Saul did an amazing job considering the circumstances and how little time he probably has to prepare

@juresaiyan

2 жыл бұрын

I seriously doubt he could have done better. Which goes to show what an incredibly underrated actor he is.

The thing I find most interesting here is how much leeway they gave the actor to choose their performance. Both are doing the same work, reading the same lines and ques, and both are doing it so completely differently. It makes you wonder how many other characters on the show were defined so heavily through performance.

@JamesC1981

4 ай бұрын

even the dialogue is slightly different i didnt know they were able to change once the script was written

@Exitof99

4 ай бұрын

This is how it is. While actors are expected to know the dialog rote, the most important thing is the performance, and not a few word changes. Further, the actor chooses how to deliver the lines, but the director may suggest changes on other takes.

Rubinek definetly killed that role. It's one of the best episodes of TNG and he's the main reason. Rapaport did ok, but his acting was more like just another day at the office. A good example is when he ordered them to transmit their sensor data. Rubinek snapped his fingers in a hasty, d-bag way. Rapaport just nodded.

@xmisterpilgrimx4869

2 жыл бұрын

This is the example that stood out for me as well. That little motion tells us a LOT about his character, while Rappaport's nod tells us nothing. It's a great example of how subtle little touches can define a character - with Rubinek, we can tell he's a douche who expects (and usually gets) instant obedience to his whims, but he doesn't LORD it over others, he just sees it as a fact - the casual nature of the gesture shows us that he expects his underlings to anticipate his desires, needing only a brief signal for his orders to be carried out. That tiny little gesture conveys an absurd amount of information to the viewer - it's clear that Rubinek has a fully formed character in his mind, with defined characteristics and idiosyncrasies. It's a perfect example of the value a talented actor can bring to a project - how they can take words on a page and breathe life into them in a way that untrained people cannot.

@scotch4890

2 жыл бұрын

Poor choice of words considering Rappaport tried to kill himself while filming

@TheaterPup

Жыл бұрын

He didn’t just nod, it’s obvious he’s hiding something.

@LadyhawksLairDotCom

Жыл бұрын

To be fair, Rappaport wasn't exactly in top form, considering he tried to kill himself shortly after these scenes were shot and eventually succeeded before the Rubinek version aired. Still, I agree, Rubinek's version is superior.

@SeaJay_Oceans

Жыл бұрын

After Star Trek, Saul Rubinek went on to become a 'collector' for Warehouse 13... Artie Nielsen kzread.info/dash/bejne/dmdspaOvlKXMeJs.html Interesting !

Saul Rubinek really did embody the role so well. David Rappaport seemed like he was just reading lines, there was so little soul behind his words in his performance. I only just noticed this a few days ago when I rewatched this episode in HD, that when Saul Rubinek as Kivas Fajo tells Data that he grew up poor and was abused or something like that, that he actually has tears in his eyes when he says it. Never even noticed that before.

@haveringpish

5 ай бұрын

Not really fair as the Rappaport scenes aren't the finished product.

@SkepticalChris

4 ай бұрын

@@haveringpish I can only judge from what I saw.

I think they are both unique interpretations of the character. David’s version plays at being initially sympathetic (on the surface) after data’s “accident” while Saul’s version was going through a mental script to avoid blame.

@michaelwalter6041

2 жыл бұрын

Such a sad story about David Rapaport, but clearly he did good work in this role. This episode was my first exposure to Saul Rubinek, and I still think, as I did on first viewing, that he knocked this out of the park. I mean, how vile do you have to be to make Data pull the trigger with the phaser set on kill rather than stun? Saul’s acting chops have been confirmed in everything I’ve seen him do, from Unforgiven to the Jesse Stone movies. But this role had an emotional impact no others have quite matched, and if we consider this comparison as an act-off between Rubinek and Rapoport, I give the win to Rubinek, by more than a nose.

@terrypussypower

2 жыл бұрын

@@michaelwalter6041 Yeah, Rubinek definitely takes the honours! Best role I saw him in was as film producer “Lee Donowitz” in “True Romance”! His were some of the best scenes in the whole movie! And btw, it’s Rappaport not Rapoport.

@jovetj

5 ай бұрын

I really like how Rubinek came off as smarmy and subtly phony. Mr. Rappaport didn't have any of that-his delivery seems pretty phoned in, in compassion. I also like Rubinek's look more, too. I'm sure they could have found a much better role for Rappaport, though. Alas, it wasn't to be.

@ghost7524

6 күн бұрын

@@michaelwalter6041 I don't think that the Varon-T disruptor (not a phaser) has a stun setting, as it was never suggested that it does.

Different interpretations of the same character. David Rappaport seems to start off rather bland and inoffensive and become more menacing throughout the episode. The final confrontation between Data and Kivas has a markedly different tone. Saul Rubinek plays it with charm, resignation, and a sense of regret making it seem like the character could be redeemed. Rappaport, on the other hand, spits venom and shows no remorse. I actually like both portrayals.

@timyo6288

3 жыл бұрын

David is playing the character a lot smaller.

@markherring3513

3 жыл бұрын

David seems too stiff doe this roll...Saul presented it better.

@eazye519

4 ай бұрын

Rapaport is garbage compared to Saul.

@hansolo631

4 ай бұрын

@@eazye519 Yea, I agree - my initial impression is that Rappaport is way too wooden. I'd be curious how menacing he would be in proper context, with the soundtrack playing and all that jazz. But from what I see here, Saul appears to be a much better actor

Saul baby! Saul killed it big time!!!!!Not to mention Brent's performance, Love it!!!!!!!!!

@TheNecropolis20

2 жыл бұрын

at Kevin Compise - Saul - for sure nailed it / killed it Big time for sure. Saul was just a cold calculated emotionless villain of the weak. and this is how its supposed to be some times like it was for this episode.. David he was too emotional and struggling with depression in real life.. David did not need to be that darn over the top / and good with his acting for a villain of the week character. The acting with David was so damn good they were setting up for a two parter with him like he would get up out of his Cell bed and then its like what are we (the Enterprise crew) going to do with this guy? and then we see him in another episode in the next week... but like it was just too over the top in his acting to where you wanted to see more of him in the next episode, he was meant to be a forget-able character . for possible we could have seen this character in the next episode , considering he was safe in his cell, but he killed himself in real life.. at Kevin - so without a doubt Saul killed / nailed it just the way its supposed to be not some over the top acting that was too good for the episode , Its true the man was a dwarf ,but his acting for this scene was larger than life it self. the acting needed to be normal person size not larger than life size.

I honestly can’t tell which I would prefer. Each portrayal brings a unique character to the screen. Saul seems to have gone for the emotionally unstable individual who has self-worth issues and needs “things” to make himself appear more valuable, even if it means others suffer. David comes across as a plainly apathetic character who fully believes that he is more valuable than others without any internal moral struggle.

@eazye519

2 жыл бұрын

Are you insane? This is one of the best episodes of the entire series because of Saul. The first guy was horrible.

@SeaJay_Oceans

Жыл бұрын

David absolutely seems more threatening in the final scene - you could imagine an episode where he escapes Federation prision and seeks Revenge against Enterprise, 'Kahn' style.

@oldtwinsna8347

8 ай бұрын

@@SeaJay_Oceans I agree, the ending with the holding cell is where I always struggled with Rubinek's portrayal which seem forced and unnecessary (even before I even seen any of these clips of Rappaport). I felt like the episode should've ended where Data held his phaser pointed to Fajo and yet materialized back on the Enterprise. But with Rappaport in that holding cell I get this frightened feeling that Fajo is going to deliver some serious payback to Data and more so to Data's friends.

I'm biased - once got David Rappaport stoned in the Casablanca club, Cardiff, and he had me giggling like a loon while enjoying the reggae and some red stripe. He said one of the advantages of being so little was that it didn't take much to get him stoned or drunk - a cheap date. I liked seeing him in the movies and TV - especially Shades in TISWAS - but Time Bandits remains his golden moment. Would like to have seen this one as his alone.

Saul Rubinek is simply perfect for the role. No one else but him could have done it so perfectly

@Scripture-Man

3 жыл бұрын

Agreed. It's my favorite TNG episode, and Saul makes it what it is!

@Scipio488

3 жыл бұрын

His performance was very rich, complex... human.

@adamlarussa5243

2 жыл бұрын

Absolutely. It's awful what happened with Rappaport, but Saul definitely did phenomenal with the role.

@divinemissem5677

2 жыл бұрын

Completely disagree. David had a unique presence that was very creepy. I've never found Saul creepy

@terminat1

2 жыл бұрын

And yet if many others had been in the role the episode would have still been great. You'd then make the same conclusion: X is perfect. I can't imagine anyone else in it.

I really like Rappaport's cold intensity here, especially his reaction to Data's last line.

I'm going to give Rapaport some credit here: he is emoting through an absolute ton of prosthetic makeup. That would probably impede his face expressions, so he has to have some cartoonish villainy in his voice.

@m.dwaynesteckley4832

4 ай бұрын

Yes, I agree Rapaport facial emoting was stifled by the make up. He was an interesting choice for the role: it shows monsters can come in all sizes. I wonder how we would react to the opposite situation where Rapaoort was canon. However, to me though, it IS the facial expressions and gestures Saul presented gave it a more authentic feel to me: less cartoony. And that Saul, a typical being, with a bit of a belly and not big and strong, not the usual visual of a monster still provides that idea that they can be anywhere or anyone. Superb episode of Data's growth either way.

I think Saul put more pizazz in the part. But to be fair, there is sound post-processing in Saul's version that isn't in David's that may be skewing things a bit. Possibly some other processing as well.

Saul Rubineks is one of those performances, it carries the whole episode. If i think of this episode i think of Saul Rubinek.

Interesting how some people watch this footage and in hindsight see a depressed man ready to commit suicide. I see a brave talented actor still hungry for the spotlight and doing his best with the script before him. Both actors made unique choices that doesn't make one better than the other. Just different. I don't see in Rappaport's performance a man who had given up at all. This wasn't why he gave up. If anything, acting was probably a lifeline for him. Something else was going on that had nothing to do with his acting. Rappaport must have had something personal and tragic outside his acting which drove him to a bitter end. His Simon McKay was magic.

@fredlodge1275

Жыл бұрын

Agree 100%. It's crazy to read anything from his portrayal here. While I vastly prefer Saul Rubinek in this role, I don't get the impression that Rappaport had "given up" in any way, he just had a very different mental image of who Kivas Fajo was (and perhaps less experience with nonverbal acting). People are just applying characteristics to him in retrospect because they know what happened later.

@JGarciaAKP

10 ай бұрын

It's possible to have the opinion that it was an inferior performance without it having to do with having to do with the circumstances surrounding his demise.

@JGarciaAKP

10 ай бұрын

Rubinek had the superior performance any way you want to look at it.

@jovetj

5 ай бұрын

@@fredlodge1275 I don't believe Rappaport was right for this role, but his career spoke for itself. He didn't have anything to prove by taking this role.

Rubinek is an actor I like a lot. His Fajo was more of an emotionless sociopath. Rappaport put more venom into his portrayal. He came across as evil because he liked being evil. Rubinek was evil because he just plain didn't give a damn about anyone or anything but himself - a true sociopath. The two were both very good in the role with entirely different interpretations. I think, in the end, I liked Rappaport's Fajo a little better because of the venom, the evil he put into the part. And I think his dwarfism added to the role. The audience could come to the conclusion that his evil was compensation for his size in comparison to other species.

@jovetj

5 ай бұрын

Rubinek's Fajo was more of a used car salesman, fast talker and selfish, smarmy creep.

Perhaps here the trick is not in watching Rappaport versus Rubinek, but in seeing how Brent Spiner matches the challenge each actor presents him. Something about Rubinek's performance brings out a better performance in Spiner. Rubinek is one of those character actors who knows how to lend focus and give a fellow thespian sharing the stage what they need to make their performance more believable and honest. Rubinek is in the moment, whereas objectively speaking, Rappaport doesn't feel as invested. I blame the make up frankly. Notice how they didn't have time to do Rubinek's face up entirely so he's able to be more expressive. Rappaport didn't need the prosthetics. So much of his performance is in his face in other projects but here the mask he's wearing is almost shackling his capabilities. Rubinek is able to give Spiner more to work with and that shows in the interplay between them.

@divinemissem5677

2 жыл бұрын

Except 90% of Brent's performance was based on neither one. They were close-ups, most likely played to a script supervisor when the other actor isn't in frame

@neonknights

2 жыл бұрын

@@divinemissem5677 There are a-hole actors (Wesley Snipes for one) who prefer to relax in their trailers while their colleagues are doing their close-ups and have the script supervisor read their lines. However, many actors stay and play the scene even though they're off-camera, out of help and respect for their fellow thespians.

@milesmojave8223

Жыл бұрын

Excellent observation! I felt the same way too. Data is emotionless so Rubinek's more colourful performance gave Spiner more to work with. He was able use more inflection in his lines without appearing to give Data any emotion. Had Spiner read his lines that way with Rappaport, I would have wondered why Data was getting emotional. It also lets Data be "angry" at the end with just enough doubt to make the audience give him a pass.

Saul Rubinek hit a grandslam here. he is way better. He may be one of the best villains ever

people dont understand how much different the background noise makes the scenes. The little guy had no background noise which made the scenes seem not as well acted

I agree with you, Rubinek was better. He had a kind of snark with his delivery. In the last scene, even Spiner acts better because he's playing off a better actor. It seems he really can feel pleasure at the other fellows misfortune, or maybe I'm just seeing what I want to see.

@StusGameReviews

3 жыл бұрын

MUCH better.

@jimmyfischer8170

3 жыл бұрын

I wonder if Saul was contracted to play an upcoming character.There must be a story behind his being asked to replace David.

@stevepalpatine2828

3 жыл бұрын

@@jimmyfischer8170 They shot these scenes on a Thursday and Friday, and were supposed to finish up after the weekend, but David killed himself that weekend, so the producers had to bring in Saul to reshoot the scenes.

@jimmyfischer8170

3 жыл бұрын

@@stevepalpatine2828 Thanks, I have since researched what happened and heard BRENT SPINER tell what happened.I should try doing some research first in the future,the internet is great for that.Still sad and tragic though.

@fonkbadonk2957

2 жыл бұрын

As far as I remember, Saul is a ST fan and friends with someone on the show. He asked to take a set tour and was allowed, which was just around the time where Rappaport attempted suicide. The producers then asked him to try for the role, and quickly decided to re-shoot the scenes with him (plus the remaining ones), sort of in a hurry. For Rappaport this was a terrible time and a tragedy overall, bit I too think that Rubinek delivered a much much more nuanced and enjoyable performance for the role. To the point where I think this episode would never have been as well regarded as it ended up being. As unfair as it may sound, having seen Rappaports interpretation of the role now for the first time, it almost seems as a bad parody of Rubinek's version :-/

Saul Rubinek is as talented an actor as there has ever been. Most would pale in comparison.

Both actors did great. I can't really compare them as they're different takes on the same character. It's a shame Rappaport didn't get to finish the role.

What happened to Rappaport was a tragedy. I remember watching him as the toy-maker/covert spy adventurer Simon on "The Wizard" on CBS when I was a kid. But I must say that Saul Rubinek absolutely nailed this character & it's hard to imagine anyone else in the role. It's actually to his benefit that circumstances gave no time to create an elaborate latex & alien make-up job for him. I think something of his incredible performance would have been compromised. As far as Rappaport is concerned, his take on Fajo is mustache-twirlling villiany. There's nothing wrong or bad about it. Perhaps in hindsight one can see that his physical, emotional, & psychological pain has overtaken him at this point.

@davidmaestas2915

2 жыл бұрын

I watched 'The Wizard' when I was a kid. One of my favorite shows at the time. They should reboot it for Netflix.

@whutzat

Жыл бұрын

@@davidmaestas2915 They would just cast a black woman in the role.

@Heldemon

Жыл бұрын

@@whutzat Shoo little MAGAt

@whutzat

Жыл бұрын

@@Heldemon You first, Antifa spawn.

David Rappaport is just not convincing me. Rubinek is far more sinister

@DovahKanye

3 жыл бұрын

Interesting I would say that I think David's performance was more sinister in the sense that he only had that one trait, Rubinek's performance came off as mischievous at times, only then to become sinister. That said David didn't shoot the other scenes so because of his death so it's hard to say if he wouldn't have played it differently in other scenes.

@private15

2 жыл бұрын

I wonder if David’s struggle with internal mental health issues made it impossible for him to act to his potential. But Rubinek was a far more interesting character. So sad that David did not get the help he needed to control his issues and be happier. Mental first aid should be taught to everyone in grade school.

I thought it was weird in the broadcast version how Saul says Data is "JUST" an Android, and Data's final callback is saying he is "ONLY" an Android. It makes more sense now seeing the original line read from David said "ONLY". Saul probably changed the word at the time not realising it would be directly called back to in the final scene.

@jamesyount2423

3 жыл бұрын

Good catch

It almost seems like there is enough footage that the episode could be completed with David's performance. He was a great actor! He was outstanding in Time Bandits! Might be nice so many years later to see a fantastic editor rework this into a ST NG episode! A fitting tribute to a talent we lost too soon!

You know, it's such an impossible question. Rappaport was playing a completely different character and would have given him his own identity and his own style. Whatever that would have been, I don't think they're similar enough to compare.

@fredlodge1275

Жыл бұрын

I feel like it's going a bit far to suggest they can't be compared, though I agree that they are very different interpretations. I personally prefer Rubinek here partially because I adore nonverbal acting and he does a great job with that in this role, but also because of how I like my villains. While David undoubtedly brings a lot more naked menace to the role, I've always found charismatic villains to be much more compelling and fully realized. Open menace is certainly... Well, menacing (go figure), but it also tells us very little about the character. I imagine a description of Rubinek's Fajo would include a lot more adjectives than Rappaport's Fajo, despite having literally the same lines, actions, and arc, which tends to mean a character has more depth, seems more complete and real, exists outside of just the role we see him in. From that perspective, I think Saul dud a better job of being believable as a PERSON rather than just a threat.

I never knew about this. Wow

Yet another instance of an emergency replacement being perfect for the part.

So if David had not been plastered in prosthetics, it would have been clear that his face was not so dissimilar to Saul's - so much of the final performance was in the face - IMO the prosthetics forced David to channel Davros, when he was capable of so much more \m/

@SalveRegina8

Жыл бұрын

Thank you! What was the design team thinking??

@fredlodge1275

Жыл бұрын

This is a really good point that is easy to overlook - it's much harder to act when you're covered in prosthetics. I still find Saul's performance leagues better, but it's interesting to wonder what David's performance would have looked like without all that shit all over his face.

About 4 years prior to this episode, David Rappaport was starring in The Wizard playing Simon McKay, a genius turned toy maker. Appearing in the pilot episode as one of his government assigned protectors named Darcy Stafford, was future Starfleet Dr. Beverly Crusher, Gates McFadden; who incidentally was going under the name Cheryl McFadden. Just a bit of side trivia.

Saul Rubinek is deliciously amazing in this episode, one of my all time favourites. In comparison to Mr. Rappaport, he's lightyears ahead in believability in the role. So many amazing quirks and nuances he added to the character he crafted.

Rappaport was perfectly competent. Said his lines clearly, projected credible and relevant emotions. He conveyed duplicity, and then menace and spite, making for an effective villain. Had his version been the one that had gone to air, nobody would have found fault with it. But there's no question that Rubinek's performance is far superior. Subtle and multi layered. Far more frightening in its understatement. With shifts of tone, pace, and emphasis, he keeps the viewer interested and makes his lines into poetry.. see how he says "rage" differently than what follows and precedes it, and his change of expression as he intones "you're just an android" in almost sing-song fashion, in taunting mock regret.

Yeah, gotta go Saul. He rocked Warehouse 13, too. Great actor. When I read "After seeing David's performance, it doesn't surprise me that he tried to end his own life." I initially thought you were just being a jerk. lol. I realized after I read the next line that you meant you could see his pain in his performance. I agree. Poor guy.

I knew nothing of The Story of David playing this role.I just looked it up becouse I remember when it was first shown being very impressed with SAULs acting abilities and some of his quirky gestures and expressions.How bizzare he was replacing another unique Actor.He must have known about David's death,maybe even knew him,and that inspired his performance.I seen him in many things since most notably his role as the "Duck of death" English Bob's biographer in the UNFORGIVEN.I was always hoping to see him again in STAR TREK as I see him as a very notable villain . &

@Scripture-Man

3 жыл бұрын

No, when Saul took over, David had attempted suicide but was unsuccessful. He didn't actually die until I think a few weeks later, after production was completed.

@jimmyfischer8170

3 жыл бұрын

It's such a sad story about an ironically sad story.I gotta wonder how I would have felt about the episode if David had completed it.The use of prosthetics mainly his nose was curiouse decision considering Saul wore none.Did the STAR TREK people feel that without the makeup David would not be believable as the calculating evil character he would be portraying ? Like I said before this was a stand-out episode for me for a few reasons,SAULS acting included.It seems they wanted an Actor who would appear rather harmless at first which David did becouse of his size and adding the nose was an attempt to make Him more monsterouse and effectively to him may have been taken as an insult to his acting ability.I know I am reading too much into something I know nothing about but I wouldn't doubt there was some doubt talk on the set.And comming up with Saul to take over the part,an actor who was considerably known for strong performances,on short notice suggests they had allready previously offered him a TREK role.I wonder what Saul would say about it all ?

Wow. I like both. Wow.

Great comparison from an amazing episode. I just wish you had done Saul Rubinek's lines _second,_ which I would have found more satisfying.

@TrekkieChannel

3 жыл бұрын

Noted!

@Scripture-Man

3 жыл бұрын

@@TrekkieChannel :-) My reasons being: 1. Showing Rubinek second would be in line with the shooting chronology. 2. I'd prefer to see the 'good' performance first, and think "hey, that was good - could that be improved upon" - then be in awe as the same lines are knocked out of the park by a genius who was born for the role! LOL It's kind of like the comparison footage that's on KZread of Janeway played first by Geneviève Bujold - and then Mulgrew comes along and absolutely hits it into the stratosphere! LOL

As much as I love David Rappaport, it’s obvious from these clips that Saul was the better choice. But some of that is also down to the silly get up they had Rappaport done up in! Whoever thought THAT up should’ve been fired the next day!

David Rappaport wasn't feeling this part you can see it, it's not fair to compare. Rappaport was contemplating suicide at the time of the making this. I think David was the best actor by far, well he did this part while acting like he was ok but he clearly wasn't so he was the better actor by kidding everybody. RIP to a great actor.

@lyndahammond8883

2 жыл бұрын

How tragic...

Perhaps it's the music and sound scores, but I believe that the way it finally turned out is better. I watched this because I had never seen or heard about it and I saw someone mention it in another yt video comment, it is likely the last tng I've never seen before but it was refreshing to see something new from my next generation family.

I like Saul in most everything I see him in, and I prefer him in this role. I know part of that preference is because I've enjoyed the episode since it originally aired so I viewed the scenes here with as little of my previous preference as I could remove. OVERALL, I prefer Saul, but there are moments throughout where I was really loving David's performance. I never knew before today that David had been initially cast, let alone filmed scenes, and it's SO interesting to compare their performances. I was thrown by the last scene comparison when Data visits Fajo in his cell. In the aired version the camera pushes in on Data as he says he has no emotions, then cuts to a shot from behind him as he turns and walks away. I've always felt this shows that on some level Data does indeed have, if not emotions, something tantalizingly close to emotions. The way they filmed Data in the version with David is just a static shot of Data facing into the cell at David and the audience and then he turns to leave...still facing the camera. This totally removed the feeling of a hidden layer inside Data.

David sounds like he's badly reading cue cards just off stage. Saul kills it

@Scripture-Man

3 жыл бұрын

Granted, the lack of sound design does make a difference, and Mr Rappaport didn't do a bad job, bringing plenty of whimsy to the role, but for me his portrayal lacked the authority, the charm, and the menace that Mr Rubinek gave Fajo. Saying that, I think Mr Rappaport would have been good in other Trek roles, perhaps a more light-hearted good-guy role?

@stevepalpatine2828

3 жыл бұрын

David killed himself a few days after shooting these scenes. I don't think his mind was in the game by this point, he was a good actor, but if he was days away from killing himself he probably had other things on his mind than his performance. F

@HangoverTelevision

3 жыл бұрын

@@stevepalpatine2828 really? Most suicides occur by quick decisions not by thinking about it for a long time.

@timyo6288

3 жыл бұрын

David also killed it a couple weeks later.

@timyo6288

3 жыл бұрын

@@HangoverTelevision how do you know that? Did you ask the dead people?

Rubinek always steals the scene. He's a great actor that brings so much more to every role he plays.

David Rapaport was in "Time Bandits"!

Interesting comparison, but this is clearly Saul Rubinek's role.

I for one feel they both did a good job playing the bad guys

Wow! They came at the role so differently. David going for the initially cordial and harmless diplomat who turns coldly venomous and without regret, while Saul decided to play Fajo as a surface demon with underlying issues of low self-worth and buried regret. Rest in peace, David. 🙏

Rappaport's version of the antagonist reminds me more of an antagonist from TOS. Not only in terms of the mask, but also the way he plays. This may be unfair, of course, since you couldn't see the episode with him in its entirety.

David seemed to play it a bit more directly villainous than Saul, which is fine but it loses a bit of pathos. Saul adds an extra dimension and makes it easier to understand the character's motivations making the character much more compelling imo

@fredlodge1275

Жыл бұрын

Excellent description of the differences in these portrayals. I agree that Saul feels much more like a fully realized person than just a threat of the week, specifically because he shows us multiple facets of the character, while David is mostly just boilerplate evil.

Each actor has scenes where he bests the other. It's a good job by both. However, I do think that it was the right choice to minimize the alien features on Fajo. Fajo is more interesting, disturbing and threatening when he is human or human-like, not a Vorta.

No one seems to mention that due to David ‘s condition, his voice runs an octave or two above Saul’s. Since we are tuned as humans to a wider vocal key range when cueing emotions, it puts David at a great disadvantage, especially when trying to balance ‘menacing’ with ‘curiosity’. Which is the key to coming across as a sociopathic character. It’s like trying to play an acoustic guitar piece on a mandolin--no matter how well it is done it always has ‘that thing’ In this case, vocal inflection range With that said, I do feel like Saul’s performance was superior. and I hope David found Love in the afterlife

I like both performances. I would have enjoyed the episode regardless of which actor were in it.

I will have to go with Rubinek's performance, but only because that is the one which I have become so accustomed to over the years. Perhaps my choice would be different if the circumstances were reversed.

I personally would choose Saul's take. David's performance seems more wooden when you see them side by side. But it's probably just that I am more familiar with Saul's more animated interpretation. Seeing David in the full episode may have made his take on the character come off totally different than just these short snipets.

@lasko24

3 жыл бұрын

David sounds like he reading directly from cue cards Saul sounds more natural

David's performance came off as more sinister, whereas Rubinek was more playful at times, I quite like that twist he put on it. I prefer his performance. Plus I've watched him in Curb and Frasier, So I have a soft spot for him.

What amazed me was the performance of Data. I think it was better with Saul. And I liked Saul's performance best as well.

I think Saul is better. It's a great shame about David Rappaport. Very talented actor who is splendid in Time Bandits n UK TV appearances I've seen him. I think David had major issues with dealing with his dwarfism. It's perhaps unfortunate they chose a more elf like appearance 4 him compared 2 Saul.

@steveshepard88

3 жыл бұрын

Spiner said they believe Rappaport killed himself over a romance/love situation gone bad over the weekend after they’d had two great days of shooting/filming his scenes and that he was a great guy and his suicide was a shock to everyone.

@mem1701movies

3 жыл бұрын

@@steveshepard88 Spiner got it wrong and couldn’t even remember his name

@steveshepard88

3 жыл бұрын

@@mem1701movies what’s the true story then brah?

Saul Rubinek will be in Toronto from October 26 to November 17, 2024 in Playing Shylock at the Marilyn & Charles Baillie Theatre. Hopefully I’ll see some of you there!

David Rappaport is a bit too villainous....almost so that we dont really sympathize/understand his need for those things.....where as Saul brings the human quality of desiring things such as the character did. The script was still had a very humanistic quality.

@MrCrazyrob666

3 жыл бұрын

Rubinek is much more sinister. With respect to Rappaport, he sounds like he's just repeating his lines

@jimmyfischer8170

3 жыл бұрын

True,but David's make-up along with his size makes him seem less human.I bet if they removed his make-up we may have sympathized too much with him which would have diminished the episodes effect.

Just from the scenes, it was more powerful from Rubinek at the start, but the part where Fajo was in the holding cell it was much more powerful of a performance from Rappaport. In the theatrical release of the episode, I struggled a bit with the ending of Rubinek since he didn't feel like a character to pity, but with Rappaport I could feel it immediately.

Saul. Yep. I was gonna comment but it's already been said. Loved that episode.

The fake kindness, evil personified, I felt it from the fist scene with him. Rubinek knocked it out of the ball park.

They should restore the original with Rappaport. rip Randall

David Rappaport definately made a more convincing alien being, especially since he was made up with with heavy cosmetics. The producers could have even modulated his voice with special effects to make him sound 'Alien', and less British. Saul Rubinek acheived great success with his role as collector, and went on to play Artie Nielsen in Warehouse 13...

Two different acting approaches, different makeup/appliances to deal with, differing personal issues, and one is shown with finished piece with sound sweetening, while the other is not. There is no way to really compare.

I was trying to remember where I had seen David Rappaport before. And I don’t mean Time Bandits. Then I remembered, he was on an episode of Mr Belvedere lol

I enjoyed David's scenes! He was excellent in the role!

Why did they reshoot Data walking down the hall, before turning the corner? And why does he aim so high (equally high) in the original version - it looks like it'd go over Rappaport's head? Anyway, I hate to say it, given what happened, but Rubinek's quiet sliminess suits the character better than Rappaport's more blustery, direct version. Although I think someone should have a talk with the costume designer about that hat - for such a character, it has some... worrisome undertones.

Rubinek seems scared, thinking, arrogant, and terrified in a short scene.

Follow your heart and you'll be fine, follow your dreams, it's the key to everything.

I liked David in The Wizard series but must agree Rubinek really knocked it out of the park.

Anyone else notice how Data's rank was incorrect in the Rappaport version? He's shown wearing collar pips indicative of a Commander, as opposed to a Lieutenant Commander. The rank pips were correct in the Rubinek version that actually aired, however.

It feels brutal to compare Rubinek to Rappaport, a professional actively struggling with depression that’s distracted by suicidal ideation while reduced to bit parts with prosthetics glued to his face. It feels disrespectful to his memory. As an actor and a suicide survivor the comments here read very absent context and compassion. Prosthetics demand larger performances to draw character like being a cartoon. Masking depression, especially one major enough to incite suicide attempts, siphons tremendous energy. In ‘Time Bandits’ Rappaport does brilliant work with plenty of range but without being morphed into some mythical creature and having access to his own face. Rappaport was not into being an Ewok or Warwick Davis’s big brother or whatever. It’s a brutal fate for a brilliant actor and the tone deaf public remarks really illustrate the narrow platform that was allowed someone not even 40.

@josieaidulis3120

Жыл бұрын

I agree, and I thought his performance was solid despite the constraints you mention. The entire episode hinges on this one antagonist, and it would have held up with David in the role.

I wanted to see the line:"THEY'VE HAD FIVE DAYS TO MAKE A DECISION! WHAT THE...."

You have to wonder if they realised that he wasn’t working as well as they had imagined in the role, and had fed it back, rubinek definitely owned this role

I wonder how close they were to being done with the episode? they seem to have edited all the blocking, the sound effects of the force field.

That background engine hum and music really do add to the atmosphere. Saul is on a spaceship, David is on a sound stage. Seems awfully wooden, perhaps he had other things on his mind. :( Love the Time Bandits.

Poor David.

For me... Rappaport lacks a cavalier darkness. There's a bit of warmth, but too much detachment in his voice. Rubinek brought a connected callousness to the role. It's as though you knew he was a creep, but you knew he would entertain you if you allowed him to use you... That's gravity.

With all due respect to Rappaport, I highly prefer Rubinek's version. He's simply outstanding.

While I think Saul Rubinek knocked it out of the park, I don't think Rappaport's performance was bad - it was just more of a straight villain interpretation of the character.

The one moral imperative they never discussed, is the fact it has always been known that committing homicide is considered an act of self defense, when conducted under the pretence of saving the life of an innocent person who is in imminent danger of being killed. Data, having a computer for a brain, did not need one moment to hesitate to kill Fajo when he killed another person on his behalf. He could have killed him instantly, and it's well within the moral grounds of self defense.

This is the first time I've seen the Rappaport footage. Was it common practice to film someone's assorted scenes within a timeframe,rather than all scenes required for an episode?

I had not previously seen the footage with David Rappaport. Although he gave an adequate performance, I believe the episodes success benefited greatly by the switch to Saul Rubinek, though the circumstances were most unfortunate.

I’m here after watching the latest episode of lower decks. COLLECTING DOESNT MAKE YOU HAPPY! YOUR SHIPS SMELL LIKE AAAAASSSSSSSS😂😂😂😂😂

Generally, when one can get Saul Rubinek, one gets Saul Rubinek.

I think I figured out what it is that troubles Me by Mr rappaport's acting and it is that he's obviously in pain. When he's speaking the lines you can actually see it but I'm not sure anybody sees what they are not used to seeing every day I'm in pain all the time I have been for most of my life but when it's really bad I can smile I can talk and I can act like there's nothing wrong but it shows in my face I've seen it on videos that you know was it a wedding or what not on photographs that people have taken at a certain time and I can tell you he's in pain.

I'm guessing that the difference in makeup was because they didn't have time to prepare a new version of David's more elaborate prosthetics for Saul on such short notice

Honestly I would have fallen in love with the David Rappaport version. I would have pitied him & saw the potential for redemption in him. I hated the Saul Rubinek version & he came off as a serial killer to me. Therefore, I believe Rubinek sold it. Rappaport gave me the “good guy doing bad things” impression. Rubinek gives the “born rotten to the core” impression & I think that was the aim.

Did anyone else notice that Data had the rank of commander in David's scenes?

It’s like…Rappaport played the character like an evil Pip, and Rubinek played him like a nervous predator two steps from the kill. Brent Spiner’s performance changed, too. His line about being “only an android” become a bit more mockingly sinister with Rubinek.

They're both good in the role, but Saul just has such a higher range. he inhabits the role with much more casual ruthlessness.

Saul Rubinek is just top tier actor, it's almost unfair to compare lol

This is my favorite Star Trek villain

Imagine you are so depressed you try to commit suicide and the people you are working for are like fuck that he's out, then immediately replace him. Yeah I can see why tried and succeeded again.

100% Saul was the better man for the role. RIP Mr. Rappaport.

As much as I love Rappaport, Rubinek nailed the part... of course, while Rubinek came in late to the production, he also wasn't suicidal. I would love to see what Rappaport could do with the role had he not been dealing with severe mental health issues.

I like David Rappaport better. Rubinek emotionally overplays, he's attitude is much too baroque. David's version is less artificial.

Saul plays him like evil Kirk and it works perfectly. He’s the ultimate D-bag. David plays him as a trickster imp. Both are interesting takes. Saul’s is downright creepy.

Rappaport was playing off of the vulnerability of his size. This was negated by the silly, impish make-up, which contradicts the effort.

@nostromo7928

Жыл бұрын

As I was watching Rappaport I was thinking the same thing - they really over did his makeup. Makes it hard not see the character as cartoon-ish.