That heater has more processing power than my first computer did.

@noanyobiseniss7462

28 күн бұрын

Probably more than the initial moon landing!

@tvelektron

28 күн бұрын

This simple programm could be done with a few lines of assembler on almost any realy small controller for sure...But the bold processors are to cheap today and and the programmers are too lazy to deal with assembler code too...

@noanyobiseniss7462

28 күн бұрын

Have no clue why my comment that is has more than the moon l a n d e r did? Utub is insane.

@bromine_35

24 күн бұрын

Nowndays a microcontroller that would outpace all the computing power of the 1950s costs about 5 cents and takes under a watt of power

@catalinbadalan4463

22 күн бұрын

Probably more cooling capacity (heat removal) as well.

This water heater shows many similarities between water flow and current flow, including the pressure drop tubing acting resistively. A great crossover assembly of electronics and "plumbing". Thanks for your insight!

@jonlitchfield8888

28 күн бұрын

Exactly my thoughts 😂 also reminded me of small and large bowels.

@G1ZQCArtwork

27 күн бұрын

Except, current doesn't flow.... If this were used here in the UK, if it leaked any amount of voltage to ground up to 30ma it would trip the protection switch.

Made in Germany, but the top text is in Polish and English, and analyzed in Czechia, true EU content ;p

@andreasu.3546

27 күн бұрын

Who would have thought that stuff like that was actually still being made in Gerrmany.

@Maulana_rhodes

27 күн бұрын

Fake ,probably made in china you see something made in country other than china you automatically start thinking it is safe

@RminusOR

27 күн бұрын

@@andreasu.3546 if there's anything I'd not get for 20 bucks on Aliexpress but made in countries with consumer protection and an (arguably) working judiciary system then it would be the water heater I use in my daily shower

@5Dale65

25 күн бұрын

It's because they are useful. Small single phase instant water heaters serve great in summer houses. You can leave them there even for wintertime, cause there is no big water tank like in a boiler, that can freeze up and explode. And it's never an easy job to fully empty that tank.

@andreasu.3546

25 күн бұрын

@@5Dale65 They are useful, absolute. It's just that such cheap home appliancese tend to be made in nearshoring countries like Hungary or Turkey (if not in China) these days.

I'm guessing the company that makes this also advertises themselves as being environmentally friendly while making stuff that can't be repaired because they refuse to sell the part therefore increasing waste.

@mfbfreak

28 күн бұрын

I suggest returning the waste back to the company's HQ.

@oscargraveland

25 күн бұрын

If this were done as a safety measure, kW water heaters would be the type of device that I would completely accept that for. You don't want your handyman repairing one for you.

EXACTLY the same thing happend to me a few years ago. I had the same or a very similar heater and the seal failed in the same way. I was thinking about just putting it back together with silicone, but ended up throwing the whole thing away. Obviously the design is flawed. Screw those manufactureres who dont sell replacement parts!

@VJETRA

25 күн бұрын

Lol id just superglue that thing and use it ONE LAST TIME.

@WolfmanDude

24 күн бұрын

@@VJETRA I thought the same thing, but plastic is sometimes tricky to glue. You need to know what kind of plastic the thing is made from

@VJETRA

24 күн бұрын

@@WolfmanDude well theres screw hold them together . the glue is just to seal that small bit

@catalinbadalan4463

22 күн бұрын

Design is not flawed. It "works" exactly as intended. For exactly how long was intended.

Still lovin’ the Catculator :D

@mrkitty777

24 күн бұрын

They have a built-in abacus calculator, meow 😂

I love how the Catculator sits there judging you whilst you use it...

Seems reasonably well designed and constructed, those seals not being available is stupid though.

@timhartherz5652

28 күн бұрын

It's probably because of liability, can't have random people mess with a device like this where high voltage/ current & heat is this close to water. They might sell spare parts to licensed companies though, i had my stiebel eltron repaired once after a surge (by an electrician).

@BarryRowlingsonBaz

27 күн бұрын

@@timhartherz5652 All the fixing screws probably have to be tightened in the right order to the right torques too - like an engine block!

@BitterCynical

27 күн бұрын

Could try to silicone it, worst case it just leaks again, depends on how high the pressure in the pipes is.

@timhartherz5652

27 күн бұрын

@@BitterCynical Worst case it leaks into the electric and the wall socket isn't properly grounded giving someone a good shock. One can try, but the Manufacturer will reject any responsibility.

@sigataros

27 күн бұрын

@@timhartherz5652 they can just write: to be serviced only by qualified personnel, no reason to not sell the seals except to make more money

Always wondered how this type of hot water heater worked. Loved the schematic.

Get your cat a flat dish. The whiskers may get stressed when touching the edge of the bowl.

Excellent video! I love these tear downs. Give kitty a petting from me! She's so cute.

Cracking heater schematic, and a new principle to look up on Wikipedia, Bernoulli's. Great video.

Nice, I wish you had explained the Triac Optocoupler Controller circuit in more depth though.

These instant heaters are commonplace in many developing countries because a gas heater system is way too expensive to build into a older house, even though it's cheaper in the long run. Most of the "suicide showers" here have no turns at all, the water floods a small chamber where there is a bare wire heater eating several kW from the mains.

@oznerol256

28 күн бұрын

Gas plumbing shouldn't be done new anyway, as methane gas causes climate change. Besides, every use for gas has better alternatives now. For hot water, use a hot water heat pump. For heating the home, use a heat pump. For cooking, use an induction stove. The price is changing too. Solar is absurdly cheap now, and battery prices are dropping quickly.

@ppdan

28 күн бұрын

Because Germany is a developing country??? These are very common in Germany and as weird as it might sound, they are very safe if installed correctly.

@walterbishop2

28 күн бұрын

They are also Common in developed Countries. These small Units are usually used for sinks which are rarely used and to far away from the Central Boiler to justify a hot Water Pipe. For some reason I have a 36kw unit in my Bathroom and a 17kw one in my Kitchen while the room heating is fueled by the waste Heat from an Incinerator.

We'd love a re-gasketing and testing video, like the transformer rewinding video :)

@rarbiart

28 күн бұрын

i would just apply some automotive flexseal used for oil pans, in case you have no matching OEM seal at hands.

@nirodper

28 күн бұрын

@@rarbiart silicone gasket maker

8:24 i love your schematics ☺ thx DGW, another great video!

Very cool. Been hoping someone would take one apart that I watch.

He has a the most pronounced up-speak I’ve heard. I keep waiting for that last syllable on each sentence. 😂

Intressting little device. I've never seen a single phase continuous flow heater. The ones we have here in Germany are usually 3 phase and use between 18 and 33kw.

@MrTurboturbine

28 күн бұрын

33Kw For what? An entire apartment building?

@IamUzyf

28 күн бұрын

@@MrTurboturbine instantaneous water heater require a lot of power. 2 kW tank heater will heat 100 liters of water after 6 hours, and 33 kw heater will heat it in seconds

@DiodeGoneWild

28 күн бұрын

Yes, with 3.5kW, the water is barely warm with a fully opened tap.

@rarbiart

28 күн бұрын

i see quite a number of them in german office buildings. it provides "warmed up" water for lavatory sinks.

@nirodper

28 күн бұрын

@@MrTurboturbine the power required really depends on water input temperature, it gets really cold in germany

I love that screwdriver probe!🤩

The heater is not "just" omitting cycles. Zero-crossing control (that's what the AC wave skipping is called) is actually the only thing allowed at these power levels! (Well, unless you have a fully power factor corrected supply, which is mighty expensive when we talk 3.8kW). Most electricity providers prohibit having more than 300-400W phase angle controlled (that's per mains phase entering the home), because of the non-sinusoidal load on the grid (that's in sync for all consumers on top of that).

@weistonaski6924

27 күн бұрын

I dont understand how it affects the provider wether you use one or the other when you're switching into a resistive load (harmonics ?) May i ask you some sources to read about it ?

@oscargraveland

25 күн бұрын

@@weistonaski6924 Switching on (or off) at the top of the voltage, creates transient (current-) spikes. So yes, harmonics reflecting back into the net.

3:15 - We have buy a Stiebel Eltron too, with 3 phases 11kW/13kW heater inside and electronic temperature settings. An other advantage is, that the Calcium oxide inside of the water can not stuck at the surface of this wires. This makes it very endurable. My female cat is doing the same, take a bit of food, put it at the side at the ground and eat it there. 🙂 I always have to clean the ground with Isopropanol+Water spray and some toilet paper after she is ready. Nice that we could see the inside of the water heater. That Stiebel Eltron does not sell this silicone seal is bad, there should be a law for the repairability of this devices.

@user-ui6xt4fd1f

28 күн бұрын

You can try to use flat dish for your cat, probably cat instinct tells them avoid to put their head in such a holes

@mikropower01

28 күн бұрын

@@user-ui6xt4fd1f - I will try it.

@mernokallat645

24 күн бұрын

It is NOT calcium oxide! It is calcium carbonate. Very basic chemistry, even a 13 year old should know this.

@mikropower01

24 күн бұрын

@@mernokallat645 - You are right, it is CaCO3. Possibly with 13 I did know it.

Thanks!

Trypophobic people may hate this video 😂

@DiodeGoneWild

28 күн бұрын

At this point, absolutely everything seems to have its phobia and filia...

@AdamChristensen

28 күн бұрын

It was the first thing I thought of when I saw the thumbnail. Too many little holes!! 😅😂

@_________________404

28 күн бұрын

@@DiodeGoneWildBased diode

@TheDutchShepherd

28 күн бұрын

Whyyyyyy do youuuuu streeeeetch all youuuuur wooooooords? You must at least be able to shorten them? Or is it a trademark?

@weistonaski6924

27 күн бұрын

​@@TheDutchShepherdIRC he's from East Europe so he's got quite an accent, and it just happen to sound like he's lengthening his word 😄

cool stuff.

Looks like the seal could be 3D printed using TPU, though drawing it would be tough. It could be 3D scanned tho. And I'm not sure about the thermal stability of TPU in hot water 😕

@volt1309

28 күн бұрын

just take a photo of the seal with banana for scale, then import this photo to a 3d program and design around it

@taist5400

28 күн бұрын

step 1 put the cover with the groove in the regular scanner with a ruler beside it for scale, step 2 cad, step 3 print in tpu if it can handle it or print a mold and inject gasket/high temp silicon

@koharaisevo3666

28 күн бұрын

@@taist5400 This wasn't meant to be open anyway just glue the cap with silicone sealant, doesn't even need high temperature.

@AnnaVannieuwenhuyse

28 күн бұрын

Place the seal on a flatbed scanner with a ruler next to it. TPU would indeed not hold up to the temperature, but as I've replied to someone else: TPU wouldn't hold up to the heat, but you could definitely create a mould in PVA filament, cast with silicone rubber, and dissolve the mould.

@SianaGearz

28 күн бұрын

It could be 2D scanned, just drop it on a flatbed document scanner. You can use a black backing or just leave the lid open. You can have Inkscape vectorise it for you, though i'd probably just do that by hand. I don't think TPU is a great choice, as its temperature resistance is limited. Instead i would be 3D printing a mould and casting it in gasket silicone; or even make a plaster or whatever mould of the original pieces and cast them in gasket silicone.

Wow, what a powerful microcontroller for such a simple task! Phase angle control isn't possible, because the optocoupler has zero crossing detection build in!

@309electronics5

27 күн бұрын

Such a pretty much simple device has more processing power then some peoples first computer ☠️

Also, this is a bloody complex thing, most of the suicide showers directly switch the mains to the heater just using the water pressure alone and a piston.

@jb5631

28 күн бұрын

How is this complex? It's just a simple feedback regulated heater

@BritishEngineer

27 күн бұрын

This one is typical of an electric shower.

I suspect the additional back and forth tubing also allows some mixing so the water coming out is of a uniform temperature instead of having hot and cold areas.

Thanks for sharing, I never come across this kind of heaters. I thought they were not even sold in EU.

@5Dale65

25 күн бұрын

They are the best way do get hot water if you have a summer house

Very similar concept to the electric showers found in latin america. The difference is that this one has electronics, while the showers are just a membrane, two resistors in water, and the power selector. It is very safe, when installed with proper grounding + GFCI + dedicated breaker.

Greetings from Poland. Some time ago I found a tiny 7,5kW heater in the garbage, powered by 380-400V AC voltage. He worked in and old apartament.

@hassenmohamod8134

28 күн бұрын

Hi

Nice 👍👍, I guess you could try to seal it using some RTV silicone!

@sakurojason

28 күн бұрын

Or 3D print

Can you use Gasket set to reassemble the heater.

We need more of your thoughts

Mains heater/wiring right in the water and it just relies on resistance of water. Would never have thought of that. I assumed it would be some metal block that has got an insulated heater attached to it, the water then just flows thru the hot metal part.

DGW, what happens to power dissipated in the ground circuit? Surely some current is lost in the ground loop. Do these things sork with GFCIs?

@DiodeGoneWild

22 күн бұрын

The ground leakage current is surely way less than the 30mA needed to trip a typical GFCI.

Thx for another awesome vid, its always exciting when you post a new one. Why do cats do that? I have to line the floor with newspaper around the cats bowls.

I wonder if you could use liquid gasket maker to fix the seals

Wonder if a 3d printed tpu seal would work as a replacement

Takže takto vyzerá vnútri prietokový ohrievač, už dlhšiu dobu som bol zvedavý ako také niečo pracuje, ale bol som lenivý si o tom niečo nájsť :), takže ďakujem za toto video.

Hi ! is it the new sui*ide bath? Lol it's surprising if it doesn't trigger the differential switch at the threshold of 15 mA What happens to scale on the resistance? if the water is softened, it becomes more conductive by adding Na+ and therefore there is a risk of phase and earth conduction. could you measure the current leakage to earth?

This is called a "Durchlauferhitzer" in German, which directly translates to "flow-through heater".

@DiodeGoneWild

28 күн бұрын

The Czech name of it "průtokový ohřívač" would also directly translate to "flow-through heater".

At first I thought you were wrong. A well-known German company makes something like that? But after a bit of googling you are right. It is a "bare wire heater" and as you say: if the water path is long enough, there are no problems with ground currents. Learned something new again.

Interesting. I need one for 24V though. I might buy one and use a resistance wire.

@deltab9768

25 күн бұрын

I don’t think they make them for 24V. To have the same power as the one in the video, you would need at least 150 amps of 24V. You might need as much as a kiloampere if you wanted a hot output with really cold supply water, even if you had a low-flow energy saving showerhead.

@y2ksw1

25 күн бұрын

@@deltab9768 I have solar panels and AGM batteries, which can sustain 120A for hours. With a NiCr resistance wire instead of the heating elements, I might get enough heat to take a shower. However, this project switched my creativity on. Instead of using a high power heater, I might use a normal one, and make the water circulate in a tank. A 3 kW heater like these, erogate about 300 W at 24 V, and with a small pump, I can heat a 100 Liter tank up to 60°C in a matter of hours, with relatively small currents (10-15 A). We have used this system at work and it works great, when power availability is limited. You switch it on over night and have all day hot water.

Nice teardown! How many pins on the MCU are actually in use? There seem to be so few things it really needs to do.

Those gasket seals look like they could be 3D printed with TPU

@AnnaVannieuwenhuyse

28 күн бұрын

TPU wouldn't hold up to the heat, but you could definitely create a mould in PVA filament, cast with silicone rubber, and dissolve the mould.

So this is a safe and up to european standards suicide heater, which is just a better developed version of the suicide shower heads from Brazil. I like that 😂

Only cycles, no angles? :)

@longrunner258

28 күн бұрын

Yes, because phase-cutting produces harmonic distortion and radio interference (which compliant phase-angle controllers have to filter). In light dimmers those are necessary evils (to avoid creating unacceptable flicker), but there's no need to go to such trouble in a heater like this.

I wonder if you could 3D print a replacement gasket out of TPU. As long as the water temperature doesn't exceed 80C, it should be fine.

Very interesting design features. A pity the gaskets were not up for the (mostly modest) task.

Surely this type of heater would trip an RCD with bare elements?

@DiodeGoneWild

26 күн бұрын

No, the leakage current is way less than 30mA.

Impressive to think this Triac cause such little voltage drop, it can switch 16 amps with no heatsink required.

@DiodeGoneWild

27 күн бұрын

It has a heatsink cooled by the water.

@andreasu.3546

25 күн бұрын

@@DiodeGoneWild You're right of course, I didn't notice it but the cooling block is clearly visible at 2:25.

As others have mentioned, you could just use silicone sealant to make gaskets yourself. I wonder why they didn't just go for an "electrode heater" design if they weren't isolating the heating element anyway - that way there's no possibility of the element overheating if it's not covered with water.

@deltab9768

25 күн бұрын

The electrode heater design has significantly more current passing through the water, and some small amount of electrolysis corrosion can happen even on AC. Not to mention the power would depend on the water conductivity in that situation.

Only seen these in the uk and find it terrifying when they are in the shower, and I am no stranger to 220v kisses.

Wow that's like those showers you see in certain countries, I don't think that would be allowed here...

How come the naked wires are immersed in the water to heat it? are you mistaken or I didn't get it? you said the copper wires are in contact with water!

@JulianA-tr6pt

28 күн бұрын

Read the text on screen 3:15

where is the schematic of the pcb? :(

can you please make few epiodes on washing machines boards and electrical oven

Megger tested?

Brother I have three old Soviet transistor name of the transistor are TKD 165-80 and TKD 165-250 and TKD 265-250 I want to donate to you but I don't know how to donate for more information reply have a nice day comrade

No chance to buy sealings? I wonder if these could be made by scanning the block and then 3D printing new ones out of a thermo-curing elastomer. Some of those Stiebel Eltron instant heaters have electronic sensing system rather than (or on top of) hydraulic, this one may be an example. These can work with pre-heated water, which is useful with a storage water heater being the primary water heating device, with the instant heater active only when the hot water from the tank hasn't reached the tap yet, or got depleted. I'd love to see the electronics reverse-engineered. It's surprisingly advanced, using a STM... not sure why.

08:23 PacMan schematic ............. This device is a slightly safer death shower which Clive investigated. Great work thanks

My dad has a similar device branded "clage" that's made in England apparently, and it is as simple and dumb as can possible be, it only has 2 micro-switches and a heating resistor and that's it, the temperature is regulated by a screw that regulates the water flow. Honestly its a pile of "rubish".

What does this mean: grounded?

@timtim8468

28 күн бұрын

Parts someon may touch, here the water connectors, are wired to the world, so there can't be voltage in-between, nobody can be shocked. One power connector is on the same potential, by the way. But these days a third wire is used. By the way, it's actually possible to have a ground free socket, where someone could touch one power connector at a time. But the existing power grid is grounded. I'm glad you asked.

@sneakybeanie01134

28 күн бұрын

@@timtim8468 Thank you for helping.

Why using an optotriac when the microcontroller is not powered by an insulated power supply ?

@DiodeGoneWild

27 күн бұрын

When the microcontroller is powered using a bridge rectified capacitive dropper, it is referenced to a wrong point. It can't control the triac directly.

When the water is turned on the flow of the water pulls the plunger in to make the contacts for the heating element.

@jj74qformerlyjailbreak3

28 күн бұрын

M glad I worked that out in my head before I seen the membrane. Nice.

👍

For a tankless water heater this really doesn’t use as much power as I would have expected. In America a typical tank water heater uses 4500 watts while tankless ones use on average around 10-20 kilowatts.

Kinda like those dodgy showers😂

I'm a bit disappointed that they didn't control the power in thirds (obviously the heater would then need to have three full-voltage segments wound with thinner wire, so whether it'd be durable enough is another question; but obviously if they really cared about durability, they'd sell replacement gaskets).

Now let's compare this safe (and necessarily complex) design with some Chinese ones!

@imeakdo7

28 күн бұрын

both are suicide showers in boxes because they use bare wire heaters with no insulation

@chrisparussin5359

28 күн бұрын

i was shocked seeing how a device that heats water with live wire like this one can be safe!

A Czech valve in a German water heater. These devices are just OTT.

I guess this proofs that a hair dryer droppen in your bath wont kill you

What is the cat's name? I don't want to call him Catculator, lol. Those extra channels make fitting another seal more difficult.

@DiodeGoneWild

26 күн бұрын

Her name is Veritáska ;)

An MCU at all fells like overkill, but a stm32 is over-overkill

@walterbishop2

28 күн бұрын

It May be Overkill, but If they Order a bazillion of identical Pre Programmed μC which can be used for all Models by adding the necessary Parts it may be still cheaper then a smaller one or doing the Same with Logic. Also the 1€ μC doesn't contribute much to the price of the Unit.

@memejeff

28 күн бұрын

​​@@walterbishop2Stm's are rather expensive though. Lots of drastically cheaper options. Although maybe they got a good deal.

Can you not use the old seal and pour epoxy to make a mold? Once the epoxy sets, pull the old seal out and use the cavity to pour silicon in it. When the silicone sets the next day, you have a new gasket. Make more if needed.

@drobotk

28 күн бұрын

I wonder how well those would sell

@sakurojason

28 күн бұрын

3D printing would work too using TPU

@objection_your_honor

27 күн бұрын

@@sakurojason TPU leaks like a sieve.

@objection_your_honor

27 күн бұрын

@@drobotk Who said anything about selling? It's how others make gaskets for repair jobs.

@sakurojason

26 күн бұрын

@@objection_your_honor Then I got a better idea. You could 3D print an injection mold and mold a gasket out of silicone.

6:35 kitty!

their boilers also suck :/ replaced lots of heating elements who were just disolved

so because it uses a bare wire heater, it's a suicide shower in a box. i was expecting to see a sheathed heating element instead

So what college are you teaching at

32kb of flash just to make current flow thru a wire And I thought the 16kb to run my electric toothbrush was stupid enough Humanity is doomed

@sergepetrov8598

28 күн бұрын

Using 100Bn neurons for some primitive work?

Decided to take bath with cold water except using electric heater

thanks, but i'll stick to my 18kW gas-powered one. it works good enough

I'd just use some good old RTV gasket maker problem solved

Please Review - 12V 2A CCTV Camera Adapter - Black

secret Life of the washing machine

Here in North America, we can only dream of such things.

@5Dale65

28 күн бұрын

Not really. Most european ones work on 230V 50Hz. They will work fine on 240V 60Hz as well.

@ozzymandius666

28 күн бұрын

@@5Dale65 Sure. All the houses are full of 240V outlets.

@memejeff

28 күн бұрын

​@@ozzymandius666Most American houses have 2 separate phases in them. It is fairly standard practice to connect them together to get 240V for AC units and some other gear.

@ozzymandius666

28 күн бұрын

@@memejeff Sure. All the houses are full of 240V outlets

@jb5631

28 күн бұрын

​​@@ozzymandius666obviously your house doesn't need to be "full of 240V sockets", of course 1 or 2, AC/this heater is enough.

much more secure than "suicide shower"

Its a tankless job but someone gotta do it

Water heater is more complex than an automatic transmission.

@5Dale65

25 күн бұрын

Nothing is more complex than an automatic transmission

BigClive, Zerobrain

Wot aböutte æ Tankful wœter heaτeř?

Seems like electrolysis would degrade the Heating element Over time.

@DiodeGoneWild

28 күн бұрын

with an AC current, the electrolytic effect mostly cancels out.

4:25 What an absolute mark of bad quality and bad business practices to not be able to offer spare parts for your products. wouldn't bother further with such a brand.

@309electronics5

27 күн бұрын

The sad reality is almost every company is going slowly towards this.

Won't sell service parts? Welcome to my blacklist, Stiebel-Eltron!

Máš otravnou intonaci hlasu.

Voltage nameplates cannot be trusted, because when heater is running, the mains voltage drops. Therefore, Real Watts = {new dropped voltage} x Current

That seal looks like a perfect candidate for a 3d printed replacement

I was gonna recommend my friend to buy one of these for his cottage. Now, I will recommend the propane version. The electric version is too complicated and not very safe in hard water.

@imeakdo7

28 күн бұрын

or, recommend him an electric heater with a sheathed heating element

@piconano

28 күн бұрын

@@imeakdo7 You just replied for the sake of commenting? I also forgot to mention the flow-rate of these, same as pissing. They're ok for kitchen sinks, but try to take a shower with that flow-rate.

@imeakdo7

28 күн бұрын

@@piconano why do you think I replied for the sake of commenting?