I was 18 at the time. I watched the first episode of "Mary" and was so disappointed I didn't bother watching it again.

@David-yw2lv

6 ай бұрын

It was weird and silly.Despite all the talk of variety shows falling out of favor at the time,Mary would have been a failure in their heyday.

@orbyfan

Ай бұрын

I was 17, and I had the same reaction. I remember the young talent in the supporting cast.

I remember watching this when it was first broadcast. "Mary", considering it's mega-successful predecessors, was anticipated to me a smash hit, and it's expected success was highly foreshadowed.

Swoosie Kurtz went on to have a long successful award-winning career.

Do remember this dated turd - couldn’t believe it. Glad you mentioned the other ‘’Mary’’ show which came later. It didn’t last long, but beat this thing by a mile.

I remember toward the end of the first show, she did a "retrospective" of "The First 48 Minutes of the Mary Show" and I thought the concept was hilarious. They show the opening of the show and Mary says: "Oh! Look at my hair!" I have to believe it was a David Letterman-written concept.

Would you consider doing a video on Carol Burnett’s flameout in ‘91? I (heart) Carol but I felt sad for her trying to keep up with the changes in sketch shows since her OG series ended in the 70’s.

@TonyBoyOhBoy

10 ай бұрын

Thanks, I'll add it to my list!

@jasonbeard4713

10 ай бұрын

I agree. She didn't need to lower herself to that mediocrity.

@douglastrapasso3441

10 ай бұрын

@@jasonbeard4713 - Assuming you’re on the subject of Burnett and not MTM, it’s one of the strangest flameouts of 90’s TV. NBC had her booked for two half -seasons of something called “Carol & Company” which wasn’t exactly her old show but connected to a Tracey Ullman-esque vibe that was popular at the time. Putting her in the same night/time slot as previous hit “Dallas” may have looked right on paper, but no show in that slot could likely meet expectations.

@jasonbeard4713

10 ай бұрын

@@douglastrapasso3441 Yes. That series was an embarrassment. Carol knew it wouldn't be accepted.

At this point, Mary didn't have Grant Tinker or Carl Reiner to manage the talent they had. Tinker and Reiner were ring leaders in circuses full of talented people who wanted to pull things in their own direction. So much success depends on one person who can corral them all into a collaboration that produces a funny result. Not enough time was taken to develop the show either - there was no "boss" that knew what they were doing.

@TonyBoyOhBoy

10 ай бұрын

Excellent points.

@paulascott5701

10 ай бұрын

@@TonyBoyOhBoy Ooops, I said Rob Reiner and meant to say Carl Reiner (creator of The Dick Van Dyke Show, in case there are youngsters out there who don't know that). I corrected it.

It failed so David Letterman could get his own show.

@TonyBoyOhBoy

10 ай бұрын

🤣

I actually remember watching this show and I can’t remember a thing about it. It’s like a blip on my memory screen. From what you’ve shown I can see why.I didn’t know it only lasted three episodes. Also, remember watching the Brady Bunch variety show with fake Jan. Fake Jan actually had a pretty good singing voice.

@brockreynolds870

10 ай бұрын

Very true. Big problem with Brady Bunch hour was a bunch of not very good singers. the entrie cast had two people who could REALLY sing. Geri Reischl (Fake Jan), and Florence Henderson. But then they had Florence singing matieral that did not suit her voice. Sorry... but a disco medley is NOT something that is right for Florence Henderson, as talented as she is. Maureen McCormick and Barry Williams could carry a tune, but were not really that good a singers. Barry has improved vastly over the years.

@flobrez2470

10 ай бұрын

@@brockreynolds870 yeah I remember seeing an interview with Susan Olsen many years later saying none of them could really sing or dance very well in comparison with other groups of the time like the Osmonds or the Jacksons. She said we were way out of our league lol. They did release a few albums as the Brady kids. I remember because I had one. But at least they were better than the partridge family. The only ones who sang were Shirley Jones and David Cassidy. The rest were studio musicians because the other actors couldn’t sing or play.

@brockreynolds870

10 ай бұрын

@@flobrez2470 That show would have been better had they gave Florence a solo every week, in a realm of music that she is GOOD at (Like when she sang "Elusive Butterfly" on the Muppet Show). If you've never seen her in song Of Norway, you should. She's amazing. kzread.info/dash/bejne/aISduryIXayYYLQ.html

The reason why the original MTM show succeeded was because of the supporting cast (Ted Knight, Ed Asner, Valerie Harper) and not because of Mary’s comedic talents which were extremely thin. Her two post show attempts were classic failures and had she not delivered in Ordinary People (a film which I did not like), her career would have ended

Wow I never knew about that that's crazy

Primetime was never ready for David letterman.

"The Variety Show in the Sky" Is the perfect picture of 70s heaven lol.

@TonyBoyOhBoy

10 ай бұрын

Thank you!

I remember watching this. My family and I were so looking forward to seeing it, because we all loved MTM so much, but also because, as this video explains, variety shows had all but disappeared, and we all loved watching them. Shockingly, the show “Mary” was just terrible. It felt so forced, and utterly fake that it was a complete disaster. The costars added nothing that might have improved it, either. I didn’t bother to watch the other episodes, and I can’t remember if anyone else in my family watched it, either, but none of us were surprised when it was cancelled, or that it was cancelled so quickly.

@TonyBoyOhBoy

10 ай бұрын

Very well said. I think you summed up how many others felt when they tuned in.

@Cheerfultoday

10 ай бұрын

@@TonyBoyOhBoythank you.

they really DID run everything into the ground lol

I love Mary and remember watching the premier mom and sister....much as i loved Mary hated this

The writing would have to improve to have been bad.

Was this the one that had the Ed Asner dancers??

@TonyBoyOhBoy

10 ай бұрын

Yep. I have to admit, that was pretty bizarrely funny.

I remember this show. That's strange since it came on Sunday night. Apparently we didn't go to evening services as much. Now many churches, including my own, no longer have regular Sunday night services. Battlestar Galactica was supposed to be the huge hit that year. Spoiler alert: this version only lasted one season. After Mary failed, CBS moved All in the Family in that time slot. My impression of David Letterman never changed from this first encounter. He was very obnoxious on this show. Jim Hampton was also in The Longest Yard. He later played the dad in the original Teen Wolf. I also recall seeing him on The PTL Club. Judy Kahan had played Rob Reiner's wife on his ABC series Free Country. (While I can't stand his politics, I might buy the DVDs if that 5 five episode series was available.) One question comes to mind. Did the CBS executives who approved this series also once wanted Carol Burnett to do a sitcom? The opening show had the Ed Asner Dancers. Another episode with Harvey Korman had an awful sketch about a girl who wouldn't eat her vegetables. TV Guide later listed this show as the most expensive regarding unshown episodes. Some sketches, and Michael Keaton, would appear in her next series. I remember Dick Van Dyke appearing in one episode. There was a sketch about the Petries. The only cast member from MTM to not have another hit show was Mary Tyler Moore. (Georgia Engel qualifies for her recurring roles on Coach, Everybody Loves Raymond, and Hot in Cleveland.) She was very talented but had trouble finding the next hit. Her sitcom also called Mary introduced folks to Katey Segal. I never saw Annie McGuire. The last successful network variety show was with Barbara Mandrell. She had to end it due to voice problems. You should do a video about Dolly's ABC series. Trying to make her into Carol Burnett was a mistake. That show was actually getting toward the end. Her episode in Nashville, including a reunion with Porter Waggoner, was a classic.

@TonyBoyOhBoy

10 ай бұрын

Wow, great post!

I remember that (unfortunately) it was dreadful

The video is too short; maybe you should have combined it with a segment about that second show you mentioned. David Letterman actually brought this up on his late night show when Mary Tyler Moore guested, and you could tell it was something she wanted to forget. 😀

@TonyBoyOhBoy

10 ай бұрын

Yeah, in hindsight I could have done both in one episode. Might have been better that way.

Those Writers Must Of Been Amateurs!”

@bluecollarlit

2 ай бұрын

must have been

The TV trifecta is one of the rarest accomplishments.

@TonyBoyOhBoy

10 ай бұрын

Yeah, Lucy did three, but the 4th was one too many. Can't think of any off the top of my head who had 4 successful ones.

@Quartzquiz333

10 ай бұрын

​@@TonyBoyOhBoy Bill Cosby had I Spy, Fat Albert, The Cosby Show and Cosby. He also had mild success with The Bill Cosby Show, which lasted two seasons. He was also in the first season of The Electric Company but left to work on Fat Albert with Filmation and CBS.

@mrgreengenes04

10 ай бұрын

Betty White had The Mary Tyler Moore Show, The Golden Girls, and Hot in Cleveland. She wasn't necessarily the "star" of the shows, but still is known for being a cast member of all three.

@blockcl

10 ай бұрын

@@TonyBoyOhBoy When I posted the comment, I expected someone to mention Michael Landon. He was a lead in three prime time network hit series (Bonanza, Little House on the Prairie, and Highway to Heaven). Landon was only 54 when he died, and he had a new series in development at the time. IMO his resume' may be the most impressive of all.

@bryanismyname7583

10 ай бұрын

She was clearly one of the leads on "The Golden Girls" and she was a major focal point on "Hot in Cleveland" despite being a supporting character. She also had shows during the fifties like "Life with Elizabeth" (1953-1955), for which she received her first Primetime Emmy nomination.

...also Swoosie Kurtz in that great supporting cast. Another reason the show flopped: MTM periodically would present herself as a singing/dancing star, like Lucille Ball, when her audience just wanted her to be funny.

1978? Really? I was out of the loop that year and now I'm glad I was. Didn't she do one with a Rhoda reunion later on?

@TonyBoyOhBoy

10 ай бұрын

Yes, they did a reunion movie. But I recall it being a very different format than the series.

For Swoosie, it seems everything she did on TV before sisters flopped and everything she did after has been successful like mike and molly and call me kat.

@bryanismyname7583

10 ай бұрын

Unfortunately, Call Me Kat has been cancelled after its third season. It was a cute show.

This really nails the reasons for the failure of Mary--the variety show(s). The writing was beneath what you'd find in a high school talent night. I feel embarrassed for Moore having to speak those awful lines. She appears trapped in the sketches--looking for an exit to something actually funny. I agree that the heyday of variety shows had passed--when Carol Burnette--who was still drawing good ratings--said "Enough" to her legendary variety program, that meant the form was exhausted. Beyond this, in her previous hit shows, Moore had a strong producer/director off camera to steer the ship. With the Dick Van Dyke Show, genius Carl Reiner created, produced, wrote and supervised every aspect of the show and knew his characters thoroughly. He even found time to act on the program--deliberately playing an egotistical, explosive TV star of questionable talent. With the Mary Tyler Moore program, Mary had the superior talents of producer/creator James L. Brooks as well as constant director James Burroughs. These very talented fellows knew where to take the program as well as where not to go. Taste, you might say, is an acquired taste. Miss Moore herself had her business partner and spouse Grant Tinker--who kept the stress of running a hit comedy away from Moore and saw that her image off-camera was consistent with her persona on the show. What might have sunk other TV star's careers (Moore's drinking problem, her baby sister's death from a suicidal overdose, her crumbling marriage to Tinker) was deftly kept from the press. Moore had none of this support in the two attempts at a variety show. Grant Tinker had spun his huge success with MTM Productions into the dream job as head of programming at NBC. He was arguably the most powerful person in American television. And if that cost him his relationship with Moore, that was too bad. It is best to appreciate Mary Tyler Moore for her successes rather than dwell on the failures which are unfortunately credited to her. Moore had a couple of decades where she was on top of the the TV world and that is more than enough. Oh--and she should have won that Oscar for Ordinary People.

@TonyBoyOhBoy

Ай бұрын

Wow, very insightful post, I enjoyed reading your take on it!

"she's as bright and perky as ever" ...

MTM is best in a situation comedy surrounded by great characters and writing, not variety settings.

The Mary Tyler Moore Hour was pretty bad too.

@TonyBoyOhBoy

10 ай бұрын

I'll be looking at that one down the road too.

@David-yw2lv

Ай бұрын

A pathetic copy The Jack Benny Show.

It was too soon. You can't create an icon and then switch it up after seven seasons. Also, frankly, Mary Tyler Moore didn't have Carol Burnett's versatility; her public persona was too limited. (She made the same mistake in 1966 when she tried to play Holly Golightly in a Broadway musical after five years as Laura Petrie.) Also, the variety format was pretty much played out by then anyway; there hasn't been a successful one since.

@TonyBoyOhBoy

Ай бұрын

Great points!

Bob Newhart was one of the few who could recreate the magic, doing it with two highly successful shows...Carol Burnetts second attempt flopped, Dick Van Dyke and Andy Griffth couldnt, at least until very late in their storied careers.

Loved TMTMS but I never did buy her TV persona, then Ordinary People came out and instantly I knew that her character was closer to the actress than any other role she ever played. She could be good , but she wasn't great, she was just lucky that the public loved her in TDVDS and that carried her through the next 3 decades of many flops and none bigger than this show.

@TonyBoyOhBoy

10 ай бұрын

Yes, her niche was usually playing a certain type character. like in TMTMS and TDVDS and she was excellent in those roles.

@bryanismyname7583

10 ай бұрын

And “Thoroughly Modern Millie” (1967).

@hectormanuel9793

10 ай бұрын

@@bryanismyname7583 Boy, was she miscast in that film!

@bryanismyname7583

10 ай бұрын

I thought she was cute in it. And it was a hit. Critics generally loved it; Roger Ebert famously gave it four stars. 7 Oscar nominations, including one for Carol Channing. @@hectormanuel9793

As soon as I saw Dick Shawn in the cast photo, I knew it was doomed.

She overplayed her hand, as so many do.

Yes, I have been to a play where I couldn't wait for the intermission - COME FROM AWAY -- the smash hit on Broadway was so contrived and corny and maudlin, I had to get outta there before I barfed especially because some of the stuff writer's added to make it woke, never really happened in Gander on 9-11. No rabbi helped to give birth to a Muslim baby in Gander -- geez! What a mess!