Excellent video. Clear and concise. It also helped me discover that I have TSC on my 2014 4Runner. I had no idea it was there. I'm not a fan of friction sway control and would rather try this route. Thanks!!

One of the things I was told many years ago was in most cases the issue of trailer sway causing an accident is the wrong tow vehicle for the given trailer and or driving to fast. I have pulled a relatively heavy trailer with a 1 ton truck for thousands of miles the trailer was high profile and considerably heavier than then the truck. Watching your speed and wind conditions is paramount. Pulling a trailer of any kind is really not a leisurely activity.

A couple of weeks ago I was travelling between Winton & Longreach. I saw the aftermath of two separate car/caravan rollover events - both were off the road and either on their roofs or side. This made me keen to find out more about these systems.

Another great video, electronic sway prevention systems.

IMO trailer stability assist systems should notify the driver of a sway event even if it was quickly dampened.

@L2SFBC

2 жыл бұрын

Very good idea!

@r0cketplumber

2 жыл бұрын

@@L2SFBC When driving my Mini Cooper aggressively on a mountain highway, the stability augmentation is not subtle- it pulses the brakes to counteract over- and under-steer, and I can really feel the action. TSC probably gives a similar growling effect.

@L2SFBC

2 жыл бұрын

@@r0cketplumber ​ @Rocketplumber I know what you mean. Poorly calibrated ESC will feel like that, conflicting with what the driver is doing when on the limit. Trailer TSC shouldn't be like that though. And good ESC is not detectable by any but the most senstive and skilled drivers.

another great vid and yes places to sea is also correct,

Another excellent explanation. It answered all the questions I had. Thank you

@L2SFBC

2 жыл бұрын

Glad it was helpful! Please share :-)

9:30 thanks for anticipating my question ;)

This is One GOOD instructional vidio for trailer towing.

@L2SFBC

2 жыл бұрын

Thanks please share 👍

Wow the BEST video on the subject on ALL the internet! ¡Gracias por compartir!

@L2SFBC

2 жыл бұрын

Glad it was helpful! Please share!

@stickymiky123

Жыл бұрын

@@L2SFBC Me too. Took a while to find this but it is excellent advice. Thanks

What an awesome video. Answered the question I had (and way more!) that having both car and trailer systems running simultaneously is fine. Also, the test videos showing sway control in action were great. Quite amazing difference in how the trailer and car behave. Cheers from a first time caravaner.

@L2SFBC

9 ай бұрын

Glad it was helpful!

Really good information. Thanks for posting!

@L2SFBC

Жыл бұрын

Thanks please share!

Thanks so much. A fantastic public service.

@L2SFBC

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks please share 👍

I did not even know that Lexus 2016 GX460 already has the TSC built in. Thanks for your video..

@Maximonious

2 жыл бұрын

Where did you find that info? I can't confirm my 2012 Premium does or does not have it!!

AWESOME VIDEO!!! Thank you!

@L2SFBC

2 жыл бұрын

You are so welcome! Please share

Very useful information :)

Very informative and interesting videos.

@L2SFBC

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks please share 👍

In my evaluations in practical situations this can be done with simple "speakers" communicating with each side of the vehcile and giving the pressure differential. Activating indivual brakes on the "van"

Interesting that the Boash system does allow some lock up of the wheels before releasing the brakes again. Results in much better braking on loose surfaces than systems that dont allow any lock up at all

Side note but stability control is so so so cool. I drive a lot of gravel and it's all but impossible to screw up. Rear end starts to kick out and the vehicle just says "LOL NOPE Back into line you go!!" as the computer independently stabs the brakes for diagonally opposite corners. One of the coolest safety features ever implemented on cars.

@L2SFBC

Жыл бұрын

yep!

Had my van for 10 years never had trailer sway, The wheels are well behind the centre of the van. What I can see is that vans with the wheels close the the centre of the van have the most problems.

If you have a tow car with ESC it adds to the effect that differential stability offers on the trailer - the two mentioned here do not offer the ability to introduce a force equal and opposite at the centre of equilibrium therefore is less effective plus there is a cost with added electronics - with differential stability ( pure mechanical) there is no chance of wheel lockup. And can be fitted to any A frame trailer. The Bosh /Dexter will disengage if rough terrain is encountered and only works with electric brakes. ALKO bought out Dexter some years ago I'm unsure when Bosh took that over but I think it was so they did not compromise the European device designed for overrun brakes. John Wilson. Differential Stability is still the only workable option.

one thing that 'may' be overlooked with caravan braking that relies on the vehicle battery to supply 12v for the trailer brakes is the potential poor connection at the 7 pin plug and the poor earth connection, due to current draw

This is all well and good until one side of the van is on say, gravel whilst the other is on bitumen. Seems to me that the on vehicle TSC is a way to detect a potential problem before it turns into a catastrophe. Unfortunately my insurance company didn't understands the question much less help with a solution

🏆🏆🏆👍🇺🇲🙏. Thank you for sharing

Thanks Robert for another informative and thought provoking educational video. One thing not covered is trailer electric over hydraulic disc brakes. These are becoming more common and ALKO ESC system works in conjunction with its IQ7 actuator. Dexter also has E/H actuator system but I presume this would negate any differential left/ right braking (one hydraulic line out only from actuator?) and/or ABS from their trailer stability module and resort to proportionately brake all wheels simultaneously….or maybe not work at all? Have you come across any info on this?

@L2SFBC

Жыл бұрын

Not exactly no, but I know the systems have yaw sensors and act on them. So if they do yaw due to differential braking, the braking would be released. Not a good siuation but better than having the trailer yaw out of control. Is that what you mean?

I think some insurance is cheaper if you have sway control on your caravan

I believe we've got the Al-KO system on our van, but I dont think it works as we've had 2x sway events that nearly ended in disaster... more investigation required

1:30 YES quick to react AFTER sway has started. Why not PREVENT it from starting altogether with a PPP hitch. I do.

Thanks for the videos they explained more details on things I did not know, thanks again. I would like to know if there is a way to indicate (dash light) that one of the brake cables has been broken off while travelling, the reason being, We recently had the van serviced and was told that 2 of the wires to the brakes where broken off so we only had braking on 2 wheels (4 wheel van), so this means I took the van to the service agent with no brakes, I would like to add a light to the dash indicating if something was wrong with the brakes on the van, any ideas?

@L2SFBC

2 ай бұрын

Always try your brakes soon as you move off. If they don't respond as normal...fix them. As for a system per what you describe, best consult your local auto sparky.

A truck travelling in the opposite direction has never corsed my caravan to sway,maybe a little when being overtaken by a truck.

Do you think that TSC on the car works as well as manually applying the electronic brakes to the trailer?

@L2SFBC

3 жыл бұрын

Good question! This is just an educated guess, but I suspect the trailer systems work more effectively, and definitely when there is a significant sway.

Robert, my new van has a Lippert system. Do you know much about how it compares?

@L2SFBC

2 жыл бұрын

No, sorry not looked into it.

Robert, is the Bosch/Dexter system compatible with Titan hydraulic power disc brakes? Who in Sydney can retrofit the Bosch/Dexter system?

@L2SFBC

2 жыл бұрын

I don't know the answer to either question sorry, contact AL-KO to find out.

Amazed at the difference.

I have Dexter sway control, $1500 for something I can't see except for a green led on the drawbar. Is it worth it. Firstly I think they should be mandatory on all vans, even insurance companies know they decrease risk which is why your premium goes down. Recently I got hit by a cross wind and I felt the red Being deployed. I would go far as to say they should be retrofitted before you can re register your van. When a van rolls it normally causes the tow vehicle to cross into incoming traffic. Motor accidents are tragic, you can't put a price on them , lives ruined for ever. Having said that THERE IS NO SUBSTITUTE FOR CAREFUL DRIVING,. How to minimise sway. Firstly ensure you van is loaded correctly, to much weight at the backccan cause sway. Secondly Don't drive to fast, avoid overtaking like the plague. I am very aware of that happens to the airstream around trucks, the air is pushed over the top PLUS either side, almost like that cross wind. If I'm in the left lane I trycand stay on 90 regardless, if a truck comes around I normally pull to the left as much as possible, and back off when the front of the trucks level with the back off the van. The reason to back off is to minimise the time the wind from the truck can affect the van. In essence it's risk management,ie minimising risk. I want to enjoy my van not live with regret of a nasty accident.. Sadly i think from observation many people towing drive way to fast and sadly most people drive way to close then wonder why they can't stop. Also part of minimising risk is if you keep your distance you may not get rear ended by the brains trust behind you. Why we don't have driver education on TV instead of Border Security and Mighty ships makes me wonder what a bunch of turnips they are appealing to???

@Cruner62

2 жыл бұрын

The Dexter only works with electric brakes not overrun as per European A frame trailers. Currently the only offering to the market is ALKO speed limiter system that introduces a problem when trying to pass a long Artic when the system is triggered it prevents the caravan from pulling clear and can cause the sway to worsen as the van slows down alongside.

@Steven_Rowe

2 жыл бұрын

@@Cruner62 inn Aus and most vans have electric brakes, The law here allows trailers under 750 kg no brakes, up to 2000 kg override brakes and anything over 2000 K must have electric brakes.

Great video. Thanks. Where can this be purchased in Canada?

@L2SFBC

2 жыл бұрын

No idea, sorry - contact Bosch or AL-KO or Dexter. Start with Dexter first, they have North American bases.

how do they work if the road is icy like from frost or a sudden freezing rain storm?

@L2SFBC

2 жыл бұрын

still work but obviously just less grip

Hi Robert I have just purchased a V2 Viscount 20 Foot Van. Weight loaded is 2,400 kg. We have a new Ford Ranger with TSC. Should I fit something to the Van? Thanks Martin

@L2SFBC

3 жыл бұрын

Impossible to answer...that is well within the Rangers limits but you may consider trailer systems important as you start a fast downhill in rhe wet with a sidewind.

Hi, great video. I am not sure how the Car TSC works, does it apply the trailer brakes as well as the car? If so, would it be able to apply each side independently? Thanks Steve

@L2SFBC

3 жыл бұрын

Car TSC doesn't do anything to the trailer. Both car and trailer TSC are explained here -> kzread.info/dash/bejne/m5mT1dyCpc2xiaw.html

@innovisionphotography7200

3 жыл бұрын

Hi Robert, appreciate the response and really get a lot of value from your vids. I was wondering, if the car TSC (TSA on my Pajero Sport) doesn't affect the trailer brakes and the recommended approach is to slow the trailer relative to the car, why isn't it a strong recommendation to install some form of trailer ESC regardless of whether the car has TSA or not. How effective are the car TSC systems once sway progresses? Thanks Steve

@L2SFBC

3 жыл бұрын

All explained in the video. If you get value from my work, please consider Patreon -> patreon.com/L2SFBC You can certainly use both towcar and trailer TSC together. It all depends how much you want to prevent sway - if your towcar weighs say 2700kg and your trailer is 1500kg, not much to worry about. But if your towcar is 2100kg and your trailer is 3300kg...I'd want it all. Car TSC tends to detect sway very very early so you may not even notice it working.

Correct me if I am wrong, but it is a legal requirement to have electronic trailer braking system when towing any trailer over 2000kg. Does a vehicle with TCS still require an electronic braking system for the trailer; and if so, does one of the systems in your video meet this requirement - i.e., in Lieu of the older style manual application braking systems we historically fitted? Great video BTW, thank you.

@L2SFBC

3 жыл бұрын

The requirement is for independent brakes over 2000kg GTM, although there have been exceptions granted. A towcar with TSC (Trailer Stability Control) definitely requires trailer brakes as all TSC does is detect and eliminate (hopefully) sway. It doesn't help slow the trailer down. Not sure about the older style manual braking? If you mean override brakes they still exist.

What happens when a sway control hitch or weight distribution hitch is added, between the trailer and tow vehicle? Would that be a hinderance to the electronic sway control systems? Thanks

@L2SFBC

2 жыл бұрын

one of my followers, Pam Love, has found a sway control hitch conflicts so use one or the other. Suggestion; test it. WDH makes no difference.

@pamlove421

2 жыл бұрын

As the follower named Pam Love I can say a resounding yes it affects my ESC. I've found using both they fight each other making my truck very difficult to handle. I use my hitch sway control. From what I've read, this is not typical, so your mileage may vary. 😊✌

Great video - If I already have TSC is this actually better than the Alko system? What I am really asking is do I actually need anything else if I already have TSC.

@L2SFBC

3 ай бұрын

TSC on trailer or car?

@alaw_perth4668

3 ай бұрын

@@L2SFBC its on the car

@L2SFBC

3 ай бұрын

OK. I'll answer that on my website tomorrow.

Just smart braking control for the trailer, which in and of itself isn't a bad thing, but...consider a free-floating weight underneath the trailer, as the trailer begins to sway the polar moment of inertia rapidly becomes unstable. A weight applied at the right place will be thrust against the opposite side to the swaying force, thus cancelling it out, acting as a sort of gyroscope. I am surprised trailer builders aren't installing their own by now.

@L2SFBC

2 жыл бұрын

The computer controlled differential braking is effective, simpler and doesn't add mass

@L2SFBC

2 жыл бұрын

kzread.info/dash/bejne/goeTtpVmqqbgeNo.html

Why do trailers with dual axles have them close together as opposed to being spread further apart? What are the physics behind that?

@L2SFBC

Жыл бұрын

Ease of turning.

Can any of these systems be installed on a US made R-Pod trailer?

@L2SFBC

2 жыл бұрын

Sorry no idea

What about anti sway bar hitches?

@L2SFBC

2 жыл бұрын

They help but better not to need them.

I was told by the weight distribution hitch rep that I should turn off the vehicle Anti-sway electronic system if there is a mechanical Anti-sway system in operation. This did not make sense to me. What is your opinion on that statement? Will an electronic sway protection and a mechanical system fight each other and degrade performance of both systems?

@L2SFBC

3 жыл бұрын

I disagree. Ask rep to explain their reasoning. Here is mine. The electronic anti-sway systems only operate if there is sway. The mechanical ones generally prevent sway happening in the first place. So, where is the conflict?

@Dadof5

3 жыл бұрын

@@L2SFBC my thoughts exactly! Thank you for the answer. On another topic: Have you looked into the effect that changing the equalizer on dual axel units (such as to the Moryde CRE-3000) have on trailer sway?

@L2SFBC

3 жыл бұрын

What's an equaliser?

@Dadof5

3 жыл бұрын

@@L2SFBC A tandem axel equalizer? It's the component that connects leaf springs in a dual axel trailer.

@L2SFBC

3 жыл бұрын

Ah yes sorry was thinking of something different. Yes brake pressure proportional to weight on tyre is critical for good braking. And an even distribution of weight helps prevent sway.

Anybody want a sailboat on a trailer?

Good video describing sway but I though you we’re going to discuss electrical sway prevention, like what is built into some vehicles, not just manually hitting the trailer brakes.

@L2SFBC

9 ай бұрын

that IS what this video is on!

These systems don't fix the problem of unbalanced loading of the trailer. It may prevent an accident but human idiot factor can override that quickly if the driver does nothing to change the loading of the trailer. Also the growing issue of car and trailer rigs exceeding Gross Vehicle Mass of the combined system. The towing cars are undersized and overloaded and the huge caravan trailers being towed by untrained, inexperienced people. It's time for caravaners to go through weighbridges for inspection like trucks do. If you want to drive a big rig, then big rig rules apply to you.

Bosch definitely does not describe their system the way you did.

@L2SFBC

2 жыл бұрын

How so?

thank you for these videos but frankly I think you owe an apology to the people whose car and trailer you shrank for this video. I hope you let them out before you shrank their equipment.

@L2SFBC

2 жыл бұрын

Lololol

The issue is the DESIGN. PIG trailers are dangerous. DOG trailers are more apropriate. Ask me why in a co-lab. To FIX the inherently UNSTABLE PIG trailers you need to spend a great deal of suspect technology that is prone to failure . KISS principal.