Omg mum I'm a part of pizzamas! So glad that you were welcoming enough to chat with us about this amazing (and incredibly nuanced) topic!

@wordzmyth

8 ай бұрын

Subscribed to you both and now back to the video

@saber1epee0

8 ай бұрын

Absolutely brilliant!!!

@SECONDQUEST

8 ай бұрын

Pizza

@untappedinkwell

8 ай бұрын

Happy Pizzamas!

@corneliuscorcoran9900

8 ай бұрын

Been watching your channel this last few months. AFAIK, you are reasonably new and still fairly small, so this must be a uuuge deal. Congratulations.

I really wish we had the same caution we're showing towards geoengineering towards fucking with the environment "incidentally."

@RainbowCornet

8 ай бұрын

Well the people being cautious about this are generally not the people causing the incidental geoengineering.

@gameoverwehaveeverypixelco1258

8 ай бұрын

Climate change could be caused by weather manipulation. They have been doing it so long it's most likely that and not carbon. We have stuffed the weather system.

@JosephDavies

8 ай бұрын

It turns out one of the biggest benefits of negative externalities is that you don't have to care about the consequences. :(

@TheStrangeBloke

8 ай бұрын

I really don't understand these arguments against geo-engineering at all. They seem terrible and close minded. Yes, Miriam, it is correct to say that a small country can unilaterally start geo-engineering at any time. But here's the thing: they're going to do it regardless. When hundreds of thousands of pakistani or indian or chinese people are dying, they will have very expensive means to save their people (mass evacuation, mass deployment of AC) or relatively cheap ones like aerosols. Faced with such a choice

@sosked78

8 ай бұрын

@@TheStrangeBloke Exactly. It would be way better for everybody if geo engineering is well studied and a reserve tool instead of a 'hail Mary' when s-word hits the fan.

Geoegineering reminds me of the numerous times we've introduced nonnative animals into ecosystems to control pests and accidentally created a far worse situation.

@virginiaheywood8535

6 ай бұрын

Excellent way of looking at it

@NPCONSULTING247-jy3pz

3 ай бұрын

Reminds me the statistic of China when they found out the birds take some 4% of their crops. After killing of these birds, the insects took 30% of their crops.

@Solar.Geoengineering.Advocate

3 ай бұрын

i really dont get the squeamishness towards solar geoengineering. considering where we are headed.

@coltonward3609

2 ай бұрын

​@@Solar.Geoengineering.Advocateyou don't know much about it then.

@guycomments

Ай бұрын

Look at the history of Michigan's great lakes

"It was initially an oopsie, it's not really an oopsie anymore; now it's like a 'stop hittin yourself' kind of situation" 😆😆

Hank, long time watcher... etc. I wanted to pop in and say how happy it has made me to watch you bounce back. This is not condescension, I'm also a cancer survivor. Mine was grade 3 brain cancer. I, too, am doing well post treatment. I want you (and John) to know how much I love you and value you as... just... the best kind of humans! ❤

@ohitsthem7601

8 ай бұрын

So happy to hear you're doing well now too🙏🏻

@anna._olsen_

8 ай бұрын

wow! I’m so happy you’re doing better!

@alexiskaas907

8 ай бұрын

This reads like someone who sat down and thought about what to say. The care and attention and intention of your message is a wonderful reflection of yourself. I'm glad to hear you are doing well 🧡

@TommyTrink

8 ай бұрын

Congrats on your recovery! I’m an Oncology Nurse, and just today I saw a patient for the first time in months (post chemo), and I have to say there’s little in life that compares to seeing a former chemo patient who has eyebrows again and a full head of hair (of /course/ those aren’t the be all and end all of chemo recovery, but still)

@plufim

8 ай бұрын

Congrats on smashing cancer. Every win is worth celebrating!

Love Hanks energy in this video. Comparing the burning of fossil fuels with "punching yourself in the face" has to be my favorite analogy of 2023.

@ClimateAdam

8 ай бұрын

Ahah I made a video a little while back all about how asking if it's too late to stop climate change is like asking if it's too late to stop punching ourselves in the face (I.e. It's never too late!)

@derekhiemforth

8 ай бұрын

Agree! I am 100% going to ste... err, _borrow_ that line!

@vigilantcosmicpenguin8721

8 ай бұрын

Why _are_ we still hitting ourselves?

@raskov75

8 ай бұрын

That is of course a wealthy person's pov. For millions upon millions of people it's more like, hey stop sticking that gun in your mouth. Of course it's actually more like stop sticking that gun in that dudes mouth.

@CRyOniiC1

8 ай бұрын

Because it's wrong?? Mindless bots. You have to walk before you can run. We aren't ready yet.

10:40 this specific example, "dried up the monsoon season in southeast asia," is what actually made me scared of this. Like "disrupt weather patterns," "change climate for the worse," that's a bit hard to wrap my head around, but "dried up monsoon season in southeast asia" sounds absolutely terrifying. So, thanks for being specific! I am now the correct amount of scared of this.

@garbagecaz

8 ай бұрын

Living in India, that thought is absolutely terrifying. You cannot feed an ever-Warming planet with increased droughts(with food higher in carbohydrate concentration, due to crops taking in more CO2 on average and converting it into sugars). Add monsoon instability to the mix, and watch farmer suicide rates rise(as if they aren't high enough already here) Dr.Simon Clark has a great video on this specific topic ,"No more CO2 won't help us grow more food."

@yancgc5098

8 ай бұрын

@@garbagecaz More CO2 is helping farmers grow crops faster, and for a growing population that’s a good thing. Increased droughts? A warmer planet means more rain on average, and the higher CO2 level means plants need less water.

@garbagecaz

8 ай бұрын

@@yancgc5098yes more CO2 does help some crops grow faster, but more CO2 also means more carbohydrate rich food(which messes up balance of other nutrients like zinc, iron etc). Since the planet keeps warming, crops have to be moved away from the equator, and towards the poles into a relatively cooler environment ( crops need a certain temp range to survive ). But this method is not viable as soil composition is not the same everywhere, and crops require soil specific to their needs to survive. It is true that more warming leads to more rainfall in some areas, but it is misleading to extrapolate that to every part of the world. Some regions will experience droughts regardless. Also more rainfall is not necessarily good for crops as they need a certain amount of water to grow. More water can reduce yield for crops that require less water to grow. Also (and this is true for underdeveloped and developing countries) more rainfall also results in stored grains going bad due to humidity(big problem here in India). Developed countries have better storage facilities so they can avoid this. Last point, more rainfall means more storms (Hurricanes are not only more frequent, but also stronger). This reduces crop yield too. It's great that conversation about these topics has penetrated, the general public and people are asking questions. (Sorry if any part of this comment comes off as rude, not best at tone management online😅)

@TheRavingLobster

7 ай бұрын

​@@garbagecazBro your comment isn't rude at all! It's amazingly informative and adds a lot of nuance I think a lot of people don't realize!

@peterwood6875

7 ай бұрын

But what if it is global warming without geoengineering that leads to the monsoon season during down? These risks go both ways.

The best way to deal with a trolley problem that you absolutely cannot avoid, is to research the potential impacts and then set up a mitigation plan. I'm an anthropologist and I know from field work that no matter what you change, no matter how good the project is, someone is always negatively impacted. The job is to figure out who that will be, discover what kind of harm will fall on them, and then put a plan in place to address it. In a situation like this where the impacts are unknown, we need to have immigration policies in place and disaster relief in place before we do anything. Because if we trash an entire country with our efforts, we can't be scrambling in the aftermath to figure out what to do with the people, because quite frankly we know how that will go. A bunch of xenophobes will do everything they can to prevent necessary mitigation. It always happens. So if we are going to do geoengineering, we need to be sure to have a huge amount of money set aside to help the people who have been impacted before, not after.

@Anon26535

7 ай бұрын

Ultimately, for a lot of world leaders in business and government, negatively impacting people is part of the incentive. Most of these people are ultimately just serial killers. The ultimate obstacle to the fight against climate collapse is not greed or laziness but sadism. The rich and powerful aren't thinking in terms of not wanting to spend money on something beneficial but being actively hostile to anything that benefits others in the first place. Their mindset is "how dare you try to take away my ability to inflict suffering." Realistically, without a worldwide socialist revolution and mass extermination of individuals with capitalist/psychopath mindsets, the only way to clean up the environment is in ways that are destructive to the lives and property of people those in power consider prey.

@edeworabraham2761

7 ай бұрын

RIGHT and the part about war, if two countries go to war because of Geo engineering they probably would have gone to war without it, like the USA would obviously not go to war to Canada because of one case of Geo engineering gone wrong

@mathmusicreading

7 ай бұрын

+

@Stettafire

5 ай бұрын

My issue with the trolly problem. Ok, so the truck will hit the group of kids, or an old lady... Well give that truck better breaks! Don't design for a scenario where you hit people! Design better breaks! Why is no one talking about this? Why do people always assume the two bad "solutions" are the only ones? As an engineer you don't solutionise for an undesirable outcome, you FIX it!

@LetterheadStudios

5 ай бұрын

@@Stettafire The good news about the Trolley problem is the inceptor of the thought experiment did so to critique this line of thinking. It was to prove a point. But this has not been taught and forgotten by people who don't specifically study this.

Before watching this video I was incredibly surprised to hear that geoengineering was controversial. It sounded to me like it was purely beneficial. I really cannot overstate the value of someone with a platform like yours talking about the nuances of such an incredibly important topic in such an easily digestible way. Thank you so much

@hime273

8 ай бұрын

Here's an Idea.. Do your own research, by searching the Magic, (Technical) terms. Trusting the "Experts" is the worst possible idea anybody could have...

@moojoy1920

8 ай бұрын

@@hime273 I'm very much pro-being informed, but who do you think published the information you're reading?

@hime273

8 ай бұрын

@@moojoy1920 Oh Yeah? Do you understand how the Government's Weather Control system actually works? I do.

@moojoy1920

8 ай бұрын

@@hime273 I'd love to know how the government's weather control system works. Where are you sourcing your information?

@alexmancera6566

8 ай бұрын

@@hime273 I’ve seen a few of your comments on this video… you’re really quick to insult people you deem as stupid or ignorant for not seeing what you see. I would also love to see where you are sourcing your info?

We should look for more examples of accidental geoengineering. I'm sure they exist and could maybe teach us some interesting things.

@Praisethesunson

8 ай бұрын

That would be industrial agriculture. Turning mass acres of land into a single crop is desertification for everything that doesn't eat those mono crops. If it weren't for climate change, the nitrogen runoff from these massive fields would be the biggest source of environmental destruction humanity has made.

@Samael1113

8 ай бұрын

You remember the pandemic? and how for about 2 weeks the worlds industrial-scale production shut down?...

@cc_snipergirl

8 ай бұрын

​@@Samael1113Dolphins came back to Venice

@currybun8570

8 ай бұрын

I'm horrible at research methods but I'm sure there could be insights gathered from those accidental geoengineering moments. Quasi-experimental stuff idk

@David-ce2mf

8 ай бұрын

Acid rain from burning high sulfur diesel fuel used to benefit agriculture in the Red River Valley of NW Minnesota and North Dakota. The US has since switched to ultra low sulfur fuel, but the sulfuric acid would shift the pH of the alkaline soil to be slightly better for crops.

The point on countries unilaterally doing geoengineering and it negatively affecting other countries really struck a cord for me. The construction of dams over international rivers have been sparking water conflicts between upstream and downstream countries. Rivers have defined boundaries and their mechanics are very well known, while rain and other climate systems are very chaotic and lack clear boundaries. Dams and similar environmental engineering projects (such as canal construction, land reclamation, river straightening, local pollution control, etc) are similar to geoengineering although much smaller in scale and more localized in impact. I'm not sure if the nebulous nature of geoengieering will make its impacts more controversial (as more people, communities & countries are effected) or potentially even less controversial (as the impacts are too diluted, probabilistic & obscured by natural fluctuations to be able to point causality & blame) If people die as a result of a dam failure, it's easy to point blame and demand justice, but if someone dies because of crop failure as a result of late rains which were indirectly caused by emissions, what justice can you demand?

@Afkmuds

7 ай бұрын

sparkling water conflicts*

@patrikpass2962

4 ай бұрын

Cloud seeding has been done for decades and if you force rain in one place another is obviously without.

@greatscott369

2 ай бұрын

There's also fish that spawn up river and migrate to the ocean. Building dams has seen off most of the large sturgeon, although I don't care much about caviar I do care that we are messing up eco systems. Even when we mean well

@DrSmooth2000

Ай бұрын

​@@greatscott369no pain-free energy source

Not until this video did I realise how thankless your job really is. Here you are, making an insightful, well-researched essay on geo-engineering, and my main takeaway is: Ooooo, new Neal Stephenson novel!

this is one of very few topics that i understand very well, but i think the best case study in why this is a bad idea is iron fertilization. We thought for ages that low iron was the main reason that there isnt as much algae and therefore as much co2 production in the southern ocean as there used to be. For so long that many companies suggested different ways of 'fertilizing' the ocean with iron. Nowadays (by which i mean in the last few years) most scientists now see that we were wrong about that, and actually just misunderstood other hydrogeological processes. TLDR; we know so little about the earth on a large scale. we can't afford to do such large experiments.

@aarushicrystalis7998

8 ай бұрын

there are other geopolitical and financial and social reasons that geoengineering is a very very bad idea, but i am neither a politician nor a geologist nor an economist. i know hydrogeology, and geoengineering is a very very very bad idea.

@Ic3dsoul

8 ай бұрын

If we dont understand it maybe we should do the Research NOW so in the future when all else failed we have solid data to move into geoengineering?

@hime273

8 ай бұрын

​@@Ic3dsoulDo you people seriously not understand that 100% of the Weather is completely Manufactured and Controlled currently?? I seriously don't understand how people can be so oblivious. That shit coming out of the ass of Jet's, is NOT Water Vapor.

@1queijocas

8 ай бұрын

@@Ic3dsoulin the future we likely won’t have a choice, global warming could get so bad that if we don’t geo engineer, the oceans currents could collapse thus cause mass famine worldwide and bringing down our civilisation with it. That is my thinking, I don’t really think we will have a choice so it is wise to at least study how geo engineering could affect the climate

@fenixfve2613

3 ай бұрын

You either have good enough climate models and can predict both the effects of climate change and the effectiveness of geoengineering, or you have bad models and can't predict either. So, do we have good models or not?

It feels like the biggest push back to geoengineering is maintaining ignorance. That as long as we don't know the consequences of our actions then we can do them freely and not feel responsible.

On the topic of fossil fuel companies funding geoengineering: I think people's concerns (or at least mine) are more around the opportunity cost of allowing FF companies to fund solely geoengineering research INSTEAD of accelerating funding for proven solutions (wind, solar, batteries, etc). If they focus their capital only on geoengineering (since that will benefit them most), the energy transition may slow down significantly because of it.

@The_Reality_Filter

3 ай бұрын

Perhaps you're unaware that FF companies do fund and profit from renewables as all of them require FF products to manufacture and maintain them.

@carpecomputer1277

3 ай бұрын

The neat part about this is that if geoengineering works, it doesn’t matter if the transition to renewables is slowed down, as long as it happens over the next century or so. We could do it at a pace which would not mess up our lives at the same time having a nice climate.

@The_Reality_Filter

3 ай бұрын

@@carpecomputer1277 and what if it doesn't work? What if is causes irreversible negative effects? What then?

@DrSmooth2000

Ай бұрын

​@@carpecomputer1277define nice climate Research 1978

I’m so glad you’re here Hank, the way you speak is clear and objective, it deserves appreciation

My 1am brain read it as Georgineering, and while that is wrong, I wish George all the best

@untappedinkwell

8 ай бұрын

I also hope George is doing well.

@paradoxica424

8 ай бұрын

Climate Change Georg

@TheDanishGuyReviews

8 ай бұрын

Engineering Georg is an outlier and should not be counted.

@colechristian3765

8 ай бұрын

Georgineering is the best solution

@GeorgeP-uj8xc

8 ай бұрын

Thank you :)

Termination Shock is a fantastic novel on this topic. What happens when the owner of Buc-ee's decides to try to save the world via geoengineering?

@snyderlevin-schwartz1025

8 ай бұрын

I was like wait a second, this is the premise of Termination Shock and then he mentions it!

@JohnVance

8 ай бұрын

@@snyderlevin-schwartz1025 Hah same, I was writing a comment to recommend it just as he name-dropped it. Can’t get anything past Hank!

@halifrasure7756

8 ай бұрын

Stephenson is definitely on Hank's radar - he name drops his books a lot ♥️♥️♥️

Thank you for addressing intentional CO2 management. You saved me from asking, "What about ...?".

@oldtimefarmboy617

7 ай бұрын

Chenistry Europe European Chemical Societies Publishing “High-Selectivity Electrochemical Conversion of CO2 to Ethanol using a Copper Nanoparticle/N-Doped Graphene Electrode” Dr. Yang Song, Dr. Rui Peng, Dale K. Hensley, Dr. Peter V. Bonnesen, Dr. Liangbo Liang, Dr. Zili Wu, Dr. Harry M. Meyer III, Dr. Miaofang Chi, Dr. Cheng Ma, Dr. Bobby G. Sumpter, Dr. Adam J. Rondinone First published: 28 September 2016 Abstract: Though carbon dioxide is a waste product of combustion, it can also be a potential feedstock for the production of fine and commodity organic chemicals provided that an efficient means to convert it to useful organic synthons can be developed. Herein we report a common element, nanostructured catalyst for the direct electrochemical conversion of CO2 to ethanol with high Faradaic efficiency (63 % at −1.2 V vs RHE) and high selectivity (84 %) that operates in water and at ambient temperature and pressure. Lacking noble metals or other rare or expensive materials, the catalyst is comprised of Cu nanoparticles on a highly textured, N-doped carbon nanospike film. Electrochemical analysis and density functional theory (DFT) calculations suggest a preliminary mechanism in which active sites on the Cu nanoparticles and the carbon nanospikes work in tandem to control the electrochemical reduction of carbon monoxide dimer to alcohol. Solution to global warming. This solution could solve two problems at the same time and the solution comes from the cola industry. Man caused global warming proponents claim that carbon dioxide is the cause of global warming. Colas get their fizz from injecting carbon dioxide under pressure into the water and cola syrup. To do this, they have to remove tons of carbon dioxide from the atmosphere, purify it to food grade, and ship it to their plants or to stores all over the world. Why not use their process for removing and liquidizing raw carbon dioxide and injecting back where it came from, into abandoned oil wells. That would remove a lot of carbon dioxide from the atmosphere while pushing the left-over oil around the abandoned oil well to producing oil wells so we could get more oil cheaper, we could also inject carbon dioxide into oil fields where the oil has run out completely. That way we would end up reducing the amount of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere while getting more oil. Considering how many millions of gallons of cola and other carbonated beverages are sold each day and at a price that billions of people can easily afford, it would be a cheap and efficient way to stop global warming without requiring drastic curtailments of people’s lifestyles. That of course would be unacceptable to liberals since it does not give their gods (politicians) that they have a worshipful reverence for absolute power or make their church (government) more powerful and does not result in their religion (politics) becoming the center of the universe.

When I watched your ship trails video I made a joke to a co-worker saying, "We should nuke the oceans." Suggesting that it would throw a lot of salt water in the air. But then he pointed out that we've already done that, and maybe I could look up to see if there was a temperature dip. Which, I'm kind of afraid to do for fear of having dangerous information. It would probably be bad to know that actually works.

@djinn666

7 ай бұрын

I'll bet nuking volcanos would do even better. Which leads to an interesting point. Volcanic winter is far more damaging than global warming, so if you consider all dangers to humanity, it's better to be warmer and have the warming limited by some artificial means that can be reversed in a few months. In case a huge volcano goes off and the planet would be cooled by 10 degrees, you can change it to just 5 degrees of cooling.

@NPCONSULTING247-jy3pz

3 ай бұрын

@@djinn666 Iceagefarmer on YT

@DrSmooth2000

Ай бұрын

Water in Stratosphere has GHG effect

@DrSmooth2000

Ай бұрын

​@@djinn666SAI cannot be reversed

Between John's hyperfixation on fighting disease and Hank's on Geoengineering, they genuinely might save the world.

@spookyoldwitch

8 ай бұрын

God, I hope so. Now we need a third Green to focus on those garbage islands floating around our oceans. Who's gonna tackle pollution?

@tbella5186

8 ай бұрын

​@spookyoldwitch Pretty sure there are four more Greens now (does John have 2 or 3 kids?l) We just have to patiently wait to see if they inherite this amazing passion! Gawd I hope so too! Also Blessed Be Sister.

@tremkl

8 ай бұрын

Okay, who is on the job of writing the fanfiction about someone who should have died of tuberculosis, but because they had access to affordable diagnosis and treatment, they went on to solve global warming. 😂

@FyreHeartStudios

8 ай бұрын

@@spookyoldwitch There are people doing this, actually! Team Seas is one of them. I also know there are people doing massive river clean ups. So, this is happening!

@burnte

8 ай бұрын

John is downright inspiring on TB. I’m an engineering nerd and love the idea of pulling co2 out of the atmosphere on an industrial scale, but John is just amazing with tb education.

"It was an oopsy, now it's more like a 'Stop hitting yourself' situation." Oil companies hold the rest of us hostage

@Praisethesunson

7 ай бұрын

Yeah it's not stop hitting yourself. It's our rulers have decreed and intentional death drive with the entire natural world. Which we doing for the grand cause of line go up so like 2000 people can become wealthy beyond any necessity.

@jordoncostello8641

7 ай бұрын

yah, the hundreds of millions of people that need to burn fossil fuels to live, just don't deserve to live, I figured it out. You are a massacre wating to happen in the same way that Russians destroying farmland (indirectly) created the Holodomor.

If folks haven't read Neal Stephenson's 'Termination Shock' yet, consider it! It really digs into a log of these geoengineering socio-political issues, and centers around the far end of the geoengineering scale you present in this video. Intense stuff!

Geoengineering always makes me thing of the graphic novel/film/series Snowpiercer, where I think the general backstory is that stratospheric sulphur injection went too far and caused a global runaway icehouse effect. I'd imagine you'd have to go pretty far wrong to get to that point, considering some of the largest volcanic eruptions in the past few centuries have only released enough SO2 to cool the atmosphere by a few degrees for a year or two, but an interesting plot and cautionary tale nonetheless.

On the eighth day of Pizzamas Nerdfighters gave to me Eight puppy-sized elephants Seven pelicans pelicaning Six giraffes loving giraffes Five Hanklerfish Four corndogs Three French the Llamas Two mustachioed Greens And a terrifying Pizza John Tee

@ornitorrinco_en_la_caverna

8 ай бұрын

I'm kinda new here and I don't know what the French the Llamas means, but I'm curious now.

@Grey0730

8 ай бұрын

@@ornitorrinco_en_la_cavernaIt’s a reference to old-school vlogbrothers when John used to exclaim “French the Llama!” When he was excited about something

@NinaDmytraczenko

8 ай бұрын

Suggestions for following lines: TB, design for awesome socks

@jaclynkurtz9808

8 ай бұрын

@@NinaDmytraczenko Thanks for the suggestions!

@TheTravelVal

8 ай бұрын

​@@ornitorrinco_en_la_cavernait's a super old reference back to the blog TV days where they used to live stream sometimes. In the chat people were typing "ftl" (internet slang of the moment meaning "for the loss"). John didn't know what it meant and someone else in chat said it meant "French the lama" as a joke. John believed them and then from there it just took off as a silly, excited thing to say 😊

I sometimes wonder about the irreversible consequences of NOT doing climate engineering. Like if we don't do marine cloud brightening or whatever and some species goes extinct because a really bad heat wave wipes it out, isn't that also an irreversible change?

@sintrabio

8 ай бұрын

Yes, but like Hank said, and it's something I also wrestle with, we need to take into account the "feelings" that people have of the consequences. It's literally the trolley problem, you can say that obviously you would move the lever to kill one person and save five. But with more complex situations not doing nothing sifferent and doing something that causes a negative effect, even if that effect is overall less destructive than doing nothing, "feels" wrong or worse.

@smoothbrainsquid1904

8 ай бұрын

The problem is we don't know if not doing it will kill that species OR if doing geoengineering will accidentally kill that species or another. We don't know enough. It's too complicated. Butterfly wing effect. And so far it doesn't seem necessary right now at this second to try the risk.

@MrFaceYeah

8 ай бұрын

I feel like this can be solved by reframing the choice to do nothing as a positive choice. It's not just standing back and letting it play out - it's an active decision to maintain the status quo (and keep killing the planet as you do so). In trolley problem terms, it's not a toggle - we're keeping our hand on the lever at the moment, and watching that trolley plow through millions of people.

@bramvanduijn8086

8 ай бұрын

@@sintrabio The thing is, we have our foot on the accelerator of the trolley. The only reason the trolley is still moving at all is because we haven't taken the action of taking our foot off. So arguing that we shouldn't take action is just... wrong on several levels. Obviously you need to try to do as little damage as possible so change the tracks, but slightly less obviously: We are actually taking the action that endangers the world, we just do it by not moving our foot. In a very real sense not moving our foot is an action, and if that is true, then not changing tracks is also an action, making the entire trolley problem trivial.

@critiqueofthegothgf

8 ай бұрын

this argument is kinda nonsensical. at the root of the problem, animals going extinct is due to ghg emissions, not due to a lack of intentional geoengineering. stop emitting, and you wont have to geoengineer.

This whole explanation around geoengineering in context of the Global Warming reminded me of my chat around coffee at someone's house. The host is a coffee drinker while I'm not: Host: "What would you like to drink? Coffee, tea, soda, juice...?" Me: "I'll just have a glass of water, thank you." Host: "Are you sure?" Me: "Yes" A bit later, she asked again if I still don't want anything other than water. Me: (thinking I need to justify my choice) "I don't like to drink bitter things, water is good." Host: "Oh you can have milk coffee and add some sugar." Me: "No, thank you. Not having it in the first place means I don't even have to constantly try to fix it." Subtraction can be a better solution than trying to keep patching it up.

I feel like I just watched a pitch for an HBO show that would make me feel morally rattled after watching it. This is "it feels weird in my bones" level stuff. I had no idea about any of this.

It's times like these where the people who truly understand a subject are most valued, as they can share their perspectives on these complex and scary things. Knowing is half battle, thank you for the links to the knowledgable :)

@Praisethesunson

8 ай бұрын

The other half of the battle is against our corporate overlords deliberately pumping the atmosphere with CO2 cause not doing that would have made a few already wealthy ghouls slightly less wealthy.

@ringsystemmusic

8 ай бұрын

NGL this comment has the exact diction of one that’s about to tell you about a great financial advisor in cooperation with 12 other seemingly random people. Glad it’s not!

In a way im kinda glad im way too poor/inconsequential to have any responsibility in this sort of situation but at the same time i wish it was easier for laypeople like myself to be involved

@jonathanyun7817

8 ай бұрын

It's not perfect, but activism and politics is the best tool we have as far as I know, so it's worth looking into :)

@oldtimetinfoilhatwearer

8 ай бұрын

Terrorism is the activity you're looking for

@sSickrabbiTT

8 ай бұрын

​@@jonathanyun7817in other words: Start getting organized :D

@ptadisbander7959

8 ай бұрын

Yeah the cavalry (aka the state) has shown they are not serious enough for the scale of the problem. Act like The cavalry is not going to arrive.

@jprec5174

8 ай бұрын

they said they are poor though. activism costs money@@jonathanyun7817

Hi Hank, my first interest in science came from watching your biology playlist, today I'm starting electrical engineering studies, I wanted to thank you for exposing me to how interesting and beautiful the laws of the true reality are and for fanning air into that spark of curiousity that schools do such a great job suffocating, so thank you again🙏

8:00 water rights, ocean EEZs and dams make a great example to study this problem

The shock issue makes me think of the aquarium hobby. Aquarists do a lot to keep the chemicals in their tanks balanced. If domething does get out if whack, it can cause a similar shock and kill the tank. Some examples that come to mind are killing the beneficial bacteria, or greatly reducing it, without reducing livestock in the tank or disturbing the soil significantly like by rearranging or removing plants.

@TheDancing0wind

7 ай бұрын

Look up Saltwater aquarium hobby :D

I for one look forward to our political leaders implementing the cheapest last minute solution to climate change that our corporate overlords can come up with.

@TheStrangeBloke

8 ай бұрын

I mean yeah that's the thing - geo-engineering is going to happen because loads of countries aren't going to have another option to keep their people alive.

@Empedocles449

8 ай бұрын

that just happens to be the worst option but that makes the corporations the most money.

@TheStrangeBloke

8 ай бұрын

@@Empedocles449 corporations don't even matter, in my view. Faced with a choice between geoengineering and hundreds of thousands of deaths, that's no choice at all, not for the countries experiencing the most severe effects.

@mobaby1979

8 ай бұрын

HAIL MARYS are all that fully corrupted countries like the USA can make room for.

@Empedocles449

8 ай бұрын

@@TheStrangeBloke( My comment was meant to be continuation of OP's sentence.) The people who knew about climate change but hid the facts should go to jail. Instead they'll get richer because the profits from their crimes have given them the resources to benefit from changing situations. This is a horrible miscarriage of justice.

thank you all for such a comprehensive set of videos!

What i love about these videos is I go to write a comment pointing something out and then as im writing you mention the point. Love the thoroughness!

This is an incredible example of why i think pandoras box (or jar, rather) is the most important and interesting story ever conceived in human history (i stand by that). There are so many instances i see of good things that could come about through some sort of action. But if it doesnt lead to good (or worse, it leads to bad), there is sometimes NOTHING you can do to stop it. Once an action is taken, the world is fundamentally changed. Things can never go back to how they were, and thats both exciting and terrifying, and we need to be INCREDIBLY careful with the actions we take

Messy and unhinged is just how i like my science, Hank

@TheDanishGuyReviews

8 ай бұрын

That's a surprisingly large amount of science.

One thought on oceanic cloud seeding: one of the many dangerous consequences of the atmosphere generally being hotter is that in some places a lot more water ends up evaporated into the air than it normally would be. If we could make that water fall back out of the air into the oceans not too far from where it evaporated in the first place, it seems like the potential downsides of oceanic cloud seeding (generally, making water that would otherwise have gone somewhere else not go there) are cancelled out (because the water you're making fall is only water that wouldn't have been there to begin with if not for our big whoopsie / stop hitting yourself).

Uncomfortable problems sometime require uncomfortable solutions. Thanks for keeping an open mind and not clutching your pearls.

Love these longer science videos!! Thanks hanks for the deepdives:)

I think you make a lot of good points in this video Hank! What intrigues me most is the idea that developing countries turn to this as a solution when developed countries fail to meet their already lackluster climate targets. Do we have a moral leg to stand on when a developing country does this, to improve their local climate, to address the damage caused by North America and China and Europe? It's gonna be a tough one to make the case for I think, especially as you point out that it's quite accessible.

@steggopotamus

8 ай бұрын

I'm reminded the stories of people in africa who are convinced by capitalists to sell trees on their land and then those people suffer decades of drought and unstable weather because those forests were an integral part of their local environment.

@nemossangeomatrix6841

8 ай бұрын

That's a really intersting thought, my mind went to something similiar. A powerful country like the USA could totally just start geoengineering for their own interests. Causing harm to countless nations and their millions of people, because what could they realisticly do to oppose them. I do think some goverment is just gonna start doing it eventually and it's probably going to quickly turn into "who has the bigger stick" politics. Hard to imagine this whole concept without war.

@grmpEqweer

8 ай бұрын

If they're saving themselves, we have very little we can say. We screwed up the climate, they're trying to survive it.

@CL-go2ji

8 ай бұрын

I would like to mention that the question "Do we have a moral leg to stand on?" does not have a good track record as a determiner of relations between industrial and developing nations. Of course, theoretically we could start caring about it ... but I am not optimistic.

@Solar.Geoengineering.Advocate

3 ай бұрын

actually i wish, i really wish the global south had the ability to start doing solar geoengineering on their own. and maybe they will come up with a way, but as it stands you need a fleet of maybe up to 100 large jets to be able to do this and the technology to build bigger more sophisticated jet engines capable of getting the planes up to the stratosphere. only a few countries could do that. the usa, russia, china, britain, france, japan. we havent built any of those jets yet and nor are there any plans so far to start. my fear is that climate change starts really accelerating and gets beyond our ability to even counter it with solar geoengineering

Y'all's Crash Course videos have greatly advanced my 16 yr old nephews understanding of philosophy, psychology and a wide range of other subjects. Ty Mr. Green for your contributions towards the advancement of education. (Your novel was pretty good too.)

Messy and unhinged intros by Hank is my favorite method of learning the basics on virtually any topic! Thanks for being one of the most accessible science communicators!

Strongly in favor of beginning to test geoengineering ideas, agree it is now and should remain a last-resort strategy to address climate change, but if that's the case, we should do enough testing to have a more robust understanding of scale of impact, risks, downsides, etc. so that if we have to pull that rip-cord down the line we can at least do so more precisely rather than trying to figure it all out in an emergency.

@MrNicoJac

8 ай бұрын

You sound like a scientist. I'm a political economist. I do not like to think what would happen if this technology got to the deployable stage, and then multinational lobbyists could start swaying our political representatives. We already favor the status quo way too much to make fast enough changes...

@flowerheit4512

8 ай бұрын

​@@MrNicoJacthank you, i feel like everyone is so focused on the problem of climate change that they arent looking up at the hands over the button I am terrified that this technology will be developed to a stage where we can cause predictable results - a stage where it could conceivably be weaponized. that is not a world i want any part in making.

@gnarthdarkanen7464

8 ай бұрын

Um... Too late. On the first mention that Geo-engineering was even possible, let alone feasible, there were think tanks already considering how to spin it and sell it to the masses as "our last best chance" so the industrialists who CAUSED all this havoc willy-nilly (and more than 80% of it KNOWINGLY) will have that tool to "fall back on" when sh*t gets really deep. ...OR when they know they have little other choice for soaking more money out of us or more free labor for the pittance they want us to sustain upon. The tool exists, and there WILL be lobbyists defeating EVERY OTHER POSSIBLE SOLUTION to keep the status quo and drive the situation from bad to worse while white and green washing their history and connections as fast and hard as they can. There are huge companies from the sweat-shop funding Fashion Brands to the Big Oil Conglomerates ALREADY hiring and sponsoring "influencers" to tour specific facilities and upload their videos about their experiences with the "progressive and environmentally conscientious" bunch they met there... The possibility that it could be weaponized also already exists. If we in the U.S. don't further our own research on how to best assert ourselves to that space, then others who are NOT us will... and probably already have. People have been trying and inventing and re-inventing ways to control weather and climate for as long back through history as we've had tech' that could even sound plausible as a means to do so. ;o)

@MrNicoJac

8 ай бұрын

@@flowerheit4512 Weaponized? As in, for wars? I don't think that's very likely, since you'd either have to fly big slow seeder planes (or missiles) over the target country (and thus their air defenses), or you'd have to fly over your own country so much that you affect the entire globe. And that sounds like a great way to get _every_ other country to turn against you simultaneously... What's _far_ more likely/problematic is _some_ countries starting to do it because it benefits _them._ Like, imagine Saudi Arabia wanting to cool down. But then suddenly Scandinavia would _really_ freeze in winter. Or the USA oil/coal states wanting to keep their economies going, and pumping out aerosols for compensation, and then half of Africa starving due to failed crops because it also changed some weather patterns. It's probably never gonna be viable as a weapon of war - but its side effects could definitely affect other nations enough that they'll declare war if the geoengineering nation doesn't stop.

@erikstevenson8508

8 ай бұрын

@@flowerheit4512 the technology exists, and as Hank goes into in the vid on HanksChannel, the reality is a lot of it is pretty cheap to implement. The options are not research it now or it's never used at all, it's research it now before random individuals/countries go rogue and start doing it haphazardly and without a globally disclosed plan/course of action. Like, in 10 years, do you want China to just randomly test some of these things over the Pacific because the impacts of climate change are becoming more noticeable and Chinese public pressure starts to build around it? I think a global, or at least UN approved, testing campaign gives us the best shot at having some clear research and understanding around these processes. Could even help individual countries pass laws that could stop wealthy individuals from doing random experiments in international waters.

I just love how, when geoengineering with intentional aerosol release was brought on the table, the know-it-all climatologists suddenly panic and admit they've not actually gotten the physics straight on aerosol-cloud interaction, which is under a larger can of worms called subgrid parametrization.

Thx for talking about ideas, controversal or not, so we can discuss them, exchange about them, sharing knowledge, and finding solutions together. ❤

The audio volume and quality of this video is amazing.

Speaking of Neal Stephenson, one of his more esoteric books (Anathem) has some interesting themes about "forbidden research". Areas of study which are so damaging to society that it is forbidden to research them except in secret. In the book, society agrees that no potential benefits could outweigh the cataclysmic and inevitable damage these technologies would cause when introduced to an imperfect, inherently-political society. It kinda feels like Academia treats Geoengineering like "forbidden research". It certainly has significant potential upsides, and could maybe even be the cheapest way to solve our climate crisis! But can we actually trust our imperfect, incentive-driven society with such power? This is not a new concept, and it's not necessarily a concept I agree with. But is an interesting contrast to the traditional American philosophy that "more technology guarantees more progress guarantees better world".

@MK_ULTRA420

8 ай бұрын

"and could maybe even be the cheapest way to solve our climate crisis!" There is a cheaper way but you probably wouldn't like it. *TheMongols.mp4*

@kefkaZZZ

8 ай бұрын

It makes them… more, more better…🥺😎😂

@chesspiece4257

7 ай бұрын

that’s an interesting perspective! i’m personally of the opinion that if knowledge is dangerous in the wrong hands, it should be put in everyone’s hands so no one can be tricked. because the people who would be able to study it secretly are the exact same people you don’t want studying it, and if it’s forbidden to study then that just means people won’t recognize it when it’s applied.

@taylornovia8911

21 күн бұрын

​@@chesspiece4257 what is this method called

Thanks Hank for the explainer! It's is a super complex topic - I like the way you discuss the complexities.

Termination Shock is soooo good. Stephenson addresses the practical aspects of climate engineering and the politics surrounding it with that really rich, smart storytelling he’s just so damn good at. Fully developed and fascinating characters. And fun! And the audiobook version? Edoardo Ballerini delivers the *best* I’ve ever heard.

One of my biggest concerns regarding intentional sulphur dioxide spraying into the atmosphere is that it might block too many of the photon frequencies that plants need for photosynthesis, resulting is a slough of ecological problems for our planet, while further reducing the planet's natural carbon sinks.

This video captures why I got hooked on vlogbrothers. The ability to evaluate the various sides of topics, to explore counterpoints, and acknowledge they have thoughts that might've been prematurely enthusiastic... there seems to be a sincere effort to gain understanding and accept correction when it's warranted. Foundationally it feels as though the Greens have respect for others, even if they disagree, such that they will take the time to explore differing opinions. I listened to the podcast, and the conference call, and I find it so refreshing to hear Hank acknowledge that he may have been overzealous in some respects, and that he makes the effort to broaden people's understanding... instead of pretending he can do no wrong. I love it. Thank You.

I’ve finally graduated college, I’m finally teaching, and I can finally participate in pizzamus. How many shirts did I buy? Yes.

@sexyscientist

8 ай бұрын

The t-shirts bundle?

@untappedinkwell

8 ай бұрын

Good for you! Congrats on your graduation, employment, and disposable income (now available in Pizzamas shirts flavor)!

I very much appreciate the Neal Stephenson nod. I first became aware of geoengineering from Termination Shock & that novel was absolutely fascinating! I should maybe reread it...

Vlogbrothers always gives me more hope for the future. Thanks

Late to the upload because i was watching the hankschannel video. So glad hank is committed to learning and growing and helping us along the way

Niel Stephenson's book "Termination Shock" has this subject as a central plot point. Super good, thought-provoking near future sci-fi.

Thank you for making this and making the topic approachable. I am currently working toward my PhD in environmental engineering and my research is on aerosols and their associated atmospheric chemistry. It is generally faculty members outside this research area who I have to convince that aerosol emission geoengineering is a terrible idea. They do not understand how much we don't know about aerosols. If it's any comfort, I don't know researchers in my field excited about this, nor do I know up-and-coming researchers willing to work on it.

You said something about cancer a while ago and I dont remember What I heard but I just hope you keep living because I just love listening to you so much.

Great video hank and thanks for showing how much nuance there is to geoengineering!

Unhinged??? Heh. Welcome to the future. Hinges optional. :P

@ornitorrinco_en_la_caverna

8 ай бұрын

I really like this comment, but I feel like I'm gonna like it even more in a few years.

Apart from local solutions like painting rooftops white, planting more trees in cities etc, there are two types of geoengineering I can get behind: 1. Cirrus thinning. The reason being, that cirrus clouds, while reflecting sunlight during the day, trap heat in the atmosphere and they are very often directly caused by aviation (contrails), so if we didn’t do so much jet travel, they wouldn’t even be there in that amount, so it seems reasonable to mitigate that. It would basically be the same effect as reducing air travel and be one way of attacking the root of human made climate change. 2. Removing greenhouse gases from the atmosphere. Greenhouse gases are the problem. It should be tackled at the root. Taking greenhouse gases out of the atmosphere would be the same as cutting emissions, which is what we need to do anyway. All the other methods - producing more reflective clouds, anything adding to the atmosphere - would not be attacking the problem at its roots, would do collateral damage and would just encourage us to continue releasing more greenhouse gases. It would also even reduce our chances of using renewables. Sunlight entering the atmosphere isn’t the problem, but can be part of the solution (solar and wind energy depend on energy from the sun reaching us).

This was really interesting hank. Thanks for taking the time. It must have taken a lot of thought and hours to do this video

A really good book that explores these issues is The Ministry for the Future, its a near-future fiction novel where different countries are fighting over geoengineering.

Bravo Hank for continuing to exemplify humility and integrity in your journey from the first geo engineering vid; you give me hope for the future of information sharing

I'm just happy that when you've mentioned another person you have a link to their online presence. So many times people don't and you have spend 15 minutes googling them. Simple things.

7:05 one piece taught me this issue years ago than any other source. Love it when art does me a learnding. Even a minor bit of exposure.

genuinely love the acknowledgement that ending coal here in the us IS a trolley problem in its own right, i get it needs to be done but we cant deny the suffering it may put on some hardworking common people and we have a responsibility as a nation to take care of them

@1queijocas

8 ай бұрын

Just offer the workers some free trainings/ industry placements and some other possible perks. Ending coal is not hard to do specially considering it is the most expensive way of making energy in the states

@1queijocas

8 ай бұрын

Just offer the workers some free trainings/ industry placements and some other possible perks. Ending coal is not hard to do specially considering it is the most expensive way of making energy in the states

Scientific accountability is one of the most honorable things.

Fantastic overview, fascinating topic. Momentum is definitely picking up

Been watching this man for what seems like a decade... this is my favorite video to date.

Petition to make Hanksgiving. A holiday about Hanks face on a turkey and stopping climate change. 👇

@jackbaker6316

8 ай бұрын

+

These Pizzamas vids have been bangers! Also, how DARE autocorrect try to change "Pizzamas" to just plain "pizza." Have you no knowledge or respect for one of Nerdfighteria's most cherished holidays?!

@untappedinkwell

8 ай бұрын

Clearly autocorrect needs to be brought up to speed! (Happy Pizzamas!)

I was just wondering whether there would be an update on that video, lo and behold!

There, subscribed to both of them... you're one of the best, Hank.

If we're willing to accept some level of the trolley problem, we could try what I call "billionaire cloud seeding" that would solve the climate problem in a matter of days, if not minutes.

I take the “Put that thing back where it came or so help me!” (In Monsters Inc Voice) Position on Post-Industrial Revolution Levels of Carbon Dioxide.

@CL-go2ji

8 ай бұрын

Good goal! Now for the implimentation ...

@ericlotze7724

8 ай бұрын

@@CL-go2ji Enhanced Weathering of Mine Tailings, and Novel Concrete Mixtures can do a surprising amount! I’m not too much of a Fan of Direct Air Capture, but short of Cost that technology is getting quite developed, although the viability of Gas Injection is debatable. I’m a fan of BECCS, although confirming sustainable sourcing of the biomass, as well as return of the nutrients in any ash to where the biomass was from (i made some goofy acronym for this, Biomass Origin Ash Return or BOAR) can add difficulty. I do like the concept of “reverse coal mining” the Char etc though lol. Carbon or Biomaterials as a Proppant may be neat. Using a PILE of “Green” Carbon Fiber etc could also sequester some. Widespread Conversion to Low/No Till Farming and Biochar is quite easily doable, although if this is truly long term sequestration remains to be seen. At the end of the day it’s all Social Will/Policy. We could have decarbonized in the 60’s even with Early Nuclear Plants. Not optimal, but possible. Between Flywheel Energy Storage, Pumped Hydro, Compressed Gas, or even just Power-to-X but inefficient (but overproduce energy to counter the inefficiency) the *Storage Myth* has been solved for decades. It’s just cheap and easy to pretend otherwise.

i saw the radiolab episode with you, amazing

Excellent video! Thank you for breaking this topic down for us all

I hope your cancer treatment is going well. I wish you the best God speed & God bless you!!!! ❤ 🙏 🙏 ❤ Get well & get better soon.

@Gouldsonuk

8 ай бұрын

The treatment finished a few weeks ago and he’s in complete remission! 😊

@sithlordbilly4206

8 ай бұрын

@@Gouldsonuk Okay, thanks

I'm still not sure where the controversy came from, tbh. I only watched it once, so maybe I missed something. But when I watched it, I left with the impression not of "we should totally do (or not do) this!" and more of "Hey, we did this accidentally, but now that we realize it, we should take stock of all that unintentional data and see what can be learned from it so it's not totally wasted." If you make a mistake or have an accident, the absolute WORST thing you can do is NOT LEARN ANYTHING from it.

Hank, you spoke about this in a very responsible manner. Which I very much appreciate. It's an incredibly complex topic. Thank you.

Have we *ever* fully predicted the correct eco-system effects of the introduction of a technology or process? And have we *ever* encountered **positive** un-predicted side-effects of such an introduction? We got into this mess because of hubris and if we plan solutions to the problem without checking said hubris it will literally be the end of us.

As @lizwrites2463 pointed out, so much respect to Hank for following up on his earlier video to provide us more nuance on this topic I knew nothing about. I thought @ClimateAdam's video was amazing - such a gentle way to call Hank in on a couple points. The internet often just descends into chaos of disagreement without actually hearing each other, and I am really inspired by Adam's compassionate follow-up and Hank's willingness to listen and make follow-up videos. Thanks to all three of you for furthering an important conversation.

The problem with corporate interventions is that if they are making a profit they will keep doing or fake results to promote it or bury problems to keep making or increase their profit. It needs to be governmental without lobby groups involved and should be coordinated between governments in multiple countries.

@MrTriple3D

8 ай бұрын

that sounds like shuffling the problem around, governments hate admitting they were wrong.

Great video, Hank. This got me thinking about things I haven't thought about before. Really well done. Hate the moustache.

thank you Hank You're a really easy person to love. there is a lot of bad in the world but with people like you about I will always have hope

“I see you’ve dug yourself into a deep hole! Here’s a shovel, just a little deeper and there’s treasure I promise!” *Balrog appears*

Slight hilarity as I realize this is what Tris Chandler was stressing about in The Will of the Empress by Tamora Pierce

I remember hearing something similar to the sulfur fuel issue years ago. It was after 9-11 and most commercial flights stopped for a few days. Apparently the jet exhaust was doing a certain level of cloud seeding. A fuzzy memory on something I think I heard years ago, LoL. There are so many moving parts in this issue. I wish there was a simple solution.

@susantaylor2937

7 ай бұрын

I remember the weather after that. The skies were so blue. No clouds. For a few months. And November, where I live, are usually gray and rainy. “Cold November rain”. But it was beautiful.

Rain making was used as a weapon in Southeast Asia by the U.S. Military. Operation Pop Eye in 1967-1972 had the goal of extending the monsoon season during the Vietnam war.

One geoengineering thing I heard was to seed the oceans with rust to create algal blooms in ocean deserts. It would probably make things worse, but it was an interesting idea.

@rakino4418

8 ай бұрын

They ran some small scale experiments where they dumped a bunch of iron into the ocean and it didn't super work?

@rogersmith258

8 ай бұрын

Yeah, it is better to grow algae in tanks on land, where they can be controlled and prevented from disrupting ecosystems, and desiccate them to make fertilizer and biochar than to do that in the ocean.

@karlbutler3351

8 ай бұрын

It's already going on.

Living in Nova Scotia ,I think this year we've been experiencing the termination shock of ending that accidental geoengineering.

In my brain the people who are on P4A every year are like celebrities so I just absolutely yelled MIRIAM!! when she showed up. Like a lil special cameo 🤗

This is the first year I’ve had enough money to buy pizzamas stuff and I even joined the awesome coffee club. I’m so happy to finally feel like I’m contributing to the community.

@minimarker3

8 ай бұрын

You do not need to financially contribute to be part of Nerdfighteria, but I am glad you get excellent Pizzamas stuff and coffee!

@mirandabug

8 ай бұрын

@@minimarker3 I know I didn’t have to, but I’m just happy to be able to finally contribute in that way!

I'm firmly in camp "let's gather as much data as possible before we try this potentially amazing and/or devastating thing", at least in regards to the more controversial geoengineering solutions. Sounds like we need more research into the behavior of aerosols...

There's actually a metal album that is a pretty apt metaphor for the pitfalls of geo-engineering. It's called Petrodragonic Apocalypse by King Gizzard and the Lizard Wizard and it slays very hard. Definitely in my top ten albums that could be viewed as a metaphor for geo-engineering

Best wishes🎉😘

I heard you talking about this on radio lab!!