What lie angle do you play in your irons?? 🔑🌪 Make a Rotational swing just like HOGAN and TREVINO with Milo's 5 KEYS: milolinesgolf.com/5-keys-to-unlocking-a-rotational-golf-swing/

@alancolbert5841

Ай бұрын

2° flat

The backstory on Hogan was he grew up caddying on West Texas hardpan with a guy named Byron (Nelson) and the caddies would have long drive contests for bragging rights. Hogan realized that if he hit low ‘stingers’ they would roll forever and that’s how he won. He used the same technique on tour. Nelson would go on to greatness as well and is credited with developing the hand-dropping, side-bending two-plane swing technique nearly everyone - who isn’t trying to emulate Moe Norman - uses today in the early 1930s, intuitively realizing at the top the kinetic energy generated in the club head mass accelerating it on the way up could be transferred into the then new hollow steel shafts by dropping the hands which bends and loads the shaft like a leaf spring, releasing it at the bottom. Gene Sarazen invented the high bounce sand wedge we all use today after the USGA banned the “Spoon” with concave face that had been used to scoop balls out of bunkers, requiring irons to have flat faces. So he melted lead on the sole in his garage with a blowtorch to create a snowplow effect which came to be known as as “bounce”. I recall reading that someone measured Bobby Jones’s PW in the case at Augusta National and discovered it had negative bounce which helps when hitting approach shots off tight lies. He was one of the first to use a set of clubs with graduated lofts and lengths but stayed with Hickory shafts long after most on the pro tour had switched to steel shafts which twist less during the swing. Trevino was is one of the smartest and intuitive golfers on the tour back in his era. I’ve watched a lot of his videos and he explained he developed his swing around the goal of keeping the club head flying down the target line as long as possible before and just after impact which requires a swing with a lot of side bend which lowers the hands and the swing path requiring a flatter lie angle on the clubs. High speed photography and radar measuring devices like Trackman have nearly totally replaced the type of intuition Hogan, Nelson, Norman, and Trevino used to figure things out on their own by trial, error and thoughtful observation and reflection. Starting with Nicklaus success on the pro level started to rely more and more on who had a rich Daddy who could afford a top level coach for their kid rather than the kid’s ability to figure out the cause and effect by themselves. Tiger, Phil and Rory were all products of that type of coaching. It took a guy named Homer Kelley, a draftsman at Boeing who took up golf his 30s and spent hours at the range just watching other golfers - the good, the bad and the ugly - to really understand the golf swing in terms of its underlying physics and bio-mechanical leverage strategies and techniques in ‘The Golf Machine’. He taught a new generation of analytical coaches like the amazing Ben Doyle in Carmel, CA who coached a lot of kids who later wound up on the pro tour. Karsten Solheim, a GE engineer who also took up golf in his 30s in the 1950s created the first modern high MOI putters and irons: 1A mallet and Anser blade putters and PING EYE perimeter weighted irons and woods.

John Erickson preaches 6° flat clubs. His explanation if brought to it's total extreme, more upright changes left right dispersion while more flat changes high low dispersion. In other words flatter clubs have straighter misses.

@sonnymarks6997

Ай бұрын

John erickson is the best !!

@rossmcdonough4329

Ай бұрын

How much more bs can you come up with?

@wayneriley7367

Ай бұрын

Agreed, I’m looking into flattening most of my clubs 2-3degrees

I lowered mine by 2-3°. Got me to a single handicap. I got onto this by watching John. Best thing I ever did.

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

Nice!

One other factor to look at is the average height of the golfers today vs golfers of yesterday. Shorter people (w/hands closer to ground) need a flatter club. John Rahm 6'2". . .. Tiger Woods 6' 1", Lee Trevino 5'7", Ben Hogan 5'8" But that said, at 5'10" with long arms, I have always favored flat lie clubs. I think this video makes a great point that few pros ever explore. One other that understands this is John Erickson at Advanced Ball Striking.

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

Height and body dimensions is definitely a factor.

@ForewardGolf

Ай бұрын

Everything matters, thanks for watching!

@A-FrameWedge

Ай бұрын

But there are tall players that have very long arms and their hands are just as close to the ground as shorter players with average length arms

@adamdodson8055

Ай бұрын

The amateur most often attempts to accelerate the club with active force from the hands and arms. This action forces the handle up and toe down. Elite strikers tow the club head through and generally do fit into clubs that are flatter than their physical counterparts in the amateur world.

Love it. There are so many "boiler plate" prescriptions to fitting; I'm glad to see [were] still learning. Excellent content!

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

Thanks so much for following along!

@ForewardGolf

Ай бұрын

Still so much to learn, thanks for watching.

Flatter lie angles is the best kept secret in golf. Upright lies twist more left to right (horizontal dispersion), flat lie angles twist more up and down (vertical dispersion) But remember Hogans clubs were not only flat, they were HEAVY and had super stiff shafts

This is a very good video. Well done Milo. 🇨🇦💝🇺🇸👍

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

Thanks Gerry!

This is fascinating! I'm currently going down the rabbit hole with equipment in the more I learn the more I realize it's hard to find good information. Not sure if you've done a video on this yet I'm currently learning about the balance point in the clubs in finding that to be huge! As a left hand left side dominant golfer who plays right-handed my lead side dominates a lot of the action and for me finding the balance point on the golf club is tremendous! So far counterbalance clubs are high balance point clubs in shafts are the only things that are working that actually allow me to load and unload the club. I'm starting to believe that most golfers swing flaws are actually more about their equipment because they're making micro compensations and subconscious compensations throughout their swing because the equipment doesn't fit them

Interesting stuff. I feel like the spinner balls (and shorter length courses) were a huge factor in promoting swings that would have 'tighter' dispersions etc, as opposed to today's lower spin power game. Interesting that flat lie angles could be a tool used to help achieve that kinda swing. That's quite different to today's approach of fitting clubs to a poor swing! Lot of guys today using lots of vertical force to maximise distance ... would this mean trend towards more upright lie angles?

beautiful scenery!

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

A great spot!

Love the fitting technique that Chad put together. Went trough the remote fitting a few weeks ago and it was eye opening for sure. My JPX 923 Forged irons were close to the prescription that he put together after the fitting. FG fitting prescription: Lighter shaft 80 gram with mid kick ( Steel fiber 80i), stiff flex with soft step, mid bounce soul, 3/4 inch longer shafts, mid size grips, overall lighter swing weight, 2 degrees flat. There were 24 clubs in the fitting process, 3 clubs per swing parameter.

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

Definitely a great process!

@ForewardGolf

Ай бұрын

Stoked you like it!

@randysitzgolf

Ай бұрын

@@ForewardGolf Going to have you guys make the 7 iron for me and try it out.

Interesting. The best golf I have ever played were with Ping Eye 2 orange dots. (2 degrees flat). I really love my current set Cleveland Hibore. I'm not sure if I can get these bent flatter.

This it! Been thinking about doing this to my irons and now I’m going to. Hate the ball going left. Working on this rotary swing more every day. Want to fade everything!

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

It is worth exploring for sure

@ForewardGolf

Ай бұрын

Test everything!

This guy is worth listening to

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

Yes he knows

Good luck James, your swing is excellent. One shot at a time my friend ❤

@MiloLinesGolf

26 күн бұрын

James?

The moment of impact 🎉

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

Theirs was pretty good!

Super interesting. I tend to over draw. My grip needs work, but i feel like 2 degrees might change my game a bit.

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

Could, I would certainly reach out to Chad or an expert fitter before making changes.

Have you ever talked to John Erickson or Bradley Hughes? It seems like you have some things in common on the swing. They are advocators of flat clubs, up to 6 degrees.

@rayhickey6768

3 күн бұрын

I immediately thought of Bradley Hughes. I believe he uses clubs 5 degrees flat.

It's funny this video came out because recently I hit an exact replica of Hogan's 7 iron. It was an old club from the 70's I think. It was exactly 4.5 degrees flat from standard. I know this because we measured it. I didn't hit a single ball left (right handed player) and I hit it about 20 times. Every shot started off a fraction right of my intended start line, where as before everything started out just left of my intended start line. My clubs are now 3.5 degrees flat from standard even though I'm a shorter person. Now I don't start the ball left anymore, unless I pull one left.

Flatter lies reduce the directional miss when face angle is off. Eg open face goes less right, the ball just smidge higher. Upright lies magnify the face discrepancy and make you miss more left or right.

@FGrecoJR

Ай бұрын

This makes no sense

Definitely reminds me of John Erickson. Milo, if you play a super flat iron, what happens when you hit hybrids. Fairway woods. Driver? Seems like it would screw you up ?

@ForewardGolf

Ай бұрын

Woods are definitely more limited with lie angle, as we continue to search for where good golf lives this will be a step in the process!

I just changed all my Lie angles on my irons and wedges to 6 degre flat , wedges felt a bit funky. but my normal set up was 3 degre flat and with that i cant fade a single one of my irons ,. But on the range Yesterday there was some fade with the 6 flat. Im playing a round today cant wait to se how the irons preform 🌞

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

Keep us posted on your results!

@heroichand1646

Ай бұрын

I like the change so far but the wedges may be over done so 6 flat is a bit to much . I will play with it some more to be sure , but i did not end up with less curve on my draws , so i have ben to the range in order to change my release so that the face dont Roll over but looks more back at me , and that helps , now im hitting a Cut . I for sure feel i need to rotate with this setup chest more open , and keep the shaft on plane or a bit higher not to dump it under like i tend to do .

Damn...Henry has a beautiful swing!!!

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

=)

My custom fit Ping irons are so flat they are off Ping’s chart. They gave me orange lie angles, but they are 3 degrees flatter than that. 🤷‍♂️👍

My iron shots consistently go straight then draw at the end. Was told my irons lie was a bit too upright and need to flatten out. Is that right? And how much to flatten?

@lawbinson

Ай бұрын

More likely a club path issue if it's starting straight.

Man I love to golf.....

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

what a game!

What do u suggest for a 12 handicap golfer regarding lie angles? -2,3,4 thanks

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

Totally depends on the player, I would suggest connecting with a reputable fitter, or Chad and Foreward Golf to get you on the right path.

How do you manage lie angles in your woods and driver Milo?

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

Not as important in driver as there isn’t much loft. I play shorter fwy woods than standard

6'3" here, wrist-to-floor around 35-36" I have my irons extended 0.5" and 1.5° upright. Absolutely no problems for me with this setup. 🤔

Question for Messrs Lines and Dietz: This flat lie concept seems to be a good solution for someone who creates and maintains a deep hip angle and steep shoulder tilt through impact. What about the normal golfer who cannot get into those positions?

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

the ideal fitting will certainly depend on the player as Chad states, the "prescription"

@BroncoYeller

Ай бұрын

@@MiloLinesGolf I got fitted at a local shop, but it was super basic and there was no in depth process. Can you please recommend a top notch facility?

Hey Milo, I just watched your video and I must say that it was really informative and well-made. I was wondering if I could help you edit your videos and repurpose your long videos into highly engaging shorts? I can also make high CTR thumbnails for your channel

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

Thanks but we already have a team for that

Couple questions: (1) if flat lie angles help, should a golfer seek a driver with as flat a lie angle as possible? (2) Is it a rule of thumb that softer iron shafts have more "droop" than stiff ones and therefore should be a bit longer?

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

Often times yes however lower lofted clubs with ball on a tee are less affected by different lie angles

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

And yes softer shafts generally droop more

2’ flat me. Not so much in Trevino’s day but im hogans day wasn’t the sweet spot closer to the heel?

Very interesting regarding the shaft being almost a lady's flex. It would be great if someone could interview Lee Trevino to discuss why he setup his angles flat.

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

In the old days, everything was trial and error. I would almost bet many of the players from his era would sit on the range with a bending machine experimenting with what gave them the best results.

@ForewardGolf

Ай бұрын

Lee is a legend, thanks for watching!

How does this apply to drivers/3 woods and hybrids than are barely able to be moved upright/flat? Are the pros all playing 6 degree flat drivers? I have found the best way to measure the correct lie angle is to play 2 daysa after a rain. The divot after impact will show you a horizontal line on your club face of mud. You know instantly if you too upright or flat. I think the moral here is what is said. a fade is always better than a draw, why, because the ball stops quicker from its landing spot

softer "whippier" shafts--is this in part the secret as to why folks hit the Autoflex shaft so well ?

@ForewardGolf

Ай бұрын

Hard to say, the technology's hidden.

@nedgermany

Ай бұрын

I smoke the autoflex

Most of us are fitted 2 degrees upright because we early extend. Fix the swing first. I had my irons flattened to standard and hit the ball terribly. Perhaps I needed to work on my swing more.

@MiloLinesGolf

29 күн бұрын

As we said in the video, Chad and other fitters we’ve brought on work with the individual and don’t just move clubs to move clubs. It’s possible there were other factors in your case to consider.

On KZread fitters often sort out leaks to the right with upright lie angles, but is there then a chance that it promotes a worse swing for already struggling players?

@ForewardGolf

Ай бұрын

Only one way to find out, test everything!

Its interesting. I would say flatter lies and lower hands at impact may make sense for accuracy but you will never see a long drive guy without very high hands at impact.

@ForewardGolf

Ай бұрын

The 7 iron is a precision tool, the driver is not.

@FGrecoJR

Ай бұрын

Hmm perhaps. But you name Hogan and Trevino. But don't mention Tiger, Jack, Scheffler, Watson, Couples, Norman etc with very high hands at impact.

Am 6'1" and 34" wrist to floor and play 3 degrees flat

Could it be that they were shorter men and needed a flatter lie angle? Lee is 5’7” and Ben was 5’8”:

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

That is part of it for sure

@thewi7ard

Ай бұрын

But Hogan was a total knuckle dragger! Freakishly long arms.

@nelsonjames1272

Ай бұрын

Absolutely!!! And this dude plays his 7 iron here at a much higher length which makes it technically play more upright from standard.

@toneyo4794

Ай бұрын

@@nelsonjames1272I think it’s the opposite, the longer your club the flatter your swing, so lengthen the club and you can flatten the iron. Your wedge swing is much more upright than your driver. Think of a club that is 10 feet long. You have to swing very flat.

Where do I buy or how do I get a flat iron

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

I'd recommend getting fit, but many irons you can bend to your desired lie angle.

@eloramirez5181

Ай бұрын

@MiloLinesGolf Thank you. I did a little research. I'll be up to see you sometime this summer. I would love the opportunity to get a fitting with you

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

I don't do fittings myself, but I can typically tell based on the student in front of me roughly what would work best for them. I would suggest going to our partners at Cool Clubs in Scottsdale or seeing Chad (from video) who is in Ventura, California or he could send you a kit.

@eloramirez5181

Ай бұрын

@MiloLinesGolf Great Thank you, sir. appreciate it

Flat clubs hit it straighter. It’s physics!

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

Not always they must fit the swing of the golfer swinging them

I feel like I'm missing something here.... To just say that you need to have you clubs flattened and you will hit better is a bit misleading. Correct me if I'm wrong, but this should be based on the individuals measurements and not a blanket statement based on the club itself. As an example, I'm 6'3", if I bent my clubs 6d down from standard I'd be hitting so much toe in the dirt I'd have the opposite issue. I have mine bent up 3d, which gives me a flatter lie angle and promotes what you are saying. I feel that this is what you mean, and not just a general comment for the club from standard, but in relation to the individual. As you were comparing the two clubs being 11d difference, I'd likely see better results with the 6d upright than the 6d flat because of my wrist to ground measurements would put that closer to flat for me. Maybe I'm wrong or maybe this is obvious to some.

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

Of course everything is relative. The idea is to flex and rotate not extend and flip what that looks like will depend significantly on the anatomy of the individual.

The only thing I don't like about this is you're going from one box and putting everyone else in a different box. That's the issue that I keep having with instruction and tips and ideas. Just some of the variables when you think about it with equipment for example with the idea of going flatter okay some patterns might work that way depending on the person's physical makeup their swing characteristics their timing their strength etcetera. Yet you'd also have to factor in the shaft weight the head weight the grip size the grip weight where the kick points going to be there so many factors that go into it that the problem is if he gave me that club maybe I would swing it better but that doesn't mean it actually fits me I still might be adjusting to it. I feel like the entire fitting process is backwards for professionals they make the club fit them. So Lee Trevino and Ben Hogan would tell their fitter this is what I'm trying to do make a club that does that. Where is the Casual golfer or the less experienced golfer that doesn't have access to an actual fitter the Fitters going to hand them a club and say how does that feel and all the golfers trying to do is get a certain ball flight. You at the club itself isn't fitting them they are fitting to the club. I feel like it's two different worlds

The upright clubs start with sorry swing instruction. Years ago when they started this point the butt of the club at the ball mess. Trevino on Hogan's butt of the club points above the ball under the plane. Hence flat lie angles. That and club manufacturers have no idea what they're doing. Upright clubs promote steep swings. I guess club manufacturers figure the more upright they make them the average golfer will not slice as bad.

Doesn't over length make it okay more effectively upright

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

Yes, so the flatter lie gets offset a touch.

anybody know what lie angle Moe played

@dubblwide

Ай бұрын

In the early days of Moe mania during the heyday of Natural Golf, they maintained that his clubs-and therefore theirs-were upright, 2 degrees I think. I’ve since heard Todd Graves maintain the opposite. He would be able to inform you definitively.

Right now I'm two degrees flat.

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

Nice, assuming that's proper for you

6’4 with short arms. 2 degrees upright which I regret but can’t afford to change them…😢

@TheWedgeWizard

Ай бұрын

Same lies as Tiger.

@ForewardGolf

Ай бұрын

Have to find your match! Thanks for watching

@nelsonjames1272

Ай бұрын

2 degrees upright from what though? Manufacturers are different.

@trebor5760

Ай бұрын

@@nelsonjames1272 Ping, it was the case of not great player getting fit and now I am improving the clubs just feel a little too upright. This video resonated with me.

There’s literally video of Lee Trevino , words out of his mouth , saying he played standard , just saying….relative to individual irons , loft , length , etc have changed over time…but for his era he played standard

Is this a Brad hughes vid from 10 years ago? 😂

@ForewardGolf

Ай бұрын

The truth is hard to change! 🐯🏳

Be careful here. Don’t mess too much with lie angle or you’ll struggle. A 61 or 62 degree lie standard length 7 iron will fit most to where they should be with a decent swing. Shaft droop with very soft shafts only.

@ForewardGolf

Ай бұрын

Assume nothing, test everything!

I am a retired club maker/fitter and I have been shouting that the clubs that are being manufactured are way too upright, That includes everything from the driver down to the wedges. It is true as clubmakers we tend to bend the wedges a little more flat. I have never understood why play clubs so upright a great way to increase your handicap. A golf swing should be more around your body easier on your lumbar easier way to pick up natural club head speed plus you stay in the shot you simply have better posture and better control of the low point. I don't know much about Milo or his rotational swing, but will say the flatter you swing the club it shallows and the best ball strikers always hit from a shallow descending blow.

@MiloLinesGolf

26 күн бұрын

Thanks so much for watching, this one was a lot of fun! I agree on the club-maker points. Longer and more upright over the years. Everyone is different though and getting an expert fitting can really help!

@1DCCX

8 күн бұрын

Unless by steep you mean ‘upright’ in a 2D down the line view, the best players hit from a flat shaft angle and relatively steep angle of attack. Especially in the past with balata. They needed to launch it lower and cover it. ‘Steep’ I prefer to associate with AoA, but in any case, ‘steep’, ‘upright’ is actually the club rotating closed, tumbling out in front of you. It morphs into upright by impact because all the momentum is tumbling that way. It’s the beginner-slicer trying to correct an open face more upright lie angles are to an extent, slice mitigation the clubmakers are building into it. Better players have better low point control and tend to miss thin and to the heel. High handicaps tend to make the shaft more upright and come in *shallow*, pick it, or hit it fat. Hit it out the toe. When you turn the corner on flat planes it comes in steep. Think Sergio Garcia. Low distance efficiency. If you look at modern balls and clubs, and the trends in angle of attack it is getting shallower, because the ball spins less and clubs need tungsten and low COG. The course design and length has changed the parameters. But even so, pros and top players have steeper AoA generally than poor players. The main benefit of flat clubs is directional control versus trajectory as the club is being spun into impact. It also encourages a clockwise arm and club pattern, because your brain forces the body to accommodate it to make contact. Upright lie angles mean less work, less *need* to swing correctly.

do you not believe in a dynamic lie test ,ie lie board read at impact not address. surely we need look at shaft droop etc.

@MartinAyersGolf

Ай бұрын

Dynamic lie tests aren’t great, the player reacts to the tool. They can move badly to get the club to work.

Hogan and Trevino were/are around 5.7 with long arms. So they had a natural advantage. Faldo eg. at 6.3 was alway looking for compromises. The other end of the scale is Bryson with a different swing type Not against a flatter swing at all. The less the hands will go into ulnar at impact; the better the shot. To get the angle just right two other factors are in the equation: 1. distance to the ball. 2. head weight in relation to club length for a playable club. Player must find an optimum.

@MichaelShinosky

Ай бұрын

Yup. I bought into the flatter lie angle theory. Clubs 2 degrees flat. Started standing way too far from the ball and coming over it to keep it from going right and way of the toe. I have a wrist to floor that is 37.5 inches at 6 feet. I'm now three degrees upright and half inch over. My rotation is the best it's ever been. I don't stand far from it anymore and I almost never miss left. Actually missed it left more often with a flatter lie angle. I can now swing a little more in to out and get myself into a really good position at impact. A lot less minor manipulations as well. Center face strikes constantly. I actually need a driver that is well upright as well as my smash goes up .05 with longer more upright clubs that OEMs don't offer off the rack anymore. 60 degree LA is the max and I need probably another degree or two since can't go longer than 46 inches to dynamically get the lie angle correct. One would think a more upright lie angle would go more left. But this is just not the case. I can actually start to hit push draws again with the same move I made back in 2010 that I couldn't seem to execute a year ago with flat angles. Body dynamics play a huge role in relation to static club setups. I was well outside the mean for my body type. In fact I have unknowingly been playing on the edge of that mean my whole life at standard LLL.. It took going way outside the mean to finally really figure it out.

If you really get into Lee Trevino’s prime he played various irons that he pulled out of a wooden barrel, early 70s before lightening strike, at this point he was at the top of his game

They knew to hit DOWN on the ball LMAO

I'm lost. I was too focused on why he would keep hitting from a divot, and didn't learn anything.

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

Hmm, what can I help clarify? We hit from the same spot to avoid tearing up a bunch of good grass.

Trevino and Hogan were like 5'7" tall of course their clubs are flat.

2 degrees flat (thanks to a fitter way back in the 80's that watched my ball flight), but every other fitter wants to put me at 2 up.... i hook em off the planet. Don't trust that lie board, doesn't work for everyone.

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

Many of the expert fitters we work with don't love the lie board.

It's 2024, anyone that doesn't know about lie adjustment must be living in a cave! Not everyone can play flat lies. There are determining factors for every player. Height, set up and swing plane being major factors. You should hit each club off a lie board and adjust individually. I'm 5'7" and my standard lie is 2 degrees flat.

micro degrees of club lie angle aren't promoting bad golf swing mechanics , come on.

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

We aren’t talking about micro degrees

@kipkapper3014

Ай бұрын

it's satirical, swap micro to singular degrees. same point. there is no way club lie angle causes poor swing mechanics. at best it randomly changes the ball flight for shit swings. not the other way around.

@ForewardGolf

Ай бұрын

@@kipkapper3014 Best way to find out is to test it. Thanks for watching.

@kipkapper3014

Ай бұрын

@@ForewardGolf you know what , i will

@darrinlygrisse5287

Ай бұрын

If your clubs don’t fit, you will adapt over time and your swing will change, for better or worse.

flat clubs aren’t a ‘secret’ and don’t account for anyone’s game!! ridiculous.

@ForewardGolf

Ай бұрын

Goodluck out there on the track! 🐯🏳

@craigg2058

Ай бұрын

Would you agree that a flatter downswing is more beneficial than steep? The thought behind having your irons bent flat is that it will encourage your swing/body motion to return the club on a flatter plane.

@tonysmario817

Ай бұрын

@@craigg2058 the club's 'flatness' at address has zero influence on the swing path, which is something unaffected by a change of clubs. if i am forced to use someone's 'upright' set of clubs, i will not change my swing path, i will simply hit more shots with the 'heel down' than normal.

@craigg2058

Ай бұрын

My experience has been different. If I have an upright club in hand I’m not going to continue to dig the heel in at impact. I’m going to athletically adjust my swing resulting in an unwanted steep downswing. Most equipment is set up too upright, resulting in an upright swing/downswing.

@tonysmario817

Ай бұрын

@@craigg2058 i understand your point...but i have never played a golf club SO upright that i cannot swing my flat swing with it...but as you say, the potential is there if a club is upright in the extreme for a person, which my experience has not found to be a real issue...nor do i believe a person's swing will be 'fixed' by using a flat club...though your point is simply that a flatter club will engender a flatter swing. but i'm not sure i agree except in each extreme, which is not really a practical issue. i'm not a tall person, but i have never had a problem swinging any standard club...the issue you're speaking of would seem to be the idea of a midget having to swing with tom wieskopf's equipment...but that just never happens in the real world. work on your SWING, and never mind the meaningless lie of the club!

waste of 12 min

@MiloLinesGolf

Ай бұрын

Why?

..the lie must match Your Height....trying to swing flat or upright are wrong....standard lie matches around 5ft11in.height....impact is a straight line from left shoulder to ball...(not like low hands at adress,which i dont like)