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@alistairbolden6340

Ай бұрын

Its true Steam is a monopoly, such things are very bad for the consumer, really it should be forced to break up into several competing companies. I honestly think that even 5% of any market share is to large, the monopoly laws should be far more strict, Capitalism is very good in theory but only when market forces are working as intended and are not being exploited by companies.

@DePhoegonIsle

Ай бұрын

Good job at not thinking this one through. Just what in the world could be done to make EA Origins, Ubisoft launcher, GoG Galaxy, Befesda Launcher(all of them), MS Store more competitive when your only action is against Valve. Also.... I want you to say this out loud. 'They are suing because they are not able to set the prices of keys that use the Steam Network for it's data, cheaper than the people who buy the game from steam store front. They, the ones who SET THE PRICE OF THEIR PRODUCTS ON ALL THEIR PLATFORMS, are suing because the network of which they are using mandates product price matching. ' Then tell me what you'd do to steam to make others competitive.

@blackmark2899

Ай бұрын

​@@alistairbolden6340Steam isn't a monopoly because it's manipulation or because there's no competition. It's a monopoly because every other competitor is just that bad that every creator and customer chooses them.

@MagicManICT

Ай бұрын

@@alistairbolden6340 But why does Steam have little competition? The competition, other than GOG, sucks. A lot of publishers don't want to sell on GOG because they have certain DRM policies that a lot publishers don't want to relinquish.

@StarNote96

Ай бұрын

why are you spreading misinformation? the price match is only for Steam keys not for purchases that have nothing to do with Steam for example on the epic launcher that does not generate a Steam key

The problem isn't that Steam is a monopoly, the problem is that the competition loves to shoot itself in the foot before it can compete with Valve.

@drayle71

Ай бұрын

part of the issue is in a lot of places having a monopoly isn't illegal doing anti competitive things to create/keep that monopoly is what is illegal and a lot of people seem to just be unhappy an effective monopoly like steam exists but as people are pointing out a lot of the reason for that is that the competition just sucks more then steam is going a load of blatant anti competitive behaviours.

@SpottedHares

Ай бұрын

@@drayle71the issue that keeps getting brought up is how they use their size to force price fixing so that the actual product can’t be offered for a better price elsewhere.

@Sw4lley

Ай бұрын

It is the same with steam and games overall as it is with World of Warcraft and other mmos. People have build their library over years, going to another platform is an annoying thing. Steam is using that heavily to keep ahead of anyone trying to break into that market. It is good that a court can look behind the scenes now and decide if steam is pushing it or if steam is fine. If nothing happens, we loose nothing. We, the consumers, can only win.

@hausmaus5698

Ай бұрын

Monopoly ist always a problem. Don't be foolish.

@Sw4lley

Ай бұрын

@@hausmaus5698 no they are not always a problem, but they tend to be problems if not checked repeatedly. And checking is exactly what courts, regulators and consumer activist organizations are for.

Valve doesn't need to be anti-competitive, the so called "competitors" aren't even trying to compete; the only thing competitors are competing at is who can shoot their own feet more.

@PropaneWP

Ай бұрын

Microsoft and Apple don't "need" to be anti-competitive either, but you can bet your ass they are. And frequently sued for it too. Don't be a simp.

@shuraamano

Ай бұрын

​@@PropaneWPWhere's the competition contender for Steam? Epic? Steam has been quality. Apple doesn't really compete outside of US. Arch arguably better substitute for OS. Don't be a simp. You rather choose garbage competition just because you lack identity? Simp.

@TiagoTiagoT

Ай бұрын

@@PropaneWP Exactly, those companies didn't earn their monopolies, and they only stay up there because they continue with their underhanded tactics; meanwhile, Valve does a great job while the competitors waste money on lawsuits and hurting customers..

@BloodwyrmWildheart

Ай бұрын

@@shuraamano The contender is torrent + crack + physical media + open source platforms. You rather choose garbage corporation just because you lack independence? Simp.

@Masaim6

Ай бұрын

@@TiagoTiagoTEven an earned monopoly is bad as there is not a single company that wouldn't use that to their advantage.

Companies are so upset that Steams "Consumer First" model is working. Game companies wont be happy until everything falls under the EA model.

@Nexuscron

Ай бұрын

Steam will never cowtow to them though, at least while Gabe is around.

@Songfugel

Ай бұрын

Nah, the problem is that steam is charging a crippling 30% revenue cut from small developers (remember, this is before tax, expenses, salaries etc), while giving the big developers a massive discount, even though the big devs earn almost all money on steam At the same time, since Steam controls almost 85% of the PC games sales and customers, developers are not realistically able to not sell the game on steam, without some very exceptional circumstances

@NFchegg

Ай бұрын

@@Songfugel 30% isnt much though, say the game costs 10 dollars, you walk home with 7 and steam takes 3 to keep the lights on. remember they have to host however much hundreds of terrabytes in games and the developer still wins out in volume sales at the end of the day if they are successful. you can also sell steam keys as a dev and steam takes 0 cut from those sales, think about it.

@InnuendoXP

Ай бұрын

​@@Songfugel Eh, compare to the brick & mortar retail model, that's actually a very low cost rate per unit Vs physical distribution. The only reason the cut is any smaller anywhere else is specifically because they're trying to compete with Steam & attract developers to their platforms & compensate for the relative lack of features & audience. It's not like a closed platform, Steam aren't preventing you from installing any other digital storefronts on your device.

@bibby659

Ай бұрын

That, or until its equally as bad, cheaply made, and barely keeping itself from falling apart that they keep themselves in. But the main issue here isn't so much that, its the fact that developers who dont have a lot can not simply sell their game on their own platforms or destribute them entirely in a manner that they want to. Like someone mentioned, paying 30%. Which isn't terrible, but it isn't great either. If nothing else, this is mostly (least outwardly facing) seems to be for the developers to have the ability to sell on their own platforms and on steam as well. Allowing people more freedom to choose who to buy from and where to buy it from. But governments never take companies to court like this without there being an obvious alternate objective or goal. While simultaneously being likely paid off by a 3rd party to make it happen.

Steam wins by doing absolutely nothing (compilation)

@TheDragonfriday

Ай бұрын

Steam wins by actually serving the customer

@alucard8433

Ай бұрын

@@TheDragonfriday Or Steam just denys service to the UK going forward and they win.

@CyprienCole

Ай бұрын

Incorrect. Steam got where it got by serving the customer. It's nothing special; it started out with a launcher, moved on to deals, moved on to features, and moved on to supporting portable machines. Is it perfect no... someone else can come up and do thing same thing and overtake steam would it be hard yes, because alot of people games already on steam no one wants to move away easily but people will use other launchers.

@Sw4lley

Ай бұрын

@@alucard8433they can not ignore the UK market, it would eat way more money than just paying up and do what they want. And frankly if the UK does find this a problem, it would not surprise me if the European Union will do the same soon after, their laws are still largely the same.

@christonchev9762

Ай бұрын

y and if X game is not on Steam yes Valve ain't getting anything but also that X game is dead on arrival cause noone will care if its on EGS

This lawsuit is a joke from someone that sees this as an opportunity to make money from a lawsuit. They don't actually care it's steam or someone else. It's your usual ambulance chaser but at a corporate level

@KitsuneKiera

Ай бұрын

Yeah just a cynical cash grab lawsuit, the fact that its opt out and not opt in makes it blatantly obvious.

Out of everything that is happening in the games industry, rampant micro/macrotransactions, unregulated gambling targeted at minors, tons of scam games with false advertising, especially in the mobile game market, STEAM is what they’re going after?

@Ramotttholl

Ай бұрын

well yeah, its easier to go after the ppl who comply then ppl who break or skirt the law. atleast that is one of the main things i learned the past 5 years.

@galacticwarlock2271

Ай бұрын

Exactly

@akatsukicloak

Ай бұрын

Oy vey

@lycanwarrior2137

Ай бұрын

You do know that a lot of bad stuff you just listed was pioneered in large degree by Valve/Steam itself, right? Especially unregulated gambling to minors!!! Just Google Kira TV and Steam gambling problem on KZread.

@TheDragonfriday

Ай бұрын

@@TheVenhammer it simple because money it the biggest money maker out there what you listed.

ya steam will win this. steam only sets prices for steam codes sold outside of their software lol. edit: before saying “Wrong”. read the steamworks key page and partner/pricing pages.

@Code7Unltd

Ай бұрын

Keep in mind that's similar to Amazon's "most favoured nation" policy.

@genlando327plays2

Ай бұрын

You're assuming rational and informed lawmakers. They are generally neither

@WingTzu343

Ай бұрын

That's interesting. Was this always the case or was this a policy change? I swear I remember steam controlling ALL sales outside their platform, with specific requirements for sales and such outside of steam.

@dragonriderabens9761

Ай бұрын

@@genlando327plays2 you're assuming lawmakers are the ones looking at this at all it will be lawyers and judges. neither of those make laws, just enforce the ones that already exist Steam's lawyers ARE rational and informed. whoever is on the prosecution's side is not the Judge...remains to be seen, but they'd have to be pretty damn awful at their job to look at the differences in how they act and not see who the nutter is, even if they don't fully understand the issue

@Sw4lley

Ай бұрын

Not sure steam wins this, atleast not in an easy way, everything points to the same solution Apple/Google had to comply with on the European Unions rules. It is more likely that steam has to do the same as Apple and Google had for the European Union, make their cuts more fair and give the option to promote outside sales with cheaper prices on the store page like „hey you, you can buy the game and play it on our *insertDev* website for cheaper“. Since Laws for the UK are still largely the same I see that as a solution to this, without steam loosing overly much, it would make the competitive aspect for games more fair.

Digital ownership is more of a pressing issue overall. This is one of the reasons why I have bought my most recent games on GOG. Also, this won't go anywhere.

@MicahkellMAS551

Ай бұрын

GOG won't stop developers and their publishers from locking you out of the use of your games through server shuttering or drm. Does GOG take some steps to remove that control? And if so, how?

@anaveragegamer359

28 күн бұрын

@@MicahkellMAS551 if you download somethign form gog its your you dont need a launcher heck you can just copy the files and run it one another pc

Developers love Steam as well, this is a total money grab by the legal firm. Pirate Software did a video on this explaining what Steam does that helps developers and how this lawsuit is complete crap. The game is hosted on Steam servers, downloads from Steam servers and these lawyers want developers to be able to sell the game elsewhere and NOT be removed from Steam, GTFO.

Steam? In hot water? You're pulling my leg.

@IngwiePhoenix

Ай бұрын

Maybe it's just ... smoke on the water.

@FahmiZFX

Ай бұрын

You could say it's boiling. You could say it's... Steaming.

@CodeXCDM

Ай бұрын

Bunch of hot air.

@ragingmonk6080

Ай бұрын

They will open the Valve and let the pressure off.

I'm confused -- I thought that the price matching only applied to the steam key -- using steam's infastructure to distribute your game and not anly listing of the game

@GrohiikVahlokJul

Ай бұрын

That is correct.

@bobpage2374

Ай бұрын

It does, but for some reason some people prefer to present it as Steam forbidding to sell the game elsewhere for cheaper at all. It's not the first time Bellular presents it that way, even though, as seen later in the video, he clearly understands the difference

@TheWeeJet

Ай бұрын

The lawsuit is done by a woman that's well known for making lawsuits just to make money from them.

Valve's strategy of just sitting around and doing nothing while all their competition just constantly makes terrible choices is too strong.

How are they even in hot water? Steam has the best experience and community than any other platform on PC. Maybe if these companies got off their butt and did something with all their money, maybe they could get close.

@pazPAPAS

Ай бұрын

People are just grasping at straws, trying to come down on Steam for demanding price parity, which A: is an extremely common practice and B: protects consumers from shady business practices.

@PropaneWP

Ай бұрын

Because using their 85% market share to force publishers to raise their prices on other platforms is anti-competitive. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand this.

@NaoyaYami

Ай бұрын

@@PropaneWP Neither does it take one to understand that you can't expect anyone to simply let you all their stuff for free while you make all the money. Valve gets no money from sales outside of Steam. If they are providing you with things like game distribution, forums, possibly workshop, online api, community features, linux/steam deck support,etc. the very least you could do is not to make Steam users' experience worse (by charging them more). That's idiotic.

@Sw4lley

Ай бұрын

It is a weird thing yes. It largely comes down to steam having such a large stake in the market that regulators have to make sure that steam does not use it in a nefarious sometime later. If regulators ignore such things steam could make a case then „but you didn’t care back then and for the last decade“. It is largely just to make sure everything is above board and steam knows not to push the boundaries.

@jacobcaron2280

Ай бұрын

Well you need hot water to make steam.

If the competition isn't as good as the headliner that doesn't mean the headliner is a problem. I wonder how many small restaurants sue 5 star Michelin restaurants for "unfair competition" in the UK?

@comlitbeta7532

Ай бұрын

Michelin restaurants stop at 3 stars btw 1 star worth the stop 2 stars worth the detour 3 stars worth the voyage

@xythiera7255

Ай бұрын

Its not the UK goverment sueing at all if you go throw the law suite it self its an independent organisation aka its a bs law suite that wont go anywere

@Narangarath

Ай бұрын

Well... There could be more law suits about that, if the Michelin star restaurants had deals with suppliers that made the "regular" restaurants sell their product at the same prices as the Michelin one.

@Narangarath

Ай бұрын

​@@comlitbeta7532 Some of the time, anyway. Depends on what kind of food you like, Michelin star restaurants tend to be a little complicated for me personally. As a professional chef. 😅 So my point is, those apply, if the restaurant serves food you'd enjoy in "lesser quality".

@theblackoutexplorer2658

Ай бұрын

@@Narangarathgood thing that ain’t happening here steam inly controls the prices for steam keys not all prices

Antitrust theory doesn't work when it comes to digital services. When you have a lot of competition, the customer suffers from too many competing standards that aren't interoperable. Movie streaming is a prime example of what happens when competition ramps up for digital services. Less content, higher prices and no innovation. Having to have a dozen different apps installed and not knowing where to watch your shows as they keep changing hands. And you see it on PC even today where people are sick of having to install launchers for games that add absolutely zero value.

@Tooney712

Ай бұрын

This is partially correct. The other half is that digital services are only allowed to do this because of copyright, a system that grants a government-enforced monopoly over a set of ideas. Because the Copyright holder is the only one who has the right to distribute copies, in a purely digital landscape, nothing is stopping the rights holder from essentially holding their own copyrighted work hostage on a platform of their own making.

About Steam preventing developers from selling their games at a lower price on other stores, I remember reading in a few different places that this was limited to Steam Keys for the developers games, and not a "ban" on them selling their games on different stores like the Epic Store at a lower price? Was that wrong? For context, Steam Keys can be generated by developers for free, so Steam doesn't make any money on those, hence why they would ban developers from selling those keys at a cheaper price than what they sell the game for on Steam.

@minze202

Ай бұрын

No, you're correct. Steam has no issues if you sell your game on other plattforms at different prices, if steam is not involved. If you use a steam key, then it's only fair that you don't compete against steam using their own plattform.

@urazz7739

Ай бұрын

Yeah, if you use a Steam key, then you are essentially making Steam use their servers for customers to download their games. So, I would say Steam is in the right to force people to not sell the games on other platforms for a cheaper price if they are using Steam keys. Simple solution if you want to sell the game on other platforms/storefronts for cheaper than on Steam, don't use Steam keys on these other platforms/storefronts.

@jamesclarkson156

Ай бұрын

If the judges do the bad option, Steam will likely just ban selling keys not on their platform. Do the people filing these lawsuits think of consequences ever?

@bobpage2374

Ай бұрын

This is annoying, because MadnessRealm is right, this rule is limited to reselling steam keys only. But many people, including @BellularNews, word it in such a way as if Steam was forbidding to sell a game elsewhere for less in general, not just the Steam key. @jamesclarkson156 I don't think Steam would ban reselling keys. They would just add their cut to generated keys. Keys are needed to sell box versions, for bundles and promotions. Getting rid of those would be shooting themselves in the foot

@roadrash2005

Ай бұрын

@@jamesclarkson156no they only think about getting paid

Valve getting sued because they dared provide customers with good deals and a convenient buying experience, the nerve of Gabe Newel.... the nerve. (Shakes fist at Gabe)

@BlueBD

Ай бұрын

Valve doesn't set the deals. The devs do. Valve literally does nothing but provide the service. The rule they are arguing is. "If you sell steam keys you cannot price it lower then what *YOU* priced it on steam anywhere else." Is this somehow wrong? Your using steams service. And Steam doesn't even get anything from it. Steam keys sold outside of steam get no cut. The devs and whatever stores front it is being sold on does. It's literally scam protection

So it's steams fualt the others suck so bad?

@Kant3n

Ай бұрын

That has been Tim's go-to from the very day EGS launched. Surely taking 2 years to add a shopping cart doesn't play into the perception of the store.

@urazz7739

Ай бұрын

@@Kant3n Exactly, he was touting giving developers/publishers a better percentage of the sales of copies of their games would incentivize customers to buy games on their store. Nope, customers are focused on themselves primarily so when you charge the same as Steam to customers and your storefront/game launcher is crap compared to the competition, don't be surprised when you don't do well.

@BloodwyrmWildheart

Ай бұрын

Relative Privation fallacy.

@domosapien

Ай бұрын

​@urazz7739 This argument doesn't remain consistent, however, in a neutral playing field because what it CANT make up for is tenure. Assume complete neutrality for a moment; Steam exists as it does. EGS, Origin, uPlay suddenly all fix their shit. Carts, forums, reviews, the whole 9. What is differentiating enough to get a user to divert from their large library? They won't. This is why Tim was CORRECT in his initial assertion 4-ish years ago and exactly why the case got re-opened and Apple got clapped on. Whats the alternative to Apple's App store; 50% of the worlds userbase? Basically the only response is "just make your own ecosystem". Yeah, let's tell the small app dev that their only recourse for missing half of the worlds userbase (if you don't agree with Apples terms) is to, ya know, make your own mobile platform and capture a large enough audience to make up for last audience capture by opting out of Apple's service. It's the same argument for Steam. If your game isn't on Steam, and you're an Indie, then you're losing a HUGE chunk of your potential audience capture. "Capitulate or die". I love Steam. I have all my games on Steam. I PREFER Steam over other services. I still use EGS to get SOME exclusive access to early games, but even still - I can acknowledge that Steam's position is for too powerful. The type of 'improvement' that everyone is commenting that other platforms need to implement to be a genuine competitor to Steam? Whatever it is, it doesn't exist yet because we've already seen that timed exclusives and better margins for devs didn't convince players. This is exclusively a PC market issue because the PC market never dealt in exclusivities - only consoles did. It's why exclusives don't work on PC to change hearts and minds of consumers. So I pose the question to you: what is an actual tangible change that a platform could make to reach Steam's success and become as appealing/necessary to devs? Steams strength comes from its live-or-die necessity for small devs. Theres no alternative, and thats a problem.

@bobpage2374

Ай бұрын

Not exactly. Steam is in the monopolist position, or is "immune to competition", as it was put in the video. And law makers try to change that. Basically, most of the anti-monopoly law is about making some stuff forbidden for big players, while at the same time encouraging it for the small players. Like Epic's exclusivity deals are fine because it promotes competition and let's small player enter the market. But if Steam tried the same thing it would be "monopolistic practices" becauses it would make it harder for new players to compete on the market. There is nothing "fair" about it, it's there to avoid monopolies. And that's good.

I'm sorry but steam is the biggest market share because it has the best functionality that devs and players alike want their games to be on the platform. As soon as Epic, GoG or whoever add all the features steam provides and (most importantly) don't charge players to use it. Maybe people will use it. Steam is currently the only ones keeping the likes of EA and Ubisoft in check. If we didn't have steam, do you really think EA would make a platform that benefits players? We would have ad spam, no friends lists features, or workshop and no sales. Steam just wants steam to remain competitive. Users and devs use steam because its the best service, not because its cheaper service. People waited a year for Metro ang borderlands 3 because EGS sucks ass.

It is only powerful because it is good. The moment they are not longer good they are done.

@vinnythewebsurfer

Ай бұрын

Steam already has a captive audience. You would have to shut down steam itself before people would leave it on their own.

@TheDragonfriday

Ай бұрын

Not just good, if it got too many people to the point competition is impossible look at youtube vs others video platforms... the problem people is not here for youtube but here for whoever they subscribe too Same with same, same got the most games any platform. People here for the games and rather not have multiple lunchers same with people who like youtube do you want multiple apps to watch videos? No we don't

@jimmytwotimez

Ай бұрын

@@TheDragonfriday I liked your post, but which company is "same"

@user-th7cw4dl3o

Ай бұрын

The problem is that developers, cannot offer sales on other platforms, which means you often don't end up getting the cheapest possible option. Like, developers who want to be on Steam are not allowed to sell a cheaper copy on EGS, even if the cost the developer earns would be the same. This behavior causes games to be a) more expensive, and b) Steam to not offer a more competitive deal for developers. GoG is in many ways better than Steam, like for example allowing you to truly own your games, which Steam doesn't, however CDPR cannot sell their games 30% cheaper on the platform they own. They NEED to sell at the prices that they sell on Steam. That's the argument - that you're not getting the best deal, because developers and publishers need to give up price control over their own product, and they are not in a position to truly make an alternative choice. These lawsuits are normal when an industry stagnates, as these monopolistic entities are identified as stagnators of growth.

@spencersharp8155

Ай бұрын

​ @user-th7cw4dl3o You know that only applies to steam keys for the game, not the game itself right? So yes they can sell the game for cheaper on other platforms but not steam keys.

And then some customers have the other problem of steams geo-blocking while the indie developer isn't offering alternatives to the steam downloads.

So why'd you get sued? Steam: I made good choices and organically got people to like what I do. Backwards world, can't win for losing.

@PropaneWP

Ай бұрын

They're not sued because people like them, they're sued because they're dictating the pricing of other games platforms as well as other anti-competitive practices. Why are you guys simping for a corporation?

@viysnjor4811

Ай бұрын

@@PropaneWP How are they "dictating the pricing of other games platforms"? Also what anti-competitive practice? Name one. Steam's competitors aren't bad because Steam is holding them down, they're bad because they just suck at providing a good storefront. In short, it's a skill issue.

@honaleri

Ай бұрын

@@viysnjor4811 They are referring to the fact Steam demands the price of games hosted on Steam to be identical on Steam as everywhere else the game is hosted, or Steam won't accept the game, while Steam simultaneously is the biggest dog on the block. This is considered anticonsumer. But steam does this so they don't get out competed to begin with, with other stores hosting for cheaper. Because of Steams 30% fee, though, this may be forcing publishers to bump up prices in order to host on steam. Thus making steam "dictate" game pricing more than they should. That's a problem Steam could solve by simply removing that clause. Because people will still buy on Steam even if other places sell for cheaper. It's already too dominant to slow down now. I don't think paying UK steam users 44 dollars does anything to solve anything. They'll just buy more games on Steam with it. 🤣 If they want to "protect consumers", demand a change in the clause in order to do business in the UK, and immediately, Steam will comply...(for the uk). lol

@honaleri

Ай бұрын

@@PropaneWP It's called a joke. Sorry you missed it. 🤷🏾‍♂️ Of course, everyone probably watched the video same as you. The comments purpose is to be funny about the topic.

@GameZard

Ай бұрын

@@PropaneWP Are you really this slow or are you pretending?

Epic have failed because their store is shit. No user reviews. No forums. No mods interface. 3 things in order that are absolutely essential and they haven’t bothered. It’s stunningly moronic.

the idea that they want to sue steam for monopoly is just dumb, they have plenty of competition, wtf are they talking about? just because competition utterly fails to get customer or shoot themselves in the foot, that not steam problems, they literally did nothing.

Monopoly laws were brought in to protect the consumer from being screwed, the idea being competition is good for prices, But what if a monopoly is benefitable to the consumer? surely this is against the justification for the law? Case of law being more important than justice.

the statement that you cant buy and use dlcs from other game stores on steam is so dumb, thats like buying a tshirt in h&m and trying to refund it in cropp

There's a simple solution to all of this. Steam can just stop handing out keys. There! Everything's fair! This is like a busker complaining that you didn't shine the coin before you gave it to them.

They want 8 billion pounds?... That's like 2 tons

@MrBluman999

Ай бұрын

4000 tons actually lol

I haven't seen anywhere in the lawsuit site or any of the links shared that this is about steam keys or being able to sell games that will use steam services at a lower price Where did you find the information that this is about key sellers? The lawsuit talks about rival storefronts not being able to sell for less, which to me sounds like "steam is strongarming (some) publishers into price parity with other storefronts" and not "key sellers can't skip the 30% and use valve's services for free"

@GrohiikVahlokJul

Ай бұрын

If it isn’t about steam keys then they don’t have a case. Steam doesn’t control game prices, only stating that steam key prices can’t be cheaper than on steam. They do let you have some allowances for charity stuff with them though, you just cant make a profit trying to undercut them on their own product. If they try to say it is about game prices they don’t have anything to point to. Their only hope is that in discovery they can find evidence of steam trying to swing that into controlling game prices in general, but steam is at such an advantage that they have no reason to even bother trying that, so it seems unlikely. GOG could sell games for less for example, devs just choose not to, and why would they when the only beneficiary would be GOG, they would be actively cutting into their own profits.

@spencersharp8155

Ай бұрын

I can't speak for everyone but I found out about the steam key part from the youtube channel Pirate Software, did a pretty good video on it.

@elijahaitaok8624

Ай бұрын

Steam, Epic, and GOG can all have games at different price points and sales offers, shiyet Epic you can give games away for free, all at the same time, so this lawsuit has no leg to stand on

in simple words steam platform is a packaged bundle of multiple services, where as the competion in majority mostly is 1 service a store front. its then understand able why it is hard to compet with since they would need add multiple services to be even a competition in the first place.

@qryvein

Ай бұрын

ther are cases when the some competitors have more services, but even then it is less services offered, then what is included in steam platform packaged bundle of multiple services.

This isn't the first time Valve has been pulled in line by western governments. The ACCC, an Australian consumer protection agency, took Valve to court and won due to their breach of Australian consumer laws in regards to refunds. As a result to that the easy refund policy was setup worldwide.

@MonsieurDeVeteran

Ай бұрын

Aaand because of that we lost Flash Sales, which were the biggest and greatest sales Steam had... geeyeez AU guv, tyvm /s

@DePhoegonIsle

Ай бұрын

That's literally not in the same class of thing. Tell me, what would change to make others more competitive?

@admiralkaede

Ай бұрын

this case isnt the same though its unright to expect a company to allow u to use steams servers for free without giving anything back

@Assimandeli

26 күн бұрын

@@MonsieurDeVeteran imagine crying about a refund system in a store

They have no actual merit to sue Steam. It'll just get dismissed. Their point of contention is that Steam doesn't allow people to sell games on other platforms at a lower price, which is wrong. They don't allow you to sell steam keys on other platforms for a lower price.

@IncognitoActivado

Ай бұрын

Steam sucks anyway, soo...

@EthanBB

Ай бұрын

Good to see at least some people actually red the developer agreement and are not just spreading the misunderstood version.

@nom6758

Ай бұрын

@@IncognitoActivado said no one with a functioning brain.

@melonelon7590

Ай бұрын

@@IncognitoActivado EGS fanboy spotted. Also if you think that I am a steam fanboy then you are wrong. I just use steam because they have better customer services unlike others like EGS.

@IncognitoActivado

Ай бұрын

@@melonelon7590 Whatever you say, Valve/Gabe fanatic.

From my perspective it doesn't seem like steam is too big to be beaten by competitors it's just the fact that the competitors don't even try

@ValenNoxFallenscythe

24 күн бұрын

It is, bro, it is. Steam is backed up by the entire PC gaming community. No one in the PC community wants or needs any other platform. If something isn't broken, no need to fix it.

Mind you, this lawsuit was not and will never not be in the benifit of those gamers. Its "in the name of..." for merely the cause, and the cause only. Steam is an amazing platform that is consumer first. This lawsuit, imo, has to be funded by big game companies, theres no way about it.

So, in other words, companies are mad that they're not willing to be pro consumer like steam so, instead of creating a service worth using, they want to destroy the actual good service? Ok...

Steam is successful because people are happy with it, Its no anti consumer when the consumer chooses you.

@BloodwyrmWildheart

Ай бұрын

"people are happy with it" The forums say otherwise.

@Xport9

Ай бұрын

@@BloodwyrmWildheart 🙄🙄🙄

@BloodwyrmWildheart

Ай бұрын

@@Xport9 No rebuttal, as expected.

@lycanwarrior2137

Ай бұрын

Apple, Netflix, and Amazon fanboys say the same thing just FYI. So Steam/Valve aren't exactly "special" in any regard.

If they sell the keys off steam, steam still have to pay the bandwidth etc. They can sell whatever other versions on other stores, but if they sell the game with a steam key, then they have to offer steam users the discount.. Steam is not just a game store, its also a service, a forum, a news outlet, a hardware manufacturer etc., its not perfect but it is way better than pretty much every other store out there.

Steam is a distributer, the weakness of the lawsuit would come from if steam allows a developer to price thier game differently on other stores so long as its not using any part of the steam distribution network. I've heard conflicting things on this, but I do believe that particular policy is steam keys can't be sold consistantly foe less than the steam store version, but if you have a different distributor, e.g. Epic, you could price it how you please. If that isnt the case then that is the most likely outcome of the lawsuite.

Love that BBC used a picture of Baezel😂

Nothing is on the line.... "the UK hurt itself in confusion."

we paying more?what are we paying more?BG3 on PC was 60$ on consoles was 70$ and same with 95% of the games that are comming out on top of that Valve is giving us so many Sales Events and y they are getting 30% of the totall sells ravenue of X game but so does EGS/Sony/MS and every other publisher tho the big diference is that Valve ain't locking games for other to enjoy like EGS does

Sooo...happy summer sale...?

Valve/Steam has done nothing but drive indie visibility down since they shifted their algorithm/fee tiers toward AA/AAA publishers in 2018. The idea that indies should be grateful for their 70% cut because Valve has effectively eliminated all other alternatives is ludicrous. The top 100 games on Steam generate 91% of the platform's revenue. 61% of revenues are driven by the top 10 alone. Guess how many of these games were created by small indie devs.

@sivasankar2784

28 күн бұрын

90% of the indie games are shit but the rest actually top the charts even beating most of AAA titles. If the game is good, gamers are ready to literally throw money at the game

@KeinNiemand

26 күн бұрын

@@sivasankar2784 While that's true for a lot of great indie games I'm sure that there are a bunch of hidden gems hidden beneth all the crapmthat is never shown anywhere near the top

If people don't have standing when it comes to speech on the internet, then why could they be harmed by a business on the internet?

You can make a game and sell it by your own! Maybe sell 1000 copies... or go with steam and sell 100.000 or a million, 100% of 1000 copies sold? or 70% of 100.000 copies sold? You can do whatever you want as developer.

But loot crates are A OK!

@BloodwyrmWildheart

Ай бұрын

They'll defend Valve no matter what. Bots.

@admiralkaede

Ай бұрын

dont buy them if u dont like them FFS they are ok do u even play CS2 or games with them

@ssStolengrad

Ай бұрын

YOU the consumer is at fault for normalizing loot crates. I have never bought loot crates and neither should anyone of you. Steam is the best platform for buying video games despite loot crates.

@admiralkaede

Ай бұрын

@@ssStolengrad actually i plan on buying some for CS2

@BloodwyrmWildheart

Ай бұрын

@@ssStolengrad What makes you think he bought them? Stop simping for megacorpos.

People have known steam does that and they still support them.

no Steam is above fire, thats how steam works! The fire goes below... ☁

Victoria Shockbolt - why we can't have nice things... Some people really lack common sense, if a thing is good, don't ruin it, even if you legally can.

Main takeaway from this - those suing do not deserve your business.

After watching Pirate Softwares video on this revently, I see another apology video coming soon. The whole "you cant have different prices on other stores" bit is apparently an absolute LIE. its about selling STEAM KEYS on other sites, not about selling your game on other platforms.

@Ceece20

Ай бұрын

Yeah, if you are selling games on other place without using Steam Keys, there’s nothing wrong with using a different price. But if you are using Steam keys specifically? Yeah that’s using Steam. If you use Steam, it has to be the same price while on Steam. Otherwise people could just game the refund system.

@MAup

Ай бұрын

Saw this too, I really hope they disasemble the lawsuit. As Thor said, if you want to compete against Steam, then make a storefront that is better.

@BellularNews

Ай бұрын

Uh.. I literally read that out in the video?

@LumpinLoaf

Ай бұрын

Yeah I thought Pirate went over this pretty well, now while Pirate might be wrong he has seemed pretty good about trying to do research before posting and I might be mistaken but I feel like this is the second/3rd time recently Bellular has had some bad reporting/takes (I unfortunately don't have specific references). Makes me watch this channel less and less

@jamesf3881

Ай бұрын

​@@BellularNews 4:01

Pirate software's Thor has a take on this and I'm gonna go ahead and think this gets dropped cause steam isn't doing anything wrong other platforms refuse to do it better.

Steam take 0% cut from Steam keys sold from other stores. Only thing they ask in return is that you do not give a better deal outside steam since steam will have to handle all the bandwidth from downloading game etc.

"changing things to allow for new opportunities" is such a nauseatingly innocent way to look at it. If it wasn't about "hitting the only nail daring to stand out by being good" it wouldn't be looking to fleece Valve, it would be about helping competition. I tire of listing my experiences, but I have done business DIRECTLY with every other "major" launcher/distributor service(-gog, I'll get there eventually), most of them fatigued me with problems, the others simply failed to provide games of interest. It's so twisted that of all the fields that could get their balls in a vice to be more "consumer oriented" people are acting against the one guy who's been "doing nothing" and winning for decades. For "some reason" these people think that a wrecking ball will help build good business, honey you need to actually BUILD something worth a damn to offer competition, not wreck the only success story.

I feel like Steam could concede the policy of not being able to sell your game cheaper elsewhere and still win overall because Steam.

9:55 But they failed because they build a shit product. They put the money not into a better service for the customers, instead they bought games exclusively so if you want to play them you need to buy the Games from them. It's like with if you want to build a new streaming services, instead of building a good service you just bought up the next GoT to be on your streaming Service that only can stream in 720p, buffers every 2 seconds and you can't skip the Intro.

@christonchev9762

Ай бұрын

y its like PS wanting PC gamers to move to the console,ain't happening so u bring your games to that X platform or u can keep them but u won't get paid

Epic Games had a decent shot. Too bad they gave up on making an actual good launcher and store front and just focused on the games and developer benefits. Which is good, but not everything

@ACMaNNeN99

Ай бұрын

Its just as slow and tedious to use as it was 4 years ago

@Kant3n

Ай бұрын

"Benefits" otherwise known as customer punishment.

@charlesfuzak

Ай бұрын

It's crazy how hard they go on the developer side while stepping all over the customer. No user reviews? Fat paid exclusivity? Great for developers but not so great for people actually buying games.

this is confusing, I thought they were suing because steam put the brakes on things like Metro Exodus being cheaper on epic than on steam, but making this about steam keys will go nowhere.

wouldn't it be nice if we could move our game licence to another platform? being locked to a single platform is problematic if you lose access to Steam.

Unlike Apple and Sony, steam does nothing to stop someone from buying a game on a different storefront. How is it their fault that no one else providing a product/service that can attract users?

Leads in like an Austin Powers threat...😂

from a user, dev and publisher perspectiv the reason why competion had failed is in all that data missing. meaning reason they failed. main cause is check what is included in steam platform and what services did the competition offer, in many cases the competition just offer bare minimum that lack what steam users, dev and publisher are used too. this in it self is a reason why majority of users, dev and publishers will keep useing steam.

still always better to have a hard copy over the digital files someone else can remove access to...

From your explanation it does sound like Valve has been doing some at the very least anti-developer stuff (meaning indies, I don't give a fuck about AAA devs) and those things have most likely been anti-consumer too. So all in all this is a good thing as we should hold all huge companies to account, as all they want is money.

In general, most clauses that state you can't sell your product cheaper is effectively price fixing. That said, if this applies only to steam keys sold off of Steam and not copies of the game that are completely distributed elsewhere, such as through GoG or their own site, I'd say it is at least fair since you are still using Steam's platform for that copy of the game you are selling.

Steam loses money on every key sold outside their store. Developers can generate and sell Steam Keys for free, while Steam takes 0% of the sales and provides the infrastructure to distribute and maintain the game for free. They won't allow the keys to be sold for more or less because then they'll be at risk of losing customers to a competitor while being on the hook for the games distribution. Essentially, losing money on every step. If the pricing matches across the board, customers are far more likely to stay on Steam and buy from them instead of another site abusing Steams infrastructure. They also require the developers to treat Steam users similarly to how they would treat users on other storefonts. This includes having similar pricing and sales as seen on other stores, which I assume is what a lot of these lawsuits are about. If you're game is $10 on Epic, It has to be $10 on Steam. If it's $50 on PlayStaion, it has to be $50 on Steam. $100 on Xbox, same for Steam. This is to stop people from adding a "Steam Tax" onto a game sold on Steam. Which could be abused to make up for the 30% cut and maliciously push Steam users to sites, like Epic, that would have then been selling the game for cheaper or at the games original price.

In Poland its a little different, here somone prove that Steam did not update currency exchange calculator which srewed deveopers and gamers.

I am going to try to stay unbiased in this, I do see both sides, and I feel like there is one issue I've always had with Steam, though it's not even the thing they're going for. They're not seeing the full picture, and I do think Steam is on solid footing for winning this. My own two bits are, the very nature of Steam incentivizes continuing to make purchases from the same platform, so that all your owned games are in the same place; however, my fear was always that if something happened to Steam, suddenly I no longer have access to those purchases. But... Of late, there has been a growing trend in another area that has changed my outlook on this: the growing number of streaming services. These days, if you want to watch three different shows, chances are you will need three different streaming services to do so. 'Competition' is impossible in this market, as almost every show is in a proprietary service, and cannot be accessed with any other. This has created a very anti-consumer landscape where you either have to choose only one product or pay for multiples, and they know you're going to pay, because they're the only ones with it. What Steam is doing is the complete opposite. By creating a free marketplace that allows consolidation of every product in one place, without restricting those products from being sold elsewhere--which Steam does not restrict or challenge the price of in general, the only price limiting is towards their own keys that use their resources to host and distribute the game-- Steam has effectively kept the PC gaming market from becoming a proprietary mess of requiring dozens of different services, some perhaps even payed just for access to their products. It doesn't discourage competition; there simply hasn't been any proper attempt made by potential competitors to offer the same end product of this free market structure with built in advertising, often attempting to go the proprietary route with their games. However, I also understand that having a monopoly in any market is bad for its health. In this case, however, the specifics of the product itself needs to be taken into consideration. If Steam were distributing a perishible or consumable product, then everyone coming to one place for repeated purchases could be extremely bad for competition; but these mediums are in most cases, neither. They are a singular purchase, and most of the time that is that, you then own the game and can access it at any time. No matter how many hours you then put into the game, Steam does not earn any more revenue, as it is not a medium that can be consumed to the point you need to purchase more. Some might play one game, and decide to never get one again, or if they do want a different game, they might decide to get it from the developers directly, which is far more common then one might think. There are games I have purchased that way, some of which I've probably forgotten about and don't even remember I own, simply because they were un-installed. Which brings me to my final point. Competition in the gaming market would probably be for the better, but it comes at a higher risk of loss for consumers, whether through forgetfulness, said competition driving others out of business--causing for the consumer a loss of a product through no fault or want of their own--or competitors allowing for more proprietary content with a premium payed just for access, which as I previously stated is perhaps the most daunting difficulty yet in long term economic impact. Tl;dr while there is some merit to looking into Steam for having such a large share of the market, in this case it is not so simple as forcing competition, as due to the nature of digital media, forcing any downsizing of the current market to allow competition would do more harm to consumers then good, due to the potential loss of data involved.

as steam restricts the things you can do on steam as long as you do not pay steam or buy games over their store worth at least 5 usd, it is possible that this case does end up costing valve some money or those restrictions. another thing is the closing of steam workshop mods to people owning games not through steam (you have to buy another copy of games on steam now, after years of it not being necessary), that too is something that might get added against valve. than the blatant copies of other games, that financially perform better because those pirate devs pay valve for better placements in the store. not implementing measures to keep minors out of the adult gaming section and instead geoblocking that section for people from countries that require such a thing, blocking people from those countries who own a key for such a game from anything other than playing the already activated game, no forums (and thus often no possibility to reach out to the devs for reporting bugs), no store page, no workshop, etc. there is enough ammunition in terms of anti consumer and bad monopolist behaviour that can be used against them. the question is: will it?

You can’t convince me that this isn’t all about money in the primary county

Its funny hearing that so many companies are complaining about Steam making sure the customer is the focus first. Its the only reason why they're in this lawsuit now. And when it comes to the many PC storefronts failing you have to really look at how they even have their storefronts and/or launchers were made, I still remember the worst one being EA with ubisoft taking that spot now. Why? because of the many problems with it, connecting to friends or even trying to buy games. People go to steam to actually have a good time connecting to people and playing games, Not getting a service error because EA play somehow shat the bed. And that also goes for Epic's launcher because it was bare bones, sure steam was but it still got fixed and updated over time to make sure everything was working, they heard their users' complaints and adapted to what the users wanted, not their shareholders. Epic in this case can only answer with piles of money because they can while asking for a small percentage while steam can go with a 30% because they know their consumers will buy and if its on discount, will cover the cost somehow.

crazy what can happen when u actually give consumers what they want...

Meanwhile Gaben browsing the net searching for a new yacht to buy from the money he's going to make by winning this lawsuit.

If only the EGS actually competes with Steam and not drop the ball in more ways than one

I don't really have a problem with steam here, because instead of forcing the steam price to be higher they force it to be comparable/equal. Thus shifting from competing on price to competing on service. Yes, they turn the fight into one where they have the advantage. But not one where artificially give their opponents a monetary disadvantage. All their competition has to do is take a similar 30% cut and use that to provide an equal or better service, sounds easy doesn't it? XD Literally Valve is not the one stopping the competition here....

Honestly, PC game pricing is fine for me, I'm not sure it's directly unfair to the consumer, but they take too bigger cut from smaller devs.

It's very easy to compete with steam, add achievements for all games, add public customizable profiles, add a player based marketplace OR a mod workshop and don't be a cock sucker when it comes to refunds. It's really that easy but they would rather hire idiots that want to put stupid shit and gimmicks on their launcher instead of just listening to people. Hell I have an idea that might bring people in, let us gift our already bought games to a friend thus transferring the key to them and off our account. It really is that simple to come up with competitive ideas.

@deuswulf6193

Ай бұрын

Nope. You don't understand the real issue. All those "features" you mention are just lip service. The issue is that valve has worked to get people invested in huge libraries on steam, and when you are already invested at that point, change is unlikely to happen. The competitors could be exact copies of Steam and it wouldn't matter because of the investment component. Btw most people don't care about achievements in games, and the competitors do have them however it is up to the developer, not the platform to make them. Profiles are silly unless you want it to be a social media platform, and that is effectively what Valve did which increases investment. Workshop? Steam's workshop is objectively bad. Most games don't even use it. Many developers opt to rely either entirely on nexus or have their own mod managers. Refunds? The only reason Steam has them is because the EU's consumer protection directives forced them to add that feature. Competing platforms that gain popularity in the EU will face the same challenge. Gifting games to friends, lending, trading, selling...etc that was normal before Steam came along. PC Games were no different than consoles, as long as you had the disc and often times the accompanying key, it was transferable. Valve worked hard to take that away, I doubt they will go back on that unless the courts order them to do so.

@CatOnALaptop

Ай бұрын

​@@deuswulf6193 Everything I said was baseline for Steam and should be the baseline for a competitor, these are things you need if you even want to think about pulling someone from a well established software. I don't think you understand how much money Steam and community members make from profile fuzz, it's useless garbage but people are paying 10$, 20$, 50$ hell sometimes even hundreds of dollars for a stupid recolor so they can match their background or even thousands of dollars when it comes to profile levels. Plus Steam is basically a social media outlet in it's own ecosystem, from DMs, profile comments, custom emojis and pfp based from various games (and you can upload your own put people still opt to buy them a lot of the time) and friends lists and people use most of these features almost 100% of the time when on Steam. That's just talking one subsection of the store, all that "lip service" makes them a pretty penny in profits. A lot of people enjoy hunting achievements, this has been a thing for the longest time, there's even websites dedicated to hosting achievements for old games now that were never made with them in mind. People love the concept of getting something for doing something challenging which is why contrary to what you say a lot of people enjoy them (there's a whole subsection of gaming dedicated to it which is why almost all steam games come with them, the devs understand its just another selling point to a lot people) and that's not even getting into the card system Steam has which loops into their store and at the end of the day also brings in profits for Steam and the community. The workshop is a very big part of Steam and just because the games YOU play don't utilize it doesn't mean many other games don't, it's far more user friendly then just using nexus and a lot of devs understand that its another tool to keep people around, so why not allow the community the tools to do it. Refunds should be something that is just a thing that is by default and not something that is argues and annoying, yes you can get a refund on Epic/Ubisoft ect but it takes forever and the support you have to go thought sucks ass, no one has beat Steams direction when it comes to refunds yet in my experience. Also, lastly, why the hell did you bring up discs? 99% of prebuilt computers don't come with a disc tray and even more companies don't make PC game discs anymore. That age is far gone now and is never coming back no matter how much people wish it would. It's all just software, which is why it was a general idea for a COMPETITOR to allow game transfers between accounts to draw in people, it could be their gimmick, not Steam. Just because YOU and YOU alone find something useless and stupid doesn't mean hundreds of thousands of other people find it just as useless. You seem to see things in a very 'matter of fact' kind of way and that's great when you aren't dealing with real people but when you add in that element, things that would make no sense or are just stupid to use becomes used a lot, just because they can.

So if a company has you secure the product on their store then release in EU you need to make it unsafe distribution and be open to viruses and corruption

Moving to online provided games was a mistake. All of the poor practices in PC gaming rely on you being online. It's too bad we can't undo that, because gaming is not the better for it.

@lycanwarrior2137

Ай бұрын

And Valve/Steam was the pioneer in this. I still remember the days of going into a store to browse the physical PC box games.

I hope they are sued for everything they are worth. They are largely why PC lost physical game sales. Then they banned my account for “cheating” because I installed a mod allowing a game to connect to my implant hearing aid and I lost over 1k games. They always replied to emails for troubleshooting until they ban you then it’s like they put your email in a different list and never reply again. I don’t think people realize how close they are at any time to losing all their games

@ForOne814

Ай бұрын

No one wants physical sales, no one buys them.

why are people always talking about steam vs epic when GOG is giving an actual competition?

Damn, the brits are angry Damn bri'ish

@matthewgubbins8515

Ай бұрын

It's know too happen from time to time

@Cartoonman154

Ай бұрын

1 digital rights campaigner is annoyed, not the government.

@niallrussell7184

Ай бұрын

@@Cartoonman154 yeah its a total non issue.. didn't need this video.

*This just makes me respect Steam more. Any pc games i get from Steam, and will continue to.*

It's a bit rich that a LLP is bringing such a case. They clearly only care about themselves and not gamers.

No. Its not more powerful. Its just accessible for people, compared to everyone else having stores that don't work

"global youth led social enterprise" that's a very big name for lobbyist.

I would like to buy my games somewhere else than steam but their shop features is light years ahead from other shops. The fact that u can't sell ur steam key for a lower price on other website is the same as amazon, teemu, and most commercial centers. They all have some rules on pricing when u sell ur product on their store. I've sold products on web shops and regular shop and they all have some rules about pricing of ur product. This story is just a lawyer firm trying to get more money for them and their clients.

Imagine getting sued because your competition sucks so hard.

One way to talk about this is digital feudalism. Consumers and developers can do what they like as long as Steam the landlord gets paid. In a market economy, essential services like the PC marketplace cannot be allowed to interfere with commerce. Because of the value of Steam, regulator cannot wait until management decides to be overtly manipulative and greedy.

Steam is literally better because we don't want any other (yet)

When any other PC selling platform adds such in-depth community functionality as steam has, I'll switch. I have yet to see it. The Xbox PC app is awful, Epic Games desktop app is awful, GOG is a great storefront but I don't see it taking steam's place. I don't see a problem personally

They dont have do exclusive contracts, they don't fight anyone over games, they offer easy refunds THEY JUST LET CONSUMERS CHOOSE.

@deuswulf6193

Ай бұрын

They don't have to offer exclusivity deals (aka better terms for the developer or publisher) because they already control the market. When they just got started, they were offering good terms to publishers and even signed an exclusivity deal with popular Darwinia game. They even demanded the developers remove the game and demo from their own website's storefront. You forget that the only reason Steam offers refunds... is because they were forced to as a result of the European Union’s Consumer Rights Directive. Valve fought tooth and nail against this directive. Let's not pretend Valve offered refunds out of the goodness of their heart, ok?

Steam is dominate in the market because it doesn't do shitty stunts like adding fee's and stupid shit to milk the customer base.

The Steam clause in question locks Epic out of the biggest lever they can pull which is pricing competition. As for “Epic failed”, we’ll see how long they keep pushing. If the UK thing goes through, we might see the clause dropped and other, lower overhead, platforms can suddenly compete on price. Steam adds a 43% tax, so there’s plenty of wiggle room in the market.

i wonder why they dont sue valve for gambling. Counter Strike and a whole market for gambling addiction is totally forgotten.why is that?

piratesoftware did a small talk about this lawsuit and described how it's a horrible frivolous lawsuit and makes no sense and will just fall apart as the slightest piece of scrutiny.

@MagicManICT

Ай бұрын

Looked it up off the Discord. It was the stream dated 18 June, 2024. Timestamp of the TTS that started it is 3h50m29s. Not sure if BellularNews allows links in their community discussion, so people will just have to manually look it up. I think Thor did a much better job answering it, and went into who is bringing the lawsuit after being prompted by the chat to check on the person running it.

So many players don't trust EPIC and EPIC trys hard to reenforce that every year.

So, the TLDR are like : Steam : "You can sell your game outside of the steam with steam keys but you need to match the pricing on your steam page or make a better deal and appeal to us" Dev : "Why should I?" Steam : "So that you can still make more money outside and the customers can still use all of our services for the game" Customers : "Hmm... Make sense" Other company : "No, you can't control the outside pricing. That's illegal"

So when a business is bad for the customer they get chased after by the law and when they're good they get chased after by the law. they just want it both ways don't they.