On popometer.io/demo?cc=865 you can check out how our tool works. You can double check your FFB with it. When the ffb chart shows 1.0 or -1.0 your ffb is clipping and you are missing out on some details (however on low end wheel some clipping is fine, as you otherwise just have to little forces in general)

@guidofoc7057

Ай бұрын

Can I ask you how hard it is for you to turn the wheel while driving? On my CSL DD 8 nm + McLaren GT3 v2 wheel, I have FFB at 100%, FEI at 100% and in-game gain 65%. At this level clipping in ACC is non-existent but turning the wheel at speed requires some effort (and I'm 1.85 m 90 kg). Is that how it's supposed to be? Thanks!

@guidofoc7057

Ай бұрын

Another comment (sorry): in ACC i used to set the steering lock to the exact steering lock for each car. For example the Porsche 992 has 800 degrees and i used 800. The other day i tried to lower the steering lock to 720 and immediately i found an improvement. So.. should one stick to the standard steering lock or just adjust it ad lib? Thanks!

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

mine certainly turns harder as i have almost the same ingame gain but twice the force in the driver. So yeah, its a bit of work but i got used to it!

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

if you want to change how fast the steering is use the "steer ratio" setting in the setup screen of the car. but ideally just keep the wheels in sync to start with. if the steer ratio setting does not give enough flexibility, you can still think about tweaking outside of that realm. but be assured some engineer though about the steer ratio a car has.

@lombardy3274

Ай бұрын

@@guidofoc7057I had to swap the McLaren V2 for a smaller wheel because it felt way too weak with the bigger diameter on the 8nm with those gain settings. Couldn’t turn the gain any higher cos too much clipping.

The comments about controlling oversteer by essentially "letting the car do it's thing" blew my mind! When the rear steps out, you have an overwhelming instinct to grip harder and fight the car, when actually, you just need to surrender a little bit. Thanks for making this.

@takadekadaka2493

20 күн бұрын

I accidently figured this out when fighting my car practicing. I got frustrated and threw my hands up when the rear was starting to step out for the hundredth time... and was amazed that the car saved itself.

What you said about correcting oversteer by letting the car do its thing was also a revelation for me. I never had a problem catching slides or massive oversteer moments in ACC, I just felt like the FFB wanted me to turn a specific way to correct it and I just did it. The problem was, when someone had problems with it and asked me how to do it, I never knew how to explain what I did because it just felt like something automatic. Your explanation was great! Although, I dont run a Direct drive, I am using a CSL Elite v1.1.

always love how you approach things academically

I drove on G25s/27s/29s for over 15 years. I only learnt to catch oversteer and drifts once I learnt I had to act proactively and initiate the correction with my arms/hands before the wheel would do it for me simply because it's too slow and too weak. That took me forever, I always just thought I wasn't a good enough driver. You actually need to fight the wheel as opposed to the wheel doing it for you - it's a real headbend to internalise that, your brain insinctively tells you the opposite. Now I'm on an alpha mini and I have learnt to react to my wheel. That only took a few days to reset. You do the natural thing on DD wheels. I catch way more slides but most importantly I catch them as small corrections which tell me I'm right on the limit without losing laptime. While before a slide would be Tokio Drift, now it's micro corrections to keep testing where the limit and to keep finding that fine line. Total game changer for me. Thanks for putting it into a video, I now understand much better what was happeneing to me in terms of forces and delays!

@texnorthman

Ай бұрын

This here is precisely why I wish people would stop recommending the G29/G920 to new simracers. It just does not work like a real wheel should, and if people keep buying them Logitech will keep making them, and nobody will be forced to come up with anything better in the 300 dollar range.

@Reetzah

Ай бұрын

You really got that message well and I love how you explain it. Unfortunately there still are people that dont understand these differances and reasons to why buy a DD base. Im happy for your progress and cant wait to get my DD.

Your talking about countersteering around ten minutes was a revelation to me, it makes sliding so much easier 😂

@virtualawakening2299

Ай бұрын

Just watch some how to drift videos. They just let go of the steering wheel and let it do its thing.

one of the best contents on youtube for sim racing, THANKS VERY MUCH!!!

The last video made me buy a 1,000hz monitor and 4090, now I have to get the upgrade kit for my La Prima. lol. Good video. Thanks for the insight!

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

😂

Its a fine line finding the right ffb. High enough to feel every tiny detail, yet low enough to be relaxed behind the wheel (unless you only drive a single hotlap). At the moment i'm driving minimal (5%) dampening (wheel driver) and fx with my Moza R9 on the edge to clipping - which eqauls 100% in software, 65% gain in ACC. Works fine for me :) Thanks for the Video!

I've been using the Logitech g29 for a year+ and only in the last few months have I realised a problem is I couldn't feel much from the wheel in ACC. Essentially everything you touched on this video. Finally bought a DD base. Just waiting for the GT neo to arrive!

You are amazing for the community bro. Keep going!

Driving a sim without proper self-aligning forces is just awful. The #1 thing that always turned me off AC1 was I could never get the FFB to self-align properly. As soon as the rear starts to go and I let go of the steering wheel, the wheel just spins lazily around until it hits the hard stop. By applying all kinds of FFB post-filtering in CM you can sort of fix it, but it was never satisfactory to me. Also many sim racers seem to be under the assumption that self-aligning forces correcting minor sideways moments without any driver input is some kind of "arcade driving assist" instead of just a consequence of basic physics.

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

agree with the latter, though never had problems with AC like you describe. Always felt crisp and direct to me. i used a t500, clubsport 2.5 and vrs dd with it over the years. weird!

@Reetzah

Ай бұрын

Also agree. But with t300 I was able to set up FFB well enough for touge, GT or drift in AC. For AC low end wheels you mostly turn everything off and setup FFB strenght with filter.

I have Fanatec DD 8nm, and no one will convince me it's enough. Once I was using it for a couple of months (bought when it came out), I could feel when I was in high/medium speed corners, where the base is loaded for a couple of seconds, and even if it's not clipping, you don't get any more information from FFB. The fact it has Peak and Holding torque makes the matter even worse.

great video, again!

This is insane! I have an accuforce 13nm with 15nm peak direct drive and i use about 18% of that in game (100% in software). Last night i went upto 35% ingame and wow it was more tiring but my laptimes improved and the car felt incredible!

T300 owner. I beleave the problem here is not if you can be fast or not with a weak wheelbase, but its more about consistency. To me its really hard to take the same exact lines every lap, as i can't be as precise as i want with my inputs. I noticed it the most when Thrustmaster introduced the new ''boost'' option: suddenly the car went exactly where i wanted to. Sadly the wheelbase can't really handle that much force, so it loses strenght overtime (don't use boost, really). Similar issue with pedals: i have t3pa, and the brake pedal has the same resistance as the accelerator one, so its impossible to trailbrake properly, and because of it you can never be consistent. Gear, unfortunately, matters. A lot. Awesome video btw.

Hi Nils, great video as always. Please excuse the question, I'm sure you've already answered it in another video, but why are you using a 32:9 monitor and not triples?

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

easier to use, more convenient solution, less cables, less space used

Another point you didn't really mention is getting up to speed. You already know how to drive fast, where the limit is, and what the car wants from you which explains your laptime that is already quite unachievable for most regular drivers. Getting there though is imo much harder with low ffb wheels as you, well, lack the feedback from the car and thus there is a lot of trial and error involved. If you don't know what the car is capable of and you don't feel it, it is very hard to learn trailbraking or rotating the car the optimal amount on power. You just accidentally hit it from time to time but it is also hard to replicate then. Thanks for your videos and trying to educate people. Also love your mini series on how simracing is essentially pay2win (lol). Next one could be 24" screen 2m away vs 49" ultrawide in your face.

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

yes agree on the learning curve! as for monitor: well... FOV setting should (yes it will be ridiculous) give you the same feel. but of course you wont see a lot 2m away on that 24" if doing fov "correctly" :D

@Freezedevil1990

Ай бұрын

@@SimracingPopometer Thanks, I appreciate your reply. The second part was more like a joke but you undeniably have to make a compromise between perception of speed and visibility on a suboptimal setup. Though I think you had a video about the FOV topic earlier if I don't mix it up with someone else. I just thought it would be funny and kind of fits the theme of your latest two videos :)

@misael5179

Ай бұрын

I have a Logitech G920, and I've been trying to learn about the feelings of the car in this game, and it is hard. However in AC it is easier.

@Reetzah

Ай бұрын

@@Freezedevil1990 I used to think I need peripheral vision to be fast and see better. But its actually opposite. Boosted media also mentioned it in some video saying it was a reason for him to swich to single monitor and fix fov. Also tested it on myself. It is a lot harder to drive when you need to see far away having monitors/driver position to far. Much more natural when it feels like youre in an actual car even if you cant have peripheral vision. Also considering fps I see pros swithcing from 3 monitor to single monitor setups. 150+ fps is a must!

Sometimes I have to race with 10% ffb strength (simagic alpha mini 10nm) to avoid noise. It's totally possible but as you say, you rely on muscle memory, I'm only half a second off my pace but you lose so much confidence as you just can't feel the car. Great video.

@lmfixit

Ай бұрын

hey i just got my alpha mini could u explain it a little bit more do we need to buy stronger wheels with more nm?

@easybreeze1

Ай бұрын

@@lmfixit no, I just mean I jurn my ffb down very low to avoid noise... quite an unusual thing to do

@lmfixit

Ай бұрын

Thanks mate

@bryn4s

Ай бұрын

Wait so you race with 1nm… why get a dd ?

@easybreeze1

Ай бұрын

@@bryn4s ha ha... no not at all. I'm just saying that there is the odd time I have ffb set to basically nothing due to vibration noise, and how it's possible but quite hard to do. Sometimes it's that or I can't race! 90% of the time I have it at 100% (50% on ACC).

Awesome video, always with a banger! Well explained and shown the problem. I don't have to much problems catching oversteer fast with t300 but I can certainly tell that that moment of oversteer is not as obvious and you still need fast reflex and to rely on sound/visuals. Plus I'm good at drifting so I guess that helps. Cant wait to get my DD base.

One correction. Canned forces do not change with the level of the model they are mimicking. If the forces are being scaled, modelled, interact correctly with other present forces, they are physics based force feedback. When physically modelled FFB puts emphasis of forces into the wheel which IRL are more greatly felt through your backside, inner-ear, or body position are "synthetic wheel forces." Let's put to one side all FFB in a sim is synthetic! My point is forces applied to the wheel in an exaggerated way when they are not normally felt too much through the wheel are considered synthetic.) The reason I like the AMS2 physical interaction scripting (not Default or Default+, or even the basic custom which is actually the same as Default) is because I can move FFB effects into the wheel or offload them to other tactile feedback devices such as motion-rigs, bass-shakers, wind simulators, pedal effects and so on. Note: LUT files are not the same! LUT files are about fine tuning wheel-base differences and spots in wheel rotation which are not as strong as other parts of the rotation; they do not affect wheel effects.

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

thanks! I don't always keep full track of complete logic when on a training spree ;)

Hallo Nils, vielen Dank für dieses Video. Habe gerade mit Simracing angefangen (Logitech Pro Wheel) und unterlag auch der falschen Annahme, das bei Übersteuern ein aktives Gegensteuern notwendig ist. Meine Suche nach erklärenden Videos, was genau FFB macht und wie es vor allem zu interpretieren ist, war bis heute erfolglos. Eine Frage habe ich noch: Du sprichst von steigendem Widerstand beim Lenken bei höheren Geschwindigkeiten. Wenn ich die Grenzgeschwindigkeit für eine bestimmte Kurve erfahren will steigere ich dann die Geschwindigkeit so lange, bis der Widerstand wieder abnimmt, also Über- oder Untersteuern eintritt?

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

so habe ich es noch nicht gesehen, aber grundsätzlich ist die korrelation vorhanden. ich denke du hörst parallel auch die reifen lauter werden und wirst auch visuell wahrnehmen, dass das auto nicht/zu viel rotiert. die summe aus allem machts. das nachlassen der lenkkräfte beim untersteuern sind nicht so ausgeprägt, und auch wenn du zu viel lenkst wird es nicht zwangsläufig weniger, ist bei jedem auto auch wieder etwas verschieden und zusätzlich hat "caster" bzw. "nachlauf" viel einfluss auf die kräfte

@jg4_skylon848

Ай бұрын

@@SimracingPopometer ich habe gestern ein paar Stunden getestet und mich nicht auf Rundenzeiten konzentriert. Ich hatte schon den Eindruck, das die Gegenkraft nachlässt wenn man über den Grip hinausgeht. Die Reifengeräusche habe ich extra laut gestellt, bei meinem Test aber nicht auf sie geachtet. In der Wahrnehmung der Rotation bin ich noch nicht so geübt. Vielleicht teste ich heute Abend weiter. Nochmals vielen Dank für dieses Video.

I probarly missed it, are you racing LFM pro this season? Hfun! Thanks for the content

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

not planning to this season. summer calling :)

I have an Alpha mini 10Nm. 100% power on driver, 70% in ACC. I was driving LFM at Monza today. 6:00PM server time. Last corner, shade...I don't know if the car is oversteering on exit under power or not. Not helped by the visuals as 6:00PM on such track it means you don't see enough details in the image (triple 1080p 210FPS) to understand the rotation, it's all shade. I didn't get enough info from the DD to understand if it was getting lighter or what. Nothing happened but I was aware I didn't have the info to drive properly. Any advice? Thanks a lot...

@WinWingLP

Ай бұрын

Video is over 20min long. Video uploaded 4min ago, this comment is 1min ago. Maybe watch first before asking questions that may get answered?^^

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

1st check would be if its clipping in this situation, which would prevent the game from differentiating different forces. if it does clip, then lowering in game % could help. 2nd thing could be to look/gaze into the distance, not the shadows around you, to perhaps get a visual feedback. 3rd thing dynamic damping is set to 100% i hope? you could try boosting that, but should really not be necessary. 4th - too much other filters in the software? I think with 10nm there should be plenty of room to get those differences

@RacingPCs

Ай бұрын

@@SimracingPopometer Thanks for the reply! 🙏The settings on DD are pretty raw. Probably, as you say, looking in the distance where light/shadow can give feedback. I will also check clipping in that corner.

@RacingPCs

Ай бұрын

@@WinWingLP I watched the video entirely as I'm interested in the topic. The answer lies around but was not specifically covered by the video.

I'm a noob to sim racing, though I have DD equipment. I think ACC feels vague, but I bought LMU early access, and wow! I don't know if LMU is more accurate or not, but it seems to communicate so much more to me. The tires getting to the edge of their grip is so much more progressive and rewarding. ACC to me just felt like you had a tenth of a second before the rear would just suddenly and violently let go. I hope you do some LMU streams soon. I am smitten with LMU early access. Note that I'm even slower relative to the aliens in LMU than ACC, but LMU has become where I spend most of my sim time. Le Mans Ultimate needs more air time! Of course, you can tell me that the physics and FFB are really unrealistic in LMU. I'm looking for the experts to let me know.

I would appreciate adding some idea about at what point you get diminishing returns. I personally think anything above 10-12 N-m doesn't really matter as you can set up a 10 N-m wheel base to never clip and will still have enough force to properly feel the road at forces that are probably close to the real thing (depending on car of course).

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

for modern GT I guess as you say 12-15 is fine. though I wouldn't target irl steering forces. they don't need 'ffb' as much as we do in the sim. they have the g-forces and don't rely on 'ffb' as much. if you have 1:1 irl steering forces in the sim, you'll likely miss out. we have to replace the lack of g forces somehow and that's in part through the wheel

I'm new to ACC and got a CSL 8nm a couple of months ago. I can already tell I need more headroom. Having experimented for hours, I can safely say that leaving the Dynamic Dampening setting in ACC on 100% is a sure way to get inadequate feedback from slower speeds - the game is trying to emphasise the contrast between alignment torque at slow vs fast, but 8nm is not enough for it to provide a high enough minimum force while maintaining that contrast (as you explained, Nils). Ive discussed this exact topic with owners of the 15nm DD+ and it is clear that they can have Dynamic Dampening at 100% without it taking away too much feedback at low speeds. The best solution I can offer to others like me is to lower Dynamic Dampening so that the contrast it is trying to make is less pronounced. Anywhere between 0 and 40% will preserve at least some noticable force at low speeds. 15 to 20٪ seems like the best compromise. Anyone who is limited to 5nm might want to try 10% or just turning it off. On Fanatec bases we can lower the FOE (force effects) a little and increase Dampening effects beyond 100% (via a PC) if we want more headroom available for Dynamic Dampening. We can also do the same for the Spring Effect that is used to return the wheel to centre, like when you oversteer and let go, but it scales pretty well at 100% imo. Another alternative is to run quite a high NDP (35-50) and consider 5 to 10 Friction... to help keep the wheel from going too weightless during situations where high Dynamic Dampening is still preferred, but you'll still want 40% or less. Hope this helps! Keep these videos coming 👍🏻🙏

@WigSplitters

Ай бұрын

Another option for ppl with lower power DDs is just to bump up the gain to max and then you put the dynamic damping higher, for example I'm much quicker and slides are much easier for me to catch if I have 100 gain and dynamic damping using the cammus c5, yes it clips a lot but unless you saw the red clipping bar you wouldn't know

@dylanmonahan5909

Ай бұрын

@@WigSplitters I spent a couple of hours today experimenting with your suggestion in a variety of contexts and with varying force settings. In a sense you're right: at 100% in both the base and the wheel and 100% Dynamic Dampening, the feedback is closer to what I'm looking for... up until it clips, which it tends to do right at the worst times... ie the wheel goes limp similar to how DD communicates traction loss, but before you actually lose traction... which isn't difficult to control, as you just respond to it as traction loss, but the time you lose from not feeling the limit properly adds up and tuning setups with all this clipping is misleading. I was trying to blitz through Mt Panorama and the last few turns as you climb the mountain peak clip way too early and really makes it hard to judge on the limit. This was in the NSX, which is light on the FFB at the usual 70%, so it was nice up until clipping. I was able to push the FFB up to 78% with minimal clipping by reducing Force Effect Intensity to 70%, which wasn't such a bad sacrifice, but there's no way to get that 7-8nm holding torque feeling without it clipping terribly just when you need the feedback most.

@WigSplitters

Ай бұрын

@@dylanmonahan5909 yeah i kinda wish there was a ffb setting that allowed low speed and high speed to be closer in terms of ffb strength output, so the torque would always be closer to the maximum output, even at low speed, unfortunately thats not a thing

@WigSplitters

Ай бұрын

@@dylanmonahan5909 also do you have 'best' settings for catching slides etc on lower powered DDS while not clipping all the time?

@dylanmonahan5909

Ай бұрын

@@WigSplitters The closest you can get to that is something like 40% Dynamic Dampening at 85% FFB with FEI at 80. Still some clipping, but it doesn't completely drop off. It helped to turn off NDP, FRI, INT etc and use 0 Interpolation. Just don't take your hands off the wheel unless you're prepared to brake+accelerate to control it before grabbing it again. Or you can try either 100% OR 20% Dyn D with 40-50 NDP at around 78% FFB with minimal clipping.

Tolles Video wie immer, danke! Kurze Frage zur VRS Base: gibt es aus Deiner Sicht einen Grund bei einem anstehenden Upgrade der Base eine Simucbe 2 Pro statt einer VRS zu wählen bzw. was spricht aus Deiner Sicht für die eine oder andere Base?

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

360hz ffb bei iracing hat bisher und voraussichtlich für eine ganze Weile nur sc2. bessere Kompatibilität in der Breite mit Lenkrädern hat auch nur sc2, Wireless ebenso. ich denke es ist das bessere Paket wenn es preislich passt.

@velophil9502

Ай бұрын

@@SimracingPopometer Merci vielmals 🙏

Hallo Nils, was würdest Du einem Neuling als Minimalwert empfehlen, wenn er nicht nach einem halben Jahr schon wieder updaten möchte. Würden 12Nm auf Dauer reichen für eine ordentliche Rückmeldung oder gleich etwas mehr?

@SimracingPopometer

23 күн бұрын

mit 12 ist man auf jeden fall gut dabei. wenn das budget für eine 15nm variante reicht solltest du aber fast schon für immer ruhe haben von dem thema

@volkers407

23 күн бұрын

@@SimracingPopometer Danke Dir für die schnelle Antwort.

Hi Nils, very interesting video! As I have been born without a left hand, I am slightly limited in terms of FFB strength. I can still use my left arm, but ofcourse most of the FFB weight is on my right hand. I have a CSL DD 8NM and am currently using about ~5NM with 50% gain in ACC, which is quite low. Currently for most tracks my laps are usually 101%-102%, on Imola for example my current PB is a 01:40.075. I think I now have a solid base, but since lately I have been taking simracing more serious and doing endurance events, I really want to get better and more consistent. Coaching could probably take me a step further, but maybe there is low-hanging fruit I didn't think of yet. Besides more practise and analyzing telemetry, I wonder if perhaps you have any other tips for me? I know this might be a rare case for you, but I'm very curious if you might have any specific tips for me :) Love your videos btw, keep it up!

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

I think we need to do something else as well. I have been coaching other people with various disabilities, maybe its time to connect you all? I'm sure there are many learnings to share. I'll make a channel on discord "disabilities" (PLEASE GIVE ME A BETTER WORD FOR IT - maybe a solution oriented one?).

@x0Niels0x

Ай бұрын

@@SimracingPopometer That's a really cool idea! Maybe we can call it something more fun indeed, maybe something like hard-mode. Although that might not sound very intuitive. We'll work on the name, but very cool initiative!

@AtomicAndi

Ай бұрын

The obvious idea would be to try putting a counter weight on the other side of the wheel

@Reetzah

Ай бұрын

Wow, people like you inspire the most! Honestly, youre fast, considering youre doing it with 1 hand makes it an even higher archivement. Wish you all the best!

From which torque in the wheel does the self alignment becomes enough? I have a G29 with low ffb, so should I go for a 15+nm direct drive or you guys see something as 8nm from Fanatec GT DD PRO as enough for this effect and steering feel?

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

more is better, but i think with the 15nm variants you're safely in the zone where it will be enough for 99% of simracing. I remember it being fine when i drove the 11nm logitech DD as well. but there's always a case where you run out of room I guess. Never felt limited by the VRS' 20NM, even though I am only using it at 16nm. I could probably run even lower ffb without losing things. with 8nm? never driven one of those unfortunately, but i found 5 too little on the moza r5.

@0Freguenedy0

Ай бұрын

@@SimracingPopometer thanks a lot for your time and response

@dylanmonahan5909

Ай бұрын

I have the Fanatec CSL DD with 8nm. It's is a massive upgrade from a G29 (I had a wheel with NO FFB, so even more of an upgrade for me). My budget had to cover everything (pedals, rig wheels, base etc.) and I already had an xbsx and no PC, so it was the best option at the time. However, while 8nm in terms of sudden peak forces is generally plenty, the base falls a little short in holding torque. As Nils pointed out regarding using 100% Dynamic Dampening, with 8nm you have to dial ACC gain back to prevent clipping. At 100% Gain it feels nearly perfect until it clips. My conclusion is that I personally need around 10nm available just for aligning torque, plus more headroom for nuances and peaks, which makes 12nm the absolute minimum, but a base rated to 12nm holding torque (not peak) would be fine and the DD+ at 15nm holding would be "end game" in terms of feedback. Other bases rated at peak force of 20nm would be end game too. All that said, I don't regret my purchase of the 8nm DD and won't be upgrading for at least 6 months. It's still fantastic, just not end game for my tastes.

@0Freguenedy0

Ай бұрын

@@dylanmonahan5909 great to know! Nice upgrade. Since I will have to travel abroad in order to avoid paying double the price here in Brazil, I have to upgrade to the end game haha. So probably 15Nm, sadly haha. Cause it's so costly.

@dylanmonahan5909

Ай бұрын

@@0Freguenedy0 I understand. I'm in Australia and (depending on the exchange rate) there have been many times where buying the same product from Europe or North America is still cheaper despite high shipping costs... just that flying to those countries from this gigantic island is always expensive. When friends or family travel it's not uncommon for people to beg them to buy things while abroad haha I know it's not the same as Brasil, but I get it. Hopefully you enjoy a short vacation, but I bet the wheel base is the part that you will remember most 😉

Hi Nils! Could you do a video on setting ACC gain vs using the Nm limitation in the wheelbase software? There seems to be something very unintuitive going on with how the gain control works. Setting my Invicta base to 20Nm and running 30% gain feels great. Setting my Invicta base to 6Nm and running 100% gain feels horrible and results in sustained clipping on high speed corners. So if the gain setting is not limiting max output, what is it actually doing?

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

yes easy. if you set your base to 10% it acts like only having 2nm available (or 6nm in your case) so that's the scale the have will use to map all forces and you'll run into a lot of clipping. while when you give it 100% in base there's enough rent for the game to scale forces along without compressing them, even if you decide to lower the peaks via gain - and thus no clipping here

@texnorthman

Ай бұрын

@@SimracingPopometer That's what I can't figure out though. There is a distinctly different feel to having my base at say 10Nm, with 60% gain, vs 20Nm with 30% gain. No clipping in either, but the 20Nm setup gives much better information of the finer feedback, while the big hits are still similar. 6Nm with 100% gain gives a lot of clipping, where I would have expected 100% gain to simply spread the forces out over the range of the 6Nm wheel limit. I'm assuming this is because the gain setting is not doing what I think it's doing, and instead providing some non-linear scaling of sorts? Has Kunos ever given any info on this?

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

I think a way to look at it (without claiming to know the details) is: lower on the base then everything gets scaled down to fit into the smaller range. lower the gain in game but keep the wheel base high you reduce the peaks but the lower force signals remain in as they were

@Habixus

Ай бұрын

I can explain it :) The base strength is scaling all ffb and sets the limit at what you set it. The in-game gain scales all ffb too, but always limits at 100% in-game output. So up to 10 Nm output to your hands, 100% in-game & 10 Nm Wheelbase strength gives you identical ffb to 50% in-game & 20 Nm Wheelbase strength. But at 10 Nm, the first combination will start clipping and won't become stronger, while the second combination has another 50% gain headroom to reach 100%. I call this "nominal strength" and "peak strength". 100% ingame * 50% Wheelbase => 50% nominal, 50% peak. 50% ingame * 100% Wheelbase => 50% nominal, 100% peak. Another important thing about this is, that in almost every sim, 100% Gain means clipping in every faster corner. It's dialled in like that for Logitech and Thrustmaster wheels. So to not get clipping in basically every corner, you need to reduce the gain to about 60%. I like Raceroom's new approach, where 100% Gain has no clipping apart from collisions or big sausage kerbs. Hope that helps :)

i had to unlearn predicting oversteer when switching from a g920 to a moza r12, the worst part of the g920 was the pedals though. even though i cleaned the potensiometers constantly i would get involuntary abs from the whole pedal range after just a few hours of use😂

@rabidrabbittt

Ай бұрын

top and bottom 10% were set as deadzone just to be able to go wide open throttle and not always be on the brakes lmao not to mention the brakepedal spring also broke after maybe 2 or 300 hours of use

Hi Nils. Are you using 400Hz ffb frequency in game with VRS?

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

yes!

Any advice for non-dd users? Go up as much as you can in the settings? Also, about FPS video, what's the name of the app with you're monitoring FPS? (could be useful to see also GPU/CPU % usage)

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

just Nvidia overlay. for ffb: yes, compromise of clipping and detail

@dylanmonahan5909

Ай бұрын

Turn off Dynamic Dampening or try a really low % and see how that feels.

G29 here. Thing is, at AMS2 and rF2 a G29 auto corrects (maybe not on the same level but do) and have extra feelings (weight transfer, wheels locking under braking, a more gradual grrip gain and grip loss) but at ACC weight transfer is so weak and vague it is almost not there, wheels locking under braking dont exist at ACC and gradual grip gain and grip loss is also sort of vague even more midcorner, but again it is an ACC thing as at AMS2 and rF2 (KartKarft and even Dirt Rally 2.0) it all is felt and is stronger and more detailed, that because Kunos want to deliver san "as pure steeering rack only feel" as possible, what to me kills the FFB at ACC and since 1.9 update, where Kunos really managed to kill most of FFB feelings aside from "steering rack feel" (wheel weight at speeds) I dont play nearly as much, it kills all the joy of playing it and ACC becomes a guessing game for 50% of its driving, what is a nuisance as other sims can deliver all the feelings. I am even using an FFB file at ACC to have it "better" at ACC but still miss a lot of weight transfer, some gradual grip gain and grip loss midturn and no wheels locking under braking whatsoever (and again, AMS2, rF2, KK, DR 2.0 can deliver such feelings, so it is not the "it is a G29 that is why", no it is not). Had Kunos set this steering rack feel the default FFB settings but allowed all the other feelings to be felt if settings where adjusted itt would be fine but ACC at 1.6 was near rF2 FFB, now ACC FFB is near an old 80s arcade sim that had just a coil for FFB (it is better at ACC and make sense as it is car reaction and not just 1 constant force, but the feeling is similar just strong/weak wheell for the most part eeven with FFB file and ACC is the only sim I use FFB file) .

@pitarinha

Ай бұрын

Same here, from all the games i tried ACC has by far the worst FFB even with strong wheelbases. I completely stopped playing it. Even AMS2 despite its strange physics has 1000times better FFB. RF2 yes the FFB is very good but as I am not a competitive simracer I dont play it. For me a fully up to date modded AC is by far still the best game for wheel owners and car enthusiasts. Weak or strong wheelbase, AC can handle both.

@GM-nl2go

Ай бұрын

Same here, i played a lot about 2 years ago but now it has almost no ffb (I have t248)

@Reetzah

Ай бұрын

That is actually why ACC is best at delivering its ffb. Because differance in forces is so high it is basically impossible to replicate it in a 3nm scale. Other games feel different but it doesnt mean they are better at it. ACC is so good because it well represents differance in all those forces/loads giving you better understanding. And thats where other games lack, making you rely more on visuals rather than feeling.

@IronwillNeo

Ай бұрын

@@Reetzah ACC is "better from the get go" to deliver a steering rack feel where other sims you have to tweak it to feel the same. ACC also was toned down from the FFB it had to cut out feelings to be as steering rack feel as possible (weight transfer is faint but stil there so Kunos did not doa perfect job at it ... tho this "vague weight transfer feeling" is part of why I continue at ACC). The FFB forcing me to rely more on visuals than on feelings is bonkers, no real life driver driives like that as they drive with all tthe gforces, bumps and brakee feelings, not only steering wheel + visuals like they were ... on a simulator that dont deliver it (what is almost what ACC do give or take faint feelings of non-steering rack feel it stil deliver). It is the worst one at FFB due to the fact you can not configure it to deliver all other feelings while the other sims allow, to me rF2 and ACC (also KK for karts) havee the best FFB. ACC is not the worst tho. In that regard, if you want "just steering rack feel" ACC maybe be the best out of the box (or with litttle FFB configuration). If you want to feel anything else it is almost the worst.

@IronwillNeo

Ай бұрын

@@Reetzah Honestly, even "tweaked to dont deliver any feel but steering rack feel" ACC still weaker than rF2, AMS2 still retain more of the other feelings but the steering rack feel is also stronger. The "wekness of wheel auto-alignment" mentioned at the video for a low Nm wheel is not so weak on rF2 and AMS2 when all the other feelings are toned down, but it still weaker at ACC (and again. it was not this weak either).

Interesting, a problem I have which may be related is I start to slow down throughout the race. Slowing down lowers force which I then confuse with tire wear causing me to slow down more...

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

mh. lower grip from wear will cause lower corner speeds, but only marginally. the other thing is that the car has a tendency to become more oversteery over a stint, so your rear will be more lose and thus lower ffb as you are on the verge to countersteer... perhaps :)

Does the frequency of FFB change much? I read somewhere that Simucube has 300hz FFB and Fanatec has 60hz FFB?

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

seems thats just bad info. all bases easily run 1000 or 2000hz update rates. the limiting factor is how often games update the ffb. acc updates up to 400hz in line with the physics "ticks". other games run other hz both in physics and ffb update rates.

So it's not skill issue, I'm just poor?😆 Great info btw, Nils. What's the lookup table thingy, what does it do? I'm on a TMX + TLCM pedals, wondering if that would help, question?

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

search for ffb LUT for your wheel. type that into google and go from there: acc FFB LUT TMX

@SinghRacing

Ай бұрын

@@SimracingPopometer copy, we are checking!

I was complaining about this issue JUST last night

Whats your ffb settings in ACC? Dynamic damping 100%, you also have damping on?

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

60% gain, 100% dynamic damping, no damping

I have the 8nm csl dd and I get clipping at the apex of every turn in ACC. It's quite annoying. I'm surprised that ACC expects a more powerful set up than even 8nm to not get clipping. I will be getting fanatecs 15nm base sometime later this year. I've tried using FFB setups for my base that are specifically tailored to ACC. It still hasn't changed the fact that I get clipping whenever my wheel is turning at around 60 degrees or so.

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

I can also get my 20nm to clip. its a matter of setting. make sure you set the CSL DD to maximum in the fanatec software and lower the "gain" in game as much as needed until the clipping disappears or becomes minimal

@lombardy3274

Ай бұрын

@@SimracingPopometerreducing the gain to avoid clipping will then reduce the dynamic range of the FFB and affect low speed feel, correct? So the only solution is a stronger base?

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

@@lombardy3274 some wheels offer the option for non -linearity so they boost the smaller forces while capping the high forces

@lombardy3274

Ай бұрын

@@SimracingPopometerah yes, forgot about that. What are the downsides of non linearity? To be honest, I am happy with 8nm mostly everywhere, the thing I struggle with is feeling and controlling the rear with low TC, would a higher force base help with that?

I have an Alpha 15Nm. what number you will setup on driver and in ACC,I want to have a refer

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

would go max in driver and the adjust only gain in acc as high as you can need to feel everything, low enough so you can deal with it for the entire race

I wonder what's next in this fascinating series of insights. large screen > small screen? sound > no sound? 2 pedals > 1 pedal?

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

screen on > off

@AtomicAndi

Ай бұрын

@@SimracingPopometer Oh, my bad, I thought that was covered in the FPS episode (which I did not watch)

As the slowest drive ever, I'm glad I can blame it on my rig.

@zlyable

Ай бұрын

Upgraded my rig, I'm still slow af 😂😂

Wo bekommt man diese Handschuhe her? Ich find die übelst nice. Mach weiter so

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

ich hatte doch gar keine an :D

@revan9528

Ай бұрын

@@SimracingPopometer Ja, ich meine generell, hab einfach mal unter dein Neuestes Video geschrieben dass die Antwortchancen höher sind😂. Ich find die Weißen BMW Handschuhe super und würde gerne wissen wo man die Herbekommt

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

@@revan9528 ah, leider gab es die nicht im freien Verkauf; die sind eine Sonderedition von bmw und Puma

could we get your VRS Settings that you are using urself to try them out?

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

80% power 10% damping 10% friction balanced slew rate. Thats it :D

@lugs118

Ай бұрын

@@SimracingPopometerwhat about smoothing in the filter section?

Thank you for justifying this. Now i can use the excuse 'its not me, its the logitech' 😄

For the csl dd (8nm)do you have any decent settings?

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

general advice is to crank up the base to maximum, minimize the filters, dampers, friction, interpolation. Keep FEI high ~90%, use 100% dynamic damping in acc and maybe 60% gain. im sure someone on discord could send you his exact settings in the #hardware channel

@TheBluephoenix16

Ай бұрын

@@SimracingPopometer I have my gain at 80 atm, but I experience some clipping, i like more ffb, but its not that detailed with it at 80

@sobolanul82

Ай бұрын

I used for my CSL DD(8NM) in driver:900 degrees steering wheel, 100% FFB, 50% damper, all filters off, spring effect off, FEI and the rest 100%. In game 60-70% Gain(depends on preference), 50% damper(you can go more depending on how much weight feel you want in the wheel), 100% dynamic damper. The rest off. 900 degrees steering wheel. Main advice, set the values and drive them before tweaking them. If you change them a lot you don't let the brain to build a muscle memory.

@TheBluephoenix16

Ай бұрын

Tried all of these, but ffb feels numb

hello nils, do you know if theres a way to see wheel force graph using motec?

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

the channel is not put out through motec. only shared memory has it, which is what we're tapping into with popometer.io

@WigSplitters

Ай бұрын

@@SimracingPopometer oh damn, so ur not using telem output ur just using stuff from memory

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

@@WigSplitters it's just a different telemetry output really that has a few more channels

@WigSplitters

Ай бұрын

@@SimracingPopometer ok ty for the info!

am i reading that right? your rotation is 540 degrees in software?

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

as long as you have the same in the software and in the game it will sync correctly with the car you are driving, unless that car has more than 540° itself ;) if you want to cover all cars in the game, set it to 900° software and game. 800° fine if you are only driving gt2 and 3. I believe only some GT4 has actually 900.

@dylanmonahan5909

Ай бұрын

Not for us console peasants though. We have to put the correct steering lock in both the base and in game, but it's not too much of a hassle.

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

ah i see. makes "sense" :)

I have 0 issues with acc ffb with my new dd+ it actually is way to lively at times like tear my hands off kind of ffb. So idk maybe it's wheelbases? I like very raw sharp ffb but also clean with a little dampening. I stil have 0 issues since they made the 400hz update on console or on pc. I just dont understsnd it because my base is so lively. So yeah no issues on my part. If you look it up some say what I do while ithers have issues. Doesnt make sense tbh.

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

difference in perception i guess - or they all have weird settings

@reviewforthetube6485

Ай бұрын

@SimracingPopometer I think peoppe turn down spring, dampening forced to much thinking it's gonns bring out more detail when they end up taking sll of the eeight sway and ask why it feels dead? Dampening doesn't just take away ffb it actually helps with grip feel in game at times and suspension or weight transfer. You need in game dampening settings on at least. Idk what this new phase of turn all dampening off is people sre ruining the feel of everything. Even the makers of said wheels tell you not to do that.

@Reetzah

Ай бұрын

@@reviewforthetube6485 I got faster with turning dampening off and a better feel of wheel. I only have dynamic damping in acc.

@reviewforthetube6485

Ай бұрын

@Reetzah yesh see all preference I'm faster with dampening. Allows me to push my grip and right when it loosens I lose the weight and catch it. Makws me feel when it goes loose. If it's already loose harder for me to realize when it happens. But again we all have different queues. But yeah dynamic dampening on acc is a must. Helps tire and suspension feel. People turn that all the way off and then wonder why it feels so light lol. People seem to think dampening only dampening ffb but no it adds weight and a more relasitic feel to the car. It's literally what it's been explained to do from the start. Tires/weight and yes can dampening some details but that would need to be alot of dampening. In game dampening also differs from what's on our bases for sure.

I have been starting to think that my G29 is starting to hold me back..like a guitar player outgrowing his first instrument. Is that just an excuse for being slow or in a rut? Or is it legit? The video would suggest I'm not making excuses but, yeah. I really can't tell what the car is doing until it's almost too late. I've been on ACC for 4500 hours or so and still can only hit 2.18s on spa. Got a good ASR rig, heusinkveld sprints, a shit screen and a shit wheel. No offense to G29 but it's no dd base you know. Anyways could just be a skill issue or I've plateaued.

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

only one way to find out. it depend what kind of person you are. some people only need visual feedback to extract everything, some are more haptic in how they make sense of things. it certainly won't hurt to upgrade. and the fun increases a ton anyway

@johndoubleu5792

Ай бұрын

@@SimracingPopometer yeah for sure. I'm definitely a "feel"kind of guy so I think it would help immensely...thanks for the response! Appreciate all your videos my guy

This sounds like drifting 101 class. lol

Why don't You participate in new season of Caseking LFM Pro? You've made it easier for rest of guys ;)

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

12 weeks are a very long time to commit to driving every thursday. will do that in the winter again!

@marcinzeraa

Ай бұрын

@@SimracingPopometer Totally understandable! Like in every sport, if You want to compete on a certain level , it takes a lot of You time and energy. And on top level like You, I guess it takes all of time ;) BTW have You tried Samsung G9?

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

@@marcinzeraa i already had one ;) 49" version

let the wheel go, I need t try that!

love to be doing 1:30s with an wheel 🤣

I'm witting with a t300/csl pedals and 40-60fps...I'm leaving now 😂

@SimracingPopometer

Ай бұрын

stay strong brother :D

@Reetzah

Ай бұрын

Dont do it. Im also on t300/tlcm and 75 fps. But honestly I turned down graphics almost to 0 just to be able to see track correctly, got ~150 fps and I couldnt be happier about pace I found. Just keep trying and upgrading the fact you are here already shows your passion.