I remember the fugitive arc, and it makes it very ironic that you learn in post game content that GENGAR is the human who got cursed and his Gardevoir pretty much sacrificed herself to ensure that he wouldnt die. Him pointing fingers at your character while HAVING to know that its HIMSELF who was the cursed human....just...wow.

@Aurasoul.

7 ай бұрын

He was a jerk let's face facts when this arc happened I was legit shocked and mad actually when I was a kid XD

@ProfessionalNamielleLewder69

7 ай бұрын

It makes sense. Why else would a criminal point fingers towards an innocent man without provocation?

@MidnightWildspirit

7 ай бұрын

It also gets darker closer to the end You get.

@cameroncooper5941

7 ай бұрын

It never really clicked why he did that until many years after I'd first played PMD. He wants to prove you are just as bad as he is, that you're just doing good for your own gain like him.

@videogamerNattie98

7 ай бұрын

Gengar to me is the most interesting character and by technicality makes him the VERY first human to enter into the canonical version of the Pokémon world also I do feel bad I know he was a jerk but after what both of these two have faced I only feel pity and sorrow maybe it has something to do with the fact its been 10+ years since my first seeing of his action and that age has grown wisdom in that time. But personally I have felt that the fate they both faced and the result after it all was simply unfair because the person that did that action is clearly not the person who he is now that the whole thing is just tragic.

You know stuff gets super dark when josh gotta put a trigger warning for an entry

@UltimateGamerCC

7 ай бұрын

cant get much darker than Child Sex Trafficking...

@uprising4c19

6 ай бұрын

And this is sealing the deal on me getting into the first two arcs of Trails (Sky and the duology on switch)

What better way to have a Halloween Special then moments that make you say: “how did they get away with that?”

@shadowlinkbds

7 ай бұрын

Actually now it is an actual Halloween special. The editors are scaring us by making it seem it's tomorrow but it's actually today.

@alvaroperez2349

7 ай бұрын

@@shadowlinkbdsdo they have us fooled!

@TF2Fan101

7 ай бұрын

AKA Super Robot Monkey Team Hyper Force Go! And TRON: Uprising!

@Rusticabcd

7 ай бұрын

​@@alvaroperez2349 Kirby you gotta so SOMETHING!!!

@alvaroperez2349

7 ай бұрын

@@Rusticabcd I saw that one coming.

alphys wasn't trying to revive the monsters that became the amalgamates. she was trying to see if she could preserve their souls long enough to break the barrier but they happened to come back to life instead of turn to dust. it was an unintended result that she was just gonna roll with but then they started melting and became the amalgamates

@sarafontanini7051

7 ай бұрын

it should also be noted that she was horrified by what happend (I've seen at least one eprson treat alyphys like an irredeemable villain while ignoring her own feelings and motives) and was so riddled with guilt its implied she's suicidal and ends her own life in some neautral endings.

6:11 - 9:19 Can confirm, *this* is why I firmly remain a Kirby fan. Also, we really need to start giving Shinya Kumazaki some credit. He’s the current director of the Kirby series after Sakurai stepped down. He’s dipped his foot into the eldritch and cosmically horrible, and came out a master of his craft: making quality Kirby games, and casually setting some of the darkest lore imaginable in stone for the Kirby series as a whole.

@Cata-qp6fi

7 ай бұрын

Also the director does awesome eldritch art

@pancakes8670

2 ай бұрын

Yeah, a lot of people forget Sakurai doesn't direct Kirby anymore, and it's the current director who's leaned more into the Kid-friendly eldritch horror

After both Athena and Renne entries…. Here’s an idea: Top darkest videogames backstories

@angeldario6271

6 ай бұрын

That I could get into, but I know could never use that to introduce my gamer friends to this channel. Some of them have been through some s***, or really empathize with anyone who has been through some s***. Cool concept tho🤩

@LunaP1

4 ай бұрын

You know Astorian would end up on that list somewhere. Poor sexy, sassy vamp.

@thatonecubchoo1541

Ай бұрын

@@LunaP1 *Astarion, but yes, he would.

@TheSh1nyZoroark

Ай бұрын

Magia Record, a spin-off of Madoka Magica, could probably score an entry

All I have to say about Renne's backstory: that is honestly one of the most ****ed up backstories I've ever heard of in my life for a video game character.

@BlueB360

2 ай бұрын

Or ANY character

"Kirby Pause Screens would get along real well with the Pokedex" So fun fact about that... The team that writes Pokedex entries and the team that designs Pokemon are two separate teams. The designers have no clue the adorable balloon is written as a child kidnapper, or the goofy big mouth giant Gengar is a portal to hell, etc. until later.

@mythicalthings1796

6 ай бұрын

So PokeDex enrires are even less credible then they already were, goooot it.

@zeal9442

3 ай бұрын

Basically, the Pokédex has always been 99.99%​ utter bullshit. @@mythicalthings1796

This video is the first time I found out about both Athena's backstory and Star Door 15. All I have to say is, "What the HELL, game creators!? How did you get away with this!?"

@emberfist8347

7 ай бұрын

Well the first one got an M-rating so they didn't. To me the darkest moments are ones in games rated T or lower as that causes me to ask that question. Specifically Batman Arkham Origins has a side-mission with Mad Hatter where he kidnaps a girl. It is heavily implied he r***d her and she is clearly underage. I mean what the hell? The game doesn't anything else close to that disturbing or dark.

@BlueCrimson10

7 ай бұрын

If it makes you feel better, Dual Destinies is also the first time you can silence a judge and get away without contempt of court

5:42 Another thing that I feel can kinda undermine the horror value of the True Lab is how, at the end of the day, none of the Amalgamates are any sort of malicious. The most threatening displays are from the Memoryheads seemingly trying to get you to join into a hive mind and Lemon Bread's ominous statements, but the Memoryheads treat the hive mind like a casual parts, and don't even force you to join, just act disappointed more than anything. And Lemon Bread's attitude can be chalked up to how two of it's components are antisocial introverts. Also they all have happy endings getting reunited with their families, so all's well that ends well I guess.

@newbiegamelover4767

7 ай бұрын

Gosh, I hate Lemon Bread! I can never avoid their chomping attack! They're the only Amalamate that I've ever died to, and it's always from that attack alone!

Athena's REALLY threw me for a loop. I knew shit would be bad, BUT DAMN. And Renne.... It's always the small little girls that always haunt us all.

When I first played through the first two Trails in the Sky games, one of the biggest thoughts in my mind was “Damn, I don’t think there’s a single kid in video games with as much baggage as Joshua Bright.” I also remember being really annoyed with Renne’s behaviour throughout SC and thought, “I hope in the future she’ll really get knocked down a few pegs and be slapped with a fat dose of reality.” Then I played Sky the 3rd and Star Door 15 happened…

@BlueCrimson10

7 ай бұрын

LOL when I saw the first part of this comment

When you started putting the Trails Series in your videos I told myself “there’s gonna be a countdown with Star Door 15 one day” and well, it’s here and just as hecked up as anticipated. Seriously, I cannot recommend this series enough. Seeing the growth of characters like Renne over the course of several games and seeing her go from small psychotic child to not-so-small only slightly psychotic teenager is just such a treat. And the bond she shares with Estelle and Joshua, especially in Sky 3rd and Zero, still brings me tears every time I see it.

@FlyingFocs

7 ай бұрын

At the expense of asking a stupid question, where would be a good place for a complete newbie to start?

@insecdroid

7 ай бұрын

I need to finish more games. I’ve only gotten through Trails of Cold Steel 1 & 2, but I love them. I started 3, and need to continue.

@SagittariusAyy

7 ай бұрын

Yeaaaah, I understand now why they’d want to censor that for later releases.

@ej8476

5 ай бұрын

Start at the beginning, as...hard as that might be. The narrative payoff is WELL worth it@@FlyingFocs

@kippies66

5 ай бұрын

@@FlyingFocs While you can "technically" afford to start at the beginning of each "Arc" (Sky FC, Zero, Cold Steel 1) you'll be shooting yourself in the foot in multiple ways if you do anything other than start at the beginning, that being Sky FC. I can narrow the long list of reasons down to the most important three. First, you'll of course be missing out on the story itself, but also your experience of it. The sheer joy of meeting characters both playable and NPC's from past games for the first time is something that cannot be recreated. Lastly, you'll also harm your gameplay experience. Each game adds new Quality of Life features in some form or another. The later you start, the more you're gonna miss them if you go back to older games.

The reason why I consider (SPOILERS FOR POKEMON SUPER MYSTERY DUNGEON) Nuzleaf's betrayal in PSMD is the darkest moment in the Mystery Dungeon series to me is... that was you father figure. That was the man who took you in and sent you to school, and now he turned you to stone and essentially *literally sent you to hell.*

@pikachuchris6302

7 ай бұрын

yeah. i don't really like smd, its kinda... meh for the most part with me, but good lord the darkness kept building up higher and higher the more entries in the series we got, and i friggin love the stories of all these games, even smd. good god smd got to levels of dark that i didn't even think were possible in A KIDS GAME. how the actual frick was this allowed to be rated E?! HOW?! like if danganronpa didn't exist, A FRIGGIN POKEMON GAME WOULD BE THE DARKEST THING I'VE EVER PLAYED!

@zeospark9715

7 ай бұрын

@@pikachuchris6302 I feel ya the game was a hot mess. Difficulty spikes like crazy, bringing back the dumb hunger mechanic, and the story was alright. It was incredibly dark though for a game

@isenokami7810

7 ай бұрын

@@zeospark9715 Bringing BACK the hunger mechanic? I didn’t know it ever left.

@isenokami7810

7 ай бұрын

Didn’t read because SPMD spoilers, but that makes this yet another reason to give SPMD another shot someday. It’s the only PMD I haven’t beaten, never even came close, but only because I burnt out early: that school prologue was too boring and way, WAY too long. And yet it has avid defenders, and I’m willing to bet there is a good game in there after the school; stuck around just long enough to catch some glimpses, in fact. Just a shame I was out of patience by the time I reached them.

@DeadlockDrago

7 ай бұрын

Honestly a moment like that may have hit me harder if the game wasn't constantly throwing plot twists at you so fast even M Night Shyamalan would get dizzy. Seriously, I just grew numb to them and went "Okay. Fine. Sure. Whatever." after a while. The only 2 that stuck with me after such bombardment were Yveltal's sudden arrival that also happened there (was definitely an oh crap moment) and the ending pulling an Uno Reverse card..... which the post game also undermined.

Star Door 15 is legit the darkest experience I’ve ever had in a game before. After a game full of magical creatures, strange worlds and quirky moments this basically dropped kicked me in the chest.

What gets me about the Sam and Max entry is just... How the games built up to that prior. When time travel became a thing, it's almost telling and honestly quite sad seeing Max go. Because in foresight... The games suggested just as much. In the past, the two are youthful eager kids who are playing games together, and generally having a good time. The future is so disconnected in that regard. Max in the future is almost just as young as he is throughout the games, just with sci-fi gimmicks. Sam on the other hand is old, likely suffering from more intense mental degradation. The Max he ends up with at the end probably also gets replaced. The tragedy is that they NEVER just get to grow together. Some version of Max just comes along as Sam's care taker, and it's sweet that he DOES care so universally about Sam he would do that, but Sam is lost in an old mind. Recalling his earliest adventures with the Max that he WAS growing up with. The one he likely had feelings for the most. It's such a gut punch looking at that scene again, because it really feels like the consequences of them NEVER truly opening to each other. They joked about it, they flirted with the idea, and were likely close to it multiple times. But it wouldn't last, so Sam felt incomplete, words not said to his little buddy.

The second I heard you say Trails I got chills... I still can't believe they actually pulled that off in a tasteful way

As you can imagine, I was thrilled to be writing entry Number 1 ^^ ...and I'm impatiently excited for when The Devil's Playhouse Remastered comes out ^^

@Starcat5

7 ай бұрын

Wait... I'm not subscribed to you? How have I been watching your work on other people's channels for so long and yet not anything that was purely your own? Time to fix that. -_(\

@jameslawrenson1208

7 ай бұрын

If this isn't his favorite franchise, I would be SHOCKED.

@nightshardthefanguidebrony847

7 ай бұрын

WHY DID YOU NOT TELL US MAX ACTUALLY DIES?!?!? All these years and you knew the tragedy??? I feel like i just had my heart ripped out after seeing no.1 💔💔💔💔💔;-; ;-; ;-; ;-; ;-;

@shadowlinkbds

7 ай бұрын

Thanks for ruining many childhoods of Sam and Max good sir. 😉

@michaelnelson1127

7 ай бұрын

Same for me! I was already [thankfully?] spoiled on the finale years ago when it was called one of the best finales, so I know what happens, but I’d still like to experience it myself! And I know I could just get the original on Steam, but I’m hesitant to do so in case the remaster gets announced shortly after!

I’m so glad that Renne’s backstory from the Trails series was in the list because I literally had to leave my controller for a bit after learning what she has gone through, she was just a child for crying out loud. Did not expect at all how insanely dark it got. There are a few other dark moments but Renne takes the cake or she will rather host a tea party to take things. The Trails series is my all time favorite series and the characters and world building in the series are the main reasons why. I love Renne and I can’t wait how she will be in Trails Through Daybreak next year.

@theskullboy8700

7 ай бұрын

Bro that crap was hard to listen to.

@christiandauz3742

7 ай бұрын

Uh, have to break this to you kid but... ...The Catholic Church has being 'doing' countless Renees since TWO THOUSAND YEARS AGO That's one of the reasons I'm Atheist and I find it strange that Josh is Religious

@tylergardner8033

7 ай бұрын

@@christiandauz3742 Believe me I am well aware. The history of the world is full of dark deeds that still plagues to this day. I don’t find it strange that Josh is religious, everyone can choose what they believe in.

@christiandauz3742

7 ай бұрын

@@tylergardner8033 The sooner Atheism becomes dominant the better things will be

Something I really love about Pokémon Legends: Arceus is that it’s basically a Pokémon Mystery Dungeon game but with humans. Let’s see… -you’re brought to another world from your own in order to resolve a conflict -you’re part of a larger exploration guild but you also have your own independent team -there’s npc quests with items and new Pokémon as rewards -there’s a ranking system -there’s an extended period of time where you can’t return to the main hub SPOILERS you get betrayed by someone you trusted

@wyattmcgahey3035

7 ай бұрын

your also a human from the future who wakes up on a beach, and item management.

@Shantae1188

7 ай бұрын

As someone who never played a Mystery Dungeon game, but has played Arceus, I both saw the twist coming and STILL felt like I was caught off guard when it happened

Nobody was ready for star door 15 And it remains the most gruesome backstory not just for a trails character but for a jrpg character in general

Pokemon Mystery Dungeon Explorers of Time was probably the first time I ever felt *scared* playing a Pokemon game. The way the tone shifted in the plot was insane!

Honorable Mention: Suguru Kamoshida from Persona 5 - A bit of an explanation: Picture a game that, while having plenty of dark elements, tends to have more fantastical moments to help you escape... only to undergo sheer mood whiplash of the (depressingly) realistic scenario of a statutory rape victim attempt suicide on screen and explicitly state the main target was behind it and that he's been pulling strings to get your player character expelled in the same scene. Sounds fun, don't it?

@MrAuthor3DS

7 ай бұрын

And let's not forget bits about other Palace rulers: - Madarame: He purposefully let Yusuke's mother die to a seizure in front of himself just so he could profit off her final painting. - Kaneshiro: Mainly, what's implied to happen to Makoto if you don't steal his heart before the deadline. - Futaba: Just the fact that the conspirators would put a child through all that guilt...! - Okumura: His lethal mental shutdown on live TV. - Shido: He apparently had a suspicion that Akechi was his bastard-son, but happily used that possible knowledge to manipulate him more easily. ...And also the Monarchs in Strikers: - Alice: Her bully was really relentless if she went as far as telling young Hiiragi to kill herself...! - Natsume: Considering how his editors were using him, I can't help but feel that Prince of Nightmares was written as a cry for help. - Mariko: She was probably the most noble of all the Monarchs, but she was still blaming all of her staff for what a few sleazy fellow politicians did. - Ubukata: ...His Jail in general. Everything about his Jail. - Akane: The reveal that the person blamed for her mother's death was forced to commit suicide - and Akane felt worse for how his family felt. - Konoe: Oh gods, his backstory... - Ichinose: She got gaslit by everyone's accusations of her being "heartless" just because she couldn't express emotions as easily as them. That, uh...hits hard for me. No surprise she was almost convinced to help EMMA create a world with no Desires.

@phantomstorm359

7 ай бұрын

There are so many dark moments in Persona 5, including spinoffs like Strikers and Q2. From Kamoshida, to Futaba's issues, implications of human experimentation in Ubukata's jail, and the 4th labyrinth in Q2. More I think about it though, good God third semester has to be the darkest moment in that era, if not a close contender. Waking up in a dream world with everything granted sounds great, but that doesn't erase just how wrong and unnerving everything feels, only Joker and Akechi seem to notice something off and along with Yoshizawa finding a palace visible in the 'real' world (showing that the Metaverse is still bleeding into reality). Not only that, but the rest of the Phantom Thieves are stuck in this reality for a good while and you can't do much about it around the first week or two. Further adding to this arc is the palace itself, the twists that proceed, the identity of the palace ruler and his motive, and seeing just how he's distorting reality. The more I think about it, the creepier it gets and the more I love it.

@Jacob_G9

6 ай бұрын

@@phantomstorm359 HELL, just include Persona in general, Innocent Sin and Eternal Punishment's Final Ending is genuinely screwed up.

@ElNeroDiablo

4 ай бұрын

@@Jacob_G9 Then there's what happens to Inaba if you don't discover the TRUE culprit of all the murders and murder-attempts and thus lock yourself out of the TRUE Good Ending. Oh and Persona 3's whole thing with Nyx and how it (as the God of Death) is 'defeated', followed up in "The Answer" in Persona 3: FES. Like, good grief ATLUS - are your writers okay or do they need therapy?! (if the game development isn't already their therapy)

The best thing to come from the dark moment at #4 is the fanart I've seen that gives the character in question draconic additions to their human form, and I love the design so much. The fanart also leaves them as 30ft tall or so, but that's neither here nor there 😁

As a HUGE Miitopia fan, it's nice to see it be represented in a countdown video! And, now that you mention it, Josh... *_HOLY CRAP IS THE BACKSTORY FOR THE DARK CURSE DARK!!_* 😱😱😱

@bradleyadams5252

4 ай бұрын

Yes, well the whole "casting off your own face" could essentially be a child friendly way of talking about self-harm. Not a pleasant topic, and one that can only be helped by support and patience.

Really appreciate the Trails of recognition in the video. Star door 15 really shocked me beyond believe when i experienced that. Definitely up there with the darkest moments in video games for sure.

Number 2 hit me in the feels. Child trafficking is a crime that should really have more attention brought to it and more heavily inforced.

I can honestly think of how they could've made Number 1 even darker.... by having Sam kill himself by leaping to his death as he could no long live without Max. Heck maybe that's what he was going to do if the other Max hadn't come in. Now that's dark and makes good fanfic material.

You actually used a soundbite from the Party Crashers/Sophist and I love you for that.

another reason the true lab's creepiness is brought down: ultimately the creatures inside are allowed to leave and noone's bothered at all and now they can be with their families the creatures seem to be pretty happy.

I think I'm used to dark moments in videogames appearing after all the plot twists I have seen... but I was just shocked hearing and reading about number 2... Wow...

@uprising4c19

6 ай бұрын

I learned it was for the FIRST Trilogy of the franchise, They threw one of the darkest bits in at the start of the franchise?! How long did that bit last before being censored?

@LordHapa

6 ай бұрын

@@uprising4c19 It took about a year for it to get censored. It was originally a PC game and those don't need age ratings in Japan so devs could get away with whatever they want as long as they have self made content warnings, but when it was ported to consoles a year later that bit had to be censored or it would've affected the age rating too much. However the english version is based on the PC version so there's no censorship there.

@uprising4c19

6 ай бұрын

So, the steam version is uncensored, but the PSP version is? (from wikipedia on consoles the game is on)@@LordHapa

Oh my god, Renne's backstory really, REALLY disturbed me. I wouldn't wish that on my worst enemy. And from what I could find because I don't play the Trails series, it seems that the cult was destroyed, with Paradise being the last remnant, which ended up being taken out by Ouroboros, so hopefully this never happened again…right?

@LowestExpectations

7 ай бұрын

The cult remains mostly abolished, with only a handful of surviving members, but its impact continues beyond its demise like a curse that plagues much of the world. It's a very interesting series and you should give Trails in the Sky a shot if you're interested.

24:33 - The moment you mentioned The Legend of Heroes, I knew *exactly* where you were going... poor Renne.

@warriorofdawn876

7 ай бұрын

Yeah. There's a reason why even Ouroboros were more than willing to help destroy the DG Cult. Those monsters are the driving force behind the tragic backstories of so many characters across the series. Tio and Ennea also suffered at their hands, and you just know there are going to be more victims of the cult revealed in the Calvard arc...

I love how at beginning of number 2, every Trails fan knew exactly what Josh was about to talk about (based on the chat's reaction)

No quote more terrifying for a Trails fan than "It would be my pleasure"

I prefer it when fictions mix up lighter moments and darker moments and do it well, instead of just a fiction being too much of one or too much of the other.

your forgetting another Dark moment, Sonic DX where the Echidna tribe was so obsessed with power that they Wanted the power of the chaos emeralds and they almost did by killing the chao's and when they were about to get the emeralds Chaos awakens and obliterates the whole tribe leaving Tikal saddened and heartbroken that both the chao's and and her own clan were killed and thus caused Chaos to take all the emeralds and Almost destroyed the world as Revenge for the death of his friends.

Josh, mentioning Trails: 😃 "Let's talk about Renne": 😨

As someone whose favorite videogame series of all time are Trails and Etrian Odyssey, and whose favorite game of all time is Trails in the Sky the 3rd, I KNEW Star Door 15 would be high up on the list and the Sandy Barrens genocide would be at least an honorable mention. But yeah, Star Door 15 is so vile that I genuinely had trouble reading it. I tend to put my all into voicing unvoiced lines, and about a third of the way through, I took an hour long break. Star Door 15 broke me, to the point where the track Stairway to Gehenna, as well as the words "it would be my pleasure" trigger Vietnam flashbacks for me.

i remember the fugitive arc. i was TERRIFIED to the point i never went into town to stock up one last time. it wasn't until one of my later playthroughs that i realized you could. tho i think Gates has the better 'running away' part, there's still no denying what the original gave us. now Nintndo; GIVE US A NEW MYSTERY DUNGEON! IT'S BEEN 3 GENS!!!

No joke kid Athena covered in blood smiling, while saying “something’s wrong with mom, so I’m taking her apart to fix her!”. Made me shiver I was so shocked. I know she was a child and didn’t know any better also being in a dazed state didn’t help, but still you just can’t help but think who would do that

I definitely recall years ago with the darkest mario moments countdown but I guess this time anything goes now. Theres a lot of surprising dark moments throughout non horror games and I cant wait to see which ones will be on this list.

The conquest ending reference in Neptunia Sisters Vs Sisters was a massive surprise for me. For those not in the know, the Conquest Ending was basically the ultimate bad ending in the second game. That was already a surprisingly dark moment in of itself, considering the general tone of a Neptunia game, but they went as far as to reference it later in SvS. It's like, "Hey, remember when we had that really dark ending where everything went horribly wrong? Yep, that was a thing that happened"

At least in the story version of the Etrian Odyssey remake (Untold) killing the Forest People is less committing genocide and more putting down a tribe that has been driven insane by the corruption of the Yggdrasil Core (Primeval). The loli chieftain even becomes a guild master for your guild after you beat the boss rather than presumably wander off to die off screen. Granted she still resents you despite knowing there was no other option, but she still sacrifices herself in the final battle just to help you kill off the core for good. So still a genocide I guess...

@isenokami7810

7 ай бұрын

I feel like Untold 2 has some better dark stuff. Guess that wouldn’t have qualified for even an HM, though: once the dark stuff sets in, the cycle of sacrifice to keep the world from ending, the messed up way Bertrand “abandoning” his place in the cycle for legitimate and originally temporary reasons f$&&ed it up, the master of Yggdrasil and what he does with souls, it all completely changes the course of the quest down to its objective.

14:22 NO WAY!!! A PARTY CRASHERS REFERENCE??? Sophist ramming in for some hilarious moments with that one quote

@Cata-qp6fi

7 ай бұрын

And so, Nick couldn’t recover 😂

@lozangekitten-gamer7626

7 ай бұрын

Exactly 🤣🤣

IMO Links Awakening should have been somewhere on this list. In order to beat the game, everyone is erased except for you, marin, and the windfish, and marin only survives if you never die in the game.

@isenokami7810

7 ай бұрын

That one is made darker by the deaths of the seventh and eighth bosses, well after you’ve had the dream reveal. They question why you’d ever want the dream to end…because they think YOU are also part of the dream. Even the spawns of the nightmare, mostly aware of the truth, have no idea who you are and why you’re ending their existence.

@michealforguson5317

6 ай бұрын

"My Strength...is gone. But you will be gone, too. Remember. You are in the Dream!" Evil Eagle "WHY DID YOU HAVE TO COME HERE?! IF IT WASN'T FOR YOU, NOTHING WOULD HAVE TO CHANGE! YOU...ARE...IN THE DREAM!!!" Hothead. (His speech is in all caps, since he's...well, a fireball.) "Our world is going to disappear soon....our world....OUR WORLD!" Dethi. None of them seem to realize that Link isn't a part of the dream, except for Moldorm who calls Link an outsider, so Slime Eel, Facade, Evil Eagle, Hothead, and Dethi question why Link would ever want to end the dream.

It's moments like these that make me shake my head at the "All video games are for kids" argument some people make. Especially those last two, yikes! I would personally add all of chapter 4 from Underhero as an honorable mention. The twists that come in that chapter... I was shocked considering the light-hearted tone up to that point! For those who haven't played it, I recommend it. Just don't go in thinking it to be like Undertale.

Renne’s backstory is probably the most disturbing thing I’ve ever witnessed in a video game.

17:31 a great bit of detail with this particular trial is the reveal of exactly what Black Locks are. The literal only time we see them in game is from Ace Attorney Apollo justice coming from the disgraced defense attorney, Kristoph Gavin. A man that has murdered people, and fabricated evidence just because he thought he was better than everyone else. (there’s also the interesting little detail that black marks locks were given to Trixie in the MLP/ace, attorney crossover turnabout storm. And despite it being a couple of years before dual destiny’s came out. They seem to portray what black locks mean pretty well.)

@isenokami7810

7 ай бұрын

Yes, exactly to that last paragraph! In fact, I think the Trixie locks, despite being from a fan work, are my favorite portrayal of the black locks. Mainly for Twilight’s reaction to seeing them, having whatever dark, suppressed emotions are tied to their secret reflected onto her; there is basis for that, Wright feels Gavin’s cold, malicious intent in his black locks, but the Trixie locks made powerful use of that aspect. Really makes you wonder how the black locks truly function, when put into perspective with Gavin and Athena. Though the explanation we finally get with Athena, that black locks hold back a secret the holder’s keeping even from themselves-a traumatic suppressed memory, basically-came after Turnabout Storm, I think that fits retroactively with Trixie the way that series presented her…but I don’t think it applied to Gavin. Nor do I recall Athena’s locks forcing intense dark emotions onto Wright. Trixie’s locks are merely the complete picture that put the issue in the proper canon into perspective: Gavin and Athena both present aspects that should define the black locks, but are mysteriously absent from each other’s cases.

@Nazo-kage

7 ай бұрын

@@isenokami7810 taking the discovered reason for Black Locks, if there something locked away from even the person themselves, if applied to Gavin would imply that even he doesn’t know what is the source of his driving force. What pushed him to do what he did even he doesn’t know.

Regarding TotK and Zelda being the Light Dragon, Nintendo has admitted that the Hyrule we see in BotW and TotK might NOT be the same one from the previous LoZ titles in the franchise. Basically, King Rauru and Queen Sonia may have founded a "New Hyrule"; one that exists so far in the future from the others that virtually nothing of the previous Hyrules remains (save for some ancient stories, images of long lost relics like the Triforce, and some game staples like the Master Sword).

@MegaMilesprower

7 ай бұрын

I honestly thought botw and tears were part of a unified timeline, where somehow all events prior to botw happen at some point. I could have sworn Nintendo said botw took place at the end of all three timelines

@L337M4573RK

7 ай бұрын

@@MegaMilesprower Yes, but how long after all 3 timelines merged into the unified timeline does BotW take place? When the 3 timelines merged, did Hyrule still exist, or was it and everything that occurred beforehand lost to legend and myth (except for the Goddess Hylia and the Master Sword)? If Hyrule was lost during the merger of the timelines, then King Rauru did establish the Kingdom of Hyrule...again. Curious how Queen Sonia has markings of the Triforce on her hands, isn't it?

14:20 I didn't expect a Party Crashers reference in a JoshScorcher video but, all things considered, it was a pleasant surprise.

A dark moment that comes to my mind is from Freedom Planet. After getting through the sixth zone (Thermal Base) as Lilac, she is knocked out and captured by Brevon, the game's main antagonist. When Lilac comes to, she's bound to a some device with Brevon in the room. He proceeds to reveal that Lilac's ally, Torque, is in the next room. Brevon demands Torque for information that he wants. When he doesn't comply, Brevon filps a switch that has an electric beam electrocute Lilac, who I believe is considered a kid. In an effort to save Lilac from more pain, Torque tells Brevon the information he wants. But then Brevon has Lilac electrocuted again, with this one leaving visible burn marks and smoke. Game has voice acting to, so Brevon gets to delight in Lilac's agonizing screams.

As one of the Trails enjoyers in your audience who's also been watching you since 2011, I love seeing it pop up on your lists. Star Door 15 was one of the most depressing and disturbing moments in any game I've ever played, but also one of the best moments I've ever seen. The way it was written, the music, the way it ties into so many future plot points in the series, and the fact that they were willing to include such a horrific plot point that other series fear to tread, making the universe come to life and feel so much more real than any other (which is why it's very high in my top 10 Trails moments video). That's a big part of why Trails in the Sky the 3rd is my favorite game in the series to this day, after playing every single one of them up to Kuro 2, which I finished recently. Sadly, later games don't quite live up to all the interesting things we learn about in Trails in the Sky the 3rd, but Renne's backstory has some very shocking links to a lot of the things happening throughout the entire series.

14:22 hey it’s the Party Crashers, nice addition

@shiffpup2529

7 ай бұрын

*monke noises*

@oldschoolman9878

7 ай бұрын

@@shiffpup2529 piplup pictures

14:20 that sophist clip of is your refrigerator running so funny and also unexpected from your video

It's not a stretch to say I love Miitopia. There's at least 2 pages on TVTropes about everyone's casting choices in each role - main hero, party members, NPCs. Then we have the Dark Curse. Tragic character, that one. In both 3DS and Switch, I made him the Pringles Mascot, because irony.

@marykateharmon

7 ай бұрын

I made him The Phantom of the Opera/Eric because I felt that the Dark Curse's story paralleled his.

One dark moment for me when it comes to videogames is in Persona 5... I know the Persona series has a LOT of dark moments, but seeing you and your team get erased from existence really throws your brain into crisis-mode. O_O (Anyway, the choice for #1 really hits home, and I wish you all a Happy Halloween! 🎃)

@Arexion5293

7 ай бұрын

If you think that's dark for Persona, try Persona 2 Innocent Sin. ... You know what, I'm not even gonna say what it is. Just go play P2 IS and Eternal Punishment in some way, presumably emulation since there are no other proper methods of doing so. Eternal Punishment's PSP remake did get a fan translation pretty recently too.

@hestiarose

7 ай бұрын

Persona 5 is generally a pretty dark game though. Like, there's plenty of light moments, but I think the existence of Kamoshida's arc at all disqualifies that moment from making the list.

@kaelanmcalpine2011

6 ай бұрын

@@hestiarose Yeah and it also doesn't really help that it's the first one in the game, so they came out swinging with that one.

@kaelanmcalpine2011

6 ай бұрын

@tomboyangel78 That's a good one and I think I can also say Hebijo's route from Senran Kagura Shinovi Versus is kind similar, only you're playing as the team of girls that are causing it. For the most part, the series as a whole is basically just magical girl ninjas with (mostly) big boobs that fight each other alot supposedly to kill each other, but in reality they just rip each other's clothes off. Though there are dark moments here in there, but it's mostly backstory and most of them involve a beloved friend or family member dying at some point (though Homura was exiled from being a good ninja because of self defense, which makes an exception to the rule). Sure there's youma which everyone fights but in gameplay they're not much of a threat that they can kill any of the playable cast. Then you get to Hebijo's route and Miyabi is out for blood, and it seems her newly formed team was somehow convinced to be not much different (well Imu would've already been this anyway). Starting from the second chapter, they kill each girl of the other playable girls one by one with Gessen and Hanzo being in the way of their real targets, the Crimson Squad, which is their final massacre. Then once all of that is over, the two twins, Ryouna and Ryoubi, stage an assassination against Miyabi for supposedly killing their older sister (she kinda did, but it was out of mercy rather than malice or just winning a battle). Imu's younger sister, Murasaki, took the bullet for Miyabi and Imu got pissed off so much that she went berserk in the same way her sister does on a regular basis. Despite all of that at the end, everyone in Hebijo survives somehow and thankfully most of the story isn't canon anyway.

Isn't Legends Arceus supposed to be Mystery Dungeon but you get to remain human?

4:29 The fact that I heard that EXACT JonTron clip in my head mere SECONDS before it actually happened made me freaking lose it! 🤣🤣🤣

Heres a non game honourable mention in Gundam witch from mercury. The main character, Suletta Mercury's main moble suit, is HER OLDER SISTER in the series prologue her name is Eri, and she became linked to the data storms during a purge and a extra bit being Suletta first kill

@baittheawesome3861

7 ай бұрын

Spoilers: My honorable mention is conker bad fur day's ending. You may consider this a surprising dark game but i consider it a surprising violent game. Theres a differance any way. The whole game up until the ending was funny, joking around and whenever somebody died it was treated as slapstick but berri death and ending was depressing as hell. Not only did it come out of complete nowhere, it stayed that way forever. What makes it worse is that in the final cutscene when he returns to the pub, just to figure out that war chapter with all the slapstick deaths were actually his friends and conker is just sitting alone in silence. By far, the most depressing ending i've seen in any 3d platformer.

@Nameless-ln5mr

7 ай бұрын

I’ve got another non-game example from the Gundam franchise. The midway point of Gundam Build Divers Re:Rise. The “Build” Gundam series are meant to tell stories about kids playing games with Gunpla, with the conflicts being silly when viewed from a Doylist perspective. But then… EPISODE 11 HAPPENS. The BBEG appears, reveals his plan to nuke the beast people living on the world the heroes were defending under the pretense that it was part of a series of quests they were doing for their MMORPG, and then… the heroes lose, the WMD goes off, destroys the temple that our protagonists and their Gunpla spawn in, forcing them out of the game, and temporarily locking everyone out of GBO. THAT’S NOT THE WORST PART. The worst part is that IT WASN’T A QUEST. THOSE BEASTMEN WERE REAL PEOPLE, LIVING ON AN ALIEN PLANET, AND ACTUAL INNOCENTS DIED. In other words, that silly little anime about kids playing a video game turned into a pseudo-ACTUAL LIFE-OR-DEATH GUNDAM SERIES.

Funnily enough, I was a Charmander with a Pikachu friend in my playthrough of Pokemon Mystery Dungeon, Red Rescue Team. Thanks for the memories.

Miitopia is one of my favourite games, and the way the Dark Curse is utilized in Funny Mii Game is one of my favourite parts of it. Despite how choosing to break the dark curse prevents you from fully completing the game, there's no "real" wrong answer in whichever ending you choose.

14:20 is that the party crashers!? I love the party crashers

Dark stories can be both interesting and scary

14:20 never in my life would I expect a Party Crasher quote in a FieryJoker video, but I'm not against it at all! 🤣

@alihamadqabazard2857

7 ай бұрын

Yeah I was surprised.

Regarding #8… wow, I’ve never thought of that connection before. I wonder what other cues the Kirby series took from Fire Emblem for its villains?

@CountShaman

7 ай бұрын

Void also shares resemblance to Grima, given they're both considered some of the top tier threat of their respective universes while also being the main character's body double. I'd argue Void is way better since not only is its design and use of power in the story more creative, but knowing Kirby's reputation, being on par with him is considered an upgrade, as opposed to being a counterpart to some guy that was just introduced in their own game.

@Shantae1188

3 ай бұрын

And unlike Grima,Void is allowed to survive. Beat Soul Melter EX and you basically manage to purify Void into a helpful being

Ok, yeah. That bit with Athena. That’s freaking insane!

Of course the Trails pick would be Star Door 15. Anyone after seeing the contents of Star Door 15 will be extremely shocked at minimum.

Yeah, I knew #2 was going to be mentioned here. First time I played through that... _thing_ as a teen, it actually made me vomit. Somehow being shown nothing explicit disturbed me more. And this is the same guy who played Silent Hill 2 and barely got fazed by Pyramid Head. At the same time, the way the story was presented is goddamn masterful. They're not even trying to hide how abhorrent that shit was and honestly, I'm glad Renne is doing waaay better these days. Gods know she needed therapy.

I would have thought that this video would never get monetized when Josh mentioned Renne’s backstory, but KZread seems to smile upon Josh today.

I can remember another surprisingly dark moments in games: Like ending Shadow of Colossus, when I finally realized that I killed innocent creatures for no reason. N’s past when he was abused by Ghetsis, and was locked in his room (dang even this room’s theme is disturbing and sadly as same time). Shroobs’s invasion and final battle with Elder Princess Shroob. Moment when Kefka destroyed entire world and killed almost all humanity. True About Dark Elf Wars. Sakura Matou’s origin, this is main reason to hate Shinji and Zouken. Sayori’s Suicide was kinda unexpected. Gerald and Maria’s death was dark and tragically. GLaDOS just everything about her.

I like to pretend that Kamando (who is implied never trusted you) watched you sleep every night and then went crazy from the lack there of when the sky exploded

It makes Angel Core hit harder IMO mostly because lore wise both later in BL2, some bits in BL: Pre-Sequel, and a side quest in BL3 that points out that Jack wasn't kidding on what he said relating to angel's terrifying power. She is able to "Talk" to machines and she only used it a little before, but when she was scared by a bandit she accidentally took command of a Hyperion turret and dumped a good number of rounds into him... Unfortunately she also swiss cheese'd her own mother in the cross-fire and Jack not only felt that pain. But could only think of locking her up to get her away from everyone via connection to "Control core: Angel". His daughter even hates it and lashes out in fearful sorrow about it... Only for her to basically go numb to that pain. She basically was wishing for death by the time Jack started pumping Eridium into her veins to charge the key and use it early. So in BL2, the VH's are basically putting her out of her torture filled misery. Honestly it makes it worse that this game isn't even the most dark, IMO that goes to my main man Krieg... Jesus fuckin Christ that's a dark pit in the void of space.

Now Josh really needs to do a Miitopia playthough sometime Personally, I don't see downloading others miis as a lack of creativity, but more so a matter of, not having the time to make all those complex miis. Its why Mii Central was made in the original version (that will be dead soon, and I am still sad that's going to be the case.)

@uprising4c19

7 ай бұрын

Also, there is a funny TF2 video called Miitopia Fortress that tells the story of Miitopia with TF2 models, and not TF2 miis. Go see it, it is very funny

I'd like to honorably mention the ending of Professor Layton and the Unwound Future. Level 5 pulled all plugs on that one and left no one with dry eyes afterwards. Like, there are clues throughout the game that hint to part of the ending, but what happens after that rather obvious reveal was completely out of nowhere.

JOSH WATCHED THE PARTY CRASHERS! YES!

21:35 LITERALLY breathed a sigh of relief as you said it XD

14:20 I wasn't expecting a Party Crashers reference out of this, but I'm happy about it!

34:06 It's actually been established more than once that Max possesses an awareness of all memories and experiences of his alternate selves across time and space, so in a way it _is_ the same Max but in a different body.

Great video. I love when media dose dark right. Not for superficial "look at how adult I am", but for exploring or experiencing for potential long-term positives, talking about important things, learning to get past/cope with trauma...and the like. I would recommend checking out Laika Aged Through Blood sometime. It is a fantastic game, better than the sum of it's parts.

Surprised that Alice: Madness Returns’s plot twist wasnt on here. As DaFawfulizer put it, and I full heartedly agree, “The ending of Fran bow, is tragic, but the plot twist in Alice: Madness Returns is the most disturbing plot twist I’ve ever seen.”

@absollum

7 ай бұрын

Probably because the game isn't exactly happy.

@Dafawfulizer

7 ай бұрын

Honored to be mentioned here, but l don't think it would fit because Alice Madness Returns is already dark as hell, and isn't exactly subtle about where it's going.

@DR_L3G0

7 ай бұрын

@@Dafawfulizer omg I didn’t think you’d see this. Though now that I think about it you are right. But I’m surprised you didn’t talk about Star Room 15 on your lists (no offense) and now after I watched this, I don’t know which one I find more disturbing

@Dafawfulizer

7 ай бұрын

I never played any Trails games. That's the main reason.@@DR_L3G0

@tanandalynch9441

7 ай бұрын

The game is full of subtle clues to this and is dark in and of itself so that twist isn't really that off putting

30:21 Honestly all she had to say is, “You remember the movie “Old Boy,” right?” And I was like. SAY NO MORE!

Now you got me thinking of moments in dark moments that were surprisingly light hearted and/or silly. Like in the first FEAR game when first meet Norton Mapes. After dealing with stress inducing enemies that use stealth and attack from walls and ceiling’s you then see a overweight nerd fall through the ceiling while making a silly scream and farting on impact with the floor. Afterwards the dark and tense music is replaced with music you would hear in a kids cartoon. Anyone else has any examples of dark games going silly?

I love how you included The Amazing Digital Circus at 15:43

"oh i bet the Pokémon entry will either be the ending of SV or the Guzzlord dimension from Ultra--OH GOD I FORGOT ABOUT MYSTERY DUNGEON!!!" Had to skip the Zelda entry but I'm at least far enough that I can guess what happened.

Happy Halloween to you as well Josh & Nice List some of those really spooked me. personal picks Splatoon 3’s Alterna’s backstory Xenoblade Chronicles 2 Pyra & Mythra’s REAL reason for going to Elysium NEO The World ends with you Rewind’s purpose.

@KrimsonKattYT

7 ай бұрын

Eh, XB2 is more so of a sad moment and it's heavily downplayed by being in the same cutscene as the most triumphant and epic scene in the series. (The Master's Awakening)

@MrAuthor3DS

7 ай бұрын

For Xenoblade 2, I'd go more with Rex's initial death, Amalthus's full backstory, or Nia being a substitute daughter.

@cjthenarhwalking1378

2 ай бұрын

There is also morytha from 2

Zelda's eyes changing is giving me some Majora's Mask vibes, for some reason.

The true origins of the Hero Relics and the Crest system as well as Nemesis and the 10 elites and Fodland in general in Fire Emblem Three Houses and Three Hopes

9:50 **nervous chuckle** miitopia doesn't get serious all that often but when it does.... oh boy...

Im sooooo excited! These sre my favorite of all tier lists of youtube! Love you JoshScorcher, remember you with GreenScorpion and RabbidLuigi!

One I would say would be the conversation with Sovereign in Mass Effect. Cuz like, it’s never been a really cheery series, but that moment is what pushes the series from space opera to cosmic horror. It’s where you come to realize that you are not some galactic superhero, you are an ant before forces far greater than you, surviving simply because they’re not here.

14:20 love the party crashers/sophist, Nick Brent and vernias reference.

@uprising4c19

7 ай бұрын

Link to the video please?

@timewarpchronos3795

7 ай бұрын

@@uprising4c19 I can’t post the link but I know it’s a Video it is it’s Mario party, but last place wins

@Cata-qp6fi

7 ай бұрын

I think it was there where the “refrigerator running” started, right?

Know what would have made zelda tale more surprinsingly darker? Is we had to actually kill the dragon shadow of the collosus style to get the master sword.

So, what have games been able to get away with? The fact that the True Lab is the thumbnail speaks volumes. 10: I need to play this. (Control Core Angels (Borderlands 2)) 9: The existence of the genocide route does indeed take away from the horror. If we're talking about another moment, I'd also argue that the dinner scene with Sans at MTT Resort is a pretty dark moment, as well, albeit a short one. A friend you've had this whole time suddenly tells you that the only reason why you are alive is because he made a promise, and he'd kill you otherwise. Then he plays it off as a joke. (True Lab (Undertale)) 8: Thankfully, Susie managed to find a way to move on, using the company to help other planets (the English translation lies to you; she's not continuing to mechanize planets). (Sectonia & Haltman (Kirby)) 7: I never finished Miitopia, but JESUS CHRIST! (Dark Curse (Miitopia)) 6: Mystery Dungeon is not my cup of tea to play, but I appreciate what it brings to the table. (Fugitive Arc (Pokemon Mystery Dungeon Rescue Team)) 5: I want to play the Ace Attorney games SO BAD, but they won't release a big collection on the switch or something, and that's all I have in terms of handhelds. (Athena's Backstory (Ace Attorney)) 4: Good thing she managed to turn back. Imagine if Link had to lose both of his love interests. Jokes aside, you deserved better, Mipha. (Light Dragon (Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom)) 3: Make Mother 3 in English, Nintendo! (Giygas (Earthbound)) 2: ...Yikes. (Star Door 15 (Trails)) 1: ...Yeah, that deserves to be Number 1. (Max's Death (Sam & Max: The Devil's Playhouse))

@isenokami7810

7 ай бұрын

Uh, but I thought the first three AA games WERE on Switch in a collection. And the Great Ace Attorney duology. Okay, sure, you don’t have Dual Destinies with that dark moment (though I think the 3DS games are on mobile now), but Ace Attorney is on Switch.

@Shantae1188

7 ай бұрын

And the (3)DS Trilogy is coming out soon

@phantomdragon3893

6 ай бұрын

The whole trilogy is actually on stream a very good price

Triple Deluxe and Robobot were my first Kirby Games! That's enough for me to love them for the lore!

@sidhantpindiproli9112

6 ай бұрын

They were also my first Kirby games.

Me when I saw #2: Oh, I didn't know I was going to be reliving my past trauma today

Some dark moments that I can think from the top of my head are: [SPOILERS] • FF6 Doma Poisoning • All of Cave Story • The 'Living Doll, Dead Person' case from Digimon Cyber Sleuth • Finding out about The Elf Wars and Omega from Mega Man Zero 3 • The ending of MM7 • Nier Automata and the end of YORHA including the last moments of Operators. • Queen Sonia's fate from TOTK • The X Parasite scientist scene from Metroid Fusion • The drop of the Sector 7 Plate from FF7 • The reveal and backstory of the killer from A.I the Somnium Files. Also, the ice cutting machine. •Giygas from Earthbound • The Ansem Report experiments from KH1 • Nanana's Backstory from Crystar

@jaydenc367

7 ай бұрын

wait...was so dark about the ending of MM7 again?

@ya-kiri794

7 ай бұрын

@@jaydenc367 Mega Man expressing the desire of wanting to kill Wily as the past 7 games of letting him get away and the betrayal of Bass has taken it's toll on the little, innocent Blue Bomber. He is physically incapable of doing so due to being bound by the rules of robotics (to add insult to injury, Wily has to remind him of that), Wily gets away and Megaman walks away from the burning remains of Wily's castle behind him, unhappy that Wily got away again thus ending the game on a bittersweet note.

@thomasthecoolkid7228

7 ай бұрын

Oh god... that case is pure nightmare fuel, when you really think about it. It's not even just the end or some other specific moment, _the entire case_ is littered with freaky nonsense. Yes, Infermon and the last shots are both horrifying, but just the fact that someone potentially has dolls of all your female friends is kinda chilling too.

@lordfluffybunz2698

7 ай бұрын

Doma getting poisoned is really dark. But so is a lot of that game so I see why he didn't mention it.

@demongodking6681

7 ай бұрын

Ok these are good choices but have you all forgotten about how call of duties Nuke gets a Honorable mention but what about a moment in my opinion the most darkest thing in any video game which is basically what happenes in real life especially with war and that name of the game is called spec ops: the line more specifically the white phosphorus scene where it littleraly shows the casualtys of war more specifically the civilians and then the child in the persons arms its just a really dark scene so how was that not on here

One game I haven't seen mentioned in the comments is Klonoa: Door to Phantomile. Most of the game is very whimsical and cutesy, which is what you'd expect from the kind of 2D Platformer that it is. However, the story features two dark moments that come WAY out of left field. A little over halfway through the game, Joka, a rather goofy villain who's normally hard to take seriously, just outright kills Klonoa's Grandpa to get his Moon Pendant. There's even a pretty emotional scene afterwards with Klonoa and his Grandpa exchanging some words before he passes, followed by a downright heart-wrenching scream from Klonoa himself. The entire sequence caught me completely off-guard when I first played; I never expected a death like that, especially one caused by such a silly villain like Joka. And that's not even getting into the ending, where Klonoa learns that he doesn't belong in Phantomile and that all of his memories growing up there were fake (just like how you can have a dream where you live in a different place and not question it). He's then sucked out of Phantomile, being torn away from his friend Huepow and this world he thought of as his home. I mean WOW, talk about an out-of-nowhere gut punch of an ending.

#1 also works since the Max that comes in ends up losing his Sam, just like the our Sam did, making it just a gut-punch ending that, while uplifting, makes you want to just give them hugs even after the fact.

I played the Devil's Playhouse and yeah that part with the ending was grim for the Duo. But when you add the implication of Max wanting to off himself this whole time, yeah it got deeper.