I have been watching your reviews for over a year on the Forester Wilderness and Bronco Sport, since I was looking to replace my old Jeep. I actually couldn't make up my mind until I saw how the Forester really tackled various conditions with ease and yet came in at a lower price point (even with the package that give you heated seats, better speakers and power lift gate) than the Toyota or Bronco Sport mid-trim. I just bought the Forester Wilderness and I am absolutely loving it. Thank your for all your reviews!

@ericchin739

9 ай бұрын

Solid choice! I'm on my second Subaru in a row. I'll never own another brand of car.

@ledzep3692

8 ай бұрын

I Agree 👍...Mine will be arriving in two weeks.

@MiriamBoldyreva

7 ай бұрын

Subaru Forester Wilderness the best👍🏼

@ashleykeeney6489

7 ай бұрын

And, its gorgeous

@user-yi6td6fu2g

7 ай бұрын

remember as long as you maintain the subaru it will never fail you, i know people who have 300plus k on the speedo and never had any major issues, just do your maintenance and it will last you a very very long time, i bought a 16yr old forester gave it a tune up and years later still no issue thank God. enjoy in good health

I love how hard Ryan works to make it up the course. I think many other testers would have thrown in the towel. I am impressed how well both vehicles performed.

@formanaliuzdenoff6323

Жыл бұрын

Ryan real show man))) He needs bigger show ..but dont forget about Nickki..alright?))

@wildbill23c

Жыл бұрын

The other "testers" would have stopped as soon as they spun a tire. Course a certain group of testers are blacklisted by Subaru, which is great as they can't do a fair review to save their lives anyways....Ryan does such a great job in his real world reviews.

@mrvwbug4423

Жыл бұрын

@@wildbill23c They got blacklisted for damaging an Outback press car, because the route to their old off road test hill has a section that will pinstripe any vehicle. They finally opted to buy a piece of land and construct an off road course.

@sarunassurvila7857

Жыл бұрын

The guy used all the momentum with Subaru and none with the RAV4

@formanaliuzdenoff6323

Жыл бұрын

@@sarunassurvila7857 toyota fans see momentum at subaru but i see how careful about toyota they are)

This is more of a tire test. They didn’t seem to have a clearance problem and they didn’t run out of power, as they were still turning over the tires. And yes I know you said you can’t change tires. But both would be so much more capable, for test purposes, with a more aggressive tire. Great video and thanks for making them

@imblackmagic1209

10 ай бұрын

so much this, I've seen another channel do tests on tires, 4x4 with all terrains vs 4x2 with snow tires, 4x2 on snow tires killed the 4x4, tires are what makes or break traction, of you have the wrong tires, then any amount of tech and power a vehicle has doesn't matter

@somestuffithoughtyoumightl6985

9 ай бұрын

That’s why I put real WildPeaks on my Outback Can’t wait to test them out!

@paulholterhaus7084

9 ай бұрын

AND Why I put DMV2's on Year round.............Paul

@neildeatherage2269

8 ай бұрын

@@imblackmagic1209 Absolutely well said. If anyone reading this needs new tires and your ride can accept Mich. Cross Climate 2, couldn't recommend this tire enough such a game changer

@steve8803

6 ай бұрын

@@neildeatherage2269 yes, tires certainly matter. With equal tires, the Subaru is far superior in these tests.

As a Forester owner, all I can say is: thank you for doing this for us. It's nice to know what it can do! Thank you.

@MsJamesnorton

Ай бұрын

Yeah getting dug out it sure helped it look better

By far the most fair and realistic reviews on KZread.

@WontSeeReplies

Жыл бұрын

…without the same tires on each? Not suggesting a Toyota is good off-road. They aren’t good for much beyond getting groceries. Still an unfair test anytime the tires are different, unless the manufacturers request it.

@dennissmith7214

Жыл бұрын

@@WontSeeReplies Yes and no, run what you brung is the one way to look at it because that’s how they come from the factory but to say one system or vehicle is better without putting the same tires on is unfair…….you can have a better system overall and if a manufacturer gets a “deal” or is has a relationship wit one tire manufacturer it could hamper a better system because of it. I would like to see a channel actually test with the same tires to see which vehicles are best in these situations be after that first set of tires most people don’t get what the manufacturer sends it out with! 🤔🤷🏽‍♂️

@tlingiter

Жыл бұрын

@@WontSeeReplies tires are everything. Wouldn't hurt to have a good driver either lol

@kylehurlbrink

Жыл бұрын

Should have swapped and had the rav4 run first on the second test.

@formanaliuzdenoff6323

Жыл бұрын

Absolutley

I picked the 22 Forester Wilderness over the Toyota. Great visibility all around.

@mrvwbug4423

Жыл бұрын

Yeah, if they were the same price I would get the RAV4 every time, but with with the Forester being $7k cheaper, I would definitely lean towards the Forester because the RAV4 isn't $7000 better.

@billricheter5678

Жыл бұрын

@@mrvwbug4423 I think the rav 4 is overpriced and not that well built

@rickeycooley9139

Жыл бұрын

@@mrvwbug4423l don’t know?

@devil2jz500

Жыл бұрын

Until it blows a head gasket or the CVT transmission 😂

@gulammohiddin5747

Жыл бұрын

@@mrvwbug4423 I think the 7k difference is actually justified if you look at the reliability of the Toyotas. Toyotas are more reliable than Subarus for sure. Subaru's boxer engines are prone to head gasket failures and servicing them is expensive when the moment arrives.

As a 2020 rav4 TRD owner..I’m always biting my nails with these reviews. 😅 This is by far the best car/suv review channel in KZread! Keep it up!

Its surprising to me how well these 2 did, especially considering inadequate tires. Amazing performance, fantastic driving. I am impressed how well both vehicles performed.

I'm on my fourth Subaru, but have respect for Toyota. Grandaughter has a new Rav 4 with Gramps's approval.

@trailmonstah1892

Жыл бұрын

Get over yourself. Your granddaughter def smarter than you for picking a YOTA 😂

@brucey5585

Жыл бұрын

Toyota only made it because they stole subaru awd tech when they own 30% of subaru. Notice how toyota suddenly have all cars awd and not using their old reliable awd system like the 4runner and land cruiser.

@warweaponx6629

Жыл бұрын

You’d still be on your first Toyota if you’d have bought one.

@iffykidmn8170

Жыл бұрын

@@warweaponx6629 👍

@coryducey2650

Жыл бұрын

I generally lease because hey...new car smell more frequently 😜😜. My 4th Toyota and on my second Rav4 LE AWD. Great winter car. Running Blizzaks and no issue in the winter.

That was probably your most exciting video yet. You really put both to their limit. Good job.

@formanaliuzdenoff6323

Жыл бұрын

Great comm.but I think all these guys do an extremely qualitive and very presize..I cant find anything like this on whole grid exept"Grand Tour" and its already closed,and different budgets there..))

@TinLeadHammer

Жыл бұрын

What is exciting about two vehicles in all-season tires polishing a snowy mountain road? Ok, we know that both vehicles can transfer power to rear wheels, great. What is next? They were sitting in the snow, helpless. If he put the same snow tires on both vehicles, it could be interesting.

Loved this comparison! The fact both vehicles made it up the hill was awesome. I’m a Subaru fan, so I’ll take the Subaru…but the Toyota is impressive.

@truckerrickakamanowar

8 ай бұрын

I agree. The Rav 4 is no slouch.

@user-yi6td6fu2g

7 ай бұрын

shout out to my brother n sister subaru fans! im a firm believer in subaru, theyve been doing the same exact engine for past 60yrs should tell you something

@toddwanous2356

6 ай бұрын

Great comparison! It would be fun to do it again with Blizzaks on both vehicles.

@fubartotale3389

6 ай бұрын

It better be for 20% more bank.

@jeffreya8329

5 ай бұрын

The rav4 is great for soccer moms in the city thats about it

What an awesome review! Enjoyed it till the end... Thank you!!

Thanks for the great video as always, Ryan! I would like to see another competition with the same brands of proper snow tires.

Wow!?!? Awesome video!! Thx for sharing. I got Rav4 SE hybrid last summer and although not the same as the TRD I'm learning a lot from your videos. I don't anticipate driving in conditions like your test being I'm in SoCal I appreciate your insights 👍 Bravo 👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽

Love your channel. You're not scared of saying what you think of things which is very refreshing. One thing that is frustrating to me on all vehicle reviews is comparing them. If you want to test tires, put them on the same spec vehicles. You want to test AWD or 4-wheel drive systems, put the same tires on both. I don't care what the stock tires compare like. I want to know if I throw snow tires on the Subaru and the Toyota, which is going to perform better. You can put any tires on any vehicle so I want to know which traction system will work the best on what tire I decide to change it to. Just my 2 cents.

@mesabman

3 ай бұрын

I totally agree with you because if you have different tires on the vehicles being compared, it will never be a fair comparison.

Awesome review as always! LOVE my Primitive skid plates on my Outback!

I have a colleague who strapped proper winter studded Nokian Normans on the Wilderness. This thing can follow my Wrangler absolutely anywhere in light to medium difficulty trails. We struggle finding country trails where the Subie can’t make it. Impressive car. A tad thirsty, however.

I really appreciate all the effort you put in for these videos Ryan!! Always a fan. Keep up the good work man👌👌

Great video. I appreciate seeing how well the snow mode works on the Rav4. My only real complaint about the Rav4, since the tires can be easily changed, is the lack of tow points. It makes no sense at all and I'm struggling to find a solution that won't likely damage a front or rear bumper cover as you'll likely need to strap to a suspension component for recovery and the angle of the recovery strap will pull into one of those covers. Anybody have a good solution to adding recover points?

I already own a Toyota and from snow country. I was interested in how the Subaru did in the snow and how it stacked up to the Toyota. My choice is still a Toyota but I really enjoyed the different performance of each vehicle. Well done. Both vehicles are very good and their performance is superb. Thank you for this informative demo!

I love these Forester Wilderness videos and your videos are so much better than TFL. Keep up the good work! 😎

@BowmanOverland

Жыл бұрын

Dude TFL is a bunch of tools. #sorrynotsorry. Ryan is so far above them on every level

@rstefoni

Жыл бұрын

So spot-on comment. TFL was great

@TheBabadush

Жыл бұрын

It’s not hard to be better than tfl.

@gmac8852

Жыл бұрын

Tfl is crunchy. They suck

@jkid4855

Жыл бұрын

TFL is biased against Subaru. Ryan is not biased toward a brand. That's the difference. Plus Ryan is much less annoying.

Man, I love this channel! Watching this video for the 2nd time. It awesome you don't give up easily, push cars to their limits without breaking them. I learn so much! Thank you!

Your channel is the reason I bought my Forester sport back in 2021. I have 0 regrets with my choice. I live in the mountains where it snows a lot and I have no issues getting anywhere. Thanks for the great reviews. I enjoy watching your comparisons with the Forester and other cars.

@Studio89Graphic

Жыл бұрын

We live in Weather Cold ─ Minus -40°F/C sometimes and the Subaru Legacy 1992 Model ─ with less than 1/2 hour plug-in Block-heater it can run on right away; except once it was so cold the Tire went Flat .. then all we had to do was driving to the Station and Pumped new air then since that until now the Winter-tires/Rims replaced/Rotated (Bridgestone Japan Made imported ─ Of Course then the Label Heavy Fuji Industry still was the Trademark of the Subaru Brand. The total cost of Ownership and repairment was like 16-17k Dollars and only some wiring needed to be rewired ─ when we went to the Dealership Subaru to have the Timing-belt changed ─ Original since 1992; The Technician Mechanics said the Timing-belt was older than she was - Oh My G! 😂 😂...

@deller5924

11 ай бұрын

Have you experienced any technical issues with your 2021 Forester? Thank you!

@quantumfzx

11 ай бұрын

@@deller5924 Nope, no technical issues as of yet. Still running strong.

@deller5924

11 ай бұрын

@@quantumfzx Awesome.

@calpolyca

8 ай бұрын

@@quantumfzx Which model Forester did you get? I'd like to get one, but just wondering if the upgrades and price are worth forking out for the Wilderness model vs Premium. Especially if the lower-priced models work just as well in heavily snowed areas. Thanks

My wife & i Just bought a '23 Outback Wilderness due in large to your excellent reviews. We love it. Thanks for your outstanding videos and keep up with your cardio...looks like you're getting quite the workout there. Ha!

I live in Buffalo, NY. I'm on my second RAV4, been driving them for 23 years straight. I can confirm they do well in snow. Even with stock tires. Have yet to get stuck. I even drive them to the Adirondack mountains for hunting trips. :)

@danbeit-halahmi2515

Жыл бұрын

This RAV4 of mine is 2017 model, and my third Toyota car, I live in NY state and we get at times a lot of snow (up to 8 to 10 inch) and if you know a little bit about driving in snow, I never ever needed to shovel or get this car out of anything, put it in AWD and just go...

@roberttompkins9510

11 ай бұрын

Did you have the base model

@Studio89Graphic

5 ай бұрын

With 7,000 USD difference in the Two and Clearance; I would go with the Subaru of any Forester and drive the Subaru for 20 years then buy a brand new Subaru Forester 2025 Japan Made; vs. RAV4 America; with the Interests and/or Capital Gain that we/I have in the Subaru; In fact I could purchase even in 2020 Brand New Forester and then resell the 2020 to get the 2025 Forester Wilderness which will have been completely Changed in Style and Trims and Powers.

A good shovel in the trunk is a must, and, the right tires! Thanks for a good show! 😊 👍

Excellent comparison! I've been looking at both the Rav4 & Forester. Too bad they don't have a demo model to take to the snow to test drive. Thank you for this video. I just purchased the 2024 Forester - I hope it does just as well.

The stock tires on the Forrester Wilderness are beasts. One of the biggest advantages the Wilderness has.

@puffdc

Жыл бұрын

they're actually snow rated, snowflake symbol that is

@SenorGato237

Жыл бұрын

@@puffdc For OEM tires, on something that isn't a Wrangler or Bronco, they're really good.

@gs98999

Жыл бұрын

Snowflake symbol by itself doesn’t mean a ton. Only a slight traction improvement needed to meet that threshold. Huge range exists within tires with snowflake category

@user-ql3ge2us4s

Жыл бұрын

@SFRJ agreed. The rubber is slight more compliant in lower temp and traction is only tested in a straight line.

@WildernessForever

Жыл бұрын

My Wilderness turned over to a thousand miles yesterday. Got stuck driving 70 miles home in a blizzard. Not one mistep from this vehicle. So impressed.

Don't think I caught any discussion about power or lack of power for either model. In your assessment, did each one have enough for this outing? Thanks for posting, your channel is the best!

Solid vids. I enjoy this channel because they just do not do easy "consumer reports" trails when testing their vehicles. This snowy hill would give even Wranglers and 4 Runners a run for their money. Most people wouldn't push their cars even this far. I purchased a Wilderness Outback after seeing it go up against a 4Runner (which I owned) in another vid.

Keep up the good work, great review!!

I bought a FW last year after watching Ryan's deep snow comparisons vs. the Trailhawk. Love the darn thing . . .

@mrvwbug4423

Жыл бұрын

the Compass isn't the real Trailhawk, for that you need the Cherokee or GC, they are the only two Trailhawk models with low range and a locker. The FW won't touch the Cherokee TH in an off road situation

@NudlemanJones

Жыл бұрын

@@mrvwbug4423 Well those models aren't the proper comparisons / competition, are they? I hope you feel real good that you believe the FW would not be able to "touch" such models in off-road situations.

@davidheller7919

Жыл бұрын

@@mrvwbug4423 ...and the Forester isn't meant to! How many more thousands of dollars did you spend on your TH?? $20,000+ MORE for the GC Trailhawk!!! For that much more money I'd get a boat with a trailer.

Great video Ryan. A real world test that stretches these 2 vehicles. They are not 4Runners or Wranglers, but it's good to know they'll work well in the snow belt as an excellent all-around vehicle.

@The-wd40

7 ай бұрын

Go cry with you awesome Toyota’s

Tires make a huge difference. I have a 2020 WRX that came with summer tires, I had to drive on them through a very light snow, and it was like driving on ice. As soon as I switched to winter tires the difference was dramatic. There was traction in snow, and on mixed snow and ice.

@Brian-um9zz

Жыл бұрын

live in CO and you will know the diff...

Loved it! Best SUV comparison video ever.

It's a shame the forester wilderness didn't get the same engine as the outback

@Mpompi315.

Жыл бұрын

So true.

@Kiss__Kiss

Жыл бұрын

Exactly, Otherwise I would have purchased one.. In a flash!!!

@onedankind

Жыл бұрын

@@Kiss__Kiss To be fair. It would probably increase the price by 10% or more. So maybe it's alright they didn't. An option would be nice. Especially for those at high altitude. That turbo would really help.

@Kiss__Kiss

Жыл бұрын

@@onedankind Even at only 10% more of a cost, I still would have purchased one.

@kpcasey

Жыл бұрын

Rav4 has about 20 more HP, 10 more tq than the WIlderness. Add in the comfy stuff, and the 10 extra Cu Ft of room behind 2nd row, is it worth the $6k extra?

Forester for me... I wish it had more HP/faster acceleration on the road, but it works wonders off road

@huntstyle

Жыл бұрын

Anxious to see what they bring in '24. I've read that it'll be a new generation.

@WildernessForever

Жыл бұрын

And does just fine as far as acceleration . It's not a freaking Corvette.

@Ricksnet2008

Жыл бұрын

@@WildernessForever Yes a Forester with 500 HP would be hilarious, but all I meant was if they can make the Outback XT... would love that to come to the Forester.

@alozano793

Жыл бұрын

Yeah no doubt on the acceleration. Scared me a couple times in dicey merging situations where I couldnt get to speed confidently. Pray and throttle!

@firefly9838

10 ай бұрын

I bet you could squeeze out another 20 to 30 hp with some aftermarket tuning and minor upgrades to the engine.

I went from 2010 forester to 2020 RAV4 le awd. Subaru wanted around $3,000 to pull engine and change valve cover gaskets. With the RAV4, spark plugs, valve cover are on top. You get timing chain, electric water pump(believe 3 bolts to change it),. OH! 8 spd trans with manual shift. On the RAV4, I put JP Adventure lift to increase ground clearance and 245/65x17 Faulkner Wildpeak at3. Don’t think can go that big on forester. I like the forester, until time for maintenance! The RAV4 has ALOT of torque steer when you get on it. I like them both!

@atticstattic

Күн бұрын

_Falken_ Wildpeak

@prawnshop4573

39 минут бұрын

You can get used low millage engines at jdm exporters for 1800 cad already with a new timing chain and cam gears set. 😊

Excellent review. We live near Santiam Pass and have loved our Outback. Put Crossclimate 2 tires on and doing very well. I love your reviews. Thank you

Love the Subi and all your videos! Would really love to see how some real winter tires would rock the course and how big the differences are. Something like the Hakkapeliitta…

I absolutely love your videos Ryan, Nick does a great job as well! I’m a Subaru fan boy owning a 2015 WRX but very much approve of the new RAV4

I like that when you show a front view the audio matches what you are saying.

Love your reveiws aways great job

This review feels like a movie. So interesting. 👍🏾

Great job pushing them both!

Tires make the biggest difference on snow. Without traction, you don’t go anywhere. The beep might be Lane Keep Assist. There’s a settings menu where you can turn them off.

I bought my first Subie in 2018. I drove it across America and back. It did very well and I put it through the paces with all the safety features. I have taken it in some dirt and snow and it just wants to climb. The all wheel drive has saved me from one crash and the second crash was smaller than what could have happened. Even though it sits high with the ground clearance the all wheel drive had me sticking to the road when I had to swerve hard to avoid these accidents. The parts for replacement after the wreck were economical. I have a 10 year 120k mile warrantee on this and I am gifting it to my grandson as soon as it is paid off. Looking at the wilderness model for myself and then I can take him off road with me and have some family Subie fun!

Ryan you are awesome, no other car reviews are like this!!!

Great video and comparison. I have 2022 Subaru Forester and was interested to see how the tires performed in challenging terrain. I normally go with a more aggressive fully dedicated winter tire but was pleased to see the performance of the stock tires. I have a heated steering wheel in my Forester Wilderness. It’s a must have in the colder Canadian winters.

@arbel7655

7 ай бұрын

I'm glad to know they have a heated steering wheel option. I'll take that over heated seats any day... though I know they go together.

Your reviews are just awesome. How can I watch a fluffy on-road review after seeing hardcore content like this?

I’m just recently subscribed to your channel and I liked a lot the content and quality of your videos, thanks for that. Hey, just a question, from your point of view, what is the best Subaru option for off-road: Forester or Outback Wildness? and why?

@Studio89Graphic

5 ай бұрын

Choose Forester over Outback... The Foresters are still Made in Japan; but soon will be changed in 2025 and beyond as they will be Manufactured from USA Indiana.

Great review / comparison video. I have a 2021 Forester and it is fantastic. But I would also be happy w/ a RAV4.

It comes down to personal preference. Our family likes Subaru. I took off from a rainy intersection in our forester. Right hand turn, she barely slipped and we were on our way ahead of approaching traffic. Our son-in-law and daughter went to a dinner party in Alta, Ca. While other vehicles were spinning their tires the Subarus were “killing it” up the hill.

I like the look of the TRD Off-Road

@chrisbennett1037

Ай бұрын

You if I was to go smaller SUV again and I was looking now it would be the TRD off road with over 200 HP and a real 8 speed transmission and the only thing id own again in a Subaru is the turbo engine as it makes enough HP to make you forget about how bad the CVT is. Id never again consider something like my 2020 Forester Premium with a CVT and 182 HP just not enough that little HP+CVT makes it sluggish unless you flogg it... mine has 2 modes.. Flogg it and youre ok but it sounds like your trying to kill the Hamsters on that wheel in the engine... or drive it like you would any regular transmission car and the HP+CVT= you driving along like a 80 year old grandmother trying to figure out their first traffic circle they encountered..

Thanks for your videos. We bought a 2022 Subaru Forester Wilderness in large part due to your test videos. It replaces a Jeep JK Wrangler. Very nice vehicle and I don’t miss the endless repair expenses.

I guess in such situations as on hard hill it might be useful to have an option to manually select how much momentum each axle will get. Like set 37/63 front/rear, go through hard place and come back to auto.

Its surprising to me how well these 2 did, especially considering inadequate tires. Amazing performance, fantastic driving.

@Databyter

Жыл бұрын

Yeah, the Raptor is a monster, and it had to plow up that last hill in worse conditions. But the other cars have one advantage the Raptor, and other 4x4's don't have, and that is their much reduced weight. Those cars are very light vs their traction capabilities, and would have been even better slightly aired down. The Bronco is a superior beast, but at least half of that added power and 4x4 capability HAS to be there to handle the significantly increased weight of those systems themselves. This is why if you have a Bronco sport, Subaru Outback or Forester, or Rav4, the last thing you want to do is defeat your biggest advantage, and loade it up with 800 more pounds of offroad crap like winches and roof tents etc. That's fine if you are just camping on fireroads, but if you want to go thru soft sand and snow, or really rutted terrain, or steep inclines, you want to keep as light as possible, because that is your ace in the hole. You are a billy goat. I carry a minimal amount of emergency tools, a tow hitch, super lightweight snow chains that are just for legal requirement show, and s kinetic tow rope. Then I have food and water, an electic cooler and a power station with solar panels. And that is ALL I will carry. I bought everything with weight in mind and although it would be nice to have twice the gear and clothes and tents, it would mess up my MPG and my ability to soft road harder trails. Databyter

@MrSmith-rk4jq

Жыл бұрын

the geolandars are actually pretty great in snow from my experience on them the last two winters

@Databyter

Жыл бұрын

@@MrSmith-rk4jq Agreed. I don't have extensive experience with them but I bought my car in the winter about an hours drive from snow, and I went thru some foot high snow, that had even thicker drifts from plowing, and I had to park on a shoulder that was very deep with ruts and was basically deep snow. I thought it might have been hard to get out of their when I got back to my car, but just like when it drove in, it drove right out. I didn't use Xmode. Didn't need to air down. And because of traffic I was stuck driving on this shoulder field area for quite a ways before I could get back into traffic. Not exactly an extensive winter test, but enough to tell that these tires had NO problem in snow. I did however sell them with a few hundred miles on them for the Falkens two sizes bigger and never looked back. Both are great tires. I think the Falkens stand taller, both physically and metaphorically. Databyter

@pavelvasin9137

Жыл бұрын

Tyres really inadequate. Especially on Toyota

@ozzierabbit587

Жыл бұрын

@@pavelvasin9137 Yes, the tread didn't look at all aggressive.

I would pick the Subaru because they have been doing all-wheel drive forever, but the Rav was much more capable than I thought. Both great choices.

I bought a Subaru Forester Wilderness❤😂, and my wife and I are totally impressed. The ride and handling are amazingly smooth. It is a very enjoyable car to drive.

Got 2017 forester XT i have been pleased with it here in Finland it actually has some use every winter, not yet been able to get it stuck the highest snow was over the bumper that I drove tho was powder but still. The biggest issue is the bit slow trunk open and close.

I got my FW because of Ryan's videos. I also got to learn the basics of soft roading from them too as a added bonus!

@martinr8278

Жыл бұрын

Great choice. Out of my price range but after watching these videos…….Subaru wilderness all the way🏆🥇

Basically looking at this, it is the tires that matters most. I have the Toyota RAV4 2021, but I changed it to real Wildpeak tires with 3 mountain peak rating. This December we drove in the snow and ice of the Canadian Rocky Mountains, the Icefileds park way and it did it. owned a Subaru XT 2017 too, loved that vehicle too, but got the RAV4 because it can tow upto 3500 lbs, and now we have a 2500lbs camper. Also the RAV looks better, for me personally 🙂

@lilpeppa117G

Жыл бұрын

The rav4 is shit seats are hard as a rock,loud and noisy the engine is a little punchy but sounds like its throwing a bearing while doing so the awd systems are to quick to deactivate

@moloono1

Жыл бұрын

Congrats on your RAV4. Definitely a great buy. I agree with the looks too.

@Databyter

Жыл бұрын

Anything after 2020 in the Subaru Outback XT line, or others with the Turbo powered engine, will also tow 3500. Most Rav4's that are not Adventure trim or TRD will only tow 1500 I think. But if you tow alot I think I'd be more comfortable with a traditional transmission in the Rav4, especially since you can change the oil and maintain it. Subaru says to NOT change the CVT fluid on their vehicles. If you tow, I think it is smart to change the fluid more often. Subaru America claims that this is basically never needing to be changed. Maybe 60-90 K if you do. I figure if you are towing a lot at close to capacity, it should be 4 times as much.

@default7950

Жыл бұрын

@@Databyter The Warranty and Maintenance booklet says, "When the vehicle is frequently operated under severe driving conditions**, CVT fluid replacement (if applicable) should be performed every 24,855 miles (40,000 km)." **Examples of Severe Driving Conditions: [pretty much anything other than leaving it parked]

@Databyter

Жыл бұрын

@@default7950 Mine says THIS, and I used Copy and Paste directly from the Owners Manual of my 22 Outback Wilderness. "Warranty and Maintenance Booklet Continuously Variable Transmission Fluid-There is no fluid level gauge. It is unnecessary to check the continuously variable transmission fluid level. However, if necessary, consult your SUBARU dealer for inspection." Under the Maint. schedule it says 36K and 66k, or each 24K if under severe driving conditions which is NOT everything other than parked, but includes most notably TOWING. And it also says somewhere that this is a function that should be performed by your dealership. It is not recommended to change CVT oil yourself, although, personally I would after researching the procedure, which should be straighforward. However if there are maintence anti tamper seals that may void warranties, you're better off getting it done to protect your warrantee in SOME situtations. Databyter

A side note about winter tires: In my personal experience, studless snow tires like Blizzaks excel with on road conditions like nothing else. In off road conditions like this where there is a mix of mud thrown in, the tread pattern becomes packed with mud and they become useless. As they start spinning, they hit rocks below and the rocks destroy the tread (don't ask how I know lol). I have found that a studded winter tire performs much better in these conditions and if you ever encounter conditions like this, adding chains to your kit, although not a 100% guarantee it will more than likely get you thru most of what you will throw at it.

I own a 2020 Forester, and love it, but both vehicles are beasts! Nice job!

I have never had an issue with the RAV, although I switched my tires to Toyo AT3. I even went to a super muddy situation where I had a friend got his FJ stuck in mud, I was able to pull him out with the RAV. I was surprised it was handling things smoother than the FJ. But In the end, it all depends on the driver and how you can get out of a situation.

@drivingsports

Жыл бұрын

Tires are everything.

@solidsnake2030

Жыл бұрын

@@drivingsports Big part of off-roading is the tires. You can have the best 4x4 on earth and you still can get stuck with bad tires and unexperienced driver.

@Databyter

Жыл бұрын

FJ'S are super heavy for their size. They are very capable, but the advantage of the Rav4 is that you've got a lot of traction and very little weight to bog you down.

That was impressive, I wouldn't have expected either to get up that without proper snow tires. It also would've been much easier on proper snow tires. I would also add that neither of these holds a candle to the segment king of off road performance, the Jeep Cherokee Trailhawk. I had a 2015 Trailhawk and took it on proper 4x4 trails with no issue thanks to the full skidplates, real low range and real locker. It was just cursed with Jeep "reliability" which is why I traded it in on a Tacoma.

@marketingmajor8126

Жыл бұрын

So true about the Trailhawk, that's practically a beast in it's own category. But for the same reason, I got rid of my Jeep reluctantly, after the warranty expired it became an alligator, spending more time in the repair shop than on the road. The Toyota/Subaru options are the next best thing once a person has had it with non-stop repairs, even if in stock form they leave something to be desired as compared to Jeep abilities. Easy enough to take both Toyota's and Subaru 's up a notch in capabilities through aftermarket options.

what tires you use are having huge impact too!

sheesh this one had me breaking a sweat - thanks for this awesome review!

Reliability depends on end user for the most part. Maintenance and driving habits. Although that said if you look at factory recalls Toyota and Subaru fair very well. Just take care of vehicle and do the routine maintenance and it could last longer than you want it too🎉

@user-wv1sg4gz4h

Жыл бұрын

This is not entirely true. Most Stellantis brands (Fiat, Chrysler, Dodge, Jeep) aren't reliable, regardless.

@Starf2022

10 ай бұрын

Hmmm what preventive maintenance to do for your engine to last more than 200k before the head gasket get blown and etc that comes with those boxer engine while toyotas keep runing for ever...

The Forester has been a leader in this category for a long time but now the others are catching up. RAV4 looks the goods but as you say the price maybe a big factor here. Personally as a long time Forester owner I'll stick with that. I Australia we don't get the Wilderness model but then again we don't often need to drive through deep snow.

I have a 2001 Subaru Legacy GT Limited 5MT and it's so amazing in the snow. I taught myself how to snow drift with this car many years ago.

Love your videos, I have the Wilderness, absolutely love it! Ryan I appreciate how you explain x mode changes for different situations, my question is have you ever tried Sport mode while in XMode for harder terrain? Is it possible to use it in XMode? Thanks again!

@alozano793

Жыл бұрын

I used to have that same question and dont think Ive found it possible to be in sport mode with X-mode. Ill give it a try today to be sure though.

@slongo9516

Жыл бұрын

@@alozano793 please let me know what you find out!

DSTV is the best. I test drove both before I bought my SFW. The RAV4 TRD would have been my second choice. I really like the roomy interior of my SFW. Approaching one year of ownership and would choose it again. BTW that big infinity SUV merged into traffic ahead of me yesterday. Those turn signals at the bottom of the bumper are awful, I couldn't even see him signaling.

Great videos ,but when you make a comparison it would be better to use same tyres on both vehicles.both are poor tyres for the conditions, but Subaru tures seems getting better grip. Great videos,keep up the good work we love it 👍👍

Thank you so much for these videos!! They are so helpful! I had no idea how amazing Subarus were until I found your channel. Haha 😂 And you’re somehow chill, funny, honest, and a good show man at the same time. Very rare combo! You can tell you’re having fun. And it’s fun to watch! Thank you! :)

Toyota’s new Torque Vectoring all wheel drive is quite impressive. I have it in my 2021 limited Highlander and after owning four Subarus I don’t feel like I’ve lost anything. In fact the Toyota feels more sure footed to me than anything else I’ve drove. My son bought a 2022 RAV 4 Adventurer after owning a Subaru, and he feels the same.

@Martin944turbo

5 ай бұрын

Interesting! I've been a Subaru owner for the past 12 years and thinking of trading in my 2021 Subaru STI for the 2022 RAV4 TRD edition because my kids are getting bigger. Looking forward to trying the Toyota AWD going to ski hills and stuck in blizzards; I'll definitely get Nokian or Michelin winter tires.

@jeffreya8329

5 ай бұрын

Rav4 is perfect for the city, if you want to go offroad every now and then you pick the forester, better clearance and awd system

@Martin944turbo

5 ай бұрын

Also looking at the 2024 Forester Wilderness edition, hard to beat yes! @@jeffreya8329

Great review!! Honestly lack of steering wheel heater in the Subaru has been a big issue for us adding a Subaru Outback Wilderness to our garage. Where we live this is a must for 4-5 months a year.

@danielfair4675

Жыл бұрын

Wear gloves, and your vents are adjustable to hit your steering wheel. Makes me wonder how folks managed to operate a vehicle in cold weather for over 100 years.

@stonepa

Жыл бұрын

@@danielfair4675 my first car had no ac and a 3 speed transmission. Things have improved since then. It also takes a long time for the heat to work in mid winter alaska but the steering wheel heater works immediately.

@jagslr

Жыл бұрын

@@danielfair4675 Poor fix and excuse. Huge oversight as once you've had it you're going to want it again. Human nature I guess lol

Great review. Consider bringing a set of Maxtracs for an emergency option should you become stuck and unable to drive out.

That was amazing great work!

Great comparison video as always. I'm glad to see Toyota narrowing the AWD capability gap with Subaru. I have personally purchased 6 Subies over my lifetime, due to their awesome performance in snow. But with a total of 7 head gasket failures between the 6 vehicles, I have migrated to Toyota. So far so good. Still have a soft spot for the Subies; just won't fork over any more money to them.

@bgmpt

Жыл бұрын

Ditto here with 3 head gasket failures on 5 Subarus and probably the only reason the other 2 didn't fail is because one was sold early and the other was totalled early. I'm in the Toyota camp now and won't be going back to Subaru.

@Studio89Graphic

Жыл бұрын

@@bgmpt We have had no Head-G at all on all of our Sub-Legacy 1990-1992 Model Ls and L... In fact our 1992 had the Original Timing-Belt since 1992 until 2019... Mostly all Parts and Engine are org. including the Winter Tires+ Rims Bridgestone Winter-Tires 4 of them still Origin and we rotate to Summer Tires/Rims. FYI Subaru BRZ are the one Subaru Gave the "Know-how" Technology to Toyota. A Friend had a Sub GL/ DL last forever ... Then 1986 Turbo XT was among the Best "World Rally Racing Cars" Not many Sedan Toyota knew then how to make good 4x4 Racing Vehicles/Cars. Cheers,

@bgmpt

Жыл бұрын

@@Studio89Graphic How many miles did you put on the car in that period from 1992 to 2019? Also, where is the geographical location that you ran the car?

@wholeNwon

Жыл бұрын

Exactly!!!!!!!

@damienbell3155

Жыл бұрын

I worked at both Subaru and toyota Lexus. From 00-05 Subaru, I hated changing out transmissions on the foresters and doing the head gaskets valve cover gskt. Went to toyota L in 09-17 but have been a mechanic for 25 yrs , I rarely ever seen a Rav -4 come in for anything , just typical maintenance. I’ve really impressed with toyota I’ve worked at Volvo,Suzuki, Mazda , bmw, Mercedes , dodge, Honda, jeep, Hyundai/kia and Chevy/gmc. Was impressed with only Volvo till 03 then ford purchased them and gutted them. There slowly trying to come back. But yah I would choose toyota Lexus over all car brands. I own rx350, es300, sequoia and a Corolla. Enough said lol. I’m in Alaska There are hundreds upon hundreds of 19- and newer raves here. Subarus had the title in 80-90-2000 but Toyotas have taken the thrown. Mpg is another point to why so many r being purchased.

Idea for a future video. 4runner off road or trd pro vs lexus gx460 since it is the same vehicle with very different 4wd systems and compare them on your test hills. The used market down here in Texas, you can get an off road or pro for about the same price as a couple year old GX460. Feel like both make for a solid overlander.

Great analysis....be careful kickin that snow/ice! Love both these cars, partial to Subaru b/c cost and parents owned many growing up

Exciting video! I would pick the Subaru, liked your word "balanced" and it has more clearance

Would be interesting to see the how the Bronco sport does on these tests. Also the RAV4 TRD doesn’t have twin clutch rear drive? Can’t find anywhere confirming this 11:10

the fact that this snow test was made with summer tires, impresses me even more

Bought a 2022 Subaru Forester Sport for my son and we love it. We are in Nashville area and don't have all this severe snow to deal with. Can't wait to test it out if it ever dumps here :)

Nice review! I love my 2017 Forester 2.0XT Touring... wish the new Forester Wilderness versions (or any version) offered the Turbo motors but oh well.

@harrahphotoman

8 ай бұрын

I wish they did, too. But, my 2021 Touring is a great car. Comfortable and the interior is upscale. Nicest interior of any car I've had and I've had some very nice vehicles. The visibility is superior to anything I've seen -- ton of glass all around. I feel safer in it than in any car or truck I've owned, as well. It is just an overall great vehicle.

@ericmoss8344

8 ай бұрын

@@harrahphotoman all of your points I 100% agree with. However, the NA flat 4 in Subarus are not my favorite motor. Very little power (by today's standards) and not that fuel efficient for a NA 4 cylinder. They sell a lot of them so obviously most people don't care... but it's a deal breaker for me and my wife. :)

I am a Subaru fan and I have a Wilderness Outback. I have to say, other than the clearance I think the Rav4 system is pretty good. That was a heckuva challenge and a lot of holes and ditches to fall into. That being said, the Subaru with it's better clearance and better tires was the obvious winner here. But I wouldn't say the Rav4 failed in any way. With a dedicated owner used to how it responds, perhaps some slightly better tires, perhaps aired down, it might have made it up. Especially if the Rav4 can fitted with tires a few sizes up by a new owner, which I do not know if that's possible due to wheel well clearance issues.. I know I went two sizes up on my Wilderness immediately and never looked back. No rubbing. It has raised my ground clearance to over 10" without a lift. It really helps. And I have the real Falken AT Trails with the Severe Snow three peak rating. I wonder if the Rav4 version at least has the M+S rating at least, because where I live you need at LEAST that on a passenger AWD to be allowed to travel on snowy highways without chains during our R1 and R2 conditions. And chains usually are not recommended for AWD's, and on many of them, like my Subaru, they are basically forbidden due to both AWD and Clearance issues. I carry them with me to comply with the law, but I am not required to install them because I have the winter rated tires. The minimum to be considered a winter rated tire in California IS the M+S rating, the Three Peak Rating is far above that being not just snow and ice rated, but SEVERE snow and ice rated. It's not just the tread, but the rubber formulation which has to stay pliant and somewhat soft even in cold weather. This is expensive so I guess Toyota was economizing on their material, a poor decision in my opinion. If you're going to go with a brand model, don't skimp on it's full features. Anyway I digress. I thought BOTH vehicles did really well, and both have certain advantages. If the Rav4 had better tires and clearance it would have given the Subaru more of a run for it's money because it also has a fine AWD logic, with a superior clutched differential system in back, paired with a traditional transmission that is more bullet proof while attacking obstacles. Databyter

@kimdecell5096

Жыл бұрын

My 2005 forster and good snow tires,manul shift would leave them way behind. 😆

@matthewdavis2549

5 ай бұрын

What size did you put on your outback?

@Databyter

5 ай бұрын

@@matthewdavis2549 I put 245/65/17's on Motegi 17x7.5 wheels. Falken AT Trails. the NON LT version for crossovers which are tough, but lighter than LT's

@Qis4Question

3 ай бұрын

RAV4 can take 245/65/17 without a lift. Something I'm planning on doing for my wife's RAV4 once she needs new tires@@Databyter

Be interesting to see how a hybrid RAV4 (Woodland?) would do. I've driven one in deep snow and it actually went better in "normal" mode than "trail" mode. Woodland also has the same tires as the TRD version. I've had a few subies and other SUVs (really liked the 2012 Santa Fe with v/6) and have to say it often comes down to the tires. I'm trying a RAV4 Woodland while waiting for the next gen, hybrid 4Runner.

@mrvwbug4423

Жыл бұрын

The Hybrid will likely be comparable ... until the battery goes flat, then you lose your AWD entirely, the RAV4 Hybrid AWD system is an electric motor for the rear wheels. Though on pavement the hybrid RAV4 probably drives nicer than the regular one

@jmichael6931

Жыл бұрын

TFL did a pretty honest test with the Rav4 hybrid and it performed very well for what it us. Generally, the limitations seemed to be the stock all season tires followed by clearance issues. With the fake Wildpeaks the Woodland will probably have a comparable performance as seen here. Of note, the three wheel slip test seemed to really confuse the Rav4. Otherwise, it performs quite well for what it is marketed as.

@ivanvarykino8202

Жыл бұрын

I would not assume awd / snow performance would be the same. Make sure to look to some of the detailed hybrid videos. I believe Alex on Autos revealed that for the Lexus RX450 system, the rear electric motor had inferior power for winter awd performance. This alone swayed me to not get the hybrid version since I live in Minnesota and regularly end up on unplowed roads. Not sure if the hybrid RAV4 is the same 2 motor set up as in the Lexus.

@MustardChannel

9 ай бұрын

@@mrvwbug4423 That's not how it works. The battery doesn't go "flat" - once the battery starts to deplete, the engine turns on to charge the batteries to ensure they have adequate power. There's no such thing as a 'flat' drive battery in a hybrid.

That was awesome driving. Both vehicles did great.

Really good thank you, and I especially appreciate the "which would you pick"? I think there are arguments for either. Of course, which one will "hold up" longer and/or less expense to maintain can't be part of this review.

Wow guess you're right about the tires. I think if the Toyota RAV4 TRD off road had better suited tires for snow like the peak rated tires in the Subie Forester it most likely would have given you a lot less issues than the OEM tires from Toyota. Yes, I believe that ultimately the tires peak rating do make the final difference in that harsh winter environment. That was a superb testing and comparison 👌.

@h-rttv4897

Жыл бұрын

Everything good in drivetrain toyota has it has from Subaru. It's obvious.

@iffykidmn8170

Жыл бұрын

Did not help that the tires on the Toyota were getting close to their end of life nearing the wear bars.🤨

@marketingmajor8126

Жыл бұрын

​@@iffykidmn8170 That was a big factor, you can see it clearly at 7:40 not only is the overall tread close to the wear bars, but look at that outer edge, the part of the tire that's supposed to offer the most bite precisely when it starts sinking in to snow/mud to gain the extra traction, those sides are worn smooth, and the sipping simply does not exist on the sides anymore due to the rounding/wear on the outside edge. When you factor that in and how well the Toyota actually did both parts of the run compared to the Subaru I would actually give the Toyota the win since the ground clearance difference isn't what actually came most in to play, but rather the worn, non-peak rated tires on the Toyota, and yet despite that, the Subie still got stuck briefly at the turn around point at the top of the climb, whereas the Toyota did not.

@shariandchrismcknight6600

8 ай бұрын

You mean AFTER THE SUBIE blazed the trail and created the path? The SUBIE got up and around the turnaround where Toyo did a lower level turn around. Rather do downhill in the SUBIE.

@kjburke58

4 ай бұрын

The rav had to go through the mess it left and the clearance was mad worse because the Subaru dug it out and left holes. Really people?

I am a Subaru owner and fan but, great job Toy!!!

this is an awesome 'real world' demonstration - thank you !

Hey everyone, I'm looking at replacing my 1999 F-250 super duty and want something less thirsty (I've got a V-10) and also I'm over 250K miles so at some point something's going to break. Been looking at the outback wilderness and the Rav-4 TRD and wanted to know what you guys think of both alternatives. i fish in Montana/Idaho/Wyoming and am usually on dry roads (dirt/gravel, no snow) but some times it gets a little gnarly. Never had problems with my super duty, but I need something different now. Thoughts?

Great review! As others have mentioned it would have been more accurate to have each vehicle using an equivalent winter tire, but I realize the manufacturer would not allow you to do this. Both seem like winners to me as I doubt 98% will ever take them on this type of steep, muddy type of snow hill. With results fairly close, (IMO a slight edge going to Subaru), I would still choose the Toyota for the rock-solid reliability as I have many friends who have Subaru.. and love them, but often complain of the frequent and high cost of repairs.

@Duckgrabber

Жыл бұрын

The fact the RAV4 doesn't have any tow hooks is a deal killer for us that live places like the Dakotas.

@bikeman1x11

11 ай бұрын

subaru needs to lose the sh*TTy CVTs

@user-cj3rx3rk3f

5 ай бұрын

I put hitch on back of my RAV4. So, at least one recovery point. It sad they did not include anything up front.

Need to see what AWD with real good winter tires can do on this location... I get the stipulation about manufactures not allowing tire change but DSTV has their own vehicles that they can change tires on. I'd be much more interested in a back to back different tire run with one of those vehicles, than watch another vehicle struggle on OEM All Season tires.

That was fun, thanks man! :)

I am driving my fifth Subaru so I am obviously a big fan. The Toyota surprised me, it's better than I thought, but the Subie would be my choice because I have virtually no issues. My current 2017 Legacy sport model still looks like new. Thanks for a great test!

Awesome video very well done. Makes me glad I went with the Subaru the Rav 4 was my 2nd choice even if they were the same price which of course their not I like the Subie better.