I can't decide if this is a good circuit or not. I keep swinging back and forth on this.

@copernicofelinis

10 ай бұрын

Only time will tell.

@tinygriffy

10 ай бұрын

What agitated you ?

@DW-indeed

10 ай бұрын

I'm trying to resist saying it's good...but I'm biased

@charlesfletcher7963

10 ай бұрын

Perhaps a second opinion?

@SunnyJulienDivine

10 ай бұрын

Maybe you need some feedback.

I'd love to see you rig up a simple pendulum and get this working, then hang a scope off the coil to see the waveform :D Then disconnect that damping capacitor and see the effect it has

Very impressive how you zoomed out just the right amount where the end pop-ups fit precisely. 😎

Clive packing to go on a work trip looks like he is moving by the time he puts all the cameras and everything in there, lmao. Thanks for the video Clive

@bigclivedotcom

10 ай бұрын

I have a very slimline studio setup for travel.

@chrisprobert6

10 ай бұрын

​@@bigclivedotcomprior planning and prep. Prevent piss poor performance 😅

@olavl8827

10 ай бұрын

@@bigclivedotcom Are you away from home? I thought for a second you just had a new desk or something.

@stepheneyles2198

10 ай бұрын

@@olavl8827 Clive would never get a new desk; the old one has the scars of dealing with runaway circuits over the past few years!!

I just picked up a 70's Smith's carriage clock that uses this sort of circuit. In that case it isn't a pendulum but a spinning magnet attached to a balance wheel and escapement. I usually prefer fully mechanical clocks, although I do like the accuracy of quartz I try to avoid having too many quartz about the house. This clock I just got surprised me as it wasn't fully mechanical and certainly not quartz. It also has a lovely tick tock sound too.

Used to be a company (Kundo) made clock in the 60s with this type of mechanism, although with germanium transistors, OC71 or similar. Must have looked like magic at the time.

Super interesting. It is almost like a tuned pwm or tuned mono stable device where the pulse turns on to suit the swing. Very effective & clever! Thank you for sharing!

Thanks Clive. Thank you for all of the problems you helped me resolve,

This looks like a version of the classic Hartley oscillator. The centre tapped coil and 100nf capacitor form a resonant circuit. The larger capacitor and resistor are biasing. It would be interesting to see if the circuit resonates without a pendulum, and at what frequency. If we know the wire thickness, we could estimate the length of wire, number of turns, the inductance then estimate a resonant frequency for the tank circuit.

Another instance where learn how something functions, that I have always wondered about. Thank you Big Clive.

Years ago ( 1970s) there was a animated advertisement display at a Woolworth's store. It had one transistor, one resistor, one capacitor, and the coil. The swing arm had a magnet on it. It would run for months in a old school zinc carbon " D" size battery.

Greetings Clive! Hope you are well. Yes I have been there too,, A swinging desk ornament of a couple swinging on a swing, there were loads of these knocking about Inthe 80's,, My swing originally had a Similar circuit as you described,, mine was not working,, I further screwed it up trying to get it working,, in the end I used an op amp and home made coil, I even replaced the 2xAA cells with a more convenient lipo cell & usb C charging port lasts about a month until it needs charging, strangely rewarding making the whole thing work after all these years,, You in part inspired the rebuild after I watched your (what could be done with lipo cells from vapes that had been thrown on street,, Thanks dude

@warrengray610

10 ай бұрын

I also understand they are receiving my deep space signal in a neighbouring galaxy,,,lol

Great 👍🏻 little video about clock 🕰️ starters

Thanks a million OMHS Clive 👍🇮🇪🙏🏻

Thanx again I’ve learnt so much from you Thank you

Coming From you it's very interesting love watching your stuff. Schematic included

Thank you Clive

Nice little circuit. The coil bobbin looks a lot like one designed for clock mechanisms.

What a coincidence, I was at BHI clock museum near Newark yesterday. Apart from The Speaking Clock and Greenwich Mean Time kit I loved the old Master Clock systems from a pendulum master like Pulsinetic and Gents of Lecester I maintained in big factories around Liverpool 50+ yrs ago

@alastairchestnutt6416

10 ай бұрын

I have a Synchronome and a Gents Master clock. The Synchronome is ticking away and clicking away every 30 seconds on the wall behind me in our kitchen. The Gents was the Master clock in a Carpet Factory, 1949 vintage. The Synchronome is from 1914. I've no information about where it was installed. You must have had an interesting job.

@alanjones3873

10 ай бұрын

@@alastairchestnutt6416 Part of an interesting career. Bonus of the time I worked on clocks was a weekend of overtime for changing BST. I got two hours for each site including travelling as I had to stop for an hour then restart. Of course I stopped one, went to next and stopped that and so on then returned to first to restart. Only risk was if security delayed me getting in at one site and I missed the hour so it took forever to catch up but I usually got 8 hours time +half Saturday double time Sunday for just over two hours work each day. The simple ones we could wind forward in spring but the electronic ones could go double speed and took an hour to add an hour so same trick.

Clive. Thanks for the normal but somewhere else video, it's made me realise that the world hasn't gone mad, it's only AvE that's lost it. 😆👍

@RaglansElectricBaboon

10 ай бұрын

Oh boy has he ever!

This circuit is similar to the joule thief or the blocking oscillator. As you suggest, the capacitor between base and collector must stop the circuit oscillating at a much higher frequency. The circuit likely operates on the edgy of stability. I have seen examples where the circuit has been used to phase lock a pendulum to a more accurate time signal, either a crystal or a radio time signal. I assume such circuits put a small bias on the pendulum so that it runs slightly slow, or maybe fast I can't really decide which, it must depend on the mode of operation. The circuit just pulls the oscillation into phase with the master time signal. In the example I was shown, the pendulum had an aluminium plate added to the end. This passed through a slot between two coils. When the coils were energised, the pendulum was slowed by induced eddy currents.

I keep hearing coil saturation in different videos, my experience with a current probe and hall sensor shows this not to be the case. Thanks for sharing. Also, i was a little surprised the coil is center tapped, most cases I have seen, the base side coil has many more turns (like the top secret spinning top), it does not have to be, but seems more tuned for efficiency.

Homofaciens built a nice coil winding machine out of a 3d printer .. (which printed the bobbins first and then wound the wire on it.) .. but sewing machine is genius ! 👍

In principle it might be neat to look at Bulova's "Accutron" watches, first sold in October 1960, They used use a 360 Hz tuning fork and transistor energised instead of a balance wheel as the timekeeping element, It was guaranteed to be accurate to a minute a month. Broken ones seem to go for as little as 15 quid.

Great to see a youtube presenter considering where all those popups are going to appear at the end of the video, all too often those little windows pop up, obscurring important/intersting details on the main video!!

That's a cool circuit.

It explains why my clock stops before the pendulum does.

very simple design

You are the Bob Ross of electrical circuits

Brilliant!

If the resistor's purpose really is to keep the transistor slightly biased on, I think the electrolytic capacitor's leakage current should be enough for that. Though I doubt such weak biasing is necessary at all in this application. Seems to me like the 1M resistor would be better used across BE to minimize Ice between pulses.

@olsmokey

10 ай бұрын

I don't think capacitive leakage would be consistent enough to rely upon.

@teardowndan5364

10 ай бұрын

@@olsmokey I doubt base bias current is necessary at all in this application. As I wrote earlier, it would make more sense to me to use the resistor to pull the base low instead. The only reason to bias the transistor would be for faster turn-on speed vs completely off, though you'd need an exceptionally slow transistor for that to be an issue with a ~5ms pulse at ~1Hz.

@eDoc2020

10 ай бұрын

@@teardowndan5364 I'm guessing the moving pendulum does not create the 0.6v needed to turn on the transistor without extra bias.

@teardowndan5364

10 ай бұрын

@@eDoc2020 The AC coupling capacitor between Vbat, the base drive coil and the base is already charged to Vbat-Vbe in the static regime, which takes care of the 0.6V base voltage: Vb = Vbat + Vcoil - Vcap = Vbat + Vcoil - (Vbat - Vbe) = Vcoil + 0.6V. The only thing the coil needs to do is provide the base drive current.

@eDoc2020

10 ай бұрын

@@teardowndan5364 But without the resistor the capacitor wouldn't be charged to the proper level. It would fire once and then the capacitor wouldn't let any more current into the base.

Nice and simple, just like me!

The 100nF cap would damp if it was in parallel with the coil. As it is in series with the coil and the base of the transistor, it will actually decrease the rise time on the transistor switch (i.e. it will increase the frequency)

Is it weird that I love how Clive pronounces "microfarad?"

@williamcampbell9859

10 ай бұрын

yes, because that's how everyone should be pronouncing it.

@Jumbo344

10 ай бұрын

ChEmICALs…

@KNfLrPn

10 ай бұрын

How else would it be pronounced?

@DavZell

10 ай бұрын

​@@KNfLrPnHis pronunciation is almost like "fard" (even "fart" in some videos), whereas I think of the pronunciation as being more annunciated, like "far-ad".

@KNfLrPn

10 ай бұрын

@@DavZell 🤷‍♂ I don't hear it @0:49 but maybe my brain is automatically adjusting the accent.

Very similar to joule thief 😊 your favourite Clive 😅 Mine too 😅😂❤

Love your sssssschematics...

That's almost exactly the same circuit used in the battery operated Kit-Cat Klocks. It differs only in the placement of the 1M resistor and it uses a 22uF capacitor and runs off of 3V instead of 1.5V.

Haha no way! I was just designing a (much!) larger driver for my hammock auto-swinging. Might take a little bit of an inspiration from this one!

@alastairchestnutt6416

10 ай бұрын

Love to hear if you could produce such a driver. Toying with a similar idea.

This is one of those where it would be gret to see this on a multi channel oscilloscope 🤔 one channel for each coil

Clive, Is this circuit similar to the ones in the Phony perpetual motion devices? thanks for another interesting video my friend 😀

The 100 nF capacitor is possibly fitted to pass a very brief pulse ( which the 1 M Ω cannot do ! ) ... in some circuits this is called a " speed up capacitor " ... ( ? ) ...... DAVE™ 🛑

I'm guessing it'd be in something like those Felix the Cat clocks that were popular oh so many years ago, where the tail swung as the pendulum, and the eyes looked side to side too... :P

I’ve wanted to retrofit my electric kit-kat klock, for decades!

I think that was called a 'blocking oscillator' 50 yrs ago, got its name from how a signal was blocked on a radio or something.

the sewing machin trick to build coils is awesome! (But aren't you supposed to count the loops?)

@Palmit_

10 ай бұрын

rev counters are like 10 quid including stickers. experienced operators however, run the machine for 5 seconds and count the winds after. divide by 5 is winds per second. divide by 10 is per half second. thats usually about enough for human level hand/foot control accuracy. easy enough to trim a few winds off of the end result. :) you're welcome.

@mikebond6328

10 ай бұрын

Depends on the application. For a certain length/resistance of wire the coil can be weighed. Works well when matching coils.

@jostouw4366

10 ай бұрын

Apart from the increase of diameter?@@Palmit_

Turn the coil through 90deg. Allow the magnet to pass through the coil. This fixes the torque problem twisting the pendulum rod.

Solar powered bobble head toys use this. Kit-Cat clock has similar but was invented 90 years ago and AC powered, converted to battery in 80's.

Fishing reels are good for winding larger coils. 😉 ✌♥️🇬🇧

Less components less failure! My 1985 panda always work perfectly after 28 years and survive at other 9 cars in family!!

@darkworlddenizen

10 ай бұрын

1985 is a lot older than 28 years

Pendulum circuits? I kind of go back-and-forth on the topic...😉

Very similar to your joule thief circuit you designed Clive.

Is this your new table? It looks nice!

@bigclivedotcom

10 ай бұрын

Temporary location.

Yes, I've learned over the years the simple designs are the best. One or two transistors and a few components other than a tiny crystal driven timer chip. In fact, I used this same principal years ago to accelerate a round magnet to over 150,000 RPMs

Wow no microcontroller. That’s a thing of beauty. Very clever design.

Hey Big Clive, I'm like a transistor ... although as I get older, it takes MORE than a little "bias" to my "base" to turn me on! ... And the "output" from my "emitter" isn't what it used to be! 😂

@abitofabitofabit4404

10 ай бұрын

I've found in my certain age that a bit of emitter degeneracy helps

@marcse7en

10 ай бұрын

@@abitofabitofabit4404 The "output" from my "emitter" isn't what it used to be! 😂

I’d love to see the blob chip version with an oscilloscope

Hi Clive, maybe a dumb qestion, but anyway..... would it be useful in something called Swinging Sticks Sculpture? I am under some temptation to try to build it, so it would behelpful... Thanks, Stef

It's a joule theif in disguise 👍👍

Get well soon

It's Genius..

I’m wondering if it could be adapted to use that coil & circuit as a form of guitar pick-up ?

Hi, is there anyway one could modify this circuit to be used in some sort of solenoid motor or a reed switch motor controller type thing? maybe with a joule thief circuit as well involved? take care and have a great day!

Sam from Look Mum No Computer had restarted and explained a few Master Clocks with pretty simple circuit

Classic blocking oscillator.

Any chance to see the ringing effect of such circuit's coil(s)?

How does the 47uF capacitor discharge? It only let's the pulses though, as a high pass, but were is the resistor to drain it?

Doesn't the electrolytic discharge through both coils to give an extra kick?

multivibrator, i think the additional cap is taking place of the flipflop

I might actually attempt this one. How important are the specs, especially of the coils? Also is it would similarly to the one in Jewel Thieves?

@duanecjohnson

8 ай бұрын

I don't think anything in this circuit are critical. redrok AD0TJ

Could you pair this with a joule thief for extended run time?

The Pendulum is mightier than the Swordulum.

This video came out right on time, if you catch my drift ;)

@TechGorilla1987

10 ай бұрын

...took me a couple of - seconds - to get that.

@CNCmachiningisfun

10 ай бұрын

Awww. You are just winding us up, aren't ya?

@Pulverrostmannen

10 ай бұрын

@@CNCmachiningisfun you bet I am ;)

Not a great deal going on, they really have cut back as far as they can with the components. 2x👍

you shod make a video on making a clock with this

Wow missed this one from 5 months ago .Now how can you use this as a perpetual motion machine

Hey Clive, what’s the right hand coil for with what appears to be a 32,768Hz crystal underneath it? Can this thing alter the timing of a swinging pendulum… oh no, I’ve just figured it out. It’s completely separate. There’s a quartz circuit for time keeping and the pendulum is just for show. Oh hell no, how hideous 🤦‍♂️

@bigclivedotcom

10 ай бұрын

It's for the clock movement.

@BillySugger1965

10 ай бұрын

@@bigclivedotcomSorry, although I’m an electronics engineer, I also have a love for well made mechanical clocks.

It seems there is a bit of confusion here, with the difference between the schematic and the PCB. The PCB came from a clock and I assume the 'crotch' between the legs of the PCB was where the AA cell holder was originally. Right? The 2SC1815 comes in four current gain ranges: O, Y, GR, and BL. Please tell us which gain range it is. Thanks, Clive.

@bigclivedotcom

10 ай бұрын

The battery is outwith the PCB. The transistor gain is GR.

@BillySugger1965

10 ай бұрын

@@bigclivedotcomAh, outwith. A peculiar Scottish word 😉

What was that?! Is there someone under the table, squeezing your transistors? 😉🤣😂😍🥰❤

interesting

found my grandfathers clock. made it... 1930 maybe? its so weird, an axial ratchet escape gear, a worm gear reduction... and a solenoid driven pendulum. some terrible switch on the pendulum, appears to switch it so it retards the upswing as much as assist the down... and 50% duty... lol. meh. planning on giving it a little overcentering toggle, operate a set of switching reeds so it turns on just as its getting to the solenoids, toggles over ready for the return swing as it simultaneously turns off, then repeats... and dump the back spike into some neons around the face. pretty :) maybe distributed for hours/mins. no solid state allowed! well, i wanna stay period correct. except for threads. its getting metrics where needed.

Hi Clive, a quick question maybe you could help me with. In regard to DC circuits, is there a difference between using a solid conductor or using a multi stranded conductor ? This is in regard to model railway using up-to say 25v DC at about 6 Amps for points, Lights etc. Also DCC train controllers that output 16 Volt up-to 8 Amps. Pulse Width Modulation. Not quite DC nor AC but more like On/Off pulses of DC. Any help in this regard would be appreciated. Thanks for your time. Alan

@bigclivedotcom

10 ай бұрын

The main advantage is flexibility. Using stranded cable puts a lot less strain on things it's attached to. But solid core has its uses too. I use both.

Does the magnetic pulse repel or attract the magnet on the pendulum?

@SeanBZA

10 ай бұрын

Repulses it, as the kick occurs while the magnet is approaching, nearly over the centre, and then pushes it away from the coil, giving it a pulse. That is why you need a rigid mount for the magnet, otherwise it will simply flip it on it's side.

Would be nice to see it working using an oscilloskop!?

would love to see a step by step video on how to make a simple pendulum circuit - HINT HINT ;)

@bigclivedotcom

7 ай бұрын

I've a few other pendulum modules here to look at.

How would the circuit need to be adapted for a string? Like for a powered Foucault pendulum.

@bigclivedotcom

10 ай бұрын

It's tricky, as the magnet sometimes deflects to the side. Maybe the string attached to a long heavy shaft.

Clive, could circuit be used to made a earth rotation clock? Those ones that have tiny blocks in a circle that as the earth rotates one by one the pendulum finger knocks down?

@SeanBZA

10 ай бұрын

Yes it can be used with a Foucalt pendulum, though normally you would need to make it a little bigger, simply because you need to apply a lot more force to the pendulum to overcome air resistance than the milliwatt or so of energy this one delivers per pulse. Normally they use a coil wound with fewer turns of thicker wire (20SWG) for the collector side, and wind the base side with 36SWG wire, and then run it off 12V instead, so you can get around 1A of current in the pulse to drive the coil.

@assassinlexx1993

10 ай бұрын

@@SeanBZA Thanks man for your answer. I just thought you could make a micro one. Could sit on the desktop.

@SeanBZA

10 ай бұрын

@@assassinlexx1993 Normally those are around 10m high, or even more, so that they can react to the rotation of the earth and not have the tint force be overwhelmed by friction and wind.

A Bulle clock from the thirty’s has a much simpler circuit purely mechanically.

Can you teardown LED backlight tester. Thanks

What does the other coil on the other end of the board do?

@chrishartley1210

10 ай бұрын

As far as I know the pendulum side of things is purely for decoration. If you look next to the other, bigger, coil there's a crystal which will be providing the timing. That, along with the coil and (presumably) a blob, is the actual clock mechanism.

@bigclivedotcom

10 ай бұрын

It's the stepper motor coil for the clock movement.

That capacitor is like a semi-diode...

How does the clock circuit interface with the pendulum circuit?

@bigclivedotcom

10 ай бұрын

It doesn't. They are independent.

Would be nice to see the behaviour of this on an oscilloscope

Could you use this to turn a 7 day wind up clock into a continuous one?

@DasIllu

10 ай бұрын

I think not, these are made for decorative purposes. You'd need to ramp up the power significantly to actually drive an actual clockwork. And when doing so you can go wild with an IR reflex sensor, a beefier electromagnet and transistor to go along with it.

@JCGver

10 ай бұрын

No. The pendelum in a mechanical clock is there to do the timing. Each swing will let a gear turn one tooth for each swing (called the escapement mechanism of a clock). The power that actually turns the gear comes from the weights/springs. It's technically possible to make a ratchetting mechanism that would use the power of the moving pendelum. But that would be an extensive redesign of the whole clock which would require quite a lot of expertise in designing clock movements.

A very simple circuit that works well.

A bit big for wearing on the wrist. more SUITed for a Tie Pendulum ... I'd toss the battery, go with larger magnet n' coil, longer pendulum, solar cell, super capacitor. Wind once a decade. , ;)

Just trying to understand here, but you explained that the pulse of the feedback goes through the 47uF and into the base of the transistor. Is this because the capacitor is blocking DC current (after it initially charges) but passing an AC component of the pulse? That part of the video wasn't clear to me.

@bsekisser

10 ай бұрын

That would be correct... Blocks DC, passes AC.

@Jeff-cu4cb

10 ай бұрын

@@bsekisser thanks... I was getting hung up on the negative component passing through trying to figure out how that would switch the transistor, failing to realize that the cap would pass current normally afterwards as it recharges and momentarily switch the transistor. I learned something today :)

Is there a off the shelf unit ?

@bigclivedotcom

6 ай бұрын

You can buy complete pendulum movements online.

Can you make a Joule Thief out of that?

The Tennis Racket of Zeus (with design flaw). The mosquito zapping tennis racket sold at the Dollar or Pound Store would be a great item for you to disect. It is just up your alley. We bought one yesterday and it does zap the huge Canadian mosquitoes, dead! This looks like a tennis racket but has 3 layers of aluminum mesh sandwiched with 2 layers of plastic grid, and runs on 2 AA batteries. When you wave it at a mosquito and it enters the mesh ZAP!!! the mosquito is dead. The design flaw is as follows. When you push the red button, the red LED does go on as per the instructions. But when you release the button, the LED immediately goes out, leading one to believe that the racket is now safe. But it is definitely NOT safe. Pressing on the aluminum mesh with any force releases a whitish-blue spark straight into your finger. Youch!!! It does not really hurt and is kind of fun once you are used to it and expecting it. It is basically like rubbing your feet on the carpet and touching the doorknob, but on steroids. This could be a fun item for a Big Clive analysis and diagram. Cheers.

The big mystery is how this is stable enough for a clock, since slightly more current causes a longer swing, slightly less current causes a shorter swing. The amount of current depends on the precision of a lot of analog components, battery voltage.

@johnopalko5223

10 ай бұрын

I believe this circuit is for clocks where the movement is a quartz fit-up and the pendulum is purely decorative. Besides, the period of a pendulum depends solely on its length and not on the amplitude of its swing. Galileo is generally credited with discovering that.

@jagmarc

10 ай бұрын

It wouldn't take much to make a National Standards Lab based "pacemaker" to add to a conventional pendulum clock to replace Galileo. Add a microcontroller and GSM network module to reach the NS time server over the phone network.

@kimchristensen2175

10 ай бұрын

@@johnopalko5223yes... That's what the other coil and the crystal, that Clive didn't really talk about, are for.

@duanecjohnson

8 ай бұрын

​@@johnopalko5223 While generally true for small swing amplitudes, Galileo was wrong about the independence of amplitude vs period. Larger swings are slower than smaller swings. Of course, the limit would be +- 180 degrees. Once 180 degrees the pendulum would stop at the top. (assuming a ridged pendulum. This is why precision pendulum clocks have the cycloidal mechanism at the fulcrum to effectively shorten the pendulum length with larger swings and called "isochronous". See wikipedia, redrok AD0TJ