If there is no Mordeth in season 1 then it is a RADICAL change from the books. He is a major character and it sets up his arc in book 2.....

@TheDustyWheel

3 жыл бұрын

I'd be disappointed if we didn't get the Fain/Mordeth combination arc. For Fain to be anything but a common darkfriend, he needs Mordeth. Someone suggested Mordeth being awoken by the taking of the dagger, and coming into a scene later.

@block4562

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheDustyWheel I was just thinking you could skip Mordeth in a sense, have Fain be there too, he could encounter Mat, maybe Fain had already the dagger himself, not knowing about the danger. Somehow Mat obtains it, maybe he steals it from Fain. Now Mat and Fain are both cursed, and maybe the "Mordeth" persona emerges in Fain as he grows more twisted.

@MrCuriousgeorge1000

3 жыл бұрын

@@block4562 I think you could get by with Fain not touching the dagger until he steals it in Shinar. He can easily just be Fain until then and the whole Mordeth corruption get explained over time.

So, what do you think? Are we getting Mordeth before this scene? Maybe he'll appear to Mat as some kind of connection to the Dagger afterwards? Think it's going to turn out just like the book with everyone there, and Mat manages to slip off his horse unseen and go rummaging through a house and finds the dagger before anyone notices?

@rainbowsprinklez

3 жыл бұрын

I watched both videos, and honestly think you have the right of this. Also, my WoT dyslexia kicked in and I'm like, "No Moridin in season 1? No ****" :)

@BobWill731

3 жыл бұрын

I don't know if this points to Mordeth not being in the season at all, but it certainly seems like he is not involved when Mat takes the dagger. I think having him as part of the dagger and manifesting later (Mat gets his own LTT) is most likely. Another option may be that Mordeth is woken when Mat takes the dagger, but cannot act before he leaves. Then he pounces on Fain when he passes through SL. As a viewer, it would probably be a little scarier if it is just Mat and Rand in SL. They would have no warning that they are in a dangerous place and no Moiraine/Lan to bail them out when Mashadar shows up.

@TheDustyWheel

3 жыл бұрын

@@BobWill731 Great idea! He is woken by Mat taking the dagger, and then he gets to Fain. Brilliant. I like how I post this video, and an hour later, I've already liked two theories in the comments as much as my original idea.

I hope they’re all together still in Shadar Logath. WAY more scary to ALL be separated by the mist. By the time the dagger is found, boys are already cut off by the mist, Mat was looking to hide at the time he found the dagger. Maybe boys were checking on horses. No ship.

@TheDustyWheel

3 жыл бұрын

There are so many possibilities, and my ideas are just scratching the surface of what likely is actually happening. I like the idea that we might get a Mordeth/Fain scene, perhaps. And, since I really like the Mordeth sub-plot, perhaps it will come to play elsewhere, or in a different way from the books, but still be there.

@LuckPuddle

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheDustyWheel I certainly hope we get a Mordeth/Fain scene too, anywhere is fine. :) I'll miss the ship if they cut it, but I'm just thinking the money spend wouldn't be a good bang for your buck...

I hope he’s in the show. Guess we have to wait and see

Awesome! Everyone who worked on this unblurring are great! Great work!

You can lose Mordeth but you NEED the unique evil of Shadar Logoth to remain.

I think Mat found the dagger before they met Mordeth. There was a part where he went in somewhere for a minute, came stumbling out with cobwebs all over. It's possible he found the dagger then saw a vision which is why he came out so quickly, then seemed dazed. It wasn't long after that he mentioned treasure. Perrin even looked at him sideways and said there was no treasure, only dust. I do think we will meet mordeth.

Any shadar logoth scenes in s1 without moiraine present will NOT work at all. She is needed to properly explain its history and significance. Book fans will love seeing shadar logoth regardless but I worry that new fans will find it underwhelming - especially without exposition. If Rand and Mat are in Shadar Logoth alone, all that new fans will see is a bunch of old ruins.

Mordeith attack > Boys split up, get lost > Mat ends up in dagger room > hear scream > finds he's back near Moiraine and company. Main group in Shadar Logoth > Mat sneaks off to explore nearby building after tying up the horses > finds dagger > Mashadar attacks Plenty of reasonable ways to explain it given the small amount of information. I don't see any evidence at all that Rand and Mat are in Shadar Logoth alone here.

@TheDustyWheel

3 жыл бұрын

The “sneaks off close enough to hear the horse” is the easiest answer, in the sense that he runs back into a scene of chaos as everyone is confronting what appears to be Mashadar, and no one is the wiser about the dagger.

@Jackroyal897

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheDustyWheel Now that I've watched both videos and let it roll around in my brain for the last half of my work day, I'm a lot less confident that they're all in Shadar Logoth together. The one thing I'm really stuck on though is how/where do they get split up then?

I don't agree either - but we'll see!

The boys may not run into Mordeth and he may just be an unseen "bump in the night" that scares the boys out of Shadar Logoth once Matt has the dagger in tow. Perhaps Mordeth is fully revealed later when he meets Fain and they merge though.

Somehow roll Fain and Mordeth into one character? Fain is in Shadar Logoth too, and somehow Mat takes the dagger from him, and Fain himself is also tainted, promoting his eventual "other evil force" role

Interesting theory. Hearing what the other parts of the script said about the horse and Mashadar got me super excited. Not that I enjoy watching horses get killed. That's awful! Stop thinking that. smh. Anyway, it sounds badass and creepy and I can't wait to watch! As far as when we meet Thom, I think it will be after Shadar Logoth. I think they all still go into the city together (the EF5 and Moiraine and Lan) and Rand and Mat meet Thom after they are separated from the group. I believe Rand is looking for Perrin when he is talking to Dana. I am curious as to how Thom ends up in the story.

I might be with you on the Mordeth part. Only way it would seem to work is if Mat meets him prior to finding the dagger. However, I don't see how the horses part means anything as to where the others are. In the books, they get into Shadar Logoth together, go to a building together and then Rand, Mat and Perrin go off to explore while Moiraine is asleep. The only difference I see for sure is that the three boys take their horses with them when they go to explore whereas in the book they went on foot. The others would still be back at the building with their horses and the rest of the Shadar Logoth scene could then play out as it did in the book. I do think it might be likely that the boys don't meet Mordeth though, and that if we see Mordeth at all it might be the scene that is referenced but not shown in the book, where Fain meets Mordeth. Or they could cut Mordeth altogether. Or simply have him referenced as having merged with Fain off camera the way the book does.

@TheDustyWheel

3 жыл бұрын

The boys taking their horses with them is an option that wouldn’t require any significant changes to who is there. As far as Mordeth, I do think they can get away without needing him in particular with the boys, but giving us a Fain/Mordeth scene would be great. In fact, they could take it an Asmodean on his way to the pantry kind of thing.

@talmanes4589

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheDustyWheel Yea I agree, I don't think they have to have Mordeth meet the boys. A Fain/Mordeth scene and smash to black would be cool and totally in line with the books as well. We know that scene occurs, we just don't see it first hand.

Can you cut highlights from your stream and make them into a short video, kind of like this? It would be great for people who want to watch you quickly (such as during a lunch break) but don't have an hour to finish the stream. Lots of content creators do this.. they have a stream that can still be watched afterwards, and then they make short videos out of cuts from the stream. Just an idea!

@TheDustyWheel

3 жыл бұрын

Yes! This is very much going to happen.

I have been thinking Issy and mordeth combined into one character might happen

I think the problem with speculations from sources like this is the same with the Moiraine reveal and her dialogue that was recorded just for that. Which version of a script are we looking at? Has it been confirmed the script pages came from the final version?

@TheDustyWheel

3 жыл бұрын

Good connection to the recording. Yeah, Information could have been purposefully changed. Or, like you said, not final script, so I hope fans just have fun with this.

@jdiggitty

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheDustyWheel Oh, I agree. Speculation and theory crafting are super fun and you do a great job. I just have suspicions we can't take what's offered at face value, but that's perfectly fine.

@TheDustyWheel

3 жыл бұрын

@@jdiggitty It will be a lot fun to find out how close or far we were off, especially with these unblurrings. Getting the behind the scenes stories some day will be great.

@jdiggitty

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheDustyWheel I feel the same way. It is very exciting. It will be wonderful listening to you talk to Sarah about it down the road. Or even the cast and Rafe!

Strangely, I'm more perplexed that Mashadar is described as 'black, almost oily' as apposed to the 'white/silvery' description in the book. Another altered detail for no (presently) explicable reason. As far as Mordeth is concerned. I would think he could/would be appropriate to keep him in the screen adaptation. Then again, if Mashadar can be changed, Mordeth can be eighty-sixed.

@TheDustyWheel

3 жыл бұрын

That’s what the text looks like in the script. I’ll try to show some screenshots tonight that led us to believe that’s what we see. That’s a good topic of discussion.

@scotchula3676

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheDustyWheel This also makes me wonder.... If Mashadar ends up 'black', does that mean Machin Shin will end up 'white'? If that's the case, then Machin Shin would no longer BE the Machin Shin. LOL

@TheDustyWheel

3 жыл бұрын

​@@scotchula3676 Lol. And now that you've pointed out the Black Shadow / Black Wind, I'm a little more perplexed. Another one of those, if it turns out to be true, questions to ask about why they made that choice. We should start a list. :) Looney theory moment...Mordeth is the Shadow that grabs the horse? That's just too looney.

@scotchula3676

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheDustyWheel That was my train of thought. And I'm all about the list. Inquiring minds want to know. lol

@talmanes4589

3 жыл бұрын

The boys not meeting Mordeth doesn't necessarily mean we won't see Mordeth or that he will be cut altogether. They could instead show us the scene that is only referenced in the book where Fain meets Mordeth or they could reference that scene as the book does and never actually show us Mordeth. Or they cut go ahead and cut him. I'm not sure it matters a whole lot.

I think it is really possible that the group splits before shadar logoth. They meet Thom on the way before the three end up in SL. Mat, Rand, Thom...

It would be too bad if they got rid of Bayle Domon. Not because he’s very important, though to Egeannin he is, but because he is a convenient tertiary character who provides transportation to the party in several books. Thus, the show really only needs one ship and one sea captain for just about any escapades on the water (minus the sea folk scenes). Cuts down on character bloat to have a character like that who’s always conveniently there when you need him as a plot device. He also has a seal but that could be easily changed in the show with little impact except that his motivation to keep moving would be eliminated.

@windsabeginning2219

3 жыл бұрын

Like a more useful cabbage man from ATLA lol

@dehue

3 жыл бұрын

They could introduce him in season 2 instead.

Did you just cut Steve????? NOOOOOoooooooooo.

What if the dagger is in the building they go to stay in and Mat finds it while looking around before they managed to get horses in building

@TheDustyWheel

3 жыл бұрын

Damn it, Mike. :) Ok, I like this theory, and now I'm annoyed I didn't mix the building with the House. I'm going to bring this up tonight.

In the interest of actually addressing the topic you bring up (Sorry about that). Not sure what scenero is more likely re: Mordeth vs No Mordeth. But I can see a case for not including him. IIRC, the Mordeth in SL is the only time we see a physical manifestation of him. After that he inhabits Padon Fain. Later on he is then subsumed by the evil in PF. Then he is neither Mordeth nor Padan Fain. If Mordeth is not in that scene, it could be an attempt not to confuse the viewer (since that character/actor would never be seen again). And it would avoid another round of necessary exposition in an episode/season that will already be exposition heavy. If he is not in this season I suspect he will not be in any. It would be too far after the fact to bring him up later, and the whole not-Mordeth-not-Padan-Fain may just be too convoluted to communicate for the general audience via small screen. That said, it would be kind of sad to see that thread nixed, as evil vs evil was a pretty unique theme in Jordons world.

Why on earth would they change the order of events with Thom? He's the one who told them not to mention the dreams to Moraine in Baerlon, that's a big deal. Are we actually going to hate this show?

**Major Spoilers for the books** Without Mordeth how does Machin Shin begin to seek Rand? Without Mordeth, how does Rand get the inspiration for cleansing the Taint? Idk, I feel like Mordeth has to be in Season 1. This would cause a major butterfly effect that would derail the whole show IMO.

Ugh. Another major flaming change. I hope they make it clear in the credits that this show is “loosely based” on Robert Jordan’s story. Light!