GM's truck ordering.... "Why make it simple when we can make it complex."

It is a down rate shame these trucks get more expensive and then they take more stuff off the trucks that you cannot get. I am so happy I got my dream truck in 2017 a 1794 loaded tundra with the TRD off-road package luxury and off-road capability all in one truck. Plus a beautiful V-8 engine not the crap Toyota is putting in their trucks now. It has a 10.5 inch ring gear. With a 4.30 axle ratio this thing is like a three-quarter ton truck axle. I love this generation tundra it is built like a tank.

This doesn't seem strange? Most off-road packaged trucks have reduced towing and payload? Look at the Ram Rebel...its numbers are awful. Power Wagon? Lol...

@crewdawg2008

Жыл бұрын

Yes they do, largely because of the extra weight added by the 4 wheel drive components taking up some of the weight capacity.

@jaro360

Жыл бұрын

Taller and softer suspension packages typically lead to reduced towing and payload numbers. Nothing new. Physics.

@wd9581

Жыл бұрын

My rebel has a towing capacity of 11,300 lbs. I also have the 4 corner air suspension. Payload is a bit low, at 1400, but it's rather heavy with all the options. I want to order a at4, but need the 4lo. Should be doable to combine the packages.

@beltran091387

Жыл бұрын

Do you know why?

@Snappydadshoes

Жыл бұрын

@@beltran091387 Rhetorical question. I'm very aware as to why.

Grumpy rant here. Who in GM thought it was a good idea to make a single speed transfer case should be swatted with a heater hose by us truck guys. He should get one more swatt from the penny pinchers in the company having the extra effort to develop, and include two separate 4x4 drives for assembly. Love the videos Tim!

Hey! Great video, I have been ordering trucks for SMP for about 7-8 years now and this has never changed. The main reason why would have to be the gas filled RANCHO suspension/shocks that can not handle the added weight of the payload/trailer once you add the max trailering. They have also changed the availability of the max trailer with the 5.3. You now have to choose the 3.0 or 6.2 to add the (NHT)max trailering. Now I am not saying this is the 100% reason but this is what I have been told over the years in sales and ordering.

@PlayWaves1

Жыл бұрын

You can still get the NHT package with the 5.3l on LT, RST, and LTZ trims.

Tim, you don't need the "max tow". You should be able to add factory braker controller and tow mirrors as separate options to any other trim. Max tow is silly on a half ton, without it your truck is still rated to tow 9000+ pounds which is more than what a half ton should be towing if it's an RV. You also can't get 4LO on the 2.7 turbo which is the real head scratcher.

That's crazy! I've thought about dropping back down to a 1/2 ton, from my 3/4 ton.. That would be a deal breaker for me!

Thanks for this video Tim, it’s fall 2023 and we are looking to update our 2007 Silverado 5..3 that has Z71 and the trailer package, 4.10 gears. This has finally explained why I can’t option out a truck as we would like. Love the chrome bumpers on the LT trim, not too sure about painted bumpers. Can anyone comment how they stand up over time. Our ‘07 chrome is perfect, pleasure to wash chrome.

Tim - I want to see the video of the truck! I ordered the exact same truck, mine is coming hopefully before Christmas

I can understand why you can't get the Z71 package and the Max Tow Package on the same truck, because the shocks, and probably the tuning of the rear springs, are different. But it is annoying that you don't have the option for a 2 speed transfer case with out the Z71 package or the High Country trim.

I discovered the same thing just the other day when trying to build a Duramax 2023. Very frustrating that Chevy doesn't allow any off-road packages when using the Max towing package. They need to change this!!

I just picked up (pardon the pun) a 2022 Silverado Standard Box Crew Cab 4x4 Z71 RST with the 6.2L. Great truck at a great price.

I understand the reason for it as the offroad z71 package adds softer suspension vs the max tow adds stiffer suspension. What is needed though is a version for the off road trims. IE, I have a Silverado 2022 ZR2. I do tow with it and I'd like to add a winch at some point. I also have an upgraded stereo. I had no way to add the higher 220 amp alternator to my truck from the factory. Offroad trucks should diffentily have the option for the high output alternator. There was also no other option gear ratio. 3.23 is the only option. Again for offroad truck the option to select a lower gear ratio for towing often or even for larger heavier tires makes sense to me.

This is why my next truck will be a high country. Currently have a 2020 3.0 duramax with diesel off road package. I need the two speed transfer case but also need to be able to tow more than 10k.

I use 4 wheel low when I am moving my travel trailer around the yard. Or when I have a heavy load on my utility trailer and backing it into the backyard uphill. It’s just easier on the transmission when moving a heavy load over rough terrain or into a tight spot. Pulling a heavy load of logs out of the woods and over rough terrain.

@donhappel9566

Жыл бұрын

Exactly. There are many times you would use low range and max tow capacity but not necessarily need the minimal extra off-road abilities of the Z71. (small lift and some tin skids?....aftermarket can do more for less here) My '22 3.0 LT work truck has to occasionally tow 8500 lbs; I'd have liked a low range (was shocked you could even get a 4x4 truck without one - nice move GM) and low would come in handy getting to/from the trailhead just on dirt roads pulling the crawler, or pulling up a slick/steep boat ramp. Or yes, just moving the trailer around a tight yard/drive with hills. Looks like the real problem here is not that you can't get max tow and Z71 together, but that you can't get a real transfer case unless you get the Z71.

Agree with @tigerjeebs5048, I bought the truck a daily and long haul tower not as an off road vehicle. Difficult to have real comfortable towing and off-road in one. I am happy Chevy did it this way

I had ordered a, LT Trail Boss (sand color)with diesel and wanted max tow, not happening they said and ordered it w/o max tow. So, changed to RST with diesel for light towing, again no 4 Lo with max tow (3.73 gears/HD springs). I said forget it, bought gladiator rubicon diesel (3.73 gears instead of 4.10, but okay) and it does have 4 LO with fr/rear lockers too, I admit it gives up some luxury items, but more fun to drive on and off road !

Looks like to me GM is trying to phase out a 2speed tcase. Maybe they will limit it to the AT4 or Trailboss pkgs eventually? That would make a lot of people upset.

Live in Texas and have a 2022 GMC 1500 SLT 6.2 liter and 3.42 rear end with Max tow (13000) and 2 speed transfer case (4Lo) Purchased my truck in January 2023 and owned my truck for less than two weeks when I saw your video. I didn't realize 1 speed transfer case even existed. Once I saw your video I freaked out and rushed outside to verify but I got lucky with my purchase.

@SULLIEDASP

5 ай бұрын

I'm not sure but if it's a Texas addition it's 13,500

Okay so sounds like the issue is simply that they took away the two-speed transfer case for most trims. I think I was confused by the max trailer package inclusion. It is a shame that in order to get the two-speed xfer you have to get an offroad specific model (or High Country).

I test drove a Chevy 1500 4wd 2.7L turbo. The truck was nice. But no 4LO was a deal breaker. In icy conditions conditions on hills, I prefer 4LO. I have other vehicles for offroad 4 wheeling. But icy roads, on a hill, with a wind, the antilock brake computer gets confused. And 4LO has helped me NOT get in a wreck!!!! My 2003 Ford Explorer gave me the worst experiences ever with anti-lock brakes. But 4LO got me through the situations. And where I needed to go! I do have a 2020 Dodge Durango GT 4wd that the anti-lock brakes are not at all frightening. My 2016 Ram 1500 4wd is fine too. My wife's Ram 2500 6.7L Cummins beast can be a bear on ice. And 4LO is the only thing that makes the trip completeable. Anti-lock brakes are not a good thing at all. Because they get us in more trouble than they prevent trouble. I live in California. And the severe conditions usually only exist for a short distance. But even when I lived in the Denver metro area. I left my high tech vehicle at home during really bad conditions. And drove my vehicle with Detroit Trutrac differentials and low range.

Maybe it changed for the refresh trucks but for 2019-2022 (LTD) the 6.2 engine came standard with the two speed transfer case, regardless of trim or options. And you could get a trailer brake controller as a stand alone option. As for max towing package and Z71 I don’t think you could have ever got that for a Chevy. But the max towing package does more than just raise towing numbers. You get as you mentioned a higher GVWR but you also get a higher RAWR and a physically bigger ring gear.

@tymatt4555

Жыл бұрын

I love my 20 RST 6.2 max tow. It’s a beast. Lower gearing helped when I lifted (BDS 6 in coil overs), and put 37s on it. Great at everything. Ride, tow. Blacked out with no chrome trim.

When I ordered my refreshed 2022, the technology package with supercruise wasn't available in a crew 6.5 box, but you could get it in a crew short box.

I have a 2017 Z71 with a trailer brake controller and 4Lo. I haven’t used either one of those options since I bought it.

I do wish GM was a bit more flexible with their packages. I think there's a lot of truck buyers who'd like to have 4x4 low and the max trailering package along with some of the off-road features like hill decent and the dual exhaust.

I wonder if part of their thinking is that these new transmissions are geared so low that the 2 speed t-case isn't as necessary. I'm guessing these decision makers also never use their trucks outside of their suburban commutes. Growing up my Dad's 1983 S-10 was capable of tractor-like work using 4lo and 1st gear. He had me pulling trees out of the woods in that thing as a kid. Damn I miss that little truck!

@NigelCarlsbadFan70

Жыл бұрын

If only. The 10-speed with a 3.23 in first gear is basically the same overall ratio as the old 6L80 with a 3.73. 3.42 is a little better but nowhere near enough to make up for not having a 2-speed transfer case.

I can understand not having max tow and off-road packages. Not having 4 low option on max tow is ridiculous. Sometimes you need 4 low to get a trailer where you need it.

definitely crazy!! But, FORD is doing the same with the F150 and Max towing...with adding 20" wheels and chrome package mandatory in Lariat trim. Which...IMHO, is ridiculous!!

@ALMX5DP

Жыл бұрын

Lariat can be optioned with different appearance package options, even with FX4 or Max tow.

So I have a High Country 2023 with the LZ0 and max tow package, I have 4 Low but no shields underneath. You are not able to add both Z71 and Max Tow packages together. It makes sense that you can't have the Rancho Shocks and Max Tow packages, like GM said, they have different functions. It was the main reason I bought the High Country over the LTZ.

It not the only miss. How about 24 gallon fuel tank vs. 33 for RAM and 36 for Ford. Wonderful stopping to refuel every two hours when towing.

@ALMX5DP

Жыл бұрын

Every 2 hours? What kind of fuel mileage you get that would necessitate that?

@mikedurling2111

Жыл бұрын

@@ALMX5DP you haven’t towed before have you?

@ALMX5DP

Жыл бұрын

@@mikedurling2111 a dozen times a year or so, why? My response was regarding 24 gallons only yielding the OP maybe 120-150 miles after 2 hours (60-75mph average). If that’s the case, that’s way worse fuel economy than I’ve ever gotten (5-6mpg). Worst I’ve seen is 9-10 mpg on towing trips, which with a 24 gallon tank should net around 3 hours between stops.

Getting that combo (in Canada anyway) appears to be impossible now... I was very excited to see they would be offering the LZ0/NHT combo for this model year, started an order with our local dealer and was also upset about the lack of 4-lo with this option. After a lot of thought I decided that giving up 4-lo for the NHT package would be fine as this truck would be pulling a 5000# enclosed trailer about 60-70% of the time for work on 90% paved or decent gravel roads. Put the order in, dealer calls me a few days later saying GM has now decided to DISCONTINUE the LZ0 / NHT combo and I would have to order it without it or change over to the z71.. would be getting the 4-lo back but I really do not want an offroad package on this thing. 4-lo yes, the rest, no.. not for my needs. Needless to say I am extremely disappointed with GM for yet again dropping a brilliant combo (like their 2.8 colorado) for corporate b.s. reasons.. Been looking at the the Ram tradesman 2500 Cummins now.. for a few more dollars I get everything I need plus cool features like rear air bags, dual alternators and slightly shorter wheelbase (useful for my area). Yes that sweet 30+ hwy mpgs would be awesome but for the work it will be doing, at the end of year the difference is almost neglible. Love GM but man they make stupid decisions sometimes...

Seems pretty logical to me. Offroad package with softer offroad suspension and such for those who want it, but not available with max trailer tow package which needs stiffer suspension or whatever to haul more load. The question is, what is the max payload/towing capacity of a Z71 package versus the max tow?

@denisleblanc4506

Жыл бұрын

Agreed. In addition, that Max Trailering package probably may have trailer sway control that doesn't work well with the 2 speed transfer case when its locked and it might even have something to do with cooling that may be hindered by skid plates. I don't think this is a decision that was made by the bean counters higher up. I think they decided to separate off roading and towing because what makes off roading better might make towing worse or what makes towing better makes off roading worse. The buyer can decide if he needs better off roading or better towing. By doing this you get to have better towing or better off roading and not some middle ground vehicle that isn't especially good at either. Don't get me wrong, I stopped being a GM fan boy a long time ago. But I can understand their reasoning.

@ALMX5DP

Жыл бұрын

@@denisleblanc4506 I made another comment as well, but i think there was too much focus or attention on the max tow package stuff. So looks like 4Lo simply isnt available on anything that isnt an offroad package or the High Country. If so, kinda is a shame that Chevy decided that's the direction they want to go.

@terrencejones9817

Жыл бұрын

9500lbs For My Trailboss. Up to 13 500 for max tow trucks.

@ALMX5DP

Жыл бұрын

@@terrencejones9817 thanks, yeah that's a decent difference. But I'm certainly one to prefer a heavy duty truck if towing nearer to that upper limit. I've towed around 8k with my non-max tow F150 and while it did fine i think if i did any more (or towed it more frequently) even at that weight i'd start to lean 3/4 ton.

@terrencejones9817

Жыл бұрын

@@ALMX5DP My 28' travel Trailer weighs 7600lbs at max load. My Trailboss does fine, the suspension is a little soft in the back, but a well set up weight distribution hitch makes a world of difference. That being said, I wouldn't tow anything larger than this with it.

Hey Tim, good video. Here's a question for you, all the pics I've seen of the new Colorado ZR2 ,I can't see a hill desent button. Hill desent is standard on all GM Z71 or off road models. My question is, did they quit putting it on the Colorado or am I just not seeing it in all the new pics of the upcoming 2023 model??

Chevy Offroad hula-hoop jumping: Select this, minus that, add this, multiply that. Toyota's Offroad hula-hooping jumping (TRD Pro example): Do you want tow mirrors with that?

The Trail Boss can get a trailer brake controller as a separate option.

Tim did you know they’re eliminating Sandstone metallic on the Silverado? I just tried ordering a 2023 Trailboss with Sandstone and I was told it has been eliminated DAMN IT!!

If what you replied in your live feed the other week that the 3.0 was not designed for towing heavy loads so why worry about an increase in towing capacity? I tow a 7500lb travel trailer with mine (rated for 9300lbs)and the only thing it lacks is an effective exhaust brake. The 2.8 and the 6.6 both have decent exhaust brakes but the 3.0 missed the boat on this and while this is not a heavy hauler , a more effect brake would have been a great asset.

@Pickuptrucktalk

Жыл бұрын

That's a solid question. The max trailer package also includes: Increased towing and GCWR Automatic locking rear differential Handling/Trailering Suspension Package Enhanced cooling radiator Revised shock tuning Heavier duty rear springs and increased RGAWR 9.76" rear axle 3.42 axle ratio (gas engine), 3.73 axle ratio (diesel engine) Trailer brake controller

This has been the case since 2019. Only Off road packages get 4 wheel drive low. Z71, X31, Trailboss AT4 all get 4wd low. Everything else is gets the 1 speed Tcase. I wasn't a big fan of the idea at first too. But honestly 4wd isn't used very often, and especially isn't useful on a truck designed for maximum towing. Max towing suspension is not good at offloading in general. I have a Trailboss and my best friend has a Sierra Elevation, my friends GMC has gone everywhere offroad I have with my Trailboss, and we've done some serious offloading. I'll be surprised if your High Country will actually get a 4wd low. I've never seen any High Country with one. Edit: I just tried to build a High Country on the Canadian site. If you try to choose Z71 it removes the Maxtow. Tim you might not actually get 4wd low.

Good video! I was looking at the LT withe the diesel, max trailering package but not being able to have 4 low is a bust for me. Terrain mode is worthless feature if you know how to use your gears. Guess I will be going with the 3/4 tin for sure now. Thanks for the insight on this!

@ALMX5DP

Жыл бұрын

I think there's more to it than just holding a gear. Sounds like everything from different traction control, steering, throttle map, shift pattern and individual wheel braking take place when in that mode.

@donhappel9566

Жыл бұрын

I agree- bought a '22 3.0 LT this year and was shocked at no lo-range. I've never bought a GM before and just assumed EVERY 4x4 had low range standard. Granted, for my work truck application I don't need low and would likely only use it occasionally when pulling my crawler to a trail head or a boat up a slick/steep ramp but it's a huge oversight to not include low range as standard. Does nothing for my over-all impression of the general as a past Ford and Dodge owner. Also agree - all of the electronic gimmicks in the world (call it trail control, terrain mode, crawl control, whatever) are pretty much just that - gimmicks. Any experienced driver will prefer a proper low range and manual lockers over this sort of thing. I believe this is just an easy way to bulk up the standard features list at little/no cost (it's just software using existing ABS hardware) and appeals mainly to new or inexperienced drivers.

@shanebrown2963

Жыл бұрын

@@donhappel9566 ya. I was really leaning toward the 3.0 lt for the fuel mileage, power and torque this little diesel gets. Just can’t be beat in 1/2 ton segment and I think it would of done just fine towing a 29’ 5th wheel. Terrain mode and features like this are just a new inventive so they can charge more for a vehicle. It is useless in my opinion. Just more things that could also go wrong.

@shanebrown2963

Жыл бұрын

@@ALMX5DP I know what it’s suppose to do but it is useless. I would much rather have 4 low. It’s just another way they can charge more

@ALMX5DP

Жыл бұрын

@@shanebrown2963 I think for most it’s fairly sufficient. Won’t work for more experienced or enthusiast minded folks, but they’ll likely get whatever offroad package equipped vehicles anyways.

It would seem to me they are not confident in the strength of the driveline . 4 low more then doubles the stress . Maybe on the High country, the extra profit they make goes toward the chance of warranty payouts .

I believe the reason GM doesn’t let you bundle Z71/X31 with the max trailering package is because they use different sets of shocks for each. I had a 2019 Custom Trail Boss, and it sucked for towing - unless you like porpoising. The off-road shocks are much more bouncy than the trailering shocks. A Z71 is going to be capable of towing most things you would want to, so if you want an off-road truck to occasionally tow with it’s fine. If your main use case is towing, or you have a really heavy trailer, you forgo the Z71 and get a max trailer package. All that being said, they really should make the 2 speed transfer case an option on all trucks, without bundling it into the Z71 package. Regarding the Ford, I wonder if you’re really getting an FX4 suspension setup on an F150 with max trailering, or if you’re just getting a sticker.

@terrencejones9817

Жыл бұрын

The FX4 is a sticker. I had a 2014 5.0L Canadian Spec XT-R package. It had the skid plates, 3.73 axle, largest factory tires , but no FX4. I worked with the Ford parts guys to try to find the FX4 shocks. They are the same. They aren't unique.

@garysarratt1

Жыл бұрын

Z71 has Ranchos. Even on hd trucks. I think the difference with max towing increase has to be springs.

@terrencejones9817

Жыл бұрын

@@garysarratt1 Not all Ranchos are the same either.

@PygmySurfer

Жыл бұрын

@@garysarratt1 NHT has “revised shock tuning” and different springs. Not sure which of those cuts down on the bounce vs. a Z71

@bearfoot100

Жыл бұрын

IMO The Rancho spec shock GM uses are junk. I replaced them with Bilstein 6100's. You can also use the 4600 model. The Bilstein shocks, made a big difference in ride quality. It was worth every penny

I have a 2022 LTZ with a 6.2 and heavy duty towing. I have auto, 2 wheel, 4 wheel high and 4 wheel low. Could not get the Z71 package.

I think back in 21 and 22 (when I was researching), you still couldn’t get Max trailer and off-road in same truck. You had to pick one or the other (or neither).

I had this dilemma when ordering my LT 3.0 max tow package. Ultimately I need the increased towing capacity more than I need 4low. Furthermore, up here in the PNW, the only time I would be using 4low would be up in the mountains on a brush filled, washed out, unmaintained logging road and I have a built up Jeep for that already.

@rodgood

Жыл бұрын

I have a jeep too , but it does not do a good job at hauling a cord of fire wood home, from up the mountain .

@kaivonmortazavi8656

Жыл бұрын

For many this may not be an issue but for others including myself I like to tow my 7K Ib. Trailer, tow a boat and also have used 4L many, many time in ice and snow or while off pavement. Its a shame that one spends $60-$70K or more for a truck but still needs to make compromises on options that really are at the heart of what a 4X4 pick truck is supposed to be all about (tow, payload and true 4X4 capability). You can have a stupid puddle light on any trim but if you want a true 4X4 capability you will have to spend another $5-$10K to get the high country trim to get a truck that can do what a 4X4 pickup truck is supposed t be able to do!!!

@bmxerben

Жыл бұрын

The one thing the 3.0 Max tow package has going for it is the 3.73 axle ratios and the 460 ft-lbs at 1500 rpm. Even without a 2:1 low range, it probably still has as much torque at slow speeds that a gas truck does when in 4low. However, if there was an option to upgrade to the 2 speed tcase I would have done it. I guess I’ll find out soon when I pick it up.

I have a 21 Silverado they told me the same thing I couldn't get Z71 and trailering package

My 21 custom trailboss 5.3 has the 2spd transfer case and the the tow package along with steering wheel controls and automatic braking.

@Pickuptrucktalk

Жыл бұрын

Odd. That isn’t even offered on Chevrolet’s website and Chevy says that doesn’t exist. Apparently you got a unicorn.

@jongom1983

Жыл бұрын

@@Pickuptrucktalk truly I tried to option out for a new truck but it doesn’t come with it anymore. 21s where built different I guess.

That's just down right low lol, plus you don't need 4 low to get groceries.

If you had a lift package after market installed would that possibly void the warranty on some components? If jumping through these hoops for a truck I might find myself looking somewhere else.

I'm not sure exactly how Chevy differs from GMC, but I am assuming they're pretty much the same. I have a 2019 Sierra 1500 SLT with X31 (same as Z71) and the 6.2L. So I do have 2 speed transfer case with hill descent control. I'm curious what the Max Trailer package actually gives you that you cannot add as an option. I have all of the trailering equipment that I need including integrated electronic brake controller? I wonder if max trailer just means they put in a higher rear end gearing and shave off weight certain places in the truck to give you "max trailering" capacity. With the integrated trailer brake controller, I have no problem pulling 9000 lbs even though I don't have max trailer package.

This is a no go for me. If it doesn’t have low range it’s basically an awd. Not that useful off-road

I bought my Sierra new in 2015 and am looking to get a new Sierra. I got so angry at the GM option nonsense (including this 4LO issue and the $1500 forced onstar subscription). I decided to look harder at a Tundra instead. Fortunately for GM, Toyota has screwed the pooch ever more on the 2023 Tundra than GM has on their trucks. A real shame all around.

Way to go GM make customers buy your most expensive trim package just to get 4 low option.

Just one more reason to step up to a HD. They are slowly neutering the half tons and burdening them with too many things to try and increase “safety” and gas mileage. You can get Z71 in a HD with a proper transfer case and it will tow and haul a lot more than any half ton regardless of package.

@ALMX5DP

Жыл бұрын

Agreed, if you want or have the need to really tow 10k+ loads, i think just stepping up to a 3/4+ ton truck is the way to go. Shame the two-speed transfer case on 1500s is no longer the standard 4wd setup, but I rarely use mine and if i did need to use it more and was shopping for a new 1500 I'd just get one of the offroad packages.

@donhappel9566

Жыл бұрын

The real problem is that such a large percentage of 1/2 tons are really just being used as family cars. Have you tried to find even a standard 6.5' bed in a half ton on a lot? Good luck - everything is the giant cab (gotta have room for taking Billy and Suzi to school!) and a 5'x bed. With that mindset who needs a low range? Why not get rig of it...they'll never notice anyway and we can keep the same price = higher profit margin = win for the general! For my work truck I needed maximum economy so went GM as they are the last man standing with a small diesel. I'd love a 3/4 ton but simply don't need the capacity 90% of the time. I do occasionally tow 8500 lbs, and the truck does it fine, but if that was my primary use then yes I'd move up to an F250. But since I'm mostly just hauling perhaps 1000 lbs of crap to and from work daily the 1500 3.0's economy pays for itself and it would be hard to stomach the 30%+ hit at the pump plus the added up-front cost of a 3/4 ton diesel.

My 2020 LTZ 4x4 has the 6.2 l with Max tow and 4 lo

I found this out when I ordered my 22 refreshed 6.2l LT Trail Boss, no max tow.... makes no sense 🙄. Love the truck otherwise.

I've been asking about this for months. It doesn't make any sense to me. The fact you can still get the transfer case on only the high county is an indicator that is some sort of bean counter/marketing foolishness.

@hochhaul

Ай бұрын

More like a tactic to nudge people to spend a few thousand more for the high country.

Wow. that's crazy.

A Chevy Silverado Texas addition 1500 might be able to pull 13,500.

Hey Tim, I really like your videos. I recently ordered a truck real similar to your high country, deposit and all. I was originally looking at GMC, but when I found out I could get the High Country with LZ0 and 3:73 gears I decided to go that direction because GMC didn’t offer max tow, I just don’t want 3:23 gears, and prefer 3:73 over 3:42. Now the dealer is telling me that GM has not picked up the order. I am an older guy and fully aware of all the different ratio choices. The dealership told me it could be the trailering mirrors or I thought maybe the heavy duty “red” brake calipers that was in the order. Please give me your thoughts and advice.Thanks in advance.

@Pickuptrucktalk

Жыл бұрын

I bet the dealer is right. There are several parts still on constraint and if you build a truck with one of those parts on constraint, they won't build it. For example, the High Country I have didn't come with the multi-pro tailgate because that was on back order basically. If I really wanted that tailgate, it would be months before GM would even decide to build the truck.

@kimblelisenby8537

Жыл бұрын

How can I find out what the hold up is? I could make some minor changes such as mirrors or break calipers, but I want the 😅LZ0 with max trailering. On the build, the heavy duty break calipers said “see dealer for availability”. You would think the dealer could find out.

@Pickuptrucktalk

Жыл бұрын

@@kimblelisenby8537 the dealer should be able to find out. I’d keep on them.

Wasn't the 4 low package with 3.42 and the max trailer 3.23 that seem like the biggest thing and you would want the higher gear ratio

@Pickuptrucktalk

Жыл бұрын

Max trailer also has trailer brake.

4 low not used often enough. 4 low is neccitated in the brief instances you become stuck. GM cost cutting at it's finest. 2 speed case or nothing. Z71 badge and dual tips denotes a 2 speed case to the uninformed.

Thx tim. The problem here is the capabilities of the various transfer cases GM uses in different configurations. I'm in the market for a truck. I recently watched a video w guy who burnt out the transfer case on his ram pulling another truck out of mud. Apparently the Borg Warner transfer case on the 1500 non rebel does NOT have a mechanical lockout. I assumed 4-hi and 4-lo did but no. Apparently the transfer case on the rebel does have a mechanical lockout. And I believe the f150 tremor and raptor also do. I haven't been able to find this info on the GM transfer cases. GM does not use Borg Warner. Do you know which GM 1500 trucks have mechanical lockout w transfer cases that include auto 4wd? I'm sure this confusion is related to the transfer case GM put in the off road packages. I want mechanical lockout in 4-hi and 4-lo, with auto 4wd. Auto 4wd mode uses clutches.

@terrencejones9817

Жыл бұрын

GM hasn't built a Transfer case without clutches for maybe 25 years. Even the HD Trucks use this set up. The Clutch dies apply full lock in 4wd high and low. It's only slipping in 4wd auto.

@stevenlefebvre2991

Жыл бұрын

@@terrencejones9817 Good information to know thank you.

Very frustrating the way GM does their packages and options….often with no technical/mechanical reasons as to why you cant get a particular option on certain trims - especially as you go up the trim levels. Its even more frustrating when you can get certain options on a lower trim model that is not offered on the next level up trim. You can order Adaptive Suspension on a lower costing Tahoe Z71 trim level but not on a Premier which is 2 trims up. You have to go all the way up to High Country to get it. Is this change (dropping 4L) a new change for 2023 or was it there in the 2021, 2022 model years as well? To not have 4L in a 4x4 pickup truck is totally idiotic. They have a 10,000 truck and power plant engineering/designing team that has no real life truck ownership experience other than going to supermarket. So don’t take out your truck in mud or sand in construction ares or go out if there is more than a few inches of snow???

I would love to see a marketing video for no 4 lo using the terrain mode. It sounds like it’s the single transfer case substitute for 4lo but there’s zero info or videos on terrain mode to see its capabilities

@hochhaul

Ай бұрын

If you drive a max tow truck with 10-speed and 3.73's, your first gear is so short that you really feel like you don't need it. Particularly with the diesel option.

You just noticed this?…..I’ve been wanting this combo for years

@Pickuptrucktalk

Жыл бұрын

I did a story a few years ago as well. Just freshening up the information with new details.

I think the z71 off road package is worthless really rancho shocks, you just paying for the z71 emblems. I have a 2016 Silverado crew cab LT2 with max trailer tow package with a 2 speed transfer case. Just last year I convert my whole suspension to King shocks with piggy reservoirs. Best decision for off road. I think Chevy company is just trying to push all those high country trucks knowing that people want those options $$$$.

Hi Tim..does GM may install Max Trailering Package for a CPO pick up truck??? And if yes...for how much????? Thanks

@Pickuptrucktalk

Жыл бұрын

Not sure how they can. It isn't an easy upfit.

Tim, This is crazy. I live in WV and pull an 8,000 lb boat. I have a very steep driveway that I use 4 Low to back my trailer up the hill to save the transmission. Also 4 Low works great to pull the boat up the launch ramp. This is a deal breaker for me I wouldn’t consider the GM trucks if this is the case. I have purchased 2 new GM trucks in the past which were Z-71 and max tow.

@stevenlefebvre2991

Жыл бұрын

Four wheel low is nice to have.

A lot less important but weird, I can't bundle black rims with my z71 for '23 🤷🏼‍♂️

As I understand it, if you have a trim level (other than the High Country) with the Max Trailering Package then you will get the single speed transfer case. But does this mean that the truck would NOT be a suitable TOAD to tow behind a diesel pusher motorhome (for example) due to the fact that the transfer case does NOT have a neutral position. So would it be accurate to say that any single speed transfer case truck should not be used as a TOAD. If that is true, Chevy kind of missed that boat???

@Pickuptrucktalk

Жыл бұрын

That's my understanding as well and yes, I agree with what you are saying on the TOAD issue.

Don’t see the point of complicating the config and build with multiple transfer case types. Just have the 2 speed for all 4x4 models.

Hey Tim, I really liked this video subject. Not sure where GM is going with this off road vs towing thing. Yep going for both is a no brainer. Is GM pigeon holing the trucking community just to get their still unreleased EV wedged in the segment? It got me thinking about the whole 20k EV WT towing thing that seems to be where GM is trying to go for.

thanks tim.. Question, with the push to start setup new vehicles have, how does 1 put the ignition in "Accessory" position? To just run the radio but not the engine. In the old dayz you would just turn key towards you for accessory mode. Do new vehicles even have that mode anymore?

@ramrider1453

Жыл бұрын

On my Ram I hit the push to start button once. Then it’s on Accessory. Hit it again and it goes to run and start. But mine will shut off after 10 mins. A pain for I may want the radio to play longer. Ya…

@Boobtube.

Жыл бұрын

@@ramrider1453 so to start it, you must hit the button 2 times everytime?

@ALMX5DP

Жыл бұрын

I believe it relates to if your foot is on the brake. I think if your foot is on the brake, one push will start the truck. If your foot is not on the brake pedal, one push just gets you into accessory mode. Our Ford with push button (and manual transmission) does similar but using the clutch pedal instead.

@ramrider1453

Жыл бұрын

@@Boobtube. No not really. If my foot is on the brake then it will. On my button it is lit with Acc and Run. If I keep my foot off the brake I can select Acc only. If I place my foot on the brake it will go to Run and start. Make sense??

@Boobtube.

Жыл бұрын

@@ramrider1453 oh ok, got it... wonder if all makes are the same.

Car companies will do anything to cut cost. But that in turn chases customers away. GM does not exist if it were not for the government bail out in 2009. The interior of the Silverado is outdated and is overpriced like any vehicle out there.

I'm confused... I bought a 2020 LT Trail Boss brand new and it came with a factory trailer brake controller?

@Pickuptrucktalk

Жыл бұрын

Something seems odd with that.

You can’t even get a diesel with the max tow. I just tried to order one.

@Pickuptrucktalk

2 ай бұрын

They seem to shut off orders when they have supplier issues. You might give it a few days and try again.

@hochhaul

Ай бұрын

I just bought one so... yes you can sir. Laura Chevrolet, Sullivan, MO. They have a few in stock and more in transit.

I just bought my 1st GM. Its the 2024 GMC 1500 4X4 Elevate Crew Cab model. Afetr all the paperwork and deal and contracts and blah blah blah, i asked where the heck was the 4WL? Sales dude said, NO 4 LOW on this model. WTH!!!??? I never heard of a 4x4 with 1 speed TC. No speeds other than 4 H. I wanna smack some folks right now. $58,000 TRUCK WITH NO LOW 4X?

GM not doing what customers asking for. Improvise if you still want to their platform. If you can get HO alternator and trailering basics elsewhere, pass the max tow. Only loose 200lb payload. Get the TRUE transfer case with a LO gearing capability. I have been in MANY situations with my travel trailer where LO range made putting the trailer into / pulling out of a slot 10X easier b/c camping spots are frequently NOT flat, and slow maneuvering in/out is way easier in Low range. A couple times had to come up and out through mud and then 4WD+LO was a necessity. GM is not listening to customers.

All 4wd trucks should come with 4 low

Being able to order what you want has been gone for years. You either take what they want you to buy or else, after all marketing managers know more.

You are right it doesn’t make sense at all. You should be able to get that 2 speed transfer case on all models at least as an option. I think it’s just a way to build them cheaper to save money. That’s ok for now Gm but when your customers buy their new for example z71 and it doesn’t have that capacity like their old z71 has,they will be some pissed in my opinion! Gm you can only screw your customers soooo many times till they say the heck with you I’m buying another brand of truck.

@donhappel9566

Жыл бұрын

I think you're onto them there. Basically they are relying on decades of all 4wd trucks having a low range and people just assume it's standard then only after picking up the truck realize it's missing. I get not packaging max tow and off-road together given the softer supspension of the off-road stuff, but not offering a low range as standard is just an attempt to trick customers given it's always been that way and is that way in every other truck on the market. But not even offering it as an option? Just stupid.

Are the new mid-sized going to be the same ?

@Pickuptrucktalk

Жыл бұрын

I'm not even sure they will offer a max trailer package on the midsize trucks.

My 22 elevation 3.0 has max trailering with 3:73 and stiffer tuned shocks. Much better for towing than those shit ranchos that squat. I believe it also adds he’s t duty leaf springs. You have to go what suits you best. I’m sure it will be fine for light off roading which most people do any way. I still have 4wD auto 4h etc. I had a 19 trailboss 5.3 and it was horrible for towing.

They’re just trying to get to fancy with 1/2 ton pickups.

Just trying to make you buy a more pricy truck. These companies have no shame

Bottom line, its literal foolery that GM has taken away 4low with max tow with anything other than the 6.3L.

Very good information keep up the good work

@Pickuptrucktalk

Жыл бұрын

Thanks 👍

It really is a no brainer. Get up out of the chair at the salesmans office and walk out the door keeping your hard earned cash until they build what you want. We need to take back the demand side of the supply and demand equation. Just say NO to electronic garbage.

That sucks! If it is not a supply issue then, some yuppie bean counter needs to be educated on how people who actually use there trucks for more than glorified mini vans work them. So happy I decided to buy my truck when I did a little over a year ago. ( was able to get good financing and a discount. Not the case anymore.) I have a 2021 RST max tow with the 6.2 L It's a 50/50 work personal truck. Commercial property maintenance and landscaping. Frequently has a trailer that can weight anywhere between 4000-8000 lbs. Even with the max tow, where I live and work in the foothills of the Canadian Rocky's an 8,000 lbs. 24 ft. cargo trailer in a blizzard, in the mountains, is the limit that I believe this half ton can safely handle. That same trailer, in the same conditions, behind our F350 fleet trucks isn't even a issue. In good summer conditions, the max I've towed this truck is 10,500 lbs. a 2.5 ton min excavator and trailer. The truck did well but this is not something I would do everyday. This time of year I use 4 low pretty regularly to get in and out of un plowed parking lots and job sites. Not having 4 low would be enough to make me move up to 3/4 ton as a mid trim level would be a comparable price point to a High Country, which would not be a good work truck. To nice, not enough pay load. Mine has 2,103 lbs. I've seen some of the newer models Max tows are significantly lower which would also be a deal breaker. It'll be interesting to see what the sticker on your truck is Tim. Congrats on the new truck and keep the vids coming!

Maybe GM would rather sell you a 3/4 ton?

so sad, sounds like chevy has began to prioritize fewer higher profit vehicles like toyota and volume truck sales is just over rated. that being said im glad ford still prioritizes dominating ever model gm and toyota makes. no 4 lo is like no locking rear end for off road driving .

Counter the need for 4LO? It literally doesn't have a low range, it's not countering anything. GM is honestly such a joke.

That's another reason I buy Ford trucks.

Max tow on a 1500 doesn't make any sense, just buy a 2500, maxing out a 1500 isn't a good idea.....2500 tows easily and gets auto/4 lo If towing is important a high country isn't the best trim to buy

@ALMX5DP

Жыл бұрын

Max tow is just the name of the package. Someone posted that it bumps up tow capacity to 13.5k, so it would allow you to tow what a non-max tow maxes out at (like 9500lbs) while still being well under the legal limit.

This is bull shit, I ordered a RST with 3L and max tow package 373. Now that I know this my truck should be here next month but will back out. Sry I need 4Low

Not strange for off roader .

Chevy is having supply chain issues I bet still. So if they offer less options on lower trim trucks. Then Chevy can build more trucks to collect dust on the dealer lots !

@Pickuptrucktalk

Жыл бұрын

Nope. It has been this way for years.

I think GM wants you to move up to the 2500

Very strange (or stupid) way that GM has chosen to configure these options. Makes no sense.

I think GM is just trying to save parts with all the shortages.