For me it’s the lack of form. Each Jedi in the prequels had a unique fighting style but in the sequels they act like they’re swinging baseball bats

@sillythygoose

6 ай бұрын

Yeah I agree. Even the og trilogy duels, which are probably the slowest and most simple, looked better than the sequels because they characters at least looked like they had good form and had their guard up. Watching the sequel duels there is so many moments where Rey or Kylo just lunges forward completely exposing their entire body and it just looks ridiculous.

@obufriend7612

6 ай бұрын

As a HEMA practitioner and fencer, I feel it makes more sense as Rey hasn't really picked up a lightsabre for long and Kylo is an over-emotional under-trained teenager, and neither of them can fight properly.

@jubilantvision2212

6 ай бұрын

I didn’t even think of that, but you’re right. They each had their own fighting style.

@gogaonzhezhora8640

6 ай бұрын

@@obufriend7612 Pillow fighting cousins they are indeed.

@gogaonzhezhora8640

6 ай бұрын

One has to praise Disney on this one for consistency. They ditched the Expanded Universe because the Kaitlyn Kennedy Klan knows better how to female force a franchize into the ground. In the EU lightsaber fighting styles were described and attached to some famous Jedi and Sith. When watching the prequels for the first time this was a pleasant surprise. They actually did it I thought. Each Jedi or Sith would not just swing a well choreographed lightsaber duel, but it would really match the different styles described in the EU more or less. Really liked Kenobi's Soresu, constantly dodging, moving close to the opponent, too close for the opponent's comfortable attack distance. Anakin and Windu on the other hand both use the more aggressive style which is more of an all out attack. Again the EU explains why Windu would do it even if we don't get much of his backstory in movies. It is a perfect match for Anakin's nature. Aggressive, (over)confident in his Force skills, trying to crush the opponent with a windmill of powerfull blows. Well, if you throw all that out of the window as KK's crew did you get what we got in the sequels and the shows. Wooden dolls swinging sticks.

Anakin against the younglings will always be my favorite one. The rage in his eyes and the no match that it was

@TrashPanda90914

Жыл бұрын

They shouldn't have taunted him

@yousifalkilabi

Жыл бұрын

They sadly cut the scene😢

@hirochavez2969

Жыл бұрын

i wish they showed it on screen

@fallbright

Жыл бұрын

@@hirochavez2969 Bro, that would just make RotS an instant NC-17 rating

@hirochavez2969

Жыл бұрын

@@fallbright good... what ever that is

The biggest thing in my opinion is that modern lightsaber fights don't have any actual form used. In the prequels, each and every character has a style based on a real life combat form. For example, Maul uses modified Kung Fu, and Ray Park was brought in as an actual practitioner. Vader's style is modeled heavily after Kyokushin Karate. Obi Wan's style is based in Saber fencing. Dooku is a Foil fencer. Everyone has a very specific way that they fight. In the sequels however, everyone uses the "hit him with a stick" form. They have no idea what they're doing with a sword. Daisy Ridley has prior experience with a staff, but they decided to give her a weapon she can't use well. And we're not going to talk about Kylo Ren.

@dr.bright6272

4 ай бұрын

It's "You Picked the Wrong House Fool!" style I guess

@joseguadalupemartineztorre9702

3 ай бұрын

​@@dr.bright6272i love Kylos damaged saber, and the cross blades would work if it was different from a light saber. I always wished Vader had a second crystal in his first prosthetic hand, use force lightening to power the crystal, his hand turns into a hilt, and then a new lightsaber appears that can't be taken. If Kylo got his saber hilt implanted into his forearm after he got his mask reforged, he could've had his fighting style be even more aggressive to show how much he's trying to be evil

@arrshoe6271

3 ай бұрын

@@joseguadalupemartineztorre9702 Honestly bro your ideas suck

@HeldIntegral

3 ай бұрын

Yea and vader can't produce force lightning

@arrshoe6271

3 ай бұрын

@@HeldIntegral He can, it's just a really bad idea for him to do it.

The part with fatigue is also showed in prequel films too. In duel of the heroes, Obi wan and Anakin are slower when on the droids speeding through the lava bank then earlier on the landing pad and interior and seem to use more overhead attacks to overwhelm the other’s defense instead of speed. In duel of the fates, Qui Gon meditates to be more rested for when the ray shield drops because he is almost 60 and tired after dueling for several minutes, and Obi Wan didn’t meditate which prevented him from using force speed to help Qui Gon beat Maul

@topbloke1683

2 ай бұрын

they are dueling slower because they are trying to balance as they have both planted their feet, best leverage they can get is with overhead strikes

@nightwing5740

2 ай бұрын

@@topbloke1683 I feel like Anakins arrogance would make him duel faster because he thinks he has Obi Wan pinned and he can just end the fight then and there instead of the outcome we know

@deathsheir2035

Ай бұрын

@@nightwing5740 Anakin has always been aggressive with his saber, preferring power strikes over rapid strikes. So it would be completely out of character for Anakin to increase his speed, believing he has his master pinned... despite the fact if he did increase his speed, he likely could've won.

@nightwing5740

Ай бұрын

@@deathsheir2035 I’m pretty sure his style of lightsaber combat was fast parries and counter attacks which we can see easily with Dooku and Obi Wan

@deathsheir2035

Ай бұрын

@@nightwing5740 Compared to us normies, yes he's fast, so too are all the other jedi. Compared to other Jedi, he's a power type not a speed type.

Can't believe you didn't mention just how much of a beast Hayden was behind the scenes while training for these fights.

@clairemadeinheaven

7 ай бұрын

20 years later and 42 year old haydens still got it, here from ahsoka episode 5

@elijahalbiston

7 ай бұрын

Choreography from bts was insane.

@Dogsparkster

6 ай бұрын

​@clairemadeinheaven he probably had to hold back too

@lightinferno4490

6 ай бұрын

​@@clairemadeinheaven Hayden made Rosario look slo mo

@RedShogun13

6 ай бұрын

I don’t think there could have humanly possibly been a better casting for Anakin Skywalker than Hayden. Played the various dimensions of the character perfectly/as instructed every single time, loved what he was doing and was passionate about it, extremely athletic and really made his lightsaber duels feel like you were watching masters of a martial art with the movements/athletics in and sharp speed. He’s the GOAT.

In my opinion, the Mustafar duel played a MASSIVE role in making Revenge of the Sith one of my favorite movies of all time.

@midnightzgamer20k

Жыл бұрын

You and the rest of us bud

@keithsnow534

Жыл бұрын

They practiced scene well filming the entire movie up until these scene. The love hayden and mcgregor put into this scene is unreal

@makisbizarreadventure4669

Жыл бұрын

You can tell they trained hard for that fight too man

@chrisbarrett2117

Жыл бұрын

Lol Revenge of the Sith is a bloated movie, and the lightsaber duel is so ridiculous because there’s never any sense that either character is going to lose until they telegraph it at the end: I have the high ground!

@_biscuit

Жыл бұрын

@@chrisbarrett2117 I disagree, I view it as a sense of impending doom throughout the entire fight since you know Obi-wan will be fine. You’re being forced to watch something you don’t want to see happen and you’re left hanging throughout the entire painfully long duration fight to finally see what Anakin became who we see in A New Hope

I personally loved the Dooku vs Yoda duel. It was the first time Yoda showed his saber skills. I remember being on the edge of my seat the entire time.

@MelodicTurtleMetal

3 ай бұрын

So flippy

@bossfan49

3 ай бұрын

When Yoda's shadow appeared people cheered so loud!

@topbloke1683

2 ай бұрын

seeing dooku seemed unstoppable and then the cheers when it turned out yoda was an absolute wizard with a lightsaber and dooku had his hands full

@McWhatevs

2 ай бұрын

Yeah, I remember the audience at the cinema cheering

@mintz9782

2 ай бұрын

yeah, for all 5 seconds.

That edit on Obi-Wan's anime leap... chef's kiss

I think the biggest issue is choreography. In the old Star Wars films, the choreography made the LightSabers feel like Swords. From the way they were used and blocked. The new movies make the Lightsabers feel more like glorified baseball bats.

@kickphielix5178

7 ай бұрын

Just..... yes

@_Umbrael_

7 ай бұрын

I've never heard a more apt description of what the lightsabers are like in the new movies.

@poloMpolo

7 ай бұрын

omg so true.. Fkcing baseball bats. Instead of elegant sword-like weapons with thusadns years of history

@e-money9251

7 ай бұрын

For me, the introduction of the crossguard lightsaber also played a part in the downgrade. Not only the design itself, which is clearly based on medieval european knight sword looks too big and cumbersome, with the handguard made out of the lightsaber beam makes it a risk to do those flashy twirlings compared to the more katana inspired regular lightsaber, the fight choreography of the crossguard saber itself is based on how those knights fight each other. This means that the way to properly use it is to just swing in around with brute force in hope of tiring the opponent. It’s basically the antithesis to the normal/usual lightsaber choreography which is more methodical and fencing/kendo like, full of parry and riposte. That’s why rey was visibly physically tired after fighting kylo, his brutish swinging didn’t give much opportunity for parry since the energy and momentum is too much to be deflected back

@dariensaintstreams

7 ай бұрын

Or the technology was that advanced to make the scenes more fast paced like the prequels.

One thing I think you overlooked is just how little danger lightsabers seem in the new movies, barely killing anyone, no limbs being lost. I guess I would put that into emotional significance.

@isorstho7378

11 ай бұрын

and the fact that apparently anyone can pick up the lightsaber and fight decently. Like how Flin just picked up the lightsaber and began fighting despite having no training what so ever. The lightsaber basically got turned from a dangerous and legendary weapon into a funny glowing stick.

@petergast7432

11 ай бұрын

Bruh Han Solo got capped in the new trilogy 😂

@oliverloake6103

11 ай бұрын

@@isorstho7378 Finn was force sensitive and also likely trained with those melee weapons that clone troopers had so he probs had some experience there

@ajtallent4501

11 ай бұрын

@@petergast7432that wasn’t a fight tho. I think they meant all the duels end with the combatants totally fine. Even when people do get injured theyre good as new right away with their wounds never being brought up again(Kylo and Finn)

@petergast7432

11 ай бұрын

@@ajtallent4501 that’s true, honestly I think all of the films have something bad about the fights When anakin loses his arm no one cares obi wan kinda kicks him in the head (Joel Embid ) Finn getting that back massage was also BS Why does maul drop obi wans saber in the hole but not qui gons? Or even pick it up, When he had like 2-3 mins to wait for him in that lazer wall In terms of the fight scenes really the new trilogy looks more like the swings have weight when they clash like knights and the prequels looks like Shaolin monks fighting so really just preference

IT'S THE CUTS!!!! You're so right! I want to see the entire fight!

In the prequels they actually used the lightsaber Forms jedi were supposed to know. I know that Rey and Kylo really didn't have that jedi upbringing but an attempt at showing some form 4 or 5 or 3 would've been nice since we see her drilling movement with the blade anyways. The final fight from Kenobi was just so much better than the rest of the lightsaber duels from the sequels because Hayden and Ewan already had preexisting training and experience in actual forms and wanted to go back to that while still bringing a little bit of modern rawness in how they swung (darth stumbling back when Obi Wan really winds up and cracks the lightsaber) if we see some old republic stuff or anything like that in the future it would only do the fans justice by putting the actual lightsaber Forms back into the movies

@Acanthophis

3 ай бұрын

Fun little fact about the forms: Kenobi in Phantom Menace uses the same form as his master. But mentally analyzing his master's performance and failure led him to the conclusion that an aggressive form was not ideal, and that's when he made the change to the third form. You can even see his style change between the first two episodes, and come episode three he has utterly mastered the form, which helped him defeat Anakin. You can even see these changes in the choreography.

@thalloutboy

Ай бұрын

Kylo was trained by Luke, and Rey was also briefly trained by Luke and also had access to Obi-Wan and Yoda as force ghosts presumably. There isn’t much of an excuse here, Kylo at the very least should be proficient in a lightsaber form (such as 3 or 5, Luke’s preferred forms).

For me, the main problem is that the lightsaber itself has changed, now it's just a club, and not a saber that can cut you.

@realtimberstalker

11 ай бұрын

More of a glorified pool noodle. You can be stabbed through the heart and still live in the new media, despite it being a fatal blow in 1-6.

@platinumrug

11 ай бұрын

@@realtimberstalker What new media besides the new Star Wars game shows someone getting stabbed through the heart and living?

@Infuryex

11 ай бұрын

@swandpie That's an example. Like how does Finn survive getting his spine sliced in half?

@thechosencat6093

11 ай бұрын

@@platinumrug Finn gets stabbed not only in the back but also near the spine near the ending of Episode VII but is somehow able to walk after chilling for a bit in Episode VIII (at least, that's how I remember it)

@0-Templar-0

11 ай бұрын

It has... weight on it for some reason. Light doesn't have weight.

I think you missed the most important thing that differentiates the prequels with the sequels. Every character had a distinct lightsaber combat style. Dart maul with a dual bladed saber, general grievous with 4 blades, Yoda jumping and rotating like a chipmunk on coke, dart sidious stab stab, Count dooku fencing style, and Darth vader an unstoppable force.

@Jesse-xg8rk

Жыл бұрын

Whereas in the sequel trilogy everyone just constantly heave-swings lightsabers at each other like they're baseball bats.

@javitelee9562

Жыл бұрын

Oh right... So, in short, the prequels stick to the lore and the martial arts vibe of the lightsaber duels. Darth Maul fights like, for example, Donatello from TMNT with his Bo. And this philosophy goes to every weilder in the series, and how they fight, as well as how experienced they are. Obi Wan, for example, uses both his own Style (I think it was IV) and Qui Gon's style (I think it was III) to fight, notably shown in rebels against Darth Maul. The sequels stick to the OG nindset, where they were just fighting with sticks.

@duytran1992

Жыл бұрын

@@javitelee9562 it's Qui Gon's Ataru (IV) that was his main style in the early days and after that fight Obi Wan started to shift toward Soresu (III) as his main focus. He realized that Ataru's agression won't benefit much when he encountered stronger, faster, more agressive duelists of the dark side as he will tire himself out before they do. It's true since he held his ground against Maul, Savage, Ventress, Grevious and Vader in Ep.3 by focusing on defence and waiting for his oponent to make mistakes he can exploit. For the sequels, I must disagree with you. Seeing how Luke handled the dark troopers in Mandalorian season 2 finale, I dont think Kylo who was under his wing in the early training days could have fought like that and lost against Rey who had almost zero lightsaber experience before that moment. Not to mention he got hit by Finn before facing Rey. How the F a trained Jedi/dark side user fight like that? I must agree that fight choreography of the sequels just simply suck.

@lydiasteinebendiksen4269

Жыл бұрын

I just wiah we'd get to see darth Jar-Jar's drunken style. It would have been my favorite fight(s) for sure *sigh*

@bonrick_0494

11 ай бұрын

@@javitelee9562 in the defense of the sequels, i’d like to believe the reason the choreography of our fighters were ultimately ass, was because all of them and yes, including kylo ren, never started nor completed a full lightsaber form. finn and rey never had a master nor teacher to train them, kylo left luke and i dont exactly see how snoke could teach him lightsaber techniques given two things: snoke is disabled and the lightsaber kylo manufactured is quite unprecedented (unless the cross guard exists in some prior legend that i dont know about). and in that regard, yeah luke had a similar way of fighting in the same regard in the original trilogy, but the fight between obi wan and vader was clearly much more refined. I know compared to the prequels it looks minimalist and slow, but personally it feels more like a samurai fight where both fighters are trying to conserve their energy.

You had me dead at Darth Vader talking Japanese and the speed jump of Obi Wan right after. Thank you for that 😂😂😂

I like how in Fallen order you can see how Cal holds the lightsaber high above his head so it's out of his eyes. Makes it more plausible that it actually could be used as a flashlight

@Lightning-gg5iu

Ай бұрын

@@user-bq5np8zb2rBro you’re tripping

In the lightsaber fight of Qui-gon vs Darth Maul, before the fight, Qui-gon sits. He is calm, one with the force, almost peaceful. Maul, on the other hand, is walking left and right, like a caged animal, barely able to contain his anger, rage. Sublime display of characterization for both sides of the force. That whole sequence, including the follow up fight with Obi-wan, is awesome.

@benmmarino

Жыл бұрын

Especially the obi portion. He comes in so strong after qui got sliced

@agustinfranco0

Жыл бұрын

Qui gon probably already knew it was his end, and he was preparing what he knew about becoming a force ghost. Honestly, he was the best jedi ever, miles better than yoda.

@limitlesssky3050

Жыл бұрын

​ @Agustín Franco Yoda is way stronger than Qui Gon. But Qui Gon has a better understanding of the Force.

@agustinfranco0

Жыл бұрын

@@limitlesssky3050 i said better jedi, not more powerful

@thetrueasisi1523

Жыл бұрын

actually, this Clash of Ideals in Episode One was so good, that there is a reference in SWTOR The Healing Animation of the Sith Lords is Mauls "walking from left to right" and the healing animation of the jedi is Qui gons sitting down

We also need to talk about how amazing some of the lightsaber fights that are from some Star Wars game cinematic trailers as well. For example, the star wars the old repulic lightsaber duels are choreographed so well that they're overlooked just because they're from a video game. Why couldn't they get inspired from those fights and put them into the sequel trilogy and so on. Great video as always

@caprisanh2845

Жыл бұрын

This is straight facts. Those trailers are among the most entertaining Star Wars fights in the franchise. Great point and thank you! 👊🏽

@Deadpool-ts3tq

Жыл бұрын

I LOVED those trailers for the duels

@Webhead259

Жыл бұрын

Dude, that’s what I’ve been saying this comment and this video needs to spread like wild, wild fire

@timechanger6679

Жыл бұрын

That’s always been something I’m annoyed about. Luke could have taught her how to use a saber better and Kylo should have already been using it like in the cinematics. The only reason Rey won their first fight was because Chewie shot him so he was at a disadvantage to begin with, and even more so since Finn had already worn him down some. But he’s fully healed from that and if Rey got some actually saber training in that film we could have gotten some badass duels. My disappointment is immeasurable, and the sequel trilogy is ruined

@bobwasdole

Жыл бұрын

nothing will ever go harder than 15 red lightsabers igniting in darkness. i’m tearing up just thinking about it

The Duel on Mustafar has to be top tier, as far as emotional connection and music go. You can hear the pain in Obi Wan's voice, and the hatred in Anakin's. You can see their hesitation, and the music mimicing Duel of the fates, it was amazing.

I’m studying lightsaber duels to eventually upload a short Star Wars film- and I really want the lightsaber battles to be really good. GREAT video 🙏

my favorite moment in lightsaber fights is when Anakin and Obi-Wan and fighting in their duel and Anakin is pushing towards obiwan in this little corridor and their lightsabers are hitting the walls and creating sparks. I think that small part was pretty awesome showing how completely focused they were on the duel and how aggressive Anakin was being.

@caprisanh2845

Жыл бұрын

Saaame. Love the sounds of the sabers hitting the walls too.

@Ares_gaming_117

Жыл бұрын

@@caprisanh2845 omg yes. it was so great. i wish they had more moments like that where the lightsabers are creating collateral damage

@darthshard8967

Жыл бұрын

@@caprisanh2845 I'm surprised that, obi wan and darth maul fight in rebels doesn't get a mentioned, yes it's very short but also the most heart breaking and personal, other than obi wan vs anakin,

One thing i observed from duel of the fates was how at the beginning of the fight Maul was treating Obi Wan like he was insignificant. Constantly just kicking him away, shrugging him off, he was an afterthought. A padawan. While the main prize in Mauls eyes was the older more renowned jedi master Qui Gon. Who would have made a much more prestigious kill. Then after Qui Gons death when Obi Wan comes at Maul with all the rage & ferocity, cuts Mauls blade in half. You can see him start to sweat it. & it was at that moment he knew he fucked up.

@kylercole2834

9 ай бұрын

The end of that is definitely true.

@Brewsy92

9 ай бұрын

​@@kylercole2834not just the end. He's got a good point. Maul really does disregard obi wan the entire time. Or keeps trying to separate the two to eliminate the master first - in his mind the bigger challenge. Maul was pretty calculating. The move he used on qui Gon to kill him worked because he managed to push qui Gon's blade to qui Gons left side, making him unable or less able to deflect the next two blows to his chin and getting impaled. Obi wan knew this when he killed maul. He deliberately did not let maul pull his blade to the left, and was able to effectively counter him. So it's not a stretch to think that maul would go after the master first... These fights are like chess matches.

@jimmyboy131

8 ай бұрын

After Obi-Wan got separated from him, Qui-Gon was skilled enough to keep pushing Maul backwards and on the defensive, to where Maul was actually worried he wouldn't survive. Only when Qui-Gon was worn down was Maul able to gain the upper hand.

@trevorthornley8835

8 ай бұрын

Never noticed that before.

@TheDeathmail

8 ай бұрын

It was actually the very end... when the Sith had the high ground that allowed Obi-Wan to win. Maul had a very clear advantage and Obi-Wan had absolutely no chance... so it made Maul forget that there was one more saber... Sith fail with the high ground... when they have it, they must gloat... when they don't, they refuse to acknowledge it's advantage...

Literally talking about this the other day. And you’re right on every aspect but I think more attention needs to be brought to the lack of choreography. It’s something I can forgive back in the original trilogy for three reasons. 1: I grew up either the original trilogy 2: The Vader suit was impossible to live in back then iirc 3: There wasn’t quite the same focus on choreography back then For all the flaws the prequels have, they still have it where it counts and the actors put effort into making those duels we love amazing. Either the sequel actors don’t care and aren’t bothering to learn, or the execs in charge don’t think it matters. Just look at Anakin in Ashoka. Hayden still has the talent, he’s learned and it’s not gone anywhere. But these new actors don’t or can’t manage it themselves. I’ll give benefit of the doubt to any character in a crazy costume or such, but if they don’t have anything hanging off of them then there really is no excuse.

This is awesome production quality! You deserve many more subs, and I'm sure they're on their way!

Another problem is that the sequels make lightsabers seem like baby swords. Unless you get cut in half, you’ll always be ok in like a week or less, whereas in the prequels, you get touched by the lightsaber and your toast even if it’s only a cut

@internetguyperson

7 ай бұрын

It never made sense with how that was handled in the prequels before either. A small cut wouldn’t have nearly as large of consequence as being stabbed since the wound would seal itself upon cutting.

@j.a.hernandez9742

7 ай бұрын

@@internetguyperson yeah but ur skin would boil, leaving not only an ugly scar, but also, depending where you got cut, it could be fatal. If you were cut anywhere from the torso to the chest you'd die, most people don't survive loosing an organ to it being inflamed, not to mention the amount of pain you'd feel getting cut could literally kill you.

@pian-0g445

6 ай бұрын

@@internetguypersonwhile the wound would ‘seal’ because of the insane heat, it would actually cause the blood and also water in the area to boil, which would actually lead to a more painful experience

@BiriBiri925

6 ай бұрын

@@internetguyperson Do you even understand what a lightsaber is? This is a stream of plasma that can instantly melt steel.

@coolmanplayz438

6 ай бұрын

​@@internetguyperson The point of small cuts isn't to leave lasting consequences anyways, its to inflict pain on your opponent in the hopes that they drop their guard so you can deal a blow that WILL have lasting consequences. That's a principle that's not just present in lightsaber fights, but in actual sword fights too.

I want to talk about something in the Phantom menace duel. As you said, there are quiet moments in good duels, when Obi fights Maul alone there is no music but there is a dark chant, something very evil, you feel that the Sith are back and, even if Obi beats Maul, the evil will stay. It's a very nice detail.

@NichtVorhanden

Жыл бұрын

I never paid attention to that. What a great detail.

@frocat5163

Жыл бұрын

From what I've read, that's because Lucas wrote his stories while listening to classical music. When he hired John Williams to score the films, he gave Williams the music he had been listening to while writing specific scenes, giving Williams a template of what Lucas wanted. Lucas also wanted the films to work without dialogue. So the music in the OT and PT is _INCREDIBLY_ important. When the music stops, it actually means something. This is completely missing in the sequels, and it's one of the (many) reasons those films are so sub-par.

@skarloeythomas5172

Жыл бұрын

@@frocat5163 Disney also completely lacks the same idiosyncratic dialogue style, instead opting for bland Hollywood. The costumes are imitative. The choices for sets and settings are the same two or three: the definition of vapid. New aliens and technologies are just derivative and uninspired.

1:22 Ooohoohoo love how you included the Darksaber, that sound is just beautiful

I love the duel with Vader in Return of the Jedi. The way the music swells when they go into the last verse of the fight is so good.

@Nijeldagamer

2 ай бұрын

It's my favorite duel.

My biggest problem with these fights is that the old fights look like a sword fight, the new fights is just straight up slamming into your opponent

@Sebbe_Myhre

11 ай бұрын

yeah right? Why does ray just constantly spam the one armed heavy attack? 🤣

@davidtibben6498

11 ай бұрын

agreed, so many full on, full send attacks gets repetitive and boring, as opposed to calculated blocks, parrys and spins from these fights

@vincent9882

11 ай бұрын

@@Sebbe_Myhre She copies her grandfather

@Sebbe_Myhre

11 ай бұрын

@@vincent9882 yeah at least she tries to... She's just so stiff in every single fight scene.

@Sothas

11 ай бұрын

This is something I actually appreciate about them. They aren't duelists. They don't really know wtf they're doing, and I think it's shown fairly well, tbh. They're not as good or exciting as other fights, but they tell the correct story.

I'M AN IDIOT. I never noticed in any of the other films that the LIGHTsabers never cast any LIGHT. aside from like twice. Also, I think the use of multiple cuts in the section where Obi-Wan cuts maul in half really works to show just how FAST he's moving. there's a reason why it worked there, because though it was slowed down for US to understand what's happening, the cuts make it seem like it's happening super quick.

@caprisanh2845

Жыл бұрын

Haha I wouldn’t say you’re an idiot for that. I think you’re definitely right about the cuts during that moment. It happens so fast that it not only surprises us, but Maul too.

@meputochannel3517

Жыл бұрын

@DBfan106 You're not alone, my friend. I'll be damned if I noticed that before this video slaped me in the face with the truth. 🤣

@vengeanceconscious9774

Жыл бұрын

Attack of the clones

@DBfan106

Жыл бұрын

@@vengeanceconscious9774 that was a typo, I meant to say 'in MOST of any of the other films'. because I remembered that part specifically.

@vengeanceconscious9774

Жыл бұрын

@@DBfan106 oh lol

I’m subbing to you man. You really understand Star Wars. Almost made me cry. I hope Star Wars Devs and Writers see this. We gotta have change.

the Mail fight is absolutely incredible with the camera! the emotions in that fight were just so exuberayting

Another thing with the prequel duels is everyone had their own style. Dooku was so elegant, Yoda agile, Maul athletic, Obi Wan was just cool. In the sequels I'm not seeing any of this, just people swinging wildly which could make sense for Rey but Kylo was trained by both Luke and Snoke, he should be much better. I'm glad you picked up on some of the positives though, I love the lighting of the new savers and I thought the fight in the forest was cool especially with the trees coming down.

@ChristhianGT

7 ай бұрын

But wasn't he trained young also? (I am not sure) But if he was, I do enjoy it because it's more realistic like a 30-40-year-old trying to do the thing they did at 15, Can they do it Yes but horrible if they keep up training and actually dueling.

@TebbleTV

7 ай бұрын

I recommend looking up the lightsaber forms to get a better understanding of everyone's fighting style.

@internetguyperson

7 ай бұрын

I mean, Kylo fights through his anger. That’s why Luke didn’t want to train him anymore, so it’s likely that overtime, Kylo cared less for his form because his anger blinds him. That’s part of the reason his lashes out at almost every character.

@elijahalbiston

7 ай бұрын

I liked that he picked up on some positives as well. But I also agree with the forms and certain temperament that each duelist in the prequels had. We even see Luke in s2 of Mando and he’s clearly in top form, everything looks smooth, and that’s the guy who trains Kylo Ren. So why’d he end up going all bats?

@TebbleTV

7 ай бұрын

@@elijahalbiston Could be just the lack of consistency in the writing but, also by the time Luke build the new Jedi Order the styles would have shifted to light, medium and heavy, at least from what we know from the Jedi Outcast games.

The double-block back to front by Obi-wan is just amazing to watch. That's why I think it's the best saber duel ever.

@caprisanh2845

5 ай бұрын

Straight facts 👊🏽

@Adeon55

5 ай бұрын

Yeah, that's the coolest moment, but also made possible by just how quickly Maul double strikes with power. I had to slow it down frame by frame and look at Obi-wan and Maul individually to appreciate exactly what opposing movements were being made in that badass fraction of a second lol

@mryeet765

4 ай бұрын

@@caprisanh2845Obi-Wan Vs Anakin tho

@ncard00

3 ай бұрын

If all star wars fans just stopped supporting Disney, and only supported fan films, Disney's star wars monopoly would end, and star wars would get so much better, both very quickly, but people don't do that, cause they complain and complain, but don't do anything about it.

@wyattE415

3 ай бұрын

@@ncard00 And we are tribal, disagreeable beings, so participating in such a thing which used to exist, called a boycott in the before-times, now does not exist. People just pour the Dark Side into every social media outlet and think that was their "making a difference." Honestly the internet should not have been invented until we were smart enough to use it, but we would have needed to wait a few thousand years at least.

Thank you for making this video. I've felt this but couldn't understand why. Now it all makes sense! Also, that obi-wan/qui-gon fight is also my favorite!

That video was beautifully done....perfection!

What I love most about the Obi-Wan vs Maul fight is that it is going so fast that every time they are close to each other, it feels super dangerous, like one wrong step could spell the end for either of them. Whenever they separate, it feels like a breath of air before diving back in.

@rory8182

Жыл бұрын

I once heard that a lightsabre duel should be like a game of chess, but every move has to be a check

@badfart7754

Жыл бұрын

yeah i feel that too another reason why the sequels sucked cuz there were WAY to many gaps so the feeling you explained just wasn't there

@SapphirosCZ

Жыл бұрын

@@rory8182 That applies to every swordfight.

@purplecat6578

Жыл бұрын

@@badfart7754 Same with all of Star Wars, honestly. The prequel fights look like a dance of sorts, with either person meeting their opponents blade way before it hits them. Of course, it makes sense in canon but pretty much all the fights in the prequels look non-lethal. The sequel trilogy does almost the exact opposite, to the point where some times it doesn't even feel like the people fighting are force-users. The prequels felt too soft, the sequels felt too hard. I would cover the original trilogy as well, but it's been a long time since I've seen the movies and I don't want to criticise something I don't have a good handle on

@SkullpunkArt

Жыл бұрын

True

I'd like to add a 4th reason: The Lack of Swordsmanship & Choreography - You look at the Original Trilogy, while they're not as flashy as the Prequels, the duels were simple & had basic swordsmanship & techniques that were serviceable. - You look at the Prequel, say what you will at how choreographed & flashy they are, but if you look at a lot of them, there are a lot of advanced sword techniques & fighting styles that would be plausible (though not the best option) in a sword fight on top of the basics. - You look at the Sequels, there are so many things wrong just on basic swordsmanship alone. Overly large telegraphed swings (some of which not even aiming at the opponent), unnecessary spins, the lack of a guard stance. Even the special effects has error (Biggest offender being the disappearing knife in the Throne Room scene).

@everlastingdragon4520

Жыл бұрын

Exactly. While Shadiversity has pointed out the many flaws with lightsaber duels, at the very least you can tell that these are based off of real techniques and the characters aren't being complete idiots. I've never picked up a weapon in my life, and I'm pretty sure I could beat Rey in a lightsaber duel.

@dipperpines2793

Жыл бұрын

This sums up some of my thoughts, same with Everlasting Dragon's comment. My only critique of the maul-vs-obi-wan fight is that there are some practical flaws that could be fixed. That's kind of the only reason I prefer the OT fights, or at least Vader VS Luke in ESB, over anything else

@shinobu5742

Жыл бұрын

They actually should break free from the old type of fighting, I mean it's a sword and force fight, just look at avatar, if they keep dancing around doing moves just to throw rocks, water, fire and air people would be bored, but as avatar improves per generation their fighting style also change. Just imagine seeing cool scene in star wars as dark and light user go crazy and shit with force power. They need to break free from old custom fighting boring stuff. I know their are many things force power can do. Choking someone with it is imaginative. I wanna see more of this imaginative stuff

@cpchyper

Жыл бұрын

@@everlastingdragon4520 no you can't. she will beat you to pulp with the mary sue power dude

@enlightenmentdoesntcomeeas5337

Жыл бұрын

Exactly my thoughts. The one most obvious flaw of the ST is the lack of form and technique in the duels. Which was present in the first 6 movies.

The attack of the finger mention brought back a core memory, any kind of sword fighting once the finger was struck it’s checkmate

You forgot the part where the person gets stabbed but is chillin latter

In the original trilogy, Lightsabers were only used rarely and were quite conservative in their usage. I always liked how cautiously they were used; remember, these things are a constant beam of energy that can cut *anything* with minimal effort, so you really need to be paying attention when you use them. Nothing could be more embarrassing than running around with a lightsaber deployed only to trip slightly and cut your own leg off.

@toastedtarts4044

Жыл бұрын

I didn’t like how in the disney show, grand inquisitor and the third sister got stabbed, and they are still alive. They had the lightsaber clean thrust through them

@kastchei7128

Жыл бұрын

They don't have to be consciously careful though, they're a Jedi or a Sith. They fight with the force flowing through them, guiding their actions. Basically a pseudo omniscience that should prevent any possibility of self harm with the lightsaber and allows them to go balls to the wall in terms of movements and attacks. It's why it canonically makes sense that such a dangerous weapon is only used by a Jedi or a Sith. They're the only ones who DON'T have to be super careful with them.

@Chzydawg

Жыл бұрын

The original and prequels nailed the deadly nature of the lightsaber, sequels didn’t get the message. In the pre/originals one swipe could cut somebody in half, in the sequels they happily showed people getting stabbed and sliced with very minimal damage. It was like they were stuck in child lock or something. Maybe all the good kaiber crystals had been used up by the Death Stars.

@toastedtarts4044

Жыл бұрын

@@Chzydawg in video games they call it a nerf. That came from an old video games from maybe 2006. A patch changed the swords to be laughable like nerf bats

@BallerTimbo

Жыл бұрын

​@@toastedtarts4044 Look at Darth Maul

Obi wan vs maul the first lightsaber duel in 1000 years?! That honestly makes it more epic, also why he and his master seem so tense.

@runerdude141

Жыл бұрын

First duel. Tatooine doesn’t count for reasons. Maybe we call it a spat? Not a duel, a spat.

@vetarlittorf1807

Жыл бұрын

No. It's just the first duel between a Jedi and a Sith since Darth Bane and Darth Zannah dueled Farfalla on Tython 1000 years earlier.

@bakionigeri6414

Жыл бұрын

Most people would choose an anime girl for their wife, and that's fine, but my wife is Darth Zannah👸🏼

@Yumums

Жыл бұрын

Yeah first with Jedi vs straight sith. Obi Wan defeating Maul got him promoted to Knight and allowed him to skip the Jedi trials. Killing the Sith that killed a fairly powerful Master was a very big deal.

@Hellraiser988

Жыл бұрын

Yet dooku yeets Obi-Wan but Anakin offs him and gets nothing lol

I like how in the phantom menace there is this one moment where obiwan flips his lightsaber around in the maul fight so fast the post production lightsaber effect literally was delayed for a second

Bro the music from the last Kenobi fight was so dope. It was epic and emotional. Just perfect

Old duels feel and have a taste that's unique to themselves. Also, characters had their own "essence" that was unique to each and every one of them. The crazy shit of whatever Grievous was doing, the elegance of Count Dooku's style, the mad speed of Yoda, Anakin's aggressive and a bit of recklessness, Emperor's lethality on each strike, Obi Wan's methodical approach, etc. But now, the sequels make everyone look the same, everyone looks like they are trying to bash and swing at a piñata.

@KororaPenguin

6 ай бұрын

Or Mace Windu turning foes' aggression against them in a lightsaber form that you need to be a paragon to master without turning bad.

@BEDCORN

4 ай бұрын

that's what made the lego starwars games so good to is that you could play as all of those characters and feel the difference

@cerebrophage7709

4 ай бұрын

You're basing your claim on a subjective perception. But let's go with it. I can feel a difference in the style between Kylo and Rey. Kylo feels wreckless, impatient, angry. You can see it in how he holds his body low to the ground, his feet spread apart, how he twirls his saber, his strong swings. Rey feels reserved, almost like she's scared of herself a bit, justifiably so.

@dracorexyz

4 ай бұрын

and also Vader's one hand stiff movements indicating his suit is made to limit him

@dr.bright6272

4 ай бұрын

Because they're being directed by people with 0 knowledge of swords and executed by people without the skill to fake their way through.

"Until this dude shows up and tries to run over a kid" I nearly spat out my soda. You're right, that really was Darth Maul's first act of villainy in the franchise. I bet in his head he was like "this one's ten points" as he swerved toward Anakin, too.

@caprisanh2845

Жыл бұрын

Omg I’m never gonna watch that scene again without thinking “this one’s ten points.” 😂 Freakin hilarious

Well said. Lightsaber fights these days just feels like two people going through what the choreographer told them to do.

The Phantom Menace duel was basically what made me fall in love with Star Wars. As a kid that scene was so epic. It made me and all my friends want to be jedis.

Honestly, while duel of the fates is good, battle of the heroes (battle and song) holds a very special place in my heart. The emotions of the entire battle are unmatched. you are on edge the whole time.

@orlandofurioso7329

Жыл бұрын

Battle of Heroes feels like a culmination, like a peak of everything built up in the prequels, and it's glorious.

@yitterskitter5223

Жыл бұрын

Which one is that?

@kevint7288

Жыл бұрын

​@@yitterskitter5223 Anakin v. Obi-Wan

@yitterskitter5223

Жыл бұрын

@@kevint7288 oh for some reason I thought that was called duel of the fates II

@captainbork1973

Жыл бұрын

@@yitterskitter5223 Duel of the Fates actually plays halfway through the fight

I really think the lightsaber styles also lack of diversity. Maul VS Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon was so intense for the reasons you mentionned, yes, but also because their fighting techniques were so damn different from each other's. Maul's speed, Qui-Gon's fluidity and Obi-Wan's agressivity towards the end of the duel were all things that allowed us to recognize each character without even having to look at the color of their blade. Even with my godawful eyesight, I was able to determine who is who only judging by their movements. Nowadays, it really is the only thing we can that would make me able to spot the difference between the duelists fighting, clothes and charadesigns aside. Kylo and Rey fight the same way as Finn did, only slow agressive moves with big swings to both block and attack. And what about the Kenobi show ? Same thing as I just mentionned, even though Obi-Wan has been canonically mentionned to be the best denfensive-oriented lightsaber user in the jedi order from that era. My point is... If you prevent a character from having somewhat of an unique fighting style, what allows us to compare their lightsaber skills to their opposant ? How can we consider Kylo Ren to be a menace while he fights like litterally all the lightsaber weilders he's come accross in his life ?

@Kal-213

Жыл бұрын

Agreed. I wish they would bring in more of the specific lightsaber styles mentioned in books and other things. Like maybe Kylo could've used Djem So as an outlet for his aggression. Perhaps Rey could use Shii-Cho because she really hasn't been taught much. I completely agree that I want to see differing fighting styles. Yoda vs Count Dooku was easy to tell the difference even if Yoda had been regular size because of his erratic jumps and movements, compared to Dooku's more stable and calculated attacks.

@jamesdick2580

Жыл бұрын

agreed. Rey and Kylo might as well have been fighting with baseball bats.

@marceloxaustivo784

Жыл бұрын

@@jamesdick2580 that was the feeling I always got in the sequels, like they were fighting with bats and not light sabers

@hazyphantom

Жыл бұрын

Same as the scene when Count Dooku (Balanced style) is fighting against Obi-Wan Kenobi (Defensive style) and Anakin Skywalker (Offensive style)

@purplecat6578

Жыл бұрын

I understand what you're saying, but the sequels do have those unique styles for each character. Finn had that janky, defensive, confused shakiness when he was fighting Kylo. Kylo has that rage-filled yet still taunting feel to his swings. Rey, while having the most exaggerated swings in the whole franchise, also had her own notable style. After rewatching the fight, I do see what you're talking about with Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon vs Maul, and the different emotions put forth by the fighting. Although, take a look at Anakin vs Obi-Wan. There's spots in the fight where you see Anakin as aggressive, and Obi-Wan as hesitant but then a long duel happens, and they look the exact same. I know they trained together, but they should still feel a whole lot more separate then they were

Perfect video analysis!

Mine's honestly Darth Malgus against the Jedi Master in the Deceived trailer from The Old Republic. Those trailers were the last time you got to see truly fast lightsaber action in really good animated form. It's good choreography from lightsaber combatants who have spent decades fighting each other and what I consider the top tier of warriors.

Yoda vs Duku had me screaming as a kid. Just the fact that Yoda could actually do anything useful was like witnessing a true miracle (my favorite dual)

@5Demona5

10 ай бұрын

It made me drop my jaw in awe, but it also made me laugh. Cause Yoda struggles to walk around all movies.... and suddenly he's so nimble and agile.... and then goes back to limping with a cane 😂😂😂😂

@Johsther

10 ай бұрын

​@@5Demona5 it's because he's using the force to help him move during a duel

@Profeshinal

10 ай бұрын

@@5Demona5 And his little stature makes it even more amazing. This little green dude absolutely goes to town on a Sith lord and all we've seen before of him is an old man. Yoda is such a good character

@hasthehighground8560

10 ай бұрын

This is exactly why it’s a terrible duel. Yoda is above physical combat, the fact that you didn’t consider Yoda useful until he busted out a lightsaber and started spazzing out doing flips is proof that it sucks. All style and no substance.

@marja-liisamakinen676

10 ай бұрын

yoda vs dooku is garbage duel i dont even know why poeple like it it literally makes me feel nothingof exitement

What I like to think about in that glorious duel is that Maul has been training for it and together with Sidious studied the Jedi's fighting style. Obi Wan normally is very patient and defensive. That's why Maul gets overwhelmed and loses half his lightsaber when fury makes Obi Wan change his style to very aggressive. When he adapts he manages to push Obi Wan in the hole. Only to misjudge his tenacity once more. Combined with the music, definitely the most epic lightsaber action of the franchise.

@Scorch-SkittishMCJames813

10 ай бұрын

It was interesting too. This video made me remember the true emotion of that scene. Qui Gon must have felt some grief himself, not knowing whether or not Obi Wan was TRULY ready. Darth Maul on the other hand, just saw him as a target. One down and one to go. Obi Wan just saw his mentor get killed, but he has no time to mourn, and he has to plan out his movement very quickly. It's very emotionally and mentally well done when you put the thought into it

@kfactor20

10 ай бұрын

I swear the Jedi and Sith are two sides of the same coin. The Sith are so cocky and arrogant in their power that they unintentionally leave themselves open for a killing blow. And the Jedi had become so arrogant and politically corrupt that it costed their entire order at the hands of a very strategic, manipulative, and powerful Sith Lord

@Scorch-SkittishMCJames813

10 ай бұрын

@@kfactor20 honestly it is, and that's the beauty of it. You pretty much have to get out of your comfort zone or get really into it if you're going to win. Being on the fence can lead to danger

This is what i needed to hear. Thank you for validating my opinions haha

0:50 great point. It's one of those that some people (like me) don't even realize why it puts the feeling off until someone points it out. It just doesn't have the weight without the light.

The animated saber battles are more thoughtfully choreographed than the live action ones now. Tales of the Jedi was amazing.

@internetguyperson

7 ай бұрын

You can get away with a lot more things in animation which might have something to do with that. For example, the author of this video showed a scene that was motion captured between two trained swordsman to get a better feel on how trained fighter would battle. It’s hard to get the same effect in live action unless both actors actors have training with weapons. They have to make some creative liberties to make up for that part. The training the actors do on set can only do so much.

@xX_DarkPriestessDemonDragon_Xx

6 ай бұрын

@@internetguyperson i just wanna say that in both cases choreography definitely still plays a major part

@necr0danc3r29

6 ай бұрын

You can do so much more with animation. The Clone Wars show had some really good fights. Obi-Wan and Anakin vs Dooku is still my favorite. As much as I love Sir Christopher Lee, it would have been insanely difficult to get him to move like that irl.

@abbc5156

5 ай бұрын

@@internetguyperson nonetheless the choreography in the anakin vs obi-wan fight is absolutely beautiful. Maybe it was the man who stages the fights, maybe director but these fights look nothing but gorgeous without pro martial artists.

@argentinelawdness

4 ай бұрын

@@internetguyperson well you say this, but some of the stuff in various star wars anime is motion capture

8:28 *Fun Fact:* In Revenge Of The Sith, Anakin jumped over Obi-Wan to try and strike him the way Obi-Wan struck down Maul. As a padawan,, Anakin was obsessed with Obi's fight with Maul, he even altered a training droid to look like Maul. But unfortunate for Anakin that was probably the biggest mistake of his life, resulting in the lost of his 3 remaining limbs.

@jackgunn1480

4 ай бұрын

Good observation.

@hamstercreature951

4 ай бұрын

I see it now

@histguy101

4 ай бұрын

He tried to beat Obi with his own move, the ultimate diss, but Obi Wan is the ultimate with his ultimate move

@dr.bright6272

4 ай бұрын

Obi-Wan: please Anakin I invented that move

@csguy3223

3 ай бұрын

Bad choice thinking Obi Wan would fall for his own trick.

When talking about the editing of the saber fights I was very happy. I felt like if I blink I completely miss what is going on.

To me the fatigue always felt more of an annoyance than anything cause they literally didn’t do much at all they get tired after two minutes while anakin and obi wan can have a ten minute high speed Dueling session while still getting out some of the best and most emotional dialogue in the series

My most favorite Lightsaber duels of All time is Mustafar Duel. Both the camera, the music, the atmosphere, the choreograph and the Characters is what makes it so memorable.

@DaanBruins

Жыл бұрын

Agreed

@ethan1937

Жыл бұрын

@Random Guy But it's the ultimate climax of the entire saga, what 5 movies before it were building up to. the most emotional fight and creation of vader.. it had to be overblown

@DaanBruins

Жыл бұрын

@@user-qo8se6dd4r It's not overdone. Jedi have the force you know. They can anticipate each others strikes. That's why it's so fast. And if you felt nothing seeing Obi-Wan and Anakin fight to the death than that's on you.

Idk why but the little bit right before Obi Wan and Maul fight where just seconds before Obi-Wan is hyping himself up, jumping up and down to get the blood flowing, was also a super nice touch compared to alot of future fights where everyone can jump into action without a moment to get themselves ready or stretch.

@caprisanh2845

Жыл бұрын

Totally agree. It’s the little details that make it so much better

@MrZithgal

Жыл бұрын

I loved that bit. Dude is amped up, angry, and raring to go. I'm glad someone else noticed this.

@sterlingroberts6240

Жыл бұрын

Ewan improvised that bit. No one told him to do it, but he was thoroughly in character.

@jez76

Жыл бұрын

The great thing about that is that Obi is not behaving “like he should”. Less than a minute earlier it was Qui Gon and Maul on separate sides, you could see the aggressive sith walking back and forth impatient like a tiger in a cage that hasn’t been fed in a thousand years, while Qui Gon didn’t waste a second to meditate while locked in. Like any master would’ve. Duel of the fates, simply a masterpiece in all senses.

Bro that Mustafar fight was the most epic duel to this day. I can agree that Episode 1 also had an amazing duel, but the Mustafar duel really felt like an appropriate climax to the prequels

The lightsaber fights in the prequels are my favorite scenes in the series.

In the original movies, the duels between vader, luke, and obi wan were based on fencing and kendo basically. In the prequels, they got more extravagant with force jumps, flips, etc, but still with realistic choreographing in terms of strikes. In the new ones, the fight choreography often looks sloppy and sometimes nonsensical (best example of this being rey and kylo fighting the praetorian guards).

@jayburn00

11 ай бұрын

Also, sometimes it seems like they are behaving like they are using clubs (which technically they are, but the depiction is supposed to be sword fighting).

@Unknown-hm7qx

11 ай бұрын

The prequal fights actually had two people sword fight, so there was no cheapening of the battle; it was what it was, while the sequel fights are more CGI, and the actors barely have to train to do the battles, vs the hours of actual sword training put into the prequals. The whole thing just shows the decent into laziness of the films, 1,2,3,4,5,6 having top quality put into them, and 7,8,9 being for nothing other than money.

@jayburn00

11 ай бұрын

@@Unknown-hm7qx if they put money into actual choreography, it would probably look better.

@xijinping3317

11 ай бұрын

@@jayburn00 its almost like the fights are supposed to suck

@xavierrodriguez2463

11 ай бұрын

even in the prequels the choreography sometimes just has total nonsense.

My favorite duel is Obi-Wan vs Maul on rebels. It was beautiful

@caprisanh2845

Жыл бұрын

This is a top tier opinion 👌🏽

@konch7567

Жыл бұрын

Always love to hear Rebels W's

@cdy

Жыл бұрын

i love rebels

@cameronis8089

Жыл бұрын

Speaking of Rebels, there’s also the fight between Ashoka and Vader on Malachor 5, one of the few duels where we get to see Anakin under the mask. It, too, was exceptional.

@nuclearsimian3281

Жыл бұрын

It is literally the best duel in the franchise. That is how fast sword fights were. One person moves, the other sees the opening, parries, then stabs. They were really like gunslingers from the old west, dueling at noon, only with a sword instead.

That Halo 2/3 song near the end just makes this video even better.

Dude... did you use the background music from Gran Turismo? Nice pick ^^ Besides.. I really enjoied your analyzse, and your are so right!

I really love the first Lightsaber duel between Luke and Vader. It’s slow and methodical and plays out much more like an old Kurosawa samurai duel. That said, I also really love Vader VS Obiwan on Mustafar. The tone, the cinematography, the effects, the story, the acting, the music, the way the environment becomes a third character as the fight progresses and becomes more perilous. Mastapeece.

@eliasadam2345

Жыл бұрын

Same, it really made it seem that Vader was trapping Luke with the environment and how there was no where for him to escape. It was like it was just effortless for Vader to back Luke into a corner and was completely dominate. Also you could imagine Luke feeling cramped in the scene and that everything around him was a threat once Vader was using objects to hurl at Luke.

@yhwach1

Жыл бұрын

Vader vs Luke was trash.

@Carlitobonline

Жыл бұрын

@@yhwach1 you have trash taste

@27648281

Жыл бұрын

@@eliasadam2345 I like the final duel between Luke and Vader more, the lighting, the music and the tension of that fight is just superb.

@marcogianesello6083

Жыл бұрын

That fight is 45 minutes of nothingness. It's 45 minutes of pointlessly waving shiny sticks around instead of actually fighting and has absolutely zero punctuation or rythm. There is no back amd forth, there is no one taking advantage or losing it throughout, there is no actual development of the conflict, it's ridicolously morbid and bloatedly self grandiose. It's flashyness in place of tension, exploding lava in place of grit and pathos and it's 45 minutes long to make you forget the fact that the entire reason why the fight is happening in the first place is beyond asinine and flaccid. Let alone the fact that it ends on the most ridicolous nonsense conclusion imaginable, which kind of works as a good metaphor for the prequels, darth vader lost what should have been the duel of the saga because george lucas decided triple random triple back flips could replace actually interesting conflict. And as such, darth vader lost because doing a triple backflip was more important than winning.

For me you can't get much better than Obi-Wan vs Anakin. Duel of Fates is great, but the speed, emotion, and power of Anakin vs Obi-Wan will always stick with me.

@leoquest1975

Жыл бұрын

IMO - Obi vs Ana was very good, but it lost points for those dark close up shots where we could not see what the characters were actually doing. Then the unnecessary twirling the sabers behind their backs when they were literally face-to-face was also weird. Like the video says, wide and brighter shots rule.

@mikedangerdoes

Жыл бұрын

Too long, too much flashy stuff, too much CGI. I don't rate it. I'll give it points for theoretically having two characters whose motivations we mostly understand and might even care about, but other than that it's sub-par.

@jmurray1110

Жыл бұрын

You know mustafar was a model right not cgi Actually the sequels have more CGI than the prequels

@mikedangerdoes

Жыл бұрын

@@jmurray1110 Ok. Too much green screen and bad CGI then. Search your feelings, you know it to be true. Also, the sequels being bad doesn't make the prequels good.

@Huggybear-ot7rv

Жыл бұрын

​@@mikedangerdoesyou're right. The quality of the sequels has no effect on the quality prequels. The prequels rock, the sequels suck and the best lightsaber fight was ROTJ. You're just a wet blanket lol

That dual with darth mail was the one I remembered from when I was a small kid. It was genuinely the best

Two kids playing with plastic swords in the park can probably have an aesthetically better lightsaber "duel" than what is portrayed in current star wars media.

The Maul fight has one of my favorite examples of visual story telling within a duel. The scene with the laser gates up offers perfect characterization for all of these characters. Maul is pacing like a wolf stalking at his prey from the shadows. Qui-Gon is meditating and recollecting his thoughts. He takes the consular’s approach to the break in combat. Probably my favorite bit of characterization for him. Obi-Wan jumping up and down, ready to dart toward Maul is also a great way of showing characterization for him. He’s still a Padawan and he isn’t as collected as Qui-Gon. He just wants to get into the battle and is anxious being split up from his master. Probably my favorite moment in the movie tbh.

@jonshaqqir4575

10 ай бұрын

That fight was awful. Darth mail left so many openings but the Jedi were too focused on dancing instead of slaying

@andersonjosiah

10 ай бұрын

@@jonshaqqir4575 That’s a problem with most (if not all) prequel duels. They can feel more like a dance than a duel.

@merluzacongelada5361

10 ай бұрын

​@@andersonjosiah Honestly this. I wouldn't say that the sequel fights are masterpieces of anything but at the very least it looks like they're actually trying to hurt the other person.

@andersonjosiah

10 ай бұрын

@@merluzacongelada5361 frfr

@CHRoOMAX

10 ай бұрын

@@jonshaqqir4575 Well then you are lost

Luke v Vader in Episode 5 is criminally underrated imo. Obviously everyone remembers it for the famous line but the actual fight itself is so beautifully shot and paced. When they’re both just staring each other down at the start of the fight with lightsabers drawn is one of my favourite shots in cinematic history

@Hananotaka

Жыл бұрын

You speak the truth. It also has everything this video talks about, in spades. Production, editing, music, emotional connection.

@stephenbernard3003

Жыл бұрын

The cherry on top is the story of that fight. Vader is toying, testing his son, probing for strengths weakness. He is impressed with his training. Then switches to force attack. When Luke finally lands a blow he like ‘stuff this’ shows the boy the real Vader.

@Aquablue62

Жыл бұрын

Completely agree, one of the better lightsaber duels imo

@elasmojones

Жыл бұрын

wait, that's underrated? by whom?

@Shad0w5carab

Жыл бұрын

@@elasmojones I just never see it mentioned when people talk about the best lightsaber duels. I feel like it’s overshadowed by the “I am your father” line but the fight itself is so well done

Lots of views on this one, well deserved. Great job!

yoda vs dooku will always be my favorite. especially because the first time i watched it, all i knew of yoda was his calm demeanor, and his incredible control over the force. but never really got to see him in a serious fight against a formidable opponent. especially when he whips out his lightsaber and does some crazy double backflips and shit oh my god

The duel between Luke and Vader in Empire deserves so much more credit than it gets. That fight is, in my opinion, literal perfection. It's closer to the sequels in terms of choreography, but the difference is that there is actual intelligence and intention throughout. Vader and Luke aren't just swinging their lightsabers like baseball bats without a single thought between the two of them (**cough cough,** Rey and Kylo). For the first half of the duel you can actually tell Vader is testing Luke. He uses one hand, and everything he does is in response to Luke's attempts to subvert his guard. The second half of the duel is a one sided beat down from Vader. He out muscles, out thinks, out skills, and overpowers Luke at every turn. He employs the Force in a casual, but devastating manner against Luke, absolutely rocking him with machinery. His thrusts and slashes cause Luke to practically buckle under their sheer force. When Luke manages to sneak a hit in, Vader cranks up the intensity and instantly disarms Luke (literally). At that moment it becomes totally apparent that Vader was going *easy.* And then of course, we get the famous reveal about Vader being Luke's father, and Luke's entire perception of life just crumbles to dust. Every moment of that duel is a masterpiece, and it exemplifies every point you make in this video. A movie from the 80's shows more of the fight in one take than most modern SW movies. I can't decide if that's impressive on Lucas's part, or sad on Disney's part.

@caprisanh2845

Жыл бұрын

I gotta say I agree with every one of your points. That dual is in my top 3 because of the amazing storytelling and the climax that is yet to be rivaled by any other Star Wars dual.

@MandatoryFruit

Жыл бұрын

@@caprisanh2845 A true man of culture

@razorpit

Жыл бұрын

I was going to respond and say this fight was the best, but I could have never put it in to words as well as you did. Well done.

@MandatoryFruit

Жыл бұрын

@@razorpit Damn. That's honestly one of the nicest replies I've ever gotten. Thank you.

@OveToranger

Жыл бұрын

"that's impressive on Lucas's part, or sad on Disney's part" Por que no los dos 😉🤣

One thing to also note: Christopher Lee had engaged in actual swordfights. He gave Peter Jackson information about what it's actually like when someone's killed with a sword, but refused to elaborate how he knew. He was also part of a legendary British spy unit in WW2 alongside Ian Fleming (creator of James Bond). I think we can all figure out how he knew what it sounds like to kill someone with a sword.

@Punishthefalse

11 ай бұрын

To think we missed the opportunity of having Christopher Lee as James Bond.

@arminmariusschmutz6779

10 ай бұрын

Wasn't that in the Lotr production? I doubt he ever had to use a real sword on someone, but there e explaines how it would sound if someone were stabbed by a dagger...

@Casedilla73

10 ай бұрын

Was he the inspiration for James Bond?

@Punishthefalse

10 ай бұрын

@@Casedilla73 No, that's Ian Fleming, who was his colleague.

@CatoSicarius903

10 ай бұрын

​​@@arminmariusschmutz6779 He probably heard first hand information of Ww1 even before his service. Where fights could be as close to hand to hand in trenches.

You nailed it man, I agree. I hope they can improve the fights in future movies

I love the halo music you added to a Star Wars video 😂

About fatigue, I think it's worth mentioning that earlier duels had this too, like Luke getting winded from his duel with Vader in ESB or in RotS when the fight choreography became slower and sloppier as the duel between Anakin and Obi-Wan went on. I think it was more subtle and interesting than in the sequel trilogy where the overall choreography is sluggish and lumbering. Both fresh and tired combatants flail their sabers wildly at each other, limiting (at least visually) the impact fatigue has on the flow of the duel.

@John-X

7 ай бұрын

just wanna say that, the uploader said he wont judge u if ur favorite lightsaber duel is from the sequels, _but i will._ i *will* judge u for liking that fanfiction-tier trash, actually no, that's insulting to fanfictions. It's insulting to compare fanfictions to the fake Disney "sequels" especially when there are high quality ones like that Darth Maul fanfic.

@christophertarliman8408

7 ай бұрын

​@@John-X What is bro on about💀💀

@John-X

7 ай бұрын

@@christophertarliman8408 BEGONE NORMIE, REEEEEEEEE 😡😡😡😡😡

I totally agree with the cuts issue. Yes, I get that it's much easier to film a bunch of perfect 1-second shots and splice them together, than to film an extended scene of continuous perfection. But the latter method makes the fight SO much more satisfying because you can see the continuity and follow the progression of the fight yourself. Don't be lazy and take the magic out of the fight by showing us a new angle every second, forcing us to recalibrate our brains and fill in the continuity ourselves every time; we'll miss most of the fight that way!

@Skyfalcon12345

Жыл бұрын

This is why everyone thinks Mission impossible, John Wick, and that scene between Steve and Georges St. Pierre are the epitome of fighting choreography. No disrespect to them of course, but there are DOZENS of incredible, uncut super fight scenes in Asian action movies. We need better choreographers and more actors/directors like Michael B. Jordan. That one shot fight in Creed 1 was intense.

@InternationalAwesomeFoundation

Жыл бұрын

Jackie Chan moment

@Ozone946

Жыл бұрын

hey, don't be so harsh! its not like star wars is one of the biggest franchises on the world and Disney a literal money making machine

@waitisthatcobalt

Жыл бұрын

One of the things that separates good and mediocre directing.

@Trepur349

Жыл бұрын

Yeah the cuts is often just laziness and I really think it hurts the viewing experience when you often can't tell what's happening. I also think setting matters. The quick cuts can work in a chaotic battle because it can make them feel more chaotic, but when it's a fight between two expet duelists it's not supposed to be chaotic it's supposed to be elegant and so the quick cuts don't really make sense in a setting like Star Wars

I think Yoda vs. Palpatine and Yoda vs. Doku have always been my favorite fights. I just love how he jumps around and attacks from all angles and stuff. Its super hype and I cannot get enough of it.

5:30 This is exactly why the Hong Kong Jackie Chan movies were so good. Yeah, you don't have all these crazy effects, but every single cut leads into the next part of the action sequence and every interaction builds off the last. I understand that the film industry relies heavily on post effects, but if they had the full flow of choreography in mind, the artists would have even more to work with when creating the backgrounds and why we should care about them.

The reason I like the Prequel fights is they were shot like a Kung Fu film. Martial Arts fans will know what I mean. Wide shots, no quick cuts, no shaky cam, you see the actors' faces doing the moves, the fight tells a story, close-up reaction shots so you know how the characters are feeling.

@loftkilla4684

Жыл бұрын

George Lucas was massively influenced by Akira Kurosawa's cinematic style, long shots, wide angles, and holding a frame for a time to to carry it's emotional weight.

@evantindle1564

Жыл бұрын

That’s exactly why they’re bad

@tartatovsky

Жыл бұрын

@@evantindle1564 no

@evantindle1564

Жыл бұрын

@@tartatovsky yes, actually

@gameoverinsertcointocontin8102

Жыл бұрын

@@evantindle1564 Oh, one of the very few sequel fans. You guys went practically extinct.

I think one of the most underrated duels is the fight between Dooku and the Nightsisters who come to assassinate him in season 3 episode 12 of The Clone Wars. The way they animated Dooku is perfect Makashi style. He fights along a forward/backward fixed line of attack and defense and never deviates to the sides, just like real fencing. It's a little detail that was really cool and showed a tremendous attention to detail on behalf of the animators.

@GeordieSwordsman

Жыл бұрын

Just like real sport/smallsword fencing. I do Scottish broadsword and Spanish rapier and they are nothing but moving in circles around your opponent.

@Daynnikes

Жыл бұрын

DOOKU WAS SO RAW IN CLONE WARS WITH THIS CAREFREE ONE HAND FIGHTING STYLE!

@Cheeseshredder

Жыл бұрын

yes! the clone wars seasons are so awesome. There were other great fights in the clone wars seasons too.

@bazzatron9482

Жыл бұрын

Dooku's fighting style really is one of the most standout styles in the star wars canon. I don't know if it's the sheer weight of presence Christopher Lee left on the character or what - but Tyranis might be the most classy, elegant and fearsome duelists in the whole story.

@xenocide1307

Жыл бұрын

The Clone Wars on average did a pretty decent job of showcasing the differences between lightsaber forms. They still didn't quite get just how fast the Jedi are supposed to be though, but fortunately a lot of the novelizations gives great depictions of actual Jedi physical prowess (as well as a bunch of other force powers).

Something I also think the newer duels lack is like interaction with the environment they’re in. I miss people tossing stuff with the force at each other. It made seeing Obi Wan pull a shonen and toss all those boulders at Vader feel amazing

Nice analysis; You've got a new sub

The entrance of darth maul was the most epic thing I've seen in movies. Them shooing away the non force user who might as well be non combatants then slowly and clamly derobing while facing off totally unbothered with each other. music blaring. it was just so perfect and cemented a very important monastic theme to jedis and sith that these guys are warriors larger than life larger than whatever else was going on.

@hansirgendwer6030

8 ай бұрын

Today every loser can fight force users. Every side character gets a lightsaber and is immediatly capable of fighting Jedi and Sith. In this scene in the Phantom Menace, we got a clue what a Power a single Sith can be. But Disney just didnt give a shit and throws Lightsabers around like candy... the magic is totally lost... today they are as uncivilised as blasters I guess...

@Turboginge

8 ай бұрын

Apart from the entrance of Darth Vader in Empire.

@Justmonika6969

8 ай бұрын

​@@hansirgendwer6030 Yeah I think the moment that broke our disbelief was the moment Finn and Rey (two untrained in lightsabers) picked up and started using lightsabers in TFA without being harmed by their lack of training. Rey Sue even beat Kylo in her first duel which was also the moment that cemented Kylo as a non threat for the rest of the series.

@digbyskellington

7 ай бұрын

That duel almost single-handedly redeemed the whole goddamned movie. Gorgeous, balletic choreography that was beautifully staged and shot.

@matthewspenceduke

7 ай бұрын

​@@hansirgendwer6030that and every single character getting stabbed in the stomach and just walking it off, back in action the next day. Makes the power of the lightsaber and the gravity of the fight less important. In Phantom, Qui-Gon makes one wrong move and it cost him his life, now they just fight anyone, get stabbed, and then live after.

The Mustafar duel was one of the best in the whole series honestly. I could really feel the emotion between both Anakin and Obi Wan. Man it was good

@opengate13a

11 ай бұрын

It's amazing how much *time and effort* was put into the choreography of that fight. It was pretty much the centerpiece of the entire film. We knew it was coming, but seeing a lightsaber collide with another that wasn't red was jarring. A true masterpiece.

@ngotemna8875

11 ай бұрын

The only thing i disliked about it was that both light sabers were blue. Made it a bit hard to see which belonged to whom at certain points

@RealTalkAlexV

11 ай бұрын

Soooo good the best duel ever IMO

@7ydy805

11 ай бұрын

@@ngotemna8875 Maybe when it first came out, but on the 2011 complete saga blue-ray that I watch it on, it's fantastic.

@matthewdunlap2658

11 ай бұрын

Ya the final battle between Obi wan and Anakin on Mustafa will always be my favorite

That final line from your script could've summed up all of the fights tbh. "Poetry in motion".

Personally, my favorite will always be the Anakin vs Obi-Wan duel in ROTS. The choreography, dialogue, music, and emotion hit on all levels to perfection. But I think objectively the Maul vs Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon duel was just a tad bit better in those regards

The Prequel lightsaber fights generally had a better selection of actors and choreographers as you mentioned earlier. Christopher Lee as Count Dooku is also another example, given his professional career in fencing and also swordfights in many other films.

@jamesdick2580

Жыл бұрын

not to mention the uniqueness of Dooku's lightsaber construction

@johnmarc1986

Жыл бұрын

Not to mention that Christopher Lee barely even did those fights. The majority of them were a stunt double.

@jamesdick2580

Жыл бұрын

@@johnmarc1986 doubtful since Christopher Lee was a master of sword dueling. however it's also possible a stunt double was used since im sure his health wasnt all that great at the time.

@ozzyp97

Жыл бұрын

@@jamesdick2580 There's a clip of him talking about it, he was very open about not being able to do most of the fight scenes because his legs were no longer what they used to be. He spoke very highly of his stunt double too.

@nephandi2316

Жыл бұрын

​@@ozzyp97 Christopher Lee definitely had too much class for this world

@3:05 Fun fact. In Star Wars canon there is a force power called 'Force Speed' which essentially allowed them to move at superhuman speeds. It was only ever shown once, in the Phantom Menace. Weirdly enough they never show it again.

@Uhhuh1015

9 ай бұрын

Another time was in the OT ep V when Luke was about to be carbon frozen. That jump was speeed. I wish they would’ve shown palp use it when windu went to arrest him instead of making it look like real time. Made those Jedi look weak and incompetent

@GamerzNTrainerz

9 ай бұрын

Another time was in AOTC when anakin saved obi wan againts count dooku

@bryce2fadeway

9 ай бұрын

So why this power isn't used more? 😅

@phisgig

9 ай бұрын

​@bryce2fadeway perhaps it causes too much strain on the body so it is more of a last effort deal?

@bryce2fadeway

9 ай бұрын

@@phisgig idk man. I just realized at this point that the use of the force depends mainly on the plot and the writer leading the story more than making actual sense ...

Perfect! That's it, and it's sad :( (because we could see amazing fights with a better quality)

This video is flawless. Thank you for existing. Disney must hire you

The poetry in the Obi-Wan vs Anakin fight is unreal, in many instances you can see how Obi-wan is aware of his surroundings and using them to his advantage (not just the high ground at the end, but swinging of the falling-pole thing first, etc), Anakin is driven on killing his old master- always the aggressor, swinging at Obi-Wan's feet as he climbs the pole, even taking a final swing at Obi-Wan as he backflips onto the high ground. The sequels just don't have that level of story, amazing video

@evanderpierznik

Жыл бұрын

Ok I have this theory (and bear with me) about the high ground. Obviously the basic thought process is that after the duel with Maul, Obi Wan went over that scenario from every point of view (including Maul's) to figure out what happened. However, my thought is that maybe he wanted Anakin to leap so that he could have the LOW ground. He had the low ground when he beat Maul and Grevious. So maybe that's the position he knew he could beat Anakin. I know it's a stretch, but it's still a fun theory.

@gooseyisbad

Жыл бұрын

I've never thought about that before, but realistically that's the type of thin Obi-Wan would do, your right that's a really cool theory

@sineadgaming69

Жыл бұрын

It doesnt matter when the fight is just an overly choreographed dance that goes on for 20+ minutes. It doesn't feel like an actual fight.

@evanderpierznik

Жыл бұрын

@@sineadgaming69 It's two of the greatest duelists of the time clashing blades, of course it's gonna be super souped up. Also, if it just looked like a regular sword fight, no one would watch it

@evanderpierznik

Жыл бұрын

@@gooseyisbad Thanks!

That "you were the chosen one" line from Revenge of the Sith hits me everytime. It's one of the most emotional moments in the entire saga.

@mac5917

Жыл бұрын

When Obi-Wan says ”I Will do What I must” it’s already the greatest fight before it even started because of the emotional weight

@cameronturk4388

Жыл бұрын

@@mac5917 I agree. And then when he says It again in the Obi-Wan series It just seems forced and just frankly Cringe! But in Revenge of the Sith It was a Masterful line and I’ll never forget my ‘Holy Shit’ feeling sitting in the Theatre in May 2005 when I was 14.

@Daynnikes

Жыл бұрын

It’s the best movie to me

Great video. Made me laugh & very good point. Favorite fight has to be Obi-Wan vs Anakin in ROTS

as a foil fencer i can 100% agree that getting tired during long bouts is definitely something that plagues me i once had a striaght 30 minute first to 5 points match. my helmet was soggy.