Doing the silliest, most wasteful combo is some of the reasons I’ve been able to stick with some fighting games

@TheKazuma410P

Жыл бұрын

Of course, you need to manage mental health bars.

@the_bromies_podcast239

Жыл бұрын

me and some buddies who played fighterZ would just never tech and let blue combos rock it could get wild

@0ni664

Жыл бұрын

Me when I do Azrael 5a>5a>5a>..... in the corner when they get hit with big boot

@kef0205

Жыл бұрын

Pulling off three supers in a row in SF Ex +alpha was euphoric when I was 10. The satisfaction of that would indicate to me that combo expression is 100% a thing.

@mrhbombman

Жыл бұрын

Me trying to doing FAZZ Sumo combos in Gundam MBON

"If your opponent is of choleric temper, seek to irritate him, with suboptimal combos that include annoying animations." -Sun Tzu kinda

@Bfire0

Жыл бұрын

This is every platinum players mantra

@lawlznet

Жыл бұрын

trip up the enemy by appearing less competent than you actually are. the rage is delicious though

@nailwind

Жыл бұрын

Seek the combos with the most amount of annoying voice clips.

@DayFul

Жыл бұрын

Long drawn out combos are the way to go especially if it's just one move.

@Stryfe52

Жыл бұрын

@@DayFul Hell yeah! Sun Tzu wasn’t the kinda guy to sugarcoat things…

Sometimes it's as simple as "This move looks sick, imma use it EVERYWHERE"

@joedatius

Жыл бұрын

It's why i miss Riot Kick. I really hate how much moves was gutted out for Strive just for the sake of "streamlining" the movelist. I don't give a shit about what's optimal i want to do cool stuff like have a real install super.

I tell people all the time: the only correct way to play is whichever path leads to the outcome you want. And that can encompass so many different playstyles, so it's always important to have as much knowledge as possible so that you can execute on the path you want when it presents itself.

My main game is +R. I swear in that game, nobody does the same combos for the same character. Sometimes I can tell you who is playing depending on what they're doing combo wise, even, without seeing the names.

@Lowtendo

Жыл бұрын

This is why my main game is Melee, every combo is open ended or a mixup. Basically anything past the 4th hit goes custom.

@sirwilczek1813

Жыл бұрын

@@Lowtendo Isnt this because Smash has DI n shit though? And then Melee has even more crazy stupid defensive options mid-combo like slide-off etc?

@masterdoge7219

Жыл бұрын

AC goes crazy with expression. I remember noticing this while watching Machaboo, Ain and Roz play Ky. While all of them were really good, none of them played the character the same way. Same for Satou, Omitto and Jonnio on Johnny or En, Hase and Tanabata on Slayer for example. Each player had a very unique style and this was one of the major things that drew me into the game back then.

@Lowtendo

Жыл бұрын

@@sirwilczek1813 DI isn't as useful in the other games, that's what sets melee apart. DI, SDI, ASDI, slide-offs, and tech choices are all mid combo defensive options. That's why you'll never see melee in a Will It Kill, because technically all combos are escapable.

@wednesday122

Жыл бұрын

@@LowtendoI’m sorry you had to hear this from me, but melee has been in will it kill. Like, twice.

someone once said to me that arcsys hokuto no ken "is what people who don't play fighting games think fighting games are like" and it has stuck with me

@syrelian

Жыл бұрын

Fuuuuuuck they're not wrong, they think people just Enter The Blender and there is No Escape I think getting into FGs also has a habit of matchmaking at the extremes being really rough, so if you just futz with Ryu in training for 10 minutes and then jump online, you're gonna get given some mix-up and oki and feel like you just Did Not Have A Visible Option, there's not really a good solution to this in terms of matchmaking(extreme ends of ranking scores are always super erratic) and not a ton in terms of game design, its really hard to organically confer the info about how to handle mix-ups all at once, you can express How You Lost but How To Not Lose is not as easy, and sometimes its just shit like Urien Aegis stuff I love FGs but they can be opaque in some really hard to resolve ways which make that mindset more common

@DerpyPloo

11 ай бұрын

@@syrelian Yeah, visual and feeling feedback is kinda not there, though they're getting better, with games having big counter hit (or punish counter) hitstop and visual effects, things to show you've been crossed up or blocked the wrong height, but things like, when is my blockstun done, or when do I get off the floor, kinda have to be learnt (to a degree), and just need repetition, which, to get on a basic level, can be annoying.

combo expression only happens on the game I like

As an MBTL scrub playing Aoko, I was feeling myself mid-game and went for her optimal midscreen combo (the 22A after 2C one) and hit it successfully. Some guy who was way better than either of us playing was spectating and said "I see you" in the text chat and it made my night. I never go for it in games anymore because I can hardly do it in training mode, but that was a huge moment for me in that game and something that fuels my desire to play even weeks later.

@foxof42

Жыл бұрын

I know what combo you’re talking about and it’s sick

You hit the nail on the head exactly with the point about not being able to make the right decision every single time. People always go "oh this is solved" or "this is optimal" you're still never gonna be able to do it 100% of the time (even pros don't do it 100% of the time) and thats what separates people from being an amazing player to being the best is consistency.

Doing a combo that makes you or your opponent got "why did that work? Why?" is basically one of the best parts of fighting games. That, and out-thinking your opponent. Going "no, don't do that" just before they do that and then making them pay for it is just the best.

Someday I'll be the main character of FGC Twitter by posting something really fuckin stupid I just gotta believe

@AMnotQ

Жыл бұрын

Just start downplaying Sol. Easy W

Crazy how this all started from one horrible take. I'm so proud of this community.

@Its_Casual_

Жыл бұрын

We are a tightly knit community, shit gets around

@brunop.8745

Жыл бұрын

"hmm today i will post something controversial and then turn replies off"

ik this is about trad fighters but in platform fighters, combo expression is important to having a powerful or interesting combo game; you will make reads on di and defensive options mid string to keep a string going and thats why i love platform fighters

@Aregulargameplayer

Жыл бұрын

I remember when Toph was playing a random net play Fox and went.... wait a minute, is this Leffen? This feels like Leffen and it totally was.

My favorite part of the thread was when someone brought up Skullgirls and the dude was just like “ok yeah I concede, that’s real”

It's always 1 dude who tweets something wild and then runs away after causing a mess. People focus too much on the concept of "optimization" when in fact all times you need to adapt to situations. Combo expression is very important in fighting games especially when weird things happen.

I get laughed at for not knowing optimal combos, but then I land the goofiest and most insulting reset into that same combo

My main game is Tekken. And in Tekken, combos give you a lot of time to think about what you want to do and make choices while doing the combo. Because of this, when I play 2D games I tend to use combos that are a bit lower in damage but gives me time to make my decisions as I'm doing the combo. They are usually a bit lower in damage but I make sure they are consistent and have choices near the end of them so that I can choose what I want the combo to do by the end. Due to this, I ignore a lot of different more optimal combo routes that require being able to hit confirm early.

@syrelian

Жыл бұрын

Good Oki and spacing is worth a hell of a lot more than removing another 5% HP with some sickass flips, after a point, combo optimization becomes a Win More, if I kill you in three solid interactions, it doesn't matter if I do 35, 40, or 45%, its still three interactions, obviously in an actual match things get more nuanced with chip and fireball hits and unconfirmed pokes and stuff, but there's a deep depth of "Optimizing meterless/low meter BnBs" that is of significantly lower value than just improving your interaction game Basic combo grasp is necessary because it reduces the interactions you have to win to... Win, but its not the end-all-be-all of FGs

@toasteredxd9083

Жыл бұрын

hehe jin hellsweep b2,1 rage art

I'll be honest, I had this mindset for a while, too, but you pretty much hit the nail on the head. Imagine saying every single player is going to only play one top character after the meta develops - that just never happens, people still pick their favorites or just some character they feel fits their playstyle better. Why would that be any different with combos? Things like these are a great source of motivation: you don't ever have to do things perfectly, just do them the way you feel is right and you'll get better at it sooner or later.

I play Kuma in tournaments in my area, and there's a tested set up where it looks like you drop the combo but the wiff after the drop leaves you +7, and for 2 weeks the commentators during every one of my matches talked s*** about what I scrub I was for not being able to finish my combos as I'm constantly relaunching my opponents and landing meaty command throw after the +7. Finally, I didn't care about landing the setup anymore and had to explain on stream what was happening just to get a lil respect. And they still mispronounce my gamertag q.q

@DoctorDarlingTTV

Жыл бұрын

Those are some whack commentators sounds like lol.

The most optimal combo is the one that looks the coolest, resource cost, damage, and oki be damned

I'm not even 30 seconds into the video and Combo Expression is in fact 100% a real thing. Back when Marvel 3 one of the main games I'd have people constantly ask me why I did X combo with Dante when X route was more optimal, and it's a very simple reason. The Dante combo I do, while could be better but not insanely inoptimal, is because it's the very last combo I hit my friend with before he passed away. So I'll always go for that combo whenever I can, because I've dubbed that as his combo and it's my way of immortalizing him anytime I play Marvel 3.

@ultralowspekken

Жыл бұрын

Dude so hardcore he does the combo he killed his friend with. Just kidding, heart warming story. I'm sure they would be proud

@brunop.8745

Жыл бұрын

If there is such a thing as a heaven, i'm sure your friend's still looking down and jokingly calling you a scrub after all this time shit man, that's what *i* would do

@deadfr0g

Жыл бұрын

This post goes so hard. 💪💪💪

Marvel 3 got that goated combo expression because of how much potential for overkill is on the table It’s not about being optimal somtimes it’s about sending a message

Combo expression (or lack thereof) is literally the whole reason that people were annoyed at Strive for changing gatlings. They added options in some other areas, but a lot of people still don't like the fact that they changed the gatlings.

@GS_CCC

Жыл бұрын

As a new player I found strive to be way easier to understand and create combos, the lack of an air tech and the way you can juggle characters made it way more enjoyable to make up and execute combos than xrd.

@phsquared1000

Жыл бұрын

I feel like the combo expression is still there in the current version of Strive but it’s like weirdly inconsistent. Ky has plenty combo expression in his routes from the changes to cS dash cancel, FA changes and jH jD changes which gives him grounded dash cancel routes, ground to air back to ground routes, grounded SS FA routes, SS VT loops, or AA air routes. Ky is a seasoned white bread character now. But then you get cases like Sol where he lost combo expression ever since release turning into HVV man. Most other characters have received better changes though like Anji, Millia, HC, Gio, Testament, May and Chipp.

@derekthedragonlayer

Жыл бұрын

as an Xrd and Plus R player, there's a whole lot more than just the gattling changes that make Strive feel like it lacks combo expression.

@joedatius

Жыл бұрын

@@GS_CCC I don't see why gatling had to be messed with and multiple characters being dumbed down and had removed options to succeed in anything you just said. like why would having no air techs be a positive?

@NeoBoneGirl

Жыл бұрын

I mean it's a lot more than just gatlings (changed hit effects, wall simply existing leading to combos being forced to be certain ways and homogenizing the corner combos you see by default), but it's definitely a part of it. I just hate that they're universal so they can't make interesting moves any more, they all have to be standard "5K is a mini poke, 6P is an anti air that hits like this and has this frame data, 6H is always a big swing combo move that's you break the wall with" etc etc

Combo expression is definitely a thing. Think of how many combos are named after the players that created them. Combos aren't key to winning in a lot of cases but they definitely bring life to fighting games.

@GenericSoda

Жыл бұрын

ah yes, the Fenritti Special

@Dzuh

Жыл бұрын

legit, immediately thought of Sako combo

@DayFul

Жыл бұрын

Julia in Tekken tag 1 - wonder juggle and that was birthed from someone moaning about her on the Tekken Zaibatsu forums.

@KenjiAsakura09

5 ай бұрын

You know you've become a FGC legend when they name a certain move after you, UmeShoryu for example

I like how effortless you make FGC stupidity into good, well-meaning content.

I appreciate how there are two opposing ways to read the thumbnail, as optimal means "as good as it can be, but not necessarily perfect" and Sol Badguy means "Sol Badguy".

Kusoru's Sol was just inspirational. It was among the most ugliest yet prettiest thing I ever witnessed in my life.

I am one of those players who feels like combos are very important, because there are so many more games I would win if I didn't drop combos or had a combo off of a hit confirm. If I win more interactions, but the few they win turns into 50%+ damage while mine is like 20%, it's their match almost everytime.

A great man with a golden mane once said, "I just want to see my characters do the cool shit."

"I wanna express myself" "but you can and do!" "but I wanna express myself and win anyway no matter what" "nvm I shouldn't have said anything"

@progamerhennessey9483

Жыл бұрын

You sound like a strive shill

"Combo Expression is a myth" [Laughs in YOMI Hustle]

This is why I love MARVEL games. Things like happy birthdays and crazy conversions while people play unique teams make for some of the most hype shit I've ever seen. Sure people will just play top tiers and just do optimal Vergil combos but the true soul of the game is in the team synergy and personal funk the players bring

When I first heard Jwong said that he isn't great at doing combos and just does more simpler combos it gave me a big boast in actually trying fighting games out

My way of expressing myself is doing the same 3-hit combo over and over again. It's the one I know and can do consistently.

@syrelian

Жыл бұрын

Moood, and hey, that Works, you can build upon it, or change it, but the fact it functions in the first place is important, you can get somewhere with that rather than going "LIGHT PUNCH" twenty times in neutral and never getting anything resembling advantage

One this i think is dope when i see it is getting combos off of random pick-ups/ situations that could never be labbed. Faust Bomb or random anti airs and getting a nasty combo from it gets me so hype.

"You have to listen to the notes they are _not_ playing" --Jazz Same principle as combo expression, really. The act of ignoring certain paths is itself telling a story about how the artist thinks. Whatever it was that led them to that specific series of notes in that specific order at that specific time is how you get free-form jazz, and how you get combo expression.

hitting an enemy with a heavently potemkin buster instead of a normal button to kill them on 1 hp is my way of expressing my intent to twerk on my opponent.

@richardjohnson8991

Жыл бұрын

when you just have to win with gold burst Pot Buster PRC'd into HPB to let them know. Sometimes you just have to flex

@pedrito890

Жыл бұрын

Evil

If a Kazuya lands a CH df2, whatever follows tells you exactly how everyone within a 20 foot radius feels.

Labbing combos and showing people who you respect cool stuff they haven't seen is so rewarding, I was able to do it in Tekken tag tournament 1 with Julia. She already hits like a truck but I was doing stuff no one else in the UK was doing at the time turning her into a 2 mistake and your done character.

Whoever made that poll has never played BBCF

@AMnotQ

Жыл бұрын

Bro they’ve never played a fighting game.

There are certain moments in fighting games where players prove their mastery with situational optimization based on feel, seeing specialist character players do the big boy stuff with all that pressure is super hype and takes unimaginable skill to pull off.

Strive Ky is a 'baby' character in a 'baby' game, but I still choose to not do 6H loops on heavies, and I also choose to cash out on damage vs low health characters. Not Millia though. Since she is so fast and I hate trying to catch her I just take CSE oki instead. But maybe I have bar for RTL wallbreak..... Simplest character in the game. So many decisions to make. FGs aren't as clean cut as people sometimes make them out to be.

damn, he's expressive

I have never thought combos were the reason I'm on floor 4. I KNOW the reason is that I flail, constantly. I can't do a single thing consistently.

@coalminecanary1277

Жыл бұрын

Admitting this alone has put you leaps and bounds ahead in your journey

@DoctorDarlingTTV

Жыл бұрын

One could argue if you had a combo memorized down to muscle memory, you could turn a stray hit into that combo and thusly stop flailing constantly

I am so glad you highlighted the SPEED aspect of what makes combo expression (and other forms of expression in fgs) so legit. You could maybe analyze and calculate the exact best 100% solved combo decisions when reviewing a vod for hours. But in reality HALF a second is asking a lot in terms of time you get to make a decision.

Combo expression keeps me playing a game I love going into the lab and having fun figuring out something fun and cool not caring if it's optimal. One thing that stopped me playing strive is that I bought it because how cool nago cancels were but the blood gauge limits how flashy I could be with him I didn't care if he was good or not I just wanted to do like a shit ton of his teleport in neutral and stuff.

Of course it matters, that's why I play Big Band (I only play Trumpet) 🎺

This reminds me how I've started to do roundstart MMM in the Faust mirror because it is such a visceral hard counter to that one specific option and it leads into the perfect corner spacing I personally vibe with. I'm also pretty sure it upsets them lmao.

Hearing about that tweet reminds me of annoying conversations I've had with people who don't play fighting games.

I remember ranking my sub in Tekken and I matched this one guy who had horrible neutral game, kept whiffing, and couldn't handle small pressure; but if you let him launch once he would do the universal near mx damage combo and never drop it. The gap between his combo execution and other fundamentals were so comical that you could tell this man definitely focused on nothing but combos 😂

If my opponent is one hit away and I have super, they are going to watch that super rock

I find a lot of Combo expression in Blazblue's Amane. Here's an example I do his 6C with 2 hits to bring the enemy close in. I can cancel into 4D to boost my spin gauge and get some good damage if I have some built up already but my combo options from there are limited. I can do ⬇️↘️➡️D into A drill for a basic combo with a basic extender from there. I can do the same move but with a stance cancel into 2B and 5B. Each option has different benefits and risks, execution limits and might be more useful depending on spacing and how far I do it in a combo. But generally, I have the freedom to try and use them all and even more other options. So, I think, Amane has good combo expression. And that extends to his pressure loops.

This has been something I've been struggling with thanks for the video. I've been thinking of other characters besides anji an playing a character right and doing the right combos for the situations is really holding me back. Thanks for basically telling me the obvious an helping me through this slump

SF6 is going to make combo expression extra prominent, we will see some nut constantly fight on the edge of burnout against someone constantly staying on the defensive and we won't know who wins.

@Michael_Raymond

Жыл бұрын

EVO finals somebody will burn themselves out and win the round

@DayFul

Жыл бұрын

The Marissa Vs Manon fight was it, Manon dumped all her resources in the last round but failed to seal the deal and got destroyed in burnout.

Combos are the reason for me sticking with fighting games. Combo expression not only exists but it's also strategic, and I don't mean like okie. I mean visually having your opponent getting used to seeing the same combo, and then eventually changing up the rhythm of when they land or creating a new scenario for your opponent to figure out.

RTL versus Tyrant Barrel is a perfect example of combo expression and player choice

Player expression as a whole is what makes fighting games really special to me. its so much more clear just how somebody plays that over time you can clearly distinguish people just by how they play certain characters in a way i don't think any other genre has to this extent. Jyobin being a prime example of someone who is practically unmistakable simply due to how he plays. And even outside of pro FGC people it still rings true.

@syrelian

Жыл бұрын

In some ways its really obvious at low skill levels, I'm a dogshit player but I like Skullgirls a fair bit, and my lack of skill means I have some very predictable things I do that are hard for me to mix up largely due to not having comfortable alternatives, so its easy to see its Me because I use the characters a certain way, someday I'll hopefully grow out of that, but I enjoy myself well enough

Two things I've learned from this: After looking through the replies from the hot take person, it seems to me that what THEY consider as combo expression is apparently not what the rest of us consider as combo expression??? And secondly, I think the existence of combo expression is sometimes based more on the character themself than the game they live in. Cause some conversations are like "this game doesn't have combo expression because it's ALWAYS optimal to do THIS" and then someone replies "but on MY character I can do this, this, and this and they'll all give me different results to pick and choose from based on what I value"

This is why killer instinct is one the Greatest fighting games of all time. The environments and musical score gave combo expression a level never attained in a fighting game before nor been replicated since. The fact that K.I hasn't received a update is legit criminal and I wanna see heads roll for the lack of productivity. Spends hundreds of millions on entire catalogs but can't spend 1/4 on their own catalog.

I feel like learning combos is much more important to low/intermediate players than it is to higher level players, but it also definitely depends on the game. If I'm picking up Skullgirls for the first time, taking 5 or so hours to learn an 8k damage BnB is going to get me a lot more mileage than just freestyling random stuff into level 1 super for 4k damage, or worse, trying to freestyle something and just giving them undizzy. But SG also has some of the most combo expression at a high level because you get to decide whether to continue a combo for guranteed damage, go for a 50/50 reset, or go for a burst bait. And even if you decide to go for guranteed damage, there are a near-infinite amount of combo routes based on what assists/DHCs you use.

i like certain combos a lot, and i will fish for that hit more than others, because its so enjoyable. Xrd Sol 6h CH combos have so many routes, and they are all very fun

This is why I moved to Blazblue from Strive. Blazblue, it seems like players are fully able to play each of the vastly different characters their own way. I have never seen two players play the same, they all have their own ways of playing the game, but I moved away from Strive because it felt like that wasn't really possible. Everyone felt too limited after a while with the lack of specials, lack of different combo routes, and the overreliance on 6P (some more than others obviously). After a while, everyone who played the same character really just felt like the same person, or they just weren't playing the game right and suffered from a lower rank because of it. In other words, it feels like Strive punishes you for playing a character how you want, vs how the developers want you to play. This is why I am excited for SF6, it looks like there are a LOT of different ways for combos to go while still keeping the utility of better options depending on the situation. From what has been shown already, characters seem VERY flexible and free form, while still remaining optimal. Hopefully, the game does feel like that when it actually releases.

I feel like in SF6 that my Guile is quite different from the other Guile's I've played against through just combos alone. Other Guile's like this Jab (Medium?)Punch Sonic Boom target combo while I'm quite simple with my Guile High Kick into Flash Kick combo, hopefully after landing jumping Heavy Kick to complete the combo I found myself back in SF4.

That thumbnail is so sharp it could kill someone

One hilarious thing about this whole discussion to me, was the amount of people on twitter, who i've seen dunk on strive for having no "player/combo expression", that saw that tweet, and replied giving examples of the type of stuff they consider combo expression... *And said examples are stuff that Strive has too*

@notimeforcreativenamesjust3034

Жыл бұрын

It isn't like Strive has no player expression, it just has waaay less than XRD (since it has way less stuff than Xrd) it's like going from anti grav to earth's gravity.

@Sorichuudo

Жыл бұрын

That's all fine and dandy The problem is the people i've seen didn't say "strive has waaay less expression than Xrd", they said "Strive has NO expression"

@AMnotQ

Жыл бұрын

They play Nago for three seconds and think 5s, 5s, 5s is literally all he does. They’re right, of course. But that’s on the fault of the players. :)

@rachetmarvel931

Жыл бұрын

I mean they are not wrong, Strive barely has combo/player expression. You lot can't praise Strive for being simplified and "accessible", then get angry when we call the game out for the consequences of being simplified and "accessible", which are low character power,weak system mechanics,lack of characters special moves,lack of combo variety,lack of player expression, volatile game,lack of player options, and honestly a boring game to watch. Remember, every action has a reaction.

lmao i was waiting for this to drop as soon as i saw that tweet

Having combos you think are fun or cool also changes how you play in neutral, in pressure, etc, and I think that's great too. I absolutely love a Goldlewis combo that starts with CH 268 (because it lets you do late hit 248 without the corner and I fucking love late hit 248), and so my entire gameplan revolves around conditioning people to mash and then going for frametrap 268. The combo I like is determining how I like to play outside of combos and that's sick.

Combos often showcase the unique abilities and playstyles of different characters in fighting games. They also add variety and depth to the gameplay, encouraging players to explore different characters and their respective combo potential. For example, in Tekken, characters like Mishima family members have electric-based moves that enable them to perform advanced combo extensions not available to other characters.

As a lower execution focused player, I think combo variety is really important. It's one of the reasons why I love MB so much. It's REALLY easy for basically anyone in the cast to get a safejump setup, which is all a player might need in order to start playing at a competent level. Hell, they arguably don't even need that, since even the most basic BC BC airthrow combos don't vary that much in damage when compared to optimal combos, at least at midscreen.

I only got into fighting games properly late last year so my combo game is still awful in any game. In REV2 I just go for slash slash, low dust, whatever oki because tripping my opponent is amusing to me. Looking forward to being able to do the real nasty stuff though.

@funkuro

Жыл бұрын

What region do you play in? Please, I’m new to Rev 2 and need someone to play against.

@morzathoth919

Жыл бұрын

@@funkuro Europe.

@funkuro

Жыл бұрын

@@morzathoth919 YES. does Xrd have Crossplay? If so I’m a psn user. Please. I need games.

@morzathoth919

Жыл бұрын

@@funkuro Doesn't seem like there is crossplay from a quick search, no.

@funkuro

Жыл бұрын

@@morzathoth919 from quick search?

ive always questioned if not doing the optimal thing was the right thing, then u mentioned the ability to play neutral better to compensate which validates it for me, this is a good video

I'm in the middle of the video, so if you mention it later don't judge me ❤ but One of the things that make me love the topic of combo expression is that team/tag games have so much combo expression, because depending on your team, you have to change your route because you're close to the corner, or because your DHC snaps to the floor so you gotta end the combo with a divekick, or maybe your assist has multiple hits and it allows for a crazy extension, or even a double super that nobody knows exists. That's one of the most fun things about team games, and it's one of the main reasons I keep playing and playing DBFZ to this day. Much love, sajam. I'm lovin the vid

"and everyone freaks out they all freak out" yeah turns out people don't like being called shit, astonishing revelations

As someone who has played smash,unist, mvc, and street fighter no two player are the same there going to go for different routes ideas strategy and hell it's why I love fighting games as it makes it more interesting

I'm old enough to remember when people said AI would never beat a chess/go grandmaster because of "expression"... until they did.

@joedatius

Жыл бұрын

not sure how expression has anything to do with that. expression and ability/skill aren't the same thing. its also good to remember that wining alone isn't actually the only major goal when talking about this subject. If that was the case you would just pick a top tier and do whatever strongest combo possible.

@ukyorulz

Жыл бұрын

@@joedatius This controversy is something that pops up repeatedly, in the context of all sorts of endeavors (mostly games). The exact form it takes varies, but it always boils down to: Is there such a thing as a "correct" option? If there is such a thing, then it logically follows that the other options are incorrect (or less correct, if you prefer milder phraseology). But people *hate* this idea and they put forth various arguments against the existence of a "correct" option. Most of them can be boiled down to: * No one can prove that any given option is the correct one, so they must all just represent varying degrees of immeasurable correctness * No human has the ability to consistently find and act upon the optimal option in all circumstances, so for all practical purposes an optimal option does not exist This is where AI comes in. AI finds the correct options that "can't be found" and it executes them at a level that "can't be performed", revealing that the thing we call "expression" just describes varying degrees of sub-optimal play. "Expressiveness" is just a colloquial measure of how sub-optimally a person can play and still have a decent chance of winning.

When I do suboptimal combos on purpose, I am expressing toxicity, like a poison toad.

Appreciate the effort

i love playing skullgirls with my friend and seeing how different our squigly's play. i go for fewer resets and longer combos for higher damage cause i cant move as well as him and i dont want to have to try and win neutral again, but he goes for cross ups and weird resets far more cause he knows if i block or tech throw he can out maneuver me and get me back where he wants me.

Some fighting game players love doing the sick nasty execution heavy shit even if it's risky as fuck and sends you to losers if punished. Being known as the hard combo/1 frame/ewgf guy is like a badge of honor, even if you never place first. Style over practicality to get the crowd going, which is tight(if it lands).

i remember seeing this tweet and my first thought was it reads as "competitive is the only PROPER way to play fighting game" probably one of the sweatiest tweets ive seen in a while. XD

Im old school FGC, So once I lab out some good BNBs I move on to spacing, defensive options, etc...

People act like combo expression is like a freestyle breakdance where you just style however you feel like and always do the same amount of damage, rather than the expression is in how the results are different. A very simple example is rcing a throw as baiken, you can either do a normal red rc on the main part of the throw for more meter but higher scaling, and a shorter combo, or rc after just the tether for less meter for more damage and style.

Combo expression is my passion. *jab super*

i usually lab few combos. then keep few routes that leads to oki n mixups. also worrying about online....sometimes just go for simple combo that won't drop

My first time realizing what combo expression is was in SF5. Playing Akuma, I always wondered why Tokido 99% of the time ended his combos with HK Tatsu, when I always did DP. I loaded up training mode and saw that Tatsu builds more stun and gives better oki after a backroll if you dash up afterwards.

absolutely beast thumbnail

Damn is that Sajam?!

@Manglet762

Жыл бұрын

Damn, he's Sajam.

@ellagage1256

Жыл бұрын

Oh you're a Sajam fan now?

@AMnotQ

Жыл бұрын

That’s Latif.

Combo expression is finding the most optimal way to fit as many teabags in one combo as possible.

Tweek vs Marss at LvlUp Expo is a perfect example of two VERY different combo expressions

Honestly I've seen so many people hit a big button CH with full bar match point and NOT doing an IK Like I could NEVER I think that's a small part of combo expression

You know, when people talk about combo expression I always get reminded of Daigo doing that 25 hit combo on Momochi. Maybe that is a myth worthy of being part of some kind of FGC mythology.

I personally like consistent and/or simple/short combos usually wanting decent oki, and good dmg, usually with little regard to corner carry (except tekken cuz wall splat) And i usually spend meter on combos cuz im a hoarder, this is how i express myself in combos, and why i like negans combos, easy, consistent, high dmg, decent oki :)

The thing that sells me on a fighting game is “are there cuts girls and is watching the game hype af”

me omw to do a silly combo ender that completely wastes my meter and gives me no absolutely no advantages: 🏃🏃🏃🏃🏃🏃🏃🏃🏃🏃🏃🏃🏃🏃🏃

I an Order Sol player and all my combos are just me trying to IK you at some point as stylish as possible

Should I RRC after Pot Buster into HPB, or should I PRC before the damage into HPB?

So, I love playing Sol in +R. Problem is, I suck at jump canceling and so doing sidewinder loops is basically impossible for me. However, I can play nuetral and I have one solid ground combo that I do using S and H buttons into Fafnir, and if I have meter I get a Tyrant Rave. Boom, combo expression. I'm not optimal at, by any means, but I love +R all the same.

I'm in Floor 6-8 and even I'm having the JWong experience. I regularly lose rounds to people who have a couple combos that do way more damage than everyone else in the Floor, but they can only do it out of particular setups, and I get more enjoyment out of stuffing those setups than joining the combo damage arms race. Part of the reason I love Faust so much is that he naturally forces the fight into a semi-random scramble and it punishes people who want to just hit 6P and do their one combo over and over again.

I can see where the original tweet is coming from, especially since the type lumina community does have a tendency of being like "do optimals or you're throwing damage away". But I've got old man execution so I tend to stick to the baby easy combos so I'm less likely to drop them (I still drop them in ranked games anyway ;_;) Also my form of combo expression is always fishing for an astral heat if I can get one in blazblue lmao

I have to say though, that video thumbnail is definitely both expressive and optimal.