Keith, In software we have a saying that the best is the enemy of the good. If you miss the market window the best is not even good. I don't love the cane mill videos, but this one was instructive in how to overcome challenges in real time.

@davidt8438

11 ай бұрын

Yea I’m getting a little tired of these cane mill fixes too. There’s tons of things he hasn’t finished like the band saw for instance.

@ellieprice363

11 ай бұрын

Relax fellas. We need to take what’s offered when it’s offered. After all, for most of us it’s free if not always what we prefer.

I probably would have chucked the drum true and cut new centers in the shaft ends. Also, slower rpms and/ or heavier feed helps remove chatter.

using an indicator on the press will speed thins up a bunch

How about a quick review of that hammer collection that's always behind you!

Funny how when any maching videos come on the Tube ,all the experts appear ,whom I'm guessing haven't done this type of work . It gets so old . Good job Keith ,you just keep on doing your thing .

@phlodel

10 ай бұрын

I have done this kind of work for many years. I almost never think I know a better way than Keith's.

The weld problem might be cured by more time wire wheeling the weld area. A cleaner prep might weld better.

This reminded me of when I was rebuilding a lawn mower. My Granddad told me, "Son, it's a lawn mower, not an airplane."

@nmccw3245

11 ай бұрын

As a kid working in a restaurant I became very upset over an unreasonable customer. The owner turned to me and said “ it’s only a burger joint”. A life long lesson in perspective was learned that day. 😁👍🏻

Other than when you are brazing, have never seen you heat the metal before you weld. On these bigger pieces, you may try that to help with the porosity issues. I noticed the welding sounded better the more heat that got into it.

If you watch Cutting edge engineering you will see he uses special alloy flux core wire with argon and co2 shield and he gets very good results, no pitting and excellent finish. He also turns the shaft before welding. Probably over kill for a cane mill but could save time in the long run.😊

@jamesdavis8021

11 ай бұрын

I was thinking the same thing.A alternative way would be to turn both🎉ends down to remove rust and pitting,before welding it up.Mig welders don’t clean very well unless,like you said,you use a dual shield wire.The welding supplier will be able to recommend what to buy.

@rossgebert-goldsmith183

11 ай бұрын

How would that save time that's extra work my friend it's hard to compete when your not in the video

@jamesdavis8021

11 ай бұрын

@@rossgebert-goldsmith183 I didn’t say it would save time but, it probably would be preventing you from having to do the job over again

@canuckloyalist4681

11 ай бұрын

Curtis would had done it horizontally and by hand but off a rest. Dual shield and skinned off for a cleaner base metal would also help.

@rossgebert-goldsmith183

11 ай бұрын

@@jamesdavis8021 bro what are talking about

I'd say that journal is far better than it was when it was new.

Tip cleanliness makes for good gas flow.... 🙂

Back in the early seventies my friend bent the front fork shocks on his motorcycle. A machinist straightened them by spinning them in the lathe and running a piece of chalk on them to find the high spots, then pressing them and repeating until they were straight. No dial indicator , and they worked perfectly.

@tinaliebe5118

10 ай бұрын

😂😂 yap its called chalk engineering 😊

Why wouldn't you turn the shadt down to a good known surface before welding anything to it?

The mule will never notice the runout.

Seeing that porosity, I was thinking if you had cleaned up the area enough by a wire wheel or a few cuts on the lathe, plus preheating the shaft, but all in all, a job well done.

Your becoming the cane mill master! I am sure some more will find there way from the boneyard into you capable hands to be resurrected.

Nice accessories for pressing projects would be a couple shop made heavy duty steel V blocks, about two inches wide and some kind of adjustable scale for the ram, to see exactly how far the ram is moving JIM 🎉

Looks nice , yes the mule will care . E aw. Ha Ha

Another great job at South Ga. Cain Mill Repair

I have noticed that people who do line boring turn the pieces before they build them up with weld just to remove any bearing material ground into the repair area.

@nmccw3245

11 ай бұрын

Just watched Oliver Snowball (Snowball Engineering) break an insert when it hit a bit of hard embedded material on a line bore.

Is the run out more of an issue if you have a REALLY fast mule?

Thanks for sharing,first class job of filming the welding.

That press is already showing its worth, awesome One thing I saw in another video: it's a good idea to have some kind of indicator setup in the press to track your progress. Like make a test bend while tracking the value on the indicator and see how much it did. Then you can extrapolate easier and don't have to do as much guessing. Need a pretty steady setup for that though, too much wobbling might make it useless.

Your new hydraulic press came in handy in the nick of time. Nice work, Sir

Why not put an indicator on the shaft as you press it straight to see how far you’ve gone and the amount of spring back when you release it?

Lol, sitting watching, thought to myself, "that run out is gonna bug the crap out of him", next scene, new shininess and running much more true.

I'm pretty sure the weld porosity was caused by rust on the surface...

Great job Keith. I wonder if it would've been quicker to just cut the shaft off both ends, bore it out, then fit a new shaft in.

Cane Mill Keith, you are the goto person to repair and restore a Cane Mill. Great Video!

Once again, a great video! I'll also comment, that you look like you feel better. You've also lost some weight, which will make you feel better. Stay healthy!

very nice job Keith!

Thank you Keith!

That's a lot of work but you got it looking good. Thanks for the video.

Looks great Keith! Thank you for sharing

Wow you have to wonder how large that mule was that could bend a shaft while pressing cane

Good morning Keith. Thanks again for the videos.

Thank you for sharing.👍

The run out would have bothered me too. Short cuts can end up taking more time than if you did it right the first time. The last thing you need is for a machine to lock up due to run out.

Turned out very nice!

Thanks

With having a big press now. It probably would have been easier and faster to just press out the shaft and replace it.

@MrChevelle83

11 ай бұрын

the drum is cast iron. it would have a high probability of breaking it.

Thanks Keith, that was a worthwhile, high quality video. It was such a welcome change from all of the other videos across KZread that should have been most truthfully entitled "It's Filler Time".

Sounds like Keith would have quite the little industry if he made new cane mill rollers under the Rucker tool Company. Every year he certainly repairs a lot of them.

@mickestahl6178

11 ай бұрын

The problem is that hi have so high standard that they will not come back for service in the next 80 years 🙂

Thanks for sharing 👍

The drum was just a rough casting. By truing it up even a little bit, you took "good enough" to "pretty darn good."

@Hoaxer51

11 ай бұрын

I know it’s hindsight but it seems like truing that flange up first could save some time when you’re trying to get a good finish on those shafts. Same thing when you weld those shafts up, they’re in the lathe when you check it, just turn a little off and then there’s a nice surface to weld to. Maybe next time. They turned out nice and are ready for another season of juicing!

Great video thanks for sharing

Thanks for sharing.

Very nice.👍👍👍😎😎😎

Nice, Good job.

Learning so much from you

Very nice job Keith . I have always enjoyed weld and turning videos .

Okay - given that the roller looked so bad in the first place, would it make sense to turn it down first to improve the surface? Or is the poor weld infrequent enough that welding it first is the better course? I mean, I could see either course as the better course depending on your experience. Another wonderful video, by the way. Fascinating.

@mysock351C

11 ай бұрын

That was my thought as well, in that taking the rust off might have helped a bit. But with the presence of pitting he may still have had the same issues since that would cause momentary breaks in the arc.

@mysock351C

11 ай бұрын

But if he can get a bead down, then he does get some additional material for "free" that can then be used to get a better surface to work with when making the final pass rather than turning the shaft down further.

@jimlangerie

11 ай бұрын

Thank you. Why not turn down _past_ the pitting? That's what I was driving at. @@mysock351C

@jimlangerie

11 ай бұрын

I get that. My point was that turning away the pitting would give a clean surface to weld to without the pitting. ?? I dunno. Is it worth the extra effort? @@mysock351C

Great video ☹🇬🇧

We want ice cream ! 🍦🍧🍨

Yes I agree he should have cleaned the shaft up before welding it and he started that later in the video but to he’s credit he is not a boilermaker he is a machinist 😊❤

Try the W series tools and inserts for interrupted cuts.

Hey Kieth. Good video! Could you maybe do a road trip video to film sorghum in process? I'm from Albany, GA, and although I'm A damn Yankee I have learned to love this unique sweetness. Maybe even a cent short coupon for tasters?

I would think that after your initial measurement on the lathe, you could set up your dial indicator on the press to determine how much you have moved it.

@daleburrell6273

11 ай бұрын

...that's a HECK of a good idea-!!!

@johnscott2849

11 ай бұрын

Did you watch and listen to the start of the video? Those are not V blocks just a couple of pieces of metal to support the shaft. Measurement would not have been very aceturate.

@user-dn4iv2ne6r

11 ай бұрын

@@johnscott2849 I watched and listened carefully. It would have been worth a try to avoid repeated trips back to the lathe.

@johnscott2849

11 ай бұрын

@@user-dn4iv2ne6r Form experience on things like what he was doing no it wasn't .No 1 No good way to get a reliable measurement. It turns into a big waste of time. The press moves things not just the shaft. You keep leaving out the part where he says it doesn't have to be that aceturate. It had a small bend just over 1/8 of an inch. The shaft was also tapered from wear.

You should have put a steady rest on the bearing journal. Thats all that matters to the drum. Doesnt matter a whit if the handle is sitting cocked. 😂

" I'm not going to spend hours chasing my tail to get it perfect, I'd rather spend hours repeating why I'm not going to spend hours." You should watch Keith Fenner straighten prop shafts- you can do it right in the lathe by heating your high spot red then rapid cooling it. No need to haul the thing back and forth to the press.

@daleburrell6273

11 ай бұрын

...WELL, KEITH FENNER AIN'T HERE-(!)

@oldschool1993

11 ай бұрын

@@daleburrell6273 His videos are always here.

@ellieprice363

11 ай бұрын

That’s why you have Keith Rucker and Keith Fenner. Two different men with two different methods.

@oldschool1993

11 ай бұрын

@@ellieprice363 They don't have to be opposing sides- sharing knowledge is what progress is made of.

@johncollins719

11 ай бұрын

There's a thousand things Rucker could learn from Fenner. I imagine if Fenner watched this he'd be shaking his head in disbelief. That's why Fenner is the boss.

It doesn't have to be perfect, but the mule will know.

Fine result in the end, not the way I'd do it though. I would have replaced it with a keyed 4140 shaft, after chopping long end off and drilling out in radial drill. Held in the chuck from short end off an radial indexer. The closer one gets it to OD the better, you can collapse it in on its self on off it pops. No welding.

@ydonl

11 ай бұрын

Clearly you have a lot of experience, but... how much of it involved *mules*? :-) :-)

What RPM were you running the lathe? Your lathe always looks and sounds fast on video. It was interesting that when you got chatter, the fix was to do everything opposite of what one would normally to to get rid of chatter. Normally, you slow down the speed and increase the feed rate.

the mule wont care

@FireGodSpeed

11 ай бұрын

I am the mule, I do care actually.. 🤓

@Hoaxer51

11 ай бұрын

My mule doesn’t like other people laughing at him!

@daleburrell6273

11 ай бұрын

​@@FireGodSpeed...AT LEAST YOU'RE HONEST ABOUT YOURSELF...(!)

@billkurek5576

11 ай бұрын

It’s those “union mules “ calling for a work slowdown.

Keith, have you considered metal thermal spray on the shafts? They turn nice. I know a guy that owns a thermal spray shop. This is up their alley. Spray a lot of aircraft engine parts.

You have to wonder if the mill was being produced on Friday and the manufacturer just wanted to get something finished and go fishing

I maybe way off on this. When I was a young man working in garages and turning brake drums on a brake lathe, we had a leather belt we would wrap around the drum. I think it was to dampen vibrations. This may help or not.

I'd be interested to know how that 2 inch shaft got bent.

@ellieprice363

11 ай бұрын

Mule power.

Would spray welding like I have seen Abom 79 do filled the pore in original weld.

would it have been possible to use the drum as the center for centering the bearing surfaces to make everything true.

@RambozoClown

11 ай бұрын

He pretty much did that by indicating in the drum surface using the four-jaw chuck.

Great video Keith. Do you need to lower the weld positioner? It looked like it would be difficult to weld that high on top of the bench.

@Hoaxer51

11 ай бұрын

Looks like a good video making a roll around base for the weld positioner.

@Blazer02LS

11 ай бұрын

Mount it on one of the hydraulic lift tables so you can adjust it as needed.

@sparkybell11

11 ай бұрын

Why not have the weld positioner running horizontally ?

@Blazer02LS

11 ай бұрын

That one can angle as well as run vertical.

😛😛😛😛😛❤❤❤❤🦾🦴🦾🦴👍👍👍👍👍👍👍

Wouldn't a stainless steel sleeve pressed onto the shafts make a rust resistant and replaceable wear surface ?

Couldn't you place a indicator under the shaft when straightening to have a better idea of how much to go?

Why not use an indicator 180° from where your high point is and push it the distance needed for it to reach the straight point?

Why do you not use the clock on the press

@GameBacardi

11 ай бұрын

He just got setup that press. It also not have those different fittings.

Why didn’t you show cutting the drum portion

I'm not a machinist and I don't know how much the steel shaft can either anneal or harden on heat treatment. Would it have been worthwhile to heat and then slow cool the steel shaft at the very beginning? IF steel anneals much, wouldn't that make it easier to deform on the press and also reduce warping during the welding? Again, IF you were able to anneal the shaft at the beginning, could you then at the end heat and quench the shaft to harden all your changes in place?

@RambozoClown

11 ай бұрын

Based on what it is and when it was made, the shaft would be low carbon steel or maybe even some kind of wrought iron.

@stuartschaffner9744

11 ай бұрын

@@RambozoClown , Kieth said that the shaft was steel. I presume that the roller is cast iron. Sorry, but I don't know if ordinary steel of that time could be hardened and annealed by heating and cooling. If not, what I was suggesting would be a real waste of time. However, if heating/cooling cycles, such as welding on a new outer surface, do cause hardening or annealing, then it might be worthwhile to anneal the shaft first and keep it relatively stress-free during the machining. I really don't know, but I am curious.

You would have had better welds had you cleaned up the rust etc first .

Keith lost like 100lbs Good on you!! He could share some notes with Adam!! Hope it was not. Bypass...

I find it difficult to believe that your reaction to being screamed at would be to hurry up.

Why wouldn't you put a gauge on the shaft while your pressing it. This is pure guessing doing it your way

Doesn't that thing layout horizontal ?? it would be a lot easier and you could weld and turn the knob at the same time without having to reach all the way up and you wouldn't have to stop welding.

That is not a press !! It's. A vaccum cleaner!! I can see that Keith is gonna get sick of that noise press really soon!!

Hey Ken, Couple of things that might be useful to you. First check out those guys in Pakistan . They stick shafts in the press in a couple of V-blocks when the are straightening shafts (That a normal guy would scrap) When they re close they take a surface gauge and put it right in the press to see where they are at. - No going back and fourth to bench centers of the lathe. = How those guys get away with the strff they do wearing Ho Chi Minh sandals and working in the dirt and then get away with it is beyond me, but I do see things that might be useful. - A couple of 2" thick V blocks are pretty useful un the press anyway weather you use the surface gauge or not. Then back when I was 50 pounds lighter and 30 years younger I was the welding engineer/production supe at a big shop where we did LOTS of build ups and re-machining. - We never welded a shaft like that, or anything else including 9 ton steel mill rolls, in the vertical position. If it was me on this one I'd run it horizontal and make up a tail stock with something like a pipe vice tripod. Weld on a stub for a run off tab on the short end if you have to and make a center out of a piece of round bar and sick it in the pile vise and hold the whole thing together with a come-along. - Set the MIG gun about 5 or 10 degrees before top center perpendicular to the axis and pointed streight at the center line. Set the rotation speed so the puddle will solidify as it goes over the top. - You will get better gas coverage and a much cleaner weld that way and you can set up your rack and pinion bar horizontally and step over on the fly with no Start/stops. (Until that air cooled gun starts to overheat. You really need a water cooled gun for 100% duty cycle) Think about it and maybe it will help you the next time (And I'm sure there will be a next time!) Later, Alligator and if you ever get to Cleveland I owe you a couple cold ones for the informative and entertaining vids. - Keep up the good work.

Taper?

Abused and left rusting, now their in a hurry? Okay.

I think you’re just looking for excuses to play with your new press! 😅

Not a fine job

Nice work.

It's a mile off being true ffs......................

Great video thanks for sharing