Thomas Becket is an example of someone who didn't choose or want his job, but who chose to step up and do his very best.

I’ve heard the story of Beckett numerous time and heard that the King walked through the streets until his feet bled- but I did not know he kept going to the shrine. I always assumed it was a shrewd move to get the people on side, but him continuing to go shows it was sincere

@user-fq8rs7rz3i

4 ай бұрын

It was a lot of both. But the main thing was Beckett was gone.

@renastone9355

4 ай бұрын

Oh, I'd say Henry;continuing to go was a continuing ploy to keep people on his side...

@jacksmythe2187

4 ай бұрын

Considering that inside the shrine were all the priests who'd worked under Beckett, even if he wasn't sincere he had to go the whole way in or they would've still hated him. He had to get the clergy on side as much as the people. Imo, it was both sincere and a political ploy. The timing of him receiving news of the Scottish King's capture always made me think it was stage-managed to an extent, but I also feel he did actually want to repent for once in his life for murdering his old friend. It just helped he could set it all up to salvage his mess of a situation at the same time.

This story is what got me interested in history, especially that time period. What was Becket's faux pas? He started believing his own PR. That never ends well.

@peterwindhorst5775

4 ай бұрын

That and believing that his was on the fast-track to become pope. He is one of the first Englishman that could have easily become pope if he had Henry's support. Then bit the hand that fed him.

@JBT_On_YouTube

4 ай бұрын

Awww! Me too! The movie was great but it left me wanting more.

@richarddefortuna2252

4 ай бұрын

I'm inclined to think that Henry II commanded his own sizable cache of hubris in this matter as well.

@patriciagodfrey6345

4 ай бұрын

@@richarddefortuna2252Oh yes. A Match Made In Heaven, up until that certain point when it all went south.

@ms_scribbles

4 ай бұрын

@@richarddefortuna2252 Oh, certainly. Two massive, *massive* egos butting up against one another.

Can't wait to show this to hubby! We pop Beckett in the VCR a few times a year and except for for female drama it seems to be at least history adjacent. I love the movie, especially Peter O'Toole's tortured performance. His love for Becket is there even while he uses the political machine to destroy him. I believe it started as a genuine bromance and when Henry realized his bro served someone higher, be it Beckett's personal honor and vanity or his genuine devotion which caused a rift Henry's pride and selfishness couldn't handle. Hope that makes sense, I have dementia and can't really put things properly when i write them any longer. This story has always fascinated me and broken my heart for both of them.

@ReadingthePast

4 ай бұрын

Thank you for this comment! I have never seen the film but the more I read the more I know I must!

@hdwarrior8830

4 ай бұрын

@@ReadingthePast I think you would love it! Hubby and I usually make a day of it and watch that and Lion in Winter so we can watch Hepburn and O'Toole go "tusk to tusk", as it were. Mesmerizing, even if not actually historically accurate.

@pamelaoliver8442

4 ай бұрын

That's it 😂 now I'm going to find it

@scarletohhaha6938

4 ай бұрын

@@ReadingthePast Perhaps do another of your reaction videos? 😏

This period (300 to 1300) is often called The Age of Faith. Difficult to separate the forces at work to establish motive. Economics, faith, power all in the mix.

St Thomas has been one of my favourite people for decades. I remember seeing a movie about him with Richard Burton as Thomas when I was young. I have made his feast day, in the last week of December, a day I mark every year. I admired his refusal to knuckle under to Henry II as I admired Thomas Moore's stance against another Henry. Funny how some things repeat themselves.

@atamburlaine

4 ай бұрын

Thomas More gets a little overshadowed by Wolsey but I would absolutely love to see a video by Dr. Kat about the stances of the two Tudor Chancellors on The King's Great Matter. More is a hero of mine, Wolsey not as much, but they both thought Henry was doing too much, in my opinion.

Thank you for yet another delightful & informative video, Dr. Kat. I did not know that King Henry II saw a business/PR opportunity in creating a display at Dover Castle for wealthy nobles to visit en route to Canterbury. So Henry succeeded in welding the Church to the State. What an entrepreneur he was! If only he had not possessed such an infernal temper....

@capt.bart.roberts4975

4 ай бұрын

The Plantagenates weren't exactly known for their equanimity.

My godson is descended from William de Tracy. We live 45 mins from Canterbury so visit it often but it was a surreal feeling standing "where" he died with a de Tracy descendent. Probably me over reacting but definitely felt chills 😆

Whenever I hear about Henry II, "The Lion in Winter" comes to mind. I know this is fictional entertainment, not history, but the turbulent relationship between Henry II and Eleanor of Aquitaine is memorably and vividly dramatized in that movie by Peter O'Toole and Katharine Hepburn, and it seems to be generally accurate from everything I know. Eleanor was a powerful woman, and she didn't take s**t from anybody, not even her husbands. Their characters are unforgettable! As for the movie "Becket," Peter O'Toole and Richard Burton do a good job, but I don't find the movie quite so compelling. As a quick aside, Becket was martyred at an altar in the northwest transept of the cathedral, not at the main altar. Since the depredations of the English Reformation, it has been reconstituted as the site of Becket's murder and is now a place of historic and religious pilgramage.

@arcola44

4 ай бұрын

During a visit, the docent said during the Civil War Puritans destroyed the stain glass window of "proud Thomas" in the transept, but because it had been the subject of an earlier painting it was later restored. Cool story, whether true or not. Also, love "Lion in Winter." They were the original 'dis-functional family.'

@opheliadeclines

4 ай бұрын

Fiction is where I picked up the Eleanor habit. Sad she was so foolish about her sons.

@christopherstephenjenksbsg4944

4 ай бұрын

@@arcola44 Your post reminds me of how that Puritan stated, proudly, the he "rattled down proud Becket's bones."

@Kris-bw7cv

4 ай бұрын

I loved both movies 🍿

@arcola44

4 ай бұрын

@@christopherstephenjenksbsg4944 Thanks!!! That was the exact quote!

As always Dr. Kat, this is a wonderful video. Thank you for making Fridays a good day to anticipate, more so even that it is the day before THE WEEKEND! To the subject at hand I'll simply say that I would have given all my worldly goods to have been a fly on the wall hearing just one conversation between Henry II and St. Thomas a Becket though I would request that such a time be during the brief era that St. Thomas was Archbishop and Henry the King. What a spectacular fallout. The fact that we're still discussing it 700 years on speaks for itself.

I think Becket felt like he was forced to make a life change he didn't want to make, so he did it to the specifications given. However, being angry about the change, he started doing something of a power play. Granted, this is a bit of a guess before I go look to find out if the monks changed their mind privately as well as publically about Becket.

@j.t.lennon177

4 ай бұрын

I might be wrong, but it really seems like the monks didn't so much like Becket as the monks realized that he was useful dead for their purposes. Reading the lists of the Arch Bishops that came after him made me realize that it was a really rough time.

@RestingJudge

4 ай бұрын

Idk if we could even consider it a power play. If he threw himself into the role he knew what that entailed including the properties and such (that weren't supposed to even be sold off anyway). Beckett could've just seen his actions as restoring the dignity of the office.

Brilliant presentation. 👑 Thanks Dr. Kat. 🇬🇧

Dr. Kat! This was a wonderful post.. St. Thomas is one of my favorite saints and I made an actual pilgrimage (as opposed to a tourist destination) to his cathedral in Canterbury. Have you ever seen the movie “ Becket “ with Richard Burton in his favorite role as the saint? I also visited Ferns in Ireland where Henry was whipped by the monks and had to build an abbey there in penitence for Thomas’ murder. I greatly admire Thomas’ spiritual turn around when he was made archbishop at Henry’s request. He stood for what he thought right. Thanks for this post.

Gosh, Friday again! I enjoy getting your emails reminding me about your videos 😊

There is a service still held on December 29th that marks Beckets Martyrdom. On my last visit it started with plain song similar to services in Beckets time. You then walk through the cathedral to the small altar that stands near where the act took place, then down to the crypt where his body lay and to the site of the shrine. It's a lovely service and worth a visit if you are in the area at the right time. I first discovered it by accident on a rather failed post christmas shopping trip.

Henry was such a compelling person. I mostly feel he spoke out of anger and hurt feelings. I have wondered if that was a family dynamic that created many of his problems with his wife and sons.✝️👑

Two exceptionally strong egos in conflict. Canterbury itself is well worth visiting, and the Cathedral close is beautiful.

I can't wait to get home to watch this! Becket is one of my fixations (thanks ASD 😂) and you're one of my favourite historians so I know this will be amazing!

This brought back two memories - of a visit to Canterbury and of reading an excellent novel about Becket years ago - the name of the author, Alfred Duggan, came back to me and I tracked down the novel , which is called God and My Right - Duggan also wrote a biography, Thomas Becket of Canterbury - they were published in the 1950s so might not be easy to get hold of🗡✝

I learned about Becket through the eponymous movie from 1964, that showed Becket finding true faith. Personally, I think the power got a bit to his head. Excellent video as always!

Awesome video once again! Thank you for the story about Louis VII's visit on behalf of his son Phillip, and thanks for the comparison of Henry II with Henry VIII. Historians note that Henry VIII accomplished what Henry II could not, but I think Henry II's later support of Becket's shrine indicates he thought Thomas' intercession may have been working on his behalf. Contrast this with Henry VIII digging up Thomas and tossing him into the river! Three parts power, one part faith. ⚔⚔⚔⛪

Love your content! You're amazing!

Always love Friday afternoon. You accompany me every week while I prep dinner ♡♡

Wonderful. My offspring often asks me "is this history or fiction." I wish I'd known to ask. So far The Lion in Winter is closer than Beckett.

This Henry, his family & especially Thomas Becket are an obsession for me. Thanks for this video!

In my work I sometimes see what I call “the Beckett effect”- when I person achieves a lifetime, permanent role, they sometimes change notably, in order to fully inhabit and enact that new role, identifying with the values and concerns of that role. It is difficult to control someone who has lifetime tenure at the top of their field.

🤴🗡️⚔️🏰 thanks for another informative and entertaining presentation. I think it is always about power with Monarchies and Church.

I’d love to see you do more on this period of time Kat!

Henry's reaction to someone Acting on his "wish".....like Elizabeth's reaction of Shock @ Mary's Death Warrant being carried out... after SHE had signed the warrant FOR IT?? 🤔

@user-fq8rs7rz3i

4 ай бұрын

We’ll never really know their true intentions.

@arcola44

4 ай бұрын

Oh!!!! Excellent point!!!! Great comparison. Like Claude Rains in Casablanca, "I'm shocked, shocked there's gambling going on."

@peterwindhorst5775

4 ай бұрын

No matter what country one lives in, whether the president is only a figurehead or a fool - if he says, “Would someone rid me of this troublesome priest,” there is someone who might “do him the favor” of removing the president’s annoyance.

@pistolannie6500

4 ай бұрын

Goes to show.. careful what U wish for!

Thank you for this interesting and fascinating discussion. I think Henry II was trying character trait acquisition in his embrace of Saint Thomas a Beckett . 🎉

Good video! I first learned this story when I read T.S. Eliot's "Murder In The Cathedral" as a teenager. I have always enjoyed learning more about it since then!

To me, Becket let the power of his position get in his way. He behaved like many converts who become even more vehemently supportive of their new perspective. I believe he thought his power within the Church made him almost an equal to the king. Made him think he could defy the king and be protected under the mantle of the church. Bad choice. And Henry II was a smart man. Whether his barefoot walk through Canterbury was true penance or not, it was a brilliant PR move. He also recognized opportunity in the canonizing of Becket and used it to his advantage. ✝👑✝👑

Beware … the Ides of March! Another great Shakespearean quote- just for today! Seriously, it’s strange you are on this subject … as I’ve been bingeing on it for about 2 weeks now… love this channel SO much ! Been a great fan nearly 5 years now!❤

@ReadingthePast

4 ай бұрын

Thank you for sticking with me, I’m so pleased you like my content ☺️

I appreciate your going a little past the usual stopping point ofthis tale, Henry's fortunes turning after his penance. I've not heard before the story of Louis coming to the shrine to pray for Philip and Henry's uppgrade of Dover castle to accommodate well-to-do pilgrims to Canterbury and thus benefit politically by linking his star to Beckets.

My goodness, this tale is one I am long familiar with BUT - this narration is absolutely perfect. The best I've listened to in a long, long time. Beautiful voice. Thank you. ❤

As always, thank you for your wonderful videos. Oh, that I had had a teacher like you when I was younger. I wanted to particularly thank you for the visual images you add to your videos - they really help me to remember the people you speak about and some of the details of your videos. And my word, what a wild story this one is (my knowledge of British history prior to Henry VIII is rather murky. 😞) ✝👑🏰

This was an excellent video!!!! I've read many, many histories of England and the UK more generally so the story of Thomas A Becket is one with which I was already familiar. Your presentation was just the right balance of facts and questions about what really was going on in the minds of these 12th century men. Bravo!!! 🙂🙂🙂

Fantastic! Do watch Becket and Lion in Winter.

@ReadingthePast

4 ай бұрын

They have both shown themselves to be “must sees” in my chat and comments today!

⚓️I loved being reminded of the stubbornness of priest and king. My feelings about Becket are now complicated. Previously I paid sympathetic attention to the play which seemed honest emotionally. After your presentation it clearly is not accurate historically. I still, romantically possibly, hope Becket’s ordination corrected his and behavior. I love how you often make me think! Thanks.

That was wonderful. Thank you, Dr. Kat! I can't help but be saddened to recall, whenever I think of Thomas Becket, that during the Dissolution of the Monasteries, I believe it was, King Henry VIII had the saint's tomb destroyed and his bones scattered after of course stealing the jewels, gold and other precious offerings there.

Excellent vid as usual. Keeping up this standard is admirable. My take-away? Medieval Europe was brutal, all Kings were power mad Narcissists and being the Archbishop of Canterbury really went to Thomas Becketts head...(no pun intended)👑😱nice place to visit but I wouldn't want to live there.

Thank you for another incredible video. When I was a kid and several times after, I watched the movie, Beckett. I loved this movie! And if I remember the movie correctly, it wasn’t too far off from the historical accounts. Plus or minus a little wench and grabbing back of the monte lands. Thank you again for putting the record straight. I wonder though, why he went from playboy Priest to archbishop who doesn’t. I guess it’s true motives are really mystery.

Your makeup looks lovely in this video 🫶🏻

@ReadingthePast

4 ай бұрын

Thank you so much ☺️

Interesting to see how a change of position can change your views and ideas in life, in the case of Beckett this definitely seems the case ⛪

🏰Thank you so much for this video. I believe Henry felt betrayed by Beckett. And in his hurt angry outburst lead to his friend's murder. I want to believe his penance and regret were genuine. The Plantagents were not gentle or wise when you really look at it.

The spot where he was killed and the high altar are quite far apart. To get to the murder site involves walking through the choir and down a large set of stone steps towards the living quarters of the monks. I wonder if he had tried to run away or was dragged away from the alter by the knights to somewhere less sacred.

@thelittleredhairedgirlfrom6527

4 ай бұрын

From what I’ve read he did run

@DoingItOurselvesOfficial

4 ай бұрын

@@thelittleredhairedgirlfrom6527that’s interesting to know, I know Canterbury cathedral quite well. I used to get the train there as a teenager. I’ve even been up above the vaulted ceilings into the bell tower. I can tell you it actually moves when the bells are rung together.

In 1177 King Henry II founded the Augustinian Abbey of St Thomas the Martyr outside Dublin in honour of St Thomas Becket. In the same year, Henry granted what is now the county of Cork in Ireland to Milo de Cogan and Robert FitzStephen 'if they could take it.' These men and their followers granted the tithes of a number of parishes in the county to St Thomas Abbey in Dublin.

@ReadingthePast

4 ай бұрын

Thank you for this additional context, it’s really interesting!

I think Becket was motivated his entire adult life, by the desire for power and control.

@user-fq8rs7rz3i

4 ай бұрын

Of course. A lot of power laid in the church. I’ve never trusted the clergy.

@beverleyheadley-glover371

4 ай бұрын

I totally agreed I also believe All of the above. NAMELY: Greed, Power,Self-serving, land, silent pomposity, and the fact that he was the Kings Friend and confidant. Now , he might be pious. Religious , I don't know. Need more research on the Archbishop of Canterbury. NO I don't believe in killing anyone, much less chopping their heads off. No, brutal very.

Thank you ❤

St Thomas Becket is one of my favorite saints! ⛪️🕊️

Thank you for this discussion. I've always been fascinated by the interaction between Thomas and Henry. It seems that Thomas 'got religion' in a way that Henry resented. I'm not sure what caused Thomas to take the turn he did, maybe he actually had a sense of the spiritual that was not shared by Henry. I was fortunate enough, in my college years, to have seen the original production of Becket on Broadway in 1960 with Laurence Olivier as Becket and Anthony Quinn as Henry. Powerful stuff. I've never forgotten it. I also saw the movie, but it didn't hold the same sense of drama as on stage.

Excellent talk. Thank you Dr Kat! ⛪

Never clicked faster Dr Kat!!

Thank you. I learned a lot from this presentation 👑✝️⛪

Great video! You are an inspiration. Your hard work and obvious love for history make these my absolute favorite notification bells! thanks!

As always a joy to visit your site 💝

Videos about the people and events from the 'lesser known' earlier periods of history are always fascinating and make a refreshing change from the Tudors. Thank you for this one. 🫅⛪️

Thank you for another brilliant episode.

Thanks for this video. I didn’t know I was waiting for it.

Thank you, as always, for your thorough research and entertaining presentation. Love your videos, and I was looking forward to this!

Great video.. Thanks 👑✝️🥁⛪️

It's interesting to me that there were at least two, significant time periods wherein a Thomas and a Henry were at odds with each other 😅 I wonder how often that happens?

Awesome video Dr Kat! 😮😮😊❤xo

Loved it x

Such complicated times! Your video distilled this significant historical event in a very clear and cogent manner. The conflict of church and state could lead to violent outcomes - even murder. Thank you for your wonderful channel!⛪ ⚔

That was fascinating, thank you so much! 👑

Thank you for filling in the blanks in my knowledge. I love medieval history! ⛪️

Henry II is my favorite English monarch. I love the Plantagenet line. I'm a Texan who loves Britain and her history. I do believe Henry was in part responsible for Becket's death and also that his penance was something that worked in his favor. What a family!! Love 'em!

A brilliant video, such an interesting moment in history. Just a small point; crescendo is the build up, not the climax. Apologies, it’s a pet peeve of mine as a musician (many published authors use it incorrectly as well smh). Very excited for the next vid

Thank you so much! 🙏

Excellent overview and analysis ⛪ 🏰

This is an interesting topic ! I have heard of Beckett , but I didn't know about what happened after his death . I didn't see tbis ending coming !

Thank you for showing the pilgrim badge from Canterbury. I just listened to a podcast about pilgrimages, and this has gotten me interested in the entire idea of pilgrimages. Perhaps you could do a video around the subject? 👑⚔

Well told, as always. 🏰 vs ⛪️

Fascinating, as always. Thank you.🤑💪😱🪞

😊very interesting and informative as always❤

A very important tale of Church and State. The struggle that will be seen many times in thev futere.. Responsibilities are confused with power when egos are involved. ❤👨‍✈️

So glad to see this as subject matter! Thank you

👑👑👑 Very interesting . Love the video!

Outstanding Dr. Kat! The visuals were wonderful. I think Henry expecting Becket to continue being his best friend and collaborating with him on all matters involving church and state. Neither saw Becket’s repentance and devotion to the church coming. Then it became a classic power struggle. I believe Henry was personally mortified and devastated at Becket’s death and the manner and place it occurred. Henry seems to have so regretted it and missed his old friend and also realized that he was not ultimately responsible for it. Violence was always the way problems were dealt with. Here’s to separation of church and state. 🗡️🎚️🕍👑

❤thanks for this video!

Another great video. Thank you🏰

Fascinating video, thank you

There should have been a notice put up to the mums in the districts. “ do not call your son Thomas”. Seems a dangerous name. Many more of them I guess. Poor Becket, he took his role too seriously, at least in the kings opinion. Still, not s nice way to go - and in the church! Thank you dr Kat. I saw you last night on a program about Eleanor of Aquitaine . Made me sit right up! Expected our music to play 😂😂🙏🙏🙏👵🇦🇺

Thank you 🎉

fabulous!

Thanks!

Great Video.. Thanks

👑🛐great video!

Excellent video 👑👑👑💰💰💰

I get the impression that being a member of the clergy and being named Thomas was a sure way to get into trouble back then.

Enlightening and entertaining!! 👑🤜🏻 ⛪️

Thanks Doctor Kat👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼🌹👑💪🏼

thank you

Love from Melbourne Florida

Gosh, your tone and tempo in storytelling and supplication nudged my typically lazy self to pop up, scrolling for swords and priestly icons to enthusiastically promote your storytelling indeed, but the research, accumulation and initial form of the well developed action, atmosphere and actors really tell that story all of itself! 🙇🏼‍♂️🙏🏽🍻🏹🤺

Can you also do a video about Maria Edgeworth She was one of the first realist writers in children's literature and was a significant figure in the evolution of the novel in Europe

@ReadingthePast

4 ай бұрын

Another figure for me to look into, thank you again 😊

I remember the movie Beckett made in the 60s. A great film that stimulated my love of history.

Thanks

In the Serpent Queen the writers put in the line “Who will rid me of this woman!”