Become a channel member: kzread.info/dron/MmaBzfCCwZ2KqaBJjkj0fw.htmljoin or patron: www.patreon.com/kingsandgenerals to watch exclusive videos, get early access to all videos, learn our schedule, join our private discord and much more! You can donate through Paypal paypal.me/kingsandgenerals as well!

As an avid fanatic of military history, kings and generals is just spoiling me rotten.

@colynfischer2365

10 ай бұрын

Serious, these guys are great! Btw, Yinz got a nice profile pic n’at

@TheStrategos392

10 ай бұрын

@@colynfischer2365 💯

@jonny-b4954

10 ай бұрын

Yeah, they've got a nice thing going. Shame that KZread demonetizes them. Absurd.

@markusskram4181

10 ай бұрын

Same

@eclipsesoldaccount9248

10 ай бұрын

Yea….. they have never been biased once nope …..sarcasm just so u redit users know

I'd never heard the Melian dialogue before, but it seems like geopolitics hasn't changed in the two and a half thousand years since

@jessejojojohnson

10 ай бұрын

Human nature has remained remarkably stable over the last few millennia.

@twonumber22

10 ай бұрын

While using religion to condition people into lying to themselves and each other.

@dennisgichohi5392

10 ай бұрын

​@@jessejojojohnsontimes have changed but human nature hasn't 😂

@dennisgichohi5392

10 ай бұрын

​@@twonumber22with or without religion humans will find a way to lie to themselves or each other sometimes through political ideology,it part of human nature

@METALFREAK03

9 ай бұрын

@@twonumber22 I would refute that it is man (as in human) in which lie using the word of religious texts as its purpose and to persuade the weak to conform to its desires. We had this with the media in 2020 and even today, in UK at least, where again they are exploiting such devices to try and persuade the populace in draconian measures once more.

11:11 the 20 mounted archers being remembered to this day is quite impressive

Athens and Sparta trying not to stab eachother challenge: *Impossible*

@balabanasireti

10 ай бұрын

Old and overused

@EnclaveEmily

10 ай бұрын

@balabanasireti yes, it is old. 2000 years old plus in fact!

@andrewflare1361

10 ай бұрын

Thucydides trap

Everyone talks about the rivalry between Athens and Sparta, but Argos was really Sparta's ancestral enemy. Also, it's interesting how Athens and Sparta fought each other during this period of peace without declaring war, sort of like a Cold War situation.

@crossetler_2184

10 ай бұрын

You ain't alone in this basket. Several magazines in the world featuring articles from various people (reporters, teachers, researchers, etc) share your opinion. If you don't believe me, buy a couple from different publishers and check it out.

@marcpeterson1092

10 ай бұрын

Well, except that Athens and Sparta directly fought each other, the US and USSR did not.

@twonumber22

10 ай бұрын

​@@marcpeterson1092A tiny bit at Mig Alley.

@circleancopan7748

10 ай бұрын

Argives really are the poison on the Peloponnese.

2:38 Argos was never part of the Peloponnesian League - they hated the Spartans for taking away local hegemony from them in preceding centuries and conspired against Sparta incessantly. About once per generation, this lead to a fight, which the Spartans inevitably won, resulting in truces scheduled to run for decades. One such truce was just expiring at this time, leading to Argos to gather allies to try to challenge Sparta once again.

I wasn’t aware that Argos had ever been in Sparta’s camp. They have a storied history of rivalry with the Spartans that makes the Athenian rivalry look quite trivial. Also, though it’s not very important, the Herms (the statues dedicated to Hermes along roads) were, in appearance, a solid square or rectangular block with a head on top, and a representation of male genitalia sticking out of the front.

Nicias, as we shall see, was a horrible strategist. The enemies of Alcibiades, the ones who falsely accused him of defacing the herme statues, would eventually doom Athens in the years to come by destroying Alcibiades's reputation. Again, I'm glad everyone else now has access to this wonderful series.

@dlugi4198

10 ай бұрын

I am not saying my homie Alcibiades did nothing wrong, but if it was his way, I am pretty sure Athens would become the first Greek Hegemon. Where Alcibiades went, victory followed.

@iexist3919

10 ай бұрын

@@dlugi4198Alcibiades also tended to be too overconfident, which partly led to his downfall. At the battle of Notium, he put a lot of trust into his subordinate commander, and he left him to look out for the Spartan fleet. It turns out Alcibiades put too much trust into him, as his subordinate disobeyed orders and attacked the Spartan fleet, getting annihilated. The battle was a humiliation for both Athens and Alcibiades and he was exiled as a result. While Alcibiades was a good commander, he tended to be too overconfident and arrogant.

@dlugi4198

10 ай бұрын

@@iexist3919 Yea, well shit happens. Antichonus happened to face Lysander, arguably the only capable fleet commander in the history of Sparta.

@giningmos2338

10 ай бұрын

Alcibiades was too arrogant, he created the Sicily expedition, which was the single most disastrous event in the Peloponnesian war for athens

@RTWPimpmachine

10 ай бұрын

Nicias was incompetent but so was Alcibiades. Most of the accounts of Alcibiades (e.g., by Thucydides and Xenophon) come from the pro-Oligarchic factions of Athens, who prized aristocratic "virtue" above all and Alcibiades had plenty of that considering he came from a very old family. Alcibiades had little to do, for example, with the great Athenian victory at Cyzicus. The Sicilian expedition, Alcibiades' brainchild, was idiotic. I doubt anyone could have "succeeded" in it. Syracuse was a city as large as Athens, launching an expedition that far away was moronic, attacking a third-party not fighting in a stalemated war is about as stupid as you can get. It would be as if Russia suddenly decided to invade China while fighting in Ukraine.

Thank you for covering a historical topic that not many history channels have not covered or haven't went to such depth 🙏

One of my favorite periods of Greek history aside from the archaic age and their colonization of the Mediterranean.

Thank you guys for another fantastic episode. This series is excellent. God be with you out there everybody. ✝️ :)

Now I get why this was patreon exclusive for awhile. Great video.

Ancient Greece is one of my fav counties. Lot of things to learn. Brilliant series. I love your videos. Love from Sri Lanka ❤️🔥.

@giannisgiannis870

9 ай бұрын

Sri Lanka?You are so far away than Greece...thank you brother.

Here since before you guys hit 1Mil Subs,still remember you replying to my comment back in the day,meant the world to me ^ ^ Keep up your amazing work!

@KingsandGenerals

10 ай бұрын

Thank you for being with us so long!

@bornassassin2111

10 ай бұрын

@@KingsandGenerals Just made my day again! :DD So thank you too!

This war deserves a series

Love when you do the BC Era ❤️ Thank you for everything y'all do.

Alkibiades picture looks like an ordinary man while he was described as extremely handsome and charming. An Alexander before Alexander.

I listen while I'm at work and I watch when I get home. Awesome channel

@KingsandGenerals

10 ай бұрын

Thanks!

How has a history channel so popular not made a video about 80 years war?

Thanks as always K&G!

What an amazing video! Please continue with these gems Kings and Generals!

These videos are so in depth it's awesome

Love this series! Keep going!

Excellent work as always !

This video is SO good in SO many levels!

Nice, ancient battles, my favorite content

Great video keep it up you're doing amazing things 😁👍

What a fantastic video! ⚔🔥🙌

Athens: "accept democracy or face your doom!!!" Think they might have forgotten some of the principles during this war 😅

@jimmyandersson9938

10 ай бұрын

Was it any special principles tied to democracy back then tho?

@desmondd1984

10 ай бұрын

@@jimmyandersson9938 Mostly opposition to oligarchy and a belief that (male) citizens were able to effectively govern better than "tyrants". There was, as yet, no real concept of human rights. Many of the things we associate with democracy today were not yet present.

@jimmyandersson9938

10 ай бұрын

@@desmondd1984 Yeah and it seems they were right concidering how well Athens was doing, playing biggest role in defending from Persia and then becoming a small empire. Guess its hard to say if its a correlation or causation of their democracy.

Always great videos

It is obvious that the ancients did not study history just to know what exactly happened, but also to morally educate themselves with the events that took place. They seemed to have appreciated the thread that runs through events more than the exact events and their exact details. That is probably why ancient historians featured these dialogues or speeches, which could not have been recorded in any exact way. Yet they point us toward the lessons we need to take.

@METALFREAK03

9 ай бұрын

Athenian history likes to create drama as their main etnertainment was the amphitheatres. It might be read as a moral quandary today but back then it be like us watching a soap opera like Dallas or Eastenders.

@OPVSNOVVM

9 ай бұрын

@@METALFREAK03 I wouldn't dismiss that interpretation, but to solely focus on that possibility would be an underestimation of the ancients, I think. We also need to consider the practical facts: writing was costly and had to be concise, unless there was something more valuable to transmit in it than its production cost. The fact that those writings were copied for millennia is proof enough for me that both their contemporaries and subsequent generations found value in them.

Great information

Just joined the membeship, I wish you guys the very best. Been supporting the channel since I firstly saw Skanderbeg's rebellion

Great video!

Good video thanks 👍🏻

Alcibiades switched sides so much that it does show how chaotic those times were

Fantastic 👏

Last time I was this early, the peloponnesian war was still ongoing

I just wanted to let you know 5:57 some of your Spartans do not have spear tips, they might need to be given new spears. Great videos btw been subbed for a few years now.

@basilismaster

10 ай бұрын

they are in bottom of the spear cause they are javelins

@GenYGaming

10 ай бұрын

​@@basilismaster I think the troops in the front are hoplites so those would be dory which are not javelins, they do look like javelins and they can be thrown like javelins but are not javelins.

@basilismaster

10 ай бұрын

@@GenYGaming they are using the rome 2 models and they are javelin throwers

@GenYGaming

10 ай бұрын

@@basilismaster ok fair enough.

These videos literally make my entire day, no lie guys you are saving my life 🙏👍

Thanks!

Comment The Athenian aesthetic and culture is just, kino. Love it.

You gotta love that neo cons read Thucydides' lament of the excesses of imperialism and the neo cons picked out the line about great powers and lesser powers and were like "this fuckin' rules, lets make the weak suffer what they must."

@KingsandGenerals

10 ай бұрын

Selective reading required

As a political science grad, and one that still has Rome II: Total War installed three computers later, I was waiting for this one.

@carstrucks9641

2 ай бұрын

Haha bro.

Hey guys, well done as usual I have to ask how are you still plan to redo the battle of Ankara for the Ottoman series or is that pretty much done at this point since he already did it again for the Tamerlane series

@KingsandGenerals

10 ай бұрын

Not sure right now

Love The vid

It is incredible to read the writings of great people throughout history, from their manner of conduct to their grammar and penmanship; while also looking at how less intelligible we have become as a species today.

Very interesting video! Maybe a "How weak was post-Alexander Greece really?" I've heard that the Macedonian Greece was actually weaker than Classical Greece, but I want to know if this was true.

@petrosb52

10 ай бұрын

It is probably true just after Alexander's death lamian war happened, then Epirus vs Sparta, epirus vs argos, epirus against Macedon, diadochi wars, Macedon vs pergamon, Athens vs Macedon, Macedon and achaian league vs Aetolian league, Sparta vs achaian league and so on. If you have in mind that Greece was at war constantly from 490 Bce (against Persia) you have 300 years of wars

@johnquach8821

10 ай бұрын

@@petrosb52 And then that post-Alexander/Macedonian Greece got conquered by Rome.

@Pyrrhic537

10 ай бұрын

The problem with Greece was constant war and division amongst Greeks.

@CG-yq2xy

10 ай бұрын

Well, before Phillip II it was definitely more backwards and underdeveloped. It's primary exports were (if I remember correctly of course) mostly timber and a few other commodities and it really lacked the trade and industry that was characteristic of Athens and the other states. It was really after Phillip studied in Thebes and built off of what he learned when Macedonia came into it's own. The post - diadochi era (i.e. the Hellenistic age) was quite an interesting one regarding this question. Compared to the other city states, Macedonia was still strong. Thebes had been raised to the ground, Athens was at best a middle power and Sparta was in a downward spiral after the battle of Leuctra, never to project any power beyond the Peloponnese. Ironically, it could be argued that from the "classical" city states Corinth was the preeminent power hence why the Romans burned it. However Macedonia had to compete with Ptolemaic Egypt, Seleucid Asia, Asia Minor, and even Pontus who funny enough were cut from the same Alexandrian cloth as Macedonia and possessed even more resources. So after the diadochi wars, Macedonia went from being a big fish in a pond of tired small ones to a small fish in an ocean of bigger ones. Then of course (as is typical of Greek history), there was a general malaise during the closing times of the Hellenistic era. Alexander, when he showed up, was "fresh" (to use some US slang), had a vision, and used new strategies and techniques. Everyone else following his death was at best a cheap knockoff of Alexander, with the last Greek general to really add any innovations and vision being king Pyrrhus. The great Hellenistic empires either turned inwards into spectacle (Egypt especially in Alexandria) and let the natives run the daily affairs, lost vast regions of their land to both natives and invaders (Seleucids) or just let internal squabbles eat away at them (Pergamon). At that point the Classical Era Greek city states were not even on the radar, the were used as the stomping ground and proxies of the bigger players. The last person who attempted to remedy the situation was Philopoemen with his Achaean League, though it was too little too late. In the end, the Romans played these differences to their advantage and took over the region.

One interesting detail of the sicilian expedition is how Nicias actually claimed huge expenses would be necessary (money, boats, men etc) in order for the agora to realize how crazy the idea of the expedition was. But it backfired spectacularly because they actually bought it and instead of a small venture, in became a huge fleet and huge expense which eventually caused a loss from which they never recovered. I like to imagine him, sailing at the head of a fleet far bigger than the one he originally was reluctant to lead

Thank you can you please cover early Roman expansion to the Punic wars please❤😊

please make a video on what weapons the goguryeo used

nice

what mods are you using for total rome2 ?? I need those in my life!! thanks in advance!

You guys are better than the history Channel

Will you guys cover the Persian invasions of Greece and Cyrus conquests

Love your videos, but you've misspelled "Emperor" in member ranks

you should do the american revolution followed by the american civil war,, i think it’d be very eye opening as well as some of your most popular series’

This could have been a lot better. I don't remember reading that Argos was a member of the Spartan Alliance...Agis originally had the Argive army trapped when he accepted to negotiate rather than fight the Argives...this is why the Spartans were so upset with the guy; he had a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to eliminate Argive power forever, and had passed. Though he was to lead another effort against Argos, the Spartans did not trust his judgement and before he could engage in any action, he had to get the approval of a special council of 10 Spartan advisors who accompanied the army. The accounts I have read, indicate the Athenians at the battle did not actually fight; seeing the invincible Spartan hoplites bearing down on them, they lost their nerve and fled the battlefield.

Everybody : "But who were the good guys and who were the bad guys in the Péloponnesian Wars ?" Historians : "Ummm..."

@circleancopan7748

10 ай бұрын

Both sides have bad ones. But it was the Athenians have more bad ones than the Peloponnese.

Wonder when you will do Leuctra?

@KingsandGenerals

10 ай бұрын

Down the line, not planned or scheduled right now

@alfrancisbuada2591

10 ай бұрын

@@KingsandGenerals hey I've been waiting for you. When are you guys gonna do my idea of the Spanish-American War and the Filipino-American War?

So Sicily being the overstated "soft underbelly" had ancient roots...

Yay!

Wait, how much of your content is member exclusive.

Athens and Sparta: "We really don't wanna fight, but we kinda have to."

@circleancopan7748

10 ай бұрын

Athens: Let's p off the Peloponnese. Argos: Just give us something and we just stab Spartan surroundings for you. Athenians: Sure.

What mods you using for rome two?

The guy castrating himself with a stone.... oh god I could almost feel that by thinking of it

I can never shake the feeling that Athens really should have won this war and that Alcibiades, demagogue he may have been, would have had far more success in Sicily simply because he believed in the venture and was decisive in his decision making.

@marcpeterson1092

10 ай бұрын

Not so sure. Syracuse was far away and well defended. Also, Athens was unwise and overconfident in it's military power. Much like modern times.

🔥

11:09 20 mounted archers hahaha such precise and small number for a specialized unit of elites for ancient greece I guess...

How many users are in your discord server?

"Syracusians, Sparta has heard of your woes!" "Yes, here comes the Spartans!". "Actually, here come the Spartan"

Victor Davis Hanson said it all i belive.

Good series, but what happen with post Caesar civil war, it's been half a year since the last video

What is the modern name of Ornae city ( 09:50 ) ???

Interesting as per ususal.

@KingsandGenerals

10 ай бұрын

Thanks!

I wrote a tv series on Alcibiades.

Can't wait for the Siege of Syracuse!

@circleancopan7748

10 ай бұрын

Yeah, and see some Boy Lovers fall to their doom. Melians shouldn't have suffered for that scumbags.

💥💥💥

Would it be possible to do a video about Cumania which was led by the kiptschacks? My ancestors were kiptschacks too and had to flee to Erzurum because of the wars and occupation from the Russian Empire.

@KingsandGenerals

10 ай бұрын

Yep, it is coming

❤

A lesson in human nature unlearned until this very day. We love to discuss the details but not the big picture. That's ok. That is why things have never changed and likely never will.

Hum the piece as been broken, that's showing that an alliance not united is nothing in any points...the Blood should be spilled !!! The greeks are damm crazy as fuck warrios..... Nice vidéo as always !!

Ah Sicily, the grave of the Athenian Empire, Pyrrhus, and Carthagenian Empire.

@user-nz1eu8cz1d

10 ай бұрын

Actually Pyrrhus never lost a battle in Sicily.He was obliged to abandon his campaign there because the Romans(Carthage's allies by that time) were gaining the upper hand in Italy again.Pyrrhus had to return to Italy to face them.

@ElBandito

10 ай бұрын

@@user-nz1eu8cz1d I'm referring to the fact that Pyrrhus had the opportunity to be the King of Macedon, but instead he chose to chase out the Carthagenians in Sicily, where he lost almost his entire navy, many of his army and valuable time. And this Sicilian venture directly sent him to Italy afterwards as a result, and what a shitshow he got himself into over there.

@user-nz1eu8cz1d

10 ай бұрын

@@ElBandito actually he was for a time the king of Epirus and Macedon. He was trying to do what his cousin, Alexander,did for the Greeks of the East. He tried to liberate the Greeks of the West from the constant threat of the Romans and the Carthaginians. You have to rembember also that his uncle,Alexander 1st of Epirus,died in the attempt to do exactly that. So the problem was n't that Pyhrrus failed in his task to solve these problems.The problem was that the other greek states failed or refused to do the same. Actually the Carthaginians were left with just one city to hold on to Sicily because of Pyhrrus and because of that they made a pact with the Romans.

This Agis guy was basically Spartan Stalin. Evil and ruthless.

Evening

15:25

Until I starting watching this series I always had rooted for Athens. They were just as bad as the Spartans. The senseless Wars of these petty kingdoms prevented a united Greece.

I would love to send you my script on Alcibiades. It is written more historically accurate than anything made about the classical world before. Let’s team up!

@jessejojojohnson

10 ай бұрын

Upload your own videos to your channel. I'll watch that too

@pilomalik9696

10 ай бұрын

@@jessejojojohnson it’s a script. Written as an hbo series or whoever picks it up. I wrote all the battle scenes on location. I just need to get it out there and I don’t know anyone in the business.

It doesnt make sense why Sparta would sit idlily by while Athens come down to Argos and sieged Ornae, i mean that shit is right by Sparta. Then to also do nothing when Athens were sieging Melos. It makes a bit more sense cuz of the logistics of crossing the sea and Athens being a naval superior nation but still. To do nothing and consider this to be "peace" is ridiculous.

@PcCAvioN

10 ай бұрын

Spartans don't actually like fighting. Every time they have to fight is a time their mystique is challenged. They "go to war" by marching to Athens, burning some fields then leaving. If they don't have a clear advantage they do not like fighting

I am greek and i am so sad for this..

Alcibiades was a power house. In any side he was with they were winning . lol

Question why would anyone unconditionally surrender in the ancient world? Are they just counting on their enemies to be merciful?

The Melian Diaolgue's. The cornerstone of political science

@circleancopan7748

10 ай бұрын

And shows that Athenians weren't that merciful.

It’s the Herms not the Hermes statues. The Herms were basically big penis statues which were guardians of the city.

I am not sure Argos was ever a member of the Spartan Alliance...

Thank you, for making more and more history content. And I'm a heterosexual man who's quite confident in his own sexuality, but damn. Your voice actor is a sexy man.

FIRST but why there are comments already?

@KingsandGenerals

10 ай бұрын

Patrons and KZread members get early access

They love 300 number