I think maybe the guitar used for jazz has become less important over time with the likes of Larry Carlton (335), or Julian Lage Telecaster), but jazz has come to encompass more than just the Joe Pass sound. Lee Ritenour plays an L7 (big Gibson - fully hollow) but also plays a Gibson 335, a Les Paul, and frequently a Yamaha silent guitar (nylon) all to great effect. To my point you made them all sound beautiful. A great guitarist is probably the most important variable as you've so convincingly demonstrated. Thanks.

@refuseit

4 ай бұрын

​@@godzoo18Effeminate? What a weirdo. Go wank to Manowar if you want big muscles and masculine power. And yes, Julian Lage is a more complete musician than any of those you listed, as much as I enjoy Wes and Benson.

@topografer

Ай бұрын

Spot on

@godzoo18

Ай бұрын

You mean white jazz of course..

@Wingman52

Ай бұрын

@@godzoo18 White jazz, purple jazz, green jazz, or blue jazz... all the same to me. Check out Andy Edwards on this topic..Cheers.

@godzoo18

Ай бұрын

@@Wingman52 There is only one colour jazz.. and it's none of those.

The Telecaster has quite a jazz history: Ed Bickert, Mike Stern, Bill Frisell, Tim Lerch, Julian Lage. My favourite guitar at the moment is a ‘49 Gibson ES300 or a ‘43 acoustic L5. The L5 is a non cutaway model with an outrageously quilted maple back and sides that is a real looker. All three of the choices posed in the video would work just fine.

I use a tele for everything. Combined set of flat 12s on the bass and 13s on the top. Not quite as jazz boxy as a 175 but honestly way more note clarity. Works for me. Jazz is not just the sound but the language. My jazz guitar teacher would play an afternoon solo jazz gig then go play a classic rock/blues gig at night .. all with an old Japanese strat. He made a decent living.. at least til the whole live music scene changed.

@kevinanderson967

3 ай бұрын

Was your teacher Jack Pearson?

@godzoo18

Ай бұрын

You got to be absolutely kidding, go listen to Grant Green play Idle Moments and then come back and tell me it would sound just as good on a ukulele. m.kzread.info/dash/bejne/k6Vkz5KhkqbQdrQ.html

@godzoo18

Ай бұрын

Wrong.. jazz wouldn't work on a didgeridoo, harpsichord, bagpipes and a 100 other instruments I could name.

The best guitar for jazz is the one that inspires the jazz player the most. That's all that really matters. That's really true of all instruments.

@What_If_We_Tried

9 ай бұрын

100%

I played a Gibson 175 for many years and for pure Jazz it's great. The only guitar I played and is even better is a Gibson L5, with even more darkness and deepness in tone like Wes Montgomery on "Round Midnight" 🙏

It’s a common misconception that jazz players roll off the tone knob. It’s more usual to slightly roll off the volume knob. Glad you mentioned Peerless - I play a Peerless Sunset which is a thinline hollowbody archtop, with Thomastik-Infeld Jazz BeBop 14 gauge strings. These are roundwounds but have smaller windings so smoother than normal roundwounds but more lively than flats. Definitely worth a try especially if you aren’t fortunate enough to have a dedicated jazz guitar.

@alainvb8786

4 ай бұрын

C est vrai quand on abaisse légérement le volume il y a une petite baisse des aigus ☺

The ES175 takes the cake by a hair. Awesome playing!

A really well-done and thorough demonstration of these three guitars. Thanks, John.

All 3 depending on player and style of jazz. All 3 great guitars. Love them equally 😎🤓.

You should make a blindfold test. Nobody can tell without seeing the instrument 😁 I am surprised you have so much trouble with feedback on the ES175, whenever I have played archtops with humbuckers on gigs that has not been too much of a problem.

@matt_greene

Жыл бұрын

I think because the feedback is much easier to control on stolen ES175s :)

@JensLarsen

Жыл бұрын

@@matt_greene ok, never played a stolen ES175 with a humbucker (as far as I know anyway)

@BluegumCounterpoint

11 ай бұрын

Agree with your comment re the blindfold test. For many players, choosing a guitar is heavily influenced by the image it conveys. I recommend choosing a guitar that feels right in your hands.

I like the 335 here. Can't beat the tele for an all rounder - what a remarkable instrument! I like the 175 but prefer a nice L5

It would be really interesting to hear your learning guitar story.

That is insane dynamic control in that intro video

They all sounded great. If I had to choose, I guess the 335 wins...barely. I only dabble in jazz, but I play any style I want on whatever guitar is in my hands, lol. I don't discriminate😅😅😅. Great playing. sir.

Thank you ! They all sound good in your hands.

I always liked a Les Paul for playing jazz. Very similar to a 335

@alainvb8786

4 ай бұрын

J ai une modeste epiphone les paul 100 . Imblement je. N ai pas les moyens de mettre cher au total les 3 guitares 300 euros en parfait état ! En jazz l epiphone c est super avec beaucoup de sultain . Ma télécaster gear4music knoxville super aussi et mon ibanez afs 75t aussi .toute régler par mes soins .... Cela dépend des morceaux et de l humeur ! 😉🎶🎶

I use a 14” carved archtop made by luthier Ed Schaefer for jazz. Also have had good luck with a parts Tele with humbuckers and a 2014 ES Les Paul (semi-hollow).

I've got an Epiphone ES175 which I got years ago (adminitedly because it was an affordable version of Steve Howe's) I didn't do much with it until I started learning Jazz and with flatwounds on it I get a great tone out of it with my Katana. I picked up a 1980 Epiphone Emperor (which I think became the Joe Pass signarure model) which also has great Jazz tone but is heavy as feck. My Epi 335 doesn't give as good jazz tone as these two even though I changed the stock pickups to Semour Duncan Jazz pups although it could just be my ears. The Tele is good and as pointed out by others is smaller!

I am lucky to have all those style guitars, but my ear the one that takes the cake in your video, in terms of pure tone, is your 335 style. Soothing.

@es330td

2 ай бұрын

I prefer the 330 personally. Yes, I know it has feedback problems but I think the fully hollow body gives a warmer sound. Plus it is a lot lighter.

Another great video John and great explanation and tips. Do you have posted your preset you were using for this comparison. Love the tone.

I use a thinline tele with flatwounds on the lower 3 strings and elixir polyweb 10s on the higher few strings. i also use a harmony comet with polyweb 9s. gotta say the flatwounds do matter for the strings with the thicker windings, sounds less bright and more mellow. overall both do the job, but i love the feel of the flatwounds and the overall slicker feeling (which is probably why i use polywebs). main thing id say would actually be the touch/the pick you use because i love collecting picks and even among different jazz tipped picks, the material and thickness make such a difference in how i play and how it sounds, so id suggest to play around with different pick choices! personally i love the primetone range of picks, the ones that are translucent amber!

they all sound wonderful--loved the woodiness snap to the Herb Ellis 165. it is that sound that only some Gibsons give out and through a Fender tube amp that defines the old Gibson arch top sound.

The ES175 takes this for me. A Goding Kingpin is an affordable and fantastic option. I am partial to charlie christian piclups as they have a character that is magic. A surprisingly great jass option pickup wise are goldfoils.

Great sound out of all 3. I agree with the assessments. Your amp setup has a nice reverb and / or delay. What are you using for that?

The rosewood /ebony frets on the telecaster TOTALLY changes the sound. Wow

I’ve got all three of those guitars. I suggest taking the pick guard off the 335 and the 175. They suck up a lot of the tone and perhaps rattle. I put some foam that I cut out in the F holes of the 175 for playing louder. My Telecaster has flat wound strings. However, I use an unwound third string. All three guitars have incredible action, but I find that the telecaster is easier to play and hold. Very nice demo. I chuckled when I ran across this video because last night I was playing the song autumn in New York as you did. Don’t tell me these phones don’t listen to us. Thank you my friend.

JNC, you are pure talent ❤ and the answer to your question about best jazz guitar, all of the above. It seems to me it’s all in the player, not the guitar, and you’re certainly that player

You play beautifully and have provided an excellent analysis. Would love to hear a hollow body with a floating neck pickup.

My experiences with flat wounds / round wound strings: With a solid wooden bridge for jazz arch tops, you are most probable better off with flat wounds / wound G string: that bridges are designed to work with flat wounds. If you have a metal bridge, you can set it up either for wound G string or plain G string with adjusting the G string length.

I would say the 335, because it tones and hum buckers can adjust to so many sounds.

All of them sounds amazing!

Great playing

I forgot to say, you play beautifully and thanks for making the video.

They all sound wonderful because of the player but the 175 has the magic.

The playing is sublime. I don’t care which guitar, the music is where I’m at. But if you push me I like the 335 least, the 175 soundslikeMetheney, sp I prefers the articulation of the tele.

Dang. The 165/175 sounds amazing. I was going to call for a P-90 guitar like an ES 125, but that 175 has the tone.

They all sound good - beautiful playing! Never owned any of these 3 but, depending on the style of jazz I guess a 175 would be the 'purist' approach (Metheny), 335 maybe 'modern / a little bluesy' (thinking Scofield). On the odd occasion when I needed to fake some jazz chords / lines in a short soundtrack I would flip to neck pick-up on my Les Paul and wind the tone way back but about 15 years ago noticed an Epiphone Broadway on sale for about USD 350 and grabbed it and have come to love it - especially for finger-style work. Bill Frisell has certainly made good use of a Tele on some stuff. John McLaughlin has been playing PRS Custom solid bodies for the last few years!

Depends a lot on what kind of player you are. The 175 has a very woody tone and as a plywood hollowbody it has the typical pecussive "thunk" to the tone. For classic bebop/straightahead jazz you can't go wrong with one. I personally love the classic "Jim Hall" tone of a 50s ES-175 w/ p90s through old octal Gibson amp. If you're someone who plays more modern, maybe tries to achieve more of a singing quality to the tone or want to use effects, you'd be better of with the 335 or the Tele. Also, if you play more intricate voicings with lot of innervoice movements, the sustain of the 335 or a Tele will serve you well. I recently took my Tele (52 hot rod model with a mini at the neck) to a jazz gig and was very pleasantly surprised with the clean jazz tone I was getting out of it with my AER 60.

I guess the 175 is the most appropriate for jazz, particularly with the flatwounds. The 335 is the most versatile and I think it would be worth trying flatwounds on the Tele. Cheers Great playing btw...

My benchmark guitar tone comes from the nylon string classic. As I move to harder styles of music I like brighter tones. I trade the brightness and sustain of solid body construction over to the resonance and warmth of hollow body F hole designs. Same goes for string choice, round wounds emphasize brightness and harmonics, while flat wounds reinforce a strong fundamental. I always try to get a genuine and authentic tone from the design of the instrument I choose. This holds true for all stringed instruments even banjos or bass guitar. Try a light wipe of Williams Lectric Shave on a clean set of flat wounds to see if there is any Jazz in that.

Telecaster sounds great . Your playing is inspirational . A 72 Telecaster Thinline with wide range Humbuckers is also worth a mention .

I just bought the DeAndrlico DC Excel, normally 1900, i got a returned one in mint condition for 1000. I'm pretty happy with it.

I've owned a Samick rl5 for about 15 years. It's kind of a cross between an es175 and a 335. It's a 175 shape that's semi hollow with a centre block and not as cumbersome.

Es 175d player for a year or so. Very few issues with feedback. I recommend. I use it for rock and roll and it sounds awesome with some dirt.

This sound is just devine🥰

Beautiful playing. You’re very good. Of the three, the 175 sounds the best. Convincingly to me. Plus you seem to “hear and feel it” better than the other two. The full, throaty sound of the full hollow is imitated but never duplicated by a semi or solid. It’s “one dimensional” as you say, but if you want to be in that “dimension” it’s the only way. But one does give up the versatility, and dealing with the feedback live is so challenging. But if it’s “the sound” you want then it’s the 175.

All three were totally passable, the 175 is my personal favorite. The more "wood" or guitar body I hear on the single pickup, big box with f-holes, the closer, IMHO, you get to that "jazz" sound. But, then you have a 1 dimensional guitar... I can make my HSS Fender strat sound pretty close just by putting it on the neck pickup and turning the tone knob almost all the way down (but not all the way!), and then play a Journey tune the next minute!. I heard Jocelyn Gould play on her Benedetto: she can completely change the tone by how she holds the pick and the angle of the guitar! Amazing

The tele color is amazing

Actually, I’ve moved over to a PRS SE Hollowbody II for jazz. Candidly, I was absolutely shocked at the build quality and overall playability of this instrument. Also, it’s nice to play jazz on a guitar whose body isn’t quite the size of a small automobile.

@Guitar6ty

8 ай бұрын

I have the same guitar and its a beast when it comes to Jazz Tone. Its down to the build quality and the wood used. Awesome guitar.

@eohippusone

8 ай бұрын

Full hollow bodies are too hard on my arthritic shoulder. So, I covet a Benedetto Pat Martino, but for the price. And I have a tele. Nice playing!

@City2x

2 ай бұрын

I just got a PRS semi Hollow. So I'm really I pressed with it for jazz tones,

I essentially play jazz, but I also love blues and rock blues; I've changed several Gibson guitars, now I use an ES175 SH signature and I think it's fantastic for playing jazz

I never thought of a Telecaster as a Jazz guitar until a couple of years ago when I stumbled across an Ed Bickert video. Next was Bill Frisell, then Julian Lage. And I was so inspired, that I bought a Player HH soon after, and will be upgrading the humbuckers soon. John, you're a wonderful player. * subscribed *

@benjaminsoundandprojects3710

6 ай бұрын

Tim Lerch. KZread him.

@To.Si.Ma.

5 ай бұрын

Cecil Alexander is great too. - A neck HB (PAF or SD Seth Lover with 0.047 pots) and fat flatwounds is more important for a jazztone than the bodyshape. (If you go for the Wes sound)

@topisantakivi1512

4 ай бұрын

Ted Greene!!

@What_If_We_Tried

4 ай бұрын

@@topisantakivi1512 Yep, another great Tele Jazz guitarist.

@topisantakivi1512

4 ай бұрын

@@What_If_We_TriedSpeaking of solid body guitars, just watched Cecil Alexander beboping on a Jackson Soloist kzread.info/dash/bejne/n6pqstB9ipObnpc.html

And the Gibson has lots of veneer on it....Gibson's semi-hollowbodies like the ES-335 and ES-339 have tops and backs constructed of layers (either 3 or 4) of maple veneer. My understanding is that the veneers are assembled in successive cross-grain layers with the top layer having its grain longitudinal to the length of the guitar. The tops and backs are approximately 1/4" in thickness after layup.

For me, the best tone for that jazz sound is the perfect ES-335 guitar. I've always liked this guitar, the sound is bright and tasty, and maybe because I'm a fan of LC, and also after listening to and enjoying, for many years, many albums by many other artists, who played with this beautiful guitar. Now (I'm 51) I'm a beginner guitarist, and I'm in a bit of a difficult choice, because I'm hesitating to buy maybe this year a Gibson 335 or 345, or Ibanez, or Epiphone ES-339 pro , or Tokai , etc.

Personally not a 335 fan in general, but I did think the tele and the 175 both sounded the best here. I like teles for solo playing because they sustain a bit better, but a fully hollow electric just has a sound too.

My Eastman Ar503ce has a magical jazz tone. It sounds good even through a roland cube. My other guitars can't compete with how good that thing sounds clean. But many great jazz players have used teles. Ted Greene, Ed Bickert, Tim Lerch, etc. By the way, i love your jazz playing. I am glad i got into jazz quite early, at around my 2nd year of playing. Its one of my favorite genres to play due to its difficulty.

@donsimons9810

3 ай бұрын

chinese guitar alert

@gavinw5469

3 ай бұрын

@@donsimons9810 Yup, they are great Chinese guitars.

The 175 sounds really good to my ear but all those sound great....I have an archtop Ibanez Custom 125 and a 335 and the archtop has the tone but the 335 has articulation and sustain...teles are very good in the mix...they cut through with a band...for solo guitar I go with the 175

The trick to using a hollow body on stage is limiting the stage volume. Put the amp further away , lower the volume and don't be close to the drums. Or better yet, use in-ears and modeler direct FOH. I've seen a plexiglass baffle used in front of the amp too.

I like a 335 for Jazz it just seems perfect but with small tweaks it could be a Les Paul or Tele. The tones here are all lovely as is the playing and frankly listening blind I'd be pushed to distinguish if I'm listening to the music not "which guitar".

All 3 guitars did great. Agreed, the 335 is probably the best all around, most versatile guitar when factoring for live performing. I was amazed how well the Tele sounded, and it is a great option when you're playing live and don't want to worry about toting around something like the Gibsons. But I was completely floored by the beautiful lush tones from that ES-165 (175). Judging on tone itself, that guitar is the gold standard for jazz. If I was just a home player, it would be an easy choice. But because of the feedback issues, probably not a good choice for live use in a group setting. One final note - I would've loved to see a Les Paul included in this comparison, as it's a guitar that is widely owned (like the Tele). A good Gibson option if you already own one and don't want to fork out the extra dough for an ES.

I'm curious how the 335 compares to the 175 with flats on it as well they would sound pretty similar no?

Wonderful performance John and I think the 175 might have had the nicest sound (clearly this is personal preference). Great work.

@cchavez248

8 ай бұрын

Agreed, the sife of the body is just audible, overdriven, the smaller guitars would come into their own but clean, the es175 reigns supreme to my ears!

I wonder how mixing a set of 11s for the unwounds and 10s for the wounds on the Tele would work out...

The good news is that you don't have to spend more than $3000 dollars to get a good Guitar for Jazz. Their are many in the $1000 to $3000 range or even less. Specifically Hollow Body and Semihollow Body Guitars by Keisel, D'Angelico, Ibanez, Gibson, Epiphone, Washburn, and Eastman to name a few. Even though the Gibson L-5 is in many ways the Hollowbody Jazz Guitar that all others are judged by, it's the ES-175 that's one of the most popular Jazz Guitars. Thanks.

i really enjoyed the song at the beginning of the video so much i signed up for patreon. can’t find your tabs tho, anywhere i should look?

They all sound exquisite. Because of how you play them, all three are remarkably similar. My view is that good quality full bodied, hollow guitars sound fractionally more authentic for jazz, but only at very low volumes. I have two examples: when I saw Pat, playing his 175, his sound was muddy and blurred. I once used a Variax on a small gig, then was kindly lent a 175 for the second half of the gig. The Variax was infinitely superior- both to play, and gauging on audience reaction. I make of that what I will…

Creo que la guitar telecaster se adapta a todo estilo, pero la magia esta en los dedos, y un buen amplificador ayuda mucho!! Gracias

Your Jazz playing is nice!

Loved the Pat Metheny ibanez but traded it in on Gibson 175 Have regretted it ever since..

which amp are you using?? sounds really great

Obviously as your beautiful plating proves at the beginning any guitar that makes sound wielded by a good player can play jazz

Ummmm, my 1982 ibanez george benson guitar plugged straight into a Quilter amp reverb at 5. exquisite tone for bebop and jazz

The best one is the one you have!

I have an Aria Pro 2 Herb Ellis model that I bought in 1990 for $400.00. I can actually gig with it. What a lucky find.

Yes!!!! ❤❤❤ But not only for Jazz....

I own all three guitars and some others. I prefer ES 175 and Ibanez GB-10 made in Japan.Of course,Telecaster and ES 335 are wonderful guitars.

Whatever guitar you have that inspires you to play, is the right guitar for the job.

I have a few guitars for jazz. An Ibanez ag93 (cheap George Benson type smaller full hollow) pups swapped to Ibanez super80s, a the loar 615 I think it's called which is an acoustic arch top, a gretsch streamliner centre block jr with paf pickup swapped in from the stock and an Ibanez as 83 with alnico paf pups swapped in (formerly their cheap overwound ceramics). All sound good, but the most convincing things was with my vintage 70s Ibanez ar2630 with original super80s pup (underwound ceramic paf alike) which just has the sound (finding that the turns/wind has more impact than the magnet type - Ibanez overwound ceramic pup sound dull but the super80s have the jazz sound ¯⁠\⁠_⁠(⁠ツ⁠)⁠_⁠/⁠¯). The as83 is out of the case so it gets played the most though. Saw a friend do jazz on an ibanez RG HSH shredder and it sounded amazing. No turtle could deny.

“Jazz” is pretty broad term. Sonny Sharrock played his jazz with a Les Paul into a dimed Marshall stack. Al Di Meola played a Les Paul into a guitar synthesizer. Allan Holdsworth played a SynthAxe guitar that WAS a synthesizer.

Well, the tele's not stock replaced neck pickup?

Notes are a little too bell-like or too high which is a typical gripe I have about performances and the guitar and its settings.

Beautiful, oh 🥹

For me it’s the 175 bc the ability to have the amplified and acoustic sound simultaneously and the playability of the Gibson scale length

Why no flats on the ES-335 or Tele? I've had TI flats on my tele, sounded good to my ears for clean picking!

@johnnathancordy

8 ай бұрын

I find flats don't really work across as many styles as rounds - but use them on my jazz guitars!

Let's no forget Mike Stern on Tele, or Steve Khan, Will Bernard etc on 335's

I liked the Tele more, Julian Lage fan here 😅

All great but the Telecaster has a more vibrant and alive sound.

I wouldn't even pretend that I'm some great jazz player, but I do have a a couple of hand-carved beauties. I am really careful with my muting techniques on those guitars (with both hands) in order to manage volume and feedback.

What's the deal with tape on the neck pickup? Ive seen this a few times on jazz boxes mostly.

@zigatron1

Жыл бұрын

Some people but tape on to prevent the pick from potentially taping the top of the pickup

NOBE OF THE ABOVE it’s either Gretsch or D Angelico

I've got an old ES-175, and tried round wound strings on it. They killed its sultry, warm tones, and defeated the purpose of its design. I use flat wound strings exclusively on it. Regarding feedback, I've read that on hollow and semi-hollow body archtop guitars, a number of people report better results by blocking the F-holes, instead of stuffing the guitars with things like cloth or foam. 🤷

Gorgeous playing - and lovely tone from all three guitars. I think you’re overly modest about your jazz chops. I was surprised at how much I loved the Tele. I can’t say I enjoyed Tom the 175 more than the 335, despite hearing the difference.

Epi es-335?

John, are you sure about the neck pickup on the Tele? I don't think K-Line makes that pickup, it looks more like a Lollat Royal T pickup.

@johnnathancordy

5 ай бұрын

I'm absolutely positive, email Chris, he may be able to build one for you too?

John, I just purchased a Greg Bennet Lasalle JZ2. It is an Archtop… I got it new from UK 🇬🇧 to Colombia 🇨🇴 from Gear4Music. It costed exactly $450USD + Shipping. It’s sooooo worth it. An incredible, outstanding Archtop, not only for its price range. I’ve seen them 2nd hand in Australia for over $1000USD. It’s is very much superior to its Ibanez/Epiphone etc kind of competitors. This is the second time I advice you to try it out. It’s sooo worth it. A great great value. Cheers John 🤙🏽✌🏽🎵⚡️

@genec8393

Жыл бұрын

They are great sounding but so big!

@Pinzonic

Жыл бұрын

@@genec8393 yes. They are big, but to me that’s not a bad thing though. I like it. It gives a totally different experience. I feel it familiar too since I’ve come from classical. I think Jazz is probably the closest of genres when it comes to classical guitar. Anyways. Thanks for your reply

Educate me… why the masking tape on the humbucker of the es175?

For my money 175 but they all sound great.

What standard were you playing at the beginning?

@orlandoguitarist

Жыл бұрын

Autumn In New York by Vernon Duke

What is the name of the song he is playing?

Whatever you have and want to play - is the best for anything. Equalizer in there! :D

I choose a Guild Artist Award myself, an 89' to be exact. This is what it's for.