Air RB either needs a rework or need the addition of Air RB EC. Warthunder's game modes feel like the game's still in a beta.

To be honest I think it takes more skill to actually play bvr and notch and crank and everything than it does to mindlessly launch ir missiles and hope for the best

@InTheMood-fi3bh

Ай бұрын

True, but it will be cancer in 16v16 arb, have fun going cold against 3 different angles at once, I think that more full scale play testing should be done with 16v16 arb and reduced multipath to see how players use them, because what’s being thrown around right now is dcs 1v1 assumptions

@sgtj.peldridge4567

Ай бұрын

@@InTheMood-fi3bh I think we do like 9v9 and it would be great but right now in 16v16 the reduced multipathing will help because it will take a little skill to just fly low and be invincible to missiles with 100m multipathing it takes 0 effort whatsoever to be invincible to missiles

@InTheMood-fi3bh

Ай бұрын

@@sgtj.peldridge4567 yeah I'm by no means saying that it should never go through, I'm just saying that there needs to be more play testing, because all we have now for how gameplay would work is from turbo virgin dcs players.

I’m not sure if everyone yelling about multi pathing being nerfed or removed know how much more PAINFUL stock grind will be.

@Brzzzyexe

Ай бұрын

all they have to do is give anything past 11.3 2 stock fox-1's and then the grind would be exponentially less cancerous

@PvtPartzz

Ай бұрын

I just play the air arcade assault mode until unlocking the necessary mods. Granted the ones I needed most were flares back before they were stock but still, it’s probably a better option than going into a match just to die to BVR missiles every match until you finally unlock your own. Or play sim where you have more mountains to use. Sim is more fun at top tier than rb anyways.

@illegalaryan823

Ай бұрын

"JuSt FoRcE ThE MeRgE"

@InTheMood-fi3bh

Ай бұрын

“Just force the merge” yeah until you get beamed from 2 different angles immediately, have fun “GoINg COld” while in a dogfight

@gregc9344

Ай бұрын

@@illegalaryan823 Pretty sure most people complaining about it are complaining because it's too easy to force the merge and what exactly are you supposed to do in your Tornado, F4, Harrier when a Gripen can just meet you in the merge because the very missiles that put you in the br able to see that thing just don't work if he flies at a not even challengingly low altitude. If multipath stays we will see aim120's at 11.3 11.7 because an F14A is better than all of those 3

The fact that this game still doesn't have a serious combined arms game mode is a tragedy. Imagine a real battle front that lasts weeks or months and updates based on which side captures what or who destroys the correct objectives first. Every game mode is just search and destroy from call of duty in disguise, pretending to be a different game mode.

@Bylov6812

Ай бұрын

it's painful

Dude stuff like the meteor missile are gonna be straight oppressive

air rb needs a fucking complete overhaul and imo needs multi spawn gameplay with bigger maps and more pve objectives the single spawn 16v16 furballs aren't fun, and haven't been fun in years

The Snail should at least be so fair to put all aircraft that can use Fox-3 Missiles in their own BR Bracket so that Planes that only have FOX 1s and FOX 2s don’t have to fight them. Otherwise it would be unplayable for these planes.

@vaccuumrolls7243

Ай бұрын

Doubt it, they didn’t do it for all aspect missiles, IRCCM missiles, the first Fox-1s, etc. Part of the selling point is to club those with the “last generation” technology otherwise people wouldn’t want it.

NGL, the only thing that WT will die to is apathy inflicted upon the player base by stuff that simply isnt fun to fight against. Pantsir, 2S38, Strelia 102, etc, while are fun to use, are the definition of “single player experience”. While I am nervous about the addition of ARMs, the player base needs to analyze the weaknesses of these new missiles and change up their strategies. After that, then we can determine if it actually needs changes.

@ItzCPU_

Ай бұрын

Cope, people have been saying that for years

@swordsman1_messer

Ай бұрын

@@ItzCPU_ you tell me when every game out of five actually does feel like there are other players, and not bots or absolute brainless players that play worse than said bots.

@ItzCPU_

Ай бұрын

@@swordsman1_messer then play those games and stop complaining here

@briartousley9806

Ай бұрын

People are stilp complaining about the strela? Lmao

@ItzCPU_

Ай бұрын

@@briartousley9806 apparently lol

early cold war is my favorite era of warthunder, perfect fun

That’s the thing too, these are medium range missiles. All of these new missiles have less range than the Phoenix and r27er

Arcade air is going to be more popular since in realistic people are not going to be able to farm and grind because of these missiles

How to adapt: Select 12 v 12 and j out until you get a 12 v 12 match.

I played the Dev Server extensively and tested the 120, 77 and MICA. What I found is the burn time and energy retention on these missile is not the be all end all, their max speed is M4 and they never reach that speed unless you're very very fast and high. They are after all just the first versions of them, it's the latter versions that will be a big step up. AIM-120 C7 and D versions, R-77M, Meteor.....AIM-260 or R-37M if they ever show up. The AIM-120A and R-77's ideal launch range on the dev seemed to be around 22 - 24km. With this range I found just going cold (turning away) and maintaining your speed with using NO chaff you can beat all of them easily. Add chaff and notching to the mix and this update actually puts all the top jets on a level field instead of AIM-7M vs R-27ER :/

@VectorGhost

Ай бұрын

The r27er in no way should be as good as they are

@honzavasicek

Ай бұрын

You know damn well once russians starts losing in BVR and wont have longest, range, most pulling fastest BVR missile, gaijin will go and slap in R-77-1 from 2015 vs amraam A from start of 90s. The performance of R-77 on dev was already OVER what was observed in india when it got actually deployed in combat where it totally failed to meet numbers russians sold it with. There is reason russians never used base version of R-77. That thing was absolute SHIT and gaijin is AGAIN using propaganda numbers for russian tech.

If they didn't touch touch the multipathing altitude, the Fox 3 missiles would've not really changed how the game is played at all, at least in Air RB. Everyone (at least the players with an iq above 30) just hug the ground all game so no matter what you do to radar missiles the only thing that will change gameplay from them is changing multipathing.

Gayjin wont make ww2 update because they dont give a f if you like their game or not, they only care if you gonna give them $$$ and ww2 doesn't do that. ppl see new flashy jet/tank with a 60$ price and they buy it. they are a business, they care about profit

@sebastiannelson6355

Ай бұрын

In Gaijins' limited defense, they have released entire full years of pure WW2 updates in the past. While there is more, they can't say they never added anything.

@gerkadas

Ай бұрын

@@sebastiannelson6355 and what brings gayjin more $? a ww2 tank/plane or a modern era counterpart? whichever brings more $ gayjin will add, without regard of what ppl think and judging by last few years modern vehicles bring more $, so gayjin will focus on adding those. gotta keep the cash flowing. unless the community can impact how much gayjin earns gayjin wont listen to said community

@gerkadas

Ай бұрын

@@DigitalShaolin If you re read my comments you will see that my point was exactly like that, so idk what you were bursting, but good for you

I think the skill will be in BVR fights. Knowing when to be offensive, crank, defend, go cold, recommit etc will be the meta. Maybe it ends up like Growling Sidewinder DCS videos. (I kinda hope it does to be honest).

Gotta remember it doesn't have to be 16v16 anymore And most aircraft can only guide 2 missiles if not then 1(unless you're and f14 and you can guide 6)

Hey, i recommend using ghe rectangular radar instead of the conical one. Its significantly easier to read

to be fair i got a 66km kill in a yak141 with the R27ER lol, gonna be simply flying high dumping them and straight to ground after lol

The problem is that gaijin hasnt done anything to the core gameplay loop. If they added new modes or refreshed Air RB this would be fine but, its furball v furball still.

I constantly forget that air battles exist so I doubt it will doom anything for me.

When talking about adapting, needing more chaff and flares are seen for a lot of allied nations with jets with hundreds of countermeasures while russain ones only get around 90 max, will that ever change for the russain jets?

I just hope this ushers in a permanent return of RB enduring confrontations.

I wonder if all of this Fear Mongering was a thing back when radar missiles or all aspect missiles were being added?

@ICECAPPEDSKY

Ай бұрын

It was

No. I mean yes ARH missiles will change the game a bit. The radar in these missiles will only activate when within certain range of their target, so in a way you will still need to maintain lock to do BVR snipe shots. What will really change TT is AESA radars that can maintain multiple locks. Thats going to be the big game changer. I havent played the Dev server yet, so I dont know at what range the ARH missiles will activate the radar but .... I dont think it will change the game that much. Long range BVR will be amazing.

@Brzzzyexe

Ай бұрын

they have iog so it's not completely a dead missile if you just spam them out, definitely will have a pk of like .2 if you don't maintain a lock to a somewhat decent range

@NGC2419-

Ай бұрын

the mechanical radars we have in game should already be able to maintain several soft locks, the thing is that gaijin needs to completely change how TWS locking works to actually show several targets on screen, or by changing the lock through TWS to allow us to cycle through targets and still maintain that original lock.

Addictive!

i don't see any way they're ever going to flesh out the mid-game/ww2 vehicles...since they've seen how much money they can make off of it, they only care about bringing in top tier halo vehicles because it pressures people to buy the top tier premiums, that's it. That's why they walked back their 'promise' of not bringing in top tier premiums.

@2goober4u

Ай бұрын

they added sex to war thunder!!!!!

Every time Gaijin adds a new mechanic they fundamentally break the game.

multi pathing change is awful, just means we have to fly lower and crash sometimes

I miss the good old days. Where knowledge and skill was king. Now all you need to know/do is remember you key bindings for lock on and fire :/

@sebastiannelson6355

Ай бұрын

Then you know absolutely nothing of Top Tier, for it requires both old skills and new. Those that wave the standard of "just lock and fire" are the same that can't dodge them.

@Dragonmaster6587

Ай бұрын

and those good old days are still here. You know not a top tier. idk why people complain about top tier having no skill and yet they still insist on playing it instead of going to a lower BR

A little fyi. These missiles are very evadable. Theres not a single missile out there that is invincible to evasive tactics. Honestly if you go watch Aero Turtle who has been doing a lot of Fox-3 bvr encounters you'll see he evades them pretty easily. Now these missiles are still a lot more dangerous and irl had a 80%pk. Tjing is that just means youre gonna need a lot more skill to evade these missiles than what you were doing before. Think of it this way. You need to have the skill to somehow make yourself become that 20% the pk doesnt go over, fire your own missile or even merge to then to either continue a bfm dogfight or extend to go after a secondary target.

You're forgetting the limiting factors of AMRAAMS. They do need bigger maps to enjoy. Players will get mad because they don't know how to use AMRAAMS. You can take a missile bus like the Su-27/J-11/F-15C, go up to 40,000ft, and launch them at a bunch of jets below, but you will never hit anything like that. We can have a mix of BVR and dogfighting with smaller lobbies but bigger maps. Players will have to focus on a single target. That will likely not happen as most War Thunder players know very little about how BVR fights.

Glad I'm not playing wt anymore, because the moment a mass of missiles were launched in a match, my frames dropped. Even without that, 16v16 with how many missiles per jet is just stupid. Idk how one would play with that many players in a match, and it's hilarious how Gaijin's only having small player matches as an option that will probably turn out like ground rb night battles, almost nonexistent.

The stock grind

Sincerely I really hope that tactic becomes an important part of War Thunder at least onde you get to the point you start using better missiles. The WW2 era vehicles usually demand morre tactics to get kills, but once you get better missiles, you start adopting unrealistic gameplay styles, like multipathing, miisle jousting, or spamming flares and chaff, or getting in gun range with the enemy. These are not how Mörder combat should be, most planes can't fly at Supersonic speeds with a full weapons load and at 100m from the ground. Nost planes would hip its wings and blow their engines try to NG to do this for more than a couple minutes, the few that can do it have spealised terrain following radas with dedicated autopilot that makes correction so the meat ball pilotin it don't lose control and smash it on the ground, the Tornado, the B-1B, the F-15E Striking Eagle (the air to ground variant of the F-15) até among the few that could sustain flying that low for longer periods of time. Countermeasure AR used tactically so it maximizes the chance of it successfully defeating the missile. Missile jousting isn't a thing, either you have a good lock and pull the trigger or you don't. The average height of War Thnde combat is bellow 2000m while most jet action from the 50s to now happens above 5000-6000m, heck even in WWII Dive bombers started their dive from 12000ft and it ended at about 6000ft. This never happens in War Thunder. Also most planes after the Vietnam War have some degree of ECM capability to make the chance os missiles hiting harder. If the game introduced Wild Weasel and AWACS and Electronic Warfare planes I would be great. One fo the wildest tales from the operation Desert Storm was when a F-111E, the EW variant of the aadvark, that had now weapons whatsoever, managed to kill 3 Iraq Mirage F1s just using their Electronic warfare and making a great use of its terrain following radars, speed and wide range of maneuverability due to its variable geometry wings, and the fact that it was a moonless night on the Iraqi desert to avoind missiles, or to make them go astray due to ECM, condusing enemy radars and other sensors so they they would attempt maneuvers at such low altitude that no plane without a terrain following radar could manage to do and send them crashing to the ground. 3 ou of 4 Iraqi Mirage F1s found their way to the ground trying to maneuver just a few hundred meters from the ground. The third went out of missiles and the. Went away. And for guns, after Vietnam very few gun kills happened, most of them by Israeli Airforce. Só it would be a great opportunity to break a little from the 16v16 PVP cage deathmatch it is today, towards a more interesting meta. But I don't hold many hopes for Gaijin to ever attempt to make this game so good. Their policy is just good enough to keep us interested.

Sky is already falling GIVE US CZECHOSLOVAKIA GAIJIN

The grind to obtain these wonder weapons will be very painful. For the average or casual player I think it will be very off putting to even attempt it. Spawn and killed in the first 5 minutes? Fun. What about those who try to help the grind by bombing? Nope, obliterated before you even get near the target. New players coming into the BR will get even more frustrated and give it up. In R/L the AIM-120 has a successful combat record (around 20 launches with 13 kills), the Russian R-77 is being used in Ukraine, but I could not find any kill/launch data. Maybe if ECM was added to the game to degrade radar performance, the "magic bullet" effect would be reduced.

I can’t wait for this update because the worse it is for top tier rb, the more players are going to scream for real changes to be made to the game mode and that’s what’s needed for the game to grow. I expect some much more immersive game mechanics to come out within the next year because of how annoying rb will become with its portapotty-sized maps.

Here is my problem and concern with the 'Fox-3's' coming in, and you can kinda see an example of it at about 4:35. Now admittedly - I'm mostly an arcade player, I want something a little more chill (and I do mean little as there are still people as toxic as those the last time I really tried to get in to RB) and it's nice to not have to worry about what happens to flaps and all at speed and just have fun dogfights - at least at lower tiers where that's actually a thing. But my concern is that it's going to become like the AIM-9M's and AIM-7M's as well as their foreign counterparts who I can't remember which is which top of my head. The nerf to CM was bad enough with existing missiles - but it gets infuriating to no matter what the aspect is dump 50-75% of my countermeasures in like a second before going in to a turn that in RB would rip the plane apart and the missile just goes 'lol, I delete you now', more so while my own less advanced versions are fooled by a single or double shot of CM while the guy flies in a straight damn line. To say nothing of the ridiculousness of the F-105 and 111 being ranked as high as they are with lack of proper CM and competitive missiles and might as well not even be there missiles respectively. Now your basically adding 'what if we made the Sparrow a Phoenix that behaved like the AIM-9M'. As much as I like and understand to an extent various generations of aircraft fighting against one another - the performance gap between basically some of the Rank 7 planes and the Rank 8's that were formerly 7 is way too damn high for these things to be fighting one another in a game, or at least Arcade where it's supposed to be more game like. Cause honestly, much as I want to play high tier - I get frustrated by these skill-less clowns from these two 'top clans' who basically just sit on/near the spawn lobbing 9M's with the occasional 7M and running away till they reload (which is I think 40 seconds because I guess they just buy ace crews instead of earn them like they'll do with the Fox-3's) and will likely do the same from a safer distance with the 120's because 9/10 times they can't actually win a dogfight they just pad their K/D's with the cheapest BS possible. And just to be clear despite how it may sound - you have the gold and want to pay to get Ace qualification, that's fine, plenty of times I wish I had the money to do so for that little extra edge, especially cause I play everything so it's an even slower grind. My issue with them is they are more strictly 'pay to win' combined with the attitude of some of their players in chat.

AWACS and WILD WEASALS!!! MAKE THIS HAPPEN GAIJIN!!!

I'll dodge these missiles by not playing air rb anymore.

@Sol-Orion

Ай бұрын

Fr tho. Catch me never playing above like 11.0 again.

I wish they would revive tank sim in some way. We had a queue, they axed it, replaced with "events" about which nobody cares very much. They have like a basic blueprint ready in Enlisted. Like imagine tank on tank, larger scale, like in Enlisted (except you cannot leave tank I guess). It would be so fun. Imagine having some sort of a Steel Beasts Pro PE lite, with proper matchmaking. People would flock in. But alas, enjoy new shit arcade-tier map. And I guess 2S38 will have more modules. And FOX-3.

Skill is still going to be required it's just going to shift from skill in offensive dogfighting to defensive BVR, and it's going to be hard for a lot of people due to gaijin encouraging hugging the ground so much I barely see anyone who's able to competently engage in a BVR fight. But it can be learned and it can be mastered, and I heavily agree with @sgtj

@williamkwl6153

Ай бұрын

People doing defensive bvr with their 2 stock IR missile be like:

It's a Catch 22 While on one hand it'll be great for the game. But at the same time it'll ruin the game. Me personally I want them to come to top tier Air RB but in order to save it they need a different game mode where they are not available. Or maybe even a Strategic game mode which requires skill to come out on top instead of just clicking away like that line of slot machines hoping they get a kill or two.

i only play the game for the modern planes... idc about the rest i come from dcs i have thousands of hours in that game and i wanted something to relax with... and i picked warthunder i bought immediately 2 planes the mig 23 ml and the f4s and im almost top tier usa and i got the mig 29 and su 27 in a couple weeks so its a comftable grind for me tho and imo due to the multipathing defeating missiles and everything in top tier was never the issue i saw another video and he brought a good argument... the problem is less the new missiles its more the amount of players... if you have matchmaking with 8v8 or 10v10 or so you have less of a clusterfrick and more time to react and keep SA... and ofc they can throw in some ww or early cold war stuff but i think they mostly have made everything there is in that era ... its mostly the modern era that isnt build yet so they have to do that tho

It wont kill war thunder cause most players never reach these types of planes :/

Only OGs get the Chicken Little reference.

Sounds like phly

Real

Imo, lack of console acknowledgement will kill a good portion of this game's appeal. How long has it been since consoles have had a big place in the community besides a laughing stock/insulting way to play compared to the objectively better PC original? The console version seriously needs a rework or even a complete rerelease, because of things keep going this way, it'll die off pretty quickly.

@iceicebabyil

Ай бұрын

No one cares about consoles anymore just build a damn computer, war thunder can run on a potato

@Skinny6539

Ай бұрын

re release?? rework??? bro what does that mean… if youre bad at the game and cant compete then just say it… ain’t no way lil bro making his skill issue a game problem

@MrSv7dzg

Ай бұрын

I am playing from PS5 and it’s fine, nothing has to be reworked. In the end just connect a keyboard and mouse

@MrSv7dzg

Ай бұрын

@@Skinny6539yeah, I am console too and it’s fine nothing has to be reworked

@frosty8183

Ай бұрын

Console is fine I play with controller and I still outperform pc players. It’s about skill and finding workarounds

I say they fix navel and add subs and cold war ships even newer ships make it fun because as it is I've played like 10 matches and it's boring

WT Top tier is goint to be a Sh*tshow. 200+ ARH Missiles and multipathing lowered to 50m.... have fun

@nikolaideianov5092

Ай бұрын

You do know you wont be able to guide more then 2 at a time right ?

@saintgordon338

Ай бұрын

@@nikolaideianov5092 you dont "have" to guide them at all. the inertial guidance will guide then untimm about 10km before the targets potential position. then they activate there own radar. sure. if the target cahnges course the missile wont find a target. but if u have 200+ (potential) missiles in the air... something will find a target

Big monke

Why cant air RB have SP so we can spawn more than just once? Top tier most of the time is takeoff simulator anyway

Thank God I don't play top tier.

@ichosolemanuel6048

Ай бұрын

Yes top tier jets might look cool but thats about it I find props much more fun

@Ausf.D.A.K.

Ай бұрын

@@ichosolemanuel6048 I wholeheartedly agree. The props are beautiful, they have personality, the dogfights are fun, etc.

Seems like a lot of skill issue. Just defend, and keep pushing the enemy off. Easy as that

This will imo make the skill gap bigger. You need to learn radar mechanics and defnesive flying to win.

@ferrous3262

Ай бұрын

Notching doesn't require any skill stop pretending like it does

they should have kept multipathing at 100M or even buff it to 150M to make fox 3s not completly broken and for stock grinds at up teirs to still be not that bad

@zacharymarino8926

Ай бұрын

Someone doesn't want to learn to defend

@DigitalShaolin

Ай бұрын

@@zacharymarino8926have fun going cold against 3 different missiles at the same time lmao

@zacharymarino8926

Ай бұрын

@@DigitalShaolin My man, you vouch to make the fly-low IR furball meta even more powerful and render BVR even more impossible than it already was. The multipathing change exists to make BVR possible at all

Easy Solution dont play Air RB nowadays :)

Gaijin are so weird!

Multipathing nerf is great we just need EW to give a more realistic way of reducing the effective range of fox3 missiles. Keep in mind superhornet will just be a fat legacy hornet with a lower topspeed if they dont model ew

low tier is best tier, no need to fight a 10 deep russian bias lineup of a bajillion T-80 and BMP variants.

You suffer in air because of missiles, I suffer because I’m a GRB main and the maps have 0 cover and is plagued with spawn camping. We are not the same.

i pray for war thunder to end

If the players will be too dumb to adept too proper BVR tactics, their problem. There are a lot of jumps where you have to adapt with a new playstyle to new tech in the trees.

i think people will get used to fox 3s like how people got used to radar missiles when they came out. but i do hope no one uses them for BVR, idk why anyone would ever do that. also, this allows for chaff to be a lot more useful

@xtodnfs549

Ай бұрын

I mean i think that warthunder will juat be more like dcs but without the realisme aspect, just like more tactical plays i guess

@CtRAlTtAb

Ай бұрын

@@xtodnfs549 well i see what you mean but "without the realism aspect" goes a little too hard on war thunder. war thunder is as realistic as a game can get imo.

@grahh7234

Ай бұрын

@@CtRAlTtAball planes are artificially buffed with an increased 1.5x g overload limit and pulling hard does not have a lasting impact to your pilot, this needs to be removed because it’s not fair for bvr trucks to get annihilated by light fighters doing 15 g pulls all of the time

@CtRAlTtAb

Ай бұрын

@@grahh7234 yeah i do believe gaijin thinks they have a little too much liberty, i think they need to chill with the unrealistic stuff. but it's at least the most realistic war video game that i know of that isn't a simulator and with a few tweaks it could probably be that for everyone

The game is already doomed with 1 nation being the best at everything, and still getting all the goodies just because that's the nation the devs play.

@Brother_Rony

Ай бұрын

Ah yes, the old reliable. Blame russian bias for a solid skill issue and then ignore when anyone points out basic facts

@dsg4500

Ай бұрын

cope.

@kalumbailey5103

Ай бұрын

Shhh imma be clearing the skies in a tornado

@decmoto4768

Ай бұрын

​@@Brother_Ronythey get the best AA by far... With the only counter being a... Russian plane with the best air to ground missiles in the same- all while giving the US AGMs half it's claimed range

@BunBoNamBo

Ай бұрын

Haven’t noticed. I’m much more scared of germans at 11.7 then russians tbh. I’m currently Japanese main

it is not game breaking , it.s alright, it will still come to who is the better player, only the downitered guys will cry , probably

@nikolaideianov5092

Ай бұрын

Same as the all aspect missiles Or irccm missiles People said the same thing

@valentintudor866

Ай бұрын

@@nikolaideianov5092 yep , the only problem we gonna face is spadeing , cuz having 2 aim9l's against a full spaded boy with 2 9m's and 6 aim120 gonna be a little painfull

@nikolaideianov5092

Ай бұрын

@@valentintudor866 at least russian planes get stock r73s

This video was brainrot.