Reading alot of the comments here and just in my own life experience, I think the mistake we keep making is that we put our faith in man, who will always let us down. We need to put our faith in the ONE who has overcome the world, we need to put our Faith in Jesus. Love you all.

@vickieadams6648

4 күн бұрын

True, tell that to the people expecting an elderly unsaved millionaire to rescue them instead of Jesus.

@thelookout5802

Күн бұрын

On point. We put our trust in pastors, church leaders and other people who are just sinful men instead of in God.

In regard to having his own house in order. You do see pastors whose own families are not cared for and lacking in good relationships with their spouses and children who think that they can pastor a church. If you can't be faithful with a little, you can't be faithful with much.

Let not many of you become teachers, my brethren, knowing that as such we shall incur a stricter judgment. James 3:1

One issue I have seen is a pastor is removed. They don't seek repentance. They move on and start a new fellowship.

Involvement with an underage child, sexually should be a disqualifer even when there is true repentance.

I understand no one's perfect and even the most faithful can stumble but once a pastor does something out of line, don't care if it's just once, my trust and respect ain't gonna be the same anymore. 😕

@user-rs6bz9so3g

5 күн бұрын

Physical or mental abuse or fooling around on your wife or getting drunk constantly is hardly a stumble those are all conscious decisions

Great analysis.

Pastors disqualifying themselves from ministry will continue to happen because it has been written that in the last days there will be a falling away. Sad, but true. Some of these are not as subjective as they seem. I think Paul was pretty clear about what type of a man's character qualifies him for ministry.

@WMPBLSD

6 күн бұрын

It is important to remember that although a person can be disqualified from ministry, they will never be disqualified from the cross.

@juliem.3936

5 күн бұрын

@@WMPBLSD If they repent.

@PatrickInCayman

5 күн бұрын

Correct, Paul did, and we call these men Bishops and Presbyters ordained through successive Apostolic consecration.

I’ve really really struggled with a pastor that I really trusted and thought I got to know quite personally, him and his wife and kids, and even helped them when they moved to my country as missionaries… only to find a year after that he was caught in adultery and had absolutely no repentance. In fact, he then left his wife and kids and went to be with this other woman. And then started to post pics of him celebrating occasions such as Halloween with his new family etc…. It was a 180 it seemed and just so hard to watch and see and so terribly confusing. He was removed from ministry as soon as the adultery was found out …. But it’s just so heavy on my heart. I can’t even try to understand what on earth happened…..!

@py20

4 күн бұрын

He is unrepentant and deserves to remain out of ministry. But don't stop praying for him. Also, don't let his sinful behavior discourage you. Christ alone is our example; look to Him only, not any man, and follow in His lead, one day at a time. Blessings to you.

Family is your first ministry. If you cannot raise God fearing and God loving children who had been with you since they were babies, how can you lead any other ministry?

@MarkMay-cr6bv

6 күн бұрын

Spot-on comment. Thank you.

@ntabile

5 күн бұрын

It is tricky. Because there is one Pastor in the US where the son rebels and becomes apostate. I saw the son's video, and he is totally the opposite of the father.

@Tye-pf8vi

5 күн бұрын

Deuteronomy 24: 16 says, "Parents shalt not be put to death for their children, nor children be put to death for their parents; each will die for thier own sins. Everyone is accountable for their actions."

@lawrenceehrbar8667

5 күн бұрын

Pastors with unruly, rebellious, worldly, and spoiled children seem to be commonplace. Especially with those pastors who are very charismatic and treated like roylalty. In fact, it seems that these pastors create such an aura about themselves that congregants start idolizing them and begin wanting to "hover" around the pastor. This causes the pastor to create a protective inner circle of confidants to guard himself from his "subjects." It becomes self perpetuating. We see the same thing in the world. You've heard the stories. About celebrity such-and-such who place an "edict" that subordinates aren't to ever look the celebrity in the eye. This is almost commonplace in some churches.

@MoonlitShoreWalk

5 күн бұрын

I think it's referring to when children are still in their parents' household. While they're being raised, the pastor/wife should be raising them well, in love, in the knowledge of God and His Word, and with patient discipline. If they've done that well, to the best of their ability, then what their kids do as adults should not disqualify the pastor. After all, you can do everything right raising a child and s/he can become apostate, while other families do everything wrong (kids raised in abusive homes, no God, no church, taught to do drugs at an early age, etc.), and those kids can turn out to be Christians, even pastors. Each adult is accountable for their own actions.

I totally agree!! I left my church because I couldn’t look at nor listen to the word coming from my previous Pastor.

If the situation is still QUESTIONABLE after many years of pastoral restoration……it’s best for the minister to step down.

Todd Friel talked about this and I am inclined to agree with his assessment. If you are sinning as a pastor--while there is grace and forgiveness in Christianity--you should not be back behind the pulpit. There are many examples he brings out from Church History that agree that the one who errs should be removed from the pulpit. They need to get themselves into a good Bible preaching church under a Godly pastor and learn in submission.

@Gargeler

2 күн бұрын

The perspective on the Christ Righteousness and holiness certainly is the cause of divisions from so called Christians , both past and present, even from ministers from those that advertise the Show “Chosen” and the ones that dont.

I am listening to you and how you are dividing the Word of Jesus Christ as mentioned in the Book of James and your lessons from Study The Bible series for doing exactly what you are doing now sir. Righteously defining the meaning of key words from Greek is a life lesson. I am trying to do this on my young KZread channel but no where is well as you, sir. I thank you for all that you are doing for the Kingdom of Jesus Christ. Be blessed and I will pay $20.00 dollars using the dollar symbol because I know that you have a family and staff to support, pastor Parr. Be blessed always by Him Who can do immeasurably more than anyone else can do…to Him be the praise and glory always in Jesus Christ. Amen.

@Beanmachine91

6 күн бұрын

Know thyself and such

Have been through a few pastors like this. Said goodbye to their church. "Feed the sheep not beat them"!

Managing household well--includes managing finances and things related to the home

This was helpful in thinking through these types of situations… Thank you!

For the lack of examples, we are encouraged to know that the same Spirit that gave Paul understanding guides and leads us to discernment in these nuanced situations.

Luckily I did not choose to go into ministry. I'm definitely not qualified. I'm just grateful for God's forgiveness, but all I can do is to serve in a lesser capacity.

@JoseRodriguez-yr9uv

3 күн бұрын

Jkdm27, As believers, we are All in full-time ministry. There is no lesser capacity. Your ministry has immense value to God.

Great video.! I was always curious if I was disqualified as a minister due to my past. This was so encouraging..thanks Allen!

Thank you Mr. Parr

Thanks for bringing some clarity to a very delicate and serious situations.

You know Allen if its a bad character issue I think ministry is not the place for that individual. We all sin it doesn't make it right but as long as we're attached to this flesh we have problems. For me I choose to show mercy and pray for the person because eventually I'll need mercy also.

@david4unthank

6 күн бұрын

You are correct in what you say, however, the office of Pastor is not the same as everyday Christian. It has higher standards and when those standards are not met, then disqualification applies and the Pastor is no longer qualified for that office.

@Jaydubbayoutwo

6 күн бұрын

@@david4unthankis the standard perfection for leadership? Or what standards are there to determine when a leader crossed the line? Is there a sin limit? Is there a category of sin that leaders commit that automatically disqualifies them?

@shanteladams7613

6 күн бұрын

​@@Jaydubbayoutwothere is also the fact that sexual abuse is a crime. This man is roaming free and not paid for his actions. After that, maybe the next steps could be taken, but no one should get away with this

@dahliaherrod4301

6 күн бұрын

​@@JaydubbayoutwoI think it depends on your duties and the type of sin. For example, if it's confirmed an elder stole money from the church and defrauded them then remove them from access to the money and place them elsewhere. You don't have to kick them out or keep them from ministry forever. It may be a particular duty is just not appropriate for them. This protects the church and the elder too who may be struggling with a chronic sin issue

The husband of one wife could mean only married once and faithful. Also not divorced.

@EDFCentral

5 күн бұрын

This is what I was taught it meant in every single church I've ever been in. It literally says husband of ONE wife. I personally think it means not married to multiple women like they used to do back in the time it was written. I don't think it means divorce and the reason I say this is because I know a wonderful pastor whose wife left him for another man. He tried to resign because he had always been taught that "husband of one wife" meant he couldn't be divorced. The church refused to let him resign and he has gone on to be an effective pastor and church planter to this day. God still uses him in a pastoral role and he is now married to a wonderful Godly woman.

@eli-bt4he

5 күн бұрын

A man who remarries after a divorce, except in the case of adultery by the wife, is committing adultery, and is disqualified permanently from being a pastor. However, I would only apply this to men who got remarried while already a Christian.

@theeternalsbeliever1779

3 күн бұрын

@@eli-bt4he It doesn't really matter how you'd personally apply it. We have to look at how _God_ would apply it.

I could NEVER trust a pastor that had an affair. Period.

@nickjones1314

6 күн бұрын

I could never trust any man to speak and or write on behalf of a god.

@whoaitsally7676

5 күн бұрын

@sallyjane8274 me either. That shows such a lack of control and morals and boundaries.... like the pastor in SC who's wife just passed... he had had several affairs and divorces. Never should've been pastor.

@henning439

5 күн бұрын

If David was of this time, I would not stand a chance with you.

@davidpmilligan1965

5 күн бұрын

@@henning439David was a king , not an elder/pastor. Apples and oranges

@henning439

5 күн бұрын

@@davidpmilligan1965 So adultery has another meaning because David was a king? He slept with someone's wife and plotted his murder, yet God forgave him. Be very careful in your radical approach. You saying that you would never trust a pastor that had an affair is completely unbiblical because you suggest that they cannot change and do not deserve a second chance.

Thank you, Allen. As a long-time subscriber who has been hacked and canceled in a similar fashion that you have, I have your back 100 percent.

Thanks, Pastor Parr for all that you do, sir. Blessings to you and your family always in Christ Jesus. Amen.

@lectron307

6 күн бұрын

Where can you make donations to Brother Parr ?

@geekgazette

6 күн бұрын

@@lectron307 The dollar symbol and 'Thanks' is beside it to the far right of the thumbs up icon. Be blessed.

@LoveWisdomCourage

6 күн бұрын

Amen! Thanks for your generosity!

Thought provoking information as always. I believe child abuse would be a non-negotiable disqualification.

@ftmb1022

6 күн бұрын

Exactly.

@thebeatagp

6 күн бұрын

I would 100% agree!

@jesusprofessor314

6 күн бұрын

Does that include biblical spanking? The liberals have broadened the definition of abuse to include that in many places.

@laurykristensen6239

6 күн бұрын

Yes, thats why he and others had to misrepresent the truth. His earning potential was irresistible to all of them.

@cailewilkinson8362

6 күн бұрын

@@thebeatagphey brother a friend of mine a brother in Christ committed child sa before he got saved, now he is a legitimate repentant follower of Christ and is in ministry. What are your thoughts on that? Should the people he ministers to be concerned?

Great job, Allen! This is so necessary. Thanks for covering this!

I agree and I’m glad that you’re going over these and clearing up things because this is obviously something that’s really relevant. I will say, however, that in our day and age with social media and access to information, that we should not be too quick to draw conclusions because people can make accusations that are false. It doesn’t mean that people need to have this specific proof in order to prove that something did happen, but to think that people don’t bare false witness is also not entirely correct. So we should be cautious, make sure that we’re ensuring the safety of (alleged and confirmed) victims, but also make sure that we gather information before fully coming to a conclusion if the situation may call for it. This isn’t the case for everything, but those cautionary tales where people’s lives can be ruined because of things that end up not being true, are important because those are still peoples lives. However, often times there’s lots of evidence and if it’s a pattern, then that’s way different.

Thank you for this! This was an answered prayer from God for me since my husband and I was having this discussion and we have different opinions but this definitely helped me to see how there is subjectivity to the list that is given in 1 Timothy.

There is an example of, Charles Stanley... He was unfaithful and him and his wife decided to divorce. He stepped down from preaching. But, soon after the church "overwhelmingly voted" for him to continue being the Pastor. And he vowed to remain celibate and focus on feeding the flock! I think in that situation it ended up being the right choice.

Thank you for the information. It would be a nice follow up on how members of the church should deal with pastors who should be disqualified and yet refuse to step down from ministry. Blessed with your videos and content.

My pastor/husband (of 39 years) was denied a calling to 2 different churches because the search committee found out that I was divorced 40 years ago due to his adultery. Even though this isn’t biblical, this was their belief that I’m not qualified for a “leadership” position. So wrong!

Talk that talk

Thanks

Great Teaching Man Of God!!! 🕊️✌️✌️🕊️

I definitely agree that when someone stays in the pulpit while living a double/sinful lifestyle that is a big deal and they like should not be restored

I know a pastor no one knew was abusive but he truly was saved. The couple ended up starting a marriage ministry and ministering to others. His reputation is solid and he gives his testimony to others.. I say if they get caught in a sin yet don't repent and get help then there is a problem. If it is a pattern that he can't break then stepping down may b best option. This Christian walk is hard and support to truly walk free and in His work limited to none

You broke it down as good as I've heard. This is not an easy topic. Thank you for your clarity

Great video

Good questions to get answered Pastor Allen. Thx 🙏 and God bless you

Im so impressed with the redemption work the lord has done in Carl lentz life and his family. The pod cast he started is very supporte and healing and amazing testimony of the lord. He takes FULL responsibility

The recordings starting at 7:30 remind me of what it was like to serve in ministry during my time at Liberty University. Especially after being ordained at a church several miles north of campus, I was treated like this, and then blamed for everything. Calling them on it got me in big trouble, leading to a contract not getting renewed. Amen, Allen! Ministers need to quit acting like that!

Great video, Allen! This is actually part of the reason why I stopped doing the "sermon" part of Cinema Sermons. I've shared with you some of my struggles in our personal conversations and there's some other things I'm actively working to overcome, but I just wanted to make sure that I don't give the gospel black eye in any way. I want to make sure that the same guy doing videos at the same guy that they'll see out doing karaoke on a saturday. So I'm just enjoying making videos about movies and trying to be the best coach I can, and when I feel the time is right and that the Lord approves of it I'll start doing the sermon part again. Well done as always, my friend!

@thebeatagp

6 күн бұрын

Good to see you on here! Thanks for the clarification. God bless you!

@CinemaSermons

6 күн бұрын

@@thebeatagp God bless you as well!

You shared appropriately. Thank you

I really got a lot from this. The information distinguishing a 1 time incident verses an ongoing issue was insightful. Thanks!

Thanks Mr Allen

Thank you for this video Allen! In a time where people are speaking in opinions, you are equipping the saints! Very helpful video, especially as the LORD seems to be separating the wheat from the chaff right before our eyes!

Great video, brother Allen!! God bless you and your ministry!

Very good lesson. Greatly appreciated

Great and timely word of insight, big bro. Thanks for all that you do to inform and build up the body.

Good balanced teaching. Thanks Allen.

You are absolutely right on all points.

Keep these videos coming brother you are truly a blessing shout out from Toledo Ohio✊🏿✊🏿🙏🏿

@gohawks3571

6 күн бұрын

Just heads up; think your phone rearranged your words. My phone does that all the time ☹️ Just letting you know ✌️

@travarusmart24

6 күн бұрын

Ayeee Ohio in the house

@DH-wm8pd

6 күн бұрын

@@gohawks3571 thanks 🙏🏿✊🏿

@gohawks3571

6 күн бұрын

@@DH-wm8pd YW👍👍👍 I knew what you meant 😉

@allenparr what I’m yet to understand is Robert Morris was one of Pastor Mark Driscoll personal accountability Pastors. Yet, He’s been totally silent on this RM child abuse issue. And since he is very vocal about other men. I find it curious he’s now silent.

@johndibert5509

6 күн бұрын

Get over it, I think enough people have piled on RM

@bilandshark

6 күн бұрын

@@johndibert5509 pathetic reply. Seriously. Wasn’t talking to you anyway. People like you enable abusers.

@bilandshark

6 күн бұрын

@@johndibert5509 Get over a pedophile Mega Church Pastor? I’ll pray for your salvation.

At 4:25, pastor says, "Nothing that you did before you came to Christ disqualifies you from ministry." What about sexually abusing kids?

@thebeatagp

6 күн бұрын

Great question. I guess as I mentioned, we'd have to consider whether God disqualified the Apostle Paul for killing Christians. It's a tough situation. For me personally, I would not feel comfortable knowing my pastor had that type of past even if it was in his past but that's just me personally.

@dank2476

6 күн бұрын

@@thebeatagp Would God have chosen Paul if he was sexually abusing children when as Saul?

@eli-bt4he

5 күн бұрын

I would argue that true repentance would include turning yourself into law enforcement. Which, in most cases, would likely give you a legal status that makes you legally unable to serve as a pastor.

@IndianaJoe0321

5 күн бұрын

Cops cannot be pastors,@@eli-bt4he ?

I'm not a pastor but I believe these guideposts should be strickly listed and remembered for all who will themselves to be followers of Jesus Christ. What is required for ministry of pastors should seriously be adopted as requirements to lead a Christian life pleasing to our Lord Jesus Christ.

Thanks Pastor Parr,!! You are a Godly you man, that seems to know the scriptures, as well as having common sense. I’m I. Agreement with you. My thought is o. Some of these issues are - if you are in moral sin before you ever get to the pulpit and still in sin as you are preaching, I ask the question - “ Did God call then into ministry while they were operating in sin. I say NO, that is not the characteristics or ways of our Holy God. If they have repented before being called, then I would say that could definitely be God calling them, since we all sin. However, God lets us know the Dangerous sins, which are rarely being preached!! God gave .Adam & Eve one warning promise, they broke the covenant (His warning promise) God kept HIS WARNING PROMISE, Rev. 22:18-19 - “ “if you add anything to this book, or take away anything from this book, I will take away your name from the BOOK OF LIFE!!!” We all need to hear the full truth from our leaders!!! At 85, I can tell you life is very short and very serious. We need to hear the full council of God, then it is our CHOICE, and when we blow it, leaders need emphasis TRUTH, SIN, & REPENTANCE!!!❤️❤️ ❤️❤️❤️😊

Thanks 👍 you were very informative.

This is gonna be a long question for Pastor Parr but I would like for his advice. What about an individual who was deep in a sin, never confessed it to a person, but confessed to God, asked for forgiveness and surrendered to Christ? Then they were delivered from it? Could someone who never was in ministry but had a sin they were delivered from in the past be in ministry? This was me. Early age I fell to the video sin (you know what I mean). It was horrid. I wasn’t in church anymore during this time. But after high school and then college, I had this urge to be in church more. Almost got stuck in a oneness church but I was led to another college in another town that was more biblically sound. I met my future wife the same day at the new college when the semester began. And a second time at the college church fellowship sponsored by the local church. Same week. God led me back to church and yet still had the sin (but this was a step in His purpose for me). I’d be mad at myself and beating myself up. But I prayed more and more because I wanted to be with Him. I was saved as a little kid but fell into all that mess. I felt as though I was condemned because I was not listening to the right voice. I asked God to forgive me and I fought so long. At some point I surrendered everything to Jesus and I never do those specified things again. Now, I am resisting the temptation to look at parts of a woman’s body, and I feel I still beat myself down when I do so by accident and unintentionally, but Jesus has helped me through this mess and I do my best to follow Him (letting Him work in my life). The Holy Spirit has helped sanctified me so much with more self-control and also reassuring me that God loves me and has a purpose for me. I feel detached from the world and I don’t like it. I long to see God and not do the sin others do. I want to do His will. I’ll never be perfect but I want to follow my Savior, my Shepherd. Temptation stings but Jesus Christ is worth my praise. To Him be all the glory amen. This is my confession to you all. And the reason I say this is because God has put into my head the idea of ministry and I have a tugging in my soul to do so. But I’ve been fighting back because of my past and my perceived ability to do something like it. I don’t think I’m worthy enough to do ministry and yet the tugging remains. There was something someone said regarding our abilities at the time and God’s purpose for us. “God doesn’t choose the prepared. God prepares the chosen.” This very quote has repeatedly worn away my fears over time. But I need advice to pursue what I feel God is leading me to. This same thing happened a year ago when out of the blue the idea of teaching was put in my head. Told my wife countless times I couldn’t fathom the idea of teaching (she’s a teacher). But that idea entered my head, I prayed about it with my wife who said it’d be a miracle if I got hired in a month since schools were about to open again. I got all my provisional licensure and prereqs done, and hired, in four weeks. Including masters program so I can teach and do classes for it. It was a miracle that I can only give God the complete credit. I know this feels similar to what I’m now experiencing but this is a bigger leap.

Well said, Allen.

Very fair and clear , thank you👏🙏

Love this teaching video. Allen Parr is on parr and on point. Fair and just in his explanation and judgement 🙏🙏🙏

I’m glad this is stuff with Rod Parsley is finally coming out

This video raises a lot of really important and valid questions. I would like to see the other side of the coin discussed that is connected to the last question of distraction. What is being done to foster healing of the entire body of Christ? What needs to happen to a leader who has sinned is undeniably important. However, the line between consequences/vengeance, mercy/avoidance are often not talked about. Ironically, these types of situations are often used by God to finally “qualify” someone who has been viewed as meeting the requirements prior to a discovery of sin. A person who cannot look at a leader without seeing a past sin is in need of restoration as well. Fallen leaders are only the tip of the iceberg. Churches would be wise to remember that ships sink because of what is below the surface.

9:22 Did he just say that if this has been a pattern, the leader needs to step away so that they can experience some sort of "humiliation" plan?

@lookingatdaisies9901

20 сағат бұрын

Yes, Paul mentions it, in the Bible, of course like anything, it can be used by evil people. Basically if someone is being unrepentant in terrible behaviour, kick them out, but not too long so they don't end up in sorrow (if they become repentant) If it helps, think of everyone in a class turning on an unrepentant bully and not accepting him back until he stops bullying people.

These were good guidelines to build on Church leaders should call on him to set rules within the church or leadership conferences over a group of churches

Galatians 6:1: Brethren, if a man be overtaken in a fault, ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness; considering thyself, lest thou also be tempted.

The fallen leader shouldn't go to treatment for their sin for the purpose of going back to ministry; the purpose of treatment is to treat the sin. If that is the objective for treatment, they are side stepping their sin

the best kind of ministry is being a youtuber...no accountability..no elders no financial burdens..no committees 😂😂😂

@tic8259

5 күн бұрын

You hit the nail on the head with this comment. You can have people send you money and have your own captive audience and following, free of accountability....if that's what you want 🤦🏾‍♀️. This day and age we live in, I wonder should the Timothy 3 guidelines apply to KZreadrs too.

@ktspirit1

2 күн бұрын

We are to use discernment. I started watching a video that showed up on YT. I could tell immediately it was an AI generated voice. I watched long enough to see the AI text (not YT generated CC) discussing the Garden of Yosemite. LOL There were a lot of subscribers commenting on how great that channel was.

@tic8259

2 күн бұрын

@@ktspirit1 😂😂 that's ridiculous (and kind of funny 🤭). You are so right! I pray the church asks God for discernment in these times where a little lie (yeast) is mixed in with a lot of truth (leaven) here and there! Lord help us! 🙏🏾

@ktspirit1

2 күн бұрын

@@tic8259 Many will be deceived. If possible. even the elect. IF Possible. It's good to ask, seek, knock.

Hallelujah!!! I’m blessed and favored with $60,000 every week! Now I can afford anything and support the work of God and the church. For Your glory, LORD! HALLELUJAH!

@JessicaMarie-sf3xp

23 сағат бұрын

Oh really? Tell me more! Always interested in hearing stories of successes.

@MatthewDaniel-gm3gc

23 сағат бұрын

This is what Ana Graciela Blackwelder does, she has changed my life.

@MatthewDaniel-gm3gc

23 сағат бұрын

After raising up to 60k trading with her, I bought a new house and car here in the US and also paid for my son’s (Oscar) surgery. Glory to God.shalom.

@MichaelJames346

23 сағат бұрын

I know Ana Graciela Blackwelder, and I have also had success...

@MichaelJames346

23 сағат бұрын

Absolutely! I have heard stories of people who started with little or no knowledge but managed to emerge victorious thanks to Ana Graciela Blackwelder.

I would agree with all the points. As a minister, you have to always be humble, because your boss is God! If he would approve of it, then why would you. As far as getting feedback when calling a new minister, from a previous congregation they served is important, but always with the filter of it is a voice a few or many. I know that I can't say something that everyone agrees with, or has no problem with, but you can always get the "parking lot" group that disagrees.

What happens with Repeat offenders such as, Jamal Bryant who is not held accountable by the church board or church members.

Very good point, especially when it comes to subjective opinions.

Above reproach is actuality failry specific and objective. Essentially, if there's anyone in the community (Christian or otherwise)that has a legitimate social debt to correct from them then they aren't above reproach. Have they wronged someone and not made ammends? They aren't above reproach.

Allen I was waiting 4 u to speak on this about pastors

In regard to a local body of Messiah (church): the disciplinary action for any of the pastoral, elder or any leadership role (including musicians and worship leaders) in that local body should be directed by the guidance of the Holy Spirit in those who are mature in discernment. Then, the local body of Messiah (church) will trust that God has allowed the outcome. In all, always remember that Forgiveness is always the order of Melchizedek.🙏

All this stuff why am happy I’m a Presbyterian pcs. It’s already been written in our bylaws if confessions is that perfect situation probably not but I believe everything’s already been discussed

I think a lot of these qualifications are subjective because it's really up to each church community. I think if a group has set the rules for engagement then the leader violated them, the church is well within their rights to remove him from leadership. He's subject to whatever consequences they've already set up. I think a major issue is that most churches never set consequences in place for violations. God sets rules with consequences. So do parents and businesses. Churches should do the same. This way people know what they're signing up for when joining a church community and it's easier to hold each other accountable.

@theeternalsbeliever1779

3 күн бұрын

None of them are subjective because these are orders from God. This is the fundamental problem with Protestants: they want to treat everything that personally inconveniences them as subjective and still claim their beliefs come from the Bible. You either take it all as it is or reject all of it. Playing the "this is subjective" game is the way of Jeroboam. Jeroboam rejected God's government, and he led an entire kingdom to physical and spiritual disaster.

@dahliaherrod4301

2 күн бұрын

@@theeternalsbeliever1779 the qualifications are a commandment but the behavior is subjective. I think there's flexibility built in to the scripture so th church can move with the time. For example, deciding what type of sin excludes man from leadership. How long do they stay away? Is there any work they can do to show their repentance? It's up to each church to decide as every case is different and requires different judgement based on God's will and wisdom. Some judgments require legal intervention, some don't. There's no way for us to do a one size fits all solution for every issue that crops up

There are many pastors who have had more than one with and nobody bats an eye. The fact that this was admitted from this video kind of proves that point. It’s treated like God was saying no polygamy, meanwhile ignoring the fact that divorce and remarriage is adultery.

What happens if the members never know about what caused the pastor to step down in the first place? Maybe not all of the terrible details, but the nature of the sin itself? True repentance involves not only forgiveness, but confession, does it not? How would any member trust the elders if only the elders know about the pastor’s indiscretion and the members don’t?

I'm agreeing with your logic on this. It challenges me a bit tho. I'm in a setting where the division between teacher and the people being taught isn't that clear. Like a small house church. I really don't care to dig in anyone's past. I dig in my own tho. So even tho I'm not a pastor, I'm not a teacher, I really sometimes wonder if I'm unfit to do what I do - I study a lot, right now I have a little pause, but usually I study a lot, and people in my circle, I know they appreciate my opinion on matters when it comes to learning how to read the bible in context and offer insight on matters. Sometimes I feel like a teacher, but I'm not. And sometimes I feel like I'm unfit, or doing something I shouldn't, because of sins I did before I became a christian. And that's like 30 years ago. I take it seriously, but I think I take it too seriously too. I just don't wanna do anything that's not right towards my friends, and I don't wanna condemn myself also by teaching when I shouldn't. Meh, this is complicated and what I write is just my random thoughts coming up as I watch the video.

@user-iz8np3vv4i

4 күн бұрын

I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who has strengthened me, because He considered me faithful, putting me into service, even though I was previously a blasphemer and a persecutor and a violent aggressor. Yet I was shown mercy because I acted ignorantly in unbelief; and the grace of our Lord was more than abundant, with the faith and love which are found in Christ Jesus. It is a trustworthy statement, deserving full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, among whom I am foremost. Yet for this reason I found mercy, so that in me as the foremost sinner Jesus Christ might demonstrate His perfect patience as an example for those who would believe in Him for eternal life. -excerpt 1 Timothy 1 -words of Paul

Great teaching Allen!! Thank you! God bless you & your Family… my schoolmate!! Go Steelers🖤💛 😊

2 men come to mind when discussing a domineering attitude, Greg Locke and Mark Driscoll. Both of them are disqualified with their actions in just the last year while in the pulpit. This is why, IMO, we are seeing a decline in church attendance. There are so many hypocrites preaching.

I think my only question is what is of the congregation is regards to forgiveness? Yes trust is broken, that is understood. But does that have us to continue to hold a person’s past against them moving forward? No, they may not be restored to their position or title, but sometimes I feel like the Church even suppress the gifting too

Good video

My husband and I just discussed this subject.. a local pasture that is well known for his ministry reaching those in addiction, because of his VERY rough past before he became a man of God, was recently arrested for a DUI. I think that sin is bound to happen, and as long as it isn't pointing toward a serious character flaw or possibly a complete lack of fruit, they should step back for a while and then once they have repented and hopefully healed the issue be reinstated.

What if someone fell and was restored 20 years ago, but then the history came back up and the church calls for the guy to get removed... even though they already were restored 2 decades ago? They didn't slip or fall since, BUT because someone brought it back up, now people are upset and want to leave. Should the Elders support the pastor or support the congregation in this situation?

@ScarlettAdiel

6 күн бұрын

👀

@eurekahope5310

6 күн бұрын

I don't believe pastors should be restored. Once a pastor has had an affair he is no longer "above reproach." It is a high calling and God warned that pastors ought to be few.

@SistaSueK

6 күн бұрын

The Elders need to support the victim.

@Angelface11

6 күн бұрын

Sexually abusing a child means somebody should be in prison

@gohawks3571

6 күн бұрын

I agree with the responses. Even if it wasn't child abuse; say, an adulterer - they should not be a pastor. Or anyone in authority. Should be in church, yes, absolutely! Unless they're unrepentant and sinning. Their testimony would be so helpful. But! They should not have authority. As a victim of SA, I would not want to go to a church with my rapists or molesters in there, esp in a place of power! I believe people can change, but they have that character flaw that they are fighting against. They shouldn't be in a place of temptation, which any place of power would be that.

Heavy drinker in my opinion means someone that gets drunk. Getting drunk (I've had a lot of experience with that unfortunately) is when you get to the point that you lose self control. For me personally there's this point of no return where if I cross it I will wake up either not remembering what happened after in the worse case but in most cases I will remember and often times that meant sinning in ways that I wouldn't have otherwise. More specifically; after becoming a Christian I drank too much once and the next day I remembered some sinful behavior. What was strange about it was that in that moment I didn't even stop to think that it was sinful. It's like being controlled by the flesh with the mind nearly absent. I actually prayed alot over that because I was confused and troubled that The Holy Spirit didn't convict me in that state. I "accidentally" drank too much so I didn't even think I was going to get drunk. Anyway, self control is the key and one fruit of The Holy Spirit is self control. That's what upset me about it. Not only did I mindlessly sin but I lost self control. Like an animal in fact.

I always thank God for your KZread channel. I wanted to take my Bible study to a new level. I prayed about it and I came across your KZread channel, please keep up the good work

Wilful, unrepentant or overly grievious sins are a distraction to the flock..and a shocking representation of all that is holy. Good job Allen

so you believe in confession? to whom?

Here is a summary of the video transcript in bullet points: Introduction The speaker discusses the concept of disqualification from ministry, referencing 1 Corinthians 9:27, where Paul says he disciplines his body to avoid being disqualified from ministry. The speaker asks what exactly disqualifies a pastor from ministry and whether disqualification is temporary or permanent. Qualifications for Ministry The speaker references 1 Timothy 3, which lists qualifications for an overseer, including being above reproach, having a good reputation, being the husband of one wife, and being gentle and not quarrelsome. The speaker notes that some of these qualifications are subjective, while others are objective. Examples of Disqualification The speaker gives examples of behaviors that could disqualify a pastor from ministry, including: Adultery: if a pastor has committed adultery and has not confessed and repented, they may need to step down from ministry. Physical abuse: a pastor who has been physically abusive towards their wife or children is not fit for ministry. Heavy drinking: a pastor who is a heavy drinker may not be fit for ministry. Not teaching the word of God according to proper hermeneutical principles: a pastor who consistently misinterprets the Bible may not be fit for ministry. Questions to Ask The speaker poses several questions to ask when determining whether a pastor should step down from ministry, including: Has the pastor fully repented of their sin, or are they just sorry they got caught? Is the sin so egregious that trust cannot be regained? Is this a one-time violation or a repeated pattern? Have other trusted spiritual leaders deemed the person fit to return to ministry? Is the sin a distraction for the minister? Conclusion The speaker notes that the Bible does give qualifications for ministry, but many are subjective, and there is no clear example of a man being permanently disqualified from ministry in the Bible. The speaker encourages balance and nuance in determining whether a pastor should step down from ministry.

I committed sorcery, idolatry, witchcraft, and swearing during the pandemic. I have repented but I think that I would not fit the ministry role because of my past sins.

@user-iz8np3vv4i

4 күн бұрын

I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who has strengthened me, because He considered me faithful, putting me into service, even though I was previously a blasphemer and a persecutor and a violent aggressor. Yet I was shown mercy because I acted ignorantly in unbelief; and the grace of our Lord was more than abundant, with the faith and love which are found in Christ Jesus. It is a trustworthy statement, deserving full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, among whom I am foremost. Yet for this reason I found mercy, so that in me as the foremost sinner Jesus Christ might demonstrate His perfect patience as an example for those who would believe in Him for eternal life. -excerpt 1 Timothy 1 -words of Paul

The video editor🙌🏽🙌🏽

Can a pastor who committed sexual assault of a minor be restored to the ministry?

@oldschool5

6 күн бұрын

Sure. Im sure some of your favorite pastors have done much worse that you are unaware of. There are whole nations of people who are now Christians because of slave masters. If we can accept Christianity from a slave master than im sure we can get the word from a pedophile.

@theeternalsbeliever1779

3 күн бұрын

Ideally, no. A congregation should be able to trust a pastor in order to submit to their authority. A person cannot logically do that knowing the pastor betrayed the trust of the most vulnerable members of the congregation and used their authority to prey on them.

@oldschool5

2 күн бұрын

@@theeternalsbeliever1779 Pedophilia is accepted in the bible. A man getting his daughters pregnant is accepted in the bible. Depending on the church, a preacher jumpin on a lil child is cool. The catholics do it all the time. The Hebrew culture deals with men marrying Baby Girls. That is the fabric of the culture

@richardaguirre3719

2 күн бұрын

@@theeternalsbeliever1779 thanks for your feedback. I was told that I was being judgemental for believing that someone who did this has lost the trust and couldn't be restored. Of course I left that church many years ago.

The verbs in 1 Timothy 3 are all in the present tense. Some obviously reflect on past behavior, but it is a stretch to use present tense verbs to claim permanent disability. Trust of the sheep is important for shepherding, but the levels and kind of trust needed depends on the local situation. My view tends to be that local elders direct the affirs of their church. So if one set of elders applies 1 Tim 3 differently from another, that's OK. It is wrong however, to insist that the elders of other churches apply 1 Timothy 3 the same way you would. Your elders direct the affairs of your church. Their elders direct the affairs of their church. Kinda like it's wrong for parents to criticize parents of other children for debatable child raising practices.

I agreed, until I applied these to David (adultery, then orchestrating her husband to be killed) and Paul (Doing Satan's work by having Christians hunted and horrifically murdered). I have concluded; ONLY God can decide. So, if with repentance, a tree continues to bear much fruit for the Kingdom, let people talk. Let some members walk. Are the critics walking in sin for not being able to forgive? God provided a Nathan for David and a Barnabas to prove Paul. We should pray and wait.

@eurekahope5310

6 күн бұрын

King David is a false equivalency. He was a king (a political leader) not a pastor or priest. If we use David as the example, what do we say about the horrible kings God allowed to serve for decades? We have the example of the disciples and apostles. Were any of them returned to ministry after adultery or murder? No. Saul committed grievous sins BEFORE conversion to Christ. At that point he is made a new creature, the old is passed away. He has his heart of stone turned to one of flesh. Going forward he showed immense fruit in keeping with salvation. The difference is when a pastor claims Christ then commits disqualifying sins.

@raynardstanfield5706

6 күн бұрын

@@eurekahope5310 Thank you. I understand your point. I look at the way God treated gross failures and I think it deserves a bit of humility and grace on our part, for those who fall. Was not Paul rebuking churches and Pastors in his letters. Calling out church leaders for pointing out the sin of others while committing or taking pleasure in their own minds the same sins? He disqualified most often for false doctirines. God will continue to make some who fail badly to rebound greatly, and we don't know who they are or will be.. No one has to join me, but I choose to pray and wait if there is evidence of Kingdom fruit. May God bless you and our Church which cannot be defeated! I love you.

I feel a restoration would be okay with me, crime woukd be a different issue though.... however, its really up to the elders and ifnthe elders allow them back yhem congregation just have to make a choice to stay or go.