Death of Gwen: Shake things up, keep Spider-man single and thus more relateable Clone Saga: Shake things up, make Spider-man single and thus more relateable One More Day: Shale things up, make Spider-man single and thus more relateable 2/3 of the times writers tried shaking things up and keep Spider-man single turned out to be some of the worst Spider-man stories ever

@Dimadick3

5 жыл бұрын

"2/3 of the times writers tried shaking things up and keep Spider-man single turned out to be some of the worst Spider-man stories ever" Because they tried to erase years of character development, regress Peter Parker to an immature jerk, and get rid of the supporting cast. As for Gwen, she was written poorly for years ... before they decided to kill her.

@blackg450

5 жыл бұрын

What's next, resurrect Uncle Ben by making another deal with the devil since deaths always have no consequences.

@SawdEndymon

5 жыл бұрын

OMD IS *FAR* WORSE

@legendofFranktheTank

5 жыл бұрын

i liked death of gwen

@snakes3425

5 жыл бұрын

Let me put it this way in Renew your Vows the moment MJ dawns that red and white spider suit and calls herself Spinneret for the first time, and seeing Annie May become Spiderling renders One More Day and the Clone Saga miscarriage unnecessary because in one panel with one line of dialogue "You're no longer a solo act" you fixed everything you said was wrong with the idea, and now all defenses of One More Day and the infamous miscarrage come across as mean spirited excuses for being lazy and uncreative so let me ask what's the point of keeping either one around other then excuses for laziness and uncreativity?

"Maximum Clonage" is a phrase that only the 90's could have produced.

@விஷ்ணு_கார்த்திக்

5 жыл бұрын

THE POWER IS MAXIMUMER

@kross_draws

5 жыл бұрын

Or Game Grumps

@pgaven9396

5 жыл бұрын

It needed a neon cover variant...or at least a glow in the dark foil. Lol

@vampjoseph

5 жыл бұрын

the decade that was neon colored EXTREME!!!!!

@damnthishandleistaken

4 жыл бұрын

CLONAGE USA

The whole thing stemmed from a gross misconception of the Spider-Man character that continues to this day. It's the idea that Peter should never grow up, when in fact he'd been aging and growing since the beginning. He started as a high school student. He graduated high school and went to college. He went from bullied nerd to actually being fairly popular, including befriending the guy who'd bullied him in high school. He fell in love and saw that love die. He graduated college and started his post-graduate studies. He moved on to a new love, which ended up being on and off for many years. He left grad school for a time when balancing his life became too difficult, but eventually returned. He got married. Spider-Man/Peter Parker was all about growing up and change. It was never about always being in the same point in life. It's also funny that he couldn't be married, but someone thought it was OK to turn him into Tony Stark when the one consistent thing about him is that he's terrible with money and keeping a schedule.

@Krystalmyth

5 жыл бұрын

Wow, you're a true believer for sure.

@emmahenderson2737

5 жыл бұрын

The rich “Stark” Parker was actually Dr Octopus in his body though not Peter

@akwilson1676

5 жыл бұрын

Guess you haven’t read All New All Different Spider Man. Otto had left the body for quite a while, what was left was Parker Industry, so Peter took advantage of that and used all the money and resources to upgrade Spider Man, like created the Mark 4 Spider Armor.

@zamirewilson7424

5 жыл бұрын

Yeah, it's rather bizzar to me. 😞😞

@lebronjame2016

5 жыл бұрын

Exactly, the fun of peter parker is you get to watch him grow up

I like the original draft of the clone saga. Scarlet Spider becoming the new official Spider-Man and Peter Parker becoming a family man would of been the perfect ending for Peter.

@Sinistralitee

Ай бұрын

Isn't that what MC2 is all about? granted, Ben didn't became the new Spider-Man he died in MC2 but peter did get that happy ending, with now his Daughter becoming the new Spider-Girl

aw man i really liked ben reily that original arc they had planned with pete setting down and ben taking over sounds like it would have been awesome

@Nightman221k

8 жыл бұрын

It also would have opened the door to a Spider-Family. I mean, MJ and Pete having a baby and Ben being her Uncle Ben would be so cute and Peter could grow up a bit while Ben lives a more carefree life not tied down, you get the best of two worlds.

@ItsMichaelReid

7 жыл бұрын

Yeah but there was one problem people had...the Peter they been following since 1976 was a clone and the real Peter would've been Ben except every time you would introduce Ben you'll have to explain that he's really Peter Parker even though he has blonde hair. You'll also wouldn't be able to interact with the Bugle and other characters even if he did come back as Peter because everyone in the Bugle would be asking where's Mary Jane Watson with the kid? Unless he told them his identity it wouldn't work. Plus all those years with the "clone" Parker would mean Kraven's Last Hunt was meaningless and bunch of other stories like Harry Osborn's death wouldn't have the same punch as it once did. Overall its a big mess.

@TheLastSane1

7 жыл бұрын

No Harrys death could have been played up. The Real Pete was not there for his best friends death. This could have been used to sober the Carefree Spiderman if people were getting annoyed that he was a bit to unconnected to the past issues. Kraven's Last Hunt does not lose its meaning it takes on a different view but hardly meaningless.

@Road_WolfMC

7 жыл бұрын

Can Doodle yea I thought the same

@rockyluan

6 жыл бұрын

The problem was having suggested that Peter was the clone in first place. Instead of revealing that Ben was the original and Peter was the clone, they should've established that Peter was the original way before and not have prolonged it. But the miscarriage was a pretty bad move, especially now that we have so many Spider-Men. Too many editors and a plot line with great possibilities poorly managed

Ben Riley, a clone of Peter, the new spiderman, taking the mantle and responsibility so that the real one could live his life and raise a child with Mary Jane. How was that a bad idea.

@Nightman221k

8 жыл бұрын

It wasn't, it just would have upset fanboys who would complain that one was the clone. (Honestly, it doesn't matter much who is or isn't the clone. Both were alive and had feelings and memories)

@zettovii1367

8 жыл бұрын

At least that story was continued with Spider Girl.

@wyattberens5723

8 жыл бұрын

The idea is great, but the writers, editorial staff and everyone at marvel was so unorganized during this project that everything fell apart

@chancepaladin

8 жыл бұрын

x-factor did the same with with multiple man, but I didn't see that brought up. :-( maybe too much of a tangent.

@XanderVJ

8 жыл бұрын

What turned a potentially good idea into a bad one was trying to make Ben Riley the original and Peter the clone, instead of the other way around.

They should have had it be a *clone* of Norman Osbourne, made by Norman before he died.

@michellelincoln9987

5 жыл бұрын

seriously, read the "Real" Clone Saga sometime it's much shorter and it actually does the story and both Peter and Ben justice plus it actually does use Harry as the real mastermind, along with that Norman Osborn clone

@themossycobble1903

5 жыл бұрын

@@michellelincoln9987 what's the issue numbers?

@husseinitami1666

5 жыл бұрын

@@michellelincoln9987 So the real Clone Saga considered canon or not ?

@silverdragon1286

4 жыл бұрын

The Mossy Cobble There’s a mini-series called Spider-Man: The Clone Saga, it was made to show the original story that was planned for the clone saga. It’s only 6 issues long, and was released back in 2013

@sonsonthegoddessofconfusio3183

3 жыл бұрын

@@husseinitami1666 some is canon, only good things was ben, Kaine and jackal

Wait, so the idea of having a new person take on the Spiderman role was more offensive to the guy than having Peter and his beloved wife tragically loose a baby? WTH? Personally I'd like to see more superheroes with kids. Great video Scott. Love the skit at the beginning. What are you're thoughts on the latest developments in Civil War II?

@Dimadick3

5 жыл бұрын

"Personally I'd like to see more superheroes with kids." Like Mister Fantastic, Invisible Woman, Henry Pym, Wasp/Janet Van Dyne, Scarlet Witch, Vision, Quicksilver, Crystal, Medusa, Black Bolt, and Wolverine? Marvel has many heroes with kids. How the writers treat them is another matter. I also like supervillains with kids. The Mystique-Rogue relationship is one of the main reasons that I became interested in the X-Men. Having a daughter with major problems, that you can't help resolve no matter how much you care about her.

@snakes3425

5 жыл бұрын

It was the 90s and the Dark Age of Comics was at it's peak...nuff said.

@bobi200samatar6

4 жыл бұрын

I want to a super family in the vain of the incredibles. Imagine the banter!

@sonsonthegoddessofconfusio3183

3 жыл бұрын

@@bobi200samatar6 powerback... Fantastic four..... Runaways...............

@Cklert

2 жыл бұрын

@@bobi200samatar6 To bad old (young) Franklin Richards won't let anyone in the universe age.

17 minutes in I finally realized the lantern is a green lantern

@NerdSyncProductions

8 жыл бұрын

+Jacob Carroll haha!

@NerdSyncProductions

8 жыл бұрын

+Jacob Carroll haha!

@zelm157

7 жыл бұрын

HHH MY GOD I think that is the original lantern from Scott the first Lantern

@BATMAN-gh1nf

6 жыл бұрын

I wonder if anyone at Marvel considered the idea of Peter Parker with a Green Lantern ring?

@ProjektTaku

3 жыл бұрын

@@zelm157 no Scotts lantern looked like the silver ages green lanterns lantern

A nice simple story of Ben Riley taking on the mantle of Spider- Man would have been so much better. I think a combination of fear of fan reaction and to many conflicting creators are what killed it. On a related note it is sad that Peter Parker as a character is not allowed to live an adult life Part of Spider-Man's appeal is that he is a normal guy with these amazing powers. Why is Peter having a wife and kid seen as such a bad thing when a big part of Spider-Man's appeal is that he has to balance real life with his super hero adventures?

@MelangeToastCrunch

5 жыл бұрын

AvatAR42420 Exactly. Its even easier to implement now, as Peter can be the seasoned, more responsible adult Spiderman, while Miles Morales is the more whimsical, irresponsible teenage Spider-Man

@sonicsucks20

5 жыл бұрын

Peters appeal was always rooted towards being the embodiment of youth and unfortunate problems with the youthful action.

What I find interesting about this whole mess is the motivation behind its conception, the idea that they were "alienating" the readership by giving Peter relatable adult issues. There seems to be this impression that the readership remained the same age, no matter how much time had passed since Spider-Man's earlier years, when in truth, the readership was probably growing up with the writers, and indeed the character himself, so issues such as marriage, mortgages and kids would have been welcome, relatable problems for Spider-Man to deal, as the character was designed to be identifiable, and as the readership got older and teenage readers grew into adults, the subject matter of his personal life should change to reflect that. Perhaps if one of the writers at the time caught wind of this, we wouldn't have gotten the mess of a saga that we have, but then again, all the editorial mishaps would have still occurred, so perhaps we would just be trading one bad event for another, making this all inevitable in one way or another.

@pgaven9396

5 жыл бұрын

Exactly!!! What they could've done instead was create the "Ultimate" version of him then and make him younger...but that bright idea unfortunately wouldn't come until after the damage had been done already.

@anothercleverusername992

3 жыл бұрын

I'm with you 💯 on the potential of aging Peter and giving him more adult problems and responsibilities. I was 9-10 when this was happening, and even then I liked that aspect. It wasn't alienating at all... It made me think, _"Oh wow, Spider-Man is all grown up... How terrifying!"_ It also made him an adult to "look up to."

The Clone Saga had potential, unlike One More Day which was dead on arrival. The dragging out is why I prefer the Real Clone Saga trade

Sorry this video was late. As you can see, it's a lot longer than normal. I also got lost in Marvel history and Clone Saga shenanigans. There's far more that couldn't make it into the video, so check out the sources in the description! Also, I love you. Keep it up!

@DreadBirate

8 жыл бұрын

i would hav thought it would come earlier but whatevs

@jupiter6314

8 жыл бұрын

u put so much effort into the vid so no sweat. Keep it up

@bonbonchocolat7777

8 жыл бұрын

I found something that might increase your opinion of Deadpool. Hamilton was in a deadpool comic. I'm internally freaking out and want to scream in caps lock. But I won't

@YourPalA.D

8 жыл бұрын

the age of the clones is more complex than X movies timeline

@jupiter6314

8 жыл бұрын

Chelsea H. whose Hamilton?

Floor scott is best scott

@CosmicNerdStudios

8 жыл бұрын

The one without a bow tie

@NerdSyncProductions

8 жыл бұрын

He's... he's just... ugh.

@CosmicNerdStudios

8 жыл бұрын

He is just perfect lol

@1alternativesound

8 жыл бұрын

I dont have a Tie, 30 seconds in the video and i burst a laughter :D

@SirKibble15

8 жыл бұрын

Real Scott should die somehow and Floor Scott should be the new host of Nerd Sync. Right that up imaginary writers, and make is as complicated and convoluted as possible

Remember "Maximum Carnage?" That started something new in Spider-man comics that the Clone Saga made even worse: Continuing the story across multiple books (for example, The Amazing Spider-Man would be continued in The Spectacular Spider-Man which would continue in The Web of Spider-Man which continued into Spider-Man, which continued back into The Amazing Spider-Man). This made collecting comics at the time an infuriating proposal, not just because you had to buy four separate books, but because it was difficult to organize the comics into a coherent storyline. Even the official Marvel 30 Years of Amazing Spider-Man CD-ROM collection they sold a few years back is impossible to read during the mid-1990s thanks to these storylines, because the damn creative team would sometimes switch, new characters were introduced every issue, and you were only getting one in every four bits of the story. It was a nightmare and a lot of people at the time just stopped collecting BECAUSE of these marketing tactics.

@isetmfriendsofire

8 жыл бұрын

Pisses me off. I have the same CD rom.

@chris_t2020

5 жыл бұрын

For me "Maximum Carnage" and "Clone Saga", are the worst of classic Spider-man stories. BUT "Sins of the Past" and "Reign" are WAY worst. ("Brand New Day" it's no that bad if your a DC fan)

@zamirewilson7424

5 жыл бұрын

I know right, tie-ins can be ok, but spreading a story that thin is maddening!!!!! I really hope this is practiced less now or almost completely dropped.

@davidjames468

5 жыл бұрын

Actually, I liked how the story kept going each week. The different stories - without interruption - of each comicbook were difficult to integrate and when they decided to have the story continue through all of them, it made the reading integration a lot easier for me.

@imagineumnomefoda500

5 жыл бұрын

I kinda liked Maximum Carnage tbh.Although,the art style was terrible,

The beautifully written swan song to Aunt May was eventually reconned out, and May was alive and once again clueless about Peter being Spider-Man, therefore killing one of the only good moments of the whole mess. It wasn't even the last time this would happen, either - JMS's run had May find out that Peter Parker was Spider-Man, come to terms with it, and become a more active member of the supporting cast -- annnnd then One More Day once again retconned it so she was clueless again. Ultimate Spider-Man had a similar story as part of its own version of the Clone Saga -- which somewhat ironically was once of the best arcs in that series. May finds out, RAGES at Peter for lying to her all this time, and almost kicks him out of the house before she comes to terms with it. As this was an alternate universe, it was never retconned out -- just erased from existence.

I geek out every time we sneak in a Hamilton reference.

@cory3888

8 жыл бұрын

So constantly ;)..

@sinci7

8 жыл бұрын

What/who is this Hamilton you all speak of!?

@insertwittynamehere1411

8 жыл бұрын

I'm here monkeysnot

@cory3888

8 жыл бұрын

Hey, Scott argued he is an AnnoyingNerd, it was a hoot

@cory3888

8 жыл бұрын

Hey, Scott argued he is an AnnoyingNerd, it was a hoot

"Since when were clones a good idea?" I think the Roy Harper clone saga in the Young Justice animated series was pretty damn cool! :P

@fightingmedialounge519

6 жыл бұрын

True, but beyond the fact that comic fans probably learned their lesson after the clone saga, red arrow had the benefit of being the only roy we knew so it didn't come across as being a massive retconn.

The Clone Saga is what got me out of comics. I loved Spiderman and had been collecting all the runs at the time, and had for a decade. FOUR DIFFERENT TITTLES at the time. If they had simply kept the continuity and reduced Peter's role and slowly worked Ben in more I would haved loved it. Aunt May's death was touching and heartfelt, and SHOULD HAVE BEEN PERMANENT. I actually cried a little bit. I didn't so much mind Ben being the real Peter, but did not want the story of Peter and MJ to go away. There would have been great story telling opportunities in the two warheads running around, and it isn't like they did not have enough titles to tell those stories. The Amazing Spider-Man, Peter Parker the Spectacular Spiderman, Web of Spiderman, Spiderman.

@timkinrade9533

5 жыл бұрын

THE CLONE SAGA IS WHAT GOT ME OUT OF COMICS TOO, which is good because I got out before all the cosmic/galactic/heroes in space stuff. Yes, Tim Kinrade, earthling, can relate to cosmic beings with the power of gods that ride around in galactic helicopters. Don't even get me started on multiple universes... it's gross in fiction and even more disgusting that people give legitimacy to idea that reality works that way. "Ah yes, sure there's more evidence for the existence of God and for a flat Earth.... but multiple universes is totally possible"

@darkthorpocomicknight7891

2 жыл бұрын

Maximum Carnage made me quit but the first ember of clone saga made me divorce Spidey Ironically I bought and read tons of Superman and Batman comics soon after but I stopped being A REGULAR - I now just selectively read one shots and/or trade paperbacks

I think they don’t know what to do with Spider-Man. Even now they killed Ultimate Peter Parker with a black Miles Morales, they don’t know what to do with Miles. They want change but who really likes Aunt May? She’s been in the hospital at death door million times. At the end of the clone saga nothing happened Aunt May came back Peter Parker is Spider-Man and Mary Jane isn’t pregnant. Even One-More Day ended Peter &MJ marriage and brought back Aunt May the most exciting comic was Amazing Spider-Man: Renew Your Vows with Peter MJ and his kid which could’ve been the most exciting comic event of the 90s and what’s crazier that it’s set alternate 90s universe!

I really love this longer format, as well as this sitting Scott set up, it really feels like I'm in a classroom learning some stuff.

@NerdSyncProductions

8 жыл бұрын

Thanks so much! I can't promise the longer format is here to stay, but the desk certainly is! I like not having to stand for long periods of time. Haha

@Doomsword0

8 жыл бұрын

Cool!

Sooner or later writers will say that Uncle Ben was the mastermind of the Clone Saga. That would get a lot of people, including myself, outraged.

@izamanaick

8 жыл бұрын

Slott will probably co-write it with Bendis and Quesada

@brandontriplin5447

8 жыл бұрын

Who would draw it

@mumbleslol

8 жыл бұрын

Cammuncoli

@WlatPziupp

8 жыл бұрын

Fool! Aunt May was obviously the mastermind all along! She wanted nothing more than for Peter to just be a guy who takes care of his Aunt, and his worldsaving and girlfriends and child kept getting in the way of that. So she created a bunch of clones who all did a bunch of stuff which somehow ended in her getting a lifetime supply of condoms and life in the Orgy Friendly Retirement Home of Blackjack and Blow!

@Just_Some_Guy_with_a_Mustache

8 жыл бұрын

"PETER! I'm back, _and I'm pissed!_"

6:52 somewhere in the world Linkara is cackling in hatred for One More Day.

@XanderVJ

8 жыл бұрын

In a way, the Clone Saga was a proto-OMD, considering one of the main objectives was to make Spidey single.

@robinhyperlord9053

5 жыл бұрын

Linkara is an invalid

Not sure about the story but I freakin LOVE that Scarlet Spider outfit

@Christ2010Grad

4 жыл бұрын

James Reed I like the suit too.

@sonsonthegoddessofconfusio3183

3 жыл бұрын

Which one, Ben Version or Kanie version

@jamesreed620

3 жыл бұрын

Ben version

@James-zr8vi

2 жыл бұрын

I'd totally recommend Vol 1 of the Clone Saga Omnibus. Vol 2 gets really Shakey, but Vol 1 is pretty phenomenal story in my opinion.

I really enjoy your videos lately. The quality of the content has gone way up. I like the new setup.

@BrickTavernFilms

8 жыл бұрын

Agreed

@ndsb5183

8 жыл бұрын

I've always loved his videos, but I agree, the new set is great!

@NerdSyncProductions

7 жыл бұрын

Many thanks! Scott worked long and hard on the new setup, and I have to agree with you. And I am not just saying that because I am contractually obligated to... really! haha. Thanks for watching! Dave "DJ" Johnson (Community Manager)

Imagine a Clone Saga movie..

@afonsolucas2219

8 жыл бұрын

FUCK! I'd preffer a Spiderverse movie with Toby Maguire and maybe Andrew Garfield.

@NerdSyncProductions

8 жыл бұрын

I'd rather not. I'll definitely do a Spider-Verse, though!

@firemonkey0291

8 жыл бұрын

How many parts would they have to split it up into? My guess is at least 10

@rarm5899

8 жыл бұрын

As long as it's based on the Ultimate universe.

@Y2JercichOJO

8 жыл бұрын

***** yeah loved the Spider-Verse. Maybe have Tobey and Andrew return as alternate Spidey's then add new ones such as Miles, Gwen, Silk etc

Why not an episode on the history of Spider-Man's armpit webbing?

This exact series is what drop Spider-Man from my number one as a kid to still one of my favorites but he went down quite a few pegs after this. I was born in the late 70s so to be told in my twenties at the Spider-Man that I've always known might have been a clone and not the real Peter Parker was a slap in the face. I still hung in there and try to read the comics to see where they were going but it just dragged on and by the time I started to accept it and the stories actually started to get good they killed Ben Riley, brought back Norman Osborn, and kidnap Peter and Mary Jane's child and turn it into a house cat? My Spidey fandom has never fully recovered since then...

This is totally on the editors' shoulders. Some of the outcomes would have been really great and while I love Peter it would have been fantastic to just have him retire with MJ. Of course they'd bring him back, but imagine Ben teaming up with Peter and his kid. So many missed opportunities.

@MysteriousTomJenkins

8 жыл бұрын

Honestly they could have had their own little Spider Family like the Bat Family of DC. Ben replaces Peter for a while so Peter can raise his child and take part in his family until his daughter (if they went with the Spider-Girl angle) grows old enough to become a child hero and Peter comes out of retirement to train her and help her on her way so we have a Spiderman that can be darker, a Spiderman that can be friendlier, both these can appeal to adults and you have a kid Spiderman that is also female to appeal to kids and girls.

@MysteriousTomJenkins

8 жыл бұрын

Justin Stovall Yeah though at least they seem to have that Spider Family thing going on now with Peter Parker, Miles, Spider Woman and I think Spider Gwen is int he main universe.

@MysteriousTomJenkins

8 жыл бұрын

Justin Stovall Yep, back then all these other Spidermen were alternate realities and dead clones.

@MysteriousTomJenkins

8 жыл бұрын

Justin Stovall Mmhm.

@Nightman221k

8 жыл бұрын

I would have liked to have see that too. Peter and Ben being like brothers and Peter being a dad would have been a cool idea. You get the best of both worlds with adult-life Peter and Ben who isn't tied down. It's stupid that people let the idea get so convoluted and get fixated on who was the "real" Peter or not? Who cares? They both were alive and had feelings and memories. I'd rather that outcome than how things are now. Not saying we don't have some good things now but I quit reading Spider-man after Sins Past (which never would have happened if this story didn't end in shitty deus ex machina Norman Osborn coming back)

wait which scott is the real scott? are any of them the real scott? will this be resolved shortly or will we have to wait 2 years for a resolution to this plot where it will become horribly complicated and drawn out

@Yzyenthusiast

8 жыл бұрын

lol

@weeping_me362

8 жыл бұрын

and then we will have to end all but two clones and make one Edgy and have the other die by a villian that should be dead. Oh and then reboot the chanel once or twice and then do the same thing over again .

So what you're saying is that the Clone Saga was actually gonna be a good comic, but a series of bad choices and people leaving/quitting made it bad. So the inicial story was gonna be okay, but the execution and the decision to prolong it was bad.

Couldn't they have just made the Kingpin the villain? He's similar enough to Norman Osborne.

Anyone else recognized the Ramona Flowers drawing in the background?

@Fragile_Media

8 жыл бұрын

oh shit yeah

@JazGalaxy

8 жыл бұрын

I've seen that film like 12 times and I wouldn't have noticed it if you hadn't pointed it out. Good job.

@kitcollar3102

7 жыл бұрын

VariTimo 😱😂👌🏻

@alfa6349

7 жыл бұрын

His name is Scott and he has a doodle of Ramona. I see what he did there.

This is my favorite episode of comic misconceptions. I never thought about how editorial decisions can influence a storyline in such a profound way. I love how you look into behind the scenes stuff i never would have paid attention to otherwise. Keep up the great work guys!

Clone saga could have been saved with them having the original set up except have Spider-Man and scarlet spider fight, then team up, then have scarlet spider die in battle after saving Spider-Man. Then Spider-Man and Mary Jane have the baby, it's a boy and they name him Benjamin Reily Parker and then that could have set up a future story of Peter's son becoming the new scarlet spider after his parents are killed and he wants to avenge their death

@fightingmedialounge519

8 жыл бұрын

The problem is that would take to long and they wanted a solution as quick as possible.

@ScaryMason

7 жыл бұрын

What you describe is a bit like what happens in Savage Dragon. The book's star from the '90s is a supporting character of a story about his son Malcolm Dragon these days (maybe grand-kids too). Plus, the creator/writer/artist/part-owner-of-the-publisher are all the same dude so the story won't fall prey to some marketing department.

@luistorre669

6 жыл бұрын

so does anybody know what happened to the baby?

@rekius328

5 жыл бұрын

@@luistorre669 they retconned the baby, never happened. But they made an alternate reality comics. in where peters daughter happened and het daughter took the mantle of Spider-Girl.

@CrownRock1

5 жыл бұрын

The sliding time scale in comics makes raising kids problematic.

I actually loved the clone saga manly because of Ben Riley

@Obi-Wan_Kenobi

4 жыл бұрын

Are you my clone?

@Dragonsrcool12

4 жыл бұрын

General ke- Hey! You're not general Kenobi!

@liaml.e.5964

4 жыл бұрын

@@Obi-Wan_Kenobi You're a bold one...

@dsrtpixie

4 жыл бұрын

I also really enjoyed it. Was it good? hell no it was super confusing. Was it enjoyable as long as I turned my brain off? Yes.

@sonsonthegoddessofconfusio3183

3 жыл бұрын

I actually loved it for Ben and Kaine, Peter's female clone was cool I guess

the clone saga was awesome in ultimate spiderman comics (peter parker)

@KaijuRamen54

8 жыл бұрын

I love the way they introduced Spider-woman (girl?) into that story. The awkwardness between her and Peter was great. I wish they would have kept her story going

@LuisMoreno-ys3lu

8 жыл бұрын

that's true

@jonesjoestar

8 жыл бұрын

Yeah ultimate version is the only clone saga i read so i didn't get the hate for the clone saga in general

@Izayoiaki24

8 жыл бұрын

Well, that's mostly because it managed to keep itself to one brief story arc that takes place over the course of a single day - not three goddamn years over multiple titles. Kinda ironic that Bendis, the guy in comics most notorious for padding shit out like mattress tampons, took one of the most notoriously overlong arcs in comics and remade it to fit into one trade.

@Ghost7065

8 жыл бұрын

lady parker and furrie spider peter were awesome!

Well, my personal opinions on the clone saga: I didn't read the clone saga from the beginning, but when I started reading it, in few books I learned Peter Parker wasn't the amazing spiderman, instead Ben Reilly was the spiderman, MJ was pregnant, but she was given an abortive by a shady nurse, aunt May was dead and Norman Osborn, the man who killed Gwen Stacy, was back. Back then, it felt to me way worse than Captain America saying "Hail Hydra". It felt like a Marvel attempt at breaking the spiderman so it's character could grow gone horribly wrong. After today's Nerd Sync episode, I feel more enlightened. As far as I understood, it was more like an accident than some attempt at spidersadism. Good work. BTW, please do another one like this on "Spider-Man: One More Day" Spiderman Storyline. I heard it's the only other spider-story close enough to be a disaster like "Clone Saga", but I never really understood why.

@deathsdoor07

8 жыл бұрын

The baby was not aborted. She was kidnapped and died somehow off scene. Also, I hate One More Day because it made me hate Peter. I no longer buy the books. I bought Superior only because Peter "died".

@marcocoelho4258

8 жыл бұрын

deathsdoor07 They retconned it. When I first saw the comic, there was a scene showing some shady woman putting something into her coffee at a cafe. MJ went into labour after drinking the coffee, and later there was a very sad panel showing Peter hugging MJ and the shady woman, who was a nurse at the hospital, saying something like "It's done" to a mysterious figure, later revealed to be Norman Osborne. That's what I remember from memory, so it might be different from the comic itself, but I'm pretty sure the scene was meant to be an abortion before Marvel changed it once again to look like something else.

@deathsdoor07

8 жыл бұрын

Marco Túlio Todeschini Coelho I read that too but after that the "nurse" had the baby with her and Norman got her on a boat. A year later, she comes back and tells Peter the baby was alive and Norman has her killed. Peter instead finds Aunt May and the baby is not mentioned again which pissed me off. Marvel or the writers lets the readers know that the baby is alive because they went back to the "nurse" and baby occasionally. Then the "nurse" dies and Aunt May is revealed to be alive but no baby. You would think Peter would do some more investigating to find out if the woman was crazy or if she was telling the truth. Nope, he does none of that shit.

@marcocoelho4258

8 жыл бұрын

deathsdoor07 Yeah, it was a pretty confusing and sad comic book saga. Back then, I pretty much assumed Mary Jane was given some abortion drug by the shady nurse on Osborne's orders, but now, I have to admit I have no idea what was the endgame plan of the "Clone Saga". Besides, I can't say my memory is the most reliable one.

@Champsr0ck2247

7 жыл бұрын

Doesn't he have a daughter in 1 Marvel universe?

I always thought Kaine was actually cool. Why did they get rid of him again in Spider-verse.

@lazybot5569

8 жыл бұрын

Agreed, he was a cool character. A darker Spiderman that fought against underground stuff like drug dealers and human traffickers.

@mattbrown671

8 жыл бұрын

He was more relatable if you can say. I think spiderman needed that down to earth side of him.

@lazybot5569

8 жыл бұрын

Yeah, that's a good way to put it.

oh can you do a video why *All-Star Batman* is considered one of the *worst Batman stories* ever while *All-Star Superman* is considered *one of the best?*

@TheInfiniteSheldon

7 жыл бұрын

The short of it is that Grant Morrisson really understood Superman as a character and managed to sum him up in a modern parallel of the 12 Trials of Hercules, while Frank Miller basically told a Sin City story with a Batman skin.

@theotakuguy8957

7 жыл бұрын

Jay K. Weatherface Best type of irony right there.

@ianbailey6592

6 жыл бұрын

+Oval Cirlce I think those images should be classified as unholy. I can feel Satan trying to worm his way into my soul.

@CN-dl6fb

5 жыл бұрын

You shouldn't the type "the comic which mustn't be named" some say it so bad that even a single utter of the name can ruin some new writer's comic.

@Dimadick3

5 жыл бұрын

"why All-Star Batman is considered one of the worst Batman stories " Because that version of Batman literally gets sexually aroused when killing people, and had sex with Black Canary next to burning corpses?

That opening sequence was fantastic! Good work, my man!

@NerdSyncProductions

8 жыл бұрын

Thanks so much!

I was like, 13 when I read the saga issue by issue as it came out back in 1995 and it broke me. I was a huge Spiderman fan till that story. I had an uncle who gave me like, 30 or 40 years worth of back issues once and I would pour over those comics in awe. I felt like the Clone saga started off well, with nice nods to older Spidy stories, but then it just dropped the ball by outing the clone as the "real" Spiderman and the hero we've been following all these years as the clone. It might have bene a great idea on paper, but the way it was told just felt like it was shitting on Spidy history. I did like Kane though and thought he made a good, tragic villain.

What I liked about the Clone Saga was Mary Jane's sticking with Peter through thick and thin throughout the whole clone saga. She loved and supported him even when she thought he was a clone. She even showed guts when trying to get through to him when he was programmed to kill her. She had faith in Peter. I also liked Ben Reilly. I just thought he was a cool and likeable person, and I thought killing him off was terrible. He ended up being a brother to Peter.

Hey- Steven Butler here- I was one of the artists on the Clone Saga back in the day- just watched your video and enjoyed it a lot!

I heard Stan only said yes to Gwen's Death because he was in a trip and didn't really think about it and got distracted.

@NerdSyncProductions

8 жыл бұрын

There's probably a few different stories. I heard that he was all for it because he thought their relationship was too perfect. We'll never know the truth!

@afonsolucas2219

8 жыл бұрын

Only the Watcher knows!

@TheAdamusPrime

8 жыл бұрын

Sadly nobody besides those involved will actually know the real story, as it's really all just he-said-she-said nonsense.

I didn't even know the history of the clone saga, but when it came to the Norman Osborn part of the video I put my face between my hands in disgust and sighed in disbelief.

Robin said it best, *"Got to love an army of me."* So clones, eat your heart out. ♡

First rule of the clone saga: We don’t talk about the clone saga.

At the risk of getting a lot of hate... I actually liked the clone saga. You could argue that it's overarching story was a mess but this was really the first story that allowed Peter to grow above and beyond the boundaries of his alter ego. We saw Peter become a husband, a man and a potential father creating a life for him then MJ and it provided some of the most powerful moments in his history. Even his relationship with Ben was well developed during the arc and when he died that actually had some impact with me.

@darkthorpocomicknight7891

2 жыл бұрын

Hey man if you liked it great I just don't think it came about from good intentions It came through greed and ego but if you dug it great

Imagine if Ben Reilly was still Spider-man, the Clone Saga would be a classic as it would have been the passing on the mantle of Spider-man story.

I enjoy when stories are like, "Don't worry, it'll all be resolved never."

@Dimadick3

5 жыл бұрын

"I enjoy when stories are like, "Don't worry, it'll all be resolved never." " Then you will enjoy "Facade". A new, mysterious super-villain introduced in a 1994 Spider-Man. storyline. The storyline was a murder mystery and was supposed to increase reader's interest of who was hiding behind Facade's mask. But the writers themselves lost interest in it and moved on to other stories. Leaving a mystery without a solution for over 20 years.

To be honest, they should never have done the whole stupid thing to begin with. This was the beginning of the end of all the Spider-Man titles for me back in the day. I still cringe and get a headache at the mention of the Spider-Man Clone Saga. :(

Hello Scott, Will you ever do a video about the MC2 Universe and Spider-man Daughter May Parker a.k.a Spider-Girl?

#SaveTheScottWithNoTie Yeah. The one in the green plaid shirt. He's too much of a fully developed character to discard this early!

This is was really good, I was always curious why it took so long for that to end

I'm hesitant to say it because as young as I am, and possibly due to living in the UK, I may not have been able to read the entire saga and definitely couldn't on release, but from what I Did read I always quite enjoyed the clone saga. I liked Ben Riley and it would have been interesting to see the original ideas for the saga come to fruition. Because of my already stated lack of confidence that I've read the entire thing, it would be cool to see a detailed video on the actual events.

Every time I learn something about Stan Lee I love him more and more :,)

I'm probably the only one who actually like the Clone Saga. I recall actually buying a lot more Spidey comics on the edge of my seat, wondering what would happen next.

@DuArMinHjalte

8 жыл бұрын

Im with you. Seems to be a lot of unfair hate against the clone saga. I remeber enjoying it from start to finish.

@KaijuRamen54

8 жыл бұрын

I still like it. I guess because I dropped out of comics in the middle of it and only picked it up after it was finished...so for me it wasn't a long drawn out thing.

@Nightman221k

8 жыл бұрын

It has good elements. I wish that Ben had taken the reigns as Spidey and Peter had settled down with MJ and baby Mayday and he could occasionally don the suit and team up with Ben and then when May's older she could have a daddy and uncle who could teach her how to use her spider-powers. It would be so much better than the crap we have currently.

@jasenkage5761

7 жыл бұрын

+Jason Scarce You're not the only one. The Clone Saga from the nineties is my absolute favorite Spider-Man storyline. Like you said, it was an edge of your seat, heck of a story. Ben Reilly, Kaine, Spider-Cide, Judas Traveller. I mean, Ben even participated in the Marvel VS DC storyline, and was a part of the Amalgam Universe when he and SuperBoy merged into one being. Brilliant.

@jasenkage5761

7 жыл бұрын

+Nightman221k Damn. Now that sounds like it would make a very nice series. Ben definitely should have been the only Spider-Man from then on. It would of been so nice to see how Mayday and Ben interacted.

I personally love the character of Ben Reilly/Scarlet Spider. I also really like Kaine (who I am surprised you never mentioned, since he was a major part of the saga). Maximum Clonage just should have never happened as well as everything after that. I would have liked it if they kept Ben Reilly/Scarlet Spider and just had him living and working somewhere else in the US, Canada, or wherever, with an occasional Spider-Men team up (like if Carnage got loose again). Just think of it like how Dick Grayson went off to defend another city as Nightwing, but would every once in a while return to help Batman and Robin In fact, I am all for the return of Ben Reilly. Also, in all honesty, I loved his outfit. I don't know why, but I have always loved his outfit.

@kaitourobin3206

5 жыл бұрын

Agreed, i read the beginning of Ben Reilly and i really like him and his journey of self discovery. Also his background is extremely tragic. Same for Kaine. Past infor about me, Robin/nightwing/red hood/ red robin was my favorite superhero until recently when i read spiderman comic. Now spider-man got move to number one spot. They are very extremely similar to each other. How they talk and fight. However one thing i like about the robins is their team ups. Their sense of brotherhood. They were all raised by Batman and despite being different can related to each because of it. For me Ben Reilly, Kaine, and Peter parker are different person but all have memories of being raised by Ben and May and sense of responsibility. So i would love it if they do more team up as brothers. They already referred to themselves as brothers and their dynamic would be awesome. Especially them be able related to all thier tragedies. Ben Reilly being killed and forcibly back alive 30 times, kaine trying to be a beter person, and Peter parker well him being Peter parker. They so much to write about with this trio. (As long they keep to these three and no other clones it should be great.)

10:20 Ironically the exact opposite being Marvel's current approach.

Even though the clone saga was bad we can all agree that ben riley had the best spider-man suit and still does in my opinion 2nd goes to Miguel o'hara spider-man 2099.

@driftingswordsmanzer

8 жыл бұрын

Oh and the other scarlet spider-man kaine had amazing suit.

@ricardorios2355

8 жыл бұрын

Both their suits are just too 90s and didn't age well in my opinion.

@SarcasticDuck

8 жыл бұрын

superior Spidey said hi

@jerr0.

8 жыл бұрын

His suit looked better on Spider-girl/woman, unless you mean the Scarlet Spider one. I think that one is too 90's with the baggy top over spandex look

@brandontriplin5447

8 жыл бұрын

I think you mean ultimate spiderman

Ahg! I had the Death of Aunt May and I lost it!

@NerdSyncProductions

8 жыл бұрын

It was so sad!

Kaine is my favorite Parker clone, his story was sad and his Scarlet Spider costume is dope af

for some reason I imagine one person pitched "the death of spiderman" and in an alternate universe that was one of spiderman's biggest arcs

That starting was amazing lol

@NerdSyncProductions

8 жыл бұрын

:)

@juliendacoolien3454

8 жыл бұрын

Senpai notice me!

@SpoonDude

8 жыл бұрын

DEADPOOL VIDEO!

Hey Scott, I think you need a longer desk or less clutter. I know what you're going for but you look uncomfortable & that makes me uncomfortable. Unless that's one of your clones... in which case make the next one with smaller arms. :D

@wesleyseifers7308

8 жыл бұрын

I couldn't agree more

@craftykittygaming7820

8 жыл бұрын

Yeah, I like all the props, but if they're cluttering your desk you could move some away.

@icouldntcomeupwithanorigin2688

7 жыл бұрын

uhhh...what is he going for?

I like the green Scott. "Deadpool?" "Lalalalalala....." "Deadpool!"

The Clone Saga only made sense in the animated version of The Amazing Spider-Man back in the 90's. Where we get the start of the Gwen death & rebirth(clone), then Spider-man going to a alternate universe, that it was Spider-Man that was cloned and we have the whole Ben Reily vs Peter Parker. As it ended with Ben being the real Peter & Peter being the clone. It was finally told right in an animation form at least.

Oh was this a fun time to be a Spider-Man and X-men fan. The Onslaught saga was huge and I remember running to the comics stores to pick up how the story kept going. I really liked Ben Reilly as Spider-Man and getting the 4 part story that brought back Norman Osborn was such an awesome twist. That flip out cover with both Spider-Men fighting Green Goblin was released at such a perfect time because I painted that cover on a store window for my town's Halloweeen parade (the country's second largest parade for that holiday BTW!). I really wanted there to be TWO Spider-Men with Peter Parker being the one true Spidey. The miscarriage thing was upsetting though. It made me reluctant to continue reading Spidey for a while. But that wasn't as bad as One More Day/Brand New Day, which basically made everything I read and enjoyed about Spidey comics from the late 80s up until that point completely UNDONE. Oh and Budiansky's indecisiveness led to wonderful stories like "The Carwash of Doom!" Ugh....Ratbat should not be leader of the Decepticons even if for only one issue. Make mine TF cartoons!

"Clone Saga" "Umm, Star Wars?

You're telling me that the "pEtEr MuSt StAy ReLaTaBlE" thing started with Romita Sr. Refusing to kill Aunt May...? I seriously am questioning Marvel's quality at this point.

I remember when something like this happened in Young Justice, only it was done far better and everyone was happy: Roy Harper’s Clone had a daughter with Cheshire, while the Real Roy Harper got to reinvent himself as the dark, angsty Arsenal. The biggest difference is that the Real Roy went into a coma for five years, while Clone-Roy started a family during said five years (and knew that he was a clone for nearly as long)

"The clone saga... *Pats desk* Let's talk about it..." Do we have to?

Wow, it's just hilarious how Marvel imploded like this. I think all the higher-ups were to blame here.

I've been catching up with your videos for the last couple of weeks (just discovered your channel), watching them in no particular order, old and new, and this is my favorite hairstyle of yours so far. 😂

as a kid reading the comics and watching the animated series, i really liked the clone saga... or at least the parts i saw. I liked the character of scarlet spider. I always wanted a spin off series that could have expanded on things and made the plot a little more cohesive.

Bad Scott is my favorite Scott.

1990s Spider-Man animated series crack a joke about Clone saga during the final episodes. Spider-Girl became ideal run for the fans of Clone saga, even May 'Mayday' Parker's costumes was Ben Reilly's.

Uh I LOVE how you slipped in the little Hamilton Musical line at 15:40!!! Well done sir.

Washington cannot be left alone to his devices 15:42 The best thing he can do for the revolution is to turn back to planting seeds in mountain Vernon

15:45 wait is that a Hamilton reference or am I crazy?

@noahcelaya7085

8 жыл бұрын

I immediately thought of that too!

@lordthanatos3564

8 жыл бұрын

Aidypie lol

@bonhll8070

5 жыл бұрын

WASHINGTON CANNOT BE LEFT ALONE TO HIS DEVICES, INDECISIVE FROM CRISIS TO CRISIS

@ride-playerbb2818

5 жыл бұрын

😱😱😱

Linkara brought me here.

@davidspring4003

8 жыл бұрын

he is a MAY-AHN!

@SuperStryker2788

8 жыл бұрын

Of course. Don't you know SCIENCE

@kkirby_

8 жыл бұрын

only a SCIENCE MAJOR

I'm really glad they didn't let Norman stay dead; his appearances in Secret Invasion, Dark Reign, and Siege are some of his best, and most of those events wouldn't have happened without him.

I'm pretty sure the 1973 comic ended with spiderman realizing he had a cut that he had gotten within the last 3 weeks. after the clone was made.

Spider-Girl MC2 May Parker was the best thing. There was a good Mysterious Scarlet Spidey Xmas story too

keep the one who wanted to do a deadpool video I'm attached to him already

@NerdSyncProductions

8 жыл бұрын

Yikes. Haha

@theholtsclaw4600

8 жыл бұрын

fair enough

Hey Scott! After reading Ultimate Comics Spiderman and Superior Spiderman comics recently, I've learned of the existence of a lot of spider-men. If it isn't too much to ask, I would love to see you do some sort of compilation of every spider-man(or woman) ever!

Wow. This one video reveals the inside story of what drove me away from reading Spider-Man comic books and, became the beginning of a quick end for my entire comic book association. Amazing. I always knew it was Maximum Clonage, but now I know why and how.

I bet the one Scott that doesn't have a checkered shirt feels left out...poor little guy..

Scott, can we please get a Blue Beetle video, PLEASE ???!!

@NerdSyncProductions

8 жыл бұрын

About what specifically?

@cory3888

8 жыл бұрын

Anything is good, but I would love for you to explain the scarab of Jamie Reyes and how it has flip flopped from alien to magic, but some ted kord is always good too

@mdstevens0612

8 жыл бұрын

All the different versions, Blue Beetle in Young Justice/Teen Titans, Beetle mythology(like the different types of beetles and whatnot), Jaime's history as the Blue Beetle, Blue Beetle's relation to Booster Gold etc etc. I would be lying if I said that I didn't know much about the character outside YJ, Smallville and Justice League vs Teen Titans, and I'd personally love to learn more about him, in any of his incarnations.

@insertwittynamehere1411

8 жыл бұрын

A Booster Gold video would be better

@mdstevens0612

8 жыл бұрын

Annoying Nerd Why not both?

I've basically been binging Nerdsync videos and never had I realized that Scott had Scott Pilgrim's scribble of Ramona on his shelf.

Wow, this brought back memories, especially the Steve Skroce page shown at 18:02 If I remember correctly, the Allison character that Osborn was speaking to was not only fully visible but you could see that she was carrying Mary Jane's baby. I was told to redraw all the panels with the baby, so you couldn't tell what it was. I may even still have photocopies of the before and after pages somewhere!

Nicely edited and very creative intro

@PotrzebieConolly

6 жыл бұрын

I loved that intro.

So it's technically the fans fault.

Funny how most of the changes and shakeups in the Clone Saga got retconned as time progressed (Ex. Doctor Octopus ended up coming back after Kaine, the First Clone, killed him and the writers replaced him with a female Dock Ock.) but the one thing that remained constant for going on over 20 years was that Norman Osborn, whose revival was considered the worst idea in the Saga, is very much alive and is by far and wide considered to be Spider-man's worst enemy. Ever since his resurrection he's basically acted as the Final Boss to most multi-year stories. He tried to gain ultimate power at the end of Amazing Spider-man's first run in the late 90s, he was the mastermind behind Menace at the midpoint of the Brand New Day era, his supposed child was the target of all the Spider-man villains in the Brand New Day era, he led a huge Goblin siege on New York City at the end of Superior Spider-man, and he merged with the Carnage symbiote to become the Red Goblin in Amazing Spider-man 798-800, the final few books that Dan Slott, the chief writer of Spider-man post-One More Day, wrote. Bringing back Norman Osborn was probably, in the long run, the best thing the Clone Saga did... Any thoughts about bringing back Kaine and Ben Reilly and having them basically share the title of Scarlet Spider?

Funny how I was just praising how well written this episode was when you praised Amazing Spiderman 400's story. It's really amazing the way you present things now compared to when you started. It really shows that caring about something and practicing it makes you improve. Thank you as always for the entertainment :)

Meh. It's still better than One More Day.

@lazybot5569

8 жыл бұрын

Everything is better than One more day.....well except for Toxin:The Devil you know God that was terrible.

@deliz1414

8 жыл бұрын

It is? I've never read the clone saga or one more day but I've heard negative about both. I'll probably read them and compare the two to see which is worst

@sabilsadat

8 жыл бұрын

Fullmetal335 One's a messed up comic which leaves you confused for the most bit and the other is a story which destroys a perfect relationship which everybody loved (except the writer) with an equally convoluted plot which makes no sense and makes you wonder how someone like Spidey could make the decision he did. Now it's up to you to decide which one's worse.

@deliz1414

8 жыл бұрын

ok thanks for letting me know :)

@sabilsadat

8 жыл бұрын

Really tho I suggest you just look up these shit stories on the net and not actually read them. There are so many good stuff you should read to get a good time. For starters, read stuff like Spider-Man: Blue and Kraven's Last Hunt if you haven't already.

As always editors are the biggest villains in every story

I'll admit the time loop idea does sound like a useful way to explain how Ben survived this body getting dumped in a furnace after the 70s Clone Saga. Then again, I've not read the Clone Saga, so I don't know how that can of worms was addressed.

Is that the "Have you seen a girl with hair like this" sketch from Scott Pilgrim you got there on your shelf? Nice