A further contributing factor would be to transfer two pilots who are both new to the aircraft there simultaneously instead of having each fly with someone who already knows that type for a bit first.

@enigmawyoming5201

8 ай бұрын

My first thought, exactly! Everything else might not have happened if there was just an experienced pilot on this plane sitting in the cockpit!

@LIVE3DPrinting

8 ай бұрын

I would certainly hope that this near catastrophe prompted a change in policy to ALWAYS have an experienced pilot on board whether they are flying or observing. Seems like a no-brainer.

@heather8518

8 ай бұрын

Definitely seems weird to have 2 newbies!

@timonsolus

8 ай бұрын

Yes, but that can be difficult if the aircraft type is new to the entire airline, meaning that the airline has NO pilots experienced with the new aircraft.

@BritishBeachcomber

8 ай бұрын

That is standard practice with airlines.

File this under "responsible but not guilty" - they clearly made mistakes BUT everything their training and experience provided them reinforced that mistake. I'm glad no one was hurt learning this lesson.

@OldGlaseye-gf7si

8 ай бұрын

Yeegads, what ever happened to 'fly the airplane'...Rotate on gyro, get nose to where ya want it, keep it there, and lift off. yikes.

@a24396

8 ай бұрын

@@OldGlaseye-gf7si They did "fly the airplane" - and jargon aside, your list o' stuff to do wasn't what they (apparently) were taught/trained to do. And since they were current and qualified on that type I don't doubt their choices were based on what the understood were the right decisions. They just learned bad techniques and applied those poor techniques at the worst possible time. Like I said, I'm glad the lessons learned in this instance didn't come at the cost of anyone's life

@pomerau

8 ай бұрын

The first indication should have been when they both said hello to the cabin crew, turned right and walked the length of the cabin to look for the cockpit door.

@OldGlaseye-gf7si

8 ай бұрын

@@a24396 Too many airline guys show an amazing lack of air sense and basic flying skills. And yes, I am a pilot...20 years flying fighters in the USN...Before you say it, I took off from a concrete runway more than from an aircraft carrier.

@a24396

8 ай бұрын

@@pomerau 🤣🤣🤣

Despite apparently doing everything by the checklist comfirmation bias, combined with no actual flight hours between the two pilots was nearly a recipe for disaster. Boggles my mind that they would not have an experienced PIC in the cockpit.

Glad everyone survived, that was a close one.

Imagine being a passenger and seeing the runway finish, yet your plane didn't lift off!

@Seventh7Art

8 ай бұрын

@RobloxianSora Nice!

@msvaj

8 ай бұрын

a very scary thought

@shreyanshaswal9831

8 ай бұрын

@RobloxianSora wtf? When?

@shizumaakiyama3129

8 ай бұрын

Or landing i was on a plane that keep going on a winter, i should say i dint fly when is cold. Not anymore

@tonybeam

8 ай бұрын

We are going farming. 🥹

"We pay for all of runway, we use all of runway!"

Taking off at Jo-burg is terrifying enough due to the thin air / altitude …. I honestly couldn’t believe how long it takes to get up enough speed to rotate. It’s a seriously long runway and most of the planes are big and heavy and going a long way to Europe or the US.

@akiechhabra6300

8 ай бұрын

Our runways are 11155 and 14495ft respectively in length, flights operating in hot & high conditions (widebodies and narrowbodies) typically do not have an issue as the runway is long enough for rotation. This would be an isolated case as we haven't had any similar incidents in Joburg since the EK near disaster

@petercarter2925

7 ай бұрын

I agree the dipshit pilot should have been looking out the window and not at the instruments and he would have known he wasnt lifting off quick enough, i was a pilot on the space shuttle so i know my stuff@@akiechhabra6300

Most of the commentators on this channel I'm sure have plenty of experience and are aware of many aspects regrading aircraft management but even for me as ignorant as I am of such matters it is totally engrossing and addictive. Great job thank you✌️

Airlines love to set the minimum power settings, fuel saving and noise abatement. Many pilots no longer are able to bring themselves to fly an aircraft by hand in an emergency, especially using an emergency application of Power. Student days, Power, Attitude, Trim.

@timonsolus

8 ай бұрын

Indeed. Add to this, too much trust in technology. Pilots become systems managers rather than pilots.

@EdOeuna

8 ай бұрын

Things have changed a lot since this, and similar incidents. Hand flying is encouraged and the notion that pilots can’t fly is, generally, wrong.

They ended up being 'trained' into making an error.

cant imagine what the passengers went through awhile this was happening..

@emerald39

8 ай бұрын

the passengers went through the runway beacons

@johngreydanus2033

8 ай бұрын

Sit back and enjoy the movie!

@johnalexander7490

8 ай бұрын

Prob a little poo in the shorts :)

@georgeedward1226

8 ай бұрын

That really Depends.

@isabellind1292

8 ай бұрын

@@georgeedward1226 Good pun, lol! I'm glad they could land on whatever remaining tires they had or they might have skidded off the other end of the runway.

I'm so glad no one got seriously hurt in this one. The Flight Channel always gives us great visual stories. Thank you.

When Emirates had the A340’s, their fleet was pretty cool, and that’s coming from a Boeing guy. For a brief period they had: - A380-800’s - B747-400F’s - A340-500’s - A340-300’s - A330-200’s - B777-300’s - B777-200/ER’s - B777-200LR’s Their fleet was pretty diverse for a bit but now mostly consists of 2 types until they get the A350’s, B787’s, & 777X’s.

@Plqnes

8 ай бұрын

I wish they had bought like 20 747-8's maybe have 10 for passenger only and 10 for Freighter use

@Delta_NWAB747fan

8 ай бұрын

@@Plqnes they clearly love their long haul double deckers, so it was interesting to not pick those up.

@SuperSpecies

7 ай бұрын

apostrophes aren't needed for making plurals, only for possession

Excited for this! Can't believe we are so early! Your video on the parachute jump really was powerful. Great work as always. Thanks!

OMG..!! It seems really a miracle! Never mind of an aircraft that managed to get airborne after running on the grass passed the runeway…😓😓😓😓😓

Thanks you guys/girls. Love your channel!❤❤

Apparently the aircraft had enough unburst tires and undamged flap drive mechanism remaining to enable it to land safely upon its return to the airport. Once again, everyone was lucky. But they certainly had an exciting take off with lots of extra noise from colliding with various objects beyond the end of the runway.

@tafadzwamapamula

8 ай бұрын

Exciting 😂😂😂😂. More like a horror ride!

"This is the first time either pilot has operated this plane outside of simulations." Jumping Jesus on a Christmas cookie!😱

@alexandradane3672

8 ай бұрын

I agree ………what were they thinking? And , how was the landing I wonder if the tyres had burst ?

@JimAllen-Persona

8 ай бұрын

I thought the same thing.. how is this possible? How did they not mention the perceived degradation in the takeoff performance in the last trip being since it was their first actual flight? “Gee.. it took a long time to get off the ground. Is this normal in this model?”

@riverwildcat1

8 ай бұрын

Emirates has been seen a number of times on this channel showing their pilot's amazing lack of skill. Every private pilot I know thinks this is nearly unbelievable. Due to their load and the aircraft's previous poor performance, they should have used full throttle from the start.

@AleaIactaEst2009

8 ай бұрын

It does make you wonder if and where that is still allowed. It's certainly not a sentence any passenger wants to read. You'd expect at least one to have flown it enough before to have become accustomed, always.

@timonsolus

8 ай бұрын

What if the aircraft type is new to the entire airline, meaning that the airline has NO pilots experienced with the new aircraft?

Emirates do really well keeping all the incidents out of the media , thanks for making this

@aaronmudi2562

8 ай бұрын

You are very right. They hate bad publicity. A similar one like this was EK407 from Melbourne involving an A340-500 where Pilot entered wrong takeoff data. He entered 262,000 instead of 362,000. Wrong takeoff calculation by FMS, little power on takeoff

The quality of TheFlightChannel"s videos never ceases to amaze me!

Excellent channel. Love every one of these videos. Haven't been off the ground in 40 years, except on my simulator. Peace.

@tafadzwamapamula

8 ай бұрын

I presume you're an American without a passport. Just joking.

@larryspiller6633

8 ай бұрын

No joke it's true. If I had want or reason to travel outside of here, I'd see you on the next flight. Come stay with you for a bit? Peace.@@tafadzwamapamula

@dethray1000

8 ай бұрын

stop flying 15 years ago and let my son fly while i hang in the back with the grand kids--never have loved flying so much since i do that.....had as many as 3 of em sleeping on me on the couch...heaven

Interesting video, thank you very much.

Yeah the A340-300 is equipped with 5 APUs

amazing goodjob bro

I found this AND your Emirates Flight 407 video next to each other in my recommended

Mistake #1. Pairing two pilots with zero experience on the type. Just WOW.

@rossbrown6641

8 ай бұрын

Agreed, but wow is a stupid comment!

@EdOeuna

8 ай бұрын

They had plenty of experience with other types of Airbus with the same type rating requirement. It’s no different to current EK pilots flipping between the 77L and 77W.

@deepthinker999

8 ай бұрын

@@rossbrown6641Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

I remember taking a BA 747 (unusual because I managed mostly to avoid BA's ridiculous pricing and snotty attitude 35 years of long-haul business travel) from Nairobi and I remember the pilot announcing that due to the altitude and the full load of PAX, fuel and cargo the plane would take one minute to get airborne but not to worry as NBO has one of the longest runways in the world. So I timed it and he was right, one minute then a very gentle climb indeed.

Tech does NOT excuse you from reality...Fly the Plane! If what you see isn't right react!

Flying is safe until something goes wrong

@GoldenMushroom64

8 ай бұрын

Facts

I recall a super long takeoff at the old Denver Stapleton airport. Thought we would never get off the ground. Scary. BTW, Emirates is now rated as the 4th best airline in the world.

@petercarter2925

7 ай бұрын

yes thats because they only fly boeing planes now

@bobbyperu4683

5 ай бұрын

Apart from the largest fleet of A380s of any carrier ​@@petercarter2925

Following the training and still ending up with this

arw imagine the captain taking so much time and precaution full in length briefing and every caution but still almost couldn't lift the plane. just glad that everyone was safe!

So, an odd instance where training actually worked against the pilots?

@hachimaru295

8 ай бұрын

similar too the full rudder kick the pilot was told to do in training for AA crash in new york a few years back for wake turbulance if my memeory is correct ?

@ITripReport

8 ай бұрын

@@hachimaru295 Yeah, unfortunately that instance the pilot was following what training was telling him to do, which sadly resulted in too much stress being put on the horizontal stabilizer

nice and clear animation

As long as airlines compute and use the minimum speed for takeoff to use the minimum amount of fuel, anything out of the ordinary will cause serious trouble. Risking lives to save money is always unacceptable.

@tomstravels520

8 ай бұрын

Doing takeoffs constantly at TOGA thrust also has its risks. You could end up with more engines blowing up in flight like that Southwest airlines one. And having an engine failure during takeoff at TOGA means more thrust to push you off the runway if you don’t counter it in time

@perniciouspete4986

8 ай бұрын

@@tomstravels520 Takeoff/go around thrust isn't necessary, but much more than minimum thrust is appropriate. According to your logic, takeoff/go around thrust is never a good idea.

@tomstravels520

8 ай бұрын

@@perniciouspete4986 I said using TOGA thrust CONSTANTLY. I never said using it is bad. It just comes with its own risks and if you don’t need to use it then reduce the risks by not using it. Do you red line your cars engine all the time when you accelerate?

@kickedinthecalfbyacow7549

8 ай бұрын

@@perniciouspete4986airlines don’t calculate minimum thrust. The aircraft has to be able to more than cope with an engine failure at v1, taking into consideration pressure altitude on the day and all obstacles in the area.

Aerosource moment😮‍💨

No wonder why some people have called the A340-200/300 models “trash” due to being underperforming of takeoff. 😂

I LOVE THIS CHANNEL 👍👍

@deepthinker999

8 ай бұрын

& we love you too !

This is what happens when computer nerds try to tell pilots how to fly.

@deepthinker999

8 ай бұрын

Re: The Air France Airbus crash at the European Air Show several years ago.

Nah that was smooth as hell at 11:18 nicely done.

very lucky people

Never heard of a Emirates A340. Thats new.

@WitherPlayz2326

8 ай бұрын

Actually the A340 was part of Emirates' initial fleet..they retired most aircraft in their fleet and only kept Boeing 777s and A380s in service..they even once had A330s, A310s and other similar aircraft

"Hairdryer" A340. That model was under-powered.

my heart beat slows down toward the end of the video when the plane landed without hurting anyone...in the plane and on ground.

Handsome Canadian Captain. 😅

Captain: Hey did you play simulator last night? FO: Yeah, did you? Captain: Yep played it too, nice graphics! FO: Sweet, I think we're ready to fly!

@Mveera-oh8wu

8 ай бұрын

LOLL

Wow!

ok, I thought the wings fell off or something

How much was this to repair? Whoops. Full throttle my G!!!

Why would they pair two pilots, neither of whom had any actual experience flying the aircraft type?

@EdOeuna

8 ай бұрын

They did. Both were experienced on A340’s and A330’s. It’s a common rating.

Quick question that I've had for a while from watching many of these videos... when an aircraft overruns the runway on takeoff or landing, and damages the lights and antennas that are there... can that runway then no longer be used until these have been replaced? And how long would that take, and who would bear the cost of that?

@EdOeuna

8 ай бұрын

Unless it is something that is actually required for the runway, like the actual surface itself, almost everything else can be listed as being failed. They took out some of the localiser antenna. The airport just lists (NOTAM) the LOC, and therefore ILS, as being unserviceable. Aircraft can still land on the runway, they just need to fly a different approach.

@jo5hua0680

8 ай бұрын

@@EdOeuna Yeah, reminds me of Air Canada 769 at San Fran.

Considering that they were aware of the "High density airport" and the "sluggish performance" of the aircraft from the beginning, why not take off with full TOGA?

@tomstravels520

8 ай бұрын

If you can reduce maintenance costs by using reduced power and still be able to climb away safely then it’ll be done

@connectpro1264

8 ай бұрын

Thank you for your reply. I am aware of the reduced takeoff power and engine de-rate techniques that airlines use to reduce wear and tear and extend engine life, but since the pilot is the last authority over how the airplane will be flown and specifically if things don't add up and in doubt of the performance of the aircraft, maybe better be on the cautious and safe side than worry about company policy that might fly you to the ground and kill everyone onboard. Thankfully it didn't end bad this time. Again, I am not to judge the pilots actions but just my thoughts.

@EdOeuna

8 ай бұрын

@@connectpro1264- they didn’t doubt the thrust they calculated. For them everything added up correctly.

@deepthinker999

8 ай бұрын

@@connectpro1264 I'm still wondering how this damaged plane was able to land?

The A340 was notorious for being seriously underpowered. Having had to fly in than multiple times I can say that they scared the hell out me. They used consume far more runway that I have experienced in any other airliner, take far longer to reach cruising altitude and also fly slower than other aircraft. The slow speed was actually apparent in the schedule, being about 45 minutes longer for a transatlantic than in say a 747 or MD-11. Not surprising when you see that it is powered by 4 hairdryers. Also Johannesburg is no joke - hot & high. For that reason, most long distance flights are schedule for long after dark.

So, I have been watching your videos for quite some time, and here are some that i am requesting that you add. Day 2. Pulkovo Aviation Enterprise flight 612 Korean airlines 858 1983 Chosonminhang Ilyushin Il-62 crash TAN 414 Pulkovo Aviation Enterprise Flight 9560 Ural Airlines Flight 178 Libyan Arab airlines flight 114 Libyan Arab airline flight 1103 TWA 800 (Not the one that crashed in New York, but the one that crashed in Italy) Kenya airways flight 431 Aero flight 311 LOT Polish airlines flight 007 LOT Polish airlines flight 5055 Delta airlines flight 723 World airways flight 30 Eastern airlines flight 375 Air Greenland 3275 Ariania airlines 701 Air Canada 621 Vnukovo flight 2801 UTA 120 UTA 772 United airlines flight 227

@RLTtizME

8 ай бұрын

OMG. Well OK. LOL.

I can't believe they'd have a flight crew who'd never piloted that particular model of aircraft before. Usually you should have a pilot/copilot crew where one of them has experience with the aircraft even if it's the other's first time flying it.

@timonsolus

8 ай бұрын

What if the aircraft type is new to the entire airline, meaning that the airline has NO pilots experienced with the new aircraft?

@EuroScot2023

8 ай бұрын

Then you have familiarisation flights without passengers and cabin crew, Not exactly rocket science. The error was doing familiarisation solely on sims.@@timonsolus

@EdOeuna

8 ай бұрын

Emirates are about to receive A350’s and 777X’s. None of their pilots will have experience with these aircraft types beyond the type rating which will be from the sim. Clearly EK can employ pilots from other airlines, for their experience, but there will be a steep learning curve for all those pilots.

@petercarter2925

7 ай бұрын

ive always found 30 mins max in the simulator is enough for me to get the hang of it, i have buried any in the ground yet@@EdOeuna

That first takeoff engine sounded like my blower powered helium balloon lawn chair experimental excursion craft . . . just saying

@rogerscottcathey

8 ай бұрын

Still, he should have checked the oleo twice, ie, after full lading

This is a hypothetical question as no pilot would do this knowing the damage but if they had decided to continue on with this journey would they still have made it to their destination?

@hachimaru295

8 ай бұрын

theres not enough info on the damage to the flaps etc

@cbuchner1

8 ай бұрын

Likely the pressure hull was compromised by tire debris and flaps would not stow properly. So, no. They would have to fly low and slow and run out of fuel.

@flybywire5866

8 ай бұрын

They couldnt know the extend of the damage. They did the safe thing and returned to the airport. If they would have made it to their destination or not is something that has to be tried out, with possible catastrophe as an answer.

awesome

Blimey! What a fright.

Flying is not dangerous, it's the sudden stop when you hit the ground that is dangerous.

@user-ng8ue6xf1m

8 ай бұрын

😂😂😂 JAJAJAJA 🤣😁👍

@VaivaPaula95

8 ай бұрын

Not necessarily. You could have a mid-air collision for example, you wouldn't have to impact the ground to die.

I don't understand why airlines are allowed to write their own training/operation manuals. They should all follow the rules, for aircraft type, set by the manufacturer, who should know better than anyone.

@deepthinker999

8 ай бұрын

$$$$$ - identify cost savings. Money is the root cause of many issues in the world. In this instance it backfired because of the expense to repair the airplane and damage to the runway.

@Shrike200

8 ай бұрын

Even when written out in black and white, there is still some interpretation and nuance required. They do attempt to precisely follow the exact guidelines written, but in this instance the 'tip' was not from the documentation, but was a 'technique' (those in the know will roll their eyes at this familiar term) given to him - NOT official instructions. BUT, it would have come from experience derived from fellow pilots, although he didn't get the full understanding (keeping the SSI at 9 degress in relation to the horizon as opposed to the aircraft nose I'm guessing). It is impossible to just read the manual and then fly the aircraft perfectly - you HAVE to take instruction from instructors, pick up experience gained by fellow crewmembers etc. What may seem like a glaring error to those not in the industry, is normal practice for pilots around the world. You talk, you share experiences, you share tips. In this case, a combination of environmental factors put an already feeble aircraft into a critical performance zone, and an incorrect understanding of technique pushed the situation over the edge.

@kickedinthecalfbyacow7549

8 ай бұрын

Aircraft manufacturers also provide recommendations for how to operate the aircraft, the airlines incorporate their own SOPs with the manufacturers recommendations. All manuals have to be approved by the national regulatory body.

An FedEx plane had to do an emergency belly landing at Chattanooga, Tennessee someone time this month

At least they noticed their mistake and heading back to the airport.. I've seen so many case where they've tried to fly with damage and it's been catastrophic!

@petercarter2925

7 ай бұрын

how many cases precisely?????

Scary ship very lucky.

Come on if you think the aircraft isn't performing well ....PUNCH IT.....give it full throttle immediately and don't wait till you're at the end of the runway.

@MrMajikman1

8 ай бұрын

Yes, a favorite saying of mine: pin it, to win it! Works every time!

@deepthinker999

8 ай бұрын

There has been a long running concern that relying on technology has drawn down basic piloting skills or put another way, what to do when things go wrong. I think that this is less of a problem with former military pilots.

Hey man, i have a question, how did you make the BB a340 works properly, i have it but does not "follows" the inputs as the fslabs or any other airbus addon

Why wasn't full thrust selected from the start, if the aircraft was known to be underpowered and sluggish. I don't get it.

@tomstravels520

8 ай бұрын

Increase engine life and reduce maintenance costs

@michaeldowd8422

8 ай бұрын

@@tomstravels520 money over safety then....figures

@tomstravels520

8 ай бұрын

@@michaeldowd8422 who says it’s over safety? Did you pay attention to the video? The computer calculated they had enough room to takeoff with reduced thrust and they did. It was the pilot who made a mistake by messing up the rotation. Full thrust was not required to get the plane airborne. Using full thrust at takeoff can come with its own potential safety issues including increased likelihood of another SWA1380 incident. If they used TOGA all the time…..guess who is paying for the maintenance…..yeah…you as the paying customer

@michaeldowd8422

8 ай бұрын

@@tomstravels520 at full power, the pilots error would not have led to the aircraft being damaged, did you study physics at school??

@tomstravels520

8 ай бұрын

@@michaeldowd8422 if the pilot had done the rotation correctly it also would not have led to damage. Did you go to flight school? There is absolutely nothing wrong with using reduced power takeoff if your performance calculator says you can do it. It’s done all the time on probably 80-90% of takeoffs

Very tragic

The Airbus A340-300 was equipped with CFM-56 turbofans, the same type used in the 737 and A320. This made the A340-300 badly underpowered. The reason for this engine selection was that Rolls Royce's geared turbofan prototype was not making enough progress for Rolls to put it into production. Ultimately, Rolls' experiment failed, and today, Pratt and Whitney's GTF rules that market. Later models of the A340 had substantially more powerful engines. It is essential that flight crews know their engines. They should know what thrust to expect at varous settings, and how long it takes for a given engine to spool up to the requested thrust. A B-52 's TF-33 engines require eight seconds to spool up; an F/A-18's GE engines can spool up from idle to full afterburner in three seconds. A pilot's using a "tip" first demands that he know the maneuvering characteristics of the aircraft without the "tip."

In memory of the 25 runway lights lost.

very similar to the Brisbane incident, also with an a340 300.

@781David

8 ай бұрын

Hadn't heard of either of these incidents with the A343, I knew of the A345 incident at Melbourne.

@superpolygaming7585

8 ай бұрын

Yeah pretty unknown, but the flight channel had a vid on the Brisbane one

That is a problem of cockpit communications which is likely to continue. Better an incident than a catastrophe . . .

Anyone else watching from South Africa ? 🇿🇦

@user-ng8ue6xf1m

8 ай бұрын

I'm from Colombia, North of South America 😮

Hard to believe two pilots who had never flown the aircraft type before were rostered together!

When 4.4 km of runway length are not enough to take off, you know that you are doing it wrong! Using up the entire runway may save you some fuel but it is not the safest way... So how much thrust did they use? 80%?

@tomstravels520

8 ай бұрын

It was enough to take off. The pilot didn’t rotate correctly. Did you actually pay attention to the video?

@petercarter2925

7 ай бұрын

they only had 28% throttle he pushed the toga button too slowly

@tomstravels520

7 ай бұрын

@@petercarter2925 you don’t push a TOGA button on Airbus. You just push the levers to the FLX or TOGA detent

At 11:08 I think you mean to say that the captain moved the side stick back, but failed to maintain it at the 2/3 back position.

@hachimaru295

8 ай бұрын

I’m not a pilot, but I took that to mean he should’ve increased it instead of keeping in at 9°, as he was too scared about a tail strike

@tomstravels520

8 ай бұрын

@@hachimaru295no, he should have pulled back to the 9 degree mark then held the sidestick. What he did was hold it a 9 degrees then as the nose lifted up he slowly lowered the sidestick so the mark stayed at 9 degrees causing the nose to drop

@y.s.miller4109

8 ай бұрын

@@tomstravels520 Exactly. I still can’t wrap my head around how an Airbus pilot in the left seat could just let the stick go back to neutral on rotation.

@hachimaru295

8 ай бұрын

@@tomstravels520 thanks for the update !

@RatPfink66

2 ай бұрын

@@tomstravels520 the narrative failed me regarding stick order vs pitch command. 9° of back stick obviously didn't give 9° of rotation, but I watched that part 3 times and it never got clearer.

This plane has no flaps.

I know it's all about passenger comfort and saving money with fuel but, I'm always fascinated when I hear that maximum thrust wasn't selected for takeoff. I know, I know it's much more complex than that but I'd rather they err on the side of caution and just give that sucker all the beans when they start the takeoff roll. I for one, am not gonna mind the extra acceleration and getting thrown back in the seat a little.

@tomstravels520

8 ай бұрын

Do you red line your car's engine every time you accelerate even when you don't need to?

@slyguyaction

8 ай бұрын

@@tomstravels520, Good point but to clarify, this specific flight and the conditions they were facing perhaps wide open throttle would have been tempting. And the engine/redline thing - can’t say because we ditched ICE vehicles for EVs years ago so can’t relate.

@sstocker31

5 ай бұрын

There are different levels of thrust reduction available to the crew, but SOP is usually to reduce thrust as much as possible to get the best life out of the engines. When I was checked out on planes and cut loose, I always chose a thrust reduction that was approximately half way between full thrust and full reduced thrust until I felt comfortable with the handling and performance characteristics of the plane. There's no way you can feel that right out of the sim, so I used the word safety when question about it....the conversation was pretty short after that.....33 yrs in and Retired now.

Both pilots in an aircraft type neither had ever flown before? With passengers? Who made that decision?

@user-ng8ue6xf1m

8 ай бұрын

Someone sitting behind a desk who hasn't flown an airplane ever 😮😮😮

@EdOeuna

8 ай бұрын

It’s a common rating, so no different to Emirates pilots swapping between the 77L and 77W.

THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO WAY TWO PILOTS WITH NO ACTUAL FLYING EXPERIENCE ON THE TYPE WOULD EVER BE ALLOWED IN THE SAME COCKPIT!!

Precisely why flying the numbers is discouraged. Rotation and flare are entirely visual manoeuvre’s. Given the length of the fuselage, tail strikes are a possibility, but a consistent 3 degree/second rotation will ensure they achieve V2 by 35 feet and tail strike margins are maintained. Rostering has a role here too, when they decided to put two inexperienced pilots on type together. Another reason why we have minimum cockpit experience.

I would think the airline wouldn’t allow two pilots who have never flown a certain aircraft, to be the ones to do it. You’d think they’d have one with experience along with the one with no experience. But I’m not a pilot or the controller of an airline so all I have is common sense to go on.

Haha Emirates did the same thing in Melbourne Australia. Draged the tail off the runway onto the grass before getting airborne

0:03 & 0:05 aerosourse moment

This is why you don't lend your car to friends.. They always return it all beat up

@leonardbenzies6374

6 ай бұрын

Correct.

We were always asked this question when something dumb happened..."Who's flying the jet"?

I'm not a pilot but how could you not pull UP on the stick when you saw the runway ending? After the warning from the co-pilot don't you think he would have looked up from his instruments.

@timonsolus

8 ай бұрын

The co-pilot should have pulled back on his own side stick himself, instead of only warning the captain.

@tomstravels520

8 ай бұрын

@@timonsolusno, only one person flies the plane at a time. If both sidesticks were moved back that would add the 2 inputs together and likely result in aircraft pitch up hard and tailstrike.

@timonsolus

8 ай бұрын

@@tomstravels520 : No, the Airbus computer averages out the inputs from the pilot’s and co-pilot’s sticks.

@tomstravels520

8 ай бұрын

@@timonsolus it doesn’t average. If that was true then both sidesticks half back would mean a combined half back input…..but it doesn’t. They are summed so both half back means an input of full back. If one is full left and other is fully right this adds to 0 input. “The system adds the signals of both pilots algebraically, the total is limited to the signal that would result from the maximum deflection of a single sidestick”

@timonsolus

8 ай бұрын

@@tomstravels520 : Sorry, I don’t believe you.

It's 10:30 similar of incident 407 accident

That could have been much worse!😱

I don't get what's wrong with trying to maintain the 9°.

@tomstravels520

8 ай бұрын

As the plane pitched up he kept the sidestick marker at the 9 degree mark……which means lowering the sidestick and therefore dropping the nose

@CC-xn5xi

8 ай бұрын

@@tomstravels520 Oh no.

@deepthinker999

8 ай бұрын

@@tomstravels520 I am not a pilot but that seems pretty elemental to me.

You gotta slow down the captions just a little bit. For us non-pilots here, it’s hard to grasp the information at that speed.

Surely blame must be squarely with the training advice. Given the differences in handling characteristics across different aircraft types, advice about sidestick movement can't be generalised as was the case here.

So they had a problem flying an Airbus "pig". But nobody dares touch Airbus!

The T/O data should have taken care of all of this. You just don't push the throttles and hope for the best.

Amazing the wheels didn’t contact the concrete fencing that is at the of the runways.

Shouldn't they always have at least one of the pilots be familiar and experienced with the aircraft? Glad it didn't end badly!

What a343 mod are you using?

As a low time private who hasn't flown in decades I have to wonder if excessive focus on procedures has dulled the stick and rudder "feel" of commercial pilots. It would seem logical that if the aircraft is in the proper configuration with adequate airspeed and is still not lifting off one would increase the angle of attack before reaching the end of the runway. I suppose one could say fly the airplane not the procedure. Am I off track here?

But the question is, did he avoid a tail strike?

Why is no one talking about how the exact same thing happened with a emirates a340 in melbourne and its also on the flight channel