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@lolepiking3240

24 күн бұрын

no

@MrBalrogos

24 күн бұрын

Funny when they show this "new tech" when planetside 2 have this for last 11 years and its hex based system map, in planetside map is 64 square kliometers and can hold up to 1000 players per map, but map is divided in hexes and every hex is like server mesh and yes player can interact beetween meshes cause, fights are often like 100v100 players on few hexes at once. And the PlanetSide hold Guiness world record for Most players in an online FPS battle 1,530, achieved on 5 November 2022

on your question about waiting for Intrepid making server meshing: SC said they were going to do this thing, but it would take time. the supporters at the time resoundingly said they wanted it done right. So we knew we were in for a long haul. Steven sold a game concept everyone knew was feasible. BIG difference.

@SETHthegodofchaos

22 күн бұрын

If you are referring to any community poll, there was none of such. Thats just what everybody says so it became "true" (its the mandela effect I think). And, of course, most gamers want more if there given the option. Thats why they make for terrible game devs. Its the responsibility of the game developer and company to make sure their goals are fitting for their game and achievable (in a timely manner). CIG could have easily decided to stick to the initially planned and worked on instanced model for the initial launch, but it was more convinient to go for SM instead directly. It gave them enough time to finish their singleplayer game while the MMO is put on the backburner because "it requires SM to function". The big difference is that SC botched their first OCS and Server Meshing implementations. A lot of time waste from like ~2017 to end of 2020. And then had to get Turbulent in to implement it with PES, gRPC, a graph DB, the Replication Layer instead. Which is the EXACT implementation SpatialOS had in like 2016. I know CIG rewrote CryEngine entirely from around 2014 to 2017. And some of the initial OCS and SM code could be used for PES and the new SM. But it still took them from end of 2020 till now to course correct and get this new SM version working.

To try and put it more simply through examples : - SC wants to be able to handle a city hub with DYNAMIC server meshing, which would for example turn 1 server running the city plaza with 100 players to 4 servers splitting the plaza running 400 when they arrive, the problem is you can't do just selective splitting because players might decide, hey we're all going to the bar right now and then 3 of those servers are useless, so the dynamic meshing will attempt to re-split its location so the 4 way split is INSIDE the bar to handle the load - Similarly, to have fleet battles where player ships have about 100 player on capital ships, you would need 1 master server for the region and a server per capital ship (for example, not the actual use case) the master server only handles the 'container' entities of each ship as a whole and say, their weaponry and hits but each smaller server holding a ship will manage everything underneath it, which would include the ship's systems and hull damage, its players, atmosphere, player inventory and so on and relay the 'general' information to the master server in both cases, for the player perspective, you just see the most plain view relevant to you while the servers manage the fine print in between them, this is how you could see the space battle from the capital ship window while being inside it or people on the other side of the bar while having normal fps, like the master server, the player sees the 'general' view (players in a bar) while the smaller servers handle remembering the 200 items each player is carrying split between them and runs its physics and simulations AoC likely doesn't need even half of what SC is doing and likely doesn't really need DYNAMIC server meshing and even if it did, it would need to handle mountains less of information than starcitizen with all its physics, entities and billion objects existing at the same time, its 2 use cases would be siege wars and the town hubs

Omg!! It's Space Tomato! I love his videos and yours so I can't believe you watched one of his videos! That's awesome! PS. He does a podcast every week, maybe you could hop in it who knows.

@DavorPranjic

24 күн бұрын

Launch Sequence with Narc. That would be a monday treat.

I think Star Citizen STARTED as 'just a game' but along the way they had to Solve a Problem, and the resulting Server Meshing Tech that CIG made is WAY WAY more Valuable than Star Citizen could ever be. Like TONS of Developers are gonna want this Tech. BILLIONS to be made.

@neugassh3570

24 күн бұрын

:D

@blackhorde22

24 күн бұрын

Sadly they only just claimed to be using server meshing in 2021 after paying 300mil, and not working on any kind of game play other then that crappy Demo.. I mean Alpha 3.43. You wanna make billions from this tech, it would have to be next gen VR for space warfare and planet warfare.. We can only Wait, Watch and Hope.

@mattk4093

24 күн бұрын

do the people who funded it buying ships years ago get a share in these billions?

@Krieghandt

24 күн бұрын

@@mattk4093 only as a side effect, when Unreal 7 comes out with it.

@blackhorde22

24 күн бұрын

@@mattk4093 Aww Hell Yeah they do, they get to fly them in virtual space that never existed before. We just have to wait another 10yrs before they perfect Meshing.

Persistent Entity Graph = is the record of where the entities/objects in the universe are and what state they are in. Is this gun in a hab? In a ship? on a person? Broken? The Persistent Entity graph is recording that and sharing it with the game servers and clients. Cliff notes - This is where all the shit is and what state its in. Replication Layer = is the record of what the entities/objects are doing in the universe. Is the gun equipped on a person? Are they on a train in the city? Is it being shot at an Npc? The Replication layer is recording that and sharing it with the game servers and clients. Cliff notes - What the hell is happening now and where is it happening? Sever Mesh/Servers = is enabling the entities/objects to actually DO things in the universe. Are you jumping off the back of a ship with that gun? The physics for all that? The game rules that govern who's getting hit. The damage calculations, the AI for the NPCs? The Servers are doing that and reporting back what is happening in their individual simulations via the replication layer to the Persistent entity graph and clients. Cliff notes - I'm the dungeon master in the DND game making all the shit happen. Clients = the players causing these entities/objects to do shit in the first place. We are getting this information streamed to us based on where we are (Client side object container streaming) and what we are doing. When we are done with a play session and drop some random crap some place, when we log back in unless someone else has moved it or its been cleaned up because of server load, it will be there because it was recorded in the persistent entity graph. And it will be there no matter what server instance you sign back in on because of the replication layer. Cliff notes - I am the player responding to the Dungeon master commands and generally breaking shit. Hope that helps!

Just think if Ashes had a creator like Space Tomato. His video quality has always been really high. His narrator voice fits so well to his style as well

His initial comment about it being a tech company is right on. Guaranteed they will sell this technology to other companies once they've got it figured out. Star Citizen is their demo for dynamic meshing.

@kaleb5926

24 күн бұрын

Yes and No. Remember they started this sever tech thing later into development. The team definitely will develop the game into completion if not for anything else but to play it themselves.

@fffx2

19 күн бұрын

I hope so. If tech like this WORKS it will change gaming forever

Sincerely hope that Steven's health is okay. Seems like he is always coughing and sick frequently.

@mikewyatt2262

24 күн бұрын

He’s clearly indulging in to much of his own Copium!

@trojancs16

24 күн бұрын

Ashes is Steven's cancer

@thelazyoz2061

24 күн бұрын

I'm convinced he's dying and wants to release the craziest MMO. Hope he doesn't die

@thegreenroom4793

24 күн бұрын

@@thelazyoz2061aids maybe?

@RealmDesigner

24 күн бұрын

@@thegreenroom4793 What the actual fuck?

What is also probably valuable about server meshing is now you can lower the specs on any individual server and increase the number of servers. Server quality isn't linear. 3 beefy servers is probably equivalent to 5 simple servers but the cost of 3 beefy servers could be more than 5 simple servers. And you can dynamically add servers to handle peak usage. The important part of that is that on low usage times Intrepid could save money by spinning down servers.

Video with tomato talking about AC and SC pls

@seveneternal7988

23 күн бұрын

this would be awesome

Blizzard v SC on servers. Blizzard owns their own datacenters. They started LONG before the cloud existed. SC is in the cloud already. So as new servers are needed, they will be spun up. The example is 100s of players will be footing the bill. The real savings occure when one pilot decides to fly (without quantum jump) from one planet to another. One server serving a moon would be told to take care of lonely boy, instead of bringing up another server. Also, once the party is over, the extra servers spin down, saving money, as they are paid for by the minute.

@rawdrakeman8152

24 күн бұрын

also, SC uses AWS which are extreamly flexible, literally u just need to pay a bit more and u have a fresh server on the fly.

What never thought I would see Narc react to Space Tomato! :O

Alpha 2 around the corner and they’re showcasing server tech… this game is down bad man

I like how he says what intrepid needs to do like he is a game programmer

Welcome to the verse Narc, I see you have your own copium supply ready. We dont talk about dates.

They're calling them the same thing but fundamentally they're completely different solving different problems. AOC doesn't have entities with physics acting across servers, and they don't save the states and locations of thousands of them (indefinitely). This is the problem SC is having doing this with an FPS game that an MMORPG just doesn't have. The world is static, besides players and NPCs. No physical objects are communicating with servers. Planetside 2 did this in an FPS game, but without the entities thing and alot of magic. Very impressive especially for its time though AOC is also only planning on thousands? on each shard. SC is trying to not limit players, except by region ofc. Each shard on ashes is supposed to tell its own story with the whole sandbox thing, so it's not a problem to be limited. The only problem there is servers 'dying' pvp and all that. Eventually you get people saying just give me a loading screen anyway, space travel might as well be one, travel between systems might as well be one, exiting planet atmosphere can be a hidden loading screen like no man's sky. I think that's just being willfully ignorant though, traveling can be interrupted, flying out of atmosphere doesn't segment your combat, you can use the time to maintain things plan or anything you want. Your 'gameplay' is never interrupted and the potential for immersion is insane. Yeah that gameplay currently is bland, and we come back to the main problems with SC but that's besides the point

WoW was running on serveral servers with its own instances. No interaction was possible between the instances other than chatting. When a space is unused and a server is powered down another server of the dynamic mesh takes over this area of space as it only needs to load the necessary object containers like the planet to show. They really power down servers but other servers take over the responsibility to represent the area. Those object containers can be a planet with the atmosphere around it or a capital ship with more than 100 people in it walking around or the bar in a citiy on a planet can be its own container. That is the beauty of the SC concept for dynamic server meshing. That is why they showed the concept with those 3 servers in CitizenCon with direct interaction between those servers.

Its cost effective because you are increasing the utilization of your servers. The number of servers in an area scales up/down depending on traffic. So instead of having 5 servers constantly running 5 dead zones, you have 1 server take care of the 5 zones by itself and use the other 4 where they are more needed.

So to be very clear: Server Meshing = 64 Bits coordination + OCS SS/CS + Entity Graph + Persistent Entity Streaming + Replication Layer + Server Cluster + Seamless Server Transition + Dynamic Server Alocation (among others). Yes, for Dynamic Server Meshing u need, at least, all those pieces together. AoC will probably only have 1 (or 2 if we are lucky) piece of those I mentioned, the servers cluster, - therefore, it wont be a real server meshing, but a refined servers cluster, just like wow or PS2 have, which is, again, not a real SM.

@lolsmite5623

24 күн бұрын

Fun fact: 99% of the people who will read your comment wont understand that SM is a group of techs put together and not only the seamless server transition. Most of them wont even understand that the server transition is the most easy part and the persistence is the hard one.

@anewagenow2981

24 күн бұрын

o7

@blackbird5666

24 күн бұрын

so what is OCS SS CS??

@therealcanopy1990

24 күн бұрын

@@blackbird5666 OCS = Object Container Streaming Server Side / Client Side is a tech that SC released in Alpha 3.8 that allows the server to stream in the entites, the textures and the IA in the DGS (Dedicated Game Server) AND in the client only when they are needed.

@StepCrow

24 күн бұрын

They need to not call it server meshing.

If they decided to have 1 MEGA server per region and fully adapt this tech... Could be legendary.

Eve Online has that MMO aspect of fights with thousands of players taking place on the same grid, they use a concept called Time Dialation or TiDi to help with the server load. I am really excited for AoC to showcase their new tech.

@BobOfBarons

17 күн бұрын

ya know what actually makes me laugh at the idea of thousands of players around each other (Especially for something like SC) is yeah sure we could technically make that possible on the server side but, what about the clients? I see 90% of players ending up with a power point presentation in situations like this.

@tekisen8424

17 күн бұрын

@@BobOfBarons that's true. The end user also has to be able to handle the increased load

Right before the 4th, nice. Narc, keep the flame alive. I will play this if it ever comes out (I pray it does). I feel like I just did a party line of refined copium with my boy.

Just checked, SC is hosted on AWS. I've been working with AWS (serverless lambda + EC2) for a while now: insane possibilities. I imagine AWS deserve a lot of credit for this being even remotely feasible

@Billy-bc8pk

22 күн бұрын

Yeah that's why they hooked the lumberyard networking infrastructure into their workflow for the StarEngine.

I hope this game will play on my EVEA GTX 980ti Classified. (not the min spec requirements) I need the 5090 to come out sooner! Great Vid Narc.

Every fucking time I have a fucking day off and can attend the livestream it fucking cancels!! Anyways, very useful info!

Playable worlds (some former EQ Next devs) announced their new game, sandbox space MMO

Spacetomato Narc video, GO!

I want gw2 with servermeshing and a open map

This is MMO server tech finally reaching what the enterprise cloud had been pushing for a decade now... The costs savings, the amount of automation, scalability, high availability and much more will finally happen to MMOs and we will finally be able to simulate full worlds in a cost and performance effective way. SC promised this from the beginning and that is why I backed them more then SC I want them to sell the tech for the gaming industry. For reference I work as AWS solutions architect and I have been involved in creating many big data, machine learning and high scale infrastructures that use all of this tech to grow and shrink seamlessly for the clients

20:13 that's what Star Citizen players have been trying to tell everyone for years

i can tell you for sure that intrepid wont do dynamic server meshing :D. Putting it on the nodes makes more sense yeah

Let's be clear about what increases lag in situations when alot of characters are in a tight space. It is because the server has to run alot more checks (for example collision) and can't keep up with the normal tick rate, because of the exponentially increased computation needed. There is no way that other servers can "help out" a "struggling" server without increasing the overall time to do all these checks. Sending data over a network connection is way slower than just doing the calulation itself for a server. So the idea of slicing a large battle in parts is a pipe dream, but it could work with better hardware that focuses just on the large battle. Perhaps the new AI focussed hardware could be helping with that, because these have alot of VRAM, which is faster than the normal RAM, but i never heard of a mmo server that runs on cuda or somthing similar. If you guys think i'm wrong, then let me know

Server meshing attached to node progression would actually be a really good sudo-dynamic way of doing it. Considering node progression/changes are not going to be too frequent, its very infrequent server movements. They can also do it based on node war status; since war is expected to have larger amount of people on node for the duration.

@SETHthegodofchaos

22 күн бұрын

Shouldnt it be solely based on where players are? Not sure what people mean by this? If there are many players in one area then there should be many servers handling those. Regardless of the node level.

Wait, Throne and Liberty already can handle massive 10k massive pvp... i tried playing TnL 2 months ago and the sieges was very fun imo

@coadamolx0100

24 күн бұрын

TnL is like new world all user based not server so it is , was and will be filled with hacks , bugs and exploits lol

@seveneternal7988

24 күн бұрын

TnL doesnt have physics nor collisions. Easy server side game

as players converge onto a small area, they AREN'T in or on other areas. IF there are no players in an area, then they don't need a server to create that area. If there are few players in an area, a single server can handle the workload. With a very few players in an area, that server might be used to create/control multiple areas.

very interesting.. sad that the livestreaming was delayed.. we will see why

@coadamolx0100

24 күн бұрын

Steven is sick that's why lol

dynamic meshing will be the most cost efficient server structure, as servers can adopt its governed space according to need. means, they can always run on optimal performance/efficiency. means you need LESS servers for the same task compared to a static mesh like WOW. in a static mesh, you always have waste.

@seveneternal7988

24 күн бұрын

wow doesnt have a mesh, they have a cluster.

@SETHthegodofchaos

22 күн бұрын

dynamic meshing is more cost efficient over static meshing. but both of these are more expensive than standard instancing.

*How did Ashes achieve Dynamic Server Meshing before StarCitizen?* *Talent.*

@herobrine024

24 күн бұрын

We dont even know what exactly Server Meshing is when it comes to Ashes.

@CestPasFaux-kt9zq

24 күн бұрын

or lies

the main difference is you can dynamically distribute server load so 100 servers can be 10x as efficient and can actually be playable together without "walls" . So if 10k ppl are playing instead of having 10 servers and 1k on each all can play together and servers can distribute areas / players optimally (i.e. mayb there is an event and 90% of players are in one city, then 9 servers can dedicate temselves to the city and leave the rest of the world on 1 server. this implies all servers are allways at "max" capacity and not wasted

8:14 btw this is wrong, Guild Wars engine was in-house developed, it has absolutely nothing to do with unreal engine, then Guild wars 2 just modified the Guild wars 1 engine to add and renovate stuff.

Funny when they show this "new tech" when planetside 2 have this for last 11 years and its hex based system map in planetside is 64 square kliometers and can hold up to 1000 players per map, but map is divided in hexes and every hex is like minisub server, fights are often like 100v100 players on few hexes at once. Also depends on your equiped weapon or vehicles ther is maximum distance rendened for vehicles it would be around 700m, for infantry 400-500. And the PlanetSide hold Guiness world record for Most players in an online FPS battle 1,530, achieved on 5 November 2022

@kaleb5926

24 күн бұрын

Where do you think those planetside2 employees are right now? Theyre working on this. This is significantly different from what planetside2 had.

@Billy-bc8pk

22 күн бұрын

It's not the same tech at all. Since it doesn't use persistent entity tracking, and it zones players.

Needs more copium!

He misunderstood what how WOW and severe meshing. He gots the feast right.

The technology shown here doesn't seem entirely outrageous (as someone in the telecom space)... BUT... the idea that objects could easily flow between servers would be extremely negotiation expensive. And we have significantly more staff than what they are working with -- hopefully they are 10x devs because this is not easy.

@herobrine024

24 күн бұрын

Its handled by the Replication Layer that sits between the Client and Servers and manages the distribution of entity simulation authority.

@escarretada

24 күн бұрын

The devs of Ark did something similar with Atlas with an side team of 10 devs , had some role back but worked , many years ago

gotta know calculus 2 for Star Citizen

@kaleb5926

24 күн бұрын

its easier than you think tbh

@Billy-bc8pk

22 күн бұрын

@@kaleb5926 Then why haven't half a dozen other MMOs used it?

I guess they are allready working on that for a while. Im not sure but i guess the idea about servermashing isn't that new. i guess the idea is from 1995. I would assume they working on it since alpha 1 because they get some data out of this to see the requierements. Someone prob would need to look up for the hirings over that perticular time, if data is avable. I think they will go with a static model, or maybe semi dynamic one to make it less material intense. Sad that there wasn't a stream, im so fucking curious now. :D

It's like the general public had amnesiaaaaaa. Server meshing is an old buzz word and not new technology. It's still interesting stuff though

@kaleb5926

24 күн бұрын

What general public? the general publics opinion of sc is that its a scam lmao.

@seveneternal7988

24 күн бұрын

you are ignorant. I could just ask you to send me a link of a website, article or book that mentioned the term "SERVER MESHING" before SC and u woulnt find any. Ignorant.

The cost of servers is not an issue at all if you have dynamic server meshing, it's actually cheaper than the standard way of doing it. If you imagine WOW has 1000 players, each one is in a different zone, that's 1000 servers needed to host those players with a loading screen in-between each. With dynamic servers, if there are 1000 players, they would be able to run just 10 servers, spread across all zones, because the terrain is mostly run client side, and they save 990 servers, because it's not a server per zone, it's a server per 100 players, and you're just spreading the server resources out. Then, if you scale this up to 10k players in just one zone, WOW servers would be dying, whereas meshed servers can just assign 100 players to 1000 servers meshed together, and no servers would be assigned to the rest of the open world because they are not populated and don't need to take up any more server resources. This is also why servers are based on player count, because nodes are fixed values which don't take up much space, anything in the world can be cached in the client, whereas player interactions are happening constantly, so take up the most resources, it's all about network bandwidth at the end of the day, not virtual locations in game like most people tend to think, that's also why games are 100GB+, you don't download an entire zone every time you go through a loading screen, would be a huge waste on bandwidth. The replication layer part is just talking about when 2 players are close to each other, but on different servers. Those 2 servers need to communicate with each other because they have common data (players), so the player data and visuals are replicated on both servers at once, then once they move away from the server boundary, their data will be assigned to a single server and wiped from the other one. Hope that makes sense.

*stares in Eve Online*

I really think intrepid prepared the terrain for a big dissapointment. They are going to show a server clusters arquitecture as thats what they have been working before, as that is what PS2 uses. Thats like 20 years behind the real Server Meshing server arquitecture..

@Billy-bc8pk

22 күн бұрын

The problem is that Epic has not implemented object container streaming into the Unreal Engine yet in the same way that the Star Engine handles it. I believe object container optimisations are on the roadmap for an Unreal 5.x update, but until it's in, either Intrepid will have to build their own or find another similar solution.

Seems to be what Throne and Liberty already DOES with a real released game, in Korea and coming global in the next few months. Could be something different, but the results are good in either cases. No "channels" no loading screens, huge world and amounts of players (probably).

@afx3142

24 күн бұрын

No

@escarretada

24 күн бұрын

Yup actually they need to study TL is insane how many players you can have on the screen fighting with zero impact in performance , even better then Albion that that zones are divided by channels

Xillin says HI. keep em coming.

I don't think it's the same system intrepret is going to use honestly, many people will get disappointed for sure

@rabbitanations23

24 күн бұрын

many people wont understand that SC scale is just another thing and the interpid adaptation from the SC Server Meshing is a limited one. However, even if limited, it covers the needs of AoC. AoC in the end is not a permanent persistent universe as SC is trying to be.

@scarletlion7201

24 күн бұрын

agreed, they really did a bad move calling what they will show SM.

@anshukandulna1844

24 күн бұрын

​@@rabbitanations23AoC's map is also much smaller which might help

@SETHthegodofchaos

22 күн бұрын

@@rabbitanations23 Imo, this "a permanent persistent universe" idea is just silly. Even Minecraft, THE persistent sandbox game, has limitations on entities (entity cramming) and item despawn after lifetime runs out to limit. Even SC is going to have such systems. They planned a garbage system that cleans up items already.

@rabbitanations23

16 күн бұрын

@@SETHthegodofchaos its not planned, its already ingame you ignorant. And it just despawn unsefull entities. It is all persistent as long as all the data is stored in a backend server and not in the DGS. This doesnt exist in minecraft, dont invent trash.

Running in someone’s server in a basement. “Trust me bro” seal of approval

Who in this day and age would want to make an mmo, it is an exercise in failure. Hell it's probably taking years off of poor Steven's life.

i wonder if throne and liberty uses this because they have 2000+ players in 1 fuckin fight

@kaleb5926

24 күн бұрын

they dont

Enjoying more the debate in the chat than the video itself, sorry narc but the comments went god tier hehe

I think you've come to a fair assessment of star citizen. It's been mismanaged, and had lots of feature creep issues, but it's definitely not a scam, and this tech is the major thing that's held it up.

Why can't Ashes just license the server meshing tech from CIG? They've done all the work, why not leverage it? Why reinvent the wheel?

@herobrine024

22 күн бұрын

They'd most likely have to switch to CIG's engine, which they are not intending on licensing right now. The majority of AoC's systems would need to be reworked to fit into StarEngine. So basically, they'd reinvent the wheel.

@SETHthegodofchaos

22 күн бұрын

is this bait? :D

@Danso_3000

20 күн бұрын

They have quite famously not done the work.

@herobrine024

20 күн бұрын

@@Danso_3000 I guess the multiple public server meshing tests were staged then?

5:07 elwyn forest was it's own server. WoW basically did exactly this. Thats why thered be times when Thunder Bluffs was down on one server (because the hardware crashed) but the rest of of the world was fine. And they did it without loading screens unelss you moved between continents. The onky thing i can think kf tba tmakes this tech exciting is that its faster for a game that is more FPS. The old way worked for WoW but probably isnt as good for an FPS game like Star Citizen.

Is it just me or is this terrifying from an AI perspective, as this is basically how human neurons work which using this tech would make true AI easy?

@Billy-bc8pk

22 күн бұрын

Possibly yeah.... hadn't thought about it like that but you're onto something.

@SETHthegodofchaos

22 күн бұрын

distributed systems and super computers arent anything new. I dont think this will change anything in this regard.

server meshing is more cost efficient to run, but much more difficult to code. But once the code exists you're good.

@SETHthegodofchaos

22 күн бұрын

Thats debateable. Server Meshing requires replicating game state across game servers for those seamless interactions and handoffs between servers. This adds additional bandwidth on the backend. Which has to be paid for. Furthermore, since you can have many more players, you also have to send them state updates of each other. That may be optimized with multicasting, but in some cases not. So you will have much more data going out of your backend to the clients if many players are meeting up. Also, optimizing the networking for the players (interest Management) will also take additonal performance off of the intermediate server (Replication Layer) and will cost money that you wouldnt have to spend in other games with meshing. I think in the end, you need more servers and costs will be higher than traditional backends. Even with dynamic server meshing.

if this is as advertised, backend offloading on assets, and not layering by another name, okay. But I do cope, not hope because down that way lies the crack cocaine of hype.

Rofl So after a long time The state of Ashes of creation is still the same And now they talk about bullshit meshing servers :D This game is still the scam it was after 8 years here the state - 3/4 classes not even finished - scenario made in dev area - same biome for years - Caravan boring shit - nothing Nice Progress

Guild Wars 2 engine is a modified version of Guild Wars engine, which is in house engine, nothing to do with Unreal.

Server bullshit

Aye waddup bois

so i understand about 1% of this but if it makes games suck less i'm 100% all-in on it

SC relabelled a buzzword, so cool

Give this man a key

This is actually so much copium, probably too much

Likely bought the tec from rsi

@herobrine024

20 күн бұрын

RSI isnt selling the tech, which would require selling the engine which they said they dont have any plans to do so currently.

i would say yes.

Eve online has been doing this for a decade

the livestream starting on my bday is wild to me ngl

I'm genuinely concerned for Stephen's health... It's always sounded like he's had a cold in nearly every episode. Hope it's nothing to serious.

really interesting to see you reacting, u should do more of these. Cant wait for next week, this will be the next era of MMOs

Mate I'd love to talk about the topic in general if you're interested! Thanks for watching and sharing the video, here's to talking about alpha games 🙃

Star citizen can sell the technology when they are done.

Ashes of Convention

Intrepid should have used another words. Calling what they are going to show a SM makes no sense (obviously it wont be the same as SC, UE5 would burn if they only tried to recreate smt at a scale of SM) because it has nothing to do to what citizen is doing

@klimaluky

24 күн бұрын

It has nothing with client, they do not run game server in UE

@rawdrakeman8152

24 күн бұрын

@@klimaluky what? Obviously Unreal Engine is not a games server, but unreal engine is what sends the orders per frame to the server and what waits the reply from the server to act accordingly. They are not the same thing but both are conected, and UE is very know for not being the best MMOs engine. Actually its a very bad engine for MMOs. Still, if u remove physics, gravityn collisions and stuff, it does work for MMOs, but its an engine meant for single player cinematic games.

@SETHthegodofchaos

22 күн бұрын

you want to be they just imported the SpatialOS plugin into UE5? :D

@rawdrakeman8152

21 күн бұрын

@@SETHthegodofchaos the only real game that tried that scam is bankrupted so hopefully no

@SETHthegodofchaos

20 күн бұрын

​@@rawdrakeman8152problem is CIGs implementation seems to be almost the exact same. So what to take away from that?

So Server Meshing is like quantum mechanics… if there is no one there to perceive it, the server doesn’t render it

@herobrine024

24 күн бұрын

That is Server Side Object Container Streaming, a part that makes Server Meshing possible. Instead of a traditional server simulating every room in a building at all times, it only simulates those that have players in them to save on processing resources. This is made possible by the fact that the game world is divided into Object Containers, which basically amounts to chunks. A room, a ship, a room in a ship, a city district, a planet, a solar system are all Object Containers. What Server Meshing allows, is the ability to assign servers to these rooms/Object Containers as dedicated simulation processors, while keeping traversal and interactions across these rooms seamless. This is achieved with the Replication Layer, which stands between the Player and the Server/Simulator and governs the ground truth of the shard's state, so that you can witness a player moving about in the hallway that is on one server, while you are in your room that is on a different server. This also allows you to interact with him by shooting him, which is made possible by the fact that the replication layer knows that you shot the other guy, sends that data to the relevant servers and they process your and his state and communicates that back to you two.

I have been saying for years all gamers should be cheering CIG on. Not trying to tear them down . Because they are single handedly dragging the gaming industry forward . If they succeed we all win . Imagine them selling or liscensing their tech to mmo devs

No one tryed something like Server meshing because the risk to try it is to high for companys that are mainly profit orientated, at least the publishers. But SC is fund raised by the community thats why they have the chance to try something like that so if the money wont run out i think we will see some legendary results. I think then we will have some kind of Sword art Online moment when they rent there engine to other studios it will be like "The Seed" any then many crazy worlds will grow

grab 1 boix z

Would that mean The Division 2 has Server Meshing of some kind? StarCitzen still broke it's promise of release dates, if they do this now, they need to cancel the game and remake it when they're ready to release instead of scamming people out of money.

@escarretada

24 күн бұрын

No , division have just Basic channels

@seveneternal7988

24 күн бұрын

SC NEVER had a release date. How did they brake a release date? Are u drunk?

@blackhorde22

24 күн бұрын

@@seveneternal7988 Holy shit man, guess you missed that era of delays back in alpha 1.0.. Go Check your History.

@seveneternal7988

24 күн бұрын

@@blackhorde22 holy shit man guess u missed the fact that SC was never in alpha 1.0. Check your iq with a medic.

@Billy-bc8pk

22 күн бұрын

@@blackhorde22 Seveneternal is correct. SC never had a release date.

Static server meshing has been around since UO. Many MMOs have seamless server transitions and have had them for years. Star Citizens intended version of meshing will hopefully one day be what they call dynamic server meshing. The best way to describe this is with their intended goal: They want players to be on a large ship that is its own server that can interact in real time with other zones and ship servers in real time. This would allow for actual Star Wars size battles with capital ships and fighters and even FPS combat all at the same time.

@seveneternal7988

24 күн бұрын

you are confusing server meshing with cluster of servers. Dont be ignorant.

@Diogenes76

23 күн бұрын

@@seveneternal7988 I have been following MMO server tech for 20 years and am a back end dev. UO had live server transition boundaries (people use to exploit them). I believe EQ, planeside, etc. Many other games we have long threads about it on spectrum. These were not dynamic, but static.

@seveneternal7988

23 күн бұрын

@@Diogenes76 You are confusing cluster of servers with server meshing. You are confusing a microserive with a servers arquitecture. PS2 uses a simple traditional old cluster of servers which has NOTHING to do with server meshing. Sever meshing is for un-limited persistent worlds. PS2 doesnt have any kind of sort of persistence. Connecting servers and allowing players to move from one server to another seamless, thats easy, thats old, thats lazy. Many MMOs use it. Thats a cluster of severs. Thats a simple microservice. Again, SM has nothing to do with that. SM is that and 999999 things more.

@Diogenes76

23 күн бұрын

@@seveneternal7988 I think the mistake here is assuming that CIG owns this term when it has been around long before they started their implementation. Even though server meshing has been around a long time, CIG still does not have a basic implantation (hopefully soon). The whole unlimited persistent worlds thing is an application of server meshing, it is not server meshing. CIG has spent the last couple of years refactoring their server into microservices. The new thing that CIG will hopefully bring to the table is dynamic real time meshing. The tech for the rest has been out for years. I will be really cool if they can pull it off, but they are years away from a practical PoC. These conversations would be more interesting without being so angsty. It does not help your point and it really is interesting to talk about.

@seveneternal7988

23 күн бұрын

@@Diogenes76 CIG doesnt own the term, but CIG invented the term. And not only that, they invented many of the microservices that are needed for the server meshing and, therefore, they invented the server meshing - yet, they dont own it. the server meshing WAS NEVER implemented, not even conceptualized, until CIG did so. The unlimited persistent world thing IS the server meshing. CIG never refactored anything, SM is a compendium of microservices (i.e. SM is just OCS + replication layer + Hybrid). All needed for the end goal of Server Meshing. You keep not understanding that SM is not a microservice but a group of them, and you are confusing cluster of servers, a unique microservice, with the server meshing which again, is not a unique microservice. Dynamic Server Meshing, same as server meshing, is a compedium of several microservices.

SC isn't "presenting the game" ... they are presenting marketing material. ... want to test it... ask an SC backer what "exploration" gameplay is ... its just a marketing term ... zero development behind it. Steven does a much better job presenting the actual game and his plan for gameplay.

@Billy-bc8pk

22 күн бұрын

Narc did a good job of explaining how CIG had to design the tools and tech to design the game. And that's precisely what Jared tells people every single week on ISC/SCL with the weekly video dev diaries. Exploration gameplay is held up by scanning v2, and scanning v2 is held up by server meshing, so we won't be getting scanning v2 until alpha 4.0, which is where proper exploration gameplay can be realised.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

i love how not a single bit of water or boats/sailing or anythign water content related has yet to be shown at all

@BeegHonkeyGR

24 күн бұрын

You missed the part where the trade caravan turned into a boat and sailed down a river way back when? Lmfao

Mortal Online has been doing this for 17 years, this is not new technology.

@sirbonobo3907

22 күн бұрын

Ahahaha

@Noob_Fodder

21 күн бұрын

Fighting on a node line between two servers and becoming invincible was the worst, lol

The ignorant regarding server meshing got humbled May the copium be with him 🙏

I appreciate you trying to help learn more about server meshing, but I’d refrain from comparing AOC to SS. If AOC ends up remotely like SS it would be a tragedy. Just because they are trying to create a new technology doesn’t get rid of the fact they have led their supporters on for so long with no true end in sight. That’s worst case scenario for an indie mmo project.

@seveneternal7988

24 күн бұрын

lets keep in mind that in SC we voted for a game in permanent growth. We ordered CIG to do this and we are vigilant that the SC scope ALWAYS goes up.

@Billy-bc8pk

22 күн бұрын

@@seveneternal7988 Yup. People tend to forget about the majority vote back in 2014 that gave Roberts carte blanche to make the game as big as possible with the funds that they were given.

Almost first

So they are copying Star Citizen's tech now?

I am not sure really... like it sounds like a lot of garbage to me personally. What is described here is basically what Lineage 2 did 21 years ago, just on steroids. Surely adding physics to objects and scaling up the world is going to require new solutions but it's not a new concept or even technology. Entirety of Lineage 2 was free of loading screens and with multiple events happening simultaneously across the world. And before anyone says "Lineage 2 played like shit" yes we all know that and it had plenty of technical issues in general but glorifying server meshing as something new is like CNN reinventing sailing and calling it "future of naval transportation" xD a hard cope to excuse almost a billion dollar investment with no ETA on horizon.

Great, another tech demo that will take forever to get anywhere and wants to be a game.

Crypto mining shows that servers aren't really that expensive, it's just the service being overcharged and of course the company profits and executive bonuses that require microtransactions on scale.

This tech will enable adcanced game systems you should normally find in single player games in mmos