i used to be able to sit down and play standard for hours and hours. now i play one or two games and rage quit.

@killat5469

7 күн бұрын

facts~

@Skitigdread

7 күн бұрын

Same, except not from rage quit but from fatigue. I'm just not feeling the game anymore.

@duranarts

7 күн бұрын

I get one game then I'm out

@Isabelle-mp8rk

7 күн бұрын

i get this tbh, the new twist has been an improvement though for me atleast

@prodstvrfire

7 күн бұрын

2 games that last till turn 5*

Because the HS team does not study the history of HS to understand what are design flaws and design hits and learn from past mistakes to improve on each iteration of design. So many mistakes that happen nowadays it's because we are repeating the same problems HS had for quite a long time. I understand staff rotates, but we need these new design teams to actually look at how previous metas worked, learn from them, and then design in such a way that actually creates new cards, not the same card we already had but much stronger.

@Karishin32

7 күн бұрын

Because the HS team is filled with talentless diversity hires.

@korekdorek

7 күн бұрын

More of a problem is they don't test cards, they just create them as a fun idea and power iteration. They are under the pressure all the time of earning money. It's impossible to balance a game, when you still create it. They don't stop creating better cards. This is why we get 5-7 turn games in standard. STANDARD, that's too wild.

@tomekk.1889

7 күн бұрын

​@@korekdorek It's both.

@AmiRaj99

7 күн бұрын

Like history itself we repeat our mastic

@ImpEranwel

7 күн бұрын

They are also potentially making more aggressive and frustrating cards to earn money. Aggressive decks win games faster, so quicker games are more friendly towards people who either "don't have time for games" or don't like slow paced games like Hearthstone (people with ADHD or zoomers for example). When it comes to frustrating mechanics in games, correct me if I'm wrong, those things are often used to make people addicted to those games. Apparently when you get frustrated over and over again, but that one time you experience something positive, that's when an addiction potentially starts. It's a survival thing. I'm not 100% sure if this is a thing, so again, correct me if I'm wrong.

Everything is designed to be as swingy and bomby as possible, or pointlessly weak. It's a very specific kind of design that revolves around flash rather than substance, while gleefully lighting any pretext of balance on fire.

@adamcosper3308

7 күн бұрын

You can't be serious.

@zsep8688

7 күн бұрын

​@@adamcosper3308what game have you been playing that you don't agree

@zsep8688

7 күн бұрын

​@@adamcosper3308arfus had a 78% wr. Multiple decks in standard (painlock, draw rogue) get 40/40 worth of stats turn 3-4

@adamcosper3308

7 күн бұрын

@@zsep8688 sure. the devs are "gleefully lighting any pretence of balance on fire". a very reasonable supposition.

@zsep8688

7 күн бұрын

@@adamcosper3308 so what is your argument bud. You have given zero counterargument. You just repeat the same incorrect statement.

There are a lot of unfun things in Hearthstone right now. Not everything is broken, but a lot of things are unfun. Uninteractive gameplay, easy OTKs, low cost mind control effects, and other things make me want to pull my hair out. I'm about to mention a few things in the game, not all of which are broken, or busted, but all of which feel like bad design. Things that make me want to uninstall game: - Brann - 8 mana win the game with no counterplay - Odynn - 9 mana win the game with no counter play - Mines that destroy your hand - Reno (being 9 mana is better) - Asymmetric board clear that can't be countered unless you don't play a minion style deck. - Plague that increases the mana cost of things so you can't play your hand randomly - Frog Staff is overtuned with 9 durability. - Weapons are uninteractable unless you have Viper, which feels like bad design. - There is no back and forth with the weapon - Uninteractable Magtheradon - Shaman spell that draws a nature spell and makes your hand free - Uninteractable Fatigue damage - This should never be good, and when it is good, it's unfun. - Decks are too consistent with card draw, and makes games feel samey. - Doomkin should have a condition - Malephic Rook on turn 2 off of demonic studies - With no board, a demon hunter can do 15 damage from hand with only 3 cards on turn 7 regularly - Weapon charge - Illidan Enforcer - Chaos Strike - Zarimi - Deny a turn with no counter play. - 0 Mana Rush + Mind Control with no counterplay from DK

@Nicenigel14

4 күн бұрын

Very true list

@neonoir__

2 күн бұрын

add sif to the list, not good anymore but horrible design

I think the main issue with current card design is each card performs too many functions. Your minions double as removal spells, ramp, direct damage, and card draw. Your direct damage spells also summon a minion. Your card draw also summons a minion. This kind of design makes stuff like the Priest location so frustrating. If they copy something like the DK Titan, they get removal and a big heal.

@SmashCentralOfficial

7 күн бұрын

Having Reska and Sylvanas in standard at the same time really made this obvious to me. Sylvanas used to be my favorite card, but now you can play her for 0 mana with Rush, and resummon her with lifesteal once you've finished excavating.

I miss the days where 4 mana 4/5 on turn 2 was a powerful play

@namelessshadow7748

7 күн бұрын

It would still be powerful, if they printed 2 mana 4/5 no text 😂

@tarille1043

7 күн бұрын

@@namelessshadow7748 They essentially did though. Coldtooth Yeti. It sucked.

@namelessshadow7748

7 күн бұрын

@@tarille1043 well, its conditional and 3 mana, and im talking about literal chillwind yeti on sale, 50% off!

@JamesCastle-vd1lc

7 күн бұрын

on turn 1 it was insane and possibly game winning xD

@dingus__1

7 күн бұрын

that was fun 10 years ago lol

This is what happens when you let your game be a constant arms race between the answers and the threats. For example, in the devs mind; Reno has to exist the way he does because any other type of straight forward removal is not perfect enough thanks to game winning death rattles/revival cards or really the untouchables like locations/dormant/rhea and Sargeras portal.

everything zeddy said was the core reason why I just don't play the game anymore playing big minions is heavily punished there are too many "for the rest of the game" winning without board control cards and too many deck/hand destruction/disruption cards the devs effectively took all the frustrating card designs, and made them the standard for every deck

@Lovyxia

7 күн бұрын

As someone who loves disruption, the buildaround legendaries are a big reason it feels so terrible in Hearthstone, IMO. Having your 1-of wincon at the bottom of the deck just dooms you to losing the same way as having it burned does. They either need to design around disruption or let us fish from our decks better because right now they lean into combining design philosophies to be way more anti-fun than they would be in isolation.

It’s because the new game devs have no concept I miss decks like deathrattle priest, Libram paladin everything seems so mediocre now

You forgot Sargeras. When that card's 'playable', it's INSUFFERABLE to play against and it's even worse than reno. It's literally a better plague of death + a 6 12 for no reason that NEEDS to be killed or the next turn, they win the game by infinitely summoning 2 3drops every turn. The only reason why there wasnt more outrage towards that card was 1: the playerbase loves warlock and simps for that class all the time, and 2: because reno counters it and you face reno decks every other game since that crap was printed. Also, dirty rat has always been trash design and Id argue that hes even worse than theotar. At least theotar was worthless vs aggro decks. Dirty rat was a card printed almost 10 years ago, and whenever it's been in standard or even in most metas in wild, it has been run at least one copy in EVERY deck. The card's a problem and it's a 'coin flip, win/lose the game' and completely shuts down many strategies and cannot be played around at all. There have literally been dozens of days where I load a fun deck, play a match for 15 mins and then get my win con ratted out, then I just close HS for the day and don't play it for a week. Hand disruption does not work in HS and shouldn't be in a game where both players usually draw most, if not all of their decks, only have 2 copies of a card or one legendary card. The only reason why people tolerate this garbage is because most of the players use it and say hehehe, my turn!"

I dream for a soft reboot of Hearthstone where they kill every of these freakin cards for the next rotation and start reverse-powercreep the game into something less BS and more interesting, but it's never gonna happen. This game is a cash-grab and nothing else and it's so bad, let's say it, it's a mess.

@robertlupa8273

7 күн бұрын

Most people would probably hate that.

@lucky_penguin

7 күн бұрын

@@robertlupa8273 ye, you

@juliandacosta6841

7 күн бұрын

They tried doing it with witchwood and rumble

@adalwolf8328

4 күн бұрын

​@@juliandacosta6841 Should have kept going with it. They were just overshadowed by the previous year's cards. We would have required two "low power" standard years for that to work.

Screw Puppet Theatre, priests can alr play their Titans like 10 times already, you don't have to play mine 10 times too, it should def be a Friendly Minion only at the very least, or just get it to 1 Durability, it's way too annoying

The problem is that there are fewer and fewer downsides to powerfull cards. At least cards like Tickatus and Denathrius require *time* and planning to use them to their full effect. There is NO downside to cards like Patchwerk or Tho'grun so long as their Battlecries go off.

@RedEyeStorm7

7 күн бұрын

At least Patchwork had rune requirements and wasn't stated very well for 7

Another nice thing about Dirty Rat is that there was always a possibility that it backfires on your opponent when they play it. It might end up helping you when they play it. Helps to balance the bad feeling when they summon your win condition from your hand. There is no downside to Tho'grun.

@guitaraffa

7 күн бұрын

A lot of people don't even know how to play Dirty Rat. Some people play it when they don't even have any mana left to answer whatever pops out.

@g_eddie

7 күн бұрын

@@guitaraffa That's another good point. At least when you get dirty rat'ed well you know your opponent had to put some thought and skill into it.

@bluesh0es

7 күн бұрын

It’s more to do with the fact that back then, decks had pure stat minions. Now every minion has a crazy effect which means no matter what, Dirtty Rat always hits something powerful and beneficial.

The problem is once you design a powerful card you can't go back. If you bring out another expansion and no card is obscenely broken then its just not playable. No one plays to have fun, they're just sweating it out

This is exactly why I can't bring myself to play Hearthstone anymore. The never ending cycle of frustrating and unbalanced card releases is just too much for me. If they actually turned a new leaf, or learned from their past mistakes, I'd gladly give the game another chance.

Why do Sarg and Reno not trigger deathrattles, but Twisting Nether does? I'm honestly getting frustrated with the HS team and the inconsistencies, powerful effects with no downside, and "anti-fun" card design

Objection was a card that genuinely made me hate playing hearthstone for the longest time. In wild you always had to have garbage in your hand to throw away to it against secret mage, because no matter what it'd always be a present threat...even if it wasn't actually there. Really sucked when you're going up against an aggro deck that refuses to pay any mana for anything that they do at that. But therein lies the problem as Objection is necessary interaction, which Hearthstone very much lacks. Honestly though, the lack of interactivity is just a fundamental design flaw that Hearthstone has. You can't do anything on your opponent's turn, do anything to really stop them, and everything on your turn has to be done to either combat your opponent, develop, or just throw in your hand and give up. Its why I fundamentally believe that Hearthstone is an Aggro and Combo only game, control will always lose while cards that favor faster gameplay exist in the game. In wild, control only exists in ways that are as toxic as they get. Insane armor generation, full clears with pretty much every removal, and so on.

Magic the Gathering devs have blogs where they talk about design hits and misses. They have talked about the "feel" of playing with and against different decks and cards. Looking at that previous Mind Vision version from beta and how it never made it to live shows the hearthstone devs are not backwards looking at all when they print zero sum disruption cards.

The thing that annoys me the most about reno is that they poof my board YET STILL HAVE A BOARD TO KILL ME WITH. 90% of my losses in legend is them playing zilliax ( perfect elusive of course) I can't beat it with one-to-one removal or minions so I have to flood the board to deal with it, and then I get poofed. BUT THEN THIS STILL HAVE ZILLIAX hitting me in the face. Like I can't even steal it with yog if I top deck it because of how stealing, reborn, and 1 minion slot work. Like hello TWISTING NETHER WOULD LIKE TO HAVE A WORD BLIZZAAAAAADDDD!!!

@RedEyeStorm7

7 күн бұрын

That zilliax only has 4 attack so its not really a must-kill that you should be playing all of your minions into, sounds like a misplay more than anything

Zeddy is dunking on my boy Theotar, but boy would i love to have him in standard right now. To fight against cards like Brann, Boomboss, wheel, reno, i would slot him in my deck in a heartbeat.

@shadowpriest2574

7 күн бұрын

People still play Wheel?

@remyllebeau77

7 күн бұрын

They need to have an anti-Reno card. And I'd probably play it in all my decks.

@virtualworld2231

7 күн бұрын

@@shadowpriest2574 wheel is actualy amazing right now

@oxtailsoup6493

7 күн бұрын

@@shadowpriest2574people are playing Highlander warlock with wheel.

@fatcat2015

7 күн бұрын

I was thinking this too, Theotar is a great way to actually interact with your opponent’s inevitable game winning strategy that you literally can’t interact with other than using dirty rat.

The problem with some of these cards is the counter play is gone. Like Boomboss could be countered by Steamcleaner; Steamcleaner is gone. Puzzle Theatre, Only two cards counter locations: Reno and Demolition Expert. And who is gonna main-deck Demolition Expert? In a matchup against a non-location deck its useless.

@kerotomas1

7 күн бұрын

The card design itself sucks. If they put back Steamcleaner then Boomboss is dead no one is gonna play it. Just like how no one plays it in Wild for this reason. Card design needs to change. The current way of cards being either valid or useless is retarded imo.

@theonlyron

7 күн бұрын

Don't disagree but a minor note is Twisting Nether now destroys locations, so there are three that counter

At least there's no "if your opponent is a druid, destroy their mana crystals" for 4 mana, or "for the rest of the game minions can't attack" for 4 mana, or 2 mana "destroy all goblns vs gnomes cards (wherever they are)". They didn't take that from magic.

Puppet Theather straight up made me dread facing priest and, eventually, uninstall the game (not the sole reason, but it was one of the main effects). I got to a point in which I was valuing my time more than ranks and I'd just concede against Priest to save me some time. It was the totally opposite of a fun experience. The same can be said about many of the cards shown here, but that one had the highest negative effect on me.

I wouldnt mind getting all of these power creep cards if i get to use it on a dungeon run or something. I really wish they would make a new revamped version of catacombs someday

Even though rogue and seedlock are the scourge of wild, I don't think it can be truly fun until hand destruction cards are removed. If you are playing a slow deck, you HAVE to play one of if not all of Theotar, Mutanus, dirty rat, or Okanni. If you don't, you're gimping yourself. It's not a game, it's a god dam arms race. Hearthstone is most fun when it's focused on response, not ruining your opponents entire strategy.

Absolutely agree with the take. Recently talked to a friend about the extreme "minion haters" like Reverb and "deluxe removal"(Like reno, aman thul, silences, polymoprhs etc). The problem with those effectrs is that they should be quite rare and costly. Those cards just turn many strategies unviable and that's not great - they basically create less game, not more and thats no good. To add onto the video, I find the design of many lategame "gamewinners" to be a little bit too game-win~y. Stuff like the Warlock Titan, Sargeras - that card on its own can beat many minion based strategies. Deepminer Brann+Boomboss. That one Shaman spell that buffs their everything everwhere by +2/+3. Paladin Excavate reward. All of those things are kind of... too much. There is so little gameplay in that. And the problem is that they are all pretty easy these days.

@RedEyeStorm7

7 күн бұрын

I wouldn't really compare Wish Upon A Star and the Paladin Excavate reward to Sargeras or Doubled Boomboss, like sure they create bigger boards but Wish Upon A Star is 7 mana so its more in line with that original design, and excavating requires you to excavate 4 times to reach that reward which I think also is more in line with the original design. Looking at cards like Lor'themar Theron or Therazane or Blackrock 'n' Roll can be a lot more oppressive with the massive amount of buffs they can generate, its just about what supporting cards are available to make them more consistent or if they can exist in current decks without getting overrun or countered.

@TheSorrowfulAngel

7 күн бұрын

@@RedEyeStorm7 I think they are comparable in big part b ecause the excavate package is not bad to run(it's not like excavate 1-3 are bad at all). Excavating, in most cases, is not a main strategy but just a small package. The point is how big those wincons are - and how easy they are. Its very similar to how Helya is stuffed into control DK decks with no other plague synergy just to win vs slower decks. And yeah, stuff like Wish is fine atm cause minion size feels like it barely matters. But what if it would matter? I think cards like that would be pretty bad for the game.

10:16 I largely agree, but I’d like to just bring it up that Convert is 3 mana and keeps the target’s statline. It’s a spell so it doesn’t have the advantages of a location, but generally I’d say it’s very in line with Puppet Theatre. Priest has always been like this.

I run Puppet Theatre in Reno Priest SOLELY to deal with Brann Warrior. You can answer their Brann with a 1 mana Brann of your own, which is a much better tempo swing than an 8 mana 2/4. Reno warrior also draws through their deck very fast, so copying their Boomboss Thogrun really hurts them. Lastly, you can copy their Dr. Boom to get your own board of Zilliaxs, provided you had your zilliaxs have die already.

Funny thing is if you play twist it really illustrates this so well. Whenever I've faced Arfus with c'thun it's really highlighted it's like 2 entirely different games.

I used to play hours and hours of constructed and here and there some BG. Now i only play BG... and im a sucker for golden cards... all my decks always were... i just played 3-4 games yesterday... i get aggro'ed by stupid hunter, then no minion mage just aims spells at my face and i die even with me healing like 20 HP a game. or you get warrior'ed by brann, boomboss, lose 4 minions to double dirty rat and then get killed by 4x 8 drop... HS doesnt make fun anymore... its all about lucking...

I feel like they should invent new rules/deckbuilding restrictions to give themselves more design space.

funny to see people have the same complaints I had in wild that no one cares about, especially right now seedlock is absolutely the most frustrating thing to play against, either you play aggro or you're probably dead

What makes things worse is that we are stuck with a number of these game killing cards for almost another 2 years.

I am more ticked off by players being able to play their whole deck in one turn past the rope burned out!!!!!

The devs goal is to have the matches not be board based. It’s that simple

Hakker IS a "last until end of game" effect mechanically, as it will shuffle more and more corrupted bloods.

Gunslinger Kurtrus is another example of a card the screws with your opponent. Again it’s not a popular card and has the highlander tag so it is conditional but I think it falls under the same umbrella of cards mentioned in this video.

@LightRuler003

7 күн бұрын

That’s because DH is a combo deck, kurtrus being a highlander card will never see play in DH

I don't use titans in my decks. Only mediocore cards for that reason. What about the nutral epic that let's you take 1 of the enemies' minions if they have 4 or more minions on the board. Sometimes you need to spawn minions for your rival and in the past the minion was chosen randomly

its interesting how warlock , warrior or priest only get these style of cards

@frozensquid9301

7 күн бұрын

Rogue's Velarok is fun and interactive the new and improved penflinger, Zeddy mentioned Helya, Hunter charge minion that removes your entire board just for good measure, Reverberations was a problem long before the current meta, Spell Druid playing with himself to otk you for 120 damage from hand on turn 7-8 having 0 interaction with the opponent, Shaman was the same in Titans expansion.

It really sucks cuz we have concepts that completely ignore the board and are incredibly low interaction and are annoying (like quest warlock etc) then we have cards that somehow interact with it (theotar etc) but they also ruin other strategies so a solution to a problem ends up also being a problem.

I have seen many people talking about several problems, but one complain that i think its fair and i didn't saw someone talking about is the overload of resources that classes have these days. Too much HP, too much mana, too much mana reducing, discovering 500 spells while reducing its costs. Starting decks with 40 45 50 cards... The second complain is: In my experience, the game is less and less dynamic. Every match is the same: The same classes, the same decks, the same playstyles.

In Wild, I currently don't understand how people play with this... the Quest Mage deck, man, you keep drawing your deck, play two Ice Blocks, two spells that make you take only one damage per turn, and then you win the game. You play alone, in your own little world, with no interaction. Besides being extremely annoying for the opponent who had won the game 5 turns ago but can't actually win because the mage played two Ice Blocks, etc., etc., and won the game, playing alone...

The designers of the game aparently don't thinking about the concept of payoof. Reno Warrior for example Get's Brann, a powerfull effect for the rest of the game. Reno Hunter, the worst reno deck ever, gains a 4 mana 3/4 who attacks everything and it's that. Just that. Cards like Dorian or Puppet Theater also creates a big problem. 1 mana big effect wasn't acceptable. Just no. Druid OTK is a Thing on Legend rank just because of that. And of course, Priest control was unbelievable value stealling everything from you and creating yours on value. Honestly, I don't have as much fun playing HS anymore and games have become increasingly rare. I've been using BG more, which despite also being unbalanced, at least leaves room for creativity and allows you to climb the rankings, reaching second or third, despite some bastard placing 4 minions with poison and Leeroy with reborn

Thats the problem with powercreep. Powerful disruption cards exist to keep other strong cards in check. Hearthstone is way too far gone for them to stop making these "unfun" cards without other fustrating cards running rampant.

@kerotomas1

7 күн бұрын

Yeah the amount of complete removals in this game now is crazy. It's pointless to play big impact big minions as they just go poof instantly. Every minion is now about it's Battlecry and then it's gone.

Disruption is important, yet the issue comes from the cards that go over the top. Burning a 5th of your deck shouldn't happen, but we really don't have an option to nullify spells, locations, and heros.

Plus I never understood why people wanted Reno/Brann to be changed to "If the deck *started* with no dups..." Horrible suggestion. Now we don't even have a way to block the effect by shuffling cards into the opponent's deck. Well done to the involved ...

@GK-jg2ee

7 күн бұрын

it's to nerf Reno - slower decks used to just play him out when they didn't have a lot of cards left in their deck, without having the deckbuilding restriction

@RudolfAW

7 күн бұрын

I agree with you that Reno had to be nerfed. But it should be something else, like Clear both sides, after all he is the Lone ranger. I find more frustrating the inability of countering highlander cards than any deck capable of running them.

I don't understand why Reno is not 10mana. Honestly, The Highlander requirement is not much of a hindrance in a world where Blizzard is printing more cards to choose from. I'm pretty confident that earlier Highlander decks did not have such a wide selection of good cards to choose from. Every turn is a stall or draw cards, not playing meaningful minions or spells. Then around turn 7 you play one good legendary followed by another until you win.

11:18 I remember a game I managed to dirty rat out brann and was so happy, but the next turn my opponent excavate the Azeroth chunk for 3 mana card, which gave him the paparazzi discover a legendary card and discovered Brann back and played it the same turn. I just conceded, was the most hate I ever felt in this game

I believe this is an aspect of trying to make the cards in the game feel more exciting to play with. I think it's also possible that many cards that are frustrating to play against are power crept versions of ways to deal with other strategies.

Well said Zeddy! This is exactly how I feel when playing Hearthstone these days. I missed the old Hearthstone.

If only there was a mode where we could play as if during past metas, such as during the boomsday expansion.

I think it's great to have more ways of stopping your opponents from doing things so long as there's also more ways of stopping you from stopping them from doing things, and so on. The more they insist on making big payoff cards like odin, brann, or pre-nerf denathrius, the more important it is to have ways of disrupting your opponent's plan. The reason busted heroes and quests suck so much for the game is that there's no good way of shutting them off. I like when both payoffs and disruption are weaker and you get a slower and less swingy game. If we have to live in a world w/ pushed threats, though, I also want pushed answers.

I've long quit Hearhstone but it seems the general experience is still the same. My biggest problem was that even though the meta was fairly balanced, every single popular deck just felt like shit to lose against. This is infact a design issue, not a balance issue. I also find that the game's creativity is going downhill with each expansion , with cards being designed only with very specific archetypes in mind.

3:43 In theotar’s defense, granted his effect was busted vs combo and many strats, but it was way more reasonable because you have to give a card back to the opponent, which could be beneficial for the opponent. The boomboss however, is completely busted in any way shape or form, it would be already super powerful if it blew just one from either board hand OR deck, but all at once is game ending the turn you draw into that. Tickatus we stil the deck burn effect on the symphony legendary for lock, it feels good when you burn those sweet legendaries but it still won’t necessarily win the game, thorgrun always leads to concede the turn after it has been played(since usually it’s played after brann leading to 6 rather than 3 bombs, giving the opponent -16 cards at max value) blowing half of the enemies’ deck shouldn’t be allowed in no game for a single card to do so

i just absolutely HATE how there's so many cards that have absolutely no counter 😭 the warrior legendaries, plagues etc. i really don't understand what the devs are thinking sometimes

the good thing is we can still play classic to avoid this ...oh wait ....

It used to be that a 4 mana 4/5 felt good to play. Not because it immediately did anything, but because it had stats that made it difficult to remove and thus likely you'd get a good trade with it. Nowadays, it feels like crap if you play anything less than a 4 mana 40/50 Divine Shield, Rush, Windfury, Battlecry: Destroy your opponent's hand, deck and board and gain 400 armor... They make everything so fast these days that everything has immediate impact. But they haven't quite figured out that with the way Hearthstone works that's not fun because you can't interact with opponents on their turn. So they simply slap band aids on it by introducing hand/deck disruption. Which is still not fun. Heck, this need for everything to be so immediate is why Puppet Theatre feels so bad. Since you get whatever broken effect the card has despite it being a 1/1. Imagine using Puppet Theatre on a Boulderfist Oger? Instead of having Good Stats for the Cost you'd be stuck with a crappy 1 mana 1/1.

Really missing steamcleaner in standard nowadays

@mikeike2177

7 күн бұрын

its too strong in a highlander meta

@7thwander781

7 күн бұрын

@mikeike2177 why too strong? Highlander has been already changed to check starting deck not current deck

There are a lot of cards that try to do unfair things fairly, such as destroying or stealing cards, or doubling already powerful effects. It’s the sign of limited ideas. It’s clear that the early team reached for low-hanging fruit, as early effects were simple and uncomplicated. New sets had fewer cards until they doubled the legendaries and added two classes to meet commercial needs, and now it’s harder than ever to innovate outside of new card types and mechanics. It’s not going to get better.

Ever Since Brode left the game, the quality of HS has gone downhill. He quit when they released Shudderwok. Second I feel like they made HS less intelligent. The Excavate mechanic is like training wheels. Play a card get then get another progressively more powerful and more braindead card. The last issue is the game relies to heavily on the discover mechanic.These factors negate strategy and thinking and reward bad plays with hailmary effects. I started watching HS streams from a streamer named Noxxious who made a "Randowin deck, which was priest with every random effect card at that time. The pools of cards were limited and the deck was aweful. But it made watching HS fun. The development team took this idea and ran it into the ground, thus killing traditional HS with a slot machine game.

This type of meta is alot more obvious to me since I'm playing Spell Mage for ladder right now. Apart from Handbuff Pally, every deck tries their best to punish you for playing ant minion, and that's why I started playing Spell Mage, as alot of these decks will fill their hands with cards that won't work against Spells, so 90% of the time it's a one sided win. Standart is currently filled with Control, and we don't have OTK decks to deal with them right now, making Spell Mage and Secret Hunter the closest thing dealing 20 or even 40 dmg in a turn. But it doesn't stop there as the new Dorian is definetly gonna become a problem in the future, as of right now he's being played alot on Wild with Druid due to how you're able to Target Draw cards after you play him. Standart doesn't currently have Target Draws, but they'll have a long time to make some as he's part of the first new expansion of this rotation. The most annoying part is that there isn't a way to rightfully nerf these cards without changing them entirely. You can make Helya reshuffle every plague that has been shuffled this game but then Plagues lose their wincondition aspect, making them unviable. Change Zilliax's Elusive into smth like Magnetic and the module becomes unplayable. And I don't even know how you'd change Reno. Things like this make PvP games have less of an appeal than their PvE side. Battlegrounds is a good example, it's still PvP but it puts itself in a PvE aspect where every player has access to every card and their counter, making the only thing that'd make it unfun being the updates that either tune up or tune down a gameplan, usually tribes, way too much, like how it's happening to Quillboars right now.

I'm not trying to be too optimistic, but this is kinda what happened with Yugioh, around 2016-2019 cards and decks were getting more and more overpowered, acquiring more ways to stop the opponent from playing the game, until eventually it reached a critical mass where everything was pretty much that broken, and the game is arguably better because of it. The main problem I can see is that that kind of system works much better without mana. With mana, I can see HS devolving into decks that have early mana cheat (the only viable ones) and the decks that don't (all of which are unplayable).

I don't mind freeze effects or stat stealing effects. I don't play arena, however. But I view those cards as delay or temporary removal. If you play a big 8/8 I think you should also be packing ways to deal with a big 8/8 from the opponent no matter how they got it. Because that would be meta right - folks playing 8/8's? And for a stat stealing effect or a freeze effect it's often a dead card in the hand until it it can come online coupled with a deck building cost to have such things. But what absolutely frustrates me beyond belief is cards that mess with your hand and deck that you cannot do anything about. As a MTG player in the late 90's and 2000's this type of mechanic in hearthstone is exceptionally annoying because of the lack of interactivity during the opponents turn. Boomboss, Symphony of Sins, Banker, Theo I find to be way worse than puppet theatre. I still don't understand why we don't have some GOOD destroy location tech which I think would solve that particular card mostly. I can see why Helya could be viewed as problematic design. But the win condition takes so long and you aren't really denying the opponent from playing their strategy. I actually kind of like the card and think it's one of the more fair ways to interact with the opponents deck that is not over the top. It's a great contrast to Boomboss which interacts with your opponents deck in the most unfun way. Things that mill, destroy or steal cards before they can be seen or played by the deck owner is the most obnoxious by far.

Doesn't help that most metas nowadays has so many uninteractable win conditions that it rarely fun to face them

The Reno Sargerus (warlock titan) relationship is terribly designed imo. I think having an non-interactable portal on a minion isn't the best idea (same for druid dragon), but to then print a single card that can interact with it feels terrible! As a warlock it feels you lost because you queued into Reno, and as a non-reno queueing into warlock you feel bad because you didn't even have the option for the tech!

If they want to release these kind of cards, they should at least confine them to a third expansion. Reverb being in the game for 2 years is far more frustrating than if it was released in Badlands

I’ve lost so many games to Reno is crazy. Even if you get through the unlimited amount of board clearing control decks have, this one card just seals the deal. Why even play anymore if you’re punished for playing the damn game?

I am ok with power creep cards but we need to have cards that allow us to interact/counter those cards. So example there are zero ways to interact with a location aside from Reno. Brann is played and the opponent can do nothing but watch so much for player versus player. So another example used are the Plagues we can't do anything as they removed Steam Cleaner from standard so the HS team is really clueless in designing a game and it's card base.

I agree with your every thought on this design complaint. But, and even though I love decks that play for the board, I was never frustrated by Reno lone ranger even once. You know when your opponent have it in their deck or not so you can somehow play around him and adapt your plays. Edit : I find early board clear such as mass hysteria or the shaman titan way more frustrating. Or even Barov to some extend

They should rework some discovery and drawing cards while they're at it!

nothing is fun in hearthstone anymore used to be able to play this all day now i play like 5 and im good

Basically, players hate hand and deck destruction cards but it is a necessary evil. I would love a softer 'objection' secret. Instead of remove it, silence it before the battlecry. If it is a mage secret, let it only activates for 3 mana and above minion. That will be so nice cos the enemy can't just drop a 1 mana drop to counter that easily. That would provide more balance it card decisions cos battlecry minions are just better cos they can't be stop now when played where other effects can be deal with in other ways.

3:30 and now Cora will never trust Zeddy again with a insight developer's view

The game being both non-interactive AND having hand/deck disruption is a strange combo. Worst of both worlds. Disruption would be fine if I could respond to it. This game used to be about tempo. Now it's just about card draw, mana acceleration, tutors and cost reduction/avoidance. Every deck is a combo deck. Reminds me of MTG when Urza's Legacy came out. If there's no back-and-forth, there is no gameplay. It feels like every game now is show-and-tell. My opponent spends 3 or 4 turns cycling through his whole deck, then says "I like this card" and the game is over.

I agree 100% Zeddy with Puppet Theatre being the worst feeling card to play against. Arena currently you get 1 legendary that you build your deck around and despite puppet theatre being a low win rate card, I have had it win the priests game just by stealing my Sylvanas, the Accused or big bomb causing me much salt.

I think the craziest part for me personally is coming from a competitive yugioh and MTG background: I still feel like hearthstone still has more deck diversity than both of those games. Like, I understand people's frustration with big bomb cards but if those all get nerfed to the ground than the game just devolves into aggrostone. Without those bombs being a solid win condition for control decks nobody would play them. Because that's what these bombs are. They aren't supposed to be big neat minions with a ton of counter play; they are *win conditions.* if those bombs don't win you the game than there is no reason to play a late game strategy. And why would you? It would be better to just play an aggro or midrange deck and just play for the board if there is no payoff that can win you the game for control. Control decks are already on their last legs and nerfing their win conditions because they win the game would feel like a huge mistake

It seems to me that the devs can't estimate the cost of some effects anymore. For example, Reno, Loneranger is an unprecedented battlecry that is priceless and above average Hero Power. I know the condition makes it a little more difficult to determine the price of the card, but personally I'd like to see an analysis from anyone I know of how much the Reno, loneranger would probably cost if it didn't have that condition.

@RedEyeStorm7

7 күн бұрын

Well it wouldn't been a Reno card if it didn't have that condition, and even at 10 mana it would be too strong so it would need some other condition to balance it out.

Devs think they know better than us. They don't understand fun, counterplay and strategy.

People complained so much that warrior was weak, but ngl the moment warrior became playable game became so boring/tilting to play.

@LightRuler003

7 күн бұрын

Zeddy was the one pushing for warrior getting buffed….

as a wild player, all the games where i die by turn 4, with having played two cards, are super frustrating. they constantly creating cards for making the game quicker and quicker. why should I bother playing the game if they don't want me to?

Yeah, Showdown in Badlands is my most hated expansion so far. I knew the bar was set too high with previous rotation expansions, but this is just so bad. I can't even bring myself to play HS anymore.

You know it is bad when you have no choice but to play these stale and predictable decks to win. AND even when you do win, you feel ZERO satisfaction.

Its insane that people are more mad about control minions/effects than the 4-5 decks that kill you on turn 5 Its just who draws better at that point

Well said Zeddy, totally agree. And you even dont tell about Zarimi (Extra Turn) or Wheel of Death (Dead in 5 Turns) before the Nerfs. This shows rly good, that new Card Designs delete the Interaction in the Game. Maybe a new Team.. maybe Blizz want it make easier for Casual Players. I dont know... i feel kina burnt out from waiting till next Expansion and next Nerfs/Buffs.

reno board lock and puppet theater feels like the 2 worst cards to play against in my matches usually, i really hate those cards

OMG, Thank you Zeddy... At last some one is our voice :D

This video is bang on how I feel, Thank you for using your platform to be real and address the issues. I have a screen shot of my mage opponent using the armor freeze to freeze my zilliak every round it doubled attack and gaining over 200 armor. Oh yeh then he summoned a frozen copy of mine and killed me. Smart but should not be allowed in Standard.

I feel like the game revolves around 1-card comebacks or nails in the coffin. I don’t want aggro to ruthlessly dominate but it feels like building a board and dealing steady damage over turns is just a losing strategy. One zilliax after all that and you know it’s just over. One reno. One of many many board clears. If you’re a control player, this is your season for sure.

I like how they made Snake Oil Salesman to counter Highlander and one DK care gets them to change Highlander into start of game. Countering Highlander with duplicates was its counter. Bring back a steam cleaner esque card and revert Highlander into a counterable archetype.

@adamcosper3308

7 күн бұрын

Salesman obviously wasn't created to counter Highlander. What are you talking about?

@frozensquid9301

7 күн бұрын

Playing a deck of singletons or odd/even cards IS the drawback if the deck,

@benscoffin6537

7 күн бұрын

Steamclearner is another part of the problem, same with viper. Can't play a weapon deck if every deck runs weapon removal, can't win by shuffling cards into the deck if theres a card that just removes them. The counterplay to these kinds of strategies should by default be pressure or defense, hard counters should be limited and come at a premium. Also, cards like Glacial Shard is a much healthier counter to weapons than Viper and overall useful in more situations and so less polarising. I feel that I shouldn't ever be in a situation where a 3-mana premium statted minion with tradeable is hard countering my deck.

As a ladder only player, the meta seems it hasnt been this bad in a long time…

Back when Duels was still around (RIP) it was the reason I complained about Eerie Shadow and Ring of Black Ice. Get a copy of a minion that costs 2 less when you kill it with a Shadow spell/freeze it.

@_tntpig_

7 күн бұрын

Dont forget shadowcasting 101

@klyngdoh

7 күн бұрын

@@_tntpig_ Shadowcasting was still your own minion at least, I didn't worry about the enemy using my minions

I really liked the way the game way going up until Black Rock Mountain, it was so exciting for each expansion/adventure. I don't mind the other expansions after that but holy do I miss those days of HS. There were def broken stuff as always but it was something about it that was thrilling, and everything was so hyped up and made with love. Ben Brode - tha man

Suddenly we're missing Ben Brode huh

Great point made about being punished for playing minions. So sad and true. Personally I love cool minions like Stitchensew and couldn't wait to play it. Then reality checked in and it became more detrimental to play than not 😢

I hate card removal from deck and hand. HS needs counters that counter the board environment, not my deck. I’m fine with bombs or plagues being shuffled in my deck that I need to deal with. But only if there actually is a way to deal with them. Need to be able to remove cards in my deck that did not start there. Game has way too much front loaded power. It’s less about strategy and more about who can set up their win in less than 6 turns.

I played exactly one game of standard just now and when Reno cleared the entire board I just conceded and logged off. I know the devs are people just trying to do their best, but I don't think they know how to design cards. The game is so unfun lately. Losing like this leaves a horrible taste in my mouth and prevents me from the desire to play.

I like that you bring this up, I honestly believe design is a major flaw which is not only effecting short term, but look at the long term how many people have left because of the direction of the design of game, and the people who won’t come back because of terrible design, this game could be the best, it could be fun for years to come but this direction helya, Reno , delete cards super cheap mana cost rubbish is not it period I hope hearthstone competition kicks up ima support them more because they been doing this type of bad design for a long time now.

Great video zeddy. Thanks for having a voice for the community.

@josephcarlson896

7 күн бұрын

That’s amazing Zeddy! Thanks so much. I’m struggling to message you on telegram, I live in England if that’s going to be a problem.

I completely agree on puppet theatre, i feel like thief priest is toxic for the game because it locks out slow decks based on randomness and easily obtain quest rewards in wild.