BDAG I have been searching for that acronym to help with study subjects and issues that you addressed in this video. Thank you!

@fiftycalguru

3 жыл бұрын

@Mark Ward I appreciate that! It will probably come out as a free app after I buy it🤪. Thanks for the resource it will be a great addition to my study.

In my opinion the strength of Strong's, pardon the pun, is being able to search every occurrence of a particular word. You can read every verse in which it is used until you understand it. Given enough examples you understand how it is and is not used in a sentence. After you read enough verses you can easily define the word yourself.

@davidchase1439

2 жыл бұрын

Actually prefer how Youngs handles that in the English

Biblical languages are very important, if one can they should. I do of course understand the frustration because of those who abuse these languages. I always tell people that, "never overreact against an abuse of a good thing to a point of rejecting the good thing itself". We must humbly teach people about the importance of context and actually demonstrate that. People must be taught to read broadly as much as possible, and that helps to see words in different contexts and that eliminates the obsession of "the Greek says or the Hebrew says".

*Logos Bible Software* I enjoy e-Sword. Thank-you so much for the tip. God Bless.

Hi Mark, thanks for the video. Do you have a blog post or a video that details all the commonly committed word study fallacies and how to avoid them?

@logosbiblesoftware

3 жыл бұрын

(This is Mark signed in as Logos-the only way I can share links without KZread deleting the comments!) blog.logos.com/4-simple-language-principles-will-improve-bible-study/

@mikedawson975

3 жыл бұрын

@@logosbiblesoftware Thanks Mark!

Logos is great for those who have not learned Hebrew or Greek, as hyper linked to the various lexicons and dictionaries and texts, but no substitute for learning the original languages if possible

@logosbiblesoftware

2 жыл бұрын

Thank you, David!

Very, very interesting! Thank you. There's always something to learn.

@logosbiblesoftware

Жыл бұрын

Our pleasure! Agreed!

This is so true! I had to learn this the hard way.

So true! Thanks for laying this out so clearly.

Good information here. Love using Logos (mobile) for my own studies and preparing sermons. Looking through the list, BDAG is out of my reach at the moment, the other two is within my budget to buy and the Lexham one i got already. Just want to ask what you think of The Brill Dictionary of Ancient Greek (GE)? I’ve watched a few videos about it but still trying to make a wise choice on my purchasing decisions, since im doing my own self study in beginning greek using books i bought on logos.

@DeconTheMonkey

Жыл бұрын

@Mark Ward looking forward to what you gotta say about GE!

What are some other PRINTED resources you’d recommend? TIA

@miketisdell5138

3 жыл бұрын

I would recommend: 1) Multiple good English translations of the Biblical text. Looking at multiple English translation is a good way to identify passages where the meaning of the original language is in dispute i.e. places that warrant deeper study. 2) Good commentaries written by people who can read the biblical languages. Note, many commentaries are written by people who cannot read Greek or Hebrew so check the credentials of the author and look at reviews. www.bestcommentaries.com is a good resource for finding commentaries. 3) The NET bible NOTES. They provide good insights into their translation decisions in their notes and often provide insights into the the debates over the translation of passages.

I wouldn't steer people away from Strong's, but I would advise care and caution. For me, I was always aware certain definitions only applied under certain contexts, Greek, Hebrew and even English. Strong's is still my quickest resource, Thayer's/Gesenius' Lexicons are next but mostly because I've had them for 30/40 years and they are well annotated books (yes, I'm pre-internet). I also have BDAG, Liddel & Scott's in print form, but less annotated. I see ads for "Logos" where you can save $1200.00, and, yikes!, I can't help but wonder how much $$$ is in it in order to save that much, thus one reason I steer away from it. Books allow for time to keep thinking/meditating on the topic while flipping through pages. I have the 2019 printed Edition of the NET Bible "Full Notes Edition" for the latest (New age?) thinking. (I'm not always comfortable with "updated definitions" but curious enough to learn/know what they are, whether I totally agree with them or no.)

@19king14

3 жыл бұрын

@Mark Ward I actually didn't see any negativity about Strong's in your video or comment. For me, I have always used it rather cautiously. I never knew of the term "meaning soup" but the concept is one I have always been aware of. It seems I have those same books that are in the "Logos" software. I reference them too, along with my English/Greek Septuagint. The books are mostly within reach or a few steps away from me. They may be a little slower than digital access, but I do find it wise to get up out of my seat and stretch my legs a little, get the blood going and refresh myself, (maybe even awaken further). I appreciate that I can keep my mind concentrating on what I'm considering or studying, while moving about and around. Yes, I do have some digital Bible software. I had a tablet and the battery swelled up, thus I lost all the notes that I hadn't backed up! Meanwhile, I have notes from up to over 45 years ago in books, still unharmed and available (unless the house burns down - less likely than a digital loss). Even when I give talks and/or sermons, it's still mostly paper notes and paper/ink bible. I've seen speakers go a-blank because their digital devices went a-blank. Not that I haven't or can't be adaptable for "digitality," I use computers for much of my work and income. But I still lean my spiritual endeavors maybe 2/3s "old school" and about 1/3 digital, mostly for keeping "in-the-know," perhaps peer pressure and the faster convenience it does offer. Maybe someday I'll go "Logos." My limited income and not seeing a vital need makes it all to easy to procrastinate. As always, commendable work, Mark!

@itrow9526

Жыл бұрын

@@19king14 Books are easier on my eyeballs and do not make me sleepy nearly as fast.

@19king14

Жыл бұрын

@@itrow9526 same here... especially if you have to get up out of your chair and walk to your library or book shelf. Doing so also allows for some 'pondering' or 'meditation' (something the bible encourages) rather than the speediness of cold digital bits of information being pumped into the memory banks of the brain. Books allow for more giving of thought to settle into the heart. Oh, I use my phone, my I-pad and computers too, and enjoy them and goodly portion of my time, but I enjoy books and the 'treasure' of 're-discovering' notes I have written in them from 30, 40, and 50 years ago. Those reminders often have great value to me. Especially since I thought enough of those for writing those notes in the fist place. I don't discourage people using "e-stuff," but there is something much more natural with book - even from an educational POV.

Mark, Overall this was very done and we need a lot more presentations like this!!! The only thing I would change is the idea that using other resources like BDAG (or HALOT) in Logos is better for those who don't know the original languages. While these resources to provide grammatical and contextual information required for understand Greek (and Hebrew) words in context, in my experience those who have not studied the original languages still end up treating it as "soup of all the meanings" or "pick the one I like best." For example, while HALOT will designate meaning for qal, niphal, piel, pual, hiphal, hophal, and hitpael, those who do not understand what these mean often will still pick a meaning they like best even when it is not consistent with the form in the text. Additionally idiomatic usages may not be covered in the entries in a lexicon, so the correct meaning may not even be found when one looks at these lexicons. Using tools like Logos to discover the "correct meaning" of Greek and Hebrew words is almost as problematic as using Strong's. Without some training in the biblical languages and a lot of training about how NOT to use tools like these, the results are far too often just as bad as the results from the "Strong's method." One thing I tell my Hebrew students is that if you cannot find a reputable English bible translation that supports the meaning you think you discovered then you, rather than the translators of our bibles, have probably made a very serious error. I strongly support your first suggestion i.e. using commentaries and multiple English translations if you do not read the biblical languages; also the NET bible notes can be very helpful because, like commentaries, they deal with original language issues in the specific text that is being studied. Many of the worst sermons I have heard used the "Strong's method" for determining the "correct meaning" of the text, and unfortunately many use Logos (and equivalent software packages) as a quicker way to implement the "Strong's method" of study. Note: I am aware that Logos provides a lot of information to help people avoid these kinds errors, but in my experience these helps are ignored because they are not understood by those who have not studied the original languages. What seems obvious to someone like you, who has spent time studying the original languages, is not so obvious to those who haven't engaged in original language studies.

@miketisdell5138

3 жыл бұрын

For example, Bruce Wilkinson (Branches of the Vine) used BDB to determine that עזב in Ge. 2:24 was mistranslated i.e. it should have been translated as "abandon" rather than "leave." He then builds a doctrine based on this "correct meaning" that is completely foreign to the biblical text and culture i.e. claiming that this text requires one to move far away from their parents when they marry and that living in the same neighborhood as your parents is outside of God's design for marriage.

Thank you,Thank you,Thank you .I appreciate this video. As you were saying this is where,as a kid, I am now in my 50's, I began understanding the Hebrew and Greek words of the Bible.Added to the fact this had to take years to accomplish without electronics but over the past 10 years I have been questioning certain words in different context the Scripture would say them yet the Concordance would give the same word meaning...I'm like God had to mean something else ....His verbiage is different than the other passage.... anyway 👍👍👍👍👍👍

I was raised with King James. I know it is not the most accurate, although that keeps changing. I do it because scripture reading is not about academic exercise and scholarship. It's not even about learning about God, my knowledge of His Gospel and doctrine is already pretty complete (at least compared to most). No, instead it is an act of worship. So, Strongs, or some outdated Biblical aids, dictionaries, or commentaries may have errors or outdated information but I still find them useful as I try to understand more about my God through His scripture.

@shawnglass108

10 ай бұрын

I can’t imagine ever coming to a point in my lifetime where I can declare that “it’s not about learning about God” or my knowledge of his Gospel and doctrine are pretty complete”. I was told by a pastor one time during a sermon that “If you ever get to a point, studying your Bible, where believe you know enough about God then you need to go back to the beginning. Because you’ve completely missed it.”. Through all of my learning I recognize that I haven’t even scratched the surface.

Sir what i orded the hollman bible dictionary is that a good alternative too?

Great presentation

So good. Context is so important. I certainly identify with your comment about debating on social media. It's the reason I stay away from it. I can't restrain myself from being more extensive and intensive about it than I ought to be :) I really like this gem from you as well: Maybe we ought not "ride the sacred cow of original language usage through the slaughterhouse of linguistic fallacies." So funny ...and convicting.

Ok. But I can buy a strongs book. The other options you gave are only on the internet, correct?

I have a Companion Bible that I also find quiet helpful.

Another hindrance is Strong's placement in the KJV text. For instance in e-Sword whoever put the Strong's numbers in line with the KJV text did not do the best job. Genesis 1:5 for instance leaves out the second verb "and the evening was and the morning was the first day." See KJV footnote. I also think there are cautions to any dictionary or commentary. Have a great day.

@christopheryetzer

3 жыл бұрын

@Mark Ward All you have to do is check Genesis 1:5 and see if H1961is given twice or not. I'm guessing it is the same text. Why do modern Bibles still use Strong's numbers?

I'll stick with Strong (and Thayer, conveniently not mentioned) used wisely as better than Logos's compromise. If only there were less sinning in social media. @ 4:40 an arrogant opinion may be given about Mary's Magnificat supposedly not being "jumping for joy," but, not having been there a more humble approach would be not imposing such narrow views on Mary's divinely inspired joyful utterance. As one who's both reformed and charismatic I frequently encounter this kind of "put God in a box" approach on both sides, ignoring how we need the whole Body of Christ. The Louw-Nida semantic domain approach has its own problems conveniently ignored in the video.

@cpr317officialvideos3

7 ай бұрын

Amen!

@cpr317officialvideos3

7 ай бұрын

@@markwardlogosLet me Guess, you read the ESV?

This is very well done, and you explain yourself clearly. One point to expound upon: using English to understand true meaning can never trump the original languages for indepth understanding! Strongs remains the primary resource for root word studies, but a Hebrew/Greek lexicon will help expound upon those words that change with context. Example: Charis is the root word for grace, and is almost always defined as God's unmerited favor, but the context in which it is used can change its meaning. We see this in Hebrews 4:16, where grace is used twice in the same verse, with 2 different but compatible definitions. This is all explained in the Strongs with perhaps some clarification by using a Vines dictionary. Logos software is not the best source. It is the laziest source, but I will always prefer the use of books over computer software. Also, the Lexham English translation is like paraphrase version. It is a poor choice for replacing the use of a KJV. If you really want to educate your followers, don't dumb them down by leading them to use poor translations, or using lazy methods to achieve understanding. True satisfaction can only come by physically digging for that treasure. Get that Strongs concordance and a KJV Bible, along with a Vines dictionary. Always place the emphasis on the original languages. They will always supercede the common language. We would not have English without them.

@Pastor-Brettbyfaith

3 жыл бұрын

@Mark Ward I am not KJVO. Blessings to you.

Very true. As a KJVO I don’t like people correcting the Bible just because they own a Strong’s. It isn’t an actual lexicon though they use it that way. Good points in this video: 5:17 You don’t need Hebrew and Greek 👍🏻 5:04 Just stick with English 👍🏻

@BibleIssues

3 жыл бұрын

@Mark Ward I know your position, but it doesn’t make one automatically wrong all the time.

Still way too difficult to be practical. Put that effort into learning the languages. Use them daily. Get some payoff for your effort.

"Some people read their Bibles in Hebrew, some in Greek; I like to read mine in the Holy Ghost." ~ Smith Wigglesworth

@speedoggy

Жыл бұрын

There is nothing Holy about a Ghost bad translation. What walking in the Set-Apart Spirit looks like in Scripture. Ezekiel 36:26-27; Acts 5:32; Romans 7:14; 7:22) Revelation 14:12

Word study to show our self approved 2 Timothy 2:15 just like in JeremiYah 8:8 days. Example Hebrew#4899 Mashiach transliteration to Greek#3323 Massias to English Messiah questioned is who replaced it with christos? Rome.

How about psalm 2:12? Kiss the Son? Nonsense

Studying the Bible in only English is one of the stupidest things you can do. English is a new language. It changes very often. It's also one of the hardest languages in the world to learn. Yes, there are rules but there are so many exceptions. I have spoken to people who speak 7 languages or more and they all say how difficult English is. It's not a stable language, plus it's a mut. This channel is called "Logos". Lol! That's not an English word. Do not be misled. Study your etymology. Hebrew is full of symbolism and many English translators "CORRECT" what seems to be a paradox because they simply just don't understand.

Your Mary example is jumping for joy. Wether it’s on the inside or out I truly see it the way Mary and Strongs did. You are way too modern, young and puffed up. You should retract this video and repent for trying to water down Gods word with your so called intellect.