Welcome to my channel, where we explore and enjoy as many aspects of jet engines as we are allowed access to.
My name is AgentJayZ, I live in Jet City, and I am equal parts Noise, Heat and Speed.
I was born on the Island of Misfit Toys, and in an earlier time, I discovered the heatilon.
If you feel especially at home here ...
Of course you are slightly strange, because you understand and have an affection for inanimate machinery.
But the socialites and politicians of the world mock what they know they can never understand.
...That the creations of technology... human technology... have a beauty, an art... a life of their own.
You, being one of those people who understand and appreciate this, are forever tasked with swimming upstream against the blindness of the mainstream.
... Welcome to the Machine...
...from Orenda 14 pt.3
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Jet wash alley has a real trench in it when it used to be flat so either the back of the engine was dropped or jet wash alley was raised but neither of those happened so I wonder
If the LM 1500 will not start without the VSV's In the proper position why was there a successful start
THANK YOU AGENT JAYZ
Some info on fuel tank boost pumps in the CT-133 Silver Star to detail the challenges in providing positive fuel pressure to the engine driven fuel pump on the venerable Nene 10. There are multiple interconnected fuel tanks in the wings featuring electrically driven boost pumps. Tip tanks use air pressure from the engine to transport fuel to the system. All feed into the fuselage tank behind the cockpit. The fuse tank has an electrically driven double ended centrifugal pump to supply positive pressure to the engine driven fuel pump. The reason it is double ended is to ensure positive fuel pressure under negative G conditions such as when the aircraft is flown upside down or during other aerobatic manoeuvres resulting in negative G. Not something the average airliner typically contends with.
Thanks
Congratulations Blade-X team and Jetcity for a successful set of tests
We are only at the beginning...
@@AgentJayZ It will be interesting to see how these new advanced blades go and what other low hanging fruit they find worth investigating on the engine. As you said in the last video, even a 1% improvement is a very big deal. If a blade does let go, I hope the team still share the findings and are not deterred.
Didn't see anything that looked like a dyno in the video. Where was the power being dissipated?
Like every LM1500, we put a jet nozzle at the end, and measure pressure rise ahead of it.
❤️🔥
Great test work as always at Jet City. So just thinking I know Dangerous!. Will a complete first stage of these “Forged Carbon Composite blades wind up in Southern part of Florida to do some ground runs and just maybe a flight at subsonic speed then MACH Two !! Be interesting if GE and Lockheed keep the ball rolling on this. I have kept the names out to protect the innocent ME and Jet City.
I was looking, but didn't see, and if you said, i missed it, but was there a nozzle on the back of that engine? Or was all that blast and fury just a straight pipe dumping out hot gas?
The normal LM1500 test nozzle, which is non-variable and sized to be at what would be called military if it was on a J79. A straight pipe would be far less noisy, because the exhaust would not be moving as fast.
I don't think you'll run the engine long enough to see wear by the blade roots on the disk. And even if you did, I doubt they would let you talk about it. But I'd really like to know how much worse the the wear of carbon fiber-on-metal is. Carbon fibers are crazy abrasive. On the other hand the blades being much lighter works in their favor. And I'm sure they manufactured the blades without fibers being right at the surface. Still, interesting.
BLADE-X! I still cant find any info or contact information on them on the web! Can you post a link to their site?
Maybe in the next video. You know the old saying: serious inquiries only.
@@AgentJayZ Oh im serious! I design and manufacture forged composites for a living. They are a bonded sub-assebly in our prepreg carbon products
amazing
The engine must of been pretty nervous
JayZ, when this technology is proven will it bring engines back from the dead? What aftermarket parts are needed the most?
Engines that are still being used, but have parts which are no longer available, could benefit from this technology.
Geez o Peets! After all that…I imagine those CF blades were DIZZY!
I assumed VSV position was scheduled as a function of either mass flowor through the fuel system. But you mentioned you ran them full open and then almost closed. Do you have the ability to manually control VSV position or do you just lock them into the desired position?
This is a special setup, created by us building the system with full manual control of the Variable Geometry system. Engines are never run this way except in experiments like this.
G'day Jay, My first, long-form, Comment failed to post, apparently. One seems to have enquired Too Deeply... Where are those Two Corporate Suits In your Frame Coming from, and who pays them to commission your Research - Testing World-leading radical revolutionary lightweight Composite Compressor-Blades, for High-Performance Jet Engines...? I was only at the Hairy Leading-Edge of anything Aeronautical a couple of times, as a teenager working on Replicas of a Sopwith Pup & Fokker Triplane at the first "Antique Airfielde" in Oz..., and the time CASA mandated my improved Procedures for safely Aerotow-Launching Rogallo Hang-Gliders (1997 & '98...). Happily enough, I never got involved with anything which a Professional Worrier-ist might regard as being any kind of a "National Security" matter ; like, oh - a way to build lighter, more fuel-efficient, and more powerful High-Thrust Jet Engines..., for all types of High-Performance Aircraft..., perhaps. Tread Carefully, Olde Bean...; If ye might take a Fool's advice... Such is life. Have a good one. Stay safe. ;-p Ciao !
Fascinating. 17:17 I think the engine was desiged to start in more than one enviroment.
It's designed to start in any combination of environmental conditions at or above sea level. You need to read about axial compressor design, what compressor stall is, and the various types of anti-stall technology before saying anything. I have videos on all those subjects. Then you will realize that your comment does not really have a meaning.
I am assuming that you couldnt just put a set of these on an existing rotor due to the drastic weight differential? Swaping out a set gives you some integrity metrics but wouldnt you need a lighter rotor also?
The rotor needs to be balanced to less than 1 gram-inch. Balancing the assembly assures that. Your second sentence I do not understand.
THANK YOU AGENT JAYZ
Designing compressor blades was/is my job, so $0.02 from me: Let's set up some terminology first - airfoil HOT shape is what the aerodynamics engineer wants to have in the spinning (at design speed), heat-soaked engine, a design intent of sorts. Airfoil COLD shape is what you manufacture. COLD shape is different to HOT shape as the airfoil undergoes deformation (imagine 3 deformation components: lean to the side, tilt fwd/back, and untwist) under centrifugal and thermal loads as the engine spins and heats up. So you start from HOT and go backwards to determine what your COLD shape should be, and then send that to manufacturing. Here lies the problem -> how much will your airfoil lean, tilt and untwist depends on RPMs and material characteristics (stiffness and density). In this case, I imagine the guys reverse engineered the original metal COLD shape and recreated the blade in a radically different material. You see the catch now -> You will end up with a different (not intended) HOT shape as you spin up. The performance will suffer (especially when you change the entire blade kit, not just one). To correctly switch to a new material, the starting COLD shape will be different (needs to be determined in a bit involved analysis), but at speed the HOT shapes will match between different materials. Regards!
Turbo: Stage one blades are surrounded by, and eat, inlet air. The air they move gets its first bit of compression when it passes through the stage one stators right behind these blades. The only time they might get warm is when they encounter the heated air exhausting from the IGVs when the anti ice system is on. Usually, the anti ice system is not present on industrial engines. A bit of a special case, as all downstream stages work on progressively higher temperature air.
@@AgentJayZ It seems that the comment oversimplified the aspect of “hot vs cold” as hot terminology in this case is more about “physical deformation” due to loading more than temperature (which is my interpretation of the wording). This reminds me of the time that a saw a test article at a national laboratory of an aerodynamic control surface that was machined into the “distorted configuration” out of a stiffer material for testing in a supersonic wind tunnel. The person that was my “family guide” explained what it was from. The aerodynamic control surface “fin” was amazingly distorted as exhibited in its “static but actually dynamic form”. Presumably the composite compressor blade will “deform & twist” differently than the metal one if both are of the same geometry and thus changing the angle of attack and performance. Also, how are the test going to validate the vibrational characteristics of the composite to metal interface at the root? If wear, damping and fatigue life could be issues, are not coatings (and compatibility with lubricants if used) have to be validated (lots of test)? Also, could not airfoil erosion be an issues with the softer composite materials (don’t some composite fan blades have leading edge metal protection)? This seems like an interesting project, hope backers are liberal with stock options.
Rejected. Anybody who wants to use words like hot and cold, but have special meanings to those words MUST supply their special definitions. If not, hot means hot, and cold means cold. Jeez. Get the hell outta here. If you didn't know I hate Jargon, then you know it now. Also, I'm just the photographer, as explained before, and in the video.
Geez, I wish all of my first tries and proof of concepts went as well as this demonstration did. Good job Jay. You may have the only photography record of a test like this in the entire world. I'm glad you were there and that you were able to share it. Thank those people for that. In this context let's substitute "at rest" for cold and "at work." for hot and not even think about it anymore.
Thanks, joncarroll8662, but I stand by my vehement reee-jection of substituting any word meanings without notice. That is jargon, and jargon is garbage. "Oh, well... you're just supposed to know that". Get stuffed.
Very cool, thanks!
Wouldn't you eventually do some kind of confidence run, say for at least 24 hours?
This is video from the first two days of what I expect to be a long, careful development program. Didn't I mention that? Yes, eventually these will be tested for months of full power running.
BUNNY LUCK for more future improvements! (~_^)-b
It seems to have a notable audio signature difference with the VSV full open... That or else some internal gearing was making odd sounds... But that could be my imagination...
It was making a warbling sound. I attribute that to some stages running much closer to a stall condition.
@@AgentJayZ Okay, so it was probably just an effect of the air and nothing to do with gears [we hope?]. Did it only make that sound during that one part of that one test? I would assume that if it never made the sound again [or only under those specific conditions] then all is well. How often do they check the oil on those machines?
What gears? There are no gears inside the engine. There is an angle drive up front, which turns a radial driveshaft, which turns the gearbox below the engine, to which the starter and oil pump are attached. that external gearbox hangs below the engine.
That paint joke had me rolling(tehe)
Wasn't it too dangerous to go close to the engine while at high RPM to disengage the hose? What if the composite blades failed at that moment?
That was idle, and she was not directly in front of the engine. It's true that it was not really necessary to disconnect the starter hose, so we stopped doing that.
@@AgentJayZ Do you think that the engine cover would handle a blade structural failure? I've seen an A380 engine explosion test but what about the J79 cover? Is it tested for structural integrity in the unlikely possibility of a blade failure?
The compressor case is designed to contain a steel blade failure. It would have no problem with containing one of these.
Coooooooool. It ran without catastrophic failure. I can see this tech finding its way into electricity turbines in 2 years. Don't think it would be viable to get legacy engines with plastic blades an airworthy certification thou.
How many 100’s of millions of dollars do you want to spend on this ‽ Besides, don’t you think that the jet engine designers at the big name companies have just overlooked this concept ‽ Probably grahamj9101 would have some insight into these topics.
Another failure point: Carbon fiber tends to corrode certain metals when in direct contact with them for a long period of time.
Nobody is asking for a list of potential problems. I am only assuming that the engineers on this project already have one. If you think you have knowledge that could help these engineers, who have experience with designing high stress carbon fiber components... you should contact them.
@@AgentJayZ what’s the company’s name?
It's all right there/here right in front of you. Smart guy like you shouldn't need my help.
@@AgentJayZ lol I don’t see the name of the manufacturer. Btw, I’m not sure why you’re taking this personal, I’m just expressing an opinion as someone with some experience with carbon fiber and metals.
@@xBIGMUSCLExI am also curious to know how they intend to deal with galvanic corrosion. Perhaps It is possible whatever mitigations are outside of the scope of this preliminary proof loading.
Wow this is truly amazing, as you adequately put AgentJayZ, "plastic in a jet engine".
Congratulations on a successful test.
As an AE, this is some freaking cool Sh*t!!
Just a caution, the Titan made 14 dives to the Titanic before its carbon fiber hull failed. I’m sure the developers are aware of this.
All of these submarine comments are irrelevant. Just go away.
How are they combating galvanic corrosion?
As these seem to be developed for stationary engines, I'd guess there's better protection from moisture (rain, snow, etc) then an aviation engine. So likely less concern about galvanic aspects.
Please explain this type of corrosion with regard to carbon fiber & epoxy? Is this that different compared to a composite fan blade?
Cool! Always nice to see new tech bring additional efficiency to older devices. Regarding the sacrificial engine... I would think that a carbon fiber blade would do a bit less damage to the vanes and blades downstream if it were to break off. Is there any test data to show how bad it is?
Hopefully we will never get that data. We've seen many a destroyed compressor when a piece of metal goes in. We usually replace the entire rotor, and all of the stators.
Fascinating! Sharing this with us is very generous of you and very much appreciated.
Well, Carbon Fiber is supposed to be super strong in tension, I can see it working. I wonder how the dovetail flats will hold up as they would be in compression.
wonder if they can embed? overmold? not sure the correct term here..some metal in that area if wear becomes as issue.
@@Live.Vibe.Lasers I wonder how the same issue is dealt with on the composite fan blades, or to say it a different way, how are those type of fan blades mounted to the hub?
G'day JZ, Fascinating, Very very fascinating. I was wondering about the Compressor version of the "Fir-Trees" holding the Blades to the Hub... I also wondered why you didn't run 4 Test Blades in two Pairs which would have been 180° apart from each other - eliminating the need to add Fudge-Weights to compensate for the Out-Of-Balance Radial Asymmetry (?). Were those two Suits Naturalised Canadians, Canadians born to naturalised Migrants, Or is the DemoKratic Republick of Kanadia selling itself And renting the Test Facilities out to Unkle Spam's Designated NEXT Enemy (AnyMe?) Of CHOICE....; The better to build Shiny Bright New and Super LIGHT, Carbon Fandangled Fibre-forged Helical Compressor-Blades for the Glorious, Long to reign victorious, PLAAF Sky-Fightery Hairygoplanes, all currently a' buildin' and amassing, and all lined-up, Ready and waitin' to go out and Repossess and Liberate the (long lost, misguided) Island Province of Formosa...? Here in Oz, In our SuperMax Dungeon in Goulburn, wasting away in Solitary Confinement..., Our Spooks are holding an Ex-Yanqui USMC Harrier-Pilot, who renounced his AmeriKan CitiZenship to become a Rubber-Stamp imprinted "Naturalised (Faux) Ozzie" and tried to make a living flying for himself as a Civilian in Tasmania. After that (predictably) failed, he opened an Advanced Jet-Combat Manouvreing Flight-Training School, in Sooth Effrika... Teaching Chinese "Airline Pilot Cadets" EVERYTHING which Unkle Spam had taught him about how the Yanqui Air Forces have Bin-Practicin' to Defeat the expected Swarms of PLAAF Warplanes When China repossesses Formosa. To cope with the numbers of Students he was pumping through, the cunning little BarSteward Hired an actual mob of miserably recently retired Unemployed discontented and disgruntled British Ex Fighter-Pilots, As his Air-Combat Instructors. All drawn from the legions of Passed-over Time-expired Time-servers, who were summarily Retired - rather than being further promoted, and whose Personnel Record for being trouble-prone had made them clearly unfit for Airline Employment..... The British closed their Legal Loophole, and prosecuted the Brit's who worked for him, and the CIA ordered ASIO to arrest Mister Duggan, Hold him in Solitary Confinement in our SuperMax, and our Courts Ordered him to be Deported back to face the Muzak in the 'MurriKa he Betrayed for Money.... Are you being Well paid to test Radical Revolutionary Lightweight Experimental Chinese Jet Engine Technology ? How are the other 4 Nations' of the celebrated, "5-Eyes Intelligence Community"..., Have to say about what you're all being Proudly Paid to Achieve...? (The "5-Eyes" being Oz, Canadia, Britain, AmeriKa & Kiwiland - English-Squeakers all !). You appear to me To be Sailing perilously close to the Track taken by Bruce Wilson of xjet Channel... The Kiwi who secured a Contract to supply 5,000 cheap Pulsejets to the US Navy, for Target Drones..., and then when the Iranian Government asked to buy some... The silly fool asked his governing Kiwis in Auckland - and they greenlit him to agree to the idea. And when the US Congress heard of that, they SuckCessFully pressured Kiwiland's Tax Department to foreclose on Wilson's old Income Tax Debts, requiring instant settlement rather than payment via installments.... Wilson couldn't raise that money, so he went bankrupt ; and the US Dep't of Defence Contract had a Clause dissolving the agreement if EITHER Party was to go Bankrupt. So the lucrative US Contract evaporated, and he was Bankrupt, and with no Factory to build Pulsejets...; the Iranians were sorry to have bothered him - and the US Navy still shoots down expensive TurboFan-powered Drones for practice, rather than loud cheap Pulsejets from Kiwiland... I suspect that you may be cruising For a bruising, on this particular track. It was all looking good, to me, Until those two tall Chinamen in Suits walked into the Frame... Are you tracking down the same ambitious little road which totally Buggared Bruce's Busyness-Plan, and also put Mister Duggan right where Julian Estrange likes to Fantasize that he may himself be going... (To die in Prison in the USA) ??? Unless their Height betrays a lifetime of being raised in the West - & fed on KFC & Macca's, in Kanadia or the Excited Status of Norte-ArmedmeriKano...(?) ! One worries about you, JZ...; You're so very Target-Fixated on the Technicalities of the Engineering...; that I wonder if you pay sufficient attention to where the Money is coming from..., and to - as Machiavelli put it..., "To determine whom is responsible, whenever anything Unusual occurs...; first Look to see Whomsoever Benefits the most, Therefrom..." Depending on who's actually Funding, & Using..., All this Research, then you-all might yet get to be Lionised..., Or Demonised...(?). All dependant on whom your Paymaster turns out to be, Actuarially...(!). Thyme will tell, I guess. Such is life, Have a good one... Stay safe. ;-p Ciao!
It would probably benefit the developers to employ some engineers and material scientists with forged carbon fiber experience and ask for their recommendations
@@johncarroll8662 They probably do. They would not have gotten to where they are now without some competency. What they probably could use is some technical people that have experience in instrumenting and collecting the relevant data on the dynamic behavior of these blades. MAN has a great youtube video on determining the dynamic motion of compressor blades under test (during surge testing). This is probably a different skill set than an aerodynamicist or a material science specialist. Besides the younger “SUIT” had a reaction that would suggest … Just reviewed the pertinent video where they show “aspects” of the “tip timing system” on their “Blades Asynchronous Vibrations” testing system. They don’t explain very much but a “picture” is worth a thousand words if you have a little background. Funny thing, the video has only had around 20 views in nearly 10 years (and I have watched it a number of times).
Thinking about the "wear" (not wear) on that blade shoulder - could it be burnishing due to a very slight (and I do mean slight) vibration due to the imbalance caused by the different blade "tip" masses? If that's the case I would expect to see it be eliminated on a fully-carbon set. Oh, and the start in the wrong condition - smart as LM1500 are they haven't reached that page in the book!
The rotor was balanced to normal standards.
@@AgentJayZ MAN Energy Solutions has some fascinating youtube videos on their testing of the AR-MAX1 compressor. Particularly interesting was how they could do realtime measurements of the dynamic vibrational behavior of the compressor blades (during surge testing). Seems like it is important to know the dynamics of the blade’s behavior and how it is vibrating in the hub’s slot where it could wear (but some vibrational damping occurs for the metal blades).
They should consider incorporating some carbon fiber or other inherently vibration damping material into the design, then reduce the mass as much as practical to limit the potential for vibrational energy buildup in the structure.
Wew I really thought it would fail. congrats!
14:20 Who are the suits? Blade designers, money people? They seem like they are not from your “neck of the woods”, maybe not even your “neck of the world”.
Was also noticing the suits. Not seen any of them out at the test cell in videos I've watched so far.
How much weight would be saved by replacing all blades with the forged carbon fiber versions? Also, how much does the engine weigh normally?
The bare weight of the LM1500 is about 1750kg. The weight of a single stage 1 blade is (from memory) about 2kg, and the carbon one is about 0.5kg (I'm sure Agent JZ will correct me if I'm too far out). So if all 1st stage blades were replaced that's about a 30kg reduction. But that's only the first stage, and there are about 17 stages - however I doubt that more than the first couple of stages could be replaced due to the temperatures in the latter stages. The engine has a lot of mass that is NOT in the compressor, but is in core, the frame and the power turbine - and these bits aren't being replaced as part of this project. BUT reducing the dynamic mass of the first couple of stages would have a larger effect than doing the same for the final stages, and this might give an improved output power, or a reduced fuel consumption - both desirable depending on the application of the engine.
Doing the math it sounds like 9lbs in first stage.
I guess weight of the engine is not the most important factor here, these are industrial stationary engines beeing used on the ground. But! AFAIK the weight saving for the blades could factor in performance of the engine, but as far as I understood/guessed the difference is in the profile of the blades itself (and I'll stand corrected here at the first hint of me beeing wrong).
All of the stages where the temp is within the capabilities of the material might weigh about 50 lbs. The LM1500 is a little over a ton, and the main rotor is about half of that.
@@darknase What are you even talking about?
🤗🤗🤗🤗💯💯💯💯💯
sounds like a 20th century instrument of some sort
I guess, there is no way to stop this thingy in 40 feet … 😂
Not without some sort of structure that will wreck the boat. Most of the boats do not have a reversing nozzle, as is fitted to recreational jet boats. At high power it will stop the boat in several hull lengths.
@@AgentJayZ Jesus! So it’s Like a kamikaze on water then! Be careful out there with this mambo-dingo! Awesome videos as always! Thx!
I cant wait for the next one!
Many years ago I interviewed at a company that made first stage fans for the engines for a Learjet. They made most of it out of carbon fiber but the leading edge had an inset piece of a very high nickel stainless steel. It was so ductile it was hard to cut. They actually modified a paper cutter to cut the stuff because ordinary tin snips would just smear it. I suspect you're going to need to do the same on this project at some point. I seem to recall that the alloy was something like 15% nickel, which is a huge amount of nickel for a stainless steel.
I think the RR composite blades has a titanium leading edge. But an industrial engine runs on highly filtered air so I don't thing abrasion from dust and dirt is a bit issue
@@fuzzy1dk Even with up to 99.7 percent inlet filter efficiency, atmospheric contaminants will erode compressor blades, corrode turbine blades and increase the frequency of washes. It is a very real issue with terrestrial power plants.
Hello, i was wondering if you know where the engine for the Dutch F-104G D-8114 has gone? 😊
Last I heard, the Dutch government will not allow it to enter the country. The external gear cases are made of alloys containing trace amounts of thorium. They have a zero tolerance for any "nuclear radioactive materials".
And every time someone drops a screw into a turbine shaft, a disney princess is born.
AgentJayZ, do you know if those blades are thermoset (epoxy resin) or thermoplastic (PEKK, PAEK, etc)? In the composites industry today thermoplastics are very much the new hotness because they can generally take more heat and are much faster to produce than thermosets (if you can reliably produce them). It is hard to tell via a video, but they look like a close compression molded discontinuous fiber thermoplastic part, probably with a continuous fiber reinforcement in the middle, which is in many ways an even cooler thing than 'just' a carbon fiber compressor blade. If that is the case, then those things really are bleeding edge technology. Very very cool, thank you for showing us.
I don't know those details, but maybe the producers will want to answer your question...
Very interesting information. Seems like there are useful options that could provide a lot of parameters to play with.