You forgot one of the most devastating options: A four-handed sword

@milesbrown2261

3 жыл бұрын

somebody said it!! thank you! I was thinking about this! A Zweihander but for four hands or a Vierhander!

@tada-kun982

3 жыл бұрын

@@milesbrown2261 INGENIOUS

@theenduriangamer5509

3 жыл бұрын

Vierhänder. I like the sound of that.

@luckart999

3 жыл бұрын

Epik

@atheoristspointofview7059

3 жыл бұрын

If you think about the force behind a 4 handed sword that could probably split a metal shield in half

The most powerful weapon for creatures with 4 arms would be the piano

@TiagoTiagoT

5 жыл бұрын

Specially if they can play Klingon opera

@ccvcharger

5 жыл бұрын

Imagine them playing Through the Fire and the Flames on Hard mode.

@alexishagerman7038

5 жыл бұрын

Radip _ _ the best bard build

@HPD1171

5 жыл бұрын

imagine them playing the two different pieces in two different keys and have each hand playing a slightly different tempo than you would have a weapon that would cause all the opponents ears to bleed. perhaps maple leaf rag and the mario theme at the same time, that would be a devastating combination.

@sakerminter

5 жыл бұрын

@@HPD1171 my ears are bleeding just by reading your comment

Could you imagine if this four-armed creature kept 1 arm open and in the middle of the fight he pulls out a Snickers bar and starts munching in your face while fighting lol

@onlinepanic2036

2 жыл бұрын

Worlds most dangerous disrespect. Especially because its difficult to eat on the move like that.

@notproductiveproductions3504

2 жыл бұрын

So he’s not wearing a helmet?

@onlinepanic2036

2 жыл бұрын

@@notproductiveproductions3504 most helmets do, in fact, open.

@notproductiveproductions3504

2 жыл бұрын

@@onlinepanic2036 and expose the anatomical off switch on the face?

@onlinepanic2036

2 жыл бұрын

@@notproductiveproductions3504 knight helmets can open. Just because your combatant wears a mask doesnt make it a space helmet.

Due to the sheer versatility of a four armed creature, their deadliest weapon is being prepared for whoever they are fighting. You would have the best chance if you caught them by surprise with weapons they aren't prepared for. like a gun.

@TailsClock

2 жыл бұрын

You pull your gun on the 4 armed fighter. It pulls 4 on you. Through proper spacing of each shot, it could even fire continuously as it reloaded.

@BlightfulProductions

2 жыл бұрын

@@TailsClock four semi auto pistols, fired continuously and with enough skill, those four arms become a slow but effective chaingun/minigun

@wilfchapman-gandy8120

2 жыл бұрын

The 4 handed humanoids in my setting traditionally wielded a glaive, dagger and longsword but switch out for longsword, shortsword and shield. But there's one that has adopted the 'fuck you, two pistols and a musket' approach.

@glowhoo9226

Жыл бұрын

Until the 4 armed fighter pulls out a gun while swinging a sword at you.

@fenrirsrage4609

Жыл бұрын

You forgot to consider if the four armed creature is also strapped. They'll make you realize that while a gu might be a good way to take them out when unprepared. That also applies to you.

One of my rules for fantasy stories and RPGs: "Never go hand to hand with something that has more hands than you."

@jerrybaker8597

4 жыл бұрын

templarw20 right hand to hand not hand two hands

@big_cheese_guy

4 жыл бұрын

@@jerrybaker8597 hand to hand hand

@f.cap.2473

4 жыл бұрын

idk man, if you are for example, a monk in dnd, you could probably beat the living shit out a 4 arm person.

@revol2933

4 жыл бұрын

Obi-Wan Kenobi

@Julian-pw5mv

4 жыл бұрын

@@f.cap.2473 unless that creature is also a monk of the same level

Shad: I don’t have four arms What I heard: I don’t have forearms

@hardpack187

4 жыл бұрын

All biceps and fists!

@revol2933

4 жыл бұрын

Shad has no forearms.

@an8strengthkobold360

4 жыл бұрын

@@hardpack187 this will be the next big fantasy race

@tenaciousstudios03051

4 жыл бұрын

Correction to what you heard: I don't have 4 arms.

@vexx0397

4 жыл бұрын

i visualized his hands being connected to elbows and i do not like it.

5:00 He was meant to fight jedi and the idea is to have attacks come from so many angles at once that the jedi can't defend against it.

I imagined that such a creature would have a higher caloric requirement than a human due to operating more limbs so that would have to be taken into consideration.

@matthieudeloget8998

3 жыл бұрын

So it would get exhausted faster ?

@generationm2059

3 жыл бұрын

@@matthieudeloget8998 Pretty much

@braydenhill4033

3 жыл бұрын

Woahhhhhh that’s coool

@Mr.Nichan

3 жыл бұрын

What if each of the arms was thinner and weaker than human arms individually?

@barrylyndon5552

3 жыл бұрын

Just the coordination of them would burn up calories in the brain and probably really stress them out

Four Crossbows with a dwarf strapped to your back who reloads for you = deadly. Speaking from experience.

@snowrhodes9176

5 жыл бұрын

Let me guess dnd

@wolf-lf4by

5 жыл бұрын

Not really, crossbows take forever to reload

@withlessAsbestos

4 жыл бұрын

Maybe Two Long bows.

@fletcherclausen4349

4 жыл бұрын

What experience...Need Story now

@adlay4181

4 жыл бұрын

@@wolf-lf4by what you’ve just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

Shad: “Doing complex movements with simply two hands is already difficult” Also Shad: “A GREATSWORD, A SWORD, A SPEAR, ALL AT THE SAME TI-“

@thallienwhite3279

4 жыл бұрын

Yeah I am ambidextrous and only know one other person that is as well so yeah

@HappyBeezerStudios

3 жыл бұрын

Doesn't mean they have to swing and stab with all of them at once, but they can carry them and use them when needed without having to sheath or unsheath anything.

@thallienwhite3279

3 жыл бұрын

@@HappyBeezerStudios They get in the way making thing more difficult you would as likely to hit your own weapons as hitting your opponent just watch any video on using two long swords

@BigPanda096

3 жыл бұрын

@@thallienwhite3279 That's why my preferred pair was an axe and a short handled mace with wrist buckler. Very fun, highly effective once you figured out the wrist buckler. For me, my off hand has more brute power than my main hand, but far less dexterity. So a mace is perfect for it, as edge alignment is difficult for me in my off hand, a nice globe style mace has no edge alignment and just needs power to ruin your day. As for my main hand I'm wonderful at edge alignment with axes, and the extra power of an axe just being a boss weapon as is just really goes well together. For me the thing about duel wielding is less about trying to simultaneously attack with two weapons and more about having double the avenues of approach in twice the positions and circumstances. For instance you make a thrust at me and I use my buckler to parry it ground bound, I can then attack with my axe and have a follow up with my mace using it to hold your weapon down, using your desire to recover as a spring force to rocket that mace right into an open spot you can't defend due to being occupied with the axe. During that runtime you aren't ever really focused on simultaneously attacking as people assume you should or would be, it just opens up my possabilities to retaliate and defend depending on the set up.

@Egerit100

3 жыл бұрын

@@BigPanda096 swinging around 4 maces would be cool in general. Or 2 double handed maces. That's a lot of brute power

The four-handed greatsword would be DEVASTATING in battle

@spencer4679

2 жыл бұрын

Yeah it could actually be like 6 ft long because there would be double the strength to wield it

@justsomejerseydevilwithint4606

2 жыл бұрын

@@spencer4679 If it could maintain its st4ucture, that is. It'd have to be adamantium or titanium or something, and a lot thicker.

@vraku9624

Жыл бұрын

The GIANT Sword (Guts)

A four-handed longbow wpuld basically be able to fire Javelins with the velocit of an arrow. Imagine an anti-siege bombardment coming from a castle with archers armed with THOSE. You wouldn't be able to carry enough armor to defend from THAT bombardment.

@an_amazing_ace7810

2 жыл бұрын

The only problem is the amount of resources required to produce that many javelins.

@Kaito57

2 жыл бұрын

At this prize, I’m going with GOT goodness : GIANTS ARCHERS ! The versatility of regular archers with the power of a ballista !!

@MrHoodlin

2 жыл бұрын

@@an_amazing_ace7810 Having four arms means double the productivity of resources harvested.

How to be good fighter: 1. Be four-armed creature. 2. Done.

@josukejostar277

3 жыл бұрын

NAH STEP TOW ORA

@scary.sticks7960

2 жыл бұрын

Not me thinking this said how to be a good father at first-

@ansuz5903

2 жыл бұрын

Imagine being a four-armed gunslinger with terrible aim

@fantasticmrmonk

2 жыл бұрын

@@ansuz5903 accuracy by volume of fire

Next level: four-armed creatures riding centaurs :D

@kythytil7460

5 жыл бұрын

Udwin Four-armed spider centaurs

@gringomoderfoquer8287

5 жыл бұрын

Even better, four-armed Centaurs

@ZombieChimpanzee

5 жыл бұрын

fantasy adventurer sees four armed creature riding centaurs "aw shit here we go again."

@realcheesy6384

5 жыл бұрын

Four armed creatures riding four armed Centaurs...

@skay7097

4 жыл бұрын

Hab dich gefunden

There's also the question of dominant hand/s, how would that effect the ability to use four weapons?

@grimmpotat6911

2 жыл бұрын

Maybe two?

@donutlovingwerewolf8837

2 жыл бұрын

Most likely the upper hands because they will receive orders from the Brain faster

@stevenroetzel4470

2 жыл бұрын

@@donutlovingwerewolf8837 in a typical "medieval" fantasy, how far apart would the arms have to be for there to be a measurable difference at neuron transition speed?

@donutlovingwerewolf8837

2 жыл бұрын

@@stevenroetzel4470 idk im not a neurologist

@stevenroetzel4470

2 жыл бұрын

@@donutlovingwerewolf8837 basically the same as electricity right? Plug a 50' and a 100' extension cords into a 3-way plug, plug both cords in with separate lights or anything else that you can see or hear when they start, plug the 3-way in and then see if you can tell the difference. 😉

optimal weapons choice: Spear and Shield + Bow and Arrow. You'd be able to form a Phalanx that is capable of shooting anything closing in. And that is reeaaaalllyyyyyyyy scary.

@tafazzi-on-discord

2 жыл бұрын

*crossbow

@charlesyergensen8918

2 жыл бұрын

A bow would be crazy you could rapid fire with two arm to grab arrows

@jaredmanwell442

2 жыл бұрын

@@charlesyergensen8918 think bigger my friend, make the bow ballista sized since they're holding/drawing with 4 arms, firing off missiles that common soldiers would consider short spears

@BrokenRazorButterfly

2 жыл бұрын

using a bow with any other weapon at the same time would be kinda dumb, as archery would require 2 hands opposite to each other to allow you to aim, with narrows your vision and takes concentration as well so you couldnt really use your hands for anything else also i love the think bigger comment using something man made for 2 hands just bigger how about a weapon unique to a four armed race, not just "made for 2 arms but more of them or bigger"

@jaredmanwell442

2 жыл бұрын

@@BrokenRazorButterfly aight so do it then

Ok, hear me out : Upper hands : Crossbow Lower hands : Poleaxe Use the poleaxe to keep the enemy at bay, and take your sweet time to aim with the crossbow for a free hit at med range.

@2010AZ

4 жыл бұрын

@ANTOINE RAFAEL R. MAXIMO Put the polaxe aside and reload normally. If you did your job correctly the closest enemy to you is dead, so you have some time. If not, use your poleaxe in the upper hands while reloading to keep him at bay.

@ReachEvilCity

3 жыл бұрын

If you had proper training with a bow a bow would be better than a crossbow 9 time out of 10

@2010AZ

3 жыл бұрын

@@ReachEvilCity @Joran van Olphen It would be hard to use a bow as your pther pair of hands with the poleaxe would get in the way, that's why I suggested a crossbow in the first place

@skynutter.

3 жыл бұрын

Using a big weapon would get in the way of your other arms. And what if the enemy had a ranged weapon or even a spear? Best would be in my opinion a shield and any single handed weapon of choice (mine would be a short spear) in the lower pair and a bow (could be a war bow, long bow, short bow pick your poison). So anyone gets near me I have a shield to block their attacks and a pointy stick to poke em. Trying to run away? Too bad I've got a war bow ready to tear you a new one HAHAHAHAHAH!!!😂

@RheaMainz

3 жыл бұрын

@@skynutter. Full Plate armour negates range weapons and spears enough to allow Pollaxe+crossbow. Crossbows can snipe gaps within armour better than two hand bows can, because two hands gets in the way of things more than one hand, and two hand bows requires one to hold their draw in order to snipe, significantly decreasing stamina. Shield is always a good option, I agree

Shad: explains a new difficult enemy From Software dev's: write that down *frantic scribble sounds*

@simonswanepoel2050

3 жыл бұрын

Talking about Mergo's Wet Nurse?

Weak, unskilled two-armed me would want a spear. Weak, unskilled four-armed me would want 2 spears.

@raaston9761

2 жыл бұрын

Spears are like a starter weapon easy to use even if your unskilled but if you are skilled you are near unstoppable

"These [Four-armed] creatures would be pretty difficult to deal with!" Hi, welcome to Barsoom, death is very frequent here. I'd avoid the Valley Dor, the desert, Jodanga, or literally anywhere that isn't Helium. Enjoy your stay!

@MrFlubber

2 жыл бұрын

This reference intrigues me, what is it from?

@lukelandis3090

2 жыл бұрын

@@MrFlubber Oh, I was reading the John Carter of Mars books by Edgar Rice Burroughs when I wrote that. It's awesome, you should check it out!

@MrFlubber

2 жыл бұрын

@@lukelandis3090 thanks, I'll try to look into that

Hello there.. GENERAL KENOBI ...

@spacewolfblackmane19

5 жыл бұрын

Have 6ou seen the 2003 mini series, that General Grevous is amazing.

@bapabs

5 жыл бұрын

You're a brave one

@germanvisitor2

5 жыл бұрын

@@spacewolfblackmane19 A shame Grievous had to become a little bitch for the 2008 series and his death was so undignified.

@matthewmuir8884

5 жыл бұрын

@Spacewolf Blackmane Yeah; he was. If only he had been that amazing in the 2008 series. Why did they make him just as terrible as he was in Revenge of the Sith? The 2003 series already gave a great explanation for his nerf in the film: Mace Windu crushed his chest with the Force during the Palpatine kidnapping. When I heard that they were continuing the 2008 series, at first I thought: "cool; maybe they can recreate and update that awesome scene", but then I realized, "But what would be the point, given 2008 Clone Wars Grievous is already as terrible and cowardly as he was in Revenge of the Sith..."

@matthewmuir8884

5 жыл бұрын

@germanvisitor2 I wouldn't go as far as to say undignified: he gave Younger Obi-Wan a lot of trouble despite lack of Force-Sensitivity and being severely nerfed compared to the 2003 cartoon. But yeah; it's saddening what they did to his character in ROTS and the 2008 series. I read somewhere that the change was because they were writing the cartoon and ROTS at the same time, and the Clone Wars writers didn't know about the cough or his cowardice; instead having it that Grevious simply knew when to fold when he clearly wasn't going to win. But why give 2008 cartoon Grievous the cough?! Keep him the badass antagonist he was in 2003!

Shad: Mentions how a creature with four spears would be dangerous fight Me: imagines a human trying to stab me with four seperate spears in one hand.

@DisturbedGeneration

3 жыл бұрын

ME TOO

@notproductiveproductions3504

2 жыл бұрын

Xaldin?

Curious how two heavy crossbows would work out as the main weakness of a crossbow is slow reload and firing speed but with two you could alternate and keep a steady stream of bolts going.

@tohaason

Жыл бұрын

It would be challenging (but could maybe be trained to muscle memory) to wind up a crossbow while you're at the same time busy sighting down the other crossbow. With ordinary bows, at least, it would be easy to keep arrows at the ready.

@Peagaporto

9 ай бұрын

​@@tohaasonShield and crossbow

I think the Japanese (or Chinese?) hook sword could be a very effective weapon for these creatures, it isn't very long and in theory, it's made to disarm your opponent. If you have one of these and three other things, you can use one hand to hook your enemy's weapon and use the other hands to finish him off.

Some great things you guys have brought up that I want to highlight: Using a bow and shield together, getting portable cover and full range = deadly! Riding a mount, one hand on reigns, one holding a shield and a saber on each hand on either side = deadly! Also regarding a four armed sword, I think having all hands on the handle would make it quite awkward and the added strength and leverage might be unneeded overkill as we have found out that two handed weapons are easily deadly enough to dispatch most foes.

@silas4lagoon776

5 жыл бұрын

What about 4 armed Orcs?

@catiasantos9470

5 жыл бұрын

what about a little change to your 2h bow idea? 1h holding the bow, 2 drawing it and 1 hand retrieving arrows for faster reload? 2x the power, 2x the speed? a small group of highly trained archers could decimate a larger force before they werre even in reach!

@jameshildebrand907

5 жыл бұрын

I'm imagining more of a phalanx formation of four armed creatures. Maybe that could be a new series on fantasy rearmed, best group formations of fantasy creatures.

@robertnixdorf6168

5 жыл бұрын

@@jameshildebrand907 Omg I can't upvote this enough! That would be amazing.

@authenticmikutard4959

5 жыл бұрын

The theoretical creature's extra limbs ARE the weaponized advantage. There is no need to overthink about the limbs getting in the way of one another because there is no need for quality maneuvers when battling a foe with half your weapon wielding limbs. Just like when you mentioned the 4 spears scenario.The creature can totally wield 4 long 1 handed weapons (or 2 handed depending on it's strength) and make what would be considered unwieldy moves to a 2 armed humanoid since it has 2 whole extra arms to keep it's balance. It's strong and advantageous even while being predictable, the numerical advantage is just too great to overcome: The creature uses lower arms for a horizontal cross section attack, the defender, unless able to move back (or rush forward and risk being baited and stabbed by upper arms), is forced to use both shield and weapon to stop the attack, however predictable it was. Now the creature is still on balance because it's momentum energy was caught up by the defender and can very very easily drop down it's upper weapons on the silly foe, that didn't do the wise thing when facing a dude with 4 arms and weapons: run away, very fast. It would also fight on rinse and repeat with easy, predictable moves that don't make it's own weapons collide. It doesn't need to worry about finesse on a 2v1 "arms race" (lol) or choreography unless you want it to look cool on the comic or movie scene :P

Fighting a creature with four spears. I believe the standard equipment you would bring is four mates.

@couchpotatoe91

5 жыл бұрын

Or, you know, just a ranged weapon to shoot that thing down.

@manamongmen3381

5 жыл бұрын

Good strategy. To bad I don't have any...

@calencor

5 жыл бұрын

hello there.

@Infernoraptor

5 жыл бұрын

That, and some brown pants

@LieutenantSilver

5 жыл бұрын

@@manamongmen3381 -- Distract with bubble wrap, then use dagger.

A very fast motocycle(200mph+), a shield, a lance.

Now, is the easiest part : we must find those creatures

@lostsoulsthc7137

2 жыл бұрын

Last remnant remastered ps4 is 1 game

Do you think this might be an interesting topic for fantasy re-armed: Best castles for [insert fantasy race]? Best castles for centaurs? Best castles for goblins? Best castles for legless snake people? etc

@tornadix99

5 жыл бұрын

yes! Best strongholds for [insert fantasy race]

@andusz5518

5 жыл бұрын

GOBLINS?

@Marcusjnmc

5 жыл бұрын

yes

@Marcusjnmc

5 жыл бұрын

But, WhaT, AbouT DRAGONS?!?!?

@salzstangl

5 жыл бұрын

You build castles depending on what you are trying to hide from, not so much on what race you are hiding. But best castles against sounds like an awesome idea! What about dragons?

Four maces... my god that'd be like trying to withstand a heavy rain of baseball-sized hail XDD

@RiJMC17

5 жыл бұрын

Yeah. I think overwhelming your enemy with blows or impenetrable defense would be the best. Make them regret their decision to face a 4 arm creature.

@jasonleejames_official

4 жыл бұрын

@Shasvin Puvanesvaran 4 axe headed maces, or Fluted maces. kill 2 birds with one stone and save time mass producing the same weapons

@sephikong8323

4 жыл бұрын

*sees something like that* "Oh hell no I am not paid for that"

@b-beale1931

4 жыл бұрын

@@jasonleejames_official 2 shields, 2 fluted maces? impenetrable defence and overwhelming offence

Two hands holding pistols and two hands flipping the enemy off.

@moritamikamikara3879

Жыл бұрын

Damn... that just made me realise something. These things would fucking DOMINATE the pirate game in the early age of gunpowder. Like you'd imagine that in the age before gunpowder, Giants and Centaurs would absolutely dominate, but once matchlocks and flintlocks came out... Imagine a four-arms just draws four fucking ducks foot guns or blunderbusses and clears the entire fucking deck of a warship with them.

6:00 Having played the VR game Battle Talent, 2 long weapons is really a pain. I have used a longer and shorter weapon quite a lot. The long weapon usually hits them but if they start getting closer or if I pull them in then having the short weapon ends up very beneficial.

Obviously it should be a lightsaber. General Grievous taught me that one.

@deadzone4155

4 жыл бұрын

Hello there

@arthurgarcia887

4 жыл бұрын

General Kenobi

@seafaringneptune3573

4 жыл бұрын

You are a bold obe

@primalaspid2843

4 жыл бұрын

Your lightsaber will make a fine addition to my collection

@arthurgarcia887

4 жыл бұрын

I will deal with this Jedi slime myself.

You could do a quickloading bow by alternating your drawing arms. MACHINE GUN BOW

@firecat6666

5 жыл бұрын

I was thinking about dual wielding repeating crossbows rambo style, one on each side

@brandonfoley7519

4 жыл бұрын

Or weild stronger bow?

@felixlenoir49

4 жыл бұрын

actually that's what 2-handed can do

@Awaifn

4 жыл бұрын

Quick Bows from AC Origins: Am I a joke to you?

@thelocust619

4 жыл бұрын

No dual wielding. Just all hands on one greatbow. Just wedge it and play the thing like a harp. If something big comes, feed it 3 to 9 arrows at once like buckshot, accuracy be damned. Thing would need a team of squires just to carry all the arrows.

They could play the piano and the violin at the same time!

Awesome video! Making a fantasy race that 4 arms and I definitely think pole-arms would be far more utilised than we would think of for humans. Particularly the legionnaire combo - Imagine a 2-handed pike, kite shield, and a shortsword like a gladius, ultimate defensive powerhouse. The caveat I think is that when it comes to armour depending on anatomy it would be far far more restrictive and things like plate would limit the range of motion egregiously of those arms, which might make chain or scale the limit, which would mean shields probably remain prevalent well beyond what humans would think is necessary (I mean they have the arms for it, it's a non-problem really) The other option is ofc the berserker, which while falchions are a pretty good choice, think of perhaps a katar-like punching dagger with an armoured gauntlet to protect it for the lower arms, which would be far more useful punching instead of making big swinging actions, and you could hold up those knives in a boxing-like guard, leaving the upper arms free to wield anything really... pole-arm... claymore... I think my favourite would be some kind of naginata or guandao now THAT would be terrifying to face...

*imagines 4-armed dude with kite shield and 3 spears*

@MehrumesDagon

5 жыл бұрын

>after continuing to watch the vid oh nice actually shad did mention that possibility..... I'd root for 3 spear guys vs shield+spear+greatsword tho

@kameradin8964

5 жыл бұрын

@@MehrumesDagon Imagine a bigass 4 handed sword

@MaycroftCholmsky

5 жыл бұрын

@@kameradin8964 it would be just pointless because creatures still have the similar body waight as humans and so can't just wield a hunk of metal larger then themselves. Not to mention that with two-handed swords most of the cuts utilise wielder's body rotation, and by adding another hand in front of a blade while cutting could lead to some difficulities with downward cuts.

@milesmatheson1142

5 жыл бұрын

@@kameradin8964 It'd be far to heavy. Even for a 4-armed person (with human-standard strength).

@GunRunner106

5 жыл бұрын

3 kite shields and 1 spear.

What about their lung capacity? The creature using those extra limbs would be burning through oxygen and need greater blood circulation as well. Without it, they might be quite weak.

@torysaccount5753

5 жыл бұрын

However, their torso would be up to 6 inch taller (for the extra shoulders). All that space could be used for a larger heart and lungs

@abrittishpanfish6269

5 жыл бұрын

I feel like this is where the discussion would move from weapons to theoretical biology

@damonmealor9701

5 жыл бұрын

That might also justify the lack of armour that forces them to use shields instead. If they can't handle the weight of a full set of plate, they might just suffocate & overheat & their hearts could give out. For that reason, I'd give them a tower shield, a pair of spears & a rapier

@germanvisitor2

5 жыл бұрын

How about a third lung in the forehead, like a Klingon?

@thehajduk6451

5 жыл бұрын

As well as more advanced complex brains in order to handle the movement of an extra pair of arms.

Me: *sees the title of this video* Also Me: General Grievous!

4:44 you've already made a few good points I need to consider for a character of mine. glad I started to watch this video. I don't know how I didn't think of how he'd have to adapt from being two armed to four in coordination.

A note that body mechanics with using two arms of the same side wold be very different from "regular" two-handed wielding. Having that in mind i think I'd go with spear in the upper arms and sword and shield in lower. Great video :)

@geoffrogers7590

5 жыл бұрын

I was about to say something very similar. You beat me to the punch. I salute you good sir or madam.

@jarlnils435

5 жыл бұрын

two spears, a gladius and a scutum and one pilum

@shanerooney7288

5 жыл бұрын

I was thinking a twohanded Halberd/pole-axe/pike in opposite arms. Plus shield in front arm and sword in rear arm.

@simonepagnotta5112

5 жыл бұрын

Not just a difference in mechanics with the arms and hands, also a difference in the movement of the lower arms, as they're usually depicted without shoulders, just sticking out from the torso. I assume this would have a big impact on the way the arms move.

@christiangreff5764

5 жыл бұрын

And also a problem with moving your body together with your attacks/blocks/... You either wield more weapons parallel to each other (which reduces the advantage of more weapons) or you wield some of them not in synergy with your body (which reduces their effectiveness and is kind of a balance problem). That's why I would choose a (long) main weapon and use the other hands for defensive (short parrying weapons or shields) and maybe one alternative weapon with less rwach for opponents that close in. My idea would be a spear/flail/polearm in the lower hands and two shields in the upper hands. Attack your opponents legs with reach (and easier acces because lower arms) or counter their attacks while blocking with shields. Maybe even better: One shield in one upper hand, a two handed spear in the lower hands and a shorter spear (or sword) in the other upper hand. Reach of a two-handed spear, defenses of a shield and a shorter spear (or sword) for opponents that close the distance; while simultaneously loosing as little as possible to the additional obstacles that having two additional arms creates for wielding weapons.

Wouldn't the also be able to have a sheild as well as the bow? instead of holding the shaft with two hands you only use one: that way you can have a sheild resting down so you can protect yourself from incoming arrows?

@DumbassCatboy

5 жыл бұрын

I was going to point this out, yeah! It would also make them a lot tougher in melee. Actually, what if you've got spearmen that can fight in melee and shoot arrows simultaneously? Now that'd be terrifying...

@Skeleton-bs7zy

5 жыл бұрын

Each hand could be firing a arrow

@milesmatheson1142

5 жыл бұрын

@@Skeleton-bs7zy You'd need to be significantly trained in order to aim 2 bows, especially at different targets, at once. Because you can really only "aim down sights" on one bow, at a time. You might as well try firing two guns at once, and hitting both targets.

@jasoncrowell8863

5 жыл бұрын

@@milesmatheson1142 If you were trying to put as many arrows in the air as possible it could still work. One situation might be if the enemy was at a moderate range and tightly packed and/or in vast numbers.

@trathanstargazer6421

5 жыл бұрын

I was thinking a bow, shield and arming sword/mace combo. The bow would be great for the range but if they get close they still can fight. Not to mention you could still use the bow in that fight. The moment they mess up, THAWK, arrow to the face.

A great combination would be a Ōdachi held by the upper arms and two katanas held by the bottom arms

It would be interesting to see them in formation and how they would fight

2000years later octopus have evolved to be the most deadly fighters with 6 arms Super comoflage Aquatic abilties

@novaraptorus6250

4 жыл бұрын

Sanjeev K Sharma wielding 1 tower shield, 1 bow, 2 spears and a sword!

@Felixr2

4 жыл бұрын

@@novaraptorus6250 Just you wait until they come at you with a six-handed sword

@novaraptorus6250

4 жыл бұрын

@@Felixr2 they could probably box themselves in with six shields

@Felixr2

4 жыл бұрын

@@novaraptorus6250 One large shield would be better. A six shield wall has penetrable gaps. Now imagine a cylinder-shaped shield around the whole body, held with two arms, and four spears coming out from the top.

@justinanderson2460

4 жыл бұрын

And the bane of Merfolk everywhere

I think you missed the biggest advantage: They can stow/draw/reload weapons with one hand and still have 3 actively participating in combat.

@yungjoemighty879

5 жыл бұрын

two crossbows

@bobbywatson942

5 жыл бұрын

MrBerns42 One hand holding the bow/crossbow, one hand pulling the string/arming the crossbow, one hand getting more arrows and one hand with a sword or shield

@the_honkler778

5 жыл бұрын

*_DUAL WIELD CROSSBOWS_*

@petrsukenik9266

5 жыл бұрын

one crosbow and sword, you fight oponent that can shoot you to face every moment

@EyeOfEld

5 жыл бұрын

Pavise in 2 hands, crossbow in the other 2, with a sword and warhammer on the belt.

Imagine a mobility quad-falchion build. Deflect their spear and longsword, then gut them twice.

I personally think TCW had the right idea with a four armed warrior dual wielding double bladed lightsabers/swords (referencing pong krell for those that are curious)

General Grevious needs to calm down. He's in space and I can hear him coughing down on earth.

I think it would help coordination, if one were to use a fairly intuitive weapon: A Katar, for example, is basically just a sword to punch with. No certain grips, no edge alignment, not much chance to tangle the weapons, but maybe most importantly it wouldn't impede balance as much as larger/heavier weapons would with a four armed creature. Punching motions are very intuitive and come natural even under heavy stress. With one or two shields, armored limbs and multiple Katars, you would have a whirlwind of pointy stuff coming at you. That would put the initiative on the side of our four armed fella, who only needs to probe for an opening without difficult technique or extensive training, while the opponent can't keep up with every hand movement at once, no matter their training. Maybe give him a javelin or two, just to be more unfair.

@Hjgudlssksl67

5 жыл бұрын

Am besten 4 nerfguns. Grüße gehen raus

@DragonHunter24

5 жыл бұрын

Du hier o.O

A two handed sword on one side, and a shield and dagger on the other could be devastating

I was needing this exact video

"This video will make a nice addition to my favorites."

Here is my favorite: Two shields and two spears, practically getting 2 hoplites with the price of one. No more phalanx weakness on the right flank, no more formation drifting right, less chance of breaking the shield wall, etc.... Also two shields on the upper and two xiphos on the lower, very nastily effective in disembowling understroke and stuffs... Or, maybe two shields on the lower while the upper arms would hold a single spear. More control that way. Or, for ranged fighting, how about two repeating-crossbow? Now that would be an idea, MOAR DAKKA lolz.....

@thetalantonx

4 жыл бұрын

That's definitely my tied for my favorite, with the other being four spears or four piercing blades. Being able to generate as many independent lines of attack as possible, or cancelling all possible lines of attack through defense and still being able to generate your own lines seems to be the best way to go. Second-favorite behind those two would be something like two short blades and two armored gauntlets. Being able to grab and neutralize enemy weapons and still attack.

@mikesoria3418

4 жыл бұрын

Two sheilds below and a normal crossbow on top is a fucking tank.

@thelorp5186

4 жыл бұрын

So, a biological tank that screams insults at you, I like it... No I love it!!

@dashiellgillingham4579

4 жыл бұрын

Funny you used the ‘dakka’ line; look up the Laer from Warhammer 40k and pay attention to their preferred load out.

@novaraptorus6250

4 жыл бұрын

I prefer 2 spears, 1 tower shield and 1 sword. Impenetrable!

Here is the usual full support. I think I'm past the halfway point of rewatching your videos, but I'm not sure. At least a third for sure.

I am late to the party here but I love this concept of four-armed man-at-arms. There were a couple of thoughts I had, while not quite traditionally medieval a kite shield with a second handle for greater articulation of movement in parrying and blocking could prove useful. Secondly possibly leaving one hand free for grappling purposes, or allowing for the possibility at least ie) having a shield, spear, "longsword" setup were if needed one could one-hand the longsword and say grab the/an opponent to throw them off balance or disarm them. While far from honourable a "free hand" could deploy pocket sand into an opponents eyes while still wielding your 2-3 other weapons. This is all just a fun thought experiment, love your channel please keep up the good work.

This, combined with your video on snake creatures have been incredibly helpful for me! I'm currently both running dnd games and writing books in a fantasy world with giant, four armed snake-creatures...They're rather scary.

@DinnerForkTongue

5 жыл бұрын

Isn't there a Hindu deity like that?

@blackguard5883

5 жыл бұрын

I often thought about traditional Nagas in this sense. Do yourself a favor and don't double the shoulder joint. Just bring the pelvic girdle up, potentially to directly beneath the rib-cage. Then just use the preexisting ball-and-socket joints of the hips, make the second arm set modified legs. The shoulder mechanism is _very_ complex, and requires a lot of interacting muscle groups and specialized bones. If you think about it, the most convincing dragon models simply mount a ball-and-socket joint on the back face of the scapula, as anyone looking at the anatomy sees the problem of just trying to double the shoulder mechanism. The only caveat to "leg-arms" would be the lack of backward mobility. Forward/up/down/left/right, all pretty good. Behind? not so much.

@LizardBrain723

5 жыл бұрын

@@blackguard5883 A very interesting thought, but i don't believe snakes have hips and the appropriate joints? I should probably say by snake people, i don't mean they just have snake heads or features, they have full serpentine forms and these four arms protrude from a "torso" upon the upper part of this lengthy snake body.

@blackguard5883

5 жыл бұрын

@@LizardBrain723 It depends on your evolutionary pattern. But lizards came before snakes, and lizards have hips. Even if they were arboreal reptilians, or even weasel-like mammals, those limbs have to come from somewhere. Easiest solution is from quadruped to 4-armed slithering. And from my perspective (as a biology nerd), your best options are either in the trees, or in the water. Check out PBS Eons "Great snake debate" video. In that case, the pelvis moved down the body and was minimized. (Edited for typo)

@dvklaveren

5 жыл бұрын

For my D&D games, four-armed creatures wield war-scissors. I don't mean the roman siscor, I mean actual sisscors the size of humans. Because they can be held in two points, they have a huge range advantage, while being able to cover a much wider line of defense. The scissors snap forward and *WHAM* your arm's been dismembered or pinched.

What I want to know is how good are they in mounted combat. They have four arms. So they can try lance & shield or dual wielding while still maintaining control of their mount with their free hands. Better yet, ranged mounted combat. With four arms, ranged weapon, plate armor, and mounts, they're basically a medieval tank.

@Ditidos

5 жыл бұрын

They are basically like the centaurs but with less control of the mount really. And without the capacity to have someone on the back.

@pennyfarting

5 жыл бұрын

But MUCH better capacity to aim while at full gallop since they can stand up in the saddle.

@Ditidos

5 жыл бұрын

@@pennyfarting Well, if they can manage to manuver the horse at the same time yes, anyway a centaur could just have someone in the back doing that. The big point of centaur riding is that there isn't a need to actually guide the horse. Then again it could bring up the question, what about a four armed person in a centaur back?

@SonsOfLorgar

5 жыл бұрын

@@Ditidos or a four armed person on the back of a four armed centaur...

@Ditidos

5 жыл бұрын

@@SonsOfLorgar OMG! Four armed centaurs! That sounds almost as deadly as the fairy!

"You fool, count dooku has trained me in your Jedi arts"

3:40 Oh! I was about to say something about that but glad you addressed it! 👍

I was just thinking of a four-armed creature using a 400lb draw strength bow: "Be vewwwwy qwiet. We're hunting Shermans" :D

@xenoswarrior6900

4 жыл бұрын

Underrated lol

@ezla1663

3 жыл бұрын

🤣🤣🤣

@SamnissArandeen

3 жыл бұрын

400 lb? That's not a bow, that's a leaf spring.

@NikkiTheOtter

3 жыл бұрын

Remember, John Carter of Mars did actually demonstrate a double-grip Falchion, a 4-hand bow draw, and a 4-hand long-arm. From the green martians. (Specifically, Tars Tarkus held his bow that was longer than John Carter's entire body, with his two left arms, and drew with both right-arms on either side of the arrow, fingers touching, and also held a rifle with three hands on the stock to aim. And the Warchief of the green martians held a 4-handed executioner sword briefly)

@steveminecraft4364

3 жыл бұрын

We’we* and Shewmans*

I feel a sudden urge to use a four-armed character in my next RPG game.

@solronjalyngvrrolstad9627

4 жыл бұрын

So do i

@mindofthelion712

3 жыл бұрын

The new Astral Monk can give you that

Guns guns guns Submachine guns on the bottom hands, one sniper rifle, and one explosive launcher. Edit: if you want a fantasy setting, a magic caster with four arms is typically deadly to deal with, they are used to multitasking because of four arms, so they can cast different magic at the same time. Worse if they carry 2 tower shields with them.

@dillonzehnder9313

2 жыл бұрын

since when do ppl use a single hand for any of those weapons? Remember they've only got 2 eyes. Honestly the deadliest thing a 4-armed person could wield would likely be a weapon that is normally only mounted. Something like a minigun, automatic grenade launcher, or .50 cal can't be wielded as a hand-held gun by a human because it's too heavy to lift or aim. I can't imagine anything deadlier than a squad with a mix of the weapons I mentioned

@JacobL228

Жыл бұрын

Spells often have verbal components to them, so that wouldn't work as you'd only have one mouth.

@liasonlee1248

Жыл бұрын

@@JacobL228 often, but not quite, do you know Skyrim? Most worldbuilding put magicians at the disadvantage of casting spells verbally so that they can be countered immediately, because without that magic is overpowered.

@JacobL228

Жыл бұрын

@@liasonlee1248 That's a game where your avatar doesn't have any speaking lines regardless of your build, but even then, you're not able to cast spells and shout at the same time, right?

@liasonlee1248

Жыл бұрын

@@JacobL228 uhh, no, what i meant is that you can cast different spells with both your hands, shout is just another system of magic.

4 quarterstaffs. Imagine the spinning knockoutmachine that would be.

There is also a little disadvantage to being 4 armed that their armor would have a lot of openings. Imagine the opening below the armpit on a normal human and multiply that by 2, plus the impossibility of using pauldrons in the lower arms and also that chest pieces that can't comfortably go around you back as a solid piece. They would probably have to use chainmail instead of plates for the chest and torso.I guess your best strategy is using shield + mace with a dagger as a secondary option and hope for the best. Because thinking about it. If i were a four armed man in battle with a human i would use 2 arms to stop the movement of my opponent and 2 arms to attack him.

@1FatLittleMonkey

5 жыл бұрын

The difficulty in making good armour, and the extra arms, would favour the species sticking with shields. Instead of plate armour, you might see two shields on one side. A larger lower shield to protect the legs and main torso, and a small nimble upper shield to protect the head and arms. Lock them together to create your own "shield wall" against ranged weapons. Double handed spear on the other side. If the opponent gets inside the spear, the shields can be bought across to defend _and_ bludgeon while you draw back and shorten your spear-hold (two hands still available to move your grip quickly) or drop one hand from the spear to grab a dagger from your belt. (Aside: Speaking of shield-walls. What about 4-armed critters in formations. The upper arms could act like the second line in a formation, except being able to reach even further over the shield-wall. A shield and spear wall with these guys would be nasty.)

@DocWolph

5 жыл бұрын

You might want to look at some species of beetle to get an idea of how armor for a four-arm would work. Pauldrons would not be fully required for the lower arms but would, if used, be considerably smaller or set lower on the lower arm shoulders. And it is assumed that such people would develop armor that is actually fully protective, not needlessly encumbering, and would learn how to wear and use it like a proper defensive system.

@matthewmuir8884

5 жыл бұрын

I would imagine that they can wear plate armour on the upper part of the chest and the upper arms, and could wear that over mail or a gambeson (and jack chains on the lower arms in the case of gambeson), and I think they would want just one shield; any more would be overkill. The shield would be held by one of the lower arms, the other lower arm would carry a spear, and the upper arms would carry various weapons based on the situation: swords and maces/warhammers if the enemy closes in, and javelins for throwing or for using as spears if facing an opponent with a large shield.

@ninjahombrepalito1721

5 жыл бұрын

Plate armor with chainmail for the torso (probably with parts of plate armor). Or gambisons. Still a shield, spear and sword would be very effective, a dagger in case they lose a weapon. Heck, perfect Roman legionaire.

@royegabrieli5858

5 жыл бұрын

​@@ninjahombrepalito1721 I think they could use plate armor for the upper part and lamellar armor for the lower part(As it is more effective than chain mail). But as shad said, they might be the kind of species to get tired fast, in which case they might just use chain mail or gambeson only simply because its lighter.

For the first 30 seconds I couldn't stop staring at the dragon but then there were images and I was like "Oh right, I was watching a video". Mild dragon obsession xD

What came to mind for me was a shield, a spear for sniping the leg and poking from a distance, some sort of forward curving weapon to snipe the head over an opponents shield and dealing powerfull cuts, and a short gladius type weapon for if you or the opponent close the distance.

I once played a 7 ft tall warforged with 4 arms in dnd and I gave him a longsword in his right two arms and a tower shield in his left top arm and an arm mounted crossbow on his left bottom arm. It was a soldier programmed to kill without remourse

My thought was a two handed spear in the bottom two hands, a shield, and a one handed sword. Because your primary weapon is the long one, put more of your hand slots into that. Plus, dedicating the weapons in rows instead of columns seems like it would be more ergonomic. I could see wielding two narrow shields just to cover yourself from multiple angles. Same coverage, more versatility. Bowmen with shields, shad, bowmen with shields. Forget the four handed bow, on a battlefield, this is king. If you can't get more volume of fire, what you want next is protection. Range is lower priority than surviving. Then you have an extra hand, (one hand can't take the weight if you pull with two) which would be used to load arrows more quickly, until somebody gets uncomfortably close, then its right there to draw a sword. Its worth noting that even in humans, one hand sees more use than the other and serves as the dominant hand. I imagine the effect is amplified in four armed people, resulting in a dominant pair, and as such, you wouldn't necessarily expect all of their arms to be equally as strong as ours, or equally as coordinated.

@Rakaziel

5 жыл бұрын

It would work best with tower shields, preferably with teeth you can ram into the ground, and hook the bow into for extra stability (and in turn can brace it with a leg, leaning your body weight into keeping the bow taut). Might be a bit more exhausting to carry, but you only really need them for the first rank. Add extra spikes to the front of the shield to deter pursuers and you have a mobile rampart.

@1FatLittleMonkey

5 жыл бұрын

Nuada: "(one hand can't take the weight if you pull with two)" If you mean when holding the bow with one hand, drawing with two. Not necessarily. Your arm is a lot stronger when extended and locked than when pulling back to your shoulder. (Same as your legs being stronger when your knees are locked and your femurs under your hips, then when squatting. Or think holding a door shut vs pulling it open.) Hence two-hand drawing might stronger and/or faster. Also, your ability to coordinate is weaker when using more of your strength; archers seem to have to draw and then set for a moment to aim. So drawing with two arms means using less strength with each arm, which might let make it easier to aim while drawing. Similarly, your muscles shake when tired, that's less critical in your forward arm, but not for your drawing arm(s). So that might be another reason to make things easier on your drawing arm(s). [Aside: I should have read down further before replying above. You'd covered a lot of the points/suggestions I made. Especially shielded bowmen and double-shielding (although I would go one-low one-high, rather than side-by-side.)]

@davidthomas2870

5 жыл бұрын

Better yet: two crossbows. Aim and fire one while reloading the other, double rate of fire.

@Bigdsl97

5 жыл бұрын

@@davidthomas2870 Depends on what type of crossbow, unless you're gonna be bent over the whole time.

@wildgoose1000

5 жыл бұрын

I would have the same bit the spear in the top set of arm so could reach over the top and thrust down easier

There was an old Spanish formation called a Tercio . It was composed of a third pike men, a third swordsmen, and a third composed of gunners. Since guns are out, a cross bow will do to substitute. This formation made Spain feared as most didn't have an answer to the formation. So this four armed dude can hold a pike to hold off people at range, an arming sword to get those who sweep the pike aside, and a crossbow to engage targets at distance. Every four armed soldier is a one man Tercio. Throw in a pavise as a shield so he has cover for ranged attacks.

a fine edition to my collection

In Destiny 2, one of the primary antagonist races is a species known as Eliksni, which are four-armed insectoids. One of the main criticisms I always had of the Eliksni is that they never seemed to use their lower arms for anything. Hell, they even developed a practice known as docking where they would cut the lower arms off. Mithrax is one of the better-known Eliksni, and he is a Splicer: a Eliksni able to commune with machines. In the Season of the Splicer cinematic, you can see him holding a Wire Rifle with his upper arms, but his splicer gauntlet is on his trigger arm, when it would probably make more sense to have it on one of his lower arms.

@ArminaticsVoiceArtist

Жыл бұрын

@ThexLoneWolf could be that the lower arms are aimply weaker

3:15 I simply choose not to get offended.

@thesurgeon0462

5 жыл бұрын

😁That's a good one. I wouldn't have even though of that without seeing your comment.

@milesmatheson1142

5 жыл бұрын

+20 Armor Class.

@gabriel300010

5 жыл бұрын

thick skin he?

@KingOpenReview

5 жыл бұрын

Heavy armor: 100

@purpleboye_

5 жыл бұрын

Do my sword strikes offend you?

*General Grievous wants to know your location*

@novaraptorus6250

4 жыл бұрын

Thibson34 wants to know your location

@Bruh-qk3ot

4 жыл бұрын

Alex of the Awesome Wings I’m dead

@novaraptorus6250

4 жыл бұрын

@@Bruh-qk3ot He owes me what you’d call a ‘life-debt.’ Your gods demand that his life belongs to me.

@jaxonprouse5337

4 жыл бұрын

Hello there

@justsomedude1593

4 жыл бұрын

Fallen want to know your location

Pole arm for the top 2 arms and a kite shield bottom left arming sword bottom right. More specifically pole axe to slash and stab at long range and the arming sword off the side to not get in the way unless someone was a bit close. Shield to block anything with too much power behind it to deflect the blow

I think that the best combination would be a two handed spear, a tower kite shield, and a Dirk and targe. If you held the spear in one left and right hand you could then you have a shield blocking both sides. You could hide behind the tower shield whilst stabbing away with the spear. If anyone trys to throw a stab around the side that doesn't have a shield you could block with the targe or counter with the same hand if you are rushed down. This would allow you to use the tower shield further to your side protecting that side far greater than humans would with the same shield. The Dirk and targe would be in a hand on the dominant side, if they only have one dominant hand that should have the targe in it for maximum maneuverability

There's an interesting physiological point I've wished I had a way to test. When we use two-handed weapons, our elbows are bent in opposing directions. That flexibility is important for quite a few movements. Shoulder rotation is probably a similar issue.A Thark (or whatever) with a two-handed weapon on each side would have elbows in the same direction, and I think that might not work as well for leverage. And that's not getting into the flexibility issue of having two sets of shoulder blades (or some other arrangement of bone that supports the extra arms.) You'd have to build a working 4-armed skeleton to see how it would work. This is not a skill I possess, so I will probably just have to keep wondering.

@theogoltzman5372

5 жыл бұрын

I was thinking the same thing. I suspect the issue you run into is if 2 hands on the same side hold something, you've got a four bar linkage. Essentially, imagine a square with pivoting corners, but the side length remains fixed. It's a very restrictive scenario, and even though you could bend you elbows, it's a major issue. Something as basic as throwing a two handed (one handed to us two armed creatures) sword cut becomes a major exercise in coordination- you'd need the lower and upper arms to bend and straighten in exactly the right ways, and I think it would still be awkward (as a test, try to follow a sword cut with the leg on that side as well, as though it was an arm- the joints are fairly similar in layout, except for the foot itself. It's really quite awkward to do). Also, in a four bar linkage all four pieces can be moved (indirectly at least) from one joint, and there tends to be reciprocal stress if you power more than one joint. i would expect that it would be uncomfortable or otherwise bad for the joints of a four armed creature to use two arms on one side on the same weapon.

@andrewness

5 жыл бұрын

@@theogoltzman5372 You can pivot your wrist, too, but it is probably easier to just use one hand from each side. You still have two left over.

@asdfghjkl2317

5 жыл бұрын

I think using two handed weapons on the same side could also put you offbalance, I would always manouver them with opposite hands, possibly of the same grade (upper or lower hands, never mixing)

@sockmonkey6666

5 жыл бұрын

When using a two-handed sword with both hands on the same side, you would use it the same way as a one-handed sword. You still get the greater damage, but are limited to just those techniques.

@AlMeSeLo

5 жыл бұрын

Why not have one upper arm and the opposite lower arm holding the sword, the remaining upper arm has the spear, and the remaining lower arm has the shield?

Just give him two of Joerg’s instant Legolas and have two hands loading one while the other two shoot so he can keep a constant stream. Boom, Undefeatable

@NaqrSeranvis

3 жыл бұрын

Interesting, but in order for it to work, that four-armed creature would have to have chameleon-like eyes as well. One to focus on aiming and another to focus on reloading another device.

@ethanlocke3604

3 жыл бұрын

@@NaqrSeranvis I’m pretty sure with practice you could load one with only glancing, and either way they could shoot a lot more than a two armed person

Yeah this is largely what I did with my Kasatha cavalier in a pathfinder game. N'mossa the Red Wind was primarily a mounted charger build so she had a lance and a shield but I also had a backup longsword and greatsword. Never really had to deal with the whole getting inside my reach thing cause of the rules of course, but it was always very fun to reap the benefits of many limbs. Together with her horse Typhoon she could dish out some insane damage each round. Was definitely a favorite character

One I was wondering about for 4-armed critters: the top two arms wield a crossbow or firearm, one of the lower arms has a big shield that the ranged weapon can be rested on, and the remaining arm hold spare ammo or a melee weapon for when charged.

This videos title should have been "fantsy 4 armed"

@iota-09

5 жыл бұрын

230 likes and not one comment(till this)... That speaks lengths.

Ohhhhhhh "four arms" not "forearms" I was so confused for a bit there.

In case of rapier and dagger: using two rapiers and two daggers having one rapier in the higher right hand and the other in the lower left hand (daggers accordingly in lower right and higher left) facing the opponent with the right side could be very useful. You could block both opponents weapons and still have something to attack with. Edit: or maybe two daggers, a buckler and a rapier. My point being - block the opponent and make a thrust.

My first D&D character was an anthropomorphic cerberus with four arms and three heads. Her weapon combinations were: A) Two shortswords (lower) and two arming swords (upper) that had blades designed to catch weapons or limbs so she could disable the enemy's weapon and reach for a weak spot in the armor with the shortswords B) Two scimitars (upper) and two daggers (lower) that could be thrown. She carried a lot of daggers with this set up. C) Longsword and throwable spears D) Double-bladed sword with two hands, dagger, and free hand for casting spells

I thought some extra options that I think you haven't considered. 1- Towershield and pike. Having four arms they could wield incredibly long spears (like a pike) with only one side of their bodies and on the other side wield a incrdibly big shield. That would make them able to engage enemies from an incredibly long distance with a practically total defence against ballistic weapons like bows and crossbows. Also, wielding the tower shield with two hands they could swing it more easily taking advantage from the leverage granted by a double wield (exacly like a two handed weapon). 2- Two handed weapon and two armored fists. In this configuration they would use the two handed weapon in a classic why but they also have the advantage of having two extra hands free. They could, for example, parry a blow from the enemy and at the same time grappling him, maybe stabbing him with a really short weapon like a dagger or some sharp studs on the knuckles of theur gauntlet. 3- "Super-heavy" lever actioned crossbows. One problem with a crossbow is the reloading times, parially solved with the lever solution. Now image this creature that wield the weapon with one hand, pulls the lever with other two hands and is already ready to place a bolt with the fourth hand. 4- Crossbow, shield and spear. Practically the same of a pavese-equiped crossbowman but with more mobility and combat effectiveness. Let me know what you think about these options and continue your work, it's AMAZING!

@LeonM4c

5 жыл бұрын

3 blew my mind. Like a living bolt gun.

@johnkidby7948

5 жыл бұрын

3 is brilliant.

@josephburchanowski4636

5 жыл бұрын

For the 1; I feel that the tower shield should be made for being one handed with the option of being two handed. That way you can two hand it for the extra nimbleness and leverage. But then one hand it and pull out a well place dagger if someone got passed your pole arm; or go 3 handed pole arm. I'd also like to see what 3-4 armed weapons they could come up with. I also feel like there are some weapon designs that could be viable for a 4 handed creature that just aren't effective for 2 handed creatures. For instances could a 4 armed creature use dueling shields effectively?

@LordButtersI

5 жыл бұрын

1 is basically a hellenic phalanx except with full size spears. Plus, the third hand can use a short sword so the phalanx doesnt have to drop the spears to resort to backup melee.

@Beremor

5 жыл бұрын

Here's my two cents: 1) I see three big problems here, and all are related to the weight of the weapons. The first problem is that with a long and heavy spear as well as a massive shield, manoeuverability becomes a big issue. You'd basically have to haul around several pieces of encumering equipment at once which would slow you down massively. The second problem is that fighting with such heavy gear would probably exhaust you quickly. And the third problem is just balance. I don't see an average human-like creature being very stable on their feet while handling two pieces of unwieldy weaponry at the same time. 2) I agree, that sounds like a solid idea for dueling purposes. In general, having one or two hands free is a massive advantage in dueling, but that constraint alone still leaves you with loads of choices, such as taking a buckler or dagger in one of your remaining free hands. 3) I don't see that drastically improving the fire rate of heavy crossbows, but it might be worth considering. The big limiting factor of war crossbows (at least as far as I've seen) is obviously the stupendously high draw weight. If you have a crossbow that is light enough that you "only" need a lever to cock it, it won't have much penetration power, and if it's heavy enough that it needs a winch, having four arms won't help you much. 4) That could work out, yes. I don't see any fundamental flaws with that.

Four arms means increased skeleton, and more importantly, increased skeletal muscle, requiring more food and more oxygen. The way to beat a four-armed creature is to tire them out, and the creature would know that and choose weapons that would allow it to duel longer without tiring. Wearing armor would allow it to distribute the weight of it's defense better, reducing strain, so a shield is not optimal. My vote would be a spear or pole-arm in the top two arms to keep an enemy at a distance. If the opponent got inside the range of the spear/pole arm, then an arming sword and dagger would be best in the lower two arms.

@Fuzzycat16

5 жыл бұрын

"coughs" magical....

@philsburydoboy

5 жыл бұрын

Cardio...

@casimiriii5941

5 жыл бұрын

neither cardio or maɡic, you can shift around metabolic functions to ɡain the enerɡy required to use four arms unstead of two. You could also create calorie rich food sources while world buildinɡ. You can also reduce the bone needed by explaininɡ the evolution of four arms. For instance a two armed ancestor evolves by splittinɡ its arms into two as opposed to ɡrowinɡ extra limbs. Thouɡh the resultinɡ arms would have half the amount of diɡits on their hands and would be some what weak. Or they could be piɡmes as a way to conserve enerɡy. In any case I'd look at octapus, squids, insects, arachnids, and other real animals with more than two arms for source material to explain it.

@justinthompson6364

5 жыл бұрын

The additional muscle mass probably wouldn't be all that much, maybe 15% at maximum. That's enough for a nonzero disadvantage, especially if it's exerting all four arms at the same time, but I'm not sure if it would be enough to rely on tiring one out. The size or efficiency of the lungs and/or cardiovascular system could be tweaked a bit and would easily offset that problem. It wouldn't effect the food problem, but that would be unlikely to influence combat except in a long, pitched battle. Maybe more significant than the extra muscle mass would be brain stem, which would have to be more developed to coordinate four arms. The brain does use about 20% of your calorie intake, after all.

@casimiriii5941

5 жыл бұрын

if its anythinɡ like a octupus, which has more than two arms, the brain function isn't too relevant. Octupus can use their arms not just idependent of each other but independent of thouɡht. They virtually think for themselves.

Longswords on top cressent at the bottom, probably an advantage of constant punches tiaring out one set of arms to them swotch to another, leadong to a lactic assod issue. The more you train the more lactic accid your body is use to. If its goro long swords on top if not if smaller hand and a half swords. Shorter 4 arms bottom set war hammer and dagger, top hand and a half swords. I think archery might be a good idea, stiffer potentially more stable postures are good for archers. Long bow at the top, buckler and an arrow bag at the bottom

I have a nearly 11 foot shadow titan oc, a race of my own making and he uses one two handed greatsword, and his lower set of arms are used for catching/stopping attacks coming from his side- if anything can reach his chest that is..

Okay, I know this is out there.. But I had a DnD character that used a tower shield and a great cross bow together, even in close range combat. He was DEVASTATING.

@stoutyyyy

4 жыл бұрын

Scotty The Rambler man really went full Pavise

@shuriken188

4 жыл бұрын

In Shadowrun (cyberpunk with fantasy elements), there's a rare variant of humans called nartaki. Nartaki are pretty normal except they have weird skin colours and four arms. I've spent an inordinate amount of time considering their effectiveness in CQC situations. A nartaki could carry one or two ballistic shields while still using a rifle, carbine, shotgun, or handgun completely normally with one pair of hands. With a single shield, the nartaki could open the shield out along the room, holding the shield in front in a comfortable position. Their firearm would naturally aim along the shield to the side, so they could easily aim and fire at targets as the shield moves along, providing cover from the parts of the room not yet cleared. Practically a one-man breach team. Normally, with basic two-armed humanoid teams, it's very hard to manage more than one shield in a breach, and the second shield is much less effective. That means only one direction can be properly covered by the shield-bearer, the rest being cleared by additional squad members. If you have a squad member strong enough to carry two shields, you can provide similar cover to the first scenario for squadmates, but really, in the end, one shield used properly will be effectively similar, and the shield-bearer can carry a handgun. A four-armed person can take better advantage of two ballistic shields, however, since they can carry a larger firearm. Assuming the person's dominant hand is on the right side (just flip directions for left-handed people), the right shield hand can cover the front and right for the shield-bearer and their squadmates, the left shield can cover the left side, and the firearm can be aimed through the gap between them to the front-left. The shields can be adjusted to ensure sufficient space to aim and fire at targets. Of course, with firearms, you can also carry two rifles, or a rifle and a shotgun, or whatever other combination of firearms. Carrying two primary weapons, one of them flipped (left hand on the trigger) can allow you to easily cover a wide angle so you can clear spaces much faster (and therefore more safely) alone, though in a formal (police, military, etc.) setting you'd have to convince your superiors you can acquire targets effectively enough in that wide an angle such that you don't accidentally kill friendlies or civilians. In Shadowrun, a HUD in your helmet or cyborg eyes can light up friendlies or possible targets so you can more easily identify people out of the corner of your eye, so it's less of a problem. Applying that idea of two primary ranged weapons to fantasy, you could have two crossbows, one loading while the other aims and shoots. That could potentially double your rate of fire, which would sort of flip the general idea that bows are fast and crossbows are strong, since as Shad mentioned, a four-armed archer could use a very strong bow but only use one bow at once. Crossbows, if held one over the other completely normally, can be used with minimal interference, so they could aim and shoot in a staggered pattern. Dang, I wasn't planning on writing a wall. *TL;DR* A four-armed SWAT squaddie could shoot between two ballistic shields with a rifle, or hold a shield with less difficulty than a normal shield-bearer while still pointing a firearm sideways completely normally. The implications of this in tactical combat are significant.

@scottytherambler6919

4 жыл бұрын

@@shuriken188 that's similar to my character build in 3.5 homebrew. An athatch warrior that uses a tower shield, a repeating crossbow, the shield is carried by the dominantly strong arm, while the crossbow is aimed with the center arm, and actuated with the non dominant outer arm. Since typically the third arm comes from the chin, neck, or chest area, and has an almost gimball turret like motion, aiming it is easy, but cocking it works like it does for a human, the creature has to focus on the task at hand because of the awkward handling properties of a 2 handed weapon being actuated from the center of the body. However on occasion he would carry 3 shields, 1 spiked buckler, and 2 spiked large shields. With an str of 22, he had no issues straight up throwing team mates like a giant, but also could one man wall of shields, and shield charge with the surface area of a larger creature... Basically a shield charge that hits 2 people instead of one. The shields were adapted after the crossbow proved ineffective on an open battlefield combined with the shield. Thinking quickly, the shield became the weapon... Then doing some math... More shields .. more protection.... More shields.... More weapons...... By the time I stopped playing DnD; Tigr (t, i not double g, r. Tigr) the athach, was using a set of shields that imbued strength, floated as if it was a pool toy, and could resist a major portion of all elemental damage. Not one for killing dragons, Tigr often found himself trying to prevent the rouge or bard from being singed by rushing over and becoming an impenetrable wall of enchanted metal. But mechanically that third arm works something like a wall or ceiling mounted industrial robot arm. Excluding the 360+ degree rotation, as the athach only have 200 give or take a tenner of degrees of "shoulder" rotation in their middle arm, unlike the norm bipedal human side arms they already possess.

@thedyingmeme6

2 жыл бұрын

A great crossbow just sounds like a slightly smaller fuckin ballista

imagine a rapier a swordbreaker (european version) and 2 parying daggers. this creature would bocome the rapier-duel-god

@NoctuaOW

5 жыл бұрын

3 sword breakers lol

@geminiblue6677

5 жыл бұрын

Sounds good. I think a pike, 1 rapier and 1 parry dagger would be even more god-like

@watermelon996

4 жыл бұрын

Gemini Blue the pike would be redundant though because rapiers are stabbing weapons too. Get a slicing weapon and a pike Instead.

@randomdude-4353

4 жыл бұрын

Jesus, can you use commas?

@Attaxalotl

4 жыл бұрын

You evil freakin' genius

Bloody hell the ideas i'm getting from this vid: i am an amateur writer in sci-fi and i have just gotten an idea for a new character i want to implement into my story/book.

Similar to one of Shad's suggestions, but I'd swap them around. Spear and shield for the lower arms, longsword in a high guard for the upper pair. Nice little stabby combo at the bottom, raining blows from above with the top ones.

*Slams* *chest* *of* *Grievous* This bad boy carries four lightsabers, makes you cough and has the ability to become a meme! Dooku: Noice Edit: This is what I have been waiting for

@ChiefderWahrheit

5 жыл бұрын

Hello There.

@GermanWaffle

5 жыл бұрын

@@ChiefderWahrheit GENERAL KENOBI!

@billwilson7841

5 жыл бұрын

THIS WILL MAKE A FINE ADDITION TO MY COLLECTION

@lucklord7

5 жыл бұрын

You must realize, YOU are DOOOMED

@leofwulf268

5 жыл бұрын

I've been looking forward to this

Shad: four arms Me: Hello there

@8th_green

4 жыл бұрын

General kenobi

a shield and mace for the bottom two hands for massive protection and anti armour, then the top two hands have an instant legious for anti light, crwoud controll and for range.

I think an interesting combo would be upper dominant hand- sling upper off hand- polearm (Bec De Corbin) lower dominant- war pick lower off hand- heater shield with a small dagger on the belt Upper arms have larger range of free motion with easier body weight additional force the sling can be dropped behind the body once enemy gets to close allowing polearm to be two handed with cross arms for additional force to be added from the hips war pick makes armored targets less of a problem heater shield allows for two hands for the pick or to use the dagger to slash/stab and with great defense

You didn't think this through, Shad. When we throw a punch or a strike, we lean our entire body with the arm to deliver power to it. Same applies here. Even if the four armed creature had two independent shoulder sets, he could only land one strike with each pair of arms i.e. two strikes at a time max. My recommendation: Put a two handed spear on the upper arms (left and right), two small shields on the bottom arms and two backup daggers on his belt..

@sinaparsi6736

5 жыл бұрын

Yes, but you're talking about power punches. Not jabs

@1FatLittleMonkey

5 жыл бұрын

That brings up the more general complexity of 4-armed creatures, differences in limb strength, movement, dexterity. The shoulder-joint is complex, running across to your neck, half your back, in addition to the joint-proper. If their other anatomy is standard human-form, as they are usually depicted, a second joint mid-way down your side will have less strength across the body, because the muscles will have less leverage, and less vertical range because the shoulder-joint can't lift "above" its support point. (When you raise your arms, feel how your shoulder joint rolls above your shoulder-line. Try to lift your arms without being able to raise your shoulder joint.) In SF (less so in fantasy), 4-armed aliens typically have one pair of "holding" arms with high strength, low dexterity, and one pair of "detail" arms with less strength but more dexterity. Sometimes the nimbler arms are also shorter, used for close work. That changes the weapon mix again. Two-handing with one dexterous and one strong arm might lead to completely styles of weapons than humans have invented, because things that simply don't work for us work for them. Also, does specialisation mean the stronger/dexterous arms are optimised, making the stronger pair stronger and the dexterous pair more dexterous than humans. Or does the complexity of the extra pair of joins mean that, by the necessity of fitting all the muscle-groups and joints into the same space, their arms end up weaker/less-flexible overall. Nerfing them against two-armed opponents.

@ollie7070

5 жыл бұрын

1FatLittleMonkey Dude you wrote this a minute ago, your thumbs are probably too sore for a reply but well done, its obvious you put research into this and we need more commenters like you.

@PJDAltamirus0425

5 жыл бұрын

No, a short, sorta 13 foot spear for the upper a lower arms on the left side and pavise size shield he can grip with the two hands on the opposite side.

@burritodorit0772

5 жыл бұрын

Saarang Sahasrabudhe shit you right

This is a very interesting and difficult topic to consider imo. First off, assuming we're essentially discussing humans that just happen to have an extra pair of arms, how are they shaped/positioned on the body? Do you have two pairs of shoulders? Are the arms located at different heights on the torso? Are the arms the same length and shape? There are so many questions to consider just in terms of how having four arms would work, let alone how one would use equipment with four arms. After some thought, it seems to me that in order to grasp how having four arms would function, it'd be important to consider the range of motion we have with two arms. Ideally, a human or humanoid with two pairs of arms doesn't want one pair of arms impeding on the other pair's range of movement much, if at all. To me, this first suggests that you wouldn't have a pair of arms directly above or below the other pair. Imagine you have a pair of arms directly below your existing ones. If you're wearing pants and want to stick your hands in your pants pockets, your lower hands won't encounter any issues, but in order to do so with your upper hands may be very awkward; perhaps even impossible. Now imagine your lower pair of arms are positioned not directly underneath your upper arms but behind or in front. Now it becomes possible to access your pants' pockets with both pairs of hands without as much trouble. Using that as an example, I think it would possibly make more sense if the two pairs of arms weren't just positioned differently but also of different proportions. In order to maximize the advantage of having two pairs of arms, I imagine you'd want to be able to increase the range of motion all four arms could cover as much as possible, while maintaining little overlap. Some degree of overlap would likely be good, especially directly in front of your chest, with increasingly less overlap above, below, and to the sides. This way you could apply all four hands to manipulating objects in front of you while also being able to manipulate four separate objects without worrying too much about one hand/arm infringing on the space of another. While I obviously can't know what the most ideal positioning of arms would be, I imagine having shorter, upper arms located where our arms are and a second pair of lower, longer arms positioned towards one's back might be a good configuration. Alternatively, perhaps having the pairs of arms in the same locations but reversing the arm lengths so that the upper arms are longer and the lower arms shorter would be good. I'm not sure what would be better for one's range of movement or center of gravity. As far as the arms and shields a four-armed human/humanoid might wield, the first thing that occurs to me is that the weapons we know of were all designed for people with two arms. The design of shields, swords, spears, and etc might be quite different when made for four-armed people. For example, imagine the use of a shield or shields. I agree that the use of four, three, or even two shields would be unlikely. That said, I figure shields designed for use by four-armed people would be quite different from us two-armed folk. Just consider how one might grip such a shield with two hands. I have no practical experience with any medieval arms or armor; nevertheless, I suspect having two hands holding a shield would offer significant benefits over just one hand. In fact, I think a four-armed, medieval warrior would almost always benefit from having a shield they could use in combat with one or two hands. Regardless of whether or not they benefit from increased coordination, even if a four-armed person has devoted two arms to holding a shield, they still have two arms free to wield one or more weapons. Better yet, if the shield is designed in such a way as to allow one to switch between a one-handed and two-handed grip easily, such a being could potentially have access to three weapons at a time without necessarily losing the benefits of a two-handed shield. In situations where supporting the shield with one hand is sufficient, one could wield an extra weapon. At times where the ability to further stabilize or control the shield is more valuable, one could drop/sheath/whatever their weapon and resume two-handing the shield. In my mind, the benefits of the increased defense are likely to be worth more than having a second or third weapon, though this of course would depend on the situation at hand. Still, the sheer versatility is indeed astounding. Overall, I think wielding three weapons at a time should be the limit for a four-armed warrior. I suspect the more weapons wielded at once, the greater the skill requirement to achieve effective results and the worse one's balance. Weapons with greater range would probably be most notable in this regard and as mentioned in the video likely interfere with one another. There's also one's movement to consider. In order to get the full effect of many types of strikes, the use of the lower body is crucial. For instance, if you're lunging forwards with a spear/polearm held in one of your right hands, the only other hand you're likely to be able to strike with is the other right hand. If that hand isn't holding the same weapon or a weapon with similar reach, it isn't really doing anything useful at all in that moment is it? To me, the main advantages of having four-arms must be in the ability to increase strength by using two arms to do the job of one, perform complex tasks with greater ease, or perform multiple tasks at once. One example I saw mentioned in the comments was in regards to firing and reloading crossbows. Another example, in this case regarding multiple tasks, allow me to set up a simple scenario. Imagine a character with two arms has been injured, is currently engaged in combat, needs to heal, and can only heal by consuming a potion. The two armed character has to be able to free up an arm, locate the potion on a belt/pouch/whatever, and successfully drink it mid-combat without issue. The other options are to attempt to flee combat long enough to consume the potion or to try to finish the fight before it's too late to heal. In comparison, a four-armed individual equipped with two to three weapons and a shield should easily be able to free up one arm to grab and consume the potion. Obviously there would still be difficulties involved but the relative difficulty would be lowered substantially. That's just one example of how useful the extra arms could be for completing multiple tasks too. As mentioned above, one of the advantages I see in having four arms is the ability to perform complex tasks with greater ease. In this regard, consider two-handed weapons. For us humans, wielding a weapon with two hands can offer greater control and versatility than with one hand. So what about using a single weapon with three or four hands? Even if you were to get diminishing returns, I imagine it could still have a great effect on certain weapons. Even if you operate under the assumption that wielding a weapon with three or more hands offers no extra benefit, what about the ability to swap which two of your four hands you're using the weapon with? Taking all this in mind, what do I think would be a good weapon set-up/loadout for a four-armed human/humanoid? Frankly, I'm still unsure. There are just so many possibilities after all. What I can say is that I think one shield and one to two melee weapons is likely ideal, at least in general. There will no doubt be situations where a different weapon composition would be more effective even if I don't know what kind of situation that'd be. As for specific weapons, I think spears, halberds, polearms, greatswords, and longswords designed for at least two hands would all be quite solid as main weapons. I suspect you could thrust a spear or virtually any other mentioned thrusting weapon forwards while gripping it with two right or left hands without too much difficulty. You could also probably use the mentioned weapons with three or four hands if you so desired, provided there was enough space for all the hands. I think swords, axes, and maces would have less use as main weapons but could serve as side weapons. For instance, perhaps you have a four-armed man equipped with a shield, spear, and sword. If the man is facing multiple enemies without allies or has entered close-quarter combat where the longer main weapon is too unwieldly, switching to one or more short weapons could make a major difference. This is a really difficult topic to cover so I guess I'll leave things here. My last thought on the subject is just that, provided they can support the weight, it may make a great deal of sense for four-armed humans/humanoids to simply carry three to six weapons and one to two shields with them. Weight and skill are probably the main factors preventing such beings from acting as walking arsenals.

@enderphoenix11

4 жыл бұрын

Hey, I just wanna say this is really cool, thanks for taking the time to write this

@vegito5626

3 жыл бұрын

This is a goddamn essey, but an interesting take on the topic

@Tyarrk

3 жыл бұрын

that is quite the deep thought on the subject, respect. yet there is one thing, people are forgetting here or simply are unaware of, and that´s energy consumption. growing additional limps takes a decent amount of calories and the organ that needs calories the most, is a sentient brain. it is very likely that a four armed humanoid creature would be significantly less intelligent than a human. And therefor it might very well not be able to wield four different weapons, simply because it can not coordinate such a complex move set. I´m guessing the creature using it´s additional arms as stabilization for greater more bulky weapons like two greatclubs or a towershield with two handles on one side and a greatsword on the other is more realistic because now the arms on each side work on the same movements but with better stability and speed, which should be easier to coordinate. the same principle holds true for other "mixed" creatures, which is why i wouldn´t be too concerned about the military finesse of Angels, Gargoyles or Centaurs etc.

@steveminecraft4364

3 жыл бұрын

Advancement made: Serious Dedication

sword and dagger in top two arms , beater shield and billhook type sickle hack and slash device. the shield and the billhook are simple movements , assuming the top two arms are the more dexterous and the lower arms can do simpler movements.

Shad whats your take on the load out of the D&Ds Thri-kreen? Their a insectoid race with 4 arms, a higher average height, greater dexterity, a chameleon like carapace for hiding and in rare cases some psionocs. Their weapons of choice are the Gythka -a polearm with slightly curved blades on both ends, usually curved opposite ways- and 2 chatka -a small triangular weapon meant for slashing and throwing- their not typically at a medieval level of tech but i feel like their onto something