As a Canadian in my sixties, I’ve been using Robertsons all my my life. It never occurred to me that someone would use anything else for electrical screws. Also, for wood screws, I can put a screw on the tip of the screwdriver and carry it to the target hole with just one hand sideways without it falling off. Robertson screws were invented by a furniture maker.

@BlaineZuk

2 жыл бұрын

The Robertson #1 (green) and #2 (red) are part of every Canadian tool box, and it left me wondering what in this video what would be wrong with this? - it did not even occur to me that people would try to use a Philips!

@HickLif3

2 жыл бұрын

@@BlaineZuk Here in the states Robertsons are primarily used in pocket screws. That's about it. a lot of people don't even know the robertson exists outside of that

@timheersma4708

2 жыл бұрын

I use the #1 Robertson the same way as described in the video, #2 Robertson for the ground screws in the outlet boxes and #3 Robertson for the Electrical Panel box screws (Square D panel). I don't recommend it, but a drill driver at slow speed helps as well.

@jaylitalien4041

2 жыл бұрын

Outside of electrical work, if you do manage to strip the screw head, you can drill 1/8 in the stripped head, tap in a #2 red robertson and pull the screw out, regardless of original shape (but you need practice as it doesnt always work and can take a toll on the driver. I keep older worn out driver for this reason). The robertson is the way to go for almost all screws when the option is available

@EvilDaveCanada

2 жыл бұрын

@@HickLif3 The Kreg branded pocket hole screws use a square drive bit. The square drive bit was a cheap knock off of the patented Robertson bit design. Robertson Inc is still in Milton, Ont. I have boxes of both Kreg & Robertson branded screws in #8 in about 8 different lengths.

To be precise, though, that slotted screwdriver is wrong for that particular screw (too small). A properly sized slotted screwdriver should be as wide as the head (or nearly so), and thick enough that it provides a tight fit in the slot.

@richardlug6139

2 жыл бұрын

Right for this demo he should have had the right size slotted screw driver, but then again when you are in a hurry or can not find the right size, which is most of the time, his demo was more realistic.

@TedHopp

2 жыл бұрын

Good catch. A properly sized slotted screwdriver also doesn't slip out of the slot as readily as an undersized one.

@osgeld

2 жыл бұрын

yes when these things were first put in practice a flat head screwdriver would have looked more like a cold chisel than what most of us have today to tighten up chair/table legs

@jkbrown5496

2 жыл бұрын

That's the problem with slotted screws, there's no hard standard so you need a handful of screwdrivers.

@gorak9000

2 жыл бұрын

@@jkbrown5496 There seems to be somewhat of a standard now with slotted screws - there's like 3 sizes that are useful - the large ones for screws like this in large electrical work, a mid size one that's kindof a jack of all trades, master of none type size, and a smaller one that's common on terminal blocks and small electronics. If you look at Klein screwdrivers, which are somewhat targeted at electrical work, there are 3 common sizes, and they're very similar to the sizes you find in other brand screwdriver sets as well.

As an electrician, I've been using the ECX screwdriver for years now. It's also great for EMT fittings. I rarely use a slotted screwdriver for anything other than a pry bar or doorstop.

@Tiny_rikk

Жыл бұрын

@@tabooretka as an electrician myself, I do occasionally use slotted screwdrivers. The offset ‘wiggly’ works best for cover plates imo. Larger slotted sizes come in handy when working on older equipment/loadcenters, and occasionally new breakers that use slotted terminal screws

In Canada we use three Robertson size bits which work for every situation, and when we order something that comes with flathead or Phillips type screws, we generally toss those screws into a jar and replace them with Robertson screws. This makes the job better and easier for us and the next guy who comes along and has to do some work on that piece of equipment.

@googledoesntneedtoknownone

Жыл бұрын

Yup. When I remove a flathead and Phillips screw I usually toss it directly into the garbage.

For the average home DIYer, that doesn't want to invest in another "specialty" tool that may see very minimal use, I'll go with the Robertson as I already have several of those loose bits and didn't really know what they were used for but now I do!

@SoleEpiphany

2 жыл бұрын

Robertson is the best screwdriver bar none, the main reason it’s not used as much as it should is it’s Canadian whereas Philips is American.

@Vanilla_Icecream1231

2 жыл бұрын

Robertson is amazing so much better than philips

@ghg789987

2 жыл бұрын

You can get the bit for your impact driver too, though. It's what I use for screwing the outlet into its box.

@kenbrown2808

2 жыл бұрын

a good quality #2 phillips grips much better than his illustration. but the hybrid locks in like nothing else does.

@gorak9000

2 жыл бұрын

@@kenbrown2808 I see no advantage to the ECX over a Robertson - it's just a gimmick to sell custom screwdrivers to yanks - in Canada, everyone has always used Robertson drivers exclusively for electrical work. I do enjoy how now in the US "square drive" wood screws are like a high end specialty item, and in Canada nearly all wood screws and self tapping metal screws are Robertson.

As a handy Canadian I just sort of took it for granted that everyone used a #1 Robbie for that. Robertson is my tip of choice for most things and I only use Philips or slotted when I have no choice. For someone who did that job all the time though I can certainly see how buying that hybrid tip screwdriver would be worthwhile.

@SolarMillUSA

2 жыл бұрын

Agreed. Though I have also come to really love Torx. :) Slotted screws should be relegated to horology and vintage machinery.

@timsievers2067

2 жыл бұрын

As an American, I just started seeing Robertson head only screws just in the last 5-7 years or so, but I just realized that most screws probably have been compatible with the Robertson this entire time. But, F**K the person that puts tamper resistance torx in the packaging of kids toys. Not the toy itself mind you, the screws that hold it to the shipping spacers.

@martinhoude3518

2 жыл бұрын

@@timsievers2067 The Torx is nice though. It holds REALLY well on the driver bit. You do need that bit though; most bit kits now have them.

@mjc0961

2 жыл бұрын

@@timsievers2067 Torx bits, even tamper resistant, are incredibly easy to come by. I can't believe people are still complaining about them in 2022.

@timsievers2067

2 жыл бұрын

@@mjc0961 talking 2005 actually, and most people today still dont know what a "torx" is or why they need it to use the toy they just bought. I just came across a "rex" bit today, never heard of it before walking through the clearance aisle at the hardware store.

I do a lot of handyman/maintenance work. I started using the Milwaukee ECX a few years ago. It is hands down the best tool for working with switches and outlets. No more slipping and worrying if your phillips is going to slip and not get the screw tight enough. The ECX grabs and very seldom slips. Always a tight connection when you are finished.

Been using Phillips for 30+ years, I can assure you I can apply enough torque to break the screws clean off. As an electrician I want to carry as little as possible, don’t get me wrong Robertson is great just don’t need all the time, I like them in panels.

@orion310591RS

Жыл бұрын

But we have to be honest, today, screws are not what used to be 30 years ago. Today screws start to slide at very little torque. Yes, I know on higher torque turn should be slower but again, quality changed. Multi-bit screwdriver is a must today. PS. Regarding this pool, depends where voters are from. In Europe, I doubt anyone used 3rd or 4th option. I am from EU, and I dont use 3rd or 4th option, this is first time I saw it.

@Mutation80

Жыл бұрын

This!

@terrabiker

Жыл бұрын

@@orion310591RS EU here , installed few breakers recently used Philips driver, but i have a breaker that i need to install so i just had to check in disbelief , and that little shit uses square driver screw. My brain just exploded...it looked weird when i was installing it but it would never occur to me I'm supposed to use square driver for it 😅

@orion310591RS

Жыл бұрын

@@terrabiker The trick is, that material from USA or standard from USA arrived to EU. And it (almost) can be done in old fashined way with old (improper for new standard) tools. To be honest we are talking about fine details, and just a little bit more (hand produced) torque which may not be needed for stationary wires, but again, this video is useful for informing people about slightly different tools/standards.

@toomanymarys7355

Жыл бұрын

if you strip half the screws you touch effortlessly, you're a true electrician. 😉

In the Electrical field here in Canada. It has been the norm to use the Robertson Drivers. They are common to purchase and are not expensive, good quality brands are readily available and they don't slip out. The Green Colored number one Robertson Driver is probably the most commonly used driver after the Red colored number two. That's the color of the handles so you can immediately tell the difference. A zero which is very small, is yellow and a number three, that is a black handle, it's for bigger screws.

@edsedlak6827

2 жыл бұрын

So common that if you say hand me a red everyone knows what you're talking about.

@leerman22

2 жыл бұрын

The electrical outlets I bought didn't even support Phillips. It made things so much easier than I thought replacing outlets would be, the torque is satisfying. I don't know anything about screwdriver sizes and the green thing worked perfectly.

@my3dviews

2 жыл бұрын

@@leerman22 That's right. I didn't even know that they made ones that accept Phillips screw drivers as well. The ones that I use only take a Roberson and a slot screwdriver.

@williamhudson4938

2 жыл бұрын

not to mention it looked like a cheap POS from the thrift store.

@HartmutWSager

2 жыл бұрын

​@@my3dviews And indeed, the screwheads in this video do NOT have a Phillips opening at all - they are a combo of Robertson and straight slot and NOTHING else.

Since I live in Canada, Robertson screws are very commonly used. The great thing about them is that you can hold the screw on the end of your screwdriver if you want to start the screw more easily. I hardly ever use Philips screws and never slot screws anymore.

@fergusontea

2 жыл бұрын

When I get things that come with screws, they are usually Philips head (and soft metal, at that) so they go directly into the scrap metal bin and are substituted with Robersons.

@mayorb3366

2 жыл бұрын

Hopefully Phillips and slotted screws will be extinct soon. Torx is coming on along pretty well in the US, they are readily available everywhere. They're around, but Robertson is still not too common here.

@wallacegrommet9343

2 жыл бұрын

Prefer Robertson over all other profiles.

@phxgen

2 жыл бұрын

@@mayorb3366 we gotta have something that cams out reasonably easy for mounting gypsum wallboard. Perhaps if mfgrs of wallboard guns introduced some mechanism that withdraws the cam-out-free bit at a certain point, but why? Philips still seems like it should be the go-to for drywall screws to me. darn near everything else? Robertson or Torx, please.

I never knew these existed. As a DIY'er, I have run into these problems MANY times with Philips screwdrivers and have wondered what the right type was for YEARS. I just ordered a Milwaukee ECX #1 along with a set of #1 and #2 driver bits. Thank you!!

I have recently gone with the multi-bit that has ECX, Robertson, Phillips, Flat, and several sizes of nut driver. It has become my go-to because of the versatility. I have large hands, so I have no problem holding the larger handle.

Fun fact 1: the tendency of a screwdriver to slip out from the screw head while applying torque is call "cam out" Fun fact 2: People who mention Robertson screws most likely Canadians because they're quite popular in Canada. These screws were invented by Canadian inventor P.L. Robertson and patented in 1909. The Ford Model T used around 700 of these screws but Ford later shifted to using Phillips screws when Robertson refused to grant an exclusive license to Ford for the use of these square drive screws.

@brianbelchior7329

Жыл бұрын

Green robbie for electrical ohly

@peterdeboer2805

Жыл бұрын

Mr Roberston was actually an American that immigrated into Canada. Us Canadians don't like to tell too many people that part though

@dabsafe

Жыл бұрын

@@peterdeboer2805 Henry Ford was a control freak as well as an admirerer of Adolf Hitler. Americans rarely mention that.

I'm an Electrician from Canada we here always use the #1 Robertson screwdriver. Most of our screws are Robertson here way easier to use they don't fall off your screwdriver, when lights etc come with Phillips screw we usually just throw them away and use Robertson screws instead.

The entire point of an ecx screw head is that it accepts multiple screwdriver tips. Every which one is listed to put out more torque than the termination is listed for. Also never heard of those ecx bits until a few years ago when I saw one made by ideal. On the other hand that screw head has been in service for ages…. Also the best tool for the job is a torque screwdriver especially if you’re a homeowner who doesn’t know what you’re doing.

@davidworks7758

Жыл бұрын

Okey and I think that is, not so bright in todays world. Torx is near perfect. If you don't have the right tool for the application, you don't know what you are doing.

@gabiold

Жыл бұрын

And the truth is, neither of the screwdrivers that it accepts work properly. There should be ONE type which is made it for, and works perfectly with! If someone doesn't have a flat, or PH or PZ screwdriver, then it might be better to avoid touching the work. But if you have all of them, but none of them works propery, nah, that's annoying! Btw. I always use a flat screwdriver for these universal crap (although not that improperly sized, like in the video). Robertson is pretty much rare in Europe. Most kits have PZ, PH, TX, Hex, Flat, but only one of my bit sets have a few square ones. Apart from that, the recommendation is good, because it works on some screws. But it really shouldn't have been imported in the EU, if the matching screwdriver is rare. Should be Torx instead, if not PH/PZ/Flat...

54 years old and have always thought about how to improve outlet screws, but no need now you found the tools! Ordering these now thanks! Update: Just checked your Amazon link, the Milwaukee driver is unavailable so I got Milwaukee 48-32-4440 Insert bit Ecx 1/4"Hex, 2 Pack. Thanks again!

As a Canadian, I have used #1,2,3 Robertson for decades. Pretty much everything from Framing, Deck building, Fence building to Electrical. It also never occurred to me to use a Philips or Slot, they will just slip. I just don't like the multibit drivers with Robertson, the dedicated Robertson screwdrivers I find last longer. I think everything should be Robertson or Torx.

@psdaengr911

2 жыл бұрын

If you can find a modern screw made for a modern P bit, a modern ISO-standard P bit will work perfectly. But those screws are rarely used in applications where so much torque is needed that cam-out would be a problem. "Jeweler's" drivers are P type.

@terrymulton252

2 жыл бұрын

Flat screwdrivers are made for prying things like paint cans open lol

@kristiankatic9965

2 жыл бұрын

As a non-Canadian, I think everything should just be Torx

@robertb3409

2 жыл бұрын

As a fellow Canadian, I love using the robertson screwdriver. On job sites, I get disappointed when some equipment comes with a slot or phillips only.

@HOWNDOG66

2 жыл бұрын

It’s unfortunate that Henry Ford is still keeping USA from using the better screw. Robertson is in so many ways superior and easier to use over Philips....should have died over 100 years ago.

I have stripped so many screws with the same thought process. The tips you provided have made me feel more confident in tackling these kind of projects.

Years ago I bought the Milwaukee 11 in 1 screwdriver that has two different sizes of that hybrid tip. At first, I wasn't happy about it and thought I was sure that I would rarely have use for them, but they have come in handy a few times now. Given the choice, I would go with the square tip, just for overall simplicity.

@Snurre86

Жыл бұрын

As a European watching this, hearing him call this things modern is pretty funny.

In all my tool bags, my desk draw, my range bag, and my main camera case, I carry Klein 11-in-1 screwdrivers. Full time, I do datacom, and often have need to use conduit, and much prefer when there is a square head on them, though I mostly use the dust-free conduit fittings because the client that I do the most conduit for requires them. Recently, I was replacing some outlets in my house, and love the squares, works so well. When doing carpentry type work, I much prefer the star head screws. For the finish screws I use for some stuff, they are a square drive and work very well. IMHO, all types have their place, well, except for flat heads, lets get rid of flat heads.

One GREAT benefit of the multi-drivers is that you can put a #1 square drive on one side of the sleeve and a small straight blade bit on the other side. Allows you to quickly flip from installing outlet and switch wiring then flip the sleeve and install the plates.

The Roberston (square) is a simply superior screw. It is great for electrical work but what I like best is that when driving screws you can put the screw on the bit first and it will stay there. Also, the screwdriver bit will not cam out as easily as a Phillips or slotted. If you buy a box of Roberstons you will never go back to Phillips.

@jeffreyesguitar5129

2 жыл бұрын

Add a good magnetic bit holder and you can’t make that screw fall off.

@JohnNorton86

2 жыл бұрын

@@CautiousCrow Robertson is less probe to rounding. I find Torx tend to wear down faster given the many fine machined points of contact. If you use the right size Robertson you will never cam out

@jamese9283

2 жыл бұрын

Every type screw has its disadvantages, including Robertson.

@P_RO_

2 жыл бұрын

@@jamese9283 True, but Robertson has one quality the others don't have: you can easily renew the screwdriver tip. Robertsons are slightly tapered so if the driver wears grind a bit off the end and now it fits good as new.

@goodun2974

2 жыл бұрын

@@jeffreyesguitar5129 , if you're using non-magnetic stainless steel deck screws and similar, magnetic bit holders and socketed screwdrivers don't work any better! But yes, Robertson screws in general are terrific, and I prefer them over Torx. Note that Makita makes a handy dandy little hollow, bullet-shaped magnet that slides over the shaft of your screwdriver or 1/4" hex drive bit and adds extra magnetic grip. These work really well for holding screws of all types. I've never used a Robertson screwdriver on electrical outlet screws, but a #1 does seem a little small for the job. I wish it was a #2.

I recently assembled most of a wooden swing set using a Phillips screwdriver on that type of screw, until it dawned on me that I could use a square bit. What a difference!

@Blox117

Жыл бұрын

i just use my hands

I inherited a bunch of tools from my dad who was an industrial electrician for decades. I came across a number of "weird" Phillips looking screw drivers. It never occurred to me to try them on electrical switches/outlets. But that Milwaukee "ECX" screw driver just answered a decade old questions of "what the heck did he have these for". Thanks!

@JoelAntoinette

2 жыл бұрын

I inherited some of my Grandpa's Fathers 1920s tools. Hand drills, measuring devices, hammers, all still work/look just fine. Like little treasures but probably not worth all that much any where else

@blur911

2 жыл бұрын

Industrial electrician here, when I started in 1990 my employer made me buy a Reid and Prince screwdriver, looks like a Phillips, never used it...ever.

@badbiker666

2 жыл бұрын

@@blur911 Reid and Prince fasteners have that extra little groove. Reid and Prince screwdrivers have corresponding pawls to fit in there. In over 50 years working with tools, I have never needed one. One would have to wonder why your employer insisted on you having one! I hope it didn't cost much.

@blur911

2 жыл бұрын

@@badbiker666 The guy making the tool list hadn't worked in the field in years, nor in Canada, I also have a set of huge fuse pullers I've never used. I remember neither of them being cheap.

Electricians adopted the Robertson early when they were doing knob and tube wiring it would allow one handed operation of the screw driver while holding the wire and insulator together.

@narmale

2 жыл бұрын

Interesting, because every old panel and jbox from the 20s-60s ive gutted or worked on from residential to industrial has been slotted only

I've been using either JIS or a larger slotted screwdriver.. never occurred to me to try the square drive. I'll probably switch to Robertson no.1 and just leave that in my appropriate bin. I might try the hybrid but only if I catch a good sale or have a chance to try one out first.

@victorpelini5995

Жыл бұрын

JIS is gold

@RaspberrySuprise

Жыл бұрын

I have a Vessel JIS driver that has a serrated tip for extra bite and it works very good. Especially when driving actual JIS screws.

3:00 I work in maintenance and have had some of these square bits and NEVER knew what they were for until now. I've never seen any of my coworkers use them so I just figured they were for a special type of screw. This is awesome!

@machstormrunner3130

Жыл бұрын

You'll use the square bits in a lot of construction screws, torx bits are found in construction screws often as well. Oh! And your pocket hole screws are almost all square bit for ease of install.

I use the Milwaukee 1000V insulated ECX screwdriver. It comes in a set of 3, the other 2 drivers are slotted and Phillips. I love my ECX, it turns tighter, and the driver never slips off the screw

@nateg08

2 жыл бұрын

Same i bought the same set and I love that screw driver. Never used one before buying that set.

@kalijasin

2 жыл бұрын

Got a link?

@andrewdelisle3476

2 жыл бұрын

@@kalijasin hone depot sells a 3 set of 1000v insulated. A slotted a Phillips and the hybrid

@Incipiwav

2 жыл бұрын

This is written so well it could be an ad lol

@nateg08

2 жыл бұрын

@@Incipiwav no better advertisement than a happy user.

I've been a home improvement carpenter for a long time, and this is the first I've heard of these screw drivers. I will be adding them to my tool collection soon. Great info. Thanks.

@rosswilliam2472

2 жыл бұрын

I have never heard of these kind of screwdrivers either.

@txfreerider

2 жыл бұрын

I have at least 6 of these sit around that have never been used. Philips gets the job done perfectly every time. Why fill a slot on my bag/belt for a single use tool

@bcreason

2 жыл бұрын

@@txfreerider Home Depot in Canda sells mostly Robertson exclusively. I can't recall seeing any Phillips screw s on their shelves. My tool pouch is all Robertson drivers. I rarely have to use Phillips and when I do it's usually accompanied by some 4 letter words has they're so hard to deal with.

Good advise for the general DIYers out there. I personally prefer to have a proper selection of drivers of most if not all the different tips/bits out there - saves me the aggravation of damaged fastener heads or gouging the surface of the object I’m working on. And those square tips(Robertson)are overly underrated….. just my 2cents

This is great advice, slotted screw drivers are of a typical ratio width over thickness, I be surprised if you can readily find a wide thin blade. I have been puzzled to these screws having background in the UK. Now it makes sense, one aspect to consider are those often scenarios where leads are too short, it’s all of a tangle and your trying to capture that difficult connection. The proper driver will make an enormous difference.

@garyK.45ACP

9 ай бұрын

If you look into specialty type screwdriver bit sets, such as a gunsmithing set, you can find wide and very thin blades for slotted screws.

I think every type of screw everywhere should be a TORX head screw so you can us TORX screw drivers. They give far far stronger and better grip than any other type I have ever used.

@michaelraney6732

2 жыл бұрын

You’re not wrong

@Dirtyharry70585

2 жыл бұрын

That’s funny just had a fellow worker tell me the button head torx was a half size metric Allen 🤪. I was hoping he was kidding but he fought it until the drill bits came out……I gave him a torx25……

@davepalmer7987

2 жыл бұрын

When I am coronated, King of the world. My first order if business will be banning straight slot screwdrivers.

@travis1240

2 жыл бұрын

Torx is good, but I've also never been disappointed with Robertson.

@cetyl2626

2 жыл бұрын

@@davepalmer7987 I don't like slotted screws but I like flat screwdrivers as they are versatile for more than just screws.

I have an electrician friend who said he would quit the trade if he had to work in the US with Philips...there is absolutely no better tip for wiring than Robertson (not withstanding the very specialized tip used here)...we Canadians love Robertson but it baffles us as to why the US hasn't adopted them.

@Tre16

2 жыл бұрын

They love to be "different" lol.

@JernD

2 жыл бұрын

It is because of a licensing dispute between Robertson and the Ford motor company way back in the day

@kenbrown2808

2 жыл бұрын

we yanks do use a fair percentage of square drive, but it has its own weaknesses. it will actually strip screw heads more effectively than anything else, and somehow I've had robertson screws strip out and still had to use pliers to get the bit loose from the stripped screw. phillips cams out easier than robertson, but it usually doesn't strip as badly so it can be backed out and replaced. torx grips amazingly well, but stainless screws will fall off the tip, and every size screw uses a different size driver.

@gorak9000

2 жыл бұрын

As a canadian that's now in the US, Robertson (well technically "square" drive) shows up here more now as a "specialty screw" - I have a feeling the patent on Robertson must've expired, so now there's no licensing requirement. I use robertson screws on purpose hoping someone after me will run into them and go "WTF?? Security screws?? why the...." :)

@kenbrown2808

2 жыл бұрын

@@andymerrett: screws in that kind of wire termination pretty much have to be flathead to have enough surface area for a screwdriver to grip.

As a mechanic I use a Snap On Philips #2 which does not slip due to its design, never knew about the square drive so I’ll definitely try that next time. Thanks for the info was very informative

Legrand is also my standard - I'm currently remodeling, and as I come across a switch or receptacle, I swap them out with a Legrand unit. They also have a great variety of paddle switches, dimmers, GFIs, Receptalces (including GFIs) with USB power plugs, receptacles with built in night lights, etc. Coolness!!!

I was an electrician, many years ago, and I never heard about the Robertson driver fitting those screw heads. Wish I had known. Thanks for the info, it will still come in handy for future projects.

@1575murray

Жыл бұрын

Older devices did not accept the Robertson screwdriver. I am not sure when the manufacturers redesigned their products to accept it. I have a #1 Robertson in my bag (purchased in Canada) and I use it on any switch or receptacle because I found that other screwdrivers could slip.

Yep... for years that was me. I could never figure why the phillips never quite fit right. Then someone turned me on to the Milwaukee insulated ECX screwdriver and it has been my go to electrical fastener ever since.

thats wild. as an electronics technician I think I will stick with the philips and then tighten with a flat head unless I come accross a robinson bit in one of my sets for personal use. will keep that in mind tho when picking new tools in the future.

THANKS FOR YOUR VIDEO. PLEASE include this on your next one. (I'm going to get myself a Milwaukee #1-ECX tool)That's Kewl! What most people don't realize, the multi-bit, (or I call them "flip-over screwdrivers"), have 2 different sized deep pocket nut-drivers (for doing stud type terminal boards). A different size on each end, and you can pull the driver tube out all the way and the handle has a slotted drive hole in it, that is a perfect tool for tightening wing type wire nuts...!

Bought Wiha ECX drivers in #1 and #2 a while ago when doing panel work to bring my panel up to current code with AFCI/GFCI breakers. Huge difference in confidence tightening the fasteners. They've also been super handy on receptacles and switches. I am slowly ridding my home of push connected outlets and switches and replacing them with commercial grade or wire around screw connections.

I wish I had known this 30 years ago. My DIY days are over, but I did a lot of home wiring back then, and no one ever suggested these tools.

@beammeupscotty1955

Жыл бұрын

30 years ago a standard receptacle did not have the type of screw shown in this video so neither the special combination tip or the square drive would have been useful. At that time only a standard flat blade screwdriver would be used.

@alexistaylor969

Жыл бұрын

Because noone cares enough to use these tools today and they didn't use those screws back in the day. Just another example of people inventing solutions to problems that don't exist.

@galvanizedgnome

Жыл бұрын

Lazy bum

I hadn't ever heard of such a thing! If I get back in to electrical work I'll certainly have one of these in my kit.

Thanks for pointing ECX out. As soon as I saw this video, I went and found my ECX screw drivers. I did notice on some older Leviton plugs I had on hand only had Philips head screws to ECX may not work for all devices.

The ECX bit is wonderful for terminals you need a good bite on to tighten. I keep a couple in the tool bag for such. I have found that a 1/4 flat driver works for 99.9% of devices I work on though. Cover plates all the way to panel lugs. The less tools hanging on my belt the happier I am.

As most others, I hadn't heard of the combo ECX driver before. This should be a "Game Changer" when installing outlets/switches. Just like jeffostrof, I went to Home Depot and got the insulated #1 ECX, a straight blade, and phillips set for $20.97. I had expected to pay $20 just for the uninsulated #1 ECX. A great deal!! THanks for the video.

@zubirhusein

2 жыл бұрын

Yup, great deal

@altimmons

2 жыл бұрын

It’s called a Xeno tip generically, ecx is a brand name

As a retired Canadian electrician, I love Robertson head screws. Unfortunatly when driving the multi head screws in recepticles, they usually strip the screw head before applying sufficient torque.

I have used the #1 Robertson for years wherever I can. I have been upgrading my switches (again), adding a bunch more smart ones. I took your advice and bought a Milwaukee ECX #1 (HD, 3 piece insulated set), as well as a Klein Hybrid multi-bit (#2 only in the set) - easiest way to get these locally. For the most part, this has been great, but a few comments about my experience so far: For most wiring devices, the ECX#1 has been great, but there is at least one brand that it won't work on. I don't remember which but I believe it was either Lutron or Leviton. My panel was updated last year and I needed to swap out a single space breaker for a tandem. The ECX (Hybrid) #2 makes quick work of removing the panel cover, but the Eaton BR breakers are compatible with the ECX #1, not the #2. As I turn off a circuit, I also try to find the outlets where I used quickwire in the past and switch those to side wire. Thanks to your videos and my own experience with failed outlet connections, I know better now. Thanks for this outstanding series. You are costing me a little with tool upgrades, lol.

Been around electrical since the early 80's. Worked with electricians many many times since then and this is the FIRST time I've ever seen this. Have seen ET's use a Phillips and then follow up with the straight, but this tip seems like the proper way to go. Strange, I've had them in my tool box for 30 years and never used them....

@ant9072

2 жыл бұрын

Phillips followed by straight is my technique.

Another great video Scott. Once one uses the ECX, its hard to go back. I might mention that for typical duplex/switch replacement, and cover replacements, I usually find myself reaching for my ‘old’ GB 1000 volt insulated screwdriver with multi tips. It works well enough on the wiring, and the smaller slotted bit is perfect for the plate screws. Peace ✌🏻

Wow. Always learning! As I understand it, a Philips head screwdriver is designed specifically to pop out of the screw head before over torquing, which could potentially damage the work or round off the screw head. A screw sized for the application would effectively determine the torque.. In practice, I have no idea if that's true.

@bombo139

Жыл бұрын

its true, but it was designed with 1900s manifacturing in mind before torqe limiters on drills were common/cheap. since it is cheap and common now we should switch to a more robust head like torx or hex.

After watching your videos and others on the combo bit I finally picked me up a Klein ratcheting screw driver that came with the combo bit and some ecx bits for my M12 drills and I have to say I’m impressed after installing some switches in my house.

How did it feel to have everyone in Canada yelling at your video for the first 3 minutes? Always has been Robertson's for me as a DIYer . Pretty sure most Canadians have the same experience.

@stephensaines7100

2 жыл бұрын

Yup, but you need both a "red handle" and "green handle" to properly do NEMA outlets. The green can work in the terminal screws, but often strips out. The Red is the one to use, and it can apply a large amount of torque, enough to overtighten if one goes too far. The Green handle is used for the box attachment screws.

I've used a no. 1 square drive for years. No slipping and you can really tighten those terminals. Far superior to Phillips and slotted.

@appalachiangunman9589

2 жыл бұрын

Allen and Torx are pretty common here in the U.S. now, I’m not sure why that they don’t utilize those for electrical applications. I agree though the square drivers are really good too.

@mjc0961

2 жыл бұрын

Philips and slotted are pretty much tied for the worst. I hate 'em both. Give me square, -allen/hex,- or torx any day. EDIT: Disregard hex, another comment reminded me of people rounding them out by using the wrong size, since they come in both SAE and metric measurements. No thanks, don't want to deal with any of that after some clown was there before me using the wrong size.

I've heard "ECX" however wasn't 100% on it vs the Robertson, Thanks for making it crystal clear.

As a homeowner I do not have specialty ECX screwdriver and I may get one as I was wiring things around and will be doing more during renos. However the Robertson(square drive) is perfect for the job and you use No 1 for the outlet wiring and No 2 for the wiring ground to the electrical box and also tightening the clamps for wire coming to the electrical box. RObertson is all you need for electrical work. (With the exception of the cover plates, damn those slotted screws) EDIT: I just realized that Canadians also have superior clamping in electrical boxes, its isnide the box so you can always adjust it instead of on the outside edge. And the screw is thick Robertson drive.

I'm retired from a fence company where, along with building fences, I installed and trouble shot gate operators and entry control systems. I let the screw head tell me what kind of driver to use. Most were square. Some were phillips/slotted in which case I used the phillips. Slotted drivers are good for prying parts apart.😁

I use the square drive, works really well for me especially for really torquing down on some things such as a 24 volt trolling motor plug.

Just ordered a ECX #1 screwdriver. Had no idea they even existed. Thanks!!

Not sure what the torque specs are for a receptacle. But, I have never had issue using the #2 Phillips. In fact this was the entire purpose for the invention of the phillips drive. Factory workers kept breaking off screws with slot and hex tips. So, factory owners wanted a dummy proof drive that would skip the bolt rather than break it off when using air powered tools. So, it seems fitting to use a drive style when the proper torque is(seemingly) achieved without the risk of damaging a device.

Most Robertson screw drivers are color coded too (at least they are up here in Canada) : Green is Robertson #1 Red is Robertson #2. Makes it very easy to spot the right one in the tool box!

@gorak9000

2 жыл бұрын

There's also a yellow #0 and a black #3 Robertson - they're kind of rare - almost as rare as a phillips #3. I think only once did I find a #0 robertson screw, and only one time did I run into a philips #3 (probably actualy a JIS screw as it was commercial electrical equipment from Japan, but a #3 philips worked fine). Robertson #3 isn't as rare, but you don't see it too often.

@pbakai182

2 жыл бұрын

@@gorak9000 black robbies are common for larger EMT. never seen a yellow though

@carlosanvito

2 жыл бұрын

I have a yellow Robbie - used mostly for very small wood screws, not for electrical work.

@gorak9000

2 жыл бұрын

@@pbakai182 Yeah, I know I've had to go fish out the #3 Robertson out of the tool box a few times, but couldn't remember for what. According to wikipedia, not only is there a #0 yellow, but also a #00 orange, and a #4 brown! en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robertson_screw The More You Know [shooting star]

@millwrightrick1

2 жыл бұрын

@@gorak9000 There is also an orange #00. I have one in my tool box as a millwright and have used it on really small screws.

I've been using the Phillips with a slotted to do the final tightening, and I'm glad to see that you suggested that as a good solution without buying new tools. I was surprised just how much more tightening I can do with the slotted screwdriver after it feels tight with the Phillips. My slotted that I use for outlets is a bit wider (more distance from one end of the slot to the other), so it works great for not slipping. It's also extra short, which gives me better control. Having tools that you like really helps.

@jkbrown5496

2 жыл бұрын

Phillips was designed to limit the torque and cam out for use on the auto assembly lines.

@davepaturno4290

2 жыл бұрын

@@jkbrown5496 Unfortunately, camping out tends to strip the screw head, especially if done with a power tool.

@davepaturno4290

2 жыл бұрын

If tou do strip a Phillips head screw that doesn't have a built-in slot, make a slot using a Demel tool with a cutoff wheel.

@kraziecatclady

2 жыл бұрын

@@davepaturno4290 as a mechanic with 19 years of experience, you just made me cringe from reminders of new mechanics sheering off 3/8" and 13mm bolts with the 1/2" impact or cracking sockets because they didn't grab the ones designed for said impact... 🤦‍♀️

@davepaturno4290

2 жыл бұрын

@@kraziecatclady Well, I have over 30 years as a mfg engineer and have a degree in mechanical engineering, so I can assure you that I am well aware of metallurgy, tools, and torque. Sadly, I'm not a mechanic but I have worked on a few cars over the years.😏

Straight bladed screwdrivers are fine as long as the blade fits the whole screw head. I've been doing this work for 52 years...never had a problem. You should use your #2...the head fits the receptical screw better!

@TheYear-dm9op

Жыл бұрын

I agree, the diver should fit the width of the slot, so it has some friction there and doesn't wiggle loosely.

@dmitripogosian5084

Жыл бұрын

@@TheYear-dm9op Not just the width, but preferable the lengh. Manually, I have better control while tightening with proper flat driver than with either Phillips or Robertsons

I live in the Netherlands, and I have a Stanley 64-961 for years now and never new why it existed. Now I know, but we have different sockets for electric work but the screws I do recognise. Handy to know when to use the Stanley Robertson tip 1

Computer guy here: sometimes I use a JIS screwdriver instead of a phillips for certain things where a lot of torque is necessary. Phillips screwdrivers are actually intended to cam-out to limit how much torque can be applied. That is why the grooves on them are angled.

@blur911

2 жыл бұрын

He could have made a video about JIS screwdrivers and motorcycles. I worked on them for 30 years before I found out they were JIS screws and not Phillips. Wow, what a difference a JIS drivers make working on a Japanese motorcycle

@joelmacdonald6994

2 жыл бұрын

Agreed. A JIS is visually similar to a Phillips, but they are practically quite different. Most people don’t know that the Phillips was designed to cam-out. At the time, good design, but archaic in today’s world.

For an electrician, time is money. When plugging and switching devices, a #1 Roberts in a 18V or 12V drill is so much faster than anything else. I tried that ECX bit in my drill and it just took too long to line up the bit with screw head. After about 10 min I went back to the #1 Roberts.

@d.k.1394

2 жыл бұрын

But the power of the battery drill can strip the thread and they are heavy and the battery goes flat often

@caseyk6625

2 жыл бұрын

@@d.k.1394 I actually use a 12 V brushless Milwaukee drill driver with a 1/4 inch quick release chuck. The drill has a great clutch and I can set the clutch so that it doesn't over tighten and strip out the screw heads. 2 fully charged 2.0 batteries gets me through the day no problem.

@pats9414

2 жыл бұрын

Drill is the way to go. Especially screwing outlet to box. You just need a feel for it. You need a new drill if you run out of battery doing outlets.

@16vSciroccoboi

2 жыл бұрын

This. A few years back I bought one of these bits when I saw it on a rack a tiers bit display. Talk about disappointment.

I've always used Phillips screwdrivers. I hate slotted screws and don't buy products or equipment that use them. I've never heard of ECX or Robertson before today, but I'm definitely gonna buy a set of both next time I'm at Lowe' s Depot!

I'm a US electrician and most use slotted for receptacles, though I'll use a Philips to start and a slotted to finish. If I'm doing many receptacles, I will flip my 11 in 1 screwdriver to Robertson as it is superior. Everyone, using a Philips only for this does not allow for the torque needed. You will sooner or later have issues if you don't torque a termination down appropriately.

@SteTrax

Жыл бұрын

Wow. I can't wait to introduce th to my colleagues We were p mo give you free raon to talk at my next party...🤔

I recently started working in electronic testing field after graduating with a physics degree. There is a lot about electrical work that I don't know about! We use a lot of those kind of screws at work, so I will have to look and see if we have any Robertson drivers at work. I've been using a Phillips or flathead this whole time because I didn't know there was any other options!

@zaxmaxlax

Жыл бұрын

Unless you're changing sockets and lamp switches in the US/CA there's no reason to use them.

@dongleberry4397

Жыл бұрын

Great "degree"...

@Blox117

Жыл бұрын

@@dongleberry4397 you're saying physics is not degree worthy?

@Blox117

Жыл бұрын

why did you choose that job? physics degree is overqualified

We should ALL be using Robertson - it is just a better design and has excellent holding power for regular construction and one-handed operation!

@EverydayHomeRepairs

2 жыл бұрын

Agreed!

@nick_vee

2 жыл бұрын

@@skim193 “That metric system is the tool of the devil! My car gets 40 rods to the hogshead and that’s the way I likes it!” -Abe Simpson

@bunkerhill4854

2 жыл бұрын

All the world really needs is love…….. and a set of Robbies! Green and red are the most popular sizes, but it’s best to have a black and a yellow too. You just sleep better knowing that you are prepared. 😎🇨🇦

@danielcarroll3358

2 жыл бұрын

@@skim193 Oh, you mean Pozidriv screws.

@EverydayHomeRepairs

2 жыл бұрын

@@bunkerhill4854 😂 that's awesome!

I always wondered why the screws on electrical outlets looked rounded out. Now it all makes sense. It even makes more sense as to why when I've seen electricians who use a #2 phillips head on an impact driver, strip the screws out.

Over here (northern EU), there are almost no Phillips screws used any more. All of them have been replaced with Pozidriv, which is a great improvement over Phillips. No question. But in woodwork, house building etc. they exclusively only use Torx nowadays.

As an electrician my go too would be a 4mm slotted screwdriver 95% of the time and that's pretty much the industry standard. You can do almost a whole second fix using just a pair of snips and a slotted screwdriver

@ColCurtis

2 жыл бұрын

Our you could just try a stick to do everything. Get some tools, people are paying you good money, I wouldn't want all my outlet covers gouged up from your slotted screwdriver slips.

@Vii7aL

2 жыл бұрын

@@ColCurtis nobody gouges the sockets up with a slotted? White plastic ones rarely scratch and if its a chrome one you just take your time

@relaxingnature2617

Жыл бұрын

The industry standard is the Robertson

@Vii7aL

Жыл бұрын

@@relaxingnature2617 I don't even know what that is

I've never seen an ECX before. Neat but seems like overkill for this application. Robertsons are cheap, ubiquitous and get the job done perfectly. I'm sure the ECX feels satisfying to use but the downside is it has to be oriented correctly like a flat head which makes it slightly less one-handable. It's also much less common and I'm willing to bet costs more (I could be wrong). That being said, I'll look for one the next time I'm at a hardware store because I'm a sucker for tools ;)

@GuyFromJupiter

2 жыл бұрын

They're not uncommon, especially as part of an all-in-one screwdriver or a screwdriver kit. They're just commonly ignored or unknown by most people.

@youtubeendorsesleftistprop4304

2 жыл бұрын

Ideal makes one, Milwaukee 11-1’s are awkward for my hand, so I went ideal

@16vSciroccoboi

2 жыл бұрын

They are annoying to use vs a robertson or phillips. Especially in repetition

@kobayashimaru8114

2 жыл бұрын

@@GuyFromJupiter Are you in the US? In Canada, I've never seen them whether in a pack or sold separately.

@randyaivaz3356

2 жыл бұрын

Not Over Kill, is the correct tool. Wanted to get Milwaukee ECX. But could only get Online. Got the 9 Bit? Klein with Bits in the Handle. 2 are ECX. I believe in getting Quality Tool to do Quality work. Stratmando

My late father was an IBEW electrician for 50 years. He would have LOVED this tool!

@EverydayHomeRepairs

Жыл бұрын

😁 My dad is a retired IBEW lineman 👍

All this time I wondered why I could not get the right sized screwdriver when working with electric outlets. I was using different sized Phillips and a stubby standard. I went out and bought a #1 Robertson today even though I may never work on an outlet again. I'm 75.

Thanks for showing this. I live in Canada and I have always used a robertson screwdriver for these. As a matter of fact the robertson screw was invented in Canada. I notice the United States seems to use mostly the philips head screws and not much of the robertson. I didn't know the ECX Milwaukee screwdriver even existed. I will have to check that out.

They also make it much easier to tighten the screw for the hot lead down on a circuit breaker, and is less likely to slip which is helpful if you are wiring inside a hot panel.

Every trade has specialty tools for the guy that does it for a living. For me, the Phillips worked fine for me when I did my renovation and it was already in my tool box. Take your time to make sure it's tight and right and you won't end up with a tool in your box you only use once every ten years. There are some projects that just can't be done without a particular tool and for those I bite the bullet and buy it, this isn't one of them

@jordanadams5902

Жыл бұрын

almost no electrician uses combination bits for terminating lol

@rickmort27

Жыл бұрын

@@jordanadams5902 i use them for panel covers, for commercial roughs its usful as hell cause all the new screws on 4x4 boxes and its mountings use a combo bit. have a screwdriver and and impact bits

As a Canadian, I've known about Roberson screw drivers since I was a kid and for electrical work since my high school shop classes, back in the late '60s. A #1 often has a green handle and #2 red, for easy identification. Also, the wood screws often used in electrical work fit a #2 perfectly, which means you can place the screw on the tip of the screwdriver and it stays put, as you push it into the wood. It's much superior to the Phillips in this regard. No Canadian tool box is complete without at least a couple of Robertsons in it. BTW, i am also not a fan of multiple tip drivers.

@davidworks7758

Жыл бұрын

What about torx?

@James_Knott

Жыл бұрын

@@davidworks7758 Robertson was around long before Torx. As has been mentioned, you want Robertson screwdrivers for doing electrical work, as they properly fit the screws. As I mentioned, they make it very easy to drive in wood screws, as you don't have to worry about the screw falling off the tip and they don't slip.

@TheMalibuman79

Жыл бұрын

You're my hero man! Glad another Canuck is here. Phillips head anything is far inferior to robbies. I often wonder how Americans still use it, along with most imperial measurements. (Admittedly, I measure lengths in inches as a go to.) Torx head is my favorite, but thats the mechanic coming out of me. For construction, im an electrician now for 8 years, robertson is the kingmaker. Keep that 🏒 on the 🧊

@jhnoakez

Жыл бұрын

Robertson can also have worn tips sharpened and reshaped in seconds on the bench grinder. Gives you many more years from a worn out red Robbie!

@user-bh6ey1ke4n

Жыл бұрын

@@davidworks7758 Torx would be better for any application, but when you're an outlet manufacturer and have two options of 'make an outlet that requires the customer to use a Torx screwdriver only' and 'make an outlet that could be mounted with any widespread Philips, slotted or Robertson screwdriver' the choice is obvious.

All Canadian DIYers and pros know that Robertson square is the only way to go. Virtually all screws sold in hardware stores here are Robertson only. If a device came with separate Philips mounting screws, they are quickly garbaged in favour of Robertsons.

@skim193

2 жыл бұрын

internet sez there are 6 diff sizes but which one is most common?

@cantech5587

2 жыл бұрын

Personally, I would say that the red (#2) is the most common with the green (#1) coming in a close second. The yellow (#0) is common for trim applications where tiny screws are needed and black (#3), are used for larger applications. I've never come across the smallest orange (#00) or largest brown (#4) before. For electrical work, the screws on the terminals of the device (receptacle or switch) and the screws to mount the device to the box are usually a green (#1). The ground screws are a larger and use the red (#2).

@mraaron1584

2 жыл бұрын

@@cantech5587 getting the driver for the #00 is near impossible i had to buy one direct from the roberston company just to have one for my set cost me like $20 with shipping. the lady in there sales dept said they normally don't sell direct to people but that one is so hard to find that others have contacted in the past to buy. don't think i've ever need to use it though lol.

@haweater1555

2 жыл бұрын

@@mraaron1584 I have seen the orange Robertson #00 in stock at Canadian Tire once years and years ago. Didn't know what the application is for as small precision things that size aren't built here. Perhaps jamming a tiny philips screwdriver in the square would work.

@mraaron1584

2 жыл бұрын

@@haweater1555 the lady from roberston said mostly people who build doll house furniture are the ones contacting them to buy. i've personally never seen anything that used a screw that small and was roberston though.

Old electrician (since retired) here, We didn't have square drives back in the day but relied on a Klein flat blade. That's what we were taught and that's what we used. Fast forward to today I have the Klein # 1 & #2 square drivers for my electrical work and boy do you need that #2 for frozen breaker screws.

@simpleminded5215

Жыл бұрын

Mike you are absolutely correct. I was trained as an electrician’s helper 47 years ago. Worked in the trade for two summers. The electrician took me to the supply house and pointed at the tools I was to buy. One #2 Philips, one small straight bladed screwdriver, one medium straight bladed screwdriver, side cutters, dykes and a 16oz claw hammer. All Klines and cost me a fortune back then.

I use that Milwaukee #1 ECX constantly, one of the best tools in my electricians belt, it definitely provides more & better torque.

The ECX has been fantastic and definitely my go to for circuit breakers especially. You won't go back after using one, especially if you fully understand that the amount of torque applied determines the current the circuit can safely carry and keeping those connections cool under heavy loads. Extremely Important and often ignored!

@ptx3914

2 жыл бұрын

Right. With any of the 4 kinds, I can torque any of them more than they should be, but an ecx bit on a ratchet limited on T handle gets it perfect every time.

@harliethomas1378

2 жыл бұрын

@@ptx3914 Hell yeah, now that's how to do it. I use one of those T handle ratchets with the torque set so I would quit tearing up hose clamps over tightening them!

I agree that the Philips doesn't give much torque, so I follow it up with a 1/4" flat head (Craftsman), always in my tool belt.

@thenson509

2 жыл бұрын

I do this too.

One minor nitpick: Square drive is NOT the same as Robertson. Square drive is that thing you find on a ratchet. A cube-like protrusion that fits into the back of a socket. Roberston, by contrast, is slightly tapered so that it can be press-fit into a screwhead. This taper provides numerous benefits. Primarily, it firmly attaches the screw to the bit enabling you to orient the drill in any direction, even directly downwards, without needing to hold the screw. It just stays attached. Very handy for one handed driving of screws where your other hand is busy holding the work-piece. (You know your Robertson is worn out when screws stop sticking) The other big benefit of the tapered tip is that it makes the tip of your tool smaller than the hole in the screw head meaning it's much easier to insert the tool. Of course, these days, there's lots of cheap screws out there that have ignored the important taper feature of a true Robertson so I guess those screws are what one would call 'square drive'. Sure, you can use a Robertson to drive those 'square' screws but it's the same kind of experience you get using a Phillips to try and torque down a Pozidriv.

It’s a Robertson #6 in Cabinetshops in Canada you honestly don’t want to see how small a number 4 is. #8 is standard size (referred to as square #2) and #10 is used for patio tables or door hinges. Basically there is more sizes here since we are metric :). The patent for Robertson is tapered so it really really grips too. The square 1,2,3 sold in big box stores doesn’t even come close.

Klein makes the same hybrid. Awesome tool. Get the 16 in one with the retractable driver. Hands down perfect

I use an R1 for receptacles, switches, etc. and an R2 for operations in the distribution panel. I wasn't aware of the Milwaukee ECX drivers. They look great. Thanks for the tip. BTW I have sets of gunsmith-grade screwdrivers that are far superior to common ones. The flat-blade drivers are hollow ground so they are much less likely to slip out than inexpensive ones. One set is from Brownell's, the other from Chapman Tools. I recommend both brands.

I've always used a Philips. I did not know that the terminal was designed for a Robertson! And, I never knew about the ECS. thank you!

What if the screw head was made to be compatible with multiple types of screwdrivers? The screwdriver that fits solidly with more contact surface is going to be better. I prefer the Phillips because it doesn't slip, though there does seem to be more leverage with the wider flat head. Cool to know that the hybrid does exist!

@aiTheVulture

Жыл бұрын

That's _standard_ PH/SL2 screw. There is _standard_ PH/SL2 screwdriver for it. There is four type of screw/bit in that standard: PH/SL1 PH/SL2 PZ/SL1 PZ/SL2

I once built a ground level patio deck for some friends just across the border in Vermont. When I started to assemble the deck , using Coated Deck screws from Canadian Tire, they were amazed that these even existed! They had never seen a Robertson screw, never mind a Robertson Screwdriver.! After they saw how much easier it was to load and torque into the wood, I had more than a few of them get me to “smuggle” in the Canuck contraband. 👍🇨🇦

@Dhalin

2 жыл бұрын

Down here, we call them "Allen Wrenches" (or at least the little metal tools to turn screws with square holes). We also have drill bits that fit those, too. You frequently also see them (albeit it larger sizes) on office chairs, if you buy one that you gotta assemble at home. The only difference is that they don't have the slot for a flathead screwdriver, it's just a square hole with an octagon head for a ratchet socket.

@francoisfortin3696

2 жыл бұрын

@@Dhalin Alllen and Robertson are not the same.

@TorontoLS

2 жыл бұрын

@@Dhalin Allen wrenches have a hexagonal, not square, cross-section.

@Dhalin

2 жыл бұрын

@@TorontoLS Weird. I've seen them with square bits too.

@psdaengr911

2 жыл бұрын

@@Dhalin Allen wrenches are hexagonal socket wrenches.

The Milwaukee 13-in-1 includes both square drive and ECX bits, so it has both of your top choices. I got it on a Home Depot Deal of the Day for like $9.

@allent555

2 жыл бұрын

Now if they only had a very small driver to releasing the quick connects

I didn't know there were any other type of screwdiver other than Robertson. Thanks for showing me how ineffective the other drivers are compared to the square drivers. Thanks

I bought a #1 Robertson screw driver at Canadian Tire in Winnipeg and put it in my electrical tool bag. I use it for any and all work on electrical outlets since it doesn't slip out of the screw like slotted or Phillips head screw drivers. I also have #1,#2, and #3 Robertson bits for another screwdriver I own that has interchangeable bits.

I've always used Philips, but I've always had a flat-head, if I needed it. I knew about Robertson in general, but I didn't know they were commonly used for outlets -- I need to look at those screw heads more closely! The ECX looks nice, and I'll see if I can find some bits for that for use in my multi-driver. Thanks!

@censusgary

2 жыл бұрын

Robertson fasteners are much more common in Canada than they are in the USA. Robertson, the inventor and original manufacturer, was Canadian and set up his operation there. Due to industrial politics, most U.S. manufacturers adopted Phillips screws instead of Robertsons (the Robertson design actually predated Phillips, star drives (such as Torx), and virtually all the others except the slot-headed screws).

@shubinternet

2 жыл бұрын

@@censusgary -- I've known about the history of Robertson drive for years, but what I was not aware of is that they are commonly used on light switches. Maybe I haven't looked at enough light switches in the last few years....

@fromagefrizzbizz9377

2 жыл бұрын

@@shubinternet In Canada, you ALWAYS see robertsons on "commodity" electrical devices (outlets, switches, most breakers, panels). Been that way for at least 2 decades, if not 4.

@shubinternet

2 жыл бұрын

@@fromagefrizzbizz9377 -- whereas I live in the US (well, Texas) and this is a new thing for me to see on the outlets down here. Much appreciated! Thanks!

@fromagefrizzbizz9377

2 жыл бұрын

@@shubinternet took you long enough, Robertson’s were invented in 1908! 🤪 As my dad (a professional civil engineer) used to say, Phillips screws should be outlawed and selling flat drive screws should be a capitol crime punishable by death 🤪 In Canada the only “commodity” Phillips screws you see are drywall screws. Phillips and flat are more often seen in specialty stuff, some smaller bolts and brass. Allen heads have always been around. Torx is making big inroads now, especially in wood screws, and after driving 10’s of thousands of Robertsons, my new bulk purchases are always torx, and I’m not alone in that.

As a Canadian for the longest time I didn't reolize the square drive (robirtson) was not used much down south but I think it's ideal because it doesn't cam out like phillips does. But there is also the Japanese phillips that solves that problem as well. Called JIS #1 (Japanese industrial standard) which people who work on Honda or yamaha equipment will know about or Pz #1 which is pozidriv which is phillips but solves camout problem as well. Small difference in design but huge difference in performance especially on those stuck screws

@P_RO_

2 жыл бұрын

It seems you and the JIS folks may not understand that the Phillips is supposed to cam out as a means of preventing over-tightening of the fastener by design. If you want the fastener to be tighter you are supposed to use a different design meant to achieve that; there's plenty to choose from. I'm an American, but I agree with you that for most applications Robertson is better, yet it has it's own design weaknesses too. The reason it never got popular outside of Canada is greed- Robertson wanted more $$$ to license it's use by manufacturers in the US than Phillips wanted for his system, so factories took the cheaper option since it was adequate. Once things got established it tended to stay that way because everybody then had those particular tools. A Canadian by the name of Witold Rybczynski wrote a book called "One Good Turn" explaining the history of the screw and the reason for the many types we have, it's really good reading and I highly recommend it.

@codylucente

2 жыл бұрын

@@P_RO_ I'm aware it was designed that way on purpose. We were talking about this specific application where you need more torque i felt these were valid options for our specific application. I mean no you shouldn't just start over tightening all the screws in your engine bay or something.

@goodun2974

2 жыл бұрын

@@P_RO_ , The History Guy channel did a video about screwdriver history a few years ---- it is still his most-watched video!

@goodun2974

2 жыл бұрын

A hint for those unfamiliar: the JIS Phillips variant usually has a small divot or dot in the screwhead to signify that it is a JIS standard screw head. You can't normally buy those special screwdrivers in a local hardware store and the primary manufacturer is Vessel, however, the Milwaukee impact rated Philips drive bits fit them quite well, much better than Dewalt or Makita bits (and there is one particular dewalt Phillips drive bit that has a pointier tip and thinner vanes than most, and doesn't seem to fit any screw I've tried it on,). Japanese built stereo equipment usually has JIS screws.

@P_RO_

2 жыл бұрын

@@codylucente A Phillips is the wrong tool for this specific application and if you try to do anything with the wrong tool you often end up with an avoidable failure. If you can't or won't do a job correctly then you shouldn't be doing it. The difference between an amateur and a pro isn't so much in doing a job the right way because both can do that, but in understanding why it needs to be done that way which only the pro does. Knowing why is worth a lot more than only knowing how.

KISS. a correctly sized flathead works great. I have also slightly took the tip off a phillips and it fits much better into the slot. I could never understand why someone would overwhelm themselves with extra tools when it is not needed. I work in the maintenance field and have done home repairs since i was about 13. Dont buy a new tool just because its new.

Well, I'm a bit late to the party but I ordered a multi-bit and an ECX1 today. Thanks and great article.

I am amazed at the most serious issue in this video: The Phillips screwdriver has no business here at all for the simplest of reasons - the screwhead is not Phillips - it is a combo of Robertson (slightly tapered square) and flat blade (straight slot) and NOTHING else. The Phillips screwdriver would only be considered here by people who typically use a totally incorrect screwdriver on screwheads.

@diggoran

2 жыл бұрын

Considered by people who think there are only two types of household screwdriver: Philips and flathead. Any other weird screws (like Torx) are for proprietary tech that is trying to keep you out. I remember the first time I saw a square hole in a screw was when I bought my first house, and I thought how the hell am I gonna unscrew this extremely stripped Philips screw? That’s when I noticed it wasn’t damaged at all, and then googled “square screwdriver” and found it. Now I see the value of the square bit, but I had to discover it on my own. My parents didn’t expose me to this during my time living with them.

@Lord_zeel

2 жыл бұрын

I think the vast majority of people (in the US at least) simply never learned that anything other than Philips and Flat exist. And even if they know that others exist, they might not recognize one in the wild.

@MarcusTheDorkus

Жыл бұрын

It's cut for straight, Robertson, and Phillips. The head is cut with two crossing slots and then deeper down is where the Robertson driver engages. If it wasn't meant for Phillips, then the crossed slot wouldn't be necessary. That crossing slot is actually what obscures the fact that a Robertson bit works in there. If you didn't have that crossing slot, you'd see two sharp corners across from each other.

Hey! I just discovered your videos a few weeks ago and have watched quite a few of them now. The very first one I watched was one where you mentioned using the Milwaukee ECX - I had never seen this before. It's a game changer!!! I went that same afternoon to my local hardware store but they did not carry it, so I found one on Amazon and received it the next day. The one I got is actually a Klein 15-in-1 ratcheting that includes the ECX #1 and #2. I am in the middle of replacing all of our outlets and switches and I cannot believe how amazingly perfect this bit works - for the past 20 years or so I have been using a combo of Phillips and flathead to get best results. ***Bonus: it ALSO is perfect for doorknob screws! THANK YOU for introducing me to my new favorite tool!!!

@EverydayHomeRepairs

2 жыл бұрын

Awesome, thanks for the feedback Beth. I didn't know about the doorknob tip 👍

@kodiham7532

2 жыл бұрын

Do you have a link?

@bethcoale7971

2 жыл бұрын

@@EverydayHomeRepairs - well the #1 combo bit was perfect for all the doorknob replacements I just did at my daughter's new house, but they weren't Schlage or Kwikset (I will provide an update if/when I find out the brand) - I just changed a few knobs at my house and they were just straight Phillips. I do wiring far more than doorknobs so doesn't matter much. I love ratcheting drivers and having lots of bits to swap out and this particular handle is super comfortable for me and the bit storage in the handle does NOT unscrew while using! - so I'm still in love with it :)