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Let's not let slip the detail that Tywin is introduced skinning a stag, the symbol of House Baratheon

The saddest part of the back half of this show is how much D and D clearly cared in the beginning. Scenes like this and the scene between Robert and Cersei are proof.

@williamhermann6635

2 ай бұрын

GRRM was also still heavily involved in the show when this clip was filmed.

@davidknight2104

2 ай бұрын

Yeh they butchered the last season and to a slightly lesser extent season 7, what a waste still grinds on me

@idakev

2 ай бұрын

​​​​​@@williamhermann6635 Season 4 was quite different from the books and some of GRRM's advice and it's the best season. I think D&D took shortcuts for a few reasons: - they saw how caught up in knots George became (minor signs of this even just after Book 3) to the point where he can't finish the story anymore, and wanted to avoid that. - Dany with 3 dragons, Dothraki and Unsullied is extremely overpowered. *That by itself causes the story to fall apart.* The second she arrives at Dragonstone, it's hard to come up with excuses to keep her from immediately winning. - they didn't want to work on the show for 10-12+ seasons as George wanted. It's hard to maintain the quality of a TV show for that length of time. That's why the plotline culling started somewhat early with the removal of Dorne plotlines. - the material near the end (e.g. zombie battles) turns into more generic fantasy which doesn't seem to interest them. The actual Game Of Thrones is what they liked. - George's trouble finishing the story indicates that it isn't easy to finish in general, particularly with the style he wrote the rest of the story in (gardener style). - Part of the reason GOT was such a great show is because it had only a few writers which was feasible with source material to work with. I don't think they wanted a large writers room but they probably needed it to be able to come up with 10-12+ seasons. That decision necessitates shortcuts. It's a shame but it is George's responsibility to finish the story if it is to be anyone's, tbh. I think they expected him to be able to finish it. They signed on to adapt.

Tywin is easily my favorite character in all of Game of Thrones, and his introduction is a big part of what makes episode 7 'You Win or You Die' one of the best episodes of the show. I know most would probably say Baelor or Fire and Blood is their favorite episode from season 1, but no, for me this episode really set the tone for Lannisters' dominance over the seven kingdoms for the rest of the show. Even before his introduction, he was already being built up, and this scene brings him in fully in such a fantastic way as you've laid out. There's no doubt, for the peak of the show, the true king of the seven kingdoms was Tywin Lannister.

@Yvanehtnioj2000

2 ай бұрын

Tywin was one of my favorites but he wasn’t as smart as he thought he was either and it irked me lol Cersei was 100% just like him lol

He literally is the king without the title.. smart.

@An_actual_walrus

2 ай бұрын

In the books even Stannis muses about how when he an Robert we’re very young they went to court and marveled at how regal and noble the king was as he sat the throne and governed the realm. Only much later were they told that Aerys couldn’t be bothered to govern that day and the man sitting on the throne was his Hand. It was Tywin!

Charles Dance was just great as Tywin Lannister. I could rewatch his scenes over and over again and still not get tired of it.

I never get tired of watching breakdowns of this scene. Might be my favorite scene in the entire show.

@1OnlyOneOnlyOne1

2 ай бұрын

A lot of men can closely relate to this scene... the feeling of being inadequate in your fathers eyes. Especially if one's father is a great man. My father was a great man and I am a nobody. It haunts me daily. I think a lot of people struggle with this.

Charles Dance's interview discussing this scene was pretty great. Especially in it giving you certain insight such as Dance never skinning any sort of game before and having to learn to prepare for the set.

@DCharles

2 ай бұрын

He’s one of the best

@Kopend09

2 ай бұрын

You got a link to the interview?

@FatherhoodAndFitness

2 ай бұрын

@@Kopend09 Idk what happened to the full interview kzread.info/dash/bejne/emxqts6ghLGZXc4.htmlsi=wFnzxZYibdflaxn-

Theres quite a difference between someones opinion of your personality, and someones fear/respect for you. It isn't praise tywin demands, it's fear of retribution.

@AGoldenShow

2 ай бұрын

Being a King Slayer brought Jamie nothing but disrespect everywhere in the series, and the Kings guard isn't exactly going to strike fear in people. I think that's why Tywin is making it seem like Jamie is just a bodyguard, secretly he does believe it weakens their position to have a member of the family who does nothing but stand next to the king (until the events of the show take place of course). But he believes Jamie is looking at the emotional impact of this disrespect instead of logically looking at the impact it has on the family. If Tywin were less dismissive during his hypocrisy, he probably gets everything he wanted in the series. But even he lets his emotions rule when it comes to Tyrionn.

@altanshagaibayarsaikhan538

2 ай бұрын

I agree, I think Tywin sees that respect and approval are different. Jaime wants people's love and approval while Tywin wants respect and authority. Both can be classified as opinions, yes, but approval and love are positive(more emotional and soft) while respect and submission to authority are hard and negative(has more practical implications).

It’s no mistake he’s skinning a stag too.

Charles Dance is an absolute perfect cast in this role. Possibly the best casting and that’s saying a lot. Show started downhill once he died, so… 🤔

Tywin was not only a man, he was an institution. When he fell, jis house fell with him

You should do Tywin putting Cersei in her place! “I don’t distrust you because you’re a woman, I distrust you because you’re not as smart as you think you are” & Tyrion when he asked for Casterly Rock. Also Oberyn & Tyrion, either outside their 1st convo outside the brothel that perfectly establishes prince Oberyn or when Oberyn decides to be his champion!

@DCharles

2 ай бұрын

I’ve got a few scenes I’m exploring. You may or may not have mentioned one.

@jeremyarrington9427

2 ай бұрын

great scenes!

Skinning the boar while confronting his son was actually borrowed from a book-only scene in which Randall Tarly (skinning a deer) tells Sam that he’s going to the Wall, and if he doesn’t agree, there will be a hunt in which Sam will be killed in an “accident.” I thought the show did a great job in taking this setting and its sense of menace and using it to introduce Tywin and how he relates to Jamie.

I still find it hard to believe that Dan and Dave wrote ✍️ this scene because it's one of my favorites I'm glad you're covering it 😎

@donttalktomebye

2 ай бұрын

Dan and dave have talent, they just stopped caring and chose to stop using the source material to guide them. If they had chosen to follow the material with more respect, it would have been great all the way through.

@robertsmiley2207

2 ай бұрын

I agree 💯 they should have never gotten to a point 🎯 of thinking 🤔 they could write ✍️ the story as good as grrm himself

@kryzzan7039

2 ай бұрын

The problem is they ran out of material, I'm sure they expected George to have finished the book series by the time they ran out, he didn't even release a single book throughout the entire show's airing.

@robertsmiley2207

2 ай бұрын

They didn't run out of material and grrm never expected the show to catch up with the books 📚

@DevinEMILE

2 ай бұрын

@@kryzzan7039 Or its prequel series first two seasons. Though he has written plenty of books in the Game of Thrones universe. Hes just never finished the one series that started it. And its looking less and less like he will finish it. He's 75, and 20 years ago he said he doesnt want anyone else to finish the series if he passes. Though maybe his mind has changed since 2005ish. Im hoping for at least Winds of Winter.

I think the line with the sheep means that if you justify yourself to others they will start to feel entitled to it. Which will definitely make you weaker. And if you really want to, you could even find a justification for the "whore" situation, because Tywin *does* have legitimate offspring, whereas his children (his sons, as far as he knows) put this off indefinitely. Which puts his house at risk (especially during war).

Solid breakdown of the power dynamic. The acting and writing of the early show, wish I could watch it again for the first time. Instead we know where it ended.

My favourite character in the GoT show, who's death basically rung the beginning of the end for the series imo. Every scene he got, you could be sure would be well written. Charles Dance did an amazing job

Thank you for making this. One of my favorite scenes with my favorite character.

Does anyone else think Tywin had a hand in Joffrey's death? I don't know that I can see him actually conspiring against him, but i could definitely see him calling in the Kingsguard one by one and giving them explicit instructions not to taste test his food, etc. And i could see him catching wind of the plot, probably through Varys, and telling whomever brought the concern to him that he has matters in hand. Joffrey is a big proboem for House Lannister.

He wanted Jaime to put the house 1st, so instead of killing Ned he would barter Ned for Tyrion a member of the house, thats why he said hes glad his vanity got in the way of doing something stupid like killing ned, It would be ironic if Tyrion was Tywins only real child and Jamie & his twin sister, were actually the mad Kings, its even more ironic that Tyrion is the only Lannister alive to continue the name as all the lannisters are wiped out.

Keep them vids coming bro 🔥

Tywin did not sentence Tyrion to death, Tyrion sentenced Tyrion to death. A Trial by combat can only end in an execution if found guilt. Tywin's plan was to find Tyrion guilty and send him to the wall, using it as leverage to put Jamie in control of House Lannister and assuming that Tyrion's smarts and high status would grant him a high station on the wall.

Tywin's point is correct though. He is saying that a Lion(an individual member of House Lannister) should not concern themselves with the opinions of the sheep(the masses) However if someone can prove the House Lannister is not a house to be feared then they have less control among the other houses due to them being shown to be vulnerable and therefore they are opening themselves up to attacks. His full logic would play out as: "A Lion does not concern themselves with the Opinion of the Sheep as long as the Sheep fear the Pride"

Tywin's whole character can be boiled down to one word "Legacy". Everything he does is motivated by how history will remember him and the family name. Within this context, the lion does not concern himself with the opinions of sheep, because history is written by the victors and the opinions of sheep are not recorded by those who write history. Tywin cares only about what is remembered after the fact, and that is usually limited to the broad strokes with details getting lost or forgotten along the way. History likely wouldn't remember that Rob Stark humiliated Tywin at every turn on the battlefield, only that Rob was ultimately slain by his own men and House Lannister emerged triumphant. History wouldn't remember Tyrion's epic defence of Kings Landing, only that Tywin swept in to save the day. History wouldn't remember Tyrion's debauchery, and if Tywin had got his way and sent Tyrion to the wall, history might have forgotten Tyrion entirely. Tyrion's ultimate revenge was destroying Tywin's precious legacy - history would remember how the great Tywin Lannister met his end, slain by his own dwarf son, with his pants down on the toilet, and a whore in his bed.

@Shannon-vv6rr

2 ай бұрын

His main focus on his idea of legacy also blinds him. He forces Tyrion to rape his wife and tells his guards to gangrape her. She disappeared and was never seen again and now he has no grandkids through Tyrion as a result. He refused to see Jamie and Cersei's incest despite it being obvious and their mother having tried to stop it, yet Tywin would rather blind his eyes and has no true grandkids as a result. Tywin shoots himself in the foot

Tywin was so smart and cunning

Great video, keep it up man!

Tywins always right and was never wrong!!

Good vid on the best GOT character. You earned a sub 🎉

excellent video

@DCharles

2 ай бұрын

Glad you liked it!

8:10 So what your saying is Tywin is game of thrones’ bill bellichick lml go pats 😂😂😂

He’s dressing down Jaime while dressing down a deer. Clever.

Always click on your videos when I see them come up. They're tremendous and it's great to see your channel growing; you deserve it. Thank you!

@DCharles

2 ай бұрын

Glad you like them!

Tywin does still keep to his belief in the family name is all that matters. He secures Jaime as heir to the Rock. Tyrion is just the pawn he sacrifices to achieve this. Tywin was all for sending him to the wall. If anything it was Tywin allowing Shea to testify that ruined his plans. Tywin didn't need her to say anything as he had his plan in place. Yet he has to drive that dagger in to remind Tyrion of Tywin's own belief in his superiority.

D Charles .... Charles Dance? (the actor who plays Tywin Lannister)

@DCharles

2 ай бұрын

🤫

9:18 Okay. Fear isn't an opinion. It's a natural fact of lesser beasts. Opinions are bluff words that don't and shouldn't bother eliciting a heartfelt response in the superior by the inferior. Idle gossip is irrelevant from sheep, and the natural sate of the sheep is to fear or be preyed upon by the lion. A sheep that learns not to fear the lion is out of countenance and must be put back in its proper place. There's his logical.

@DevinEMILE

2 ай бұрын

It really all comes from his father being a weak willed push over who pretty much just let the Reynes enter open rebellion with no plans of stopping it after years of their scheming. Thats why Tywin is so set on fear. He knows the second they stop fearing you. they stop respecting you. And then you get another Castamere situation. Sure Ned ruled the North for 20 years just being honorable, but he also had the might of the king behind him. The second he was gone and House Stark was weak. The Bolton took their old place as rulers of the North.

Incoming Sigma grind :

Dudes literally flaying the sigil of House Baratheon 😂 You missed the most important point! Great video though! Love your content

Ned and Catelyn didn't refuse to accuse the Lannisters because they were afraid of Tywin, they knew Robert wouldn't act without proof, anyone can accuse anyone of anything, but you don't condemn people without proof. They wanted the matter settled with proof before even bringing it up because at that point, the matter would be all but settled and impossible to refute, even by someone with their head in the sand like Robert.

The better question is why any of these people think they can so such things and Lord Tywin won't have anything to say? "Casterly Rock hasn't forgiven such betrayals, not since Tywin Lannister was old enough to go to war "

Tell your father I’m here. Tell him Lannisters aren’t the only ones who pay their debts

I'd love for you hear your insights on Tywin and Olenna. I've always found them to have compelling duality, in that they are the same yet different. They move in different spheres, masculine and feminine. But the operate and maneuver within said spheres in much the same way. There are differences yes, Olenna. I feel genuinely loves her family. As opposed to Tywin's more abstract, reverent love for his family/family name. Which in said context, is I think the only way you can apply the word "love" to Tywin's character barring his wife. But that aside from that. I think if positions and sex were reversed they would closely mirror one anothers actions throughout the series and lore.

3:52 I disagree that this is a prelude to hypocrisy. If you break it down on a very technical level then perhaps you can argue hypocrisy, but Tywin is teaching Jaime the difference between opinions which are consequential and inconsequential; existential and non existential. Tywin never meant that turn of phrase as a blanket rule for all opinions the 'sheep' have for his family, it's up to Jaime to understand what's worth fussing over and what isn't. One opinion jeopardises respect for the family name and the other doesn't. Tywin is completely right, House Lannister doesn't lose power because the Kingslayer did another thing that was below the belt. But they certainly lose power if they can't save one of their own from being a POW. Tywin doesn't care whether you like his family or not, he only cares if you have fear and respect. You can again argue that the above is a matter of subjectivity, but as your great video demonstrates, we know that Tywin has the best understanding and aptitude for power in the Seven Kingdoms. The Rains of Castamere is entirely about Tywin Lannister putting fear and respect back into the family name. So Jaime should indeed shut his clever trap and listen to his old man. But I agree with the rest. You perfectly broke down why this scene was so impressive.

the only lion who actually didn't concern himself with the opinions of the sheep was Tywins father Tytos. Tytos nearly ruined House Lannister BECAUSE he didn't give a f*ck. Tywin does concern himself with the opinions of others, because he wants to appear, and for his house to appear, strong. and for him, supposedly not caring about the opinions of others is a mask of strength. He does make a fair point about honor though, and I don't think it necessarily conflicts with his obsession about reputation. on one hand if you work underhanded, people, in the best case, don't know what happened so it can't damage your reputation. on the other hand if somebody like Tywin is willing to kill his enemies at dinner because he doesn't mind breaking the rules, that makes him much more scary to me. Less honorable and maybe less respectable, depending on what things you respect, but definetly scary. His main hypocracy comes from his attitude towards the opinions of others though. He's also obviously not a moral person or a good father but that's not necessarily hypocritical it just makes him a douche, a cool douche but a douche non the less

This scene was actually good even though it didn't happen in the books.

The fact the TV fans see his quotes as inspirational show how much the series did a good job to portray him. A lot of people in the book see Tywin as a great man they don't see his flaws but that's his goals his power why he is so dangerous in the game of throne. It's funny see people fall for the obvious Tywin propaganda but that prove they did it right.

@DCharles

2 ай бұрын

Yes

Tyrion’s issues were definitely deeper than him just being a dwarf.

Tywin is the epitome of Machiavellian thinking.

Please break down the final 3 minutes of Blackwater. I shared this on my social media. I have like over 6500 followers and i am known amongst Game if Thrones fans here in Louisville as the biggest Lannister fan. Hopefully I’ll get you lots of subs. PLEASE do last few minutes of Blackwater.

@DCharles

2 ай бұрын

I appreciate the sentiment. I have a handful of scenes planned similar to this one, but you never know what the future may hold.

@TheCmascagni

2 ай бұрын

@@DCharles love the work.

Most epic Tywin moment…end of Blackwater. The battle is over. We have won. (Cue Rains of Castamere)..

This is the best scene in the whole show.

You can tell he just wishes they had gained something from the situation. He see Jamie does have honor but it stands in his way when his recklessness gets the better of him. Basically Jamie you dope if you’re gonna be reckless at least be dishonorable too haha

The MIGHTY TYWIN

If I remember this was one of the few good scenes entirely made up by D&D back when they cared about the show…before the dark times…before season 6

Being worried your enemies can hold members of your family hostage at will is not fretting over the opinions of sheep. They very much become wolves at that point.

You use Final Cut Pro by chance?… some of the effects you use look like effects I use all the time. (Prism, trails)

@DCharles

2 ай бұрын

I do not. I actually have been stubbornly against apple products, but I’m coming around.

@OhNoAlexxStreams

2 ай бұрын

@@DCharles understandable actually lol the only reason to own one (in my opinion) is for editing and I’ve been told animation too. I’ve been editing with Final Cut for over 10 years now 🤷🏻‍♂️ but I’m not gonna convince anyone to buy a Mac fr 😆 What do you use? I edit for OhNoItsAlexx (which has a bunch of PC users in the community) so I’m asked all the time for a decent PC software. Alex uses Davinci but idk how good or bad that is 🤷🏻‍♂️

@DCharles

2 ай бұрын

@@OhNoAlexxStreams I was using Premiere but if people are looking for a super user friendly desktop editor, CapCut(I used on this) is obnoxiously expensive for a free product.

@OhNoAlexxStreams

2 ай бұрын

@@DCharles Yeah I paid like $500 for my software 👀 editing software isn’t cheap. I dabbled on premier for like 10 min one time like 5 years ago and struggled figuring stuff out lol I really wanna take another crack at it tho. (Premier _and_ After Effects would be ideal) I’m pretty sure chromakeying would be easier with those. But thanks man! I’ll let people know! Enjoying your content btw. My older sis read the books after I put my entire family on Game of Thrones. It’s not a perfect show, but I still mostly enjoy it. I just subbed and I’ll drop a link to your channel in our Discord! ✌🏻

@DCharles

2 ай бұрын

@@OhNoAlexxStreams sounds good. Thank you

If he would have married olenna tyrell he would have ruled westeros

THEY HAVE MY SON!

Charles Dance RULES. I named my son Tywin after him. The Emperor from Dune 2 should’ve been Charles Dance, not Walken.

Tywin was to Lannister as Aegon the Conquerer was to Targaryen

Tywin mocks and chastises Jamie over Ned Stark surviving the fight. But later when Ned is executed, he agrees with Tyrion that it was a terrible mistake because there won't be a chance for peace/negotiations with the North. Was Tywin testing Jamie when asking him why Ned is still alive, or just manipulating Jamie by continuing to disapprove of anything he does short of leaving the Kings Guard? Probably both.

@Myrkin

2 ай бұрын

I believe that Tywin mocks Jamie not so much over letting Ned Stark live, but over the reason why he did it. Basically, he tells Jamie he did the right thing for wrong reasons.

Clean. (Such disdain).

This into straight away let me know that this is a careful clever man, who is not afraid to get his hands dirty and covered and blood. Literally and figuratively speaking.

That’s not an opinion, it’s a fact..

Tywin asking why Ned is still alive don’t make sense. Killing ned stark at that point means the death of Tyrion Even arrogant Jaime knows that

This scene is extremely good, yet it's not in the books. D&D came up with it themselves. They are not idiots, they absolutely can write. Too bad they stopped giving a shit after season 6.

Tywin is walking insecurity

@Stoirelius

2 ай бұрын

What?

The “it wouldn’t have been clean” isn’t even true. He doesn’t kill ned because Catelyn has tyrion and she would kill him if they killed ned

@DCharles

2 ай бұрын

Well hang on, because they weren’t sparring. But the point you made is probably why they don’t actually fight in the book.

@happybee7725

2 ай бұрын

@@DCharles It is. And in the show. Ned actually says it in both I believe. Could be wrong I think he did. He 100% says it in the book. That’s why jaime says “leave stark. Kill his men” or words to that effect.

@DCharles

2 ай бұрын

@@happybee7725 Ned definitely says it in the show and Jaime agrees, but then Jory goes after Jaime, gets killed, and then Ned and Jaime fight. So in the show, once the fight starts I think they’re fighting to the death. It’d be hard to believe either would yield. In the book Ned’s horse falls on him.

@happybee7725

2 ай бұрын

@@DCharles aye now you say it that sounds about right. He says neds right and tells his men to take him alive then totally ignores his own command and goes after Ned anyway.

@DCharles

2 ай бұрын

@@happybee7725 sorta, but in the show Jory goes straight for Jaime and gets himself killed(which is a nice touch because he and Jaime talk about Jory almost losing his eye against the Iron Born) but then Ned and Jaime just square off. Idk it’s kinda ridiculous, but it worked. I guess my point is I don’t think Jaime was lying to Tywin, but then it makes the whole confrontation kinda absurd if we think about it too much.

Do you remember Reginald Lannister???😂😂😂😂

I don't think the starks where afriad of tyiwns power in the slightest lml have the shit they did literally tells u they have no fcks about him only.honor cat took the imp with no prove just hear or say only reason he even got away was cuz he won his trial.by combat and Ned was just a honorable man he could of easily took over after Robert's death with renly bur decided not to cuz it was no honor in that he wanted to be merciful so it was the starks being killed by their honor and lack of ambition not tywins power

"Family is what matters" said by the guy who won't stop butchering a stag to have a serious meeting with a family member

This may be the best character introduction in the history of t.v.

The way he leaves the flank on the hide was distracting for me. I would assume every child back then would know how important that piece is when curing meat. It’s a big waste of meat… ALSO a lot of extra work when tanning the hide to scrape all that meat off 🤦🏻‍♀️ but I suppose that you wouldn’t be his problem.

Tywin is a GOAT character but Jamie is the best character in GoT IMO. Minus the “innocent or otherwise” line D&D tried to ruin him with in the end of the show.

Just show it

Tbh i still like the books introduction better, i feel the show a little bit exagerated

@michaelclausen1135

2 ай бұрын

It's been a long time since I read the first book. What is his first scene again?

@NANINANI-cs6rn

2 ай бұрын

@@michaelclausen1135 it was in tyrion pov when he returned from the vale, he came with several barbaric thugs from the vale, one of them called tymett as i remember, he took one of his eyes off to show bravery,even bron talk in respectful way with tymett, soon as kevan saw them he held his sword as his father stayed calm Tyrion thought if tywin really feared those people then nothing in his face Shows that, anyway it was cool scene in my opinion

Go on say something clever. 😅. Both his sons annoying clever fools.