-- Official petition for this collaboration podcast to be a regular thing (Like if you agree) -- I really like the content both of you put out for the shmup community all around, unlike most game content creators on KZread you're not copy+paste reporters, you're both passionate about your content. I really like the way Shmup Junkie talks about what inspired him to start... He was just mad that a bunch of posers were being negative about something they didn't even know and he was passionate enough to _become_ the change he wanted to see. I see that same kind of passion from you for the shmups community. Shoutouts to Code Mystics for basically being the Western M2 as far as ports go. Pretty good insights and conversation right here, I really liked this as it shows both audiences the mindset behind the other one. The farm bois (and _dads_) who you represent and the more general casual shmup audience that Shmup Junkie represents... this is why I would love this to be a regular thing, it humbles the vocal enthusiast minorities and it exposes the deeper intricacies of the scoring audience to the "casuals". It is a healthy collision.

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks for the awesome comment :-)

I completely missed the notification for this and just got a chance to listen. Thanks so much for having me on I thought it was a good chat and enjoyed doing it. If I ever do it again hopefully my voice won’t be as hoarse and I’ll have a webcam to use this time. 😅 I’m hoping to have all my controllers modified and ready to test in the next week or two for a big shootout, so I’ll keep you posted if I discover anything earth shattering once I get to testing.

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks for being on the episode! I think it turned out extremely well, audio and all ha :-)

@ShmupJunkie

3 жыл бұрын

The Electric Underground I just put up a Story of this podcast on my IG page so you’ll likely get some extra views coming in from there. Hopefully some extra subs as well. My Twitter is small by comparison but I’ll put it up there too.

The amount of self awareness, empathy, and general maturity in this discussion is great to see online.

@TheElectricUnderground

Жыл бұрын

That's great to hear Chris! Yes this was a fun conversation with Shmup Junkie, he's a really cool guy :-) We still appear on each other's channels every so often.

Also on the topic of SHMUP vs. Shooter, I usually say "arcade shooter." Then people universally know what I'm talking about.

@2bussy

3 жыл бұрын

Yeah bro I love House of the Dead and Time Crisis too! :^)

sweet, 2 of my most beloved (shmup related) youtubers on a collab. im still waiting for my coregfx mini (getting it foe my bday in dec. thx sis). shmup junkie eased my worries on his vid ;)

Great video, loved seeing both perspectives of the community. I find myself somewhere in the middle depending on which game I'm playing so it's nice to see a constructive discussion between a scorer and 1cc collector. Most of the time such interactions end in bloddshed lol!

I love this episode! As someone who 1) loved shmups growing up but only recently got back into them with aspirations of 1cc-ing at least a few of them and 2) has enjoyed the content of the electric underground channel to help me get better at shmups: it was amazing hearing these two shmup-minded fellows talk and laugh about their shared interest from two different perspectives!

What's funny is I played the Switch Psikyo ports with the Switch hooked up to a VGA CRT PC monitor in 480p. It was definitely serviceable. I gotta play Gunbird again to see how it compares to the Saturn version.

Fantastic show you two, nice work. This was really needed. Mark, thanks for trying to raise the standards and raising awareness. At first I was also a bit pissed because I love shmups and bought nearly all available on the Switch...maybe if you wouldn't have brought it up I wouldn't have noticed. However, truth remains truth, and what you say is important to all of us. You make really good content and have mad shooter skills. Shmup Junkie, thanks for representing the more old school and casual perspective and putting things into perspective. Your enthusiasm, knowledge, passion and humour are class A. Thanks for the content I look forward to every week. In the end you are both playing key roles in making shooters great again. My skills are very casual, but my love for the genre is very serious, love you both.

Guys, I really enjoyed this conversation, and thought this was a great, civil discussion on what has become a divisive topic. Great stuff!

Thanks for this content Mark and Shmup Junkie. I'm sitting here designing and building the levels for our own hori STG, while listening to quality discussion about one of my most favorite game genres (and one that's actually hard to find great content for). All up in my veins.

Shmup junkie sounds awesome. I felt the same way about the pc engine mini reviews. One reviewer was COMPLAINING about having R-Type on the mini. He didn't get why R-Type would be there.

Last year, my video camera caught 5+ frames of extra lag in a pure CRT setup I'd just put together, all because of a DVD recorder. 3 different dvd units all had about that same lag. Makes me wonder if a lot of us always lived with lag, especially with those inline VCRs that we all had. For me lag results in playing a conservative game, giving problems a wider berth rather than dancing around next to them. I clicked over to the pce vid, yeah, that's unacceptably high, and might make future generations think old games sucked--or at least need more memorized than reflexed.

It might be because I haven't been playing hardcore long enough, or because there's a coordination/reflex lack on my part, but I literally can't detect the input lag in those Switch Psikyo ports. And I'm playing them just about every day. The only time I might sense it is when I could swear I hit the button in time for a last second bomb but I die. So I guess I'm in the lag's not a big deal camp. I'm in the avoiding emulation camp too, simply because if there's a current version I'd feel bad not supporting the developer, especially for stuff as niche as this. And with what it's going for these days it's pretty unlikely that I'm getting my Dreamcast copy of Gunbird 2 back.

thank you for keep making wonderful shmups content. Your channel is the main reason i gotten into shmups. hopefully you can keep making wonderful content like this :D

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

That s great to hear! Yes more good stuff on the way

I always thought it was weird that the PS4 controller wired caused more input delay lol. Good discussion in general. I appreciate the contrast of opinions here being respectfully discussed. The gamer fandom can get hyperbolic REAL fast.

Thank you for addressing at about 16:30 that the Retrobit Saturn Pad doesn't feel the same as the original! ❤

i thought i didnt notice the input lag playing some of these shmup games on other consoles. Then i played some of these same games using shmuparch and realized how different these games felt with 1 frame of input lag. It made some of the games easier than playing the same version on a console with 2-3 frames of lag at best. It makes it very difficult for me to be back to playing a more laggier version on a console or regular emulator.

Yes! I've been waiting for this crossover 😂

Great video as always. Im a shmup noob and suck at it but still love this genre. I learned a lot here thanks to you and your amazing dedication.

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

That s great to hear! :-) thanks for tuning in!

Love Shmup Junkie's channel. It's like enjoying nostalgia without even having known the PC Engine until recently. (now im a PCE fanatic btw lol) Also, I got a killer deal on a Saturn years ago for like $40 w 2 controllers+2 games. Never played it much till this year when I started getting into shooters. I was one of those guys that thought it didnt have many games XD Now it's my baby

Hey, Mark! I've been here for a little bit now and am really enjoying my trek through your content. I just wanted to let you know you're doing an awesome job and really helping to foster a community. Likewise, my viewings of these podcasts has been introducing me to some STGs I haven't heard of before. I'd like to suggest you list the games used in the footage in future videos to help spread the word on these if they look appealing to someone. I had to watch the entire Zero Ranger playthrough loop to find out the name. XD

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

I m glad to hear that! I have been trying to do better with identifying the footage in vids lately :-)

I get shmup junky’s reasoning but I think lag can keep people unknowingly pinned into a casual mindset. I thought I was a crappy casual but when switching displays + emulation and ridding 5 frames of lag I instantly got better. My confidence improved and here I am loving the genre and racking up 1cc’s. lag to this genre can be especially insidious.

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

Agreed!! Lag effects everyone

Really cool video. Great discussion of somewhat opposed viewpoints, but with a surprising amount of agreement as well. I think it's important to remember that the gold standard for all these ports is not previous ports, but the arcade originals/emulation. I watched that lag testing video from Shmup Junkie, where he pointed out the dreamcast port of Gunbird 2 also had 5-6 frames of lag. I completely understand the argument that this new switch port isn't any different. But to me, to hear a game has 6+ frames of lag, whether it's the same as a previous port, that's still definitely a big negative. It's not as if old ports get a pass on having lag just because they're old ports on pre-HD consoles. In a post-piracy world, you really have to convince the audience, when you come out with a port, that buying the port will provide a superior or equivalent experience to emulation. Because the emulation is usually free. I *prefer* to pay for games. But why would I pay $8 for Gunbird 2 on switch with 6 frames of lag, when I could pay nothing to play the arcade-perfect version? These games are so old now too, who even knows if the money I spend on a port will filter back to any of the people who originally made it? If those developers are even still alive. The strong cases in favor of spending money on a port are usually 1) extra features, 2) extra convenience and 3) good performance. You can apply those criteria to any port of any genre. If Dishonored gets ported to PS25 in the year 2500, it damn well better be running at 60fps locked at very high resolutions with all the DLC included.

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

exactly! This is why i think the dreamcast capcom ports are pretty crap. Yes it's cool they are on the dreamcast, but they are uber laggy

great podcast! thanks for uploading it to youtube. I prefer to listen to all my podcasts on youtube ever since I got youtube premium which lets you listen to videos even when the phone is locked

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

Hell yeah me too!!! I really wish more people would get KZread premium for that feature and the ability to remove adds without completely removing add rev from the KZreadr. I m all about the KZread premium if that isn t obvious ha.

@kokhen

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheElectricUnderground yeah man, exactly. I want to support youtubers instead of using adblock. Everyone should do it really. Anyways, now that I have your attention, thanks for creating a shmup podcast, a superb KZread channel and a website with input lag database. You are seriously the man. Glad I found your channel

Great interview, I really enjoyed hearing his perspective. I do take issue with the comment “input lag is conjecture”. Input lag is very real. Competitive 2 player dr. Mario on the nes mini is unplayable. I think these minis have there place but for me, the MiSTer with the blister board and controller adapters is where it’s at.

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

Yeah mister destroys the mini consoles, no competition.

This was a great discussion! I appreciated both perspectives. I grew up playing games in the arcade primarily and getting consoles was mostly about getting what is the closest to the arcade. I discovered emulation a long time ago too, and I have a supergun. I do realize a lot of gamers have no idea about this, it’s kind of how the games industry in the west in general moved away from the focus on arcade style action at home and towards things like assassins creed and call of duty, rpgs, etc. I’m by no means an exceptional player though, I’m more casual, but if I am going to spend big money on a port I would like to know if the experience is close to the arcade. It’s like buying vinyl records- is it a true analog master or is it a cheap pressing from a digital source? Why buy it if it’s not premium, especially since you can play these games in mame, on arcade archives, Nintendo virtual console and all that

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

I m glad you enjoyed the ep! Yeah I am very proud of this discussion :-) here s to hoping we get more quality ports moving forward!

Yo Mark digging the glasses and the scruff in the pic, channeling your inner George Michael

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

George Michael the legend!!! Next I need the cross earing ha

@michaelhoule2134

3 жыл бұрын

I was thinking more or a Orange Cassidy vibe... But thats just me

I would like to add a third point of view. While I would say I am more of a casual player, your thoughts on input lag have pushed me into seeking out the better ports. I think, just beyond that input lag, your thoughts about features that enhance the game, and not just things like "Oh here is an art gallery," really resonated with me. I appreciate games like the Sega Ages line up that goes beyond emulation. Playing Shinobi powered up? Better controls? Yes, please. Oh, Virtual Racing runs better than arcades? More of that please. It pains to hear that Sega stopped with Sega Ages line-up because it sold poorly in Japan. I want things like M2 that try to actively compete with emulation. "He is that an EASY mode for a game that never had one?" Sometimes, I just don't have the time to "get gud" at games again. I just want to enjoy them. If that means giving myself a powerd up ship to start the game, let me have it. It's people on the fringes that really move the ball, and I think you are actually onto something. Not just great ports for elite players, but accessibility options for all players. Both camps are actually fighting for the same things. When elite players can "practice" a certain level, that means players like me, that might not be able to reach those levels, can also jump into those higher levels and enjoy them too Anyways, that's my two cents.

Thanks again for your fine work, Mark. Small request - would you be able to note in the description what shmups we're seeing playing in these videos? Took a while to figure out a recent one was Gigawing Generations. I often want to hunt down what you're playing!

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

Yes I was going to do that, but forgot until after the 4 hour render ha. From now on though I 'll put a little note on screen what I am playing :-)

43:42 'I don't know if I've ever tested anything that bad.' Oh boy the future we're living in is bright and full of new discoveries.

@TheElectricUnderground

2 жыл бұрын

Ha little did I know!

Mark... keep it going dude. "SPEAK TRUTH TO POWER" LOL. I'm a very casual shmupper and I enjoy your opinion on input lag. I definitely feel it. Have you seen the Brooks wingman sd converter for Saturn? Wondering if that add lag. Shmuparch is amazing!

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

I have! I haven t tried it though because I have a brooks retro board , so I can use that with my Saturn :-)

I’m just a shmup enthusiast (far from a "pro player"), yet the input lag didn’t allow me to fully enjoy the games on the Psikyo Collections. And that’s really a shame because these games are awesome. Shmup Junkie: I get where you’re coming from, but I doubt I’m only in the 1% of people affected by that level of lag (I play in handheld mode btw). I could adjust to it to some extent, but it makes the games a lot harder for all the wrong reasons. I later tried some of them on the Saturn (using an OSSC) and it felt a lot better. It didn’t feel as I was "pulling a rope" with a plane attached to it anymore. I’m all for democratizing the shmups (again), but it would be a shame to discourage people from playing them for the wrong reasons. Thanks for the podcast!

What song is that in the intro? I've heard it before & I feel it's on the tip of my tongue. Edit: Nevermind, it took me til the end of the video but when I heard the closing music, it hit me... ESCHATOS! Great conversation, love these collabs you do with Schmup Junkie.

I think the concept of "you're not beating the game if you use rewind" is to critique people who do things like: Ninja Gaiden runs but jump over all the enemies, or Mega Man runs but slide past all the enemies. You occasionally see young people who play hard games and just cheese them and then tell people they're really easy. But for sure, Mike and James aren't people who would play games for high score.

I haven't watched the entire video yet (and I will, love this subject!) but to me there isn't much of a debate here. I play 10x better in shmups with extremely low input lag than with what most people consider "normal". Much like you, Mark, my entire setup is geared toward minimizing latency (well, without getting a CRT and running Linux KMS anyway). It's worth it as heck.

@nerothos

3 жыл бұрын

Alright, listened halfway through now (not much spare time lol) and I actually disagree with Shmup Junkie about things that initially sound completely reasonable. Having extensive experience playing with "normal" lag and extremely low lag side-by-side has taught me one thing in particular: For shmups, the input lag is more akin to a difficulty setting than anything else. I know people including Mark really enjoy the ESP Ra.De M2 port but I genuinely find it much, MUCH more difficult for sheer survival than playing the same game with lookahead on Retro/ShmupArch. Like, to the point where I'm just getting frustrated and going "god damn it, this game is just too hard". Then I boot it up in ShmupArch and reliably get past Stage 4 on pretty much every attempt. Granted, I am also playing on a ~16ms Bravia TV vs a ~4ms G-Sync monitor, so I don't mean to trash on the M2 port in particular - just illustrate how much input lag truly does matter even for casual play. My broader point being; shmups have a reputation for being almost impenetrably difficult within the broader audience. I would posit that perceived difficulty is a much bigger barrier to people getting into shmups than reviews not recommending certain emulated re-releases due to input lag concerns. Obviously I would much prefer it that people picked up the PCE Mini and played those games than not playing shmups at all, and there's plenty of enjoyment to be had in games even if they are (unintentionally) harder than they ought to be. However, most of the concerns I hear from people avoiding the genre are in relation to difficulty rather than any technical concerns. The solution (in my mind) is to educate people about about why this matters. That would, over time, translate into more development focus going toward improving latency for any future releases. There's also education about currently available solutions: it's very easy to purchase a Raspberry Pi 4 and load ShmupArch onto a USB stick and have an experience that blows any official port out of the water - but pretty much no one knows they can do that at more or less the same price of a PCE Mini. Then there's just teaching people about RetroArch in general, but that's a tricky one since it really does require a willingness to tinker for the optimal experience even if booting up a game is relatively simple. Anyway I highly appreciate the discussion and look forward to listening to the rest of the episode when I have the time! Cheers to both of you :)

@dadrising6464

3 жыл бұрын

well, that CRT would amount for quite alot.. even gaming monitors claiming 1ms are far from it, most of the time.

@nerothos

3 жыл бұрын

@@dadrising6464 Actually the past few years have gotten to a pretty good place with higher-end gaming monitors. Some truly do reach around 3-5ms. Obviously lower is always better, but in lieu of owning a CRT it's as good as it gets. Also the "1ms" refers to response times, not input lag. Response time is how fast pixels change color which results in more/less motion blur smearing. No gaming monitor has (to my knowledge) ever claimed 1ms input lag.

@dadrising6464

3 жыл бұрын

@@nerothos yeah you are right about the input/response thing. often times those 1ms claims got proven wrong (i own one of em, this 1ms mode is oure garbage, but its been one of the medium pricerange). luckily im not overly prone to lag... i just prefer my crt's for retro gaming from a visual standpoint (payed 20€ in total for 24" monitor and a big widescreen tv). as long as you got the storage space, most ppl still give them away for free

@nerothos

3 жыл бұрын

@@dadrising6464 Oh I love playing with CRT Royale and other high-end shaders, so I would love to have a CRT. But yeah, space + actually finding one is tough. My G-Sync monitor also advertises 1ms response times but even in its highest overdrive mode (which creates a TON of ghosting, rendering it unusable) it only reaches about 3-4ms average. However, its input lag is very low at around 5ms. I haven't tried true 1ms response time LCDs (if such even exist), but this monitor certainly is blazing fast regardless. To the point where upgrading from an old 120Hz TN was actually a significant upgrade in terms of motion clarity, and this is an IPS.

Nothing wrong with Shmup i am 47 been playing Shumps since i was a kid Shump fine.

Yup, bought my PC Engine mini because of ShmupJunkie.

Even if I’m casual at shmups and other games having I still notice it. And stuff like the genesis collections and some of the mega man collections the lag is really noticeable and causes some deaths and just feels bad. Whenever I play an M2 port (M2 in general not shottriggers) playing stuff like outrun or secret of mana feels way better. So while I can play the psikyo ports alright, it would just feel better with less lag. Companies can get lazy, like this amount of lag is the check mark to hit when making a port and almost developers just do that call it a day. Luckily these collections go on sale for cheap and are valued less like they should be so at least the prices of these collections is somewhat appropriate, though I’d it has less lag I’d probably pick it up play it more and enjoy it more since I don’t have to adjust to the lag for 10 minutes or something

What BGM track is this? It sounds like something from a 90s Visual Novel. @1:04:30

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

oh man I suck! I can't remember where the track is from :-( it's a great song though!

@taishou94

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheElectricUnderground no worries haha

@darylward4039

2 жыл бұрын

Its also from the Eschatos OST :)

nice video - really enjoyed the debate. What game is the music from around 35:50?

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

Eschatos! :-D

@spectrexcwk

3 жыл бұрын

since I can't edit this, also the track name for the outtro would be nice to have too - thanks!

I would also think that if they never played the original and no one told them about it most folks wouldn't even notice lag.

Hey, enjoyed this as ever, thanks 😊🙏

@run1cc347

3 жыл бұрын

So, I’ve recently got Retro Arch up and running, and I think it’s amazing 😅 I will be getting rid of a lot of hardware thanks to that (I haven’t even gotten Shmup Arch running yet, but I will)

@run1cc347

3 жыл бұрын

Having save states is like a revelation to me. Like, night and day. It makes practicing actually pleasant, instead of painful. It should be a standard feature on all ports.

@run1cc347

3 жыл бұрын

But it’s got me thinking...Do you know (or know someone who does) what the techniques are for Japanese players in arcades to make it through say loop 1 with NO training facilities??

@run1cc347

3 жыл бұрын

Like, it MUST be about plotting a pure survival route first, right? If you don’t want to just credit feed? Is there any info on this in English??

Will this be uploaded to podbean or stay as YT only content? Hoping to listen to the rest while I run!

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

I 'll put it on the soundcoud in a week or so :-)

You should do a lag review of the fightcade emulators, I've been using fightcade for games like ketsui, dodonpachi, donpachi, dodonpachi 2, guwange and I think it runs great, what's your opinion of fightcade?

@TheElectricUnderground

2 жыл бұрын

I love fightcade!! It runs on fbneo like shmuparch! It s the best way to play online fighters for sure! For shmups though I d use shmuparch, which is fightcade like but with better features :-)

This was a great listen. I have lag OCD as much as the next shmup fan and have invested in all kinds of display tech and input devices to minimise it, but I did think your Sisters Royale review on NLife was a bit extreme. You mention the mainstream NLife audience throughout the video so why submit an enthusiast-level critique to a casual audience?

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

A question for the ages! I was curious to see what would happen when you bring the enthusiast bite to the casual audience, was fun while it lasted ha. I look back at it now as a noble experiment ha.

Lag is an issue if you feel it....but if you don't? I remember DJ Hero on the Wii - it had a calibration feature to deal with lag if you felt it. That's an issue with rhythm games but it is with other genres too - so surprised other games like shmups don't have that. But I suppose if the game can't reduce it any more when the player is feeling lag then a calibration feature is useless!

the new "PSX" emu works so well, that, I could not perceive lag in the SHMUPS on That emu !!!!!! Then again I SUCK though hahahahaha. And I will probably NEVER make it to end, no, but, I will certainly be TRYING with you guys YES.

@shanecorning5222

Жыл бұрын

(Keeps Watching) .... Yeah, LET'S do a Neo Geo without KoF , nor , World Heroes? ... No star shooter game no 3d shooter (Viewpoint) and no freekin mention of PUZZLE Bobble who is doing those reviews ?!?!?!?! HAHAHAHA!!!!

@shanecorning5222

Жыл бұрын

(Still watching) ..... You should own the game if you are EMU'ing it. It's that simple if you OWN the Cart who give a Flying Fart WHAT you are playing it on. ..... SEE?

2 legends here

WHATS THE GAME ON DISPLAY THERE?

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

Super xyx :-)

What's the game being played in the video ?

@dadrising6464

3 жыл бұрын

thats super XYZ (steam)

@snoozeyoulose9416

3 жыл бұрын

Super XYX both for steam and itch.io

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

It s super xyx! Check out my review for it, it s a really great game :-)

@dadrising6464

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheElectricUnderground on a sidenote.. still waiting for the dangun feveron review xD

What's the first game being shown here?

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

Super xyx

Most fpga solutions lack save states, sd2snes has some sound issues with it and on mister only one core supports that feature (the gba one). However the improved accuracy and responsiveness over emulation makes up for it imho

Re listening a detail I glanced over , junkie mentions that the pc engine mini was railed on for its input lag but the same reviewers gave other minis and nowadays collections like the TMNT one an okay or great even though it was a huge fault in mini. Wtf double standard at its finest

that game on screen looks cool. what's the game name?

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

Super XYX, here is my review for it :-) kzread.info/dash/bejne/qKKTo82accede7w.html

@RuV9999

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheElectricUnderground Alright thank you so much! ^^

Even if you aren't going for scoring and are playing only for survival, wouldn't you still want the most responsive, least laggy version of the game you could possibly have? I almost don't even see how there is room for a debate, honestly. Less input lag is just objectively better, really no matter what kind of game you are playing, or how you are playing it. Responsive controls are king. I understand people not wanting or being able to go through the trouble of collecting PCBs, or figuring out how to get solid emulation, but still.

KZread keeps hiding my comment, so I put it in a Pastebin: vnxmidRN

@TheElectricUnderground

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks for the comment! I read the pastebin :-) Yeah, at one point I should go through and lag test the touhou games, it shouldn't be too bad to do :-)

@lunaria_stg

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheElectricUnderground Thanks! Hopefully KZread will stop pulling this nonsense soon.

@dadrising6464

3 жыл бұрын

@@lunaria_stg the amount of C3ns0rshlp on YT is getting insane

I don't care about lag at 8 frames or under and frankly, find the neverending obsession over it annoying. I understand an extreme minority notice and care, but like ShmupJunkie says, know your audience, and understand most ppl arent going to care so much. Every time I hear someone say "don't play on Switch, it's got 1 frame more lag than PS" I feel like facepalming. I've never played a game where lag impacted my experience except the Genesis Classics Collection on Switch, and that felt like a quarter second.

@TheElectricUnderground

Жыл бұрын

Being informed is annoying? Well you are in luck because you have plenty of channels out there that will rubber stamp review an 8 frame lag game, which is crazy laggy btw

All the people saying they don't notice the input delay are usually terrible at games in general. They are the reason we get shitty ports and just shitty games in general these days

The problem with giving 10 for ESP ra de and 5 for Psikyo is you're rating ONLY the quality of porting and ignoring the quality of the game itself. Both must be accounted for, but what matters most is the games.

@TheElectricUnderground

Жыл бұрын

No not the case at all. You can't drop a pile of garbage port and then expect a high score because you happen to have a license of the source material. That's silly then there basically is no review standard.

@HPPrintervx4p5q

3 ай бұрын

It's all about the user experience. The psikyo games are amazing, but they're a lot harder to enjoy when there's a bunch of lag. And for casuals it may be fine, but if you want to 1cc one or even two loops, then it suddenly becomes a lot less fun to have such a sluggish feeling game. And honestly if you're not playing for such a goal you're not really getting the full experience.

This was a great talk! Are you guys aware of the awesome controller testing project going on for MiSTer? Link: twitter.com/MisterAddons/status/1265071632382640131. I wonder how well the results would correlate for other systems, say for example, MiSTer results + 50ms = Switch results.

6 frames of lag if you're at 60 FPS is a big deal. That's 100ms. Imagine you're playing Fortnite... that's a ping of 100ms. A lot of players in many types of games would find that intolerable.