрын

@@seraphx26 Hannibal did march to Rome within close distance. However it took him two years and in that time Quintus Fabius Maximus Verrocusus “the delayer” was made dictator and strengthened Romes defenses. This made it impossible to mount a true siege. While Hannibal did struggle throughout Italy for 16 years, he did so with purpose. Attempting to cause city to city coups. He couldn’t have known every city would’ve been taken back so quickly. While I do think Scipio was a better general, I don’t think he was more audacious and committed. When compared to Hannibal’s crossing of the alps, sacking Saguntum, destroying at the Trebia in WINTER, massacring at Trassimine, and of course Canae. Zama wasn’t sure to be a Roman victory if not for Massanisa king of the Numidians.

@dentkort2046

11 ай бұрын

​@@dinsel9691He wasn't commanding that army and was like 17 years old.

the forgotten part is at the end Hannibal said "it matters not whether you defeat me or not, in the end you'll still have to live with the name Scipio, what happened, parents already had kids named Biffio and Scootero?"

I wish we still communicated like this.

@ZeRo-bx7lp

4 жыл бұрын

We never did. This was all made up. Not even kings or courtiers were that formal.

@yseson_

4 жыл бұрын

This a century later after thought

@danielchequer5842

4 жыл бұрын

We never did, actually it's part of the stereotype of "the great general", a man who not only is a strategic genius but also treats his enemies with deep respect and with the most elegant manners. This is a very romantic depiction of the scene, but honestly it's like we should think of it. If I have to choose between this and a boring speculation of their meeting, I prefer the beautiful lie rather than a lame speculative truth (wich still a lie btw)

@Cancoillotteman

4 жыл бұрын

@@danielchequer5842 I entirely agree with you ! We'll never know for sure what they said to each other. So long as every re-imagination of the scene is most likely faulse, why not believe in absence of proof the most elegant and/or epic depiction of an event ? When given the choice, I'll always chose greatness over mediocrity !

@sama847

3 жыл бұрын

Why? This way of speaking is extremely tiring

Livy was such a romantic. Amazing.

@conantheseptuagenarian3824

4 жыл бұрын

i love him.

@budibausto

4 жыл бұрын

Ave

@tHEdANKcRUSADER

4 жыл бұрын

Much agreed, people in the comments laugh at how this was written hundreds of years after the fact but, Livy conveys the gist of the matter from what he knew in only a way he could.

@niccolorichter1488

4 жыл бұрын

But you love Alexander the great ,or not ?

@bailey7095

4 жыл бұрын

It likely was a deep psychology break down of the conversation that would of happens. Which he determined from stories of the time. And seeing the traits of people around you.

Hannibal was absolutely one of the greatest generals of all time. Period.

@Karl_Degraa

2 жыл бұрын

Scipio was better.

@utubeisazzhoe1413

Жыл бұрын

@@Karl_Degraa Scipio beat Hannibal using his signature move. The one he defeated his father with.

@warlordpesco2081

Жыл бұрын

​@@utubeisazzhoe1413 scipio defeat hannibal with numidians and massinissa without massinissa no win for scipio

@gioilcreatore3547

11 ай бұрын

​@@Karl_Degraahe wasnt. He simply copied Hannibal tactical and used more fresher and Expert legions while Hannibal's army was either exausted or full of new recruits without experience. Anyway, Hannibal outsmarted him again by making Roman troops tired before the final Clash but schioio was very lucky that his cavalry came back at the right time from the chasing of Hannibal cavalry. You should study more tactical warfare before saying this

@danniton9831

4 ай бұрын

@@Karl_Degraa Just cause he won doesnt mean he was better. The one that was better was Fabius.

prepare for war, since you are unable to endure peace. dayummm

Thanks for making this video. Truly inspiring.

Livy implanted a recording device onto Scipio's person and then retrieved the device 200 years later to record the conversation on paper. Then he destroyed the recording device that he invented...before he was born. Is there anything a Roman historian can't do?

@darthscipio5289

5 жыл бұрын

+Ezemdi Anosike; Hell no, Cassius Dio was All where and All Knowing

@mykulpierce

4 жыл бұрын

Romans were great at propaganda

@mykulpierce

4 жыл бұрын

@Victor Kurske it's all about perspective And what values are seen as strong or weak for whatever audience the transcript is meant for. You might value peace, but Roman sense of Justice ought to be considered. Sarcasm likely not something they would value either in a man.

@mykulpierce

4 жыл бұрын

@Mark Mckeown pedigree doesn't garuntee objectivity

@bustarogers9990

4 жыл бұрын

@@mykulpierce so you don't believe anything about the history of our World Wars either then?. Actually yeah , that does make sense lol.

Both of these guys are legendary. Thanks for posting this!

Been looking for a description of this meeting for a long time, awesome, JUST AWESOME, A MILLION THANKS.

in my view, the whole exchange could be summarized to: Hannibal:"Still inexperienced in defeat, you young rascal may not understand that it takes a greater man to make peace than to wage war. Like your father did." Scipio: "That was a different time, besides, having already crossed over to Africa, we cannot return empty handed, you better inform your welcome committee."

Just finished the video and I was like: "Wait what? That's not a conversation... Hannibal was talking all the time!" So I did what seemed to be the only option left... I hit the replay button. PS.: Found it at 10:24 PPS.: Great video btw. PPPS.: Now that I watched it for the 2nd time it seems like you made it very clear! So no error on your end, but rather on mine... shame on me for not listening carefully.

I do find it hard to believe that these guys gave extremely long speeches to one another but I feel like this is an overall story created by the historian to capture the event.

Discovered this channel by accident last week & have probably seen 50 plus videos since - this has to be up there with the best,keep 'em coming brother

I've hit that Replay button several times, and it's way past bedtime here. 😎

These are wonderful. Thank you so much!

A really fantastic job! Very well done 👍 all the ancient maps were terrific. Absolutely brilliant work. Thank you so much.

This was phenomenal to listen too And im in the perfect mood, i just finished King Lear starring Anthony Hopkins. Epis performance's from the cast, and to jump straight into this, was to say the least an absolute joy. Truly, i can hardly wait for the next one.

@RichMitch

4 жыл бұрын

Scofield is the Lear

@616Haggard

4 жыл бұрын

The newest version of Macbeth starring Michael Fassbender is AWEEEESOMEEE. They leave out a few lines of the original play and they change the setting and timing of some scenes.. but on the whole the atmosphere is spot on. There's this blood-red theme going on. Fassbenders performance is emotional and impressive, to say the least. Not exactly 100% faithful to the original play, but in my opinion the changes are practical and don't detract from the enjoyment.

Hannibal was the Dan Marino of classical antiquity

@lucasskrobish2473

3 жыл бұрын

Stat king with zero rings

I've heard that the Romans greatly hated Hannibal, seeing him as the Hitler of their day. "Hannibal is at the gates" remained a phrase to denote a time of crisis or an impending disaster for centuries after the Punic wars.

@Jesus.purple

4 жыл бұрын

Ty good info♞♞♞♟♜💎

Great video please keep making these historical speeches and conversations can't find this quality anywhere else.

There are a handful of occasions in all of history when two of the all time greatest generals fought eachother. Waterloo, the duke of wellington vs napoleon. Operation barbarossa, guderain and manstein vs zhukov, operation torch rommel vs patton, and last but certainly not least, zama: scipio vs hannibal. I honestly believe scipio and hannibal are top 6 or top 8 generals of all time and better than any other mentioned general besides napoleon. So in many ways this is one of the greatest battles in all of history

@ethank.6602

4 жыл бұрын

How can you even compare them? Thats like comparing how good goldfish are at eating fush compared to sharks. They lived in completely different times with completely different technologies and circumstances, trained in completely different ways. All of these generals would lose to one another if the opposite were placed in the firsts playing field.

@mattpliska

4 жыл бұрын

@@ethank.6602 no that's a false equivalency. It is not like comparing goldfish and sharks ability to est fish. It's more like comparing goldfishes ability to eat other goldfish vs a sharks ability to eat another shark. It is easy to compare. Napoleon fought against people with similar technologies to himself, so did scipio and hannibal. Whoever had the most sucess in defeating the enemy is worthy of the highest praise, simple. It's all relative, we are comparing how they dealt with enemies who had similar capacity, we are not asking what would happen if napoleon time travelled to the second punic war

@hannibalbarca4140

4 жыл бұрын

Zhukov was like Grant..a general with unlimited resources and manpower vs a far superior general with dwindling manpower and exhausted resourced. Similarly, a better match would have been me with the army with which i confronted the Alps-or that which i brought to Cannae- and Scipio's army at Zama.

@mattpliska

4 жыл бұрын

@@hannibalbarca4140 you are a superior general to scipio in my book, but scipio was still very talented. Ilipa was a stunning victory. I agree mannstein was superior to zhukov. But given how the Soviets had squashed their numerical advantage up to that point, his sucess is admirable. Personally my top 5 is alexander, napoleon, khalid ibn Walid, julius caesar, hannibal.

@tyrian_baal

4 жыл бұрын

Hannibal Barca Grant knew how to win a war, Lee only knew how to fight one.

I love this video. Well done Pete, well done.

Wonderful watching your styles develop sir - and you were already very good - I hope you had a nice holiday - very glad you're back

Great video, it's amazing that this most important chat between Hannibal and Scipio has been recorded, the Romans hated Hannibal and the cartigininians with a vengeance, most of Scipio's soldiers had their fathers killed in battle at the hands of Hannibal 15 years esrlier, and the Romans showed no mercy...

Beautifully Read ... Really brought that meeting of giants to life

Fantastic video ! Well done !👍👍

The power in those words is chilling. Furthermore this was history and not fiction. This was a pleasure to listen to and for just a moment a trip into the past. Thanks 🙏

Fabulous information, very cool man.

Thanks a lot my lovely teacher, you've done a great job. I like the history of hannibal. Please keep on going, i like your work. God bless you.

Hannibal: Talkety-talk-talk... Scipio: You blew it!

Brilliant text, humanizing reading. This channel shares diamonds.

Fantastic narration! Thank you so much!

@VoicesofthePast

4 жыл бұрын

Thanks! There's plenty more!

@ulfnowotny01

4 жыл бұрын

@@VoicesofthePast I'm slowly working my way through all of your material. It's exceptionally good!

Yeah scipio, rub it in like salt on Carthage soil.

@joseph-medicis

5 жыл бұрын

@Maxine Caulfield didn't say Scipio doe

@UrbanCohort

4 жыл бұрын

Too soon...

@OfficialSpyderr

4 жыл бұрын

@Holden Mcgroine He ended a war. Caesar killed hundreds of thousands of gauls, if not more and enslaved millions and burnt communities to ash, won the civil war and basically destroyed to republic because he wisely knew that the republic was dying, so by getting himself named dictator for life he set the foundations for ovtavian to be the first emperor, which prolonged to roman civilisation for another thousand years. Not exactly hard to understand why one is extremely famous and the other, not so much

@OfficialSpyderr

4 жыл бұрын

@thomas samson Aye. They have become so involved in society they never will wash out even if it is needed

@simonpeter5032

4 жыл бұрын

@@UrbanCohort _Carthago del est_

I for one am incredibly impressed by their ability to memorize the entire speech in a time before audio recordings.

What an extraordinary channel. Kudos.

This channel is brilliantly original.

Absolutely awesome video loved it👍😎👍🦍

Fascinating to see the difference personality and attitude which Livy gives to Scipio and Hannibal.

The respect between these legendary warriors is wonderful. You can tell Scipio has the pride of Rome, same with Hannibal and Carthage.

"If you are weak in crisis, you are weak indeed." +1

Amazing!!!

Scipio: "Boss mode: Activated".

Great job.

What's crazy is that both of these men would have incredibly similar ends to their lives. Two of the best military geniuses of their days, Scipio a brilliant patient strategist, and Hannibal a master of brutal tactics, both discarded by their politicians at home.

This is what should have been said. The Victor is the one who wins the last battle and not the many that went before it. Historians have said that the ancient Romans were like ants fighting against an Elephant. The Elephant can kill thousands but thousands more replaced them and their constant stings and tearing with their claws will always win the day. But there was another reason. Scipio played the Strategic and not a Tactics game. First his Roman Army went to Spain and reconquered it from the Carthaginians, depriving Carthage of their valuable recruiting ground for their needed infantry. Then he traveled to North Africa and made a deal with the Numidians depriving Hannibal of the world's best cavalry that he had depended upon for his many victories. Well trained cavalry was always a weak point for the Romans but not anymore. The Romans destroyed Hannibal's brother and his relief force that was supposed to help Hann Finally, Hannibal had to leave Italy without his veteran Army that had won him so many of his previous victories. Hannibal had won so many victories but could never win the possession of Rome itself as he had no expertise in siege warfare.

amazing just amazing!!!

Had to look up Titus Livus, thanks

Respect to Cornelius Skipio Africanus and the Great Hannibal I'm glad this great men meet each other face to face to square things up no matter the outcome of the battle. Greetings from Albania former Illirya.

Well Done!

@VoicesofthePast

4 жыл бұрын

Thanks!

I am a late comer to this video, but I really enjoyed it. Scipio: "...prepare for war, as you have been unable to endure peace." That's just such an awesome line! This is, of course, Livy's retelling of something that happened long before he was born, but it sure was a good retelling.

I thought the title said “Hannibal meets shapiro” LOL

@FakeSugarVillain

4 жыл бұрын

Ben shapiro invades Cartago with facts and arguments

@FakeSugarVillain

4 жыл бұрын

@Holden Mcgroine Yeah I was really surprised when Scipio straight out said "Hey Hannibal, you know, hiphop isn't real music"

@vincenzobarone9080

4 жыл бұрын

I thought the title said "Hannibal eats Scipio"

@DISTurbedwaffle918

4 жыл бұрын

Shapiro to Hannibal: "okay, suppose you are not a Roman. That would make you a barbarian. And suppose you were from Carthage. That would make you unwashed and uneducated. So you're an unwashed, uneducated barbarian, correct? Now, suppose Cato the Elder is screaming 'CARTHAGO DELENDA EST' in his night terrors; this would terrify and concern the peaceful citizens of Rome. The source of these night terrors is Carthage, so to end this disturbance of the peace, it is only logical that we burn Carthage to the ground and salt the Earth, yes?"

@TerrariaGolem

4 жыл бұрын

@@DISTurbedwaffle918 Shapiro using logic is entertainment, because his logic is so alien & exactly what a Koch Brother wannabe & elitist lover would perpetuate. My favorite Shapiro quote in a paraphrased nut shell: "If the coasts flood, just sell your homes" Aquaman: "it's free real estate." Shapiro : "Taxation is theft & Socialism is evil & lazy." Also Shapiro: "Subsidies are good." Me: "bruh. Subsidies rely on taxation of hard working people, also subsidies are what edges around the illusion of socialism = evil, subsidies are just corporate welfare checks, whenever corporation executives get more lazy and entitled than they already are, they send lobbyists, to cut humanitarian welfare & increase greed welfare." Also, Shapiro is hilariously emotional. His logic flow shows less objective thought & more emotional / personal desire. He's smart, I assume, yet makes insane claims often. Its fascinating thar conservatives like Shapiro, Tomu Lahren, Dave Rubin & Candice Owens all run from the challenge of debating progressives like Sam Seder & Kyle Kulinski. Conservatives prefer easy prey, like college students brain scrubbed by pop culture & neoliberals. While in my view, progressives can run circles around thr conservative paragons. *My best friends are conservative, yet they have more intuition to use logic, philosophy, psychology, & other highminded reasoning when I debate with them. Sadly, the paragons of the conservative internet (or at least the ones who are most popular) don't seem in tow with my friends, who actually agree Shapiros a meme.* At the end of the day, Shapiro is a meme. At least Kyle Kulinski, co-founded The Justice Democrats, a revolutionary movement. (Btw, I'm not a democrat, I typically vote Independent as that's what I was before 2020, unless we get a golden goose like Bernie Sanders)

Hannibal: my bad about invading all your lands and for trying to with you off the face off the earth please don't try to do the same to me.

well done!

♥️ I'm reading and writing about it

@VoicesofthePast

4 жыл бұрын

Cracking!

Have you considered doing theese as podcasts on spotify? I'd love to hear them there

Damn, Scipio is a badass

Probably would be more labor intensive but it sure would be helpful if you had the letter transcribed in English on the Chiron below screen. Greatly enjoy your channel!👏🤗👍

scipio only get the moniker of Africanus after defeating Hannibal.

Scipio: “Veni vidi vici, Ingrata patria, ne ossa quidem habebis!”

I was born in a city ( bulla regia 0:20 / one of most prosperous cities during the punic ira ) and too close to Zama ,then I moved to carthage and now living there , this video is giving chills 😍..

Hannibal, after almost two decades of terrorizing and destroying Italy in a war he started by doing the same unprovoked to Saguntum, tries to weasel his way out of fighting at home and assert how reasonable he is for seeking peace. Scipio's answer, after losing and taking back everything: "Fuck you. Square up."

@TrajanAugustus

4 жыл бұрын

This is often conveniently ignored by Hannibal stans, and I've legitimately seen him being described as a "freedom fighter".

@anirudh177

2 жыл бұрын

@@TrajanAugustus I mean Hannibal was being smart, thanks to the Carthaginian nobles/elders fucking up and not supporting him, plus him failing to use his victories properly led him to a disadvantageous position, so he decided to try to bargain for peace, cause he knew he was in a position where he had a high chance of losing and losing meant Carthage loses, but you can't just plead for peace or just straight up ask for it, cause you know people would see you as cowardly and it would be shameful for him and the Carthaginians, so he has to justify him seeking peace in such a way that it looks like it is reasonable and to avoid shame.

@anirudh177

2 жыл бұрын

@@TrajanAugustus freedom fighter? freedom from whom?

Brilliance

History is fascinating

“Do my War Elephant make me look fat?” -Hannibal

Came here after reading scipio to hannibal manga it's awesome ❤️❤️

Hannibal: GG bro Scipio: you are a remarkable apponent !

Interesting Roman account of the encounter, I read in Wikipedia that Hannibal's family explained to Hannibal to never trust Rome or Romans and that Hannibal despised his Roman opponents. So that it's interesting Hannibal sounds conciliatory and not surprisingly Scipio sounds ambitious and aggressive as any younger military leader might. Trajan for example demonstrated that Romans were all about conquest and materialism for lack of a better term, Dacia had a lot of gold and Trajan took all he could. Also slavery and acquiring slaves were definitely an incentive for not concluding peace with anyone much less Hannibal. BTW awesome that you guys make audio readings of these primary sources! Thanks!

@thebrocialist8300

5 жыл бұрын

No great leader would hold such an absolute (devoid of nuance) view of his enemies. That’s infantile dogshit.

@andrewlange7820

4 жыл бұрын

Matt Kyle your claim that Trajan was no more than a warmonger is a clear lack of knowledge of the subject and ignorance of history. Roman culture and economics relied on its conquests to bring great riches into the empire. Trajan’s invasion of Dacia was no different than Claudius and Britain and Caesar and Gaul, it stimulated the Roman Empire with new gold, land, and slaves which it had not experienced for years. He really ushered in the golden age of the Nervan-Antonine dynasty and was regarded as high as the great Augustus when it came to princeps.

There was definitely a conversation between Hannibal Barca and Scipio Africanus but it wouldn’t of lasted 14 minutes between them perhaps merely a couple minutes and maybe conversation happened the day before battle of Zama. Livy is writing many years after it happened getting his information from good sources but it definitely played out in a different way.

I can't wait for part 2 so I can find out what happens :D

So Livy's full name was Titus Livius? Is that a Liturgical Latin spelling though, or perhaps the Modern Latin? Or is it the English translation of his full name? Would it be Titvs Livivs in Classical Latin?

That was intense

So epic

Ended up here after watching Overly Sarcastic Production's history of of Rome

Someone take away the mic. away from Hannibal!!! GOD DAMN !!! He's teasing the enemy that has a knife to his throat! His speech is fascinating... but humility would of served him better :(

"Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on . . . er ah, fool me twice, shame on . . . ." Well anyhow . . . "My favorite book is 'Green Eggs n Ham." W Bush.

How do we know what was said during the meeting between the two of them? Because that would mean there was a person there recording word for word. Did that happen?

Assuming that this is the gist of how the conversation went, I think Scipio did well to call Hannibal's bluff. Hannibal's argument seemed to mostly revolve around fear mongering. It basically goes into the: "What if you fail?" It plays right into a person's loss aversion. Scipio stood on the ground of justice and legality. Sure, the conquest of Carthage led to a massacre, destruction of many Ancient artifacts, a bloated Roman Republic which quickly degenerated into a dog fight for prominence, devolving Rome into first a de facto empire, then, from Domitian onwards, a shameless all out empire, that crumbled a few centuries later in the West, and almost 1000 years later in the East, a fall so great it can still be felt today.

Going to be honest, thought I clicked on an episode of Yu-Gi-Oh at the start.

@0bradymadness0

4 жыл бұрын

Darien Absolutely underrated comment!

@lLIBER4TORl

3 жыл бұрын

...move, your move, your move, YOUR MOVE! YUUUUGGIIIIOH

This convo sooooo didn't happen

@ridethetiger9092

5 жыл бұрын

Sounds like Roman propaganda to me. Some scholars doubt if the Battle Of Zama even took place.

@3aZM

5 жыл бұрын

Africa was not the name of Africa at that time.

@3aZM

5 жыл бұрын

@Quodlibeta It is a Roman word, Hannibal would not call his land a name other than Carthage : www.sahistory.org.za/article/africa-whats-name

@k9px

5 жыл бұрын

its not that out of the ordinary... so i don't know what you find so unbelievable. It might be a little flourished but I have no doubt that each of them would prepare something beforehand.

@villiestephanov984

5 жыл бұрын

Like hell it did

The final showdown between two OP characters

Hannibal realized that whatever he said at that point in time would go down in the history books for all posterity. He was a great man and wanted to give a speech befitting his position.

hannibal: please dont wrek my shit

ONE THING. In the description of the video, it is written that the Roman Empire had 17 years of War(Punic). Shouldn't it be Roman Republic?

@sebastiansilverfox6912

5 жыл бұрын

Technically, both are modern assignments to distinguish what we percieve as seperate entities. The reality is far more convoluted. Augustus did not see himself as ushering in a totally new system, nor did Romans see it as entirely different per se. The opening chapters of Adrian Goldsworthy's Augustus explains this rather well and I recommend it (along with several other books by him)

@TheFIZZ486

5 жыл бұрын

@@sebastiansilverfox6912 yeah, I know about the principate and such. But if it's not a mistake, then great.

@ChevyChase301

5 жыл бұрын

Mantvydas T the late Roman republic resembled an empire more than most nations who claim the title

Scipio: You See, kneeling is going to be a problem...