I am always excited when a new Wayne May video is uploaded on KZread.

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

You’re excited by deception? I met this guy in 2005 in Palmyra. I immediately knew he was a scam artist, but the worst kind because he thinks he is going to tell us everything the Lord has never seen fit to reveal to us. Columbus did not visit the continental US which means 1 Nephi proves May and Meldrum wrong.

@bryanworkman5686

4 жыл бұрын

@@TheShinyDog I came through and read a number of your comments versus others. I'll not take a side on the geography stuff, but I will say that just your antagonistic spirit turns me off completely. You sound as angry as non members do trying to prove the church isn't true. And I'm not even saying it is. But wow. The angry spirit you bring points me to think you may not really have the spirit of Christ in you. Good luck though.

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

@@bryanworkman5686 The leaders of the Heartland Scam are apostate. After all the coddling they get, do you want me to shower hugs and kisses on them?

@bryanworkman5686

4 жыл бұрын

@@TheShinyDog Oh the mental pictures. That would make me chuckle. 😉 If it were a conversation with them then do your thing I suppose. But the people who just comment on the video aren't really deserving of being belittled are they? And don't actual apostates teach different doctrine, not geography? I have yet to have a temple recommend interview where I'm asked geography questions. I did have an inactive decade, did they add that and my new bishop didn't get the memo? Sorry for being facetious, I'm just trying to keep the mood light. Have a great 4th of July.

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

@@bryanworkman5686 Happy 4th to you, too. Since you mentioned the temple recommend, I'd like to remind you of the sacred covenants we make there. One cannot break those covenants and remain in good standing. The heartland Nehorites speak evil of the Brethren. They know better. They maintain that their lies are truth because they want the praise of the world, and a little cash wouldn't hurt either. As for the apostates' naive followers, they also know that there are other theories out there and yet they hang on to the heartland scam, mostly out of a illogical sense of patriotism. It's all about 'Murica and apple pie! Knowing that it is easier to fool a man than to convince him he's been fooled, I still attempt to shock some of these misguided souls away from geographical priestcraft. (If you'll go to Alma 1, you'll note that those saints did not long allow Nehor to spread his lies. Unfortunately, Nehor had converts such as Amlici in Alma 2. Please note that there was no chapter break after Alma Chapter 1 in the 1830 edition of The Book of Mormon.) Nehorism is a vicious adulteration of pure Gospel doctrine. Even though Nehor met his demise in Alma Chapter 1, Nehorites appear in chapters 2, 16 and 24 of Alma. Real lives of real people were ruined by that abominable heresy. You'll understand then, I pray, if I would like to see priestcraft eliminated from among the membership and even from KZread sooner rather than later.

Greetings from a Lamanite. The house of Israel will rise once again and for ever. It is written and thats a prophesy.

@johnlewis6526

3 жыл бұрын

Agreed

@mrkhrrs

3 жыл бұрын

Yes, but who are the Lamanites? North American Native American's have x2a haplogroup DNA. Mesoamerican natives do not.

@kabirphillip8284

3 жыл бұрын

You probably dont give a shit but if you are stoned like me during the covid times then you can watch pretty much all the latest movies and series on InstaFlixxer. Been streaming with my brother recently xD

@malakaijad53

3 жыл бұрын

@Kabir Phillip Definitely, I have been using InstaFlixxer for months myself :)

I am a one hill girl. I have been to the hill Cumorah and the spirit is so strong! I grew up in Ohio❤️ Io

I was using satellite imagery to look-over the land near Pike County in SW Indiana. This area was settled by my ancestors. I was truly amazed at the extensive earthworks. Not only mounds but Bermed rectangular enclosures as well. Fascinating.

@LRRPFco52

4 жыл бұрын

Guess where General Albert Sydney Johnston died in the Civil War? Yes, that General Johnston who led the Army to come attack the Saints in the Utah War under direction from President Buchanan.

This is AWESOME. Thank you fir posting it!

Great presentation Wayne! Really appreciate all the great work you do. I believe you’re spot on and I’m spreading the word.

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

So wrong. Both you and Wayne.

@majesticliberatoroftheoppr3971

4 жыл бұрын

Doug Stringer I appreciate your belief in a different model. There is appeal with other models And I certainly don’t hold it against anyone if they have a different view. How do you know so assuredly that the heartland model is not correct ?

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

One more time: I do not believe in any model. I only believe The Book of Mormon. The models are a distraction at best. The problem with the cheerleaders (priestcrafters) May and Meldrum is that they want you to attend their pep rallies and clap for them. They want you to buy books from their websites. They want you to raise your hand and ask, "Master, which is the greater mound, Iowa or Ohio? Teach us, Master."

@majesticliberatoroftheoppr3971

4 жыл бұрын

I’m glad you believe in the book of Mormon. So do I. I for one appreciate what they’re doing. At the very least, it helps the book of Mormon come alive for me and I can visualize The landscape. I get a lot more from the book this way. Will we know for sure? Maybe not until it’s revealed but until then, it’s not a bad thing to have Archaeological evidence backing up The Scriptures. Likewise, it is thrilling for me to see the internal evidence is within the book of Mormon. I would not be so harsh. I think they are doing us a great service And we cannot flatly say that they are wrong. This has given me a geographical paradigm that makes sense and allows my faith to grow.

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

@@majesticliberatoroftheoppr3971 You and others keep using that word evidence, but I don’t think you know what it means. No reasonable conclusion can be made that Zarahemla of Mosiah 1’s day was in Iowa. Neither the Mississippi River or any other runs uphill. You guys are just wrong. Thanks for playing. We’ve got lovely parting gifts for you.

I was able to go to the hill Cumorah and was overcome with the Spirit. That is where I bought your book on the Mound builders. Thankyou for your research.

amazing clarity!...blessed work!

They are in west TN as well!!!!! Pinson Mounds south of Jackson TN, and in the Shiloh Battlegrounds!

@LRRPFco52

4 жыл бұрын

General Johnston, who led the Army against the Saints in the Utah War, died at the Battle of......Shiloh in 1862.

Thank brother for your discovery my family we know the Book of Mormon is very true ,we know Joseph Smith is a true PROPHET OF GOD MY FAMILY WAS BLESSED THEY ALL SERVE A FULTIME MISSION I & My wife we serve 2 times as couple missionary our testimony grows and every time we read the book of MORMON

The Timuka and Kalusa were at Florida. They were related to the Caribbean natives. There are archaeological sites in GA which indicate that they could have been up into GA.

I'm new (very new, you're the first I've heard) to this theory, which I am now heavily leaning toward. Thank you so much for all your hard work in gleaning this information. I'm part Choctaw (only 16th) and this all really resonates with me. I was fine with the theory of mesoamerica and south America being the sites (I still am fine with it however I think it's probably not correct... but not 100%) but this theory makes much more sense to me. I always was confused by the lack of evidence at other sites. This blew me away, especially at this late date. I have some of my own theories as to why this is coming out now but I'm keeping it to myself for now. We're living in some very exciting times!

@lunettepepperglow7472

4 жыл бұрын

Posie75 Hi! I was once like you in that I, too, believed that the occurrences in the Book of Mormon (Jesus Christ in the land of Bountiful) took place in MesoAmerica. Also, I know that there must have been a missionary effort at that time that must have been incredible! However, after much study, and having the opportunity to attend Book of Mormon evidence conferences, that I am now a “One Hill” lady. If you have a chance, take a look at a KZread video by a wonderful, faithful saint, Amberly Nielsen; she goes through droves of scriptural evidence that the people of Nephi lived in the Heartland.

@Posie1970

4 жыл бұрын

@@lunettepepperglow7472 I will check her out! I sent my mom this video and she's convinced also... and my husband is also leaning that way lol. I know it doesn't have a bearing on our testimonies etc but it's such a neat thought that I could actually visit those spots fairly easily. It would feel like visiting Jerusalem and seeing the places Christ lived and died and was resurrected etc.

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

@@lunettepepperglow7472 Can you point me to any area of the United States where the occupants of the land had a sufficiently sophisticated writing system as would be required for them to record 1,000 years of history such as we find in The Book of Mormon? That sort of complex writing only happened south of the United States in the timeframe of The Book of Mormon.

@lunettepepperglow7472

4 жыл бұрын

Doug Stringer I’m confused by your comment. It seems in you answering your own question (as seen above), you are not interested in a genuine discourse; in other words, I’m not interested responding to Straw-man arguments. However, I also believe the church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints does not take a stance on an official declaration/location where Jesus Christ revealed himself to the Nephites/Lamanites is partly due to the church not being interested in creating further divides among the general church population. I do the research, come to my own conclusions and I respectfully allow others to do the same. That being said, I have plenty of evidences I could steer you towards. Peace and shalom to you, sir.

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

@@lunettepepperglow7472 You will have to first share your definition of "evidence" for us to have a meaningful discussion. So many in the Book of Mormon geography priestcraft business talk about evidences and proofs, but most of their points wouldn't endure a discussion with a real archaeologist or anthropologist. I'm a rank amateur, but I have found at least a half dozen lies in this Wayne May video so far. For example, the Internet is full of untrained yokels claiming some DNA study or another proves Middle Eastern blood among the (insert your favorite Indian tribe name here). Those making such claims have, with little actual knowledge, made shoddy, unprofessional assessments and it's embarrassing to the Church for the derision it brings from experts outside the Church. (Please note, I am not doubting the truthfulness of The Book of Mormon. It is true, but Nehorites like Wayne May and Rod Meldrum just make us look like fools. I am, in fact, thankful to have The Book of Mormon because now we know the perfect name for those who preach the doctrines of men for fame and fortune.) Why do you call my comment on a writing system a straw-man argument when the problem remains? The writing on the plates from which The Book of Mormon was translated demonstrate a sophistication not found among the usual suspects in the United States. As for division in the Church, those who commit priestcraft and spread the heartland lies are responsible for their own apostasy. That said, perhaps you are referring to this: "Individuals may have their own opinions regarding Book of Mormon geography and other such matters about which the Lord has not spoken. However, the First Presidency and Quorum of the Twelve Apostles urge leaders and members not to advocate those personal theories in any setting or manner that would imply either prophetic or Church support for those theories. All parties should strive to avoid contention on these matters." www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics/book-of-mormon-geography?lang=eng I have seen and read with my own eyes the way the way the heartlanders speak ill of the Church or its current leadership and do not like it. Of course, why should that sort of behavior surprise anyone? Further, If you claimed X and I showed you that X is wrong, how should I react to you if you once again declare X to be true, especially in an open forum such as the comment section of a KZread video? If these apostates want to be coddled, let them visit their bishops and repent of their priestcraft. You claimed above that you do your own research. What is your field of expertise?

Thank you.

“The glory of God is intelligence”. (D&C 93:36) This includes more than the knowledge in modern day academia. It encompasses all knowledge without beginning or end. Only an all knowing eternal being possess this; God the eternal Father the maker (Creator) of both Heaven & Earth. The seen & unseen. Thank you Wayne you’ve given us a glimpse into His realm.

Any information on the Etowah Indian Mounds in Cartersville, Georgia? Also, the Rock Eagle formation near Newton County, Georgia?

Thank you Wayne May for your untiring search to help us understand the ancient Americans (Nephrite and Lamanites)_who lived here before we came to the promised land. It is a beautiful message. It is inspiring to see what you shared with us. Thanks again.

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

Did you know that Wayne May mistakenly claims that the ancient city of Zarahemla is under Iowan dirt? Did you know that Wayne May knows he is wrong? Can you understand now how there are modern-day Nehorites?

wonderful presentation. it totally makes sense. thank you!!! so awesome!

Liked @ 14, I am grateful to our Father Jehovah hallowed be his name, for Wayne May sharing his research. I think I've seen enough parallels to safely say that Jared and his Brother families and friends, and also Lehi, his family and friends, and Mulek and his family and friends were lead by the Father and his Son to a choice and promised land and it was Ancient America. ---mww

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

Are you missing the conjunction “and” between Father and Jehovah in your opening sentence above? Your syntax makes me think otherwise, but thought it best to confirm. Our doctrine is that Elohim is the Father and Jehovah is His son. The promised land is all of the Western Hemisphere.

@gtcazusa

4 жыл бұрын

A testament to Joseph Smith's hebraic ignorance. And quite hilarious in conjunction with the complete absence even a shred of historical context in the drab and plagiaristic fiction that is the Book of Mormon. Elohim is not a proper noun, whatsoever. Jehovah Himself uses it many times when describing others. It is a rather general term for many beings that are not human. God was never a man, humans don't become angels and there is no marriage in heaven. Sorry. You've been lied to.

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

@@gtcazusa Call for reference.

@duanedimick3342

4 жыл бұрын

@@gtcazusa you know this how? Or are you just making up lies?

@gtcazusa

4 жыл бұрын

@@duanedimick3342 Are you calling Jesus a liar? Mark 12:18-27 Luke 20:27-40 Matthew 22:23-33 Or were you referring to something else?

What a remarkable information. Thank you for sharing this 🙏

Excellent presentation Wayne! Thank you

Great info thanks so much for your work it is truly enlightning

Thank you for this awesome lecture on the sites here in America. I'm a member of the church and love your work. Can you tell me where I could get your books . I would love to have the one that has this knowledge in it . I have a hard time picturing places and where they are going in the scriptures. I'm totally lost when it comes to directions or maps. ♥️

God bless you for your grate work to keep us informed. Thank you

Has anyone heard of Fort Mountain in Georgia. Supposedly it is of unknown origin but is certainly similar to the description of these forts. Just wondering if they might also be connected.

I am always amazed at Wayne Mays' ability to confuse secondary movements of BOM peoples to North America with the original, ARCHAEOLOGICAL and geographical evidence stated in the BOM!!

There are too many problems with the New York and the heartlands theory: 1) no mention of snow or ice storms, which I've experienced all my life; 2) where's the narrow neck of land? And 3) how is Cumorah in New York to the north of it? 4) the populations just didn't reach the millions required for that great final battle. Also, 5) what of the poisonous serpents that cut off the narrow neck for several years? What possible snake could slither through snow and ice, and don't give me that timber rattlesnake stuff. Those serpents hide in woodpiles and are very shy. And 6) where did the Nephites get their silver and gold, which they found in abundance? We know where Lehi and his family left from on the Arabian Peninsula, and it doesn't accommodate an Atlantic voyage. Lehi 7) made his journey across the Pacific Ocean, and he landed on the west coast of the Western Hemisphere. Thus, they could not have ended up in New York or the American heartlands without traveling thousands of miles. All of these concerns vanish in Mesoamerica. If any of you heartlands people want to answer these concerns, I will be happy to reconsider. But Joseph Smith did _not_ know where the Book of Mormon events took place, and if he didn't, Oliver Cowdery damn well didn't know. I've yet to have a heartlander attempt to answer these objections. Why? Because they are too invested in their theories. I'm not. But I know that if you remove Joseph Smith and other general authorities from their arguments, all their _other_ arguments fall flat. The church has a plethora of archaeologists, anthropologists, geologists, seismologists, historians and professors of ancient scripture, and the vast majority favor a Mesoamerican setting for the Book of Mormon. ..

Didn't the outside of the wall of the wood post have mud plaster or concrete to keep the enemy from setting the Fort wall on fire?

This is now your best video to date!!! (that I have seen) UNBELIEVABLE truly Revelation and TRUTH. Thank you :)

@THELDSLIFE

4 жыл бұрын

Could be. Feels right. Square piece enters the square hole no problem

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

Sadly, rivers don't flow uphill. Therefore, the contents of this video and much of what this snake-oil salesman is pushing are conjecture and deception.

@THELDSLIFE

4 жыл бұрын

@@TheShinyDog rivers flow one way now...

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

@@THELDSLIFE I have no idea why you feel the need to state the obvious. The fact remains that the ancient city of Zarahemla was not located in present-day Iowa.

@THELDSLIFE

4 жыл бұрын

@@TheShinyDog you have an unusual amount of energy worried about being correct when your energies could be best spent in being right

I really liked your lecture, but I wonder how do you confront your information toward Bro. Arthur J Kocherhan,s book NEPHI TO ZARAHEMLA, witch I consider very accurate and making a lot of sense.?

@THELDSLIFE

4 жыл бұрын

3 words for you "Law of Moses" these folks were said to have been Israelites and they brought with them the Law (Brass Plates) and they built altars of Stone, sacrificed animals, ate traditional Israelite foods, had Harvest Traditions (Barley, Wheat, Grapes and Olives) and those only grew in season for them BEST in N. America... animals: Horses, Goats, Lambs, Sheep, Rams, etc... hunting seasons and seasons of war. Some want to say that they landed in the land of Eternal Spring? U betcha! Florida works for me. But they didn't stay... they left and went northward. The Jeredites started out in the Great Lakes Region, perhaps... the Jeredites mentioned Elephants which were recently found in Canada nearby, etc...

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

​@@THELDSLIFE Goats! Look at the last word in each of the two scriptural references provided below. Weren't you the guy who mistakenly claimed that the Nephites could not keep the Law of Moses in Mesoamerica because no sheep bones have been found? That's an extremely weak argument because, so far, the excavation of every square inch of Mesoamerica has not yet been completed. When you survey everywhere, get back with us. Well, as the scriptures clearly teach, a goat works for the Passover which means you're wrong, again. I'm letting you know so you can be an adult and come back to the comments section here and apologize for the deception. You're welcome. Exodus 12:3 ¶ Speak ye unto all the congregation of Israel, saying, In the tenth day of this month they shall take to them every man a lamb, according to the house of their fathers, a lamb for an house: 4 And if the household be too little for the lamb, let him and his neighbour next unto his house take it according to the number of the souls; every man according to his eating shall make your count for the lamb. 5 Your lamb shall be without blemish, a male of the first year: ye shall take it out from the sheep, or from the goats: I Nephi 18: 25 And it came to pass that we did find upon the land of promise, as we journeyed in the wilderness, that there were beasts in the forests of every kind, both the cow and the ox, and the ass and the horse, and the goat and the wild goat,

@LRRPFco52

4 жыл бұрын

@@TheShinyDog I've spent quite a bit of time in Mesoamerica, to include the jungles of Mexico and Panama, as well as climbing many of the pyramids. It's really hard to do earthworks in the jungle, so you have to focus on stone if you want your structures to remain intact through the rainy seasons. Our maps were out-dated before being printed for a lot of the Panamanian jungle because of the continuous erosion and high precipitation cycle. DNA of the native peoples of Central America is Eastern Asiatic pre-Columbus and the slave trades. Construction methods for their terraced pyramids mirrors Southeast Asia, and their language and writing are obvious relatives of Asian civilizations. DNA of the Algonquin tribes is most closely related to an ancient mountainous tribe in Israel that seems to have evaded the diasporas. Cherokee and Cheyenne ceremonies and traditions mirror Jewish feasts and seasonal rituals. Micmac language parallels to Hebrew are astonishing. Earthworks all over the Eastern US match the descriptions in the Book of Mormon so perfectly, it is hard to weasel around explaining them away. Then you have the declaration by Joseph that Zion's Camp would directly go through the heart of the land of the Nephites. Land of liberty Land of the gentiles The Gospel would go forth from the land in the last days to all the earth No kings would rule over the Nation Hill Cumorah is in Western New York Rules out every nation in Central America so absolutely, that it's preposterous to hold onto the Mesoamerican theories. It was right under our noses the whole time.

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

@@LRRPFco52 Let's dissect your comments a bit, shall we? LRR: I've spent quite a bit of time in Mesoamerica, to include the jungles of Mexico and Panama, as well as climbing many of the pyramids. Doug: I could find people who have spent more than “quite a bit of time in Mesoamerica” so your appeal to some random length of time or any other form of expertise that you want to claim is meaningless. Have you ever been wrong, even a single time, in all your life? Why would your climbing a pyramid be relevant in any way? These are not rhetorical questions. Either you know and have peer-reviewed evidence that the ancient city of Zarahemla is located within the continental USA, or you do not. There is no middle ground. I note that you seem to be passionate about the subject, but tapping your heels together and believing really hard does not make you right. And that is why I do not support any of the theories on Book of Mormon geography. Besides, it matters not a whit. LRR: It's really hard to do earthworks in the jungle, so you have to focus on stone if you want your structures to remain intact through the rainy seasons. Doug: You reveal your lack of scholarship in the field. I recommend you read Charles Mann’s book 1491. You will learn about earthworks in the upper Amazon that were constructed more than a 1000 years ago. LRR: Our maps were out-dated before being printed for a lot of the Panamanian jungle because of the continuous erosion and high precipitation cycle. Doug: Call for reference. LRR: DNA of the native peoples of Central America is Eastern Asiatic pre-Columbus and the slave trades. Construction methods for their terraced pyramids mirrors Southeast Asia, and their language and writing are obvious relatives of Asian civilizations. Doug: Call for reference. LRR: DNA of the Algonquin tribes is most closely related to an ancient mountainous tribe in Israel that seems to have evaded the diasporas. Cherokee and Cheyenne ceremonies and traditions mirror Jewish feasts and seasonal rituals. Micmac language parallels to Hebrew are astonishing. Doug: None of that means you have connected any of those native American tribes to Lehi, Mulek or the Jaredites. Prove that first and then get back to me. Seriously, you may think you have some great bit of info, but none of it is proven. LRR: Earthworks all over the Eastern US match the descriptions in the Book of Mormon so perfectly, it is hard to weasel around explaining them away. Doug: No, it is not hard. However, the burden of proof lies on you and the others who make those claims. Find one piece of evidence that definitively proves the Nephite connection. LRR: Then you have the declaration by Joseph that Zion's Camp would directly go through the heart of the land of the Nephites. Doug: Joseph Smith later remarked in the Times and Seasons about the ruins in Central America after learning of a book by John Lloyd Stevens. Was he wrong during Zion’s Camp or was he wrong in 1842? LRR: Land of liberty Land of the gentiles The Gospel would go forth from the land in the last days to all the earth No kings would rule over the Nation Doug: That can all apply to North and South America. LRR: Hill Cumorah is in Western New York Doug: There is a hill named Cumorah, but you have not proven that there was never one anywhere else. LRR: Rules out every nation in Central America so absolutely, that it's preposterous to hold onto the Mesoamerican theories. It was right under our noses the whole time. Doug: Luckily, I do not hold onto any theories. However, the world wants truth and not passion and priestcrafting. Prove it and then use the big word preposterous, OK? In closing, Ezra Taft Benson, as President of the Quorum of the Twelve taught that a living prophet is worth more than a dead prophet. His comments were delivered in a speech at BYU. Spencer W. Kimball, as President of the Church, approved of the talk and made it the First Presidency Message in the Ensign magazine. So what has the living prophet said on the subject lately? Here you go… www.churchofjesuschrist.org/church/news/pray-keep-the-commandments-president-nelson-exhorts-guatemalan-saints?lang=eng&fbclid=IwAR1SmIyMelgdJawx8sJ_0NwPU0p35ml-7zHmPUqO-KcQVR2aw4IBokMZLr8 Call for reference does not mean some nonsense by guys like May or Meldrum. Show the viewers of this video that irrefutably connects Nephites to some artifacts within USA boundaries.

@LRRPFco52

4 жыл бұрын

@@TheShinyDog When you spend time on the ground in the areas being discussed, it gives you a better perspective of terrain, weather, and seasonal patterns. It's one thing to look at a map in passing or doing "scholarly" studies, and something entirely different to walk, climb, and survey the areas. Guatemala, Mexico, Nicaragua, Belize, Panama, and Honduras have been anything but lands of liberty. More like lands of terror, murder, government instability and abuse of their peoples, and high crime rates. The Gospel went to them, not from them. The Gospel was restored and poured out onto the earth from The United States, a unique land of liberty in the history of mankind if there ever was one. The comments about the early 1800s exploration of Central American pyramids were in context of the day where the treatment of native peoples by European-descent colonists looked at indigenous peoples as sub-human savages. Joseph was pointing out that the existence of cities in this hemisphere proved that the constant mentioning of cities in the BoM should not be a stumbling block for people of that day reading the BoM. Many would read and ask, "Where are all these cities?", since there were no published surveys of the Eastern US at the time talking about the vast Hopewell mound-building civilization. Most Americans and scholars to this day have never even heard of Cahokia mounds. You mentioned the Amazon, which is in South America and in the middle of a massive rainforest. There are all kinds of ancient mounds and pyramids near there too, but with lots of stonework to hold their foundations together, particularly if you look in Peru. Some pyramids in N Peru even used large leaf bags filled with rocks similar to Hesco barriers we had at bases overseas. I've been studying the ancient structures of Central and South America since the 1980s, and am familiar with 1491. Most of what there is to know about those areas has not been discovered. If you look at the recent LIDAR effort in Maya, it blew away most historical and archaeological findings and conclusions about the Mayans by locating thousands of undiscovered structures, canals, and highways throughout their region. So there is always a lot of work to do in archaeology. It's all fascinating, but not necessary to have a testimony of the truthfulness of the Book of Mormon. I gained that when I was 12, and it changed my life. I always wondered where these events transpired as I read it, especially the logging efforts into the land northward, where the ship-building efforts of Hagoth ended up, and where the sea east, sea west, sea north, and sea south were, along with the river Sidon. It's also safe to state the geography of the hemisphere was quite different in many ways in those times, and we do have waterline and sedimentary layer geological evidence to indicate how different the Mississippi Basin, Gulf of Mexico, and Great Lakes regions were. Plate tectonics and massive upheavals in the crust over the past 2600 years makes things even more difficult to draw a map of what the Americas would have looked like in 600 BC, and 33 A.D. This is something that interests me lately. There are some good records of varying water lines of the great lakes going back, but it's difficult to say exactly what they looked like once the variables of cataclysmic events are thrown in. For DNA evidence, one of the biggest mistakes I see in a lot of the maps is that maps are a snap-shot in time. Many of the native tribes in the Western US were Eastern US in origin who were forcibly removed and driven from the Easten Seaboard and inner valleys West of the Appalachians, the Great Lakes, and Deep South, ending up in the Dakotas, Oklahoma, and drier climates quite foreign to their ancestors. The Cherokee oral history asserts that their ancestors came across the Atlantic and landed in the Southeast region that is now the US. Is it also a coincidence that they have 12 elders in their tribal organization, and rituals that mimic Hebrew ceremonies? I actually clicked and read the link you posted. Maybe I missed your intent, but I didn't find any key words or references in it specific to this conversation outside of "Guatemala". No matter, the Book of Mormon is true and the most important book I have read and continue to study, not because of geography, but the focus on testifying of the Divinity of our Lord and Saviour, Jesus Christ. The geography is interesting to ponder and study. It just never seemed to fit right looking at maps of Central America.

Awesome. Revisiting here. Finally got to watch the entire video. Monday - May 10, 2021.

Were the ditches for temples and sacred places not reversed, as in the ditch on the inside and the berm without?

As always, carefully researched and the message wonderfully delivered.

@THELDSLIFE

4 жыл бұрын

Always

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

There is absolutely no evidence of what he's claiming. May twists the words of J. Smith, Jr., to make his scam sound true. And the use of the American flag image at the end is pure exploitation. The promised land is the Western Hemisphere, in its entirety...which is a separate issue from where the Nephites flourished and then fell out of favor with God. Too long Americans have chanted, "USA! USA! USA! We're #1!" Hasn't Covid-19 taught everyone, especially the LDS that America, like the Nephite and Jaredite civilizations before us, is about to be humbled to the dust? $23 trillion in debt (hundreds of trillions more in unfunded liabilities) and everyone walks around with their chest puffed out. That ain't how you achieve prosperity. Wait until the modern-day Gadiantons start another war that leads to more domestic suffering. Will you still want to scratch dirt in Iowa? Pride leads to a fall. The higher the pride, the bigger the fall.

@jakerainey1396

3 жыл бұрын

Very good researcher. Some people can't stand that the USA is the promise land. What country in South America is known to be a land of liberty?

Question: at minute 53:44 there is a plat map of the Mississippi River showing the islands. What year was this map?

I like your presentation. A previous comment objects to limited objections. Thank you for limiting negative, objections, and anti-Book of Mormon comments, there are plenty of those else where. It's nice to scroll thru comments without having to skim over hateful objectional diatribes.

@funkycatholic6927

3 жыл бұрын

I am not an anti book of mormon commenter, I believe in the Book of Mormon, just think that anyone who believes May Wayne is a gullible idiot.

Thank you sir. you open minds and hearts...

How compelling, I love it.

I have to believe that many of the mounds are because of extreme winter and spring flooding waters. Straight across the river from the temple the area looks like extreme flood plains. May have been a way to have buildings on it or to get live stock out of high water??

My Arawak ancestors were related to the Timuka and Kalusa of To.

@carlymahoney8175

4 жыл бұрын

Man Q A We

Great talk and presentation

I used to love your stuff, Wayne, until I learned that JS knew about the Hopewell long before the BOM was ever created.

Great. Do a. Idea on how the book of Abraham is actually a Book of Breathings for common burial. And one question: if there was a great battle with thousands of casualties, where is....anything? No weapons, zero records, not a single remain.

I want to come to your next conference in Utah. How do I know when that will be?

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

@@makrsk09 That page promotes priestcraft which is an abomination.

In the "History of Cayuga County (New York)", by Elliot G. Storke, there's a passage describing one of the townships in the southern portion of the county called "Locke". Caucasian settlers from the east first arrived in the late 1700's. On a hillside about 1/2 to 1 mile west of the current village of Locke, there were some fortifications. Early settlers asked the local Native Americans about them, who built them. The response was, "We don't know, they were here when we got here."

Brother Wayne May you're a good man. Men like you are who belong in these fields. We know why many archeologists and historians fight these undeniable facts and truths. They're pride won't allow them to read The Book of Mormon in humility asking God for confirmation that it is true. They just continue to rely on men for truth. They're whole lives would wind up being a fight against the truth. They can't humble themselves down enough to find the truth. Those who don't believe in God just can't humble down to find the truth. And those of other Christian denominations are precisely guilty of the verses in scriptures "Having a form of Godliness but denying the power thereof" they believe in God and claim all is well, yet refuse to recognize they minimize their Gods power and abilities to communicate truth to us. Keep on keeping on Brother May!

Mr. May, i recently read about the 'gemara' , which is rabbinical analysis and commentary on the Misnah and is considered 'the final or definitive word'. I was struck at the similarity in pronunciation to 'cumorah' so I googled it and discovered that' gemara' is derived from the Hebrew verb 'gamar', which means to finish or complete. The Ashkenazi pronounce it 'Gemora'. Coincidence? I think not. Another piece of evidence that the Hill Cumorah is where the Nephite civilization was 'finished or completed'.

Excellent video! Thank you

Wayne May’s contribution to this gospel is immeasurable. He has dedicated his life to this work, and has edified not only members of the church, but others as well. God bless you, Wayne.

Amazing ditch/mound accuracies 👏🏽👏🏾 finding actual postmolds as it was written in the book of Mormon is great and all.. finding any or even just one evidence that the "Great battle" the thousands upon thousands of casualties & not one person left something behind? That too is amazing.

There is some very fine research and information presented here, which is appreciated. But because we have conclusive evidence that Moroni's Cumorah (Mormon's) was in New York, that does not prove that the narrow neck of land and Zarahemla were north of Adam-ondi-Ahman, or any where that near Cumorah. You can study my manuscript on file at the BYU Maxwell Institute entitled, “Where Does the Two Cumorah Theory Stand?,” by L. La Mar Adams, which shows how the Prophet Joseph and Book of Mormon passages puts the narrow neck of land and Zarahemla far south of Missouri, and not in that Jaredite land (the 3 nations existed, overlapped, but not in the same land, for 400 years). To say that the Nephits did not exist at least as far south as Central America, in addition to their later living in the US area, is not only contradicting the Prophet Joseph, but a number of Book of Mormon passages.

Thank you thank you for your report . The book of mormon is true !

One Hill. I don't know who got the idea that there were two hills. There's one Hill and it's in New York. Listen to the prophets, they said it's one Hill. ( Scholars at BYU invented the Mexico story. Even Hugh Nibley said it's not in Mexico, it's here in New York infact the whole Lamanite story happened in North America , listen to what the prophets say about it.)

Brilliant!

Sewage and garbage would have been put in the ditches to make the places septic.

What’s shocking is that Joseph Smith is referenced, but no one and I mean no one references what he personally said. With research and study one would find that Joseph received revelations pertaining to the Nephite nation. He then shared some of these revelations. One revelation in particular he says that Lehi landed a little south of the Isthmus of Darien which is now the Isthmus of Panama. Another he says that the Hill Cumorah in the Book of Mormon is the same Hill Cumorah he found the plates. That there shatters the idea that two Hills exist. Even the early leaders spoke as if there was one Hill. Joseph Fielding Smith even talks about how the the Book of Mormon focuses primarily around Central and South America. Sorry, but I will take the revelatory words of the Prophets over the philosophies of men.

Oneida means place of the great slaughter. Pequot means the great destroyer.

In Alma 63 and Helaman 3:3-5,12-16 Nephites left Zarahemla, and started migrating to the north country, both by land and by sea, as early as when King Mosiah 1, interpreted the Jaredite record and mentioned a choice land in the north country, where a New Jerusalem would be built. Once word got out about this newly heard-of-choice land in the north; the floodgates were open and groups of Nephites by the thousands (including converted Lamanites), migrated to the north country, in time filled the entire north country where habitable. This explains how a Zelph and other descendants of converted Lamanites were in the north country during the last struggles. Remember these Nephites departed FROM the lands of the main story-line of the Book of Mormon Nephites, the lands of Zarahemla. Also note, we know there is a sea, not just land, between Zarahemla and the New Jerusalem in the north country. Yes, there are plains of the Nephites in the north country, long before Christ visited. It's all accounted for in the book. There are no contradictions by Joseph, and no mental gymnastics are required to see that it all fits the book's narrative. Both the Book of Mormon and Joseph's plains of the Nephites, along with the Zelph comments, are in agreement and all fit the book's script of account. There are even statements in the BOM narration that signal there was commerce trade happening between the main storyline Book of Mormon land Nephites of Zarahemla and the migrant Nephites settlement groups in the north country. It's all in the book. The book itself, says we will find evidence of Nephite cultures all across north America, yet this northern Nephite evidence, is not the evidence of the main Nephites cultures of the land of Zarahemla, aka Bountiful, aka, Book of Mormon central lands. In the last struggles of the Nephites, Moroni tells us of the death of all his people gathered at Cumorah to battle. However, he then gives us updates as he wanders for about 30-36 years, hiding from place to place; he describes the terrible carnage that he witnesses all across the continent as he wanders; we learn that not all Nephites were killed at Cumorah, that Lamanites are now fighting each other and continue to put to death all Nephites across the continent who won't deny Christ. Moroni 1. When the Lamanite carnage continued to spread across the north country, yes, Zelph, living among Nephites, was a warrior who fought to defend his lands and people. However, Zelph didn’t die at the battle of Cumorah, let that sink in. So we know other battles were happening across the continent. Another insightful tidbit found in Mormon 1:6, reads as though Mormon was raised in the north country until he was eleven, at which time his father moved the family "into the land southward, even to the land of Zarahemla”, Book of Mormon central land. The heartland, is most likely the north country that thousands of Nephite migrated to, and the Great Lakes are most likely the large bodies of water mentioned in Helaman 3:4. Keep in mind, many migrators, crossed a sea before eventually traveling far enough to discover these large bodies of water. The large bodies of water are not the sea they crossed. Nephites migrated north, from Zarahemla, which means Zarahemla is South of New Jerusalem, NOT north of New Jerusalem, not east of it, not west of it, and certainly not across the river from Nauvoo in Iowa. Look at a map. And no, the earthquake at the Lord's crucifixion didn't change the poles. Here’s a pearl: D&C 84 declares, the New Jerusalem will be built in Independence Missouri, so we know the BOM-Zarahemla is south of Independence Missouri, and don't forget there is also a sea somewhere between them, most likely the Gulf. Question: If Zarahemla is near the narrow neck of land where thousands of Nephites sailed from, to go to the north country, if the narrow neck of land is between any of the Great Lakes, and any one of the Great Lakes was the sea some of the migrating Nephites crossed to get to the north country, where would that place the location of New Jerusalem? (Canada?? it doesn't fit the narrative). Nine years after the printing of the BOM, years after Moroni met with Joseph each year at the hill as described in Joseph's history, now canonized in the Pearl of Great Price, neither Joseph nor Moroni ever refers to the hill where Moroni hides the plates and where Joseph retrieved the plates as Cumorah, it's not mentioned there. In the BOM itself, Moroni never says he hid them in Cumorah, like his father did the other plates. Moroni, simply says he would hide the record in the earth. The hill in New York was first referred to as Cumorah many years later by other church members such as Oliver; NOT by Joseph. It was an endearing name to refer to the hill as Cumorah, much like, Mt Nebo south of Utah Lake is not the same Mt Nebo Moses stood upon overlooking the Promise Valley of the Hebrews. Joseph was fine with them calling the hill after the original Hill; no harm no foul. It was/is only an endearing name used by the saints. Joseph, John, & Wilford declared & published on the record Times and Seasons October 1, 1842, Zarahemla is in Central America, in the land of Guatemala; they did not name the exact location. And yes, there are ALSO plains of Nephites all across North America, it's all accounted for in the Book! The Book of Mormon is another volume of scripture, that testifies of Jesus Christ and His gospel. That's the message of the Book, and it's true! Among the writings of that message, are descriptions of where it took place. Moroni and Mormon included the details necessary and it all fits, and it even accommodates a Zelph-type story of a converted Lamanite. The Book of Mormon is a true record! Love, Peace & best wishes to all.

do the mormons teach who the kenites are , iam new to this

@THELDSLIFE

4 жыл бұрын

some of us correctly identify book of Mormon lands/archaeology as Hopewell, yes

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

Flee now. Take your family by the hand and flee this deception.

@THELDSLIFE

4 жыл бұрын

@@TheShinyDog www.bookofmormonpromisedland.com/Narrow%20Neck.htm

@THELDSLIFE

4 жыл бұрын

kzread.info/dash/bejne/ooaE0tOKZJfXeNI.html

@lindacrawford7904

4 жыл бұрын

@@TheShinyDog Flee? From what? Our faith is built on the premise that we search things out in our minds and take those findings to the Lord in faith for ratification.

Great to see that people around the americas knew who Christ was, even in Mesoamerica and south america. I guess we will find out where the nephites lived in the next life. East Star Man(eastern states), Kukuclan (Mexico Yucutan), Quetzalcoatl (Teotihuacan Near Mexico City), Viracocha (God in Peru), while their neighbours the Aymara called him Hyustus.) In Bolivia he was known as the "God of the Wind") (These are some of the names of the God but there are many more!)

Merry Christmas! God became a man in the person of Jesus. Matthew 1:23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

@fayelewis5476

3 жыл бұрын

@@MatthewMartone-rr6lj Yes. Jesus and his Father are two different people, but they are both God. God is one essence and three persons. "Baptizing them in the name (singular) of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit."

The very thing the experts agree on with the book of Mormon shows they are not fake. The mathematical layout of the cities, and the calender. Shows they were civilized before Columbus

I grew up in the Midwest and I know that the winters can be severe, especially around the Great Lakes area. You would think that someone in the Book of Mormon would have written about these cold winter with its ice and snow. Also, I lived in a city where they excavated one of the Indian mounds. They found stone tools, stone axe heads, etc. There was no evidence of any type of metal objects that you read of in the Book of Mormon. And yes! Over a period of time there probably were Nepites and Lamanites that ventured northward and eastward.

@amynazza

Жыл бұрын

What were the winters like 2000 years ago when the lakes were absolutely huge compared to today? Not arguing just curious.

Read Alma 50, look at the Ohio earthworks. Read Alma 53-5 compare it to the great circle. Is it not the prison facility Teancum caused to be built?

🙂👍

I am an active member of the church. I have a personal testimony of the Book of Mormon and Joseph Smith, but one thing I do not agree is the fact that the book of Mormon mention the look of the Lamanites. The book of Mormon describes them as we found in Mosiah 10: 11-17. Now here he mentioned Southern Illinois. Which is cold and cruel in the winter.

@jasonthatcher3685

4 жыл бұрын

He addresses that in some of the other videos that have been uploaded. There is documented evidence that shows there has been a polar shift between then and now and that it use to be much warmer in the northern hemisphere (despite what the climate scientists are now saying), closer to a tropical climate.

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

@@jasonthatcher3685 He’s making stuff up. Why do you fall for it?

@THELDSLIFE

4 жыл бұрын

What time of year did they go to war? Usually near the 1st month (or NISSAN) which is in the spring time and it's starting to heat up in the midwest. You mean to tell me that people dont take their shirts off in late april/early may? Nowhere does it say that the lamanites were always mostly shirtless... but during times of war? That's when they remove clothing because .. heat...

@THELDSLIFE

4 жыл бұрын

@@jasonthatcher3685 well in times of war or NISSAN which is the first month of their year but for us, Aprol, it would already be warm enough to go shirtless.

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

@@THELDSLIFE But nothing you wrote proves Zarahemla of Nephite days was on the Mississippi.

Brigham Young told a congregation in St. George, Utah that the Gadianton Robbers lived there in the surrounding hills, so one must wonder...

There were mounds just a few miles away from Joseph Smith's house. He grew up wondering about the mounds. The fact that the Book of Mormon refers to mounds is, if anything, a sign that Joseph Smith wrote that because he knew about the mounds already. This video is confusing for me.

1:23 that's sickening to see how they clear the brush off an ancient man made structure!

@TheSuicidalRectums

4 жыл бұрын

It will grow back. 😀

Wanna bet that the changes in water depth and swamp coverage in that area came about due to the 535 AD climate change event?

I grew up with a Status of Nephi in my back yard along with 4 more.. How do get in touch with someone about this?? There are more evidence. yes It is true

@johnlewis6526

3 жыл бұрын

Is this actually true?

Zarahemla . where is it ? chariots and horses , steel sword.... all missing

@richarner3856

2 ай бұрын

Here's a clue...Tattoo and Mr. Rourke are there

@markdavison7069

2 ай бұрын

@@richarner3856 LOL fantasy Island

Kind of an interesting coincidence that every 1800s church site the Saints were led to after 1830 has these Hopewell sites also at them or very close by. I wouldn't be surprised if you find them at every one of the sites they were led to. Its clever.

@noahriding5780

4 жыл бұрын

That's a very, very interesting question. I think some of these sites are yet to be discovered. But there's a very clear pattern there.

So where did Hagoth go?

@42N8_1

4 жыл бұрын

Evidence shows that large portions of North America were covered by waters. It did not look the same as it does today. Mainly the western portions of North America were under water.

@THELDSLIFE

4 жыл бұрын

i read an interesting article... it bears sharing www.bookofmormonpromisedland.com/Narrow%20Neck.htm?fbclid=IwAR3HvSYq8JOlfsU0aFoqLOWFyEJAmveQnqI-6rPSSfElu726CWqlk0i3PyU

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

@@42N8_1 And that would be so long before Lehi and family showed up. Don’t just make stuff up. Write what you know to be accurate or you’ll be just as guilty as May and Meldrum for spreading deception.

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

@@THELDSLIFE Uhm, you do know that Priestcrafter May and Priestcrafter Olive are competing against each other for the limited amount of naive American Latter Day Aints, don’t you? They can’t both be right, and in fact, they are both wrong.

@THELDSLIFE

4 жыл бұрын

@@42N8_1 so the great lakes were even greater lakes? I read essays and look for parallels... so many here. See also: www.bookofmormonpromisedland.com/Narrow%20Neck.htm People aren't going to stop finding artifacts, bones, or records by this HopeWell nation which surfaced as being from around 500BC - 400AD Hopewell is the name of the family farm where some of the first artifacts were found and it's an interesting name but also can't be a coincidence. Read essays and look more in our backyard but if not go to Chichen Itza and find nothing Hebrew there . There is a lot of possible things to see in the Great Lakes Heartland of America region

Looks very good .. but what about DNA ? do they have any ?

All I hear about is "models." Many of these models are very far apart. What seems to be missing is any evidence of the people groups that are claimed to have existed. The references in the BoM to places are quite vague and it seems like these "models" are simply places where one can loosely place the stories at. Now I understand that, in faith, Mormons are trying to locate the lands spoken of in their book but for any of this to have any meaning there must be direct evidence to the story and not just similarities.

There is a Mexican Archeologist, non-LDS that has an interesting theory. Based on records and paintings of the Hopis, Mayans, Aztecs. He states Native Americans in Mexico, Guatemala, came from the North. Which make sense. After the last battle and dead of Moroni. Probably the Lamanites moved all over ,from North to South and became the Mayans, Aztecs, Inkas, etc.

More industrial and better looking as well

@29:30 awesom!

I recently had, what I can best describe as a "verbal confrontation" with a curator at a copper culture exhibit hall. I proposed a theory that she evidently had strong feelings against. Yours is a great question: WHY do these, so called "experts", go ballistic when someone brings up a theory that does not fit their paradigm? Thanks for a great and very enlightening presentation!

@paulbrodie331

2 жыл бұрын

People become attached to their beliefs to the point of taking it personally when their beliefs are questioned. This seems applicable across science, religion, politics, etc.

When I watch the New BOM series. I love it. Mesoamerican American Architecture's influence doesn't seem right to me, especially all the stonework. Most of this type of stone architecture didn't take place in N. America, so why are set designers using it in the film? Could it be the plaster/cement the Nephites and Laminites used to put over the wood city walls and buildings were dressed to look like carved stone? I do know that concrete and plaster lasts longer and will not fall off easily if the first layer is rough with called a scratch coat. the second cost can then be put on smooth and if grooved will reduce cracking to release in stress points and will stay within the groves thus fake stone walls. You do see in Meso America the method of rough stones laid in concrete then plastered over to resemble stone block walls but not before 200-600 AD. The great Inca and Aztec Empires were not before 600AD up to 1600AD well after the Nephite period. So do BYU Professors still preach the Meso American Nephite inhabited Time-line? When there is so much in North America that fits the description even Indian oral tradition, why?

@THELDSLIFE

4 жыл бұрын

altars were made from stone and not cut to fit should those altars be from faithful Israelites who lived the law of Moses... unless these guys were radicals with disregard for the Law of Moses.

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

@@THELDSLIFE What do you know about the Law of Moses? You got the whole sheep/Passover topic wrong.

At 9:12 in the video May shows a hill or something with erosion that could have occurred in the past 10 years and declares it ancient. Such a shyster.

Mulkites not Nephites both started about the same time Nephites in panama need to go bigger heard story one the three Nephites and him saying he was from Texas there are Mounds on the red river in cooke county in Texas plus a rock with funny writing on it

& one of the Civilized Nations was called Oneida, very similar to Oneida.

Nephites were generally in the north while the Lamanites were generally in the south.

Nobody sure as hell isn't going to Guatemala. The Promise Land is where it's always been. North America. 🇺🇸

O'shiloh Was changed to ohio 1862,

Shawnee Warrior Chief Tecums"eh"

I believe your North American Book of Mormon lands , but what have you missed ? 3 Nephi 8 : 14 And many great and notable cities were sunk, and many were burned, and many were shaken till the buildings thereof had fallen to the earth, and the inhabitants thereof were slain, and the places were left desolate What Great and noble cities with crumbling buildings are in your research ? You have truth , but have missed what’s right in front of you

@horton6951

4 жыл бұрын

Travis Stowell I’m well aware of the truth , it’s children like yourself that are blinded with hate .

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

@@horton6951 If you subscribe to May then you do not know the truth. Alma chapter 56, among other places, makes it clear that the Mississippi River is not the River Sidon.

@horton6951

4 жыл бұрын

Doug Stringer Oh , Wayne is correct in his ideas , he’s just missing huge truths and proofs right in front of his eyes . The sticks and mounds and pottery are nothing compared to what had been covered up through the years by our rulers , the great inheritors of the 1700-1800s .. But absolutely Im a 110% believer in Book of Mormon Truth .. research raftsmans journal June 1858 , “ antiquities in America” there’s our real Book of Mormon people’s .

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

@@horton6951 There are dozens of images in June 1858 issues of the Raftsmans Journal. Can you help a brother out and narrow my search down a bit?

@horton6951

4 жыл бұрын

Doug Stringer I have it printed ,but I’ll definitely try to find it and get a link .. it changed my life as far as history goes .

Its a ho said ah ho like we n' nay a ho. Which is i am of the great spirit.

What caused the Ozarks a giant mound to form?

Here's the link to a lame John Lefgren video that got the crushing it deserved: kzread.info/dash/bejne/q4CTpqqyg7edZcY.html Where is Amnihu? Who is Amlici? Amlici and his followers failed to make him king over the Nephites when a national referendum went against this wicked disciple of Nehor. (Alma 2:1, 7) Amlici’s followers made him their own king anyway. (Alma 2:9) He prepared his people for battle, but apparently did so outside of the confines of the city of Zarahemla. (Alma 2:10, 14) Note that the Amlicites did not start the battle in Zarahemla but chose to take up their position across the Sidon. Where is the hill Amnihu in relation to Zarahemla? The hill Amnihu is mentioned by name only once. It was located east of the river Sidon. (Alma 2:15) We do not know what time the battle between the Nephites and the dissenting Amlicites began. However, after terrible losses among the Amlicites, these Nehorites began to flee. (Alma 2:18) After they took flight, the Amlicites were pursued “all that day” and many more were slaughtered. (Alma 2:19) After running for their very lives all day, the Amlicites just kept on running while Alma decided to pitch tents and rest for the night. Note that after beginning the fight at the hill Amnihu and chasing those Amlicites “all that day,” the Nephites were in the valley of Gideon (more on that location later). (Alma 2:20) Even after a successful routing of his enemies, Alma knew that he must not let his guard down, so he sent spies to follow the Amlicite army. (Alma 2:21) The next day, the spies returned “in great haste” and filled with fear. (Alma 2:23) The Amlicites had somehow hooked up with a Lamanite army in a land at a higher elevation called Minon which is on the way towards the land of Nephi. The newly combined forces were now making a beeline towards Zarahemla. (Alma 2:24) Alma and his army needed to cross the river Sidon and return to Zarahemla to prevent the Lamanites and Amlicites from capturing the city. (Alma 2:26) Alma and his army did not make it into the relative safety of Zarahemla’s walls. As they were crossing the Sidon, the armies of the Lamanites and Amlicites attacked Alma’s forces. (Alma 2:27) Alma and his army are ultimately victorious after killing Amlici and routing the combined enemy forces. (Alma 2:28-37) Alma’s defense of his people and their liberties is one of those great stories found in the Book of Mormon. Let us consider the applicable verses before us. For the current discussion, there are a couple points quite germane to this discussion. Notice that the land of Minon is on the way to the land of Nephi and it is “above the land of Zarahemla.” So not only is Minon at a higher elevation than, it is also south of, Zarahemla. This is the death knell to the broken, dishonest, and impossible claim by the Zarahemla Site operators that the Mississippi River is the river Sidon. Water does not run uphill. The land of Nephi is south of the land of Zarahemla. Therefore, the Sidon must flow from south to north. Conclusion: The Zarahemla Site people are just making stuff up. They only pretend to know where the hill Amnihu was located. The fake pin they have dropped on the Google Map for Amnihu cannot be right. That hill could not be that close, or it would not have taken a whole day of chasing Amlicites for Alma’s forces to arrive in the valley of Gideon. How fast can you run if someone with a sword is chasing you? Why would the Zarahemla Site conspirators try to deceive people like that? Well, ask Nehor; he knows. The secondary question here is: Why do college professors (a shout out to my boys, Elfgren and The Price Is Wrong) have such poor reading comprehension skills? Addendum 1: Even though the battle was over, there was a lot of clean up to be done. The bodies of the dead Amlicites and Lamanites were thrown into the river. The river’s flow must have been strong enough to flush the bodies and the bad ideas of the heartland scam all the way to the sea. (Alma 3:3) Addendum 2: How far away was the valley/city of Gideon from Zarahemla? Alma did not rest long after the battle. The good high priest over all the church went to work again. Beginning first in Zarahemla (Alma 5) and then in Gideon (Alma 7), he endeavored to bring his fellow church members to Christ. That is, after all, the whole purpose of The Book of Mormon. Why then do May and Meldrum and Elfgren and Price strive to pull people off the path and into the heretical weeds? It does not matter where Zarahemla was. If the Lord wanted us to find indisputable proof of the location of Zarahemla, we already would have. Gideon was east of the river Sidon seemingly opposite of Zarahemla. (Alma 6:7) That Amnihu pin in this lame video is way too close I would say for marathon distances.

There are 3 groups of people in the Church that I have a hard time trying to reason with: 1-Flat Earthers, 2-Evolutionists and 3-Heartlanders. No one is denying people lived in these areas during the times suggested. They may even have Hebrew origins, as some have tried to prove, but there is no way under heaven that the people in the so-called Heartland Model are from the Book of Mormon. You have to deny every single geographical reference in the book itself to believe it happened in an area that encompasses New York down to Florida and east to Nebraska. You can’t take them individually and say this happened here and then jump hundreds of miles away and say, this happened there. They all have to work together. At 6:30 he talks about the “Big 8” and claim these are only in the Heartland. Have you not seen the latest LIDAR scans of Guatemala? I’m not going to continue with the critique as I am sure it will not be accepted. I’ve studied this for over 30 years and it still baffles me that people believe this. There is no reason to force it to fit the Heartland Model!

@themikeflanders3470

4 жыл бұрын

Agreed. The recent lidar scans of South America show massive civilizations hidden under the canopy. The lidar shows great fortified cities with embankments around them. It was quite the discovery a year or two ago. www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2018/02/02/582664327/game-changer-maya-cities-unearthed-in-guatemala-forest-using-lasers

@kellysmithmarketing

4 жыл бұрын

@@themikeflanders3470 And notice all the Raised up ROADS, just like in the Book of Mormon, but not in the Heartland Models that I have seen.

@themikeflanders3470

4 жыл бұрын

@@kellysmithmarketing Spot on Kelly.

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

I'm so glad to find others who can see through the heartland scam.

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

@@themikeflanders3470 Spot on OWHHO!

In the Heart of Satan all truth is covered.

Wow, the Druids were in North America

@tatata1543

4 жыл бұрын

5th Gear Video No, they really weren’t.

I just noticed that Wayne's laptop has a sticker on the lid with Square, Visa & Mastercard logos prominently displayed. Priestcrafting made easy. Please remember what the Church teaches about going in debt.

Grateful for the BLOCK button, too much NON Christlike name calling and browbeating such from one ‘member’

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

Aw, did it hurt your feelings to read the truth?

That's very interesting.. though I've never spoke about or against any church teachings.. and that that is my only memory of the Lord and Mormon heritage which has stayed with me...I always thought in my heart that the Lehi/nephi were in middle America as taught by the saints..if I remember correctly...this is my only memory and knowledge and early learning I am aware of..I thought well maybe Moroni went for a long walk a very long walk...I always thought that.. this more modern interpretation and cognitive style appears more cohesive..I do not know of this stuff.. good luck God bless..?

@TheShinyDog

4 жыл бұрын

"This stuff" is wrong. The river Sidon, mentioned in The Book of Mormon, flowed north. That's all you need to know that the heartland theory is a scam.

54:04 "Okay now, here's the fun stuff." kzread.info/dash/bejne/rJedy5uJY73KZdo.html

Disagree with his assertion that the dates of the mound building civilizations perfectly match the Book of Mormon. We know from the Book of Mormon that people lived in the Book of Mormon lands for thousands of years before the Nephites (the Jaredites) and that the Lamanites continued to live in the land afterward. A civilization that only matches the time line of the Nephite civilization seems like it could be somehow connected to the Nephites but would not be the lands we read that all these other Book of Mormon civilizations lived in. Mesoamerican civilization time lines fit much better in this regard.

@kentlefevre5279

4 жыл бұрын

For the portion of the book of Mormon that recounts the Jaradite history you’ll want to review the information on the ancient North American Adena people in the Great Lakes area whose history closely parallels the timeline of the Book of Mormon record of the Jaradites, the geography of where their civilization ended, and including how their ancestors arrived in the region from across the ocean via “turtle boats”.

I am issuing a call for any supporter of the heartland theory to provide clear, unequivocal evidence that when Joseph Smith, Jr., issued the directive to name the area across from Nauvoo as Zarahemla, as found in The Doctrine and Covenants 125:3, that he did so because he knew it was the same place where the city of Zarahemla existed in its setting in The Book of Mormon. For the removal of doubt, I am calling for proof that Joseph knew and taught that the ancient city of Zarahemla was in the State currently known as Iowa on the river currently known as Mississippi. In other words, you must prove that Joseph was not simply attaching a well-known place name from The Book of Mormon to an area under Latter Day Saint control, but that he was restoring the name of that piece of ground. Please note that the highly-esteemed historian Richard Bushman says the title of Zarahemla simply applies to a Stake that Smith intended to be created there in a town called Montrose. You must prove Bushman wrong. Good luck, because, you know, the Mississippi River flows south.

FOR SURE THE TRUE LAMANITES WILL BE X2a found in Northern Israel but have shifted since those B of M days, modern times have moved many Jews all over the world but I have found the Jewish people I have met as soon as I told them of my native tribal lines (Mohawk/Ojiibwa) there has been a deep spiritual embracing! I have danced (in costume) for years & have found MANY Jewish anthropologists working with the tribes, but we MUST remember, none of our people are in Mexico, Central, or South America. We stop at the border, but are heavily in Canada, myself as well!