I like the sound of the 270 offset one myself, I'm kind of curious why it produced more power though. Either the uneven firing throws off the dyno while it's trying to measure average torque or there's something else that I don't understand haha. Either way, nice video!

@lucid523

Жыл бұрын

The man the myth the legend

@ForgottenMustard

Жыл бұрын

Thanks man! Maybe it has something to do with the ignition timing, or the cam timing. It is possible that I got it right on the 270 and they're a bit off on the other 2. I'm still on a steep learning curve with this sim haha.

@TRJx86

Жыл бұрын

Runs like a V twin , Yamaha MT-07 has this configuration They do crossplane crankshaft to even out the power pulses heading to the rear wheel making it easier on the tire and better feedback afaik on the R1 yet similar comp ratios and volume conventional engines all make around the same power irl , so I think it's just a bit of a glitch

@Kalimerakis

Жыл бұрын

@@TRJx86 actually the point of the crossplane is to make the power pulses *more* uneven, which makes it easier to control the closer the power peaks, the more they add up, inducing slip earlier the more time inbetween the pulses the more time for the tire to "catch" again in conclusion you get a wider limit range: you notice slip earlier and have more time/room to control it

@TRJx86

Жыл бұрын

@@Kalimerakis my bad

The 360 degree one sounds like an inline 4 running at half the rpm

@mrfilmer9270

Жыл бұрын

if you make it 2x speed it sounds like a 4 cyl

@duckdestroyer2412

Жыл бұрын

I honestly thought that it would have sounded closer to a inline twin 180 degree two stroke.

@junatah5903

Жыл бұрын

Makes sense, the firing in a typical 4 cylinder is 2 pistons at the same time If i recall.

@erlend1554

Жыл бұрын

@@junatah5903 99% of i4 engines are 1342 firing order. But the inner pair and outer pair go up and down together

@junatah5903

Жыл бұрын

@@erlend1554 gotcha

V4 with different bank angles and crank offsets would be another great one to do. Honda VFR and NC30, Aprilia RSV, Ducati, Yamaha Vmax, Suzuki GSV-R etc

is it just me or does the 360 seem like a really roundabout way to do what a 2 stroke single does but worse?

@ytaltacc8008

Жыл бұрын

It is somewhat similar. A boxer 2 will also have the same pause between strokes as a 2-stroke.

@ImmortanDan

Жыл бұрын

I mean, if ditching total-loss lubrication makes it worse to you, then by all means

@datrollface2863

Жыл бұрын

@@ImmortanDan oil pumps be like: 😐

@Forbiddina

Жыл бұрын

It’s a reduction in power density, but an improvement in overall efficiency and as another commenter said, you get a better lubrication system.

@white_mage

Жыл бұрын

@@Forbiddina 2 strokes can have a lubrication system and valves too

You can faintly hear a 5 cylinder engine sound on the 270° one

@huey-fan8335

Жыл бұрын

It definitely sounds like a 90 degree V2

@Chillin4030

Жыл бұрын

i hear it too

@jacquescrusan9500

Жыл бұрын

Here's the interesting things: Watch a V10 dyno run and try to listen for the crossplane v8 harmonics. They're there. They're just subdued.

@huey-fan8335

Жыл бұрын

@@jacquescrusan9500 when hearing a V10 you basically hear 2 five cylinders! The Crossplane V8 has a completely different harmony

@jacquescrusan9500

Жыл бұрын

@@huey-fan8335 i invite you to listen to them back to back if you ever have the time.

The 360 degree one sounds almost like a 4 banger. The 270 degree one almost reminds me of a 5 cylinder.

@motormouth2472

Жыл бұрын

I always thought 270's sounded a lot like a V-Twin. Even like a V8 sometimes Now I can kind of hear the inline 5 sound lol

@sjefleenaerts7277

8 ай бұрын

​@@motormouth2472they technically have the same firing timing than a 90° v-twin

@motormouth2472

8 ай бұрын

@@sjefleenaerts7277 yeah I figured that's what made the two sound similar

Cool video, I love the direct comparisons when changing just one essential characteristic but leaving everything else the same.

Great job on the engines!

Cool simulator. Neat to see the 270 degree sim since I just bought a Yamaha XSR700 with a 270 degree parallel twin.

Love my 360° twin XS650. It's a 750cc now, but still a 360°. It'll slide across the garage while on the centerstand if you throttle it 😁 Sounds thumpy like a Harley from idle to 2500 or so, then it's a Japanese screamer up to 8,000. It confuses a lot of people, and never fails to make me smile.

I would love to see more of these videos

As someone who is a motorcycle mech im fairly surprised with the memories this brings back. The first one clearly sounded like the old two valve roller crank cb250s. The second sounded like a trx850 yam at a few rpm points and the last reminded me of a triumph tiger 500 one of my bosses owned. Triumph would have shot rge pistons into a low earth orbit if you revved it that hard though!.

Beautiful sounding engine

See with the 360° offset it would solve a rocking couple, but I think it might cause a secondary imbalance problem that would have to be engineered out

Amazing !!!!!

For me it's the 270° engine

270 degrees produced the best sound, tq, and hp.

@meedinho1261

Жыл бұрын

yeah, sure but look at the rpm range 360 degree achieves max torque (60lb-ft) at around 3600 rpm while 270 has more than 65 only over 5000

@627horsepowers

Жыл бұрын

@@meedinho1261 correct. but i still like 270 the best.

@meedinho1261

Жыл бұрын

@@627horsepowers nice m8~

@MikeSmith-vb8ul

7 ай бұрын

Not sure, the HP calculator seems a little silly actually -- what "formula" even simulation even use for that? If it's a matter of intake/exhaust manifold pressures then the 360° firing order would probably stress those components the least. If it's a matter of pumping losses the obviously 180° has the least ; ) not to mention the best primary balance out of all of them too!

270 Inline Twin is basically the same as a 90-degree (cylinders) V-Twin -- same lope to idle and lo-rpm, and same benefits to output: no piston is coming to a stop at the same time as the other, so each can help the other maintain momentum thru the crankshaft -- freeing up power to get to the ground. Another benefit is the long interval between power pulses also helps you feel the limit of traction at the rear -- making them more forgiving to ride. My carbureted SV650S commuter in Seattle... if that wasn't the most forgiving track-prepped bike in the slop I ever owned. Could ride fine in conditions no liter Four (at least before IMUs and crossplane cranks) would dare show its face -- and the ferry was full of them, on their sides on Bainbridge Island (btw, if you commute in Seattle... Metzeler front and rear, or stainless pins in shins) ;)

Very much like the fiat twin air engine, it is 360 degrees but the firing is 180 degrees - pistons come up together but only one fires

Ah the 180 is very familiar. I ride a CB500x and sure enough it basically sounds like that.

Interesting to hear! I am actually developing my own 180* inline twin from scratch - Weird to hear somewhat how it will sound before it's even been cast.

@bakedandsteaked

Жыл бұрын

You do realize that inline twins actually already exist right? Is this literally your first time hearing one?

@AiOinc1

Жыл бұрын

@@bakedandsteaked No, it is not. This is an awfully rude comment. How many ~1000cc 180* firing inline twins were ever put into cars? Motorcycles with their ridiculous redlines and open exhausts do not count.

@bakedandsteaked

Жыл бұрын

@@AiOinc1 How was that rude? Toughen up. Also, the displacement of the engine, what the engine is placed in, and the type of exhaust used is completely irrelevant to anything I said.

@AiOinc1

Жыл бұрын

@@bakedandsteaked Woah, Mr expert in fluid Dynamics here says the volume and path a fluid travels in pulses does not affect it's pressure! Care to show us your doctorate while you're at it? I would love to read the paper *you* wrote on the subject.

@bakedandsteaked

Жыл бұрын

@@AiOinc1 damn dude you are actually tilted lmao

I've been wondering. What makes the sound in this simulator? The physics is math and that I understand, but what makes the sound? Combustion and movement doesn't have an inherit sound. Is it purely the change of pressure to air outside of the system?

@francisjpk

Жыл бұрын

In a real engine, main sound comes from the openning of the exhaust valve. After combusting the air/fuel mixture, that gas mixture expands so much that when the exhaust valve opens, all the pressure accumulated in the cylinder is suddenly released. Other main cause of sound in an engine is air intake sound, its like the air generates friction against the intake ducts walls, causing sound

@jwalster9412

Жыл бұрын

@@francisjpk does this application simulate exuast resonance and un equal and equal headers?

@AngeTheGreat

Жыл бұрын

The change in pressure in the exhaust manifold (or primary tube) that happens when the exhaust valve is opened is sampled and then run through a basic filter (to simulate things like reverb in the exhaust system, resonance, etc.). That's pretty much it really

@m1sst4k37

Жыл бұрын

@@jwalster9412 unequal headers features exists, but turned off in public build

@m1sst4k37

Жыл бұрын

combustion and piston movement have sound in sim

I would love a 15° vr2 twin arround 650 to 750cm³ for a supermoto build if you have some time to spend !

the 270 actually sounded more like a v-twin than an inline 2

@danishazman6222

Жыл бұрын

A 270° inline twin (AKA parallel twin) closely represents the sound of a 90° V-twin. Some motorcycles use this instead of a V-Twin to reduce complexity & weight. The Yamaha MT-07 & Honda NC700/750 series uses this config.

@InvidiousIgnoramus

Жыл бұрын

That's actually the goal. It's supposed to have a similar result to a 90 degree twin while being more compact and simple.

@exothermal.sprocket

11 ай бұрын

The firing pulse timing exiting the tail pipe is the same exact pattern. 270-450-270-450. You can achieve this firing interval by separating crank pins 90° from each other, or you can achieve this firing interval by separating the cylinders at 90° from each other while sharing the same crank pin.

Can you try and remake a Harley engine either 883 or 1200cc firing at 315 and 405° single crank pin idk if it's possible but would be cool to see how it sounds

Interesting how it changes the power

Can you do a Rotax 800? like the snowscoter engine?

Could you do a tutorial video on how to add other engines or tune engines in this sim?

@xaviert.123

Жыл бұрын

for real, I want this as well but the issue is, this guy does a ton of fun stuff for his videos but never shows people how to.

@ForgottenMustard

Жыл бұрын

kzread.info/dash/bejne/lYymrsxtYt3Klaw.html

All things equal the 270 is ofc the best but 180s can be made to sound real nice too with some exhaust magic. Although these twins are a little under powered, I'd expect way more than 58bhp out of a 930cc twin, closed to 100-110 bhp instead

@alexandruianu8432

Жыл бұрын

Cams and timings are car-like, not bike-like, so it doesn't make torque at high RPM.

@anykeyh

Жыл бұрын

​@@alexandruianu8432 Cylinder dimensions probably, they are long course while on bike they are shorter. In this simulation, torque peaks at 5000rpm, and engine has basically no more power after 8000rpm, while on modern bike it's usually more about 7000rpm pushing strong until ignition breaker around 10'500rpm.

The 360 reminds me of a brush cutter

can you make a tutorial on how to swap motors?

The 360 degree one sounds exactly like the Benelli 502C.

where i can download the engine file?

I like the sound of the 270

Is it possible for you to do a inline 4 with 270 crankpin, essentially halving the crossplane with the pistons still firing separately from each other? I do think i will still retain the benefits of inline 4 crossplane but with characters similar to inline 2.

@exothermal.sprocket

11 ай бұрын

Yamaha R1 engine is essentially two 499cc 270° parallel twins joined side-by-side, with the two inner crankpins set 180° from each other.

The 270° sounds like a big and beeffy motorcycle

You h a v e to do more of this!

there's something wrong with these engines, look at their power curve 🗿

@LITTLEBRAT775081

Жыл бұрын

there are no power curves on screen

@ForgottenMustard

Жыл бұрын

That's the exhaust flow graph.

@braziliansheetbox2497

Жыл бұрын

@@LITTLEBRAT775081 0:55 below "total exhaust flow" and next to "power" there is a blank square which is where the power curve will appear

@LITTLEBRAT775081

Жыл бұрын

again there is nothing that is in that middle section actually labeled as power and torque curves . either way these engines are feasible and it is a simulation

@braziliansheetbox2497

Жыл бұрын

@@LITTLEBRAT775081 just exhaust flow is labeled in that middle section btw 🙃

In the 270 deg the pistons hit the valves also damn it made more horse power that the other two maybe because it could breath better between the circles a little bit confusing but nice experiment

315 (Husqvarna Nuda) and 285 (KTM) would be interesting too.

is “creating” your own engine really only possible for people with coding experience? i put “creating” in quotes because i doubt it’s like automation is, and i heard it’s a simulation so how would i ensure an engine i create would work? i don’t believe i’ve found a tutorial? could you maybe do one?

@ForgottenMustard

Жыл бұрын

kzread.info/dash/bejne/lYymrsxtYt3Klaw.html

@Puffie40

Жыл бұрын

There is a little bit of coding etiquette, but you do need to know the specific technical details of the engine. Playing around with the variable can be fun too, as it glitches out and does unexpected things. I had one attempt where the engine speed kept going to infinity, then the crank and piston just disappeared.

Fiat 126p engine sound next, please. As we are in inline 2 topic

270 crossplane cp2 the Yamaha mt 07 😍

What would two of these sound like together?

180 sounds more Industrial/ work related. Like wood splitters, generators, etc. 270 sounds more like a Harley and 360 sounds more like race bikes or boats and planes

@Puffie40

Жыл бұрын

The pony motors for Caterpillar diesels are 180-degree cranks, and the motors for the D7s and D8s are in-line twins (as opposed to the D6s, D4s, and D2s which were horizontally opposed) The old Two-cyilinder John Deeres were in-line twins with 180 degree cranks, but I don't know if their 'unique' sound was from the slow speed, their timing, or their rather ridiculous bore and stroke.

@75HorseCase

Жыл бұрын

The John Deere 2 cylinders they ran fairly slow. I have a 720 diesel the rated rpm is around 1125 and the displacement is 6.2L. That engine dose not give up easily, it will start to lose oil pressure before stalling out. In general the Deere 2 cylinders had more torque/lugging power than a 4 cylinder tractor with similar horsepower. The sound is mostly form the slow rpm and cylinders firing next to each other.

the 360 sounds like a 4 stroke engine

Needs 90 degrees and 415 degrees (or whatever a Husqvarna nuda is) too

270 sounds just like my bike

lol the 360 degree one is literally a honda gx360 inline twin.

where can I download this file

looking at yours 180 startup, i can say something is wrong i had same issue when was making really big engines

@identiticrisis

Жыл бұрын

Looks like a flywheel size issue. Reducing the mass of the pistons and increasing the mass of the flywheel would help. Perhaps this is the source of the power difference, since the 270 requires a smaller flywheel anyway (confirmed by people who have converted 360 twins to near 270).

what about husqvarna nuda 900r's 315 degree?

Triumph motorcycle has 360° 2-cyl of model. But all engine was good.

download plz?

can you do a 188 degree that the ninja 500 uses?

Whatever the Yamaha banshee is, that's the best twin cylinder

@JoshRex7ven

Жыл бұрын

360° 2 stroke twin

270 sounds like inline 5 or VTwin or an 8 180 subaru boxer 4 360 inline 4

I'm trying to make a SOHC V12, but I I'm not getting something right with undefined node types and unresolved references. I CANNOT figure it out

Compression ratio: yes

I'm curious why the 360° only takes 2 strokes per ignition? While the others take 4 strokes

@dalirose9065

6 ай бұрын

360° means both pistons rise and fall in unison but fire at even 360° intervals. the 2 pistons look like 1 piston in the sim.

270 sounds like an inline 5

270 africa twin power 👌🏼👌🏼

360 degree sounds like maluch or fiat 126p (they are the same thing)

for me the 270

270 sounds like V-twin

180 sounds just like an rzr

360 sounds like a lawnmower

@frigglebiscuit7484

Жыл бұрын

it literally is. the opposed twins in lawnmowers are 360 degree i believe. i know the honda gx360 inline twin is.

180: yamaha sx650? 270: triumph bonneville thruxton R 360: triumph t140

KTM 890 hands down!

Maybe somebody knows how to adjust a peak of torque? Want to make low rpm diesel - esque engine.

All about timing

0:58 180 2:35 270 4:03 360

New Harley Davidson 1250cc 105mm x 72mm, 60° block, 30° journals, 9500 rpm.

Running kinda lean?

Lol the HP calculation looks pretty silly -- what "formula" does your simulation even use for that? If it's a matter of intake/exhaust manifold pressures then 360° firing order would probably stress those components the least. If it's a matter of pumping losses the 180° has the least ; )

Personally, I prefer the 180° inline-twin.

270 or 360 is the best Probably the 270 actually cause it has a tinge of 5 pot.

interesting that the version with the most even firing order made the worst power

no tony!

Are you Filmann86?

@ForgottenMustard

Жыл бұрын

I'm forgotten mustard xD

360 is even fire. Honda cb 450

You need a discord

Where's the 90⁰ offset?!

90°?

180 Kawasaki en6 270 Honda Forza 360 Yamaha Tmax

please remove the tutorial on how to swap motors

apakah bisa dijalankan dismartphone?

@ValyberPsychosis

2 ай бұрын

The answer is no. It can only run on PC

Rd 350 ypvs

Bocchi the engine

270 degree is the best

First comment 😉 love ❤️ from Egypt 🇪🇬

That 1 dislike hurts

180º - fucked up subaru 270º - even more fucked up V8/harley 360º - slightly less fucked up rotary

My boomer dad can say anything about me playing this because.. welp, boomers like engines.

180 sounds like a Yamaha mt-07

@josespite1741

Жыл бұрын

Nope , the Mt07 have a 270 degree piston

@fir3zzz580

Жыл бұрын

@@josespite1741 i said it sounds like, not that it is a 180 crank

@josespite1741

Жыл бұрын

@@fir3zzz580 it's more like yzf r3 to me

is there any discord?

Low rpm 270 big rpm 360 degrees and how the hell 270 degrees could hit 73 hp vs 180 and 360 only 59 hp 🤷🏻‍♂️

@irocket

Жыл бұрын

Because while runing there isn't any moment when both pistons at the same time. In 180 degrees one stops at BDC and other on TDC. In 360 degrees both pistons stops on TDC and BDC. In 270 degrees when one piston is on TDC/BDC second is moving, "giving extra torque"

@mociczyczki

Жыл бұрын

@@irocket never dig in this this is legit or some 💩? What you can actually seen is rpm diffrenc im must watch this closely 👌🏻 overall the size of air fuel ingiven time is the same for each version 🤷🏻‍♂️why they dont use it in bikes ? Each have 180 degrees 🤔as far as iknow 180 degree should havebest topend due to smalest pressure in crankshaft chamber , 270 is know for better lowend and worse topend but im never dig deep in this theme so i dont have enough knowledge 👌🏻 this what you write is 💩🫣 engine makes avg torque and avg power they dont measured peak value in specified rotation you silly boy 🤣 so no this that one piston always mowe while other is in tdc or bdc dont make more torque 😎 he someithing manulated in simulation n compresion exhpust intake or whatever 👌🏻 the only factor in real impact on output avg power which you seen on dyno can be 1 additional lesss balanced crank masss this is advantage this type of crank angle so 270 degree but 2 is it generate more crank chamber pressure which engine must defeat comapre to 180 degress configuration what is disadvantage and eat some hp 🤷🏻‍♂️ cant see be now other reason this that one piston still move while other is on tdc or bdc mean nothing and is no factor 🤷🏻‍♂️ in terms of top end power 👌🏻 cos engine makes work in specified time ,dyno measured avg power from trc to bdc not peak value innspecified moment while explosion have place but avg from specified explosion than from another finally how much avg power was generated in minute from this they give number like 100 hp on 10000 rpm etc 🤷🏻‍♂️

@asbjrnkvisle5831

Жыл бұрын

Yamaha TDM 850: 360 degrees 77 hp. 270 degrees 79 hp. Same engine block. Same rpm

@mociczyczki

Жыл бұрын

@@asbjrnkvisle5831 simulation or real egzample ?

@asbjrnkvisle5831

Жыл бұрын

@@mociczyczki Real. Just meant to say that the outcome of 360 or 270 is similar in hp

360 is engine fiat 126. From poland, ist terible engine with big vibrations

@meedinho1261

Жыл бұрын

A 180° to ursus c330

both rod journals angle? or single?