Gotta keep getting all my etho content from Iskall

@levi8971

5 ай бұрын

Amen

@davidhenry31

5 ай бұрын

I want etho to do a vault hunter series like he did with project ozone so badly. I would watch that over and over

@iossaiken

5 ай бұрын

Etho's next vid will have him at Lv100...

@txseric6294

5 ай бұрын

@@davidhenry31 I'm really hoping Etho and Iskall do a skyvault playthrough together.

@MrEightygrit

5 ай бұрын

No offense to Iskall. But I agree! Gotta get some Etho!

Iskall: "I am going on real holidays so I won't play" Also iskall: " Sooo... let's play some vault hunters"

@justaregularrhino6529

5 ай бұрын

i think this is all 1 or 2 sessions lol

@batt3ryac1d

5 ай бұрын

He's definitely a fiend for it 😅

@Eis_

5 ай бұрын

*Best friend asks to sleep over and play games* Also Iskall: "Gotta Vault"

@rasmusdampedersen6822

5 ай бұрын

"uploads pretty much everyday" :D

@zacaryhellings9507

5 ай бұрын

​@justaregularrhino6529 so far it's his 2nd session this behind the scenes

A solution to the treasure key door is to have the gem shape on the door for those who can't see the different greens and those who are colorblind . Or when you hold the key and the door is in your line of sight it gets hilighted.

@Lu-yx2vj

5 ай бұрын

That's a great idea

@seerm1744

5 ай бұрын

you can also change the shape of the keys, make sure the same color keys are very differently shaped, would do this between colors too for accessibility, but def make sure those of similar color are very diff shapes to each other. Would add on that the doors should feature same the shape as the keys or some way to match the keys besides color.

@KalThass

5 ай бұрын

As someone with red-green colour blindness I love this idea.

@justcallmeness

5 ай бұрын

Yes! Shapes are good!

@Tetrini

5 ай бұрын

@@seerm1744 or an option for like, a texture that has the gem with a smaller key icon on the corner or vice verse

Iskall was standing right next to the new vault portal in his office and still flew down to the beach to use the old one.. I feel personally attacked.

Hearing etho and Iskall talk dev stuff is the best part of etho finally playing vault hunters like every single time they play together I can’t help but stop what I’m doing and listen to the conversation

@Game_Blox9999

5 ай бұрын

I don't mean to be the grammar police, but you used "there" as in "over there" instead of "they're" as in "they are."

@Icerz.

5 ай бұрын

@@Game_Blox9999 🤓

@aelin88

5 ай бұрын

@@Game_Blox9999 and it actually should be their, grammar police

@Ms.L.

5 ай бұрын

They are so interesting

@Game_Blox9999

5 ай бұрын

@@aelin88 Yeah, I guess I deserved that. You know what they say, you reap what you sow.

Iskall talking game mechanics with Etho is one of my favorites things right now

You should add some simple parkour or something to the first room of the vaults, that people can do for fun while they’re waiting for their friends! You jumping around while you were talking to Etho was driving me nuts, even though I’m a very restless person, haha.

@laartje24

4 ай бұрын

I still wanna see what a brainstorming session with both Iskall and Gem looks like XD

as someone who plays. Diablo, WoW, FFXIV, vault hunters and many others.. as well as have thought about games. Rng is a good thing in games.. but it also needs a bad luck protections. my favorite ones are things that you can either a. win with rng.. or b. through the work of time. get exactly what you want. for example. in ffxiv. you can 100% rng get a mount to drop from a trial. but theres always the odd change you do not get that mount to drop for years (looking at the WoW drop for the mount invincible the mount from ice crown raid that i still dont have after running it often for 4 years.) in FFXIV the answer to this is each time you run. you get an item for killing that boss. and after you have beaten them a number of times (for FFXIV this is 100) you can then get the mount from an vendor. allowing you a way to get around the rng should life decide to not allow you that win. so you always are working twords the goal. i think all games need this kind of answer.. a way to get to the end of an rng grind. no matter what rng is giving you. Vault hunters i do feel does this fairly well. some of the points i think its still lacking on is like.. bad luck on generation of vault player gems. and such. or the fact that you can only target one crafted stat onto a gear.. when maybe ide like to craft all of them for a increasing cost per stat at some point. or things like that. power to the player can be there along with rng. and thats a very. fine line to talk. your doing amazing iskall! vault hunters is amazing.. and if it wasnt a part of minecraft. i would have bought into it just as much as i have.

@Kaonashineko

5 ай бұрын

I agree, this is a mod pack not a huge company so it will not have the same level but I agree that some lessons taken from other games that rely heavily on rng (roguelikes, mmos etc) would be helpful, for me I’d like more clarity with rng weights and exact number chances of things especially more on gear. Lucky hit has been something I’ve been toying with but I don’t really get its weights… other things like how item rarity affects things etc in wow I know I lost a 1-100 dice roll but even though I’m enjoying VH it’s not super clear on the rng layers and reasonings it has, like why did my brother roll a lot of omega gear wearing picture of a lucky goose? Is gear rolling apart of rarity? Idk. I love the mod pack and appreciate the effort for sure! Just chiming in things. Also allowing more rerolls on things I have found helps ‘rng’ feel better, so like above stat rerolling at an increasing cost feels better than just limited stat changes.

@melsunday1991

5 ай бұрын

eyo, what's your favorite tank in ffxiv? ;)

@Drakonredwings

5 ай бұрын

@@melsunday1991 for me to play. Gunbreaker. For me to heal? Pally. XD but they are all quite fun

Hey, Iskall since majority of the hermits had played through The vaults u should do a vault with every hermit and ask them how they fell about the game what they don’t like, what they do like and etc to see what you can improve or take out from the game

@laartje24

4 ай бұрын

That would make very interesting vodskall content. Would love to watch their perspectives.

Idk if your going to read this Iskall or if it is even possible but I have an idea about the treasure treasure doors: you can make the keys start to glow or change appearance when near the corresponding door, I believe that it could resolve the problem of the color of the doors

@eykan_ow

5 ай бұрын

I really like this idea!

@Entarra

5 ай бұрын

And/or give the keys a unique shape for each gem, since the doors already kind of have their own look for each one. Would help with accessibility too, for the colorblind players

@GuyKadim

5 ай бұрын

@@Entarra yes that would be a great idea

@hunterbshindi2310

5 ай бұрын

But that requires you to sacrifice one hotbar slot and there are only so many items one can fit into these 9 slots

@jeffreycate3967

5 ай бұрын

​@hunterbshindi2310 That's very true, but this is largely a problem when you have only one key. If you open your inventory or a chest, you could also see the glow. But yeah, it would be a significant problem.

For fixing the treasure room doors, I see two solutions. 1. The doors could be made visually distinct in ways that are not color coordinated. Playing around with different patterns on the texture of the different doors would be a massive step in the right direction. I could also see a world where the doors are a 3x3 with a picture of the vault ore in the center. There are gems on the doors already, but its not enough to be able to distinguish it at a glance. 2. Add some sort of color blindness feature to the settings of the game, or even create a browser based resource pack customizer (similar to Xisumas vanilla tweaks) that lets you change the color of different assets.

@Arcella1981

5 ай бұрын

OH! i really like your idea of 3x3 treasure door with like picture of the vault ore in the center, I also really badly want gem blocks, so for example would be super awesome to be able to make a block of sparkletin or iskallium

@xWinterMoon

5 ай бұрын

I'd love the treasure keys to sparkle if it's in the vicinity of a treasure door. And it could have varying levels of sparkliness depending in if you're close.

@icetothemac

5 ай бұрын

The colorblind thing is big big big, I really need it xD

I like the rng idea and I like how it's implemented in vh but its always nice to be able to just choose to work harder for the item, like spending 50 gold instead of gambling 5 with a small chance

For the doors, one solution could be to put an outline of the gem on the door(and key, so people can reference). That way theres a non-color way to differentiate them.

@vodskall85

5 ай бұрын

This is a very good idea

@brandonspurlock8059

5 ай бұрын

​@vodskall85 a way to figure out the color without looking at the color is great for colorblind people too

@alannadena

5 ай бұрын

The handle of the keys could literally be the shape of the unique gem it was crafted with, and the doors could have a decoration on the corners of the door that would match the key handle.

It so much fun seeing Etho enjoy the modpack, you must be having the best time playing with him seeing him love it so much

5:30 I agree with this, the mods being a side-feature. I unlock RS and drawers to handle my loot. I unlock Create and iSpawners to make altar goodies. I unlock Waystones to get to my friends so we can run vaults together. You have a very strong gameplay loop going with the core VH mod

These two bounce off each other so well. Really gives you a peek behind the curtain of Vh. I've really enjoyed watching. Iskallman to the rescue once a again 😂 (no shame in that at all 😂)

I love this sort of video more so than the polished, edited stuff, they feel so much more genuine and sincere

It is such a joy watching iskall and etho hanging out :)

I personally love the gear RNG in this game! I could honestly do with a little less RNG in the Vault Objectives themselves though. I find I fail a lot of vaults just due to bad RNG and not skill, and that's a little of a "feels bad" moment.

@Arcella1981

5 ай бұрын

sometimes for me it feels like they are getting rid of the good rng stuff and keeping the bad stuff xD like getting rid of the mystery boxes, i LOVED those and would really like to see those back, but for the RNG on gear I think ONE thing that would make it WAY better is just have a void orb that you can combine with a faceted focus and then you could use that void orb that has been turned into a "Void Orb ( healing efficiency) " then when you use it on a gear peice then it would ONLY remove that healing efficiency and not take something else that you wanted to keep

@JacksonOwex

5 ай бұрын

I'm not 100% sure what you mean here because you CAN set the objective by using a seal. Though I believe you mean the fact that it's technically possible to not get all the things you need because of the RNG of spawning! I also have NO issue with the gear randomness, especially with the addition of the... Modifier Workbench(I think that's what it's called)!

@akfek

5 ай бұрын

100% this. The Gear RNG is great. Objective RNG, not so much. Losing a vault because the altar wants wizard wands but the vault wants to give you gilded chests does indeed feel bad.

@kildain3438

5 ай бұрын

@@akfek Exactly this. The RNG of the vault itself (which I enjoy) can negatively effect the RNG of the objectives

“Life is like a box of chocolates, you never know what you are going to get”, this is my feelings towards rng, and I love it that way. I feel like playing a game with the same outcome over and over doesn’t seem appealing to me when it comes to adventuring. Nothing makes me feel like my effort is worth it than to get that one piece or gear I needed, even if it has a sprinkle of luck involved. Also RNG to me encourages experimentation, for example, I got a chaining sword with good stats instead of more attack like I wanted, so I decided to try it and now I love chaining! Without rng making that “decision” for me, I wouldn’t have found something I like. Love your vids Iskall! Continue to enjoy your break!

Iskall / Etho runs have become my favorite VH content!

RNG is a fun mechanic but should always have a workaround Like you should be able to decide you're too unlucky and get what you want another way. Give either a workaround or a guarantee. Everything should be obtainable from more than rng, always give options. Thats my opinion tho.

Iskall idk if you will read this or not but quick question: Are there any plans of getting a "Audio team" part of the VH dev team, or do you at least like the idea of it? Having music and custom sounds would make VH so much better and it's something I really miss right now.

@Werewolf914

5 ай бұрын

I'd love that

@vogelvrouw

5 ай бұрын

Ohhh yes! But theyd have to fit in with the vanilla mc soundtrack, its just too good and iconic

(written at about 8 minutes into the video) I love the rng in vault hunters, but balancing can be tricky. The tool crafting system is great, and like you said, the gear crafting system could learn a lot from that. I did the math of gear crafting recently. because you only get .1 or .2% towards mastery, that means it takes anywhere from 500 to 1000 crafted pieces to gain mastery in just one type of gear. I think even just adding the potential to get .3% while gear crafting would make it more worth it. maybe make an expertise that can raise the number to .4 or .5. that makes the math go to between 1000 and 334 for normal, and from 1000 to (potentially) 200 to finish a mastery. prices for crafting could also be adjusted. Another possibility is to incorperate faceted foci into gear crafting. crafting gear causes you to lose the potential for legendary modifiers. what if crafted gear, when crafted with a faceted focus, could have that focus permanently seared into the gear. whatever it rolls is what you get, so it still has an rng element. it couldnt be chaos focused into being better (or worse). so as an example, you craft a chest plate and use a health faceted focus. you roll it into a rare, and the health rolls a 4 (out of a possible 9). that prefix cannot be changed no matter what, but you can still rng the rest of the weapon as normal. (written at about 32 minutes into the video) Maybe a way to fix axes is by making them both better and worse at the same time. a sword is naturally and stereotypically a nice, fast, one handed weapon. Axes can be more powerful sure, but they are normally wielded with two hands. What if vault axes were like that too? start them at between 10-12 damage at level 0, let them have a much stronger base damage than swords, with the drawback being that you cant use an offhand. with less access to ability power and block chance/thorns damage, you have the potencial to build a set up that's way more focused on how hard you hit. Give axes a chance to have a small percentage of lucky hit added as an implicit. This gives players the change to make builds that don't focus on mana or ability power as much, letting them focus more on movement and shielding. I love axes, I want to use axes, and I feel like this could be the thing that pushes them into being a viable weapon. I feel like part of the problem is that their being treated as sword 2.0 when they need to be treated as their own weapon. giving them a much harder hit at the cost of being slower AND having no offhand can defiantly do that. This could even be supported by adding either new skills or new specializations into skills we already have that work based on your damage rather than your ability power. example, a subset of fireball called firefist that does a percentage of your damage on your next hit. mana shield could have a subset called mana thorns where your mana drains while its up, but when a mob hits you it takes a % of your strength as thorns damage. (written about 48 minutes into the video) the door color thing isn't just a skill issue, its an issue of accessibility. I imagine the colors being so close really can be upsetting for those players that are colorblind and literally cant tell the difference between the doors. Another way to fix it without changing it all together is to add an accent color that is colorblind friendly. (i know you said it should be fixed potentially but still wanted to add to the discussion)

I like RNG for the same reasons you mentioned! Namely the replayability and not knowing what you're gonna get. It's exciting!

I love that you're willing to discuss RNG! Of course, your Pyder loves VH. I'm OK with RNG up to a point. I prefer having input into my destiny (i.e. gear building), but would love to have more choice and customization. If I can gather lots of materials to be able to build or craft an omega item, it's far more satisfying than randomly rolling for weeks until I get it.

My take on RNG in games like diablo and vault hunters, is when you have to grind grind and grind more to make meaningful growth. It becomes more tedious than fun. Especially in a game where the durability eventually means you'll lose the gear you've meticulously crafted, and now need to rebuild all over again. Its really two balancing points to find: 1st The point where the lowest new gear you get naturally, is nearly equal to the old gear you've maxed, so even if you need to start over, you're not suffering to do so. 2nd: The point where the amount of effort it takes to max out your gear, is still a better/smarter use of time and resources than only going for higher level gear. If your game has these two points well balanced, rng feels rewarding. If it doesn't, rng feels punishing

It feels like etho is someone who gets Iskall and I’m glad he has that for a sanity check and just to bouncy things off of

Maybe Iskall needs to look into how PSO2 dealt with gear. You could merge together gear with a high amount of randomness that you could minimize with a large amount of resource use. This way you could get what you wanted without hitting a 1 in a million drop chance.

@Lakosius

5 ай бұрын

No it didnt , Dudu and Monika can burn in heck

@Arcella1981

5 ай бұрын

I think ONE thing that would make it WAY better is just have a void orb that you can combine with a faceted focus and then you could use that void orb that has been turned into a "Void Orb ( healing efficiency) " then when you use it on a gear peice then it would ONLY remove that healing efficiency and not take something else that you wanted to keep

@OsuFan418

5 ай бұрын

@@Lakosius Dudu did nothing wrong. Come back when you get doom break 3 on an 8 affix weapon.

Hey Iskall! Love all the behind the scenes videos. About your rng question; I think there’s definitely a place for it in Vault Hunters, your main point about how it provides variety and replay value make a lot of sense from a game design perspective. And I think rng can let you have a lot of fun with the gambling side, rolling that perfect modifier on a piece of gear is a pretty good feeling. Of course the opposite is also true, when you have to grind forever rerolling something just for that one stat you need, it can get exhausting. That’s where the Minecraft perspective comes in, I’m not sure how much rng is necessarily welcome by people more use to playing standard Minecraft. I know for me personally, I generally try to eliminate as much rng from my game as possible, be it using librarian villagers instead of enchanting, using lighting to stop random mob spawns, or even building nether hubs so I don’t have to deal with the chaos of random ghasts. But that’s because in regular Minecraft I’m more interested in the building side than the grindy one and want to make that side as convenient as possible so I can spend more time building. Which doesn’t necessarily apply to VH, it just seems like generally rng and convenience are at odds with each other. And most players seem to prefer a more convenient experience, like you were saying to Etho in the last bts about game difficulty, how a lot of people want the game to be on the easier side. It’s definitely a tough line to walk and I can sympathize with you and your team. Maybe if there’s rng, there can also be a more expensive but less grindy option? The reworked enchanter you guys made comes to mind, instead of rolling and hoping for the right enchants, you can just pay your emeralds and xp for the exact enchants you want, trading currency for expedience. Obviously for vault gear and everything you’d want the cost to be pretty high (vault gold, gems, etc) but it could be a good balance for the different types of players. Sorry for the long reply, it’s just my two cents lol. You’re doing great and I can’t wait for next year and all the vaulting to come. PS- and the Etho carrying lol

@Arcella1981

5 ай бұрын

I think ONE thing that would make it WAY better is just have a void orb that you can combine with a faceted focus and then you could use that void orb that has been turned into a "Void Orb ( healing efficiency) " then when you use it on a gear piece then it would ONLY remove that healing efficiency and not take something else that you wanted to keep

@vodskall85

5 ай бұрын

Thank you! Good comment! I think RNG is necessary in a game like this, and I dont think its in a bad place at the moment, but it can definately use some love here and there

@TheWalior

5 ай бұрын

I think they key is giving people a way to bypass the RNG at a price, like how in POE you can use bench to 6l an item while paying a bit more. @@vodskall85

@Apol-Lyon

5 ай бұрын

@@vodskall85 Yeah I agree, even with some of the grindier parts I’ve never found myself wishing it was removed from the game or anything. And that feeling when everything rolls just how you want it to is pretty hard to beat. I do think there’s some merit to a less grindy but more costly rng alternative for more casual players. I wouldn’t say it’s something that would necessarily be a straight improvement, just a different approach. Even if nothing changes your rng systems are still far more fun than rolling villager trades lol.

The secret with rng is that you need to supply methods to mitigate bad luck. For example, a scav vault that rolls a set of items that physically don’t generate is not fun because it is unwinable. But if you are guaranteed those items are in the vault and obtainable within the 25 minute time limit, that is mitigatable rng. I think my biggest frustration with vault hunters right now is that I’m trapped on level 28 without access to gear that can help me survive a vault and not enough vault resources to get more gear. I feel trapped because I enter a vault to get the resources, get pinned by a giant mob of enemies and killed, and I am at the point where I cannot afford my revive any more. (I am playing on a solo world as I don’t know anyone else who plays).

just a thought for another use of chest scrolls: similar to dummies, where you can test your attack damage and speed, there can be “dummy _____ chest” in which you can see how fast a chest can break. they’d break entirely but respawn after a few seconds. this can be a good way to test your tools in the overworld.

I personally am always interested in hearing more of your thoughts on the game, and for you to give those thoughts in a laid back, zen way.

Rng is simple the best as long as it scales with your progression. Nowadays, people absolutely love having everything to beat the game as soon as possible, in my opinion, that's simply bad because it takes the skill very much so out of play and everything basically relies on gear. So, long story short, I don't think rng is so bad :)

@ering9015

5 ай бұрын

I agree, as long as its scaling then RNG is fine. It actually adds to the challenge. I think that more options to modify, like being able to choose which specific prefix or suffix would be nice, rather than leaving it completely up to chance (although this may already be a thing and I've just not unlocked it).

one way to address the RNG aspect - particularly if the goal is to address the needs of more casual gamers - is to limit a non-RNG option to the easier game modes. So - if you play on easy or normal, you've got a way to craft the characteristics you want but your replayability is limited. But, if you want to maximize your replayability and you choose a harder setting, the ability to craft modifiers onto gear is removed.

Etho being part of the community has actively made it and the game better. Love to see it

Iskall, have you ever thought about making some elements of Vault Hunters into a separate mod? The tool system and skills are basically one of the best, I'd want to play with them in other modpacks as well.

@Arcella1981

5 ай бұрын

when his team first made the animal pens mod, he did say he would have that mod being its seperate mod so that others could use it for things like skyblocks ( i know this doesnt asnwer your question and wasnt what you were asking, i just remember him saying that about the animal pens mod )

@JacksonOwex

5 ай бұрын

I'm hoping he makes the Animal Jars a separate mod! I believe when they introduced the jars someone asked him and he seemed open to the idea. That would end up being one of the most popular mods I think. iSpawners might be nice too, though they would also have to move Mystery Eggs(or do something to make it work) to it so people could actually use it. I suppose Cagerium could work as well though that ends up with a VERY similar problem!

Personally I love the rng experience for the gear I really like the way it’s done. The gear system is a fun challenge when I redo my gear

Something interesting about your stats being determined by RNG is that they did a study and found that when an outcome is determined by 90% skill and 10% luck, most of those sampled that meet a threshold will have high luck even though it does not contribute nearly as much as skill. I do appreciate games that allow you to push a big portion of stats by using good skill or over-analyzing a scenario, but if there is always a possibility that the boss can send an insta-kill toward the healer, then over the course of the battle you need a significant amount of luck. For how you set up armor, having it initially roll all its stats and having the potential to totally be garbage is fine I think because there are many other ways to "re-roll" for better luck. I definitely think it is good to occasionally be able to force the specific stat you need to complete your strategy, but also keeping the stats in ascending tiers make min-maxing more efficient because you are guaranteed something better will come eventually and all decisions are short-term.

One of my favourite sayings "RNGesus take the wheel!" Most of the time he turns and drives off a bridge

Im a big fan of the concept of building your own gear like the tools. I like to control my focus and it can be very frustrating rolling gear until you get what you want.

And I love the videos…you and Etho playing are so good to watch

As someone who in the last eight years haven't played anything other than minecraft, a Love vault hunters and the progressive feel of it!

I think I can speak for a lot of people when I say that I don’t like flat RNG, but I do enjoy RNG that I can influence in some way, it gives a sense of control and accomplishment rather than being at the mercy of the dice gods

People often mistake skill issues for RNG issues.

@Bob_Smith19

5 ай бұрын

People often mistake RNG issues for skill issues. It cuts both ways.

@Game_Blox9999

5 ай бұрын

Ooh a double-edged sword!

@thomassexton6783

5 ай бұрын

@@Bob_Smith19 over the course of an entire playthrough the RNG likely will work itself out to average. Yeah if you go to a microscale like a single vault it won’t but over the course of the game it will. At least from what I have seen on the subreddit a decent amount of the complaining on the RNG is either on a single vault (mainly scav items) or something that clearly is a skill issue that they are putting as RNG (saw a level 50 something say RNG made it so he never had a dungeon)

@JacksonOwex

5 ай бұрын

@@thomassexton6783 It's still ABSOLUTELY NOT fun to have a "perfect"(quotes because there's no such thing as a perfect build) build for whatever vault type you like but not be able to finish it because you RANDOMLY don't get what you need! I'm unsure if it's changed but at one point Iskall ADMITTED that it was THEORETICALLY possibly to NOT be able to finish a Scav vault in Version 3 because of the randomness, and back then you could end up with a LOCKED vault as well, so if you got REALLY unlucky you wouldn't be able to ever leave because you CAN'T find what you needed to finish, even if you had INFINITE time in a vault! Now that's not PROBABLE but it IS POSSIBLE!

@thomassexton6783

4 ай бұрын

@@JacksonOwex and they eliminated the perms death on vaults. If you run a “perfect” vault and fail you are still gonna have enough gold to make it through.

Prob one of my fav episodes from you ever. I’m not kidding at all! I so enjoyed every aspect of this video. Conversation, topic, and of course the vault. You’re doing a good job. ❤

What would be cool for hunter, would be to have it so that if when you go into a vault you have the respec of it connected to a "challenge" so for example when you go into a vault and you have it spec'd to gilded but you wanted it for living ( because you forgot to unspec before entering ) make it so that for example every 200 mobs you kill you COULD respec it into something else or every 80 ornate or gilded or living then it would allow you to respec it, and also when you exit a vault make it auto unspec

The day after Iskall discusses the biggest controversy yet - the 3 green ores/treasure rooms being indistinguishable from each other - xB posts a video in which he and Hypno go vaulting and open up both a Tubium AND Petezanite Treasure room right after the other in the same vault. Luckily for them, they had both keys xD

Door color: is it possible to do something with the texture? (like the ores in vanilla) That would be the ideal solution when it comes to accessibility. From what I remember, if you want something to be clearly distinct, it's better to design it in black & white, and then apply the color for an even better distinction.

@brugbo613

5 ай бұрын

Makes sense to me. Also, I turn on Jade, so it's not a concern personally 🤷

Luck based games are so fun, if it's always the same thing it eventually gets boring BUT, some things shouldn't need rng, like for example, the clouds and stuff, which they don't, which is good. I feel like aside from the need to have a great computer to play and needing a lot of vault coins and mayyybe not enough vanilla in crafting recipes, vault hunters is more or less perfect

"Oh, Etho joined" i laught so hard that is almost ALMOST stupid love you iskall and love the RNG that you guys have in VH, its random, but you can have a lot of controll over it. Yeah, maybe sometimes is super sad, but most of the time its super exciting getting that thing you have work for.

I love the way that VH has its gear crafting and rolling. I, myself, am not a huge gambler when it comes to rolling equipment but it is always exciting to get that next upgrade or make the build you are aiming for. When it comes to the RNG of the game, I do have a few ideas for you to think about to potentially do more / make the system feel nicer 1) double down on the faceted foci: By combining multiple (say 4) of the same kind of focus + other crafting materials, it creates a supreme faceted focus of the same type. The supreme focus, when applied to a gear piece, will always have the max rolled stat (plus maybe a small chance at a legendary roll?). This will take the luck aspect out of rolling a gear piece in exchange for a noticeable cost. 2) Gear luck research: add a research option to create a table where the player can either choose a number of prefix + suffix modifiers to either remove or make rare for vault gear. For example, if the player doesn't want shocking hit chance on their sword, they can lessen the chance of it rolling by using the table. Obviously, the table would need research + be very expensive for this power but it would help better tune your gear rolls + remove the feel bad of getting a roll you don't want on late game equipment.

Need more developers like you 😢😊

I love the RNG in vh. I wish there was more! (VH2 cake vaults were always my favorite)

I have an idea for vault hunters in general. Correct me if this breaks some consistency part of the game, but I think it would be great if the general durability stats of armor and tools were buffed. This would make it less so you don’t have to create a whole new set of tools and armor every couple of levels because they are running out of durability, and more that the vaults are getting harder and it would be easier if you level up your gear. Or maybe there is more durability for lower level stuff, and that extra durability gradually fades the higher level you go, making the endgame more about repairing and crafting new sets of tools and armor, and keeping the early game leveling up if gear more vault difficulty focused.

I love PoE and i can tell the devs love it too. Crafting bench, prefixes, suffixes, harvest reforge prefixes and suffixes, exalt slamming, divine orb, blessed orb, chaos orb, etc. I love gear crafting in vault hunters just as I do in PoE

@bondsmatthew

5 ай бұрын

Having chase items like HH and Mageblood uniques would be so, so good

I have a suggestion for vault gear! - I want to start off by saying that Vault Hunters is my favorite modpack ever! I think the normal difficulty and ability to adjust it up or down depending on your skill level is perfect. I started a multiplayer server with friends and they agree it's incredible but they get irritated at things you and I enjoy. They are the kind of player that wants to invest time and energy into the creative aspects of building and gaining more power than a vanilla experience provides. Specifically they hate scavenger vaults because they rely heavily on RNG. We'll always get 90% there and have to escape because we're missing one thing. I think that the time investment aspect is extremely relevant too. Running 5 vaults to every 1 my friends do gives me a completely different experience from them. It's nice to have people to respond to your questions in videos but to better help your team prioritize changes and improvements, it would be nice to offer surveys to get more data from your player base if possible. Regarding vault gear improvements though, I think it would be amazing to (expensively) enchant books with the modifier of choice from a piece of vault gear. You can add RNG if desired but I think destroying the original piece of gear it was on would be perfect. Make it cost a large amount of crafting potential too, It'll incentivize people to do less rolling and more gathering of materials. I think this would provide a clear path for hardcore and casuals alike to optimize vault gear intentionally instead of relying strictly on RNG. Absolutely love the series, content, and you being good to yourself by taking a break. (even if we still get to see what you're up too through vods) 😁👍

RNG is one of the many things I think VH does phenomenally. Early game almost everything is left up yo chance, but as you progress you start to get more control over the randomness, which allows for some level of satisfaction and control in our playthroughs.

Vault Hunters bringing RNG/Rogue likes etc to Minecraft just makes it amazing to me... I love everything about it... I mean does RNG make things hard/grindy sure but I think over all it makes the Vault Hunters fun especially now that we have plunderer vaults that we can "farm" better gear without dying constantly.

Iskall Vault Hunters is everything I wish Minecraft could be. I love how you’ve kept the Vanilla aspect of Minecraft while adding the whole adventure/dungeon element. The possibilities this adds to the base Minecraft game are limitless. Basically, I love your vision. I am glad i first discovered you on Hermitcraft and found you again on Vodskall. I hope one day Hermitcraft/Vaulthunters will be a season. Love you all and all my best wishes for the lot of you in 2024. Thank you Iskall, Hermitcraft peeps, and all the Vault Hunters team.

rng in an arpg setting, and in something like VHs especially, is amazing. I adore the gear crafting, it's my favourite part of the game

One way to fix the treasure door problem would be adding the corresponding ore on the door, like how mob doors have the mob icon on them.

Funny thing is, in this play through I got a treasure chest scroll on my first room. Only took me 4 seasons, the really remarkable part was I found a key in a merchant room, rolled it, found the door 2 rooms later. Sometimes the RNG gods are stingy, and sometimes they rain down their favor!

I like the RNG, it makes the game more exciting to randomly get gear etc. Yes, it can be frustrating at times to not get what you want. However, it makes it even better when you get what you want. Sometimes I do like a bit of a grind in a game, prolongs gameplay and in Vault Hunters enables resource gathering. Thank you for VH Iskall and team

When it comes to rng, its a few things, but to me, the 2 main things that make it frustrating are: - When there's multiple layers stacked together to get something that is required for a build. - When there's a high chance to completely brick a piece of gear that you've been working on and put a lot of resources into. You've mostly solved the first by having crafter gear being a thing and the specific focus that guarantee a specific modifier, but cradting in general needs a bit of a buff, especially if you are going to introduce unique gear via looting. As for the second point, the idea to be able to lock modifiers sounds really good, but it shouldn't be super rng to get those. Having materials required as a focus would be good, but having an expertise option for it would help too. Something like "Blacksmithing" expertise, with say 4-5 levels, that does a few things, but only unlocks after level 50 or 75. 1. It allows you to lock additional modifiers on a piece of gear above the base 1 modifier (+1 per level into the expertise) 2. It gives you a small chance to roll a legendary modifier when you craft a piece of gear above a certain quality (e.g. crafting gear at smith level or higher grants +1 percent chance to roll a legendary modifier when you identify the crafted gear per level of expertise skill unlocked. Since you're introducing unique gear, this would be a good balance between crafted and looted gear, similar to how path of exile does it, where crafting has the chance to get top tier modifiers, but the unique gear is only really obtained via looting. This way you can craft generically strong gear, but to go for the niche but super strong unique stuff, you still have to loot and run vaults.

I think VH has the perfect amount of RNG. You get the fun of rolling for cool gear, but a bad roll doesn't ruin your game. Maybe a less popular opinion; I also like that a good roll doesn't make it feel like God mode. I've played modded for years, and this is possibly my favorite mod pack. It's a very nice switch up from yet-another-kitchen-sink pack.

Absolutly love these unedited BTS vods

As far as the RNG question: I find it nice to have some random elements: but not need to fully rely on an RNG to advance. The jewels are very fun and a way to not rely as much on loot crates and make your own if that’s more your thing, while still using some randomness

Mantis shrimp irl can move their claw so fast that it literally lights the water on fire via cavitation.

Petezanite, Tubium, and Iskallium all start with a different letter... maybe it''s a good idea to just put the starting letter of each unique gem on the treasure door? All of the unique gems actually start with a different letter. Another suggestion would be to let everyone know they can turn on tooltips using the 1 on the numpad, and read what door it says it is on the top of the screen!

I'm not exceptionally into the ARPG genre but I am big on roguelike games so I love the rng, so long as there is some form of mitigation for bad luck. From my single player experience of vault hunters I find it to be close to the perfect balance of RNG and non-RNG. I appreciate the videos over your holiday break! Hope your holidays have been enjoyable

I can listen to Iskall and Etho talk game mechanics for HOURS!❤ So glad Etho has joined this little SMP and shares his honest feedback to this mod. And suggesting new ideas! Love the content❤🎉

Idk why the "everyone chooses green" is so funny and wholesome to me. love that 🥺 (green flags, all of you)

I love his 189 levels after sealing the crystal

I like the gamble stats dynamic of vault hunters, I think what people struggle with more is Success dependent on RNG E.g. scavs, or early game unable to progress because every xeenium ore gave 0 gems and now you’re locked out of pogs It’s also the “single player experience” - e.g. it’s great in this context of multiple people in a world having a great time and helping people out - but by balancing that it does make a single player world feel so much harder

The number of times Iskall said "I'm out of chromatic iron? ...Oh I gave it all away" is too many for coincidence

As both an avid Tango and Iskall watcher this topic has quite fascinated me, since you are both at opposite ends with your opinions. I can see both work, literally, both have been a huge success.

Hey Iskall! I am one of the types of players you mention here, gamer dad. I get maybe an hour or 2 a night to play and VH is my game of choice! I am for the RNG but I take advantage of a lot of the gamerules that have been implemented in VH3 to lessen the pain of that. If you do anything to the RNG, I urge you to make it a gamerule like you have other loot systems. But Artifacts, OMG I hate trying to complete the puzzle, it feels impossible with the current RNG.

idk about the others but, these kinds of "episodes" are just awesome. just iskall rambling about things. and about the RNG it can be so frustrating but to me it is just part of vault hunters, its really exciting to get good gear, and am not even talking about just omega gear, legendaries on lower rarities can be really the difference from me scrapin that gear to using it

“Linux systems have an out-of-memory killer that will start killing random processes in low-memory situations. You'd think it would pick the process using the most memory, but most of the time it seems to pick the process that would be most comically inconvenient, such as your screen locker, or crond.” - jwz

Not sure if iskall even reads these comments, but one thing that i feel would probably fix almost everyone of those peoples who say they don't like the RNG when it comes to stats, just bring back the void orb and make it so that you can combine the void orb with a faceted focus and then when you use the void orb on a piece of gear it will guarantee to take off ONLY that ONE stat and not anything else, I LOVE the RNG on gear but ABOSULTY hate that i cant take off specific stuff, specially when I have spent an hour on a piece of gear and ALMOST have it perfect and then WHOOPS it took off the ONE stat that I wanted and now i have to start the whole darn thing over again OH! also I think one thing you should do is when recycling a gear piece that has a legendary modifier, make it have a low chance that it will give you a faceted focus with that modifier on it, this will do a couple things, it will not make it feel to bad when you get a legendary modifier that MOST of the time is on trash gear that you would never use, AND it would make it feel ALOT better when you actually recycled it and get the legendary focus BTW Iskall if you do read this, this is my NUMBER ONE most favorite modpack ever, i have replayed this pack 7 times, so just don't want you thinking that I hate the game, I LOVE it and you and your team have done such a tremendously good job on it, thank you!

Symbols on the doors and keys help solve a lot of color problems without having to change the colors

@Yorick257

5 ай бұрын

+1, just like the ore textures got changed

Ooh Mantis Shrimp light you one fire, because its like the real animals! Mantis Shrimp snap their claws so fast, that the create a bubble of boiling vapor inside the water that reaches temperatures similar to those of the surface of the sun!

TLDR Gear Suggestion - Make a vault grindstone to remove a prefix or suffix and put it into a special book. Make the books expensive but attainable and make them use a lot of crafting potential so you'd still want to rely mostly on rolling a good set of modifiers and then adding your must have enchantments. Also side suggestion. I like the idea of the modifier workbench being able to craft over a rolled stat if we can craft it better. There have been many times where I have a great start on a piece of gear but then get a low extra durability roll or similar and don't want to take the 20% gamble of removing the right modifier. In general being able to have a clear path to your goal is fantastic even if it's a long journey. OR you can gamble in the hopes of getting something amazing. But having the choice is what makes people feel empowered to play the game their way.

Rng is very fun, but it becomes frustrating when if feels like you put a lot of time in and, because you rolled badly, you made no progress. That's why, imo, incremental systems where you can see slow, steady progress towards what you want are a great complement to RNG-based gear systems. That's why I like the VH gear crafting system- you can put resources in and see yourself getting more proficient and working towards that piece you really want.

what we love about ARPGs is the getting of upgrades, but not the losing of items and then needing to hope the RNG is in your favor to replace those tools.

@Bob_Smith19

5 ай бұрын

Nailed it

To the FORGE room idea you discussed. Make it the 80th room of each cake-vault. Or something like that.

@aleschudarek4672

5 ай бұрын

You know when to take the stuff to repair/modify and you have to work for it

Dad gamer here, love the rng. I have been planning Minecraft since beta, and really enjoy how you brought rng into the game. It is more of a challenge for how often and much I can play, but I wouldn’t change it at all. To the detractors I say, “get good” 😂 OP gear is awesome, but the game is totally playable with average roll gear.

i think another good idea for the doors could be to put the first letter of the gem name on the door, that way it’s easier for colorblind people to see as well. when they see an “I” they’ll know it’s Iskallium, etc. and i can’t think of any letters overlap but you could use different designs !

Rng is great as long as it's balanced. One thing I've noticed on VH is that it is skewed negatively Example, you need a scav item. You need the rng to play in your favour 4 times. one: does a poi enabled room spawn Two: does the room spawn the poi required Three: does the poi spawn enough chests/ores/mobs Four: does the thing give you the thing. I once ran a scav and got annoyed at 3 omega rooms pretty much back to back. Little rebalance is all that's needed. I love VH btw. Keep up the amazing work team

Years ago in a game I needed a certain skill book to progress in crafting. The book was supposed to drop randomly between level 10 and 15. At level 30 it still had not dropped making progress difficult. The RNG needs some mechanic to insure or check an needed item drops, when RNG works against the player and fun it's broke. There is a need for the challenge and the excitement when getting a cool drop just getting everything given becomes boring. That moment a sweet item drops you want to keep going, but when it becomes work I'm gonna quit. That's my two cents worth.

The good thing with "gambling" loot is also; you always win maybe you don't get what you want, but you never lose anything from it

I just want to say I love Iskall's thumbnails, both for episodes and his in between episodes. Whoever does them (might be Iskall or an editor) is awesome!

Full length scavs are my ABSOLUTE favourite. Each POI found, each item, the scramble to the end. Iskall I’d love you to continue posting content just like this as part of your normal work week after your holiday.

One thing to remember about the whole gem/door color thing is that some people are color blind. Not everyone has a "skill issue." Sometimes they just legitimately can't see the difference in color and will never be able to. I'm not one of those people, but I can definitely understand what it must be like to have that issue.

As someone who enjoys a number of table top games, my favorite ones are always ones that have complex systems that offer diverse competitive deterministic strategies, but also offer a lot of limitation and variation from randomness. For me currently having played a bunch of VH I think there are pieces that would be improved with more diverse ways to use the randomness that exists, but other systems feel great. It feels like a game that is finished and needs some polish to be better, not a bad game to play.

I'm so happy to hear you mention 2 of my favorite games, diablo 2 and PoE. Iskall, vault hunters is SO good, I got my brother, whom doesn't like playing minecraft, to play vaults hunters. It is that good of a rogue like

LOVE RNG and also this game is yours we are just glad to join the ride and you should make it the best version of what you love (of course critiques and suggestions are always good)

The fact that Tubbo calls Iskall dad is very wholesome 😂

My first time playing Vault Hunters and I have enjoyed the game so much. I don’t understand all of the negative comments. It has revitalized my love for this game. Just know that there are people having an awesome time playing your game. Thanks Iskall