This is great stuff, thanks. Also reading the comments is quite illuminating. The choices here are more subtle than I thought! I have had a lot of back pain in a certain spot and my chiropractor advised me not to do any lat pull downs or overhead exercises at all, as he said I was putting my spine or muscles out of alignment (something to that effect). But totally cutting out overhead exercises seems to me like i would be missing out on a lot..... hopefully attempting methods or strategies like the one you suggest here could help me? Sure hope so. Let me know if you have any further thoughts on it. Thanks and your channel deserves more recognition.

@dr.joelseedman

5 жыл бұрын

Thank you so much my friend I really appreciate the very kind words. Yes I totally agree. Proper overhead movements with correct technique will typically help back pain and shoulder pain so definitely give it a try and let me know if you have any questions. Thanks again

I noticed that you don't start nor end in a dead-hang position, neither straightening out entirely vertically, nor allowing your shoulders to raise. I assume both of these choices are to avoid the joints (tendons, ligaments, and other soft tissue) from getting the brunt of the load. Am I correct in this assessment?

@dr.joelseedman

8 жыл бұрын

+boxerfencer exactly, the goal is to fully extend at the top without letting the shoulders and scapula get pulled out of position which would place too much tension on the tendons, ligaments and soft tissue as you mentioned. Great observations.

I can get behind the idea of keeping the shoulder packed during a pulling motion for the safety of the soft tissue, etc. But does this logic also apply to all pushing movement? Especially during overhead pressing. A lot of people advocate actively shrugging as you press to lockout overhead in order to avoid shoulder impingement. By this logic, keeping the shoulders packed at the bottom of the pull-up would also cause impingement?

@dr.joelseedman

8 жыл бұрын

Funny thing you should ask I actually don't agree with the cue to shrug at the top of the overhead press at it causes excessive elevation. In fact you should still have slight depression while fully extended overhead. I've seen this numerous times in athletes who can't fully lock out or finish in a proper overhead position. Once you teach them how to keep the shoulders packed even when fully overhead it completely unlocks their movement and allows them to hit that top slot position with ease. However, the packing and depression of the scapula will not be as extreme as when the athlete is at the bottom of the press. Hope this helps. Thanks

I've done the pull-downs the way you suggest and I got more trap and rhomboid development than lat or teres major than I want. Since then, I've looked into hollow body, tried it and I personally think it's probably the way to go for my desired ends (a V taper). It certainly feels different and I've had to lighten the load, quite a bit. A note on the pulling flared elbows behind the back. The lats don't work past the line of the body, but the rear delts do, as I expect do the long head of the triceps and other muscles, so why not use it as a variation for those ends?

@dr.joelseedman

8 жыл бұрын

+boxerfencer I see where you're coming from. The method I suggest is the most biomechanically sound on the joints and the safest position as it optimally centrates the shoulder joint. Sounds like you're having good success targeting your lats though so keep up the good work. Thanks

@boxerfencer

8 жыл бұрын

+Dr. Joel Seedman "pulling flared elbows behind the back". and "The method I suggest is the most biomechanically sound on the joints and the safest position as it optimally centrates the shoulder joint.". Yeah, I can see that, because the flared elbow style (obviously leaning back a bit so the pull-down looks like an incline press with slightly flared elbows) irritates my bum shoulder sometimes, when not warming up properly; although prone rowing with flared elbows, for rear delt and/or upper back, doesn't. I think I've fallen on my right shoulder one too many times ;)

Dr. Seedman, I was reading the article on T Nation and I couldn't understand the explanation of point 3 "Point the elbows straight ahead" .. does it mean starting with elbow in front of you? like an barbell overhead press? .. or does it man putting elbow to sides? .. I find that elbow position is relative to grip width, shoulder width will keep elbow in front, and wider will get elbows to the side. I think this variation looks like "sternum pull ups" or "perfect pull-ups". btw, will the grip width (with elbow in front) change the activation or the lats? .. I had done sternum pull up for a while and I always feel the lower portion of the lat activates, as well as the teres major or the upper lat, same area so I'm not sure actually. .. well after watching the video twice, I think the article needs a little edit on point 3.

@dr.joelseedman

5 жыл бұрын

Yep great question, so the elbows need to go to the front sides. It's not one or the other but a combo of both. However, so many folks let the elbows flare so extreme when doing pulldowns that you almost have to just focus on keeping them forward at first to eliminate the bad habit but in reality it's front side regardless of grip width (although there will be some subtle differences). Hope that helps.

@intelone814

5 жыл бұрын

@@dr.joelseedman thanks Doc, appreciate the reply ^^ .. these are less taxing on the shoulder and I can feel my lats and traps way more at the end of the ROM.

@dr.joelseedman

5 жыл бұрын

Excellent glad to hear it!!!