The part where Cao Cao says there is no way to restore order, but there is a way to create a new order is so absolutely legalist and so pivotal to his character. Always reminds me of my favorite passage in the Hanfeizi from the Five Vermin chapter: 是以圣人不期修古，不法常可，论世之事，因为之备, "Therefore the wise man does not seek to mindlessly restore the ancients, neither does he seek to create an order for all eternity, but seeks to observe the things of his age and prepares to deal with them accordingly." All kinds of anti-dogmatism are at the beautiful black heart of legalism.

@vazzeg

2 жыл бұрын

@@charliecho5392 no, I meant it as a metaphor. Most people would say that Legalists, 法家, like Shang Yang or Han Fei didn't have compassion, they were only cruel and strict, which is simply not true if you read their works. They were strict, but all they did, they did it for the betterment of the people's lives. How Shang Yang stated that 法者所以爱民也, "Law is the expression of care for the people", or how Han Fei wrote that 忘民不可谓仁义, "He who forgets about the condition of the people cannot be called righteous and benevolent" etc. Legalists are always meant out to be evil simply because they were strict and didn't tolerate corruption, but they were some of the most caring thinkers of ancient China. So I used it ironically to turn it around and say that strict care is what matters, laxity only invites corruption. I hope I could clear it up a bit.

@frans3950

Жыл бұрын

Right, food for thought.

@eatYoself

Жыл бұрын

Thank you for this insight, I was debating my brother on how one changes the world. He firmly believes a strong willed person can enact change in the world through perseverance and dedication, I saw it differently and argued that in order to change the world one must first learn how to live and win in the world that is before they can realize the world they want to see.

@donpedro9004

Жыл бұрын

What's really ironic though was that Cao Cao had absolute control of the dynasty like Dong Zhuo and could've EASILY taken the throne for himself since the emperor's only role left was to legitimize his actions, yet he chose to simply set things up for his successors and leave it at that. By that he never technically creates a new order, but his reforms ensure that his government wouldn't stick to the same type of corruption the Eastern Han suffered in its twilight.

@paunitka7

Жыл бұрын

@@donpedro9004 I'm not sure he could take the throne just like that. It would have caused unrest. Creating this illusion that the Han emperor is still in power was way smarter. Very much like Caesar Augustus, who never crowned himself a "rex", but pretended that the Senate still has power.

Pragmatism vs Idealism. Cao Cao is the perfect ruler to bring order to chaos while Liu Bei is the perfect ruler to maintain order in peace times. Yin and Yang. That is why their rivalry is legendary and it is being told and will continue being retold for generations.

@roger9430

5 жыл бұрын

Tyr Alexander well said man

@user-dc1ud6px3s

5 жыл бұрын

In peace time Liu would be a mat-weaver.

@wolfgangsimonsiv9444

5 жыл бұрын

only an idealist would think it such 2 dimensional terms....

@xandercorp6175

5 жыл бұрын

@@wolfgangsimonsiv9444 When you contrast two people on a given attribute, it makes sense to assess them on that attribute. Not sure what is overly idealist about that...

@vivekvelumani2519

5 жыл бұрын

@@user-dc1ud6px3s 😆😆😆

Legalism School Perspective ( Cao Cao ) Vs Confucianism School Perspective ( Liu Bei ). All of them interprates the Tao ( Way / Order ) of All things , Cao Cao saw the core of the problem is lack of Merit and Effeciency within the ranks , Liu Bei saw the core of the problem is lack of Honor and Ideals within the ranks. In a nutshell basically.

@kevinreiss-coint2353

4 жыл бұрын

Good analysis

@SM-gd2rn

4 жыл бұрын

تحليلك ممتاز

@aayushabhusal4362

4 жыл бұрын

Exactly well said but at this age caocao seems practical while liu bei seems delusional or outright hypocrite.

@romolocoglianese1056

3 жыл бұрын

Profound insight Akhi!

@ljwljw21

3 жыл бұрын

You really nailed it

In the next scene, Cao Cao is sad that he couldn't recruit Liu Bei to his side and before anyone else he recognizes that Liu Bei is destined for great things and perhaps will be a dangerous rival. Cao Cao remarks to his lieutenant, 'He [Liu Bei] will not suffer to confined as a fish in a pond. He holds too great an ambition in his heart to be used by me. I only wish that he does not come to be my enemy in the future'

I really like how Cao Cao, despite not sharing Liu Bei's ultimate goals, can't help but smile at the latter's words.

@gendoruwo6322

5 жыл бұрын

Because he could see that despite all of Liu Bei's goodie-goodie talks, he'd just become one of the scheming warlords himself. Despite him talking about opposing those who abuse Imperial Power, is too actually just him being jealous of those who do. Liu Bei is a kind of person who would believe his own lies, and do so wholeheartedly. Of this Cao Cao understands very well.

@Killzoneguy117

5 жыл бұрын

@@gendoruwo6322 That's not it at all. Its because Cao Cao respects Liu Bei's integrity. More importantly, Cao Cao respects Liu Bei's perceptiveness and intelligence at being able to see the Coalition for what it really is. Up to this point, Cao Cao assumed that he was the only one who saw through Yuan Shao's coalition. Thus, he assumed he would be the smartest among all of them, and would easily be able to play them all to become the dominant force in China. But in Liu Bei, he sees a worthy adversary. An adversary who is smart, thoughtful, but most importantly, principled. He's Cao Cao's perfect mirror. The Pompey Magnus to his Julius Caesar, the Gaius Marius to his Lucius Sulla. Cao Cao is smiling because he's looking forward to the inevitable confrontation between the two and because he's genuinely impressed by Liu Bei, his qualities and the strength of his convictions.

@naasei2223

5 жыл бұрын

@@Killzoneguy117 do u have a link where I can download and watch this place. I just found it and feels it will be good series

@dharmdevil

5 жыл бұрын

@@Killzoneguy117 both of your points are actually correct. cao cao sees the virtuousness of liu bei, his potential, and sees him as a danger, but also his hidden ambitions. This is why he later says to Cao Ren that he can't invite someone to his side with such great ambition as liu bei.

@drb4074

4 жыл бұрын

@@naasei2223 kzread.info/head/PLQgby8Rb0ImEP4108x04Feg2dBvuDADJG

It is in this moment Cao Cao realizes Liu Bei was the most dangerous rival of them all.

@majinzero8656

7 жыл бұрын

@Kris Lel: He realized shit!! if you think cao cao had any respect for the hypocritical fool that is liu bei then re-watch the series, and liu bei by himself is no danger to anyone, without zhuge liang and cao cao's desire to use him 1st, he wouldn't have lasted that long, it's because of his imperial name that liu bei was safe, it is his trump card and the reason he does what he does, a mediocre untalented fool who thinks the world should remain slaves to his family.

@KiwiImpactSaint

7 жыл бұрын

Then you have to answer, why Zhuge Liang and many others chose to serve him instead?

@dunmill9632

7 жыл бұрын

Liu Bei realized Cao Cao is a man of an ambition, even able to risk a coup as well.

@majinzero8656

7 жыл бұрын

@Derrick Liu: to answer your question, 1st you have to understand the mind of a genius, the conditions that were present at the time and more importantly remove the fiction from reality (and all the propaganda against cao cao and the positif elements added to create a benevolent image of liu bei as a hero) zhuge liang as a genius would never have truly believed in the authority of a dynasty, that is something common among all great minds in all of history simply because it is logical, they simply have always disguised themselves as believers to get along (even those with little power saw the illusion of it all and that a power shift can happen in any moment like it always did, creating new emperors and dynasties, etc and that had nothing to do with the will of heaven) zhuge liang also never wanted to serve anyone, if a genius who appreciates intellect chose not to serve cao cao, why would you think he would easily be convinced by a talentless fool. the answer is related to 2 factors that have nothing to do with liu bei being worthy of his service. 1st, he was forced into servitude: the story of liu bei visiting him 3 times politely is a propaganda i'm sure, the fact that it was 3 times where zhuge liang wasn't present (implying he was trying to hide from liu bei, knowing of his coming) and that even in the romantized version, zhang fei put fire in his house is reasonable proof that they bullied him and probably threatened him with his family to come with them. 2nd, zhuge liang found it to be a chance anyways, since he has no choice now, better use his abilities to the max and try to create a miracle, it is an opportunity for him to shine and create a name for himself, which is something he probably couldn't have done serving cao cao, since wei is already succesful and is full of talented officials, he wouldn't have ranked up as high as with liu bei as well, in shu he became the prime minister himself. as for why others chose to serve liu bei, they really don't have any worth to them, the greatest and most talented men of that period chose to serve cao cao actually, it's just in the story, they chose to give more value to shu, zhang fei and guan yu are simply bullies who were the 1st to ally themselves with liu bei, and i assure you that it was for his imperial name, and indeed it got them far in life.

@KiwiImpactSaint

7 жыл бұрын

Majin ZERO Now you are making things up, Zhuge Liang was threatened into servitude? Really? And that exchanged the loyalty which lasted into a model for whole China? You are pushing your dogma way too far. Then you are saying Zhuge Liang wants good rank to serve Liu Bei. Zhuge Liang was one of most humble characters in the story, between Pang Tong's service and Liu Bei's demise, he wasn't even in spotlight, because he simply doesn't want. That's his style. You should know it very well, the only major mistake Liu Bei and Zhuge Liang made was to appoint Guan Yu to guard Jing, otherwise, it would be Liu Bei took over central plain. Cao Cao by then had hardly any chance.

3:58 - 4:28 You can see Cao Cao was impressed how Liu bei could see through everyone else's intentions for this war. They could've worked well together, but their own point of views separated them.

@kylepessell1350

Жыл бұрын

In theory, they would have made a good team. Despite what Liu Bei says, he does have considerable talent as a ruler and Cao Cao of all people could easily recognize that. It's too bad that they had such different ideas about the Han since many years of warfare could have been avoided either by more quickly establishing order or creating a new order. Their conflict drags things out and makes both of their goals slip out of reach.

@technomancer5449

5 ай бұрын

That indeed is an ever slightly increasing "You got it all down mate" smile. :D

This movie is the best 3 Kingdom version I've ever watch. Each actor potray the character perfectly

@salebaan1

11 ай бұрын

Name of the movie please?

@danclassic7065

10 ай бұрын

@@salebaan1 "War of the Three Kingdoms". Released in 2010 I think? There's a playlist with I think all but one or two of the episodes: kzread.info/head/PLCldpz_Pc1FrGQLsaxaV0kVPqmXN_nanN Highly recommend!

@ichidoriyou7472

9 ай бұрын

@@salebaan1 three kingdoms 2010, its a tv show, not a movie

@ichidoriyou7472

9 ай бұрын

@@salebaan1 94 episodes in total, you have a playlist of decently good quality but not all episodes

@nickskyblue3602

9 ай бұрын

no ,1994 version is best

They are like two halves of the one perfect Emperor. Each spent most of their lives trying to kill each other, but they always respected each other, and I think they were each jealous of what the other had.

I am of African decent, but watching this series has opened my mind to so many area's of thought regarding strategy and benevolence...I would def roll with Liu Bei, he was an honorable man, true to his people. Cao Cao was to be respected to for his ability to see ahead and plan accordingly. they are equally and highly respected in my eyes. Respect to china for documenting your history. Ashe.

@majungasaurusaaaa

7 жыл бұрын

The hell does your ancestry have to do with anything you said?

@Cyfiero

6 жыл бұрын

Don't be disrespectful dude, his point is that even despite coming from a heritage far removed from Chinese culture, he can greatly appreciate our culture, attention to history, and political and intellectual thoughts. Thus, by sharing his ancestry, it's to only add to his compliment.

@PulloffPrime

6 жыл бұрын

I'm with Cao Cao. He knows that power corrupts and that's unavoidable. The emperors were spoiled tools with no real say unless they were the first emperor of that dynasty that established the order. Liu Bei thinks restoring the Han will restore law and order. Really he was obligated to fight for the Han because he grew up as a distant imperial relative and had nothing to be proud of as a sandal maker, except for his own heritage. Though he denied it on the surface, Liu Bei under the hood was a man who dreamed of greatness. Cao Cao ignored basic protocol because they were customs to keep everyone in line.

@jackxiao9702

6 жыл бұрын

I'm of Chinese desecent and they're mostly evil mass murderers, many as bad or worse than Christopher Columbus, Stalin or Pol Pot. We can respect their talent, but it is important to recognize their crimes as well, so we will see it in future leaders.

@damiester1

6 жыл бұрын

The difference is that these warlords were trying to re-unite China, whereas Christopher Columbus was bringing disasters to OTHER countries. You can't really say any of the Chinese warlords were anywhere near the British Empire's scope of evil. I'm of Chinese descent too and I at least understand the differences in era or times of need.

Both actors are great at portraying their characters! Cao Cao may not be as evil nor Liu Bei be as saint as were scripted. They were just products of those times.

@Blackwolfninja89

4 жыл бұрын

Both of them did some good and bad in their days but I do like their rivalry in ROTK

@TheSamuraiGoomba

3 жыл бұрын

One of the best aspects of the tv show is how it expands greatly upon all of the characters. The original novel is fantastic, but highly biased in favor of Shu (Liu Bei's faction.) Many decisions which the novel wrote off as "Cao Cao being cruel" are given new context in the tv show, so as to better portray Cao Cao's ideals of realpolitik and pragmatism.

@joaquinferrazzi923

2 жыл бұрын

lol im sure the real cao cao did more evil than this fictional one. this one never wiped out entire families for the faults of one member

@HWDragonborn

11 ай бұрын

​@@joaquinferrazzi923"wiped out entire families for the faults of one member" Pretty normal punishment in ancient China, its called诛九族 or nine familial exterminations. Cao Cao wasn't the only one who do that, plenty of monarchs and ministers in ancient China also did that.

I love how these two are in the same room. They saw similar things but had different vision. That's why Cao Cao saw Liu Bei his greatest threat while Liu Bei also sees him as his greatest adversary.

@rekostarr7149

3 жыл бұрын

I would say that they are complimentary. Cao Cao however had more neuroticism; multiple murders out of fear for his own life and to maintain his status of tyrannical power. They would have been better teaming up was it not for the murders.

Regardless of who you think is right you have to admit the fact that we are watching a novel of their lives 1800 years after their deaths gives great strength to Cao Cao's viewpoint, hell if the Han didn't face ruin in that period we wouldn't be paying any attention to the lives they lived.

@ConstantineJoseph

8 жыл бұрын

They are all products of their times. The fall of Han empire was truly down to degeneration of command structures, the feudal system had not centralized command structures and given great military power to dukes who are like little Kings in their own right. With the suppression of XiongNu forces, enlargement of the Great Wall, monarchs were well insulated from battle and battle and command training. Leaving in kept weak emperors who have no military nous like the old emperors. Unlike Rome which was fragmented by a multitude of problems from shifting its power eastwards, to barbarian invasions to famines and inflation, the Roman Empire persisted longer than Han empire because the Romans would fight for one another with Honor to the death against a common for, barbarians and Huns. But China, as stated in this movie, fell because of degeneration of human principles and character. That is true, because of the infighting and civil wars that tore the nation without any external threat

@majinzero8656

7 жыл бұрын

everything is a product of place-time causality of course, but cao cao is a product of himself too, that's what differs him from others, what i admire most about him after his intelligence, is his WILL, the way he rose in a chaotic situation while remaining virtuous and true to his beliefs at the same time, he saw the opportunity to create order and he took it, whatever the means, he knew reason is the weapon, understood the power structure and what was necessary for him to prevail. all of this despite what others would think of him, no matter how harsh his actions seem to be.

@Cyfiero

6 жыл бұрын

Not necessarily true +Constantine Joseph, as one historian once said, it is a greater mystery that the Roman Empire persisted as long as it did, given it being on the brink of collapse for most of its history, for it practically only ever had 6 good emperors. For much of its history, it was corrupt and had a culture that valued military so strongly that it allowed military generals to routinely assassinate their state leaders again and again, almost on a whim. The military culture of Rome led to a devaluing of human principles as they came to overvalue masculinity and strength at the expense of human emotion and emotional intelligence, traits they associated with "weak women". The Han dynasty comparatively had a far more stable culture even if, like any empire of its day, it experienced court intrigues and conspiracies. Finally, saying that the Han fell to the feudal system exposes I think, ignorance of a basic fact of Chinese history, which is that feudalism was abolished with the Qin's reunification of China. It persisted in practice still for some more years into the Han until the last vestiges of it were done away with during the reign of Emperor Wu of Han in response to a rebellion that _was_ the result of lingering feudalism. This was during the peak of the Han dynasty, not at its fall.

@damiester1

6 жыл бұрын

lol wtf? The Roman Empire was the apex of degeneration of human principles and character. Most of their myths, history and culture were filled with cautionary tales of immorality. Not to mention, while China's individual dynasties didn't last long, the country itself did. By modern standards, China lasted longer than the Roman Empire. I would say imperial China's terminal point should be at the end of Qing Dynasty or even earlier at Ming Dynasty.

@zennoix9984

4 жыл бұрын

What if China was ruled by Han until today? Will China be a constitutional monarchy nation like Japan or UK?

This is the moment, you decide your team.

Liu Bei wants to restore virtue and principles to people's heart. Cao Cao knows that virtues and principles are different and impermanent across eras, but what is stable and permanent are strength and reason.

@majinzero8656

7 жыл бұрын

Damn Right, not only that but cao cao sees past the illusions of dynasty, he only cared about bringing order, not satisfying any dictator family that wants the world to stay on their knees for them. unlike the hypocrite liu bei who fakes being virtuous so that people will remain loyal to his family and defend them from falling, because without them he would be nothing.

@dunmill9632

7 жыл бұрын

Majin ZERO Cao Cao just had a short sighted mind. Without the principle or the cause, the world would be always swept by the strong ones who struggle to get the power. That's the way how the turbulent age begins. See what happend after Cao Cao died. Sima Yi got the power, and his family took the throne for themselves. The descendants of Cao Cao had no loyalful men near. People nearby just followed a man of weight and pursued the immense influence, just like Cao Cao and his men did. So no one defended for Wei dynasty in the end. Only Cao relatives strained to defend themselves against losing the power. In conclusion, his philosophy that only looks for the stronger and more powerful caused another the turbulent age, which is another catastrophe to the commoners. But how about Liu Bei's son, Liu Shan? Even though he might be the most inept guy in the three kingdoms (by the mishap Liu Bei tossed him in a spur of moment), many loyalful men showed the sincere intergrity for him, including Zhuge liang, Ma dai, Zhao yun, and so on. Of course, some ambitious guy, like Wei Yan, just feared of Zhuge liang, so he couldn't stage a coup while Zhuge liang is alive, thus he attempted the coup right after Zhuge liang's funeral, but it failed in the end. This is why the principal, which is acceptable, reasonable and based on the loyalty and sincerity, is so important. I'll be the first to admit that the Han dynasty established a little bit abusurd and ridiculous principals, which leaded to the corruption and repulsion among the officers, but the appropriate loyalty and faithfulness is inevitably necessary under the name of the principal and the cause in a big picture.

@majinzero8656

7 жыл бұрын

I agree about the principle in itself, loyalty and sincerity are necessary in a healthy society, but here is the twist, the context in which it is used and how it is applied, loyalty to what or whom? to the ruling class of course!! it is always the same trick, any false authority claims to be rightful and has a divine right to rule by masquerading itself with an objective principle used maliciously. this is also why i'm sheering for cao cao, what he says is the anti-dote and the weapon that all dynasties fear the most, the acceptance of the transfer of power, i never claimed cao cao reached as far in thinking as to create a perfect society and delete imperial rule, to perhaps replace it with a meritocracy among authoritarian figures (he did use a meritocractic method in his hierarchy tho) but he sure did see past the illusion of dynastic rule, and this is something rare in history, he cared for the people and was morally capable, even as an official in the han court in his early years. as for liu bei, he wouldn't have said that if he wasn't a han, that's how it always goes. the same struggle is still happening nowadays of course, although the true ruling class have become invisible to the masses, we still see the same philosophies in play, conservatives for example use similar arguments to legitimize the inheritance of their advantages.

@majinzero8656

7 жыл бұрын

besides that, regarding cao cao, no one had the audacity to create a new form of state, and he never united the kingdom to even think of that, what he could have done after succeeding i don't know, but i sure would have liked to see it happening. however, we are sure of what liu bei would have done: keeping his line as supreme rulers and the old ways alive, unlike the cao's who at least had the intellect to change a few things.

@maat-erovermind5962

6 жыл бұрын

reason, virtues, and principles are synonymous...

Cao Cao, "Chaos isn't a pit. Chaos is a ladder. Many who try to climb it fail and never get to try it again. The fall breaks them. And some are given a chance to climb. They refuse. They cling to the realm or the gods or love. Illusions. Only the ladder is real. The climb is all there is."

@cassioeguitarra

5 жыл бұрын

Little Cao Cao Finger

@1987AnimeBoy

4 жыл бұрын

Shouldn't that quote fit Sima Yi best?

@HolyknightVader999

4 жыл бұрын

@@1987AnimeBoy Sima Yi was Cao Cao's best student.

@tzzhang3064

4 жыл бұрын

Finger Cao?

@mavl4125

Жыл бұрын

Cao Cao is more like Cercei in my opinion.

Cao Cao had always been a bright person. But so was Liu Bei a wonderful kind and loyal person.

Cao Cao has a record of massacre of around 10 times, Sun QIan recorded 3 times, Liu Bei has none, only one time robbing and one time famine caused by besieging.

Liu Bei: Do you, General Cao, harbor imperial ambitions? Cao Cao: Who ME? Little old me? Nooo! Me? Really? Emperor? Oh no, I couldn't haha. Unless.

@TovKafur

3 жыл бұрын

Jokes on you, he never took mantle of the Emperor.

@wosandberg

3 жыл бұрын

Cao Cao never deposed the emperor. Liu Bei did declare himself emperor though

@Ryanfinder226

Жыл бұрын

@@wosandberg Liu bei actually had a stronger seat to do so however. Even if far down the tree he was of imperial blood.

@luckerooni1153

2 ай бұрын

more like Cao Cao: Absolutely not. I just want to make it so the Emperor has to ask me permission to do things. Someone else can be Emperor. Anyone else in fact.

@BobFordman

2 ай бұрын

​​@@wosandbergI know its like 2 years but, Liu Bei took and declare himself as emperor AFTER Cao Pi (Cao Cao son) DEPOSED and KILLED Liu Xie (The Emperor). Edit: Also gonna add, Cao Cao reason to not deposed the Emperor at most where warlords are still roaming and active and arent few was a the most smartest move he had made Take example of Yuan Shu who declared himself as emperor, what happened to him? Cao Pi decision was something he can manage since first off: 1. There were few warlords, Liu Bei was too busy off preparing revenge war against Sun Quan because his officer Lu Meng killed his brother Guan Yu, and Sun Quan was also expecting Liu Bei to battle him. 2. Many officers/people has gotten slowly turned/got used to having the Cao family as the authority.

Hard time create strong man Strong man create good time Good time create weak man Weak man create hard time

@adamdada7750

6 жыл бұрын

Son Nguyen well said

@rekostarr7149

6 жыл бұрын

Good times create stronger men. Weakness creates weak men.

@chongweiliang6328

6 жыл бұрын

That's the truth without villain good people won't able to prove they existence for example villain is the one who make bruce wayne into batman.But if villain didn't kill bruce parent he won't becoming the batman to save many people from thryant like the joker.

@rekostarr7149

5 жыл бұрын

​@yu long Here in Canada, apparently the employment is 60%. Oh and are you lazy then? Your statement is too broad to be taken seriously.

@raeaugustus586

5 жыл бұрын

And the cycle goes on and on....

The comment section tells me that this show did it's job. In the fiction of the novel ROTK (as historically these men were different). Both sides have merits, and a simple change in perspective is all it takes to side with the other. Many shows would have failed to carry this all the way through the show. As rulers perish, heroes fall and villains rise. This show however, shows its devotion to the source material and brings it to fruition.

"There is chaos because people stopped yeeting children into the ground" -Liu Bei

Cao Cao is right, under the old Han order, Liu Bei, Sun Quan and CaoCao would be nameless nobodies. Only times of chaos, they were able to become great statesmen, outperforming those who started in higher positions like Yuan Shao

@pypy1986820

5 жыл бұрын

Sun Quan wouldn't be a nobody. Sun Jian was the Marquis of Wu and that title passed down to Sun Ce and then him... Without the Civil War, Sun Quan, as the second son of Sun Jian, would still be a wealthy lord even if he doesn't succeed his daddy's title. In fact, Sun Quan was also a talented scholar; with his family name as a boost, he will find a high bureaucratic position in the Imperial Court sooner or later.

@stuka80

5 жыл бұрын

sure, if youre ambitious and unscrupulous then youll love chaos as a means to attain your ambitions. for a man who was content with being a merchant or carpenter and to the rest of humanity, it is a scourge.

They see the same things, but go about it differently. I'm with Cao Cao. It ain't pretty, but he knows what's needed to restore order. He doesn't care as much about the name under which order is restored, he's just trying to restore it. Liu Bei's philosophy works during peaceful times. In an era of war, it's not as simple as "everyone, be good people now." He is also trying to restore order, but he's trying to restore order holding onto the mast of the irreparable sinking Han dynasty ship.

@lukelim5094

2 жыл бұрын

There lies the paradox. If everyone acts like Cao Cao then everyone will live in a world of constant strife . If most people act like how Liu Bei is then there will be true peace and prosperity. In a sense it is like to game theory. People stand to gain more if they work together. But human nature cause them to work against each other a lot of times

@sumanadasawijayapala5372

7 ай бұрын

I also like how Cao Cao massacred civilians who were no threat to him.

@frzferdinand72

7 ай бұрын

@@sumanadasawijayapala5372 it was either that or let his army starve because the civilians supposedly need to eat. You need strong leaders who are unafraid to make hard decisions without regrets.

@sumanadasawijayapala5372

7 ай бұрын

@@frzferdinand72 Yes he absolutely needed to slaughter civilians to obtain their food. That's strong leadership right there. That's how the Wei dynasty lasted 2000 years right?

There's goodness in Cao Cao's motives. And Liu Bei has some hidden agenda, despite his ideals. Even though this may not be fully historical, the series is awesome. I have watched it 5-6 times lol

@alexanderchristopher6237

4 жыл бұрын

TheSunMoon of course there’s hidden agenda. Just like there’s no such thing as free lunch. Yet, in the end, both ideas complement each other to build a nation. The righteous rebuilding of the nation’s spirit, people, and resources are critical for a successful domestic policy, while the idea of “might makes right” and realpolitik is necessary for a successful foreign policy (both aggressive and defensive). I mean, look at the fates of the two kingdoms of Wei and Shu. Wei has might, yet without the legitimacy brought by a PR campaign and investing more and more to its people, it is prone to rebellions and even produced some of the most talented, yet backstabbing leaders like the Sima clan. Shu has legitimacy, but it constantly lacks the power and will to dominate its foes, leading to several missed opportunities as well as poor offensive strategies.

@XiangYu94

2 жыл бұрын

TIAN SHAAAAAAAAAA

3:05 that was world class acting, that little detail of hesitation

@alexlau2312

4 жыл бұрын

YEs absolutely ... These two were the greatest portrayal of the two characters in decades.

@Saradelrey_

Жыл бұрын

1:40 That detail and quote is great too

They are exact opposite yet I agree with both view! 😩😩😩

As a follower of Liu Bei who is benevolent, caring and virtuous himself and to his people, the source of the chaos, lies in the evil hearts of mankind, that a solution must be in effect, ending the situation that cannot go further into the worst we don't want is full of blood.

One of the best shows I've ever had the pleasure of watching. It blows the old series out of the water.

@alexlau2312

4 жыл бұрын

I totally agree\

One of the best scenes hands down.

02:15 Liu Bei summarized the problem of today's world wisely.

@UGOTNUKED

9 жыл бұрын

The problem of today's world and that of yesterday's world. Men never change. Liu Bei's philosophy is idealistic and naïve. Cao Cao is a realist. One that puts historical knowledge to use. A stable and able government helps the people more than lofty ideals.

@kurkkamambusu4063

9 жыл бұрын

UGOTNUKED I also disagree. Liu Bei leads by example, he also tries to build an order (he later tells that he has royal ambitions) but he want that people believe this order is legimitate. Cao Cao mainly works with power and reason...but in some way he lacks heart. It is a strange thing, because cao cao is also a poet...

@UGOTNUKED

9 жыл бұрын

Karl Hrdlicka In the end Liu Bei didn't treat the people any better than Cao Cao though. Cao Cao just used reason instead of ideals as a basis for his goverment. There is an inherent hypocrisy in Liu Bei's strive for a virtuous reputation. He wouldn't wage war on his relative without a just cause, so his generals fabricated one. He also didn't hesitate exploiting his subjects when he needed to finance another war.

@kurkkamambusu4063

9 жыл бұрын

UGOTNUKED i know what you mean. his strive for a virtous reputation was a political strategy AND he had some really fanatic tendencies. but i prefer him for his example to the people, he showed that it is not everything about power and that is very important. even if, in reality he was not that virtous as he acted.

@ravenstrategist1325

9 жыл бұрын

Kurk Kamambusu Cao Cao summerized Liu Bei well: An hypocrite. For our current knowledge of both i would have choosed Cao Cao over the 2 without a second tought. People need order, rules and stability, only then they will find principles once more. What Liu Bei tried to accomplish was the delusion of an hypocrite.

Hard time create villians. Villians create Heroes.

@naasei2223

5 жыл бұрын

@Tien Dat do u have the link for me to watch this series

@zhaoqingxu1131

4 жыл бұрын

Naa sei just search Three Kingdoms and you will find English subtitles version of this series

@j.i.s.l178

4 жыл бұрын

🙄 🤔 😶 😑 That's non sens... When vilain create hard time by jealousy or just to have more power.... That's not make you a hero to defend yourself from this behavior... It's normal... (Blackmail, cheating, lies, try of murder, scam : " he's not perfect...")

Liu Bei wants to bring back the Han because he himself is a Han and thinks he is the most rightful one to rule, Cao Cao believes it is already finished and he will take his move to build the next dynasty. In matter of personalities, Cao Cao is the perfect leader and ruler in the whole realm.

@denglinzhiniao

6 жыл бұрын

Electronics Japan All of them are Han people

@williamzhao2521

5 жыл бұрын

Actually it has been said that Cao Can is not Han but rather from the household of xia hou which is a part of an ethnic minority people.

@williamzhao2521

5 жыл бұрын

I personally think is bullshit.

@williamzhao2521

5 жыл бұрын

I personally think the romance of three kingdom is about the ming to Qing dynasty change in China written during the Qing Dynasty around 200 years ago. I personally think most of these writers were gay men in the closet.

@snowass6187

5 жыл бұрын

Actually a lot of the history in the late Han dynasty (especially within the shu and wu kingdoms) wasn’t written down until the Jin dynasty. A lot of what was written in the RoTK (and who knows, perhaps all of it) was based on myths and folklore and rumors, which could have indeed been true. They weren’t necessarily made up by Luo Guanzhong. For example, people say Guan Yu is only such a big historical figure now because of RoTK, but even before Luo Guanzhong wrote the book, people already held Guan Yu in super high regard, because of the oral stories passed down from generation to generation after the Han... Since most of the history wasn’t written down during the actual time, and Chen Shou grew up in the Jin dynasty, we really don’t know what’s fact or what’s not

When Yu Hewei who's Liu Bei in this, has played BOTH Liu Bei and Cao Cao at some point XD

@zadenwachter9918

3 ай бұрын

And the First Emperor of Qin in King's War!

What i love of this srries is the subtleties, at 3:02 Liu Bei defonetely throw a curve ball at CC, we can see that CC was surprised by such question and was on backfoot for a few second, he cannot maintain the eye contact as he probably trying to throw the convo somewhere else these actor s and the showrunners are indeed doing a superb job

they both nailed it. all actors nailed it actually

2:39 Cao Cao:"it's very possible to create a new order." Liu Bei: "you sneaky mf"

nice clip, great contrast between the two

The thing I like about Liu Bei is how he triggers Wei fanboys with ease.

@JToPocHi

4 жыл бұрын

Not at all triggered. Liu Bei's idealistic ways were simply hypocritical given the chaos of the times and his "virtuous" ways simply won't restore order. Cao Cao wasn't a saint, but he did what had to be done and even shouldered the label villain to achieve that very same stability in late Han. Love him or hate him, no one out there doesn't know Cao Cao Mengde.

@MohammedAlmuzahmi

3 жыл бұрын

@@JToPocHi I mean Liu Bei was right and he did gain the heart of the people, he made huge success that even cao cao can never accomplish, from a farmer to a king by being good to the people is very impressive

@lyq232

11 ай бұрын

As a fan of Bismarck, I am triggered 💢💢

@bajscast

5 ай бұрын

@@JToPocHi Stability that lasted all of two of his descendents before the Sima family took over, yeah

In a sense, they are both right. Liu Bei saw right through the motivations of the warlords, and Cao Cao did point out the Han’s time is done and that a new order could be created. Liu Bei was distantly related to the Han, and even in RotTK he used his family name like a crutch. Cao Cao was right, if it were not for the chaos of the time Liu Bei would have remained a sandal weaver. They are both admirable in their own way and this is a great series.

My Chinese sucks back then when I was a kid and I had to watch without subtitles so I supported Liu Bei throughout. After watching this with subtitles I realised that I agree more with Cao Cao afterall.

This is profound and capture realist and idealist talking point to its very essence in its very basic/simplest core.

All you tough guys, try using your “legalism” let’s see how far it gets you. You might win for a few decades but your “victory” will fall to ash

ironically, the actor playing Liu Bei here will act Cao Cao in the drama an "adviser alliance".

great translation; kept the taste

Cao Cao response @ 1:33 should be: "You must know, sir, that chaos is a ladder."

Well everybody if Liu Bei joins force to Cao Cao.........the senseless war will be ended quickly Thats My Opinion

@TovKafur

5 жыл бұрын

He was his underling. The rest is history.

@joaogrrr

3 жыл бұрын

Yeah but then there never be so many histories to talk about.

One thing I find interesting is the parallels between Cao Cao and Oda Nobunaga.

@hamzaferoz6162

4 жыл бұрын

Or Cao Cao and Julius Ceaser

@TovKafur

3 жыл бұрын

@@hamzaferoz6162 Caesar is closer to a weird amalgam of Dong Zhou and Liu Bei. Augustus is far closer to Cao Cao. Or Stalin. Or Vlad Dracula. "Order and survival of my country above everything else" can be applied to quite a few famous rulers.

@stoggafllik

Жыл бұрын

@@TovKafur Stalin was a shit leader. Horrible comparison

@TovKafur

Жыл бұрын

@@stoggafllik a genius that transformed a ravaged country into a power that had a chance at world domination? Truly one of the most brutally efficient leaders of all time. Regarding June 1941... well, Cao Cao also had his Red Cliff.

@stoggafllik

Жыл бұрын

@@TovKafur Wew. Go take a shower.

Here's my view on Liu Bei. Liu Bei integrity and benevolence are just masks he use throughout history. In fact, he was just like any other lords during the this time all thriving for power. One prove that shows this is during the Battle of Changban, Zhao Yun saved Liu Bei's son from Cao Cao's force. Instead of being happy that his son is alive, he threw the baby on the ground and favored Zhao Yun more for his action (this could be the reason why his son grows up to be a fat dumb kid) thus proving the fact that Liu Bei might not consider his family as important, but rather he is more concern with power. There are clues everywhere throughout the entire series.

@ConstantineJoseph

8 жыл бұрын

Liu Bei probably suffers from OCD. Look at all the men he surrounds himself with, all over trained fighters who can take on several soldiers at a time showing their perfectionist streak. Liu Bei is a philosopher and a dreamer something like a utopian like Maximilien Robespierre or Jacques Rousseau. There is a great misnomer of utopia that man must remain righteous. But the egocentric society of ancient China on self goodness is all done with hidden agendas and carnal desires that no man can perfectly muster. Even the most incorruptible himself is corrupt. Look at the book heart of darkness, apocalypse now, the more one stares at the darkness the more he becomes influenced. Liu Bei had fought evil for so long that he himself became it

@8220206

8 жыл бұрын

+Bumtipu P Well just for you to know, the romance of three kingdom is not completely historical accurate. The event you speak of is made up by Luo GuanZhong

@M1astrey

8 жыл бұрын

+Bumtipu P If his son is dead then he could just produce another son. But Zilong is like his brother and brothers and are like his own limbs. And lost limbs cannot be regrow. Liu Bei values his men that has been through hell together with him on countless battle more than some baby that is just born. You may not like it but that is one hell of a bro IMO.

@noleramay6872

8 жыл бұрын

+Bumtipu P Liu Bei is an idiot. Also, all the Shu guys are as boring as watching paint dry. The end. Wei wins.

@TheNewRed2511

8 жыл бұрын

that's rather a broad insight lol liu bei certainly isnt an idiot and not all shu guys are boring. This is a drama , not historically accurate. get ur facts straight

This is enough motivation to learn mandarin

What matters is doing the things for the right reasons. A foundation cannot be built on lies. Liu Bei has ever been the only choice. Cao Cao said he's glad of the chaos so he can achieve glory and fame, he wouldn't have the opportunity otherwise. That's such an evil thing to wish. "I'm happy people are suffering so I have my chance to rule." If the land weren't in chaos, then good gracious there would be no need for "heroes" like Cao Cao. Liu Bei is absolutely right in why there is chaos and it's representative of our day too. It's important to understand why things are, in order to correct them. History is important. And it's why Cao Cao's rule in Wei fails. He fails to teach his sons what they need to carry on properly because he himself didn't understand correctly on top of teaching them nothing but, through example!, his own barbaric ways. Liu Bei is guilty of this himself though as he neglected Ah Dou, but Zhuge Liang understood, so it's fine. Cao Cao is an idiot for saying that they can determine Heaven's Will based on how long a dynasty lasted. Completely illogical.

Oh Cao Cao and Liu Bei... if only you could see China now...

@letstradetogether2897

4 жыл бұрын

whats wrong with us being us nowadays huh ？ maybe us should steer clear of our way or we would crush it like a bug

@Darksky1001able

3 жыл бұрын

@@letstradetogether2897 Its not so much the people. Its the government. You cannot tell me Liu Bei, Cao Cao, Tao Qian and Kong Rong fought for a government that does what it does now.

@bajscast

5 ай бұрын

​@@Darksky1001able Cao Cao's army killed over 100,000 civilians, including both men and women, such that the Si River was stoppered up with their corpses, in a single battle. I do not like modern china, but it is a utopia compared to the hells of old war

@mackcurran3802

3 ай бұрын

@@bajscast Cao Cao would say it was not HE who killed those people, but this age of chaos! Just like his poor uncle. RIP.

realist v. idealist

Cao cao: Cao-s is a laddah.

Reminds me of Littlefingers " chaos is a ladder" speech

Neither man prevailed but the novel certainly losses its luster after their deaths

Would've been great to add the last part where Cao Cao states, "we will never be able to recruit a man like that"

He said chaos is a ladder before Littlefinger did...

idk much about real history, but from my opinion watching the show, it seems that Cao Cao and Liu Bei were the two most interested in actually restoring order to the Han Dynasty. they just had different views. Liu Bei tried to do this the idealistic way, by being promoting the good side of Han. Cao Cao was more pragmatic and focused on eliminating the corrupt officials in Han, while letting the non corrupt ones keep their power. Both worked towards the same goal, just seeing each other as rivals.

@superbowyiming

Жыл бұрын

Yeah they are the two most interestin lords during the era in history. While Sun Quan...well he's literally a meme lord... (his brother could be Cao and Liu's level if didn't die young tho

Liu Bei wants the Han dynasty to sustain, because it's his tribe and he also have secret ambitions tand see himself the rightful heir to the emperor because he too is a Liu. Whilst Cao Cao belives that the Han is already dead and order must be restored under the capable talents, which he knows it's him who is capable of doing thia mission. I see the history always stand by people like Cao Cao.

What is the music theme name playing in this cutsence ? I cant find it in ost

@minhgianguc1316

6 ай бұрын

kzread.info/dash/bejne/gqiGu49wXc_Imbg.htmlsi=wAEMc7cirMtJpWQO

Cao Cao understood that revolutions are inevitable, that even tall trees will tumble.

They both ultimately agree that the Han is a shell and they can restore order by getting rid of the fat Lords while puppeting the emperor to do it. I believe they both agreed to puppet the emperor and time shows that they more than helped each other as supposed opposites, look who became 1 and 2.

guys try playing Loongcraft that story is related there it has zhuge liang cards and caocao and liu bei and zhao yun and many more

Chaos is a ladder - Cao Cao

Fan Cao Cao

cao cao is ruthless and relentless. the only reason i forgive him is because i also follow his philosophy.

Cao Cao is the only one who among the warlords who actually fought for the people. He wanted to bring down monarchy and create a united country not ruled by a single person. With the power he had he could've been an emperor a long time ago but rejected it till his death.

@connorthegreat7101

9 жыл бұрын

Well I feel Liu bei also wanted to do the same. He just wanted to reform the power and recapture the hearts and mind of the people. The only difference between the two is that Liu bei wants to do it in the name of the Han while cao cao wants to do it under a different name! I love both characters though!

@jia2001

8 жыл бұрын

+Connor the Great Cao Cao was more ruthless and cruel and killed many innocent people. Liu Bei never massacre 10000 of civilians.

@ayami123

8 жыл бұрын

+Jann Lee he never massacre them but rather he ate them because of famine :P

@dunmill9632

7 жыл бұрын

Woah I don't think so. If he wanted to build an united country not ruled by sing person, why would he ignore Xun Yu's advice and drive him into suicide? After he got power, he showed the disposition to the strongman. He exerted his power over the emperor, and showed off for his dignity and ambition. Of course, he cares the life of ordianry people, but his country can't last so long because of its innate limits, like the lack of the justice and loyalty between the superior and the subordinate. Without the justice and integrity of people holding positiins, only bread and butter can't guarantee the all, just like Animal farm by George Orwell.

@majinzero8656

7 жыл бұрын

yeah we can't say that for sure unfortunately, but he certainly didn't believe in rule by single person. @Djudjdbd: i think the incident with xun yu didn't happen the way it is claimed, i think their conflict is for different reasons, remember how xun yu was loyal to cao cao all his life, and if there is someone who knows his true intentions (whether be it dethrowning the emperor or not) it would be him. that was perhaps the most shocking moment for me, i felt there was another reason for xun yu's sudden change in behavior and cao cao's decision.

CHAOS IS A LADDER

Human leads the world

Which Three Kingdoms series is this and is their anyway of watching it?

@laotzu4839

8 жыл бұрын

+Sean Allerdings Three Kingdoms(2010) All on KZread with English Subs.

@seanallerdings8147

8 жыл бұрын

Thank You.

@dwarfie24

8 жыл бұрын

+Sean Allerdings you started wathcing it? on episode 21 myself and I love it :D

Watching these two is like watching Tony Stark and Steve Rogers in Civil War.

Tbh Cao Cao and Liu Bei are two sides of the same coin, both trying to restore peace and stability to a divided and broken China with the same degree of determination to see their ambition through. Altho Liu bei was an idealist in goal and Cao Cao pragmatic, both had similar methods of ruthless pragmatism to achieve their goals, be it killing those tht were a threat or persuading ppl with lies to follow them. Wht makes them heroes is tht they strived for gd intentions but with supposedly immoral actions tht went against traditional norms in China. Liu bei isn't exactly sticking to norms by tryna save the Han as he constantly preaches morality but is a hypocrite at heart, taking land while saying he would be immoral to take relatives' land. How is tht different from Cao Cao using the murder of his father as an excuse to conquer Xuzhou? Imo, heroes aren't exactly supposed to be gd through and through, but they HV noble intentions tht r strived for thru unconventional means. And I can't stand the other comments period, so much bad english and logic used, like srsly.

It is ironic that Liu Bei only managed to prolong the chaos and disorder. If he had let Cao Cao to take over and establish a new dynasty sooner, it would have been better for everyone.

@Megumi_Bandicoot

5 жыл бұрын

Liu Bei had every right to “prolong the chaos” though. Maybe if Cao Cao wasn’t such a raping mass murderer, then there wouldn’t be so many people choosing to follow Liu Bei instead.

@stuka80

5 жыл бұрын

so according to you, let Stalin or Hitler taket over because they are uniting the land, lets ignore that they are maniacal dictators who kill millions without batting an eye.

@JToPocHi

5 жыл бұрын

stuka80 Poor analogy. To debunk that simply, you think Liu Bei’s hands are completely clean? He’s not committed any heinous deeds? Don’t be naive. I suggest you look up what all Warlords in the late Han did in terms of the bad, in terms of their accomplishments and only then can you make such a sweeping statement. Also, to quickly disprove you, Cao Cao brought cultural development, agriculture stability and order in lands under his banner as opposed to Hitler where his motivations were largely based on genocide (with pretext to raise the Germans from their unjust treatment following the end of WW1) and/or Stalin where communism was the political system in effect where if you disagree with their manifesto, then you’re against the creation of the so-called utopia and would get sent to the gulag (which in irony created a huge dystopia instead. Cao Cao isn’t a saint by any means, but at least he doesn’t hide behind a pseudo veil of self-righteous ideals which brings little if anything at all to the table to lessen the suffering of the common folk in the then tumultuous late Han.

@stuka80

5 жыл бұрын

@@JToPocHi i never said Liu Bei was a saint. what im talking about is his argument that Liu Bei is delaying the unification of China, therefore he is worse because hes not letting an ambitiuos and unscrupuluous warlord unify China under his rule. So my argument is not about the morality of Liu Bei or Cao Cao specifically, but the core of his argument that just because one side has massive advantages, everyone else should just lay down their arms and stop resisting regardless whether the superior force is benevolent or evil as in the case of Hitler or Stalin. Instead of fighting for their own interests or way of life. Your strawman argument of Liu Bei being bad is your own issue to argue with, i never brought up any such thing.

@JToPocHi

5 жыл бұрын

@@stuka80 I'm pointing out your analogy comparing the warlord to Hitler or Stalin. A maniacal, genocidal dictator was a poorly thought out analogy. Everyone has a right to fight for their beliefs. But imagine someone claiming birthright to a dynasty and exclaims "I'm for the people" without so much as bringing about tangible positive value to the people, that's just lip service isn't it? Feel free to vilify whoever you see fit, in your case, Cao Cao, because the novel always makes him out to be the baddie and biases always wind up at an unresolvable impasse because the argument comparing one's negative bias to "Nazi/Hitler/Stalin" kills any potential for dialogue by modern social regard in itself.

Real Liu Bei and Cao Cao have almost no difference in approach, only in competence.

Cao Cao is out for himself. And Liu Bei is looking out for others. I find it hilarious because I think they both learned something from each other. Which is why it's dangerous to have philosophical talks with anyone who isn't aligned with your goals. I believe through the talks of benevolence and kindness to the people. Cao Cao used Liu Bei's way of ruling to manipulate others to do work for him. Countless times when he is in danger, he uses the illusion of honor, courage, and humbleness to squeeze his way out of death. Liu Bei was a true character of benevolence but got consumed by vengeance when his brothers were taken from him, which removed his favor from heaven .

@gendoruwo6322

5 жыл бұрын

Liu Bei is about preserving the old order. Cao Cao is about creating a new order. History repeats, these two types always clash. And in the end, they're always both proven wrong.

@Abygoneage

5 жыл бұрын

Gendo ruwo which is why this reality will not be redeem unless it is torn down by the ground up into a new, better world. Existence itself being rewritten, overruled. Where all beings are given their own world to play with. No matter what they desire. That's justice, that's righteousness, that's fair. Not the enigmatic self righteous morality of a God or gods seeming what they desire is necessary just for amusement.

Chaos is a Ladder

@pypy1986820

5 жыл бұрын

And the real life old man version of Dany: also gone madking by the end and turned tyrant hellbent on revenge at all cost in his later years...

Even though it’s called the “Three Kingdoms”, the story has always been practically Shu Vs Wei...

@Ventus2077

3 жыл бұрын

Not really, without the Wu, a kingdom of Shu wouldn’t have been made to begin with

@lyq232

11 ай бұрын

​@@Ventus2077Wu ended up being the supporting character

@Ventus2077

11 ай бұрын

@@lyq232 Lol, what’re your talking about? Wu was the only kingdom that resisted Wei until the formation of Jin kingdom. Read some history rather than depending on fiction

@legoshi6769

3 ай бұрын

Lu Meng didn't slain Guan Yu Yu, than Yi Ling wouldn't happened

Chaos is a ladder

Im from 2021

So, I’d one of them is Yun and the other Yang, what does that make Sun Quan?

@wosandberg

3 жыл бұрын

Not really fair to say at all. This is a story. In reality, Liu Bei pillaged, thieved, butchered, backstabbed, and cheated his way into power. Yes, he was also at times "seen" to be extremely virtuous. But in reality he was just another ruthless pragmatist, but one whose greatest weapon was his cover of being a moralist

@JebronLames623

2 жыл бұрын

He was on a neutral side actually In order to survived of this two countries Shu-Han and Cao-Wei they need to play safe. If Shu strong and Wei weak, they should join with Wei, and if Wei strong and Shu are weak, they should join Shu.

Wish both of them cooperate from the start the be powerful dinasty but history it 3 kingdom

Cao Cao, we have the same philosophies. I know this is fiction, but everything he said was a hit marker to how I see things, I wonder if this is how he really viewed the world, or it was just all for the sake of dialogue presented in this piece.

@ayami123

8 жыл бұрын

+TheLandOfTears s that's how he viewed the world

@Stealingiscaring

7 жыл бұрын

Cao Cao is real lol.

@damiester1

7 жыл бұрын

It's historic lol. While the Romance of the Three Kingdoms is a novelised version of the records, these events did actually happen.

@aidencrawford9704

7 жыл бұрын

He mean't the fictional romanticized version of the events. I do not recall reading anything about the real Cao Cao that showed him to have this certain perspective.

@Tespri

6 жыл бұрын

Cao cao was loyal man to the empire through the end. As shown in his final moments when he saw that no one truly understood him. They all thought Cao wanted to be emperor.

Cao Cao is a brilliant man, but it might not have been the smartest thing to tell a member of the Han Empire's royal family that its time is at an end. He only created a rival there, not an ally. It's like telling a Targaryen that Robert's Rebellion was justified. You're only cruising for a bruising there, pal.

In short, cao cao is only want his glory days while liu bei doesnt care about glory and famous, but peaceful of people. No matter how cao cao is making up pretty up words, i only see he is just ambition man. For that, i prefer liu bei than cao cao.

The two actors are all hui people ，how interesting

@nolbertos

4 жыл бұрын

Jasonic gamer yu hewei isn’t hui from what I saw and looked up online, thought he was Han?? I know chen jianbin the actor who plays Cao Cao is Hui.

@jasonicgamer1683

4 жыл бұрын

nolbertos he is，check again

Yin and Yang

And btw I love both Cao Cao and Liu bei, don't prefer one over the other as I believe both of them hv GD and bad traits tht make them fascinating ppl of history to analyze and stufy

Chaos is a ladder, much? Cao cao is Littlefinger and Liu Bei is Varys.

CaoCao is right. If there was peace, Liu Bei would still be a sandal weaver. It was war and turmoil that brought Liu Bei to fame.

Since we are only seeing the historical interpretation of Liu Bei and not the man himself, I wonder why he has this benevolent reputation. Why is Liu Bei seen as the good guy now, when it's highly likely he wasn't the man we read about here. Why are there statues of Guan Yu for sale now and not any other warrior?

@connorthegreat7101

9 жыл бұрын

My guess is because of their loyalty. And I'm pretty sure Liu Bei was kind to his people if I'm not mistaken. And Guan Yu is most known for his loyalty as well. But yes the novel exegerates a lot! :P

@spalenzagabriel

8 жыл бұрын

+Shuma Gorath Liu Bei is worshipped as the patron of shoemakers in Cheng Du, the former capital city of Shu-Han.

@taroultraman1

8 жыл бұрын

There are many historian answer to why people saying that Liu Bei are benevolent. this trackbacks to Song Dynasty when Three Kingdoms stories become extremely popular, the people relate themselves with Liu Bei cause Song Dynasty at that time was facing internal corruption and facing enemies from North exactly like the condition Liu Bei did thus glorifying Liu Bei. I think 3 great founders of all Three Kingdoms are able leader but Liu Bei have imperial bloodline and support of the people hence making him like the benevolent lord. Loyalty was deemed highly during Han Dynasty and Yunchang is the perfect example for loyalty hence making Guan Yu saint of war.

@bajscast

5 ай бұрын

Liu Bei wasn't as nice in real life as he was in the story, but he did have the nicest record compared to his importance. When you're dealing with big figures in history, the more important they are the more likely they are to have performed incredibly brutal acts. In a single province invasion Cao Cao killed 100,000 civilians - ironically the romance of the three kingdoms also makes Cao Cao more of a reasonable figure than he was in real life, just the same as it inflates Liu Bei's heroic actions too. But Liu Bei's forces had no massacres on record and when fleeing a city, peasants wanted to go with him because he had that reputation at the time as well. But he was a warlord who did want to rule china, so he wasn't an all good person or anything, just of the group in question he was the best one

Not saying every comment is like useless and trolling but rlly guys let's be honest there are so many of these commenters here it actually makes me vomit, and it's not only the bad english. The bias and contradictory logic and incredulous claims made make me sick coz they all cheapen who Liu Bei and basically every three kingdoms figure was historically, limiting them to certain tropes of personality propagated by romanticisation of the period. Not only tht but some of the bad comments make use of everything historically inaccurate to back up their claims at times

Being a native Chinese speaker, I found a either way to figure out more about wut behind of Three Kingdoms stories by watching these English subtitles. LOL

I see nothing but ambition in different way, Liu Bei is from the old regime and cao Cao want to established the new one, in fact both created new regime but Liu Bei's regime is different regime continued the old regime simmiliar to east Han and Southern song

was liu bei really benevolent? what he did is only prolonging the chaos. in the end liu shan, the foolish king, was the one who really brought the end of chaos.

"Having lost faith and principles." Yeah, welcome to why the Yellow Turban Rebellion became a thing. People lost faith. And-ironically enough- the Yellow Turbans ultimately won despite the rebellion being put down. The Han Dynasty they rebelled against in the first place was destroyed.

liu bei have too many philosophies but empty deed , different with cao cao at least he can stop cannibalism in china .

@mistertaz94

7 жыл бұрын

hah, I see what you did there.

@majinzero8656

7 жыл бұрын

@Der Klavier: Too many philosophies? The guy has too many hypocricies and he DOES ACT on them, always playing the role of a saint because he has the biggest trump card on his side, "his family name", all he needs to do is fake being generous in a desperate attempt to get people to clinge to the han dynasty and not give up on them. but good joke, best one that can come up related to TK.

@aoishiro6622

6 жыл бұрын

Liu Bei was born a Liu and shoe peddler yet at the end of his life, he became emperor. If you think it's only because of his "name" then indeed sir you are a fool among the fools.

@damiester1

6 жыл бұрын

Technically, Cao has been booted out of court at least twice due to his background as a Eunuch's adopted son. If anything, he started just as much from scratch as Liu Bei did, recruiting mercenaries in his early days and capturing yellow turban bandits.

@KrayzieBuddha

6 жыл бұрын

damiester1 More like Cao Cao was booted out because his distant family ties with the disgraced Empress Song (who fell into the Eunuchs plot).

I found the song that playing while they discuss: kzread.info/dash/bejne/gqiGu49wXc_Imbg.htmlsi=wAEMc7cirMtJpWQO

cao cao is entp liu bei is enfj.

Cao Cao or Liu Bei? That is really not an easy decision. But i prefer Liu Bei his concept has more foresight because even as he seized the throne people did not see him as an usurpator or tyrann. But Cao Cao ..people hated him, no matter that he was a reasonable ruler...

@nemo0036

9 жыл бұрын

Kurk Kamambusu I prefer Cao Cao. Liu Bei was actually a backstabbing asshole historically, but happened to have good PR as far as those under him were concerned. Cao Cao actually brought prosperity to the lands under him, and valued merit over birth. Thus why he had a roster of talented officers and administrators. Much of what is portrayed of Liu Bei's subordinates are highly exaggerated as is expected of a show that is inspired more by ROMANCE of the Three Kingdoms rather than "Records of the Three Kingdoms". Cao Cao was also a far better father than Liu Bei could hope to be. He personally taught his son, Cao Pi, how to shoot a bow on horseback and stimulated his intellect. While his son Cao Zhi ended up an ill-behaved drunk, Cao Cao, Cao Zhi, and Cao Pi have become known as "The Three Cao's" in literature and poetry. His other son, Cao Zhang, became a competent officer in the Wei Army. Furthermore, his son Cao Pi and grand son Cao Rui brought forth majour reforms in government when they held power, the latter being especially known for his intellect and progressiveness (e.g. placing talented women in seats of power, WHEN APPLICABLE). On the other hand, Liu Bei's son Liu Shan grew up to either be incompetent or negligent, and he and Zhuge Liang had his adopted son Liu Feng commit suicide because they thought he'd pose a threat to Liu Shan's succession due to his older age and good reputation within the Shu Army (despite having loyally served under Liu Bei). They even made the refusal to aid Guan Yu a reason for the suicide, but he actually had good reason to do what he did (i.e. consolidating newly acquired territory as opposed to "overstretching").

@astranix0198

5 жыл бұрын

@@nemo0036 I prefer Zhu Di over them all.