As a home owner? I love it. As a furniture maker? It’s a waste of space

@mcattack2009

3 жыл бұрын

I agree. For me in my garage, my table saw is mobile cause I need to make space, whereas the mister saw is on my workbench in the back of the garage. Fastest method of cutting for me is to go there, vs taking my circular saw out of a drawer, set the depth, find my square and cut, or move my table saw from the corner, plug a vacuum to it, make my cut and put it back. It all depends on your space.

@SpencleyDesignCo

3 жыл бұрын

THIS

@olbilldoor

3 жыл бұрын

To me this seems like the key, the miter saw is primarily a carpenters tool useful for building houses, or putting up molding.

@samponette3306

3 жыл бұрын

Depends on the kind of furniture you build. And even then: if you think its not usefull for making furniture, you probably haven’t used a good miter saw and/or a decent blade on it.

@AdamCraigOutdoors

3 жыл бұрын

exactly!!

Admit it, my wife put you up to this didn't she! What's next, 101 reasons why you don't need a bandsaw? Will she stop at nothing to get the garage back?

@Papou_Pete

3 жыл бұрын

Hmmmm. Bandsaw or wife?

@bobbobbinson1841

3 жыл бұрын

@@Papou_Pete Welp, they both can cut you badly if you are not careful.

@gsfuentes57

3 жыл бұрын

😂🤣😂

@mzdemetria8332

3 жыл бұрын

Lmao

@terpsmcgerps

2 жыл бұрын

10/10

Every shop I have ever had or worked in had miter saws - normally more then one. I find them indispensable, and it is usually one of the first stationary tools I recommend someone get if they are considering woodworking as a hobby (or even more then that). The reality is that if someone is a beginner woodworker, one of the best things which will motivate them to move forward are completed projects. With dimensional lumber and a miter saw, you can quickly and safely create hundreds of easier wood projects that will allow them to see results and allow them to decide if they would want to invest more into more expensive woodworking machines. On the flip side, I have talked to a number of hobbyists who have given up because of the hassle of trying to calibrate things like table saws. While it might seem trivial, for someone who has spent 20+ years as an accountant or other office work, the idea of trying to man-handle the cast iron top which was misaligned in shipment to keep the blade from scorching that nice walnut you bought...well, it can take the fun out of learning something new really fast.

I found that this video just proved how useful a mitre saw and a good mitre saw stand is. The amount of clamps, big surfaces, other tools, jigs, etc these guys had to use in each example in order to demonstrate why they don't need a mitre saw is exactly why I have one.

@RJay-yy5lq

8 ай бұрын

Exactly why would you cut the end of a board with a jigsaw over a clean, square, ready to use board cut with a mitre saw.

@robertnunes1948

7 ай бұрын

A white guy kicking a Starbucks can to the side as he asked to leave...now that is Caucasian!!! 🤌🏻

Pro builders: "you don't need miter saw" also Pro builders: uses miter saw in every single project.

Like a lot of others here, the Mitre saw is my most used power tool (except for maybe my drills/impact drivers). And a sliding one like a Bosch 12” can do almost 14” widths, which just covers so many situations. Couple that with a portable stand that has long collapsing supports, and the thing can grow when you need it and get out the way when you don’t.

When I was a professional trim carpenter the miter saw was extremely handy as we spent 99.9% of our time mobile at a customer's job site. Base, crown moldings, building stairs, mantles and tons of closest shelfing. But now that my hobby wood shop is 100% at home, stationary and all my tools are in permanent positions, I prefer using a table saw for more accurate miter cuts for furniture and project builds, when the lumber dimensions are smaller. But I still keep a miter saw around.

@darkspeed62

Жыл бұрын

Exactly, the mitre saw still has its place. How is a table saw more accurate for mitres?

@boxsterman77

Жыл бұрын

Yeah. They made that exact point.

@Robinlarsson83

Жыл бұрын

@@darkspeed62 a decently well setup table saw is a lot more stable/stiffer than most mitre saws, and as such gets a lot more precise :)

@saby8765

Жыл бұрын

I will remember this advice. Honestly, I'm a biginner woodworker. After buying a house I wanted to finish off my basement and wanted to build a shed, repair the deck etc. That's why I even strated on this. I'm working in my unfinished basement, I had no idea that table saw cuts better miter joints.

@Robinlarsson83

Жыл бұрын

@@saby8765 I wouldn't say that a table saw necessarily cuts better miters, but I would say it's easier to get good and precise results with one :) It's all down to the quality of the specific tool, how ridgid things are and how how easy they are to adjust. I'd say that you can get basically any level of quality work done with almost any level or type of tool, the difference is really just how hard it is to get there and how long it takes :) Isn't the old saying something like: it's a poor craftsman who blames his tools. :) A mitre saw that does decent cuts is probably going to be a good deal less money than a tablesaw with a good mitregauge. The cheap mitregauges that comes with small tablesaws is generally as bad or often worse than a mitresaw when it comes to accurate cuts. The main problem with mitresaws, especially the sliding kind, is that they are soft, it's easy to flex them sideways and end up with a different angle and length. They are great for construction work, laying floors and such, but not really meant for superprecise joinery. On the other hand, a good panelsaw with a proper sliding table and a really good mitregauge setup is going to cost atleast 20-50 times more than a decent mitresaw and take up significantly more space. So, its really all down to what you need and want :)

Most "Beginner woodworkers" are going to be weekend warrior/DIY types. There are infinite home improvement and shop furniture type projects that can be done with just a miter saw and home store 2x4's. If you're going from zero to 100% building fine furniture and nothing else, then I guess this makes sense, but the miter saw is amazing for most "beginning woodworkers."

@1Klooch

3 жыл бұрын

Agree with your comment. I would add that average DIY type may find themselves often in an "either, or" situation. A "shop" atmosphere, or a "job site" environment. Myself living in a semi-rural place have need to woodwork away from my shop and away from my table saw. My miter saw with it's portable table and ext. cords have saved me many steps.

@0NoQuarter14

2 жыл бұрын

It was one of my first tools (for trims and bits renovating our 120 yr old house) and I have no regrets at all. It may not be that useful for making boxes but was still the right tool for the picnic table I made a few months ago.

@peterleewoodworks

2 жыл бұрын

I totally agree, miter saw is excellent for cutting 2x4, 2x6 and everyday home projects.

@OffTrap

2 жыл бұрын

I tried working with a jigsaw and a circular as a beginning woodworking weekender and it never worked out. Too loud or cuts would be not square. Bought a 18v ridgid miter saw and I can't complain and so can't my neighbors. The brushless motor is amazing.

@LadyBovine

2 жыл бұрын

Yeah this is the annoying thing about everyone who says use a jigsaw or circular saw, because you can "easily". No, you can't easily. You can. You can get fairly straight cuts with a circular saw, but its way slower, less enjoyable and less reliable than with a miter saw, especially if you're using a right-side blade saw, which most saws are outside of parts of america. Also you can't cut small pieces from small pieces with this method. A jigsaw just straight up can't make a straight cut through anything thicker than thin plywood, on account of the bendy blade, so people should just stop. Miter saws are fantastic for most projects, and makes most building task much faster and more fun, you just can't get too fancy.

Perfect for small projects. Not got a lot of power so if the wood starts to flex it stops the saw pretty easy. Use it for small tasks and you will be happy. Safety system Works great kzread.infoUgkxjpBI8OOeUXib_iT7UomCrQ-uauwZJ62c .lose your grip on the saw it shuts off and the sheath closes over exposed saw.

I don't usually leave negative comments but I figured I miter as well. I am very disappointed in the lack of puns in this video. I felt like you two were just cutting corners.

@JustinJ.

3 жыл бұрын

I think they were trying to come at us from a different angle

@toucanproductions2935

3 жыл бұрын

😂🤣

@frederickwood9116

3 жыл бұрын

Really just not measuring up to the task at all. Perhaps they should draw a line, walk the plank and try to invent a completely new angle. Oh dear. I need to stop. it’s so bad, and I’ll be stuck like this all day.

@Jacob_Dwyer

3 жыл бұрын

Positively stop!

@GregLohr

3 жыл бұрын

Why do you have to rip them? Cut it out. OK, I've said too much. Now I'm board.

I was in the same boat as Chris at the start. I watching a million youtube videos about woodworking and everyone had these impressive shops with every power tool imaginable. I was working in a tiny basement on a tight budget and a table saw wasn't an option for me. I own a circular saw but it is by far the tool that scares me the most and I don't always feel that the cut I am getting is straight, square, accurate, or any combination of those three things. I bought a miter saw to make repeatable cuts that were square and didn't make me nervous about my limbs. While I agree with most points made in this video, the one I don't agree with is regarding space. You say having a miter saw set up properly takes up a lot space that could be better used for storage or whatever. But you don't even address that the alternative in this situation is a massive cabinet table saw that has a footprint larger than anything else in the shop. And I understand that the space:utility ratio of table saw to miter saw heavily favors the table saw. But I'd saw a large portion of your audience isn't fortunate enough to have a warehouse as a shop. Most of us are in our garages and basements, stuffing every square inch of space with tools and wood. I go back and forth about whether my miter saw was worth the money and I ultimately land on yes. I wish that I could afford and store an awesome sawstop but I just can't. And a miter saw can handle a lot of what I'd end up throwing at a table saw. So yes, in the perfect world, I'd have a table saw like yours instead of a miter saw. But at the end of the day, when I am wrapping up in my 8x12 foot shop, I am happy to have a miter saw.

@GregLohr

3 жыл бұрын

you raise some very good points! I'd only suggest that the natural alternative to the miter saw for space-challenged woodworkers is a quality circ saw, ideally with a fence or track (even if one or both are shop-made). You're right, a massive TS isn't an option for a lot of us. But when space is tight, many of us take plywood or long lumber outside, where a circ saw is super helpful. I also agree with you -- my circ saw always seemed a bit intimidating, and I only used it for rough cutting. It's grown on me, though. With a careful setup and a good blade, I think you'll get quality cuts. And for what it's worth, I saved up a for a good while and finally bought a Jet JPS 10 a few years ago. It wasn't cheap (for me), but it's several hundred dollars less than the cheapest SawStop, and it's still going strong. Hope this helps!

@matan123

3 жыл бұрын

What miter saw did you buy?

@doalex2085

3 жыл бұрын

I feel your pain

@lawlworthy9805

3 жыл бұрын

you can set a guide pretty easily for the straight/square cuts using just a circle saw. measure the distance from the blade to the edge of the plate (for me, 1.5"). clamp down a straight edge that distance(again for me 1.5") from your cut line and you can now run the plate along that straight edge to get accurate cuts!

@GoDaveGo

3 жыл бұрын

I bought a cheap circular saw and miter saw for some projects. I thought it would save money over a table saw. I found the circular saw intimidating (even though I grew up around power tools) because of the leaning involved in using it. I ran into a lot of situations where the miter saw limited me to the most basic options, or couldn’t do it at all, while the circular saw was too freehand to do reliably, even with a track. After a project required me to rent a table saw, and then another meant I had to buy one, I wish I’d just bought the job site saw in the first place. It’s smaller than the miter saw is, anyway! Due to my space limitations, I’ve decided to clean up and sell my miter saw and stand, and I don’t think I’ll miss it.

Top notch advice chaps. I’ve been building a shop out for 3 years, and I’ve had a mitre saw on the floor, struggling with where it needs to live, and I recently decided that it is unnecessary in my shop. It’s more of a “grab and go” tool and doesn’t deserve a permanent home in my furniture making shop. It’s funny how difficult it can be to make these decisions, and I think your words are spot on. Also freaking hilarious, seriously. Gets better with every video. I also love your podcast. I usually have to listen a few times though because the tablesaw and sander drowns out audio, and I have to delisted to catch all of the puns.

I'm thankful that you guys pointed out the pros and cons of having a miter saw. And as useful as it was (and entertaining) I still think I'll be adding a miter saw to my small tool collection. Mostly because I'm still a novice and living in an apartment 18 and 36 volt tools make me more mobile. In the winter months I use the basement or roof of our apartment building. In the summer I use the backyard. And I haven't had to punish any of my neighbors for complaining about the noise I make😆👍🏾

I agree with many of these points. But for me personally, I use mine daily. I'm a small business furniture creator. And am almost always working on 10 things at the same time. So being able to quickly and in one place break down material is beyond useful.

I guess I am the DIY guy because it's probably the most used tool in my shop. I don't really build a lot of complex furniture. I have never used the compound cut that I can remember. I do use the circular saw quite a bit, too. I guess everyone is different in how they do stuff and the stuff they do. Love you, man... men?

@dt2419

3 жыл бұрын

I make complex furniture and instruments, I use a mitre saw a lot, I also know a lot of others that do. It depends on your situation, I don't have a table saw or panel saw, I have a TS75 track saw, mitre saw and bandsaw. I can do things with those three just as well if not better than a table saw and I have a dedicated tool setup for each operation rather than a jack of all trades master of none. It depends on your situation and workflow, it also depends on the quality of tool you use.

Here is my take: I think you guys arrived to that conclusion by HAVING OWNED a miter saw before, in other words only by owning a car yourself and experiencing traffic and difficulties parking, you arrive to the conclusion that public transportation or a scooter would be better and make them work to do exactly what the car did. But if you start off without a miter saw your mind will not be as creative and resourceful when it comes to using a table saw to do the job of a miter one. Learn first how to implement a miter saw and all the things it can do for you and then you will be more capable to "Re-purpose" a different saw to do what the miter saw did before for you. Reading this comment over I am not even sure I managed to express exactly what was in my mind. I am just a tourist.....

I took the plunge a few years ago to replace my Rigid for a Kapex, and of course after the financial recovery, I can't say enough about it and how it really does make my furniture building more possible. My stool build from William Douglas's plans made my angled dado a breeze....And the dust collection!!!! Top notch. Still made a jig for the compound miter dado to repeat it for 4 stools, but still a very valuable tool in my arsenal. Love the F out of both your guys content, and completely see, and agree on the point depending on where you are today. But like you mentioned, depends on your life circumstances and I was fortunate enough to make that one happen for me at the time. Won't lie, if I saw this two years ago I definitely would have questioned the purchase though. Thank you fellas for all that you do. Rock on!!

If you only have a jobsite table saw a miter saw is a great item to have.

@NPrints

3 жыл бұрын

Totally agree. I have a dewalt job site and I much prefer a miter saw to crosscut with

@jaysonwarden5979

3 жыл бұрын

That's where my thoughts went too when I noticed the really nice table saw. But, I guess I could also build a table that went around my job site table saw and it would work the same.

@Lapku

3 жыл бұрын

That's correct in this video the whole argument is assuming that everyone has a big saw stop table saw which unfortunately is not true

@Razid320

3 жыл бұрын

@@Lapku Its not that hard to build a proper table around a job site table saw and the amount of different free plans for em even on youtube makes it even easier. Plus you can build exactly what you need, not just what is avaible within your budget. Thats my next project.

@GrumpysWorkshop

3 жыл бұрын

Sell jobsite saw, buy used contractor belt drive saw, upgrade fence and miter gauge, come out 300% ahead.

That was some of the best advice I have had as I look to tool up again after a 40 year gap in owning a shop and making furniture. The choices were much simpler then! Thanks.

I want to add to previous comments about the lack of space for the big table saw. On top of that, we need space to store the jigs to accomplish the equivalent cuts. I am using my miter saw much less since I got my job site table saw, but can't completely eliminate it from my workflow. They are both foldable on wheeled stands and I pull them out and work on my driveway.

16:00 my thoughts exactly on miter saw. For a trim carpenter they are indispensable and definitely in the top three most valuable saws on the job site along with circular saw and jigsaw. I would always have a miter saw on hand if I was into any type of carpentry even if I didn’t have a dedicated space for it.

I've had the same miter saw for a couple decades and would never give it up, but I also have no plans to upgrade it either. It was one of my most used power tools for several house remodels and additions, but I don't think I have ever used it for any of my woodworking projects.

I really like my miter saw. I don't use it every day, but it's on a flip-cart with my planer, so taking up space isn't really an issue. I use it (as you mentioned) to break down lumber at the start of a project. It also does a great job on steel (yes, it's a low speed miter saw).

First power tool I owned after my first cordless drill (which is still my current drill) was a miter saw. Until last weekend I owned a radial arm saw (long story) and miter saw, but turn to my table saw for almost everything! Ditched the radial arm saw and am keeping the miter saw for the home project work. Every beginner who asks me what tool to buy first, I tell them table saw! So versatile, precise, and a compact jobsite saw actually takes up less space than a miter saw!

Hahahahahahaha I just love how Shawn looked so sad when you kicked him out of the shop I literally 😂. Back to the video !!

Fantastic video guys! Would love to see an expanded video like this on workflow, because you've referenced it in being a very obvious reason on how to minimize the need for a miter saw. Keep up the awesome humor, entertaining AF!

Shawn's acting deserves some applauds. That disappointment on his face when Chris turned him down

@Foureyes.Furniture

3 жыл бұрын

I applaud him daily when he walks in. Standing Ovation slow clap style.

@AKECRAZY17

3 жыл бұрын

That was really funny hahaha

@harmandesignco

3 жыл бұрын

Chris' response just made my day!!

@stephenrichie4646

3 жыл бұрын

Sold mine a few years ago. Don’t miss it. It was very useful for a room addition and a couple of deck projects on site. In the shop: not worth the space commitment. BTW, just finished a table project that started with 8’ rough lumber. I had no problem breaking them down on my table saw; it’s all in the setup.

I have a small shop, but I designed it with a dedicated miter saw station along one wall. I use it every day. Yes, as some other commenters suggested, I use it for rough cutting raw lumber. I harvest, mill, dry and resaw 75% of my stock, so most projects start with rough cutting thick stock. With a 12” blade, it’s capacity exceeds all my other circular saws. But I use it more for precision cross cuts. I use a Forest blade that makes excellent finish cuts and stop blocks for repeated dimensions. I only use my table sled for cross cutting wide panels; and many times I use a track saw instead. I think the biggest reason I do most of my cross cuts on my miter saw is convenience. Super easy to set length and angles and I don’t have to muscle a bulky sled off the wall and onto my table, which is a real PITA when I’m going back and forth between rips and crosscuts. I appreciated your arguments here, but I think you may have rationalized your way into defending work methods to which you are accustomed rather than truly evaluating the options objectively. Love your channel. Thanks for all the great tips.

I have 2 chop saws, a 10" and a 12" compound miter saw, I use mine as you said to break down long material and I find myself using the table saw more often now for super accurate cross cuts and joinery and not so much the 10" saw. Thanks for the well made video!

Great video, I used to work on site and the circular saw came out of the van a lot more than the mitre saw. There were days where it came in handy especially when getting the apprentice to do repeatable cuts that we could setup before hand, so that they didn't cut their hands off with the circular saw. Saying that my friend cut off his thumb with a mitre saw

Lots of good perspective, I've actually been looking at a miter saw to supplement my job site saw. I also had been looking at getting a fence extension for the same purpose.

Great Video! It's really given me pause in the direction I was originally going where I had an entire wall I was going to use as a miter saw location. I recently got a Saw stop pro cabinet saw and love it so much, I'm second guessing priority of tools. This has dramatically slowed down my shop setup, but better to take more time than waste money!

Good points all around. I purchased my sliding miter saw about 10 years ago when re-siding our home. Once that project was completed I eventually built a flip top mobile table with the miter saw on one side. Most of the time I use the table top as a work surface and always have the option of flipping it over if I have the need to use the saw. My shop is 1/2 of a 2 car garage so all my tools are on wheels. In my DIY projects I do use it now and then and some when building furniture projects. I really like my table saw though (SawStop) :^). Thanks for posting!

You guys are great. I'm stoked you teamed up. It looks like you are having fun making videos together. It's great for us viewers, and I hope it's working out well for business too. Walking into the door with the board reminds me of the dog trying to go inside with a stick and getting blocked.

I’ve actually been working through these very same thought processes. After building a dedicated mitre saw station in a SMALL (12x16 covered) and 12x24 outdoors) woodworking area, I’ve purchased the mobile stand for when I cut crown and other household trim (on the job site)... and I’ve been working toward using the space more effectively.

I had no problem without a miter saw in the shop for more than 10 years. But then came a job where it made sense to get one. It now resides most of its time in my off-site storage area and comes out when needed, which isn’t often but it’s nice to have it when I need it.

I'm grateful that I've stumbled upon your video. I'm a complete amateur who's currently doing some work at a newly bought house and I'm still hesitant whether or not I need one. I have already bought and used a jigsaw and a circular saw for cutting laminate floor panels, but I'm planning to also cut my skirting boards (under a 45 deg angle) and cut some MDF boards to be used as building blocks for my DIY wardrobe. Still not 100% entirely sure I need a mitre saw, but from my very short experience with this kind of tools it seems to me that neither a jigsaw/circular have the necessary precision.

The Mitre Saw is an amazing tool. Aided with a cordless circular saw with an additional rail - will give the enthusiast DIYer all sorts of cutting capabilities.

If you're starting out, a mitre saw is a sensible, useful tool to have that doesn't take up a lot of space. i.e. you can put it on a shelf out of the way. If you've got a huge workshop it may well be possible to do things without one. Most of use don't have mega workshops. A circular saw and a square are not a decent alternative.

@darkspeed62

Жыл бұрын

I completely agree, as someone who went with a circular saw because of its limitless ripping ability, it's a disaster for making consistently straight cuts. I'm now having to gvet a mitre sq because it's quicker and easier by far.

Thanks, this is a really helpful video. I have a small mitre saw which has a deep footprint which has annoyed me for years, a good deal for a large mitre saw with less deep footprint came up, and I was very tempted to buy. After watching this video, I think your points are correct and made me realise I can do all that I need with my track saw and table saw, very happily and without much compromise. Thanks! It means I haven't spent the money and no longer desire getting one. Very appreciative of helping me realise this.

I'm am seriously glad I watched this video. The repeatable cuts is my only reason I was thinking about getting one. And I know I don't necessarily need it. Table saw and router table can get it done. Great advice, thanks 👍🏾

Have been doing carpentry/joinery 15 years as a full time business and have to say my mitre saw is one of my most used tools.

I have one because I can't cut a strait line!

Great Video. One additional key factor for me beside the space issue is the DUST. The miter saw is the worst offender in the shop. When I downsized to a one-car garage shop, I eliminated the dedicated miter saw station. I just remodeled the shop and built a miter saw station OUTSIDE attached to the back of the garage and covered by a box. We'll see how that holds up in the weather.

I was about to buy a miter saw more than a year ago. But then I started watching your videos (and Shaun's) and I started to notice that you're heavily using your table saw. I also noticed you didn't use a miter saw on almost all your vids (at least the first bunch I've watched). And the only main reason I was in to buying a miter saw was my fear of the table saw. And overcoming that fear and eventually buying a table saw has taken me to the next level. So thank you for that :)

In framing carpentry we use circular saws all day every day, even at heights like when working on roofs, installing the fascia boards, etc. I think its a pretty safe tool and its the only thing we use except when we have to take something apart with a sawzall.

@ctrlaltdebug

8 ай бұрын

I see people trying to cut short pieces of lumber over their knee. On the other hand, it's obvious how to use a miter saw safely.

I can't imagine making all of the mitre/angle jigs for a table saw. Just the one shown here would probably take me 3 days, between seeing the end product in my mind, then figuring out how to make the jig, then wondering if I did it correctly to get the cut I need. I'm good with formulas and angles, but haven't ever been taught the the specifics of making jigs. I'm on the Autism scale, and need to be able to ask questions to understand a lot of things.

@barnyardkh4

3 жыл бұрын

If you watch their videos closely you'll see that the base of their sleds is (or at least could be) common. The stop blocks are the 'custom' part and they are just screwed in place. It's not like they have dozens of sleds taking up space someplace.

@darrinlindsey

3 жыл бұрын

@@barnyardkh4 I totally understand that that. If I had a finished product to look at, when "customizing" the jig, I might be able to set it up, with a lot of time spent thinking about each individual step. But, if I had the finished product to look at, I wouldn't need to make the cuts to begin with.

@GregLohr

3 жыл бұрын

@@darrinlindsey Are there any woodworking clubs or meetups you can join in your area? Or classes you can take, even just for a morning at a Woodcraft or big box? I can understand wanting to see projects in person and ask questions. I've also found some supportive people on reddit's woodworking forums, where you can have more of a conversation, share photos or plans, etc.

@southpole76

2 жыл бұрын

finally somebody who doesn't pretend every project can be done in 5 minutes. i don't think this applies only to people on the autism scale, i need time as well to decide on a project and make it exactly like i want.

A timely video for me.. i've just recently bought my first sliding miter saw. Having quite a big workshop, space isn't an issue. Noticing all the times i thought 'I wish I had a miter saw' led me to getting one, and it'll get used frequently, especially given the large volume of work I have coming up. Saying that, yes, it's a luxury tool (I also just really wanted one!), and i expect it will never be as essential to me as the table saw, bandsaws etc.

I started off with a cheapo miter Saw, eventually got a Bosch Glide 12". Found that I wanted a track saw and got the Festool Tracksaw and MFT/3, sold the miter saw and found that I got great results with the Tracksaw MFT/3 and table saw combo, this worked well for me for about 5 years. Recently, I got a larger workspace when I moved to a larger home, picked up the Festool Kapex with the mobile base and extension wings, so happy with it, can easily and quickly make repeated cross cuts on long and medium sized boards, now just use a small parts sled on the table saw. The MFT/3 is useful when I need really huge cross cuts. I know it's a luxury, but I have the space and the money, what I don't have a ton of is time (I have 4 small children), so having everything set up so when I can make it out to the shop for a few hours the time is very productive. I do agree, a track-saw table, like the MFT/3 or Kreg and a table saw are great, and you don't really need a miter saw. Especially, because most miter saws other than the Festool Kapex are not that precise and have terrible dust collection.

I agree with all their points and if I was in their position I'd feel the same way too but I'm just starting to make money with woodworking and I'm only buying tools with the money I make from woodworking. I'd love to have a huge table saw that I can make jigs for and have basically an unlimited cut capacity and options. However, the reality is that it's too expensive right now. Most of what I build is with solid wood up to 2x8's. So a miter saw really speeds up my workflow and everything it can't do can be done with my circ saw/jig saw (both also very affordable). The miter saw adds a lot of consistency vs just a circular saw. I've had to square up table legs using a flash trim bit on my hand router!!!!! just to get them to the same length. So I agree with them but if you're just starting out with a limited budget, I think you can buy a decent quality miter saw for not much money which will be far better than a cheap table saw with a bad fence and an uneven table. Please let me know if I'm wrong. I'm still learning.

@jasonsahadeo5740

3 жыл бұрын

And please don't tell me to make jigs for the circ saw. I tried that, it limits the cut depth and size of boards I can work with unless I make an unyielding large jig(which costs more than 10% of the price of a decent miter saw) and if you don't have a jointer it's hard to get straight boards to set everything up correctly. Again when I have a full shop of tools I'm sure the miter saw will take a backseat but for now it's how I'll make the money to buy a decent table saw.

@karl_alan

3 жыл бұрын

I don't think you can be wrong on this topic. I think it all just depends on what you're making & how. I personally have been in this a decade & never had a circular saw or miter saw, and I use a jobsite table saw, rather than a giant cabinet saw. We probably just make very different types of things though, and thus have different needs.

@jasonsahadeo5740

3 жыл бұрын

@@karl_alan good point. That probably makes a huge difference.

@braindamage_eclipse

3 жыл бұрын

that's where I'm at, Jason, just a little behind you. I've got a great circular saw but I'm fighting myself to get angled cuts that can actually be joined. was planning on grabbing a miter this week as it would be a huge upgrade in accuracy for repeatable angled cross cuts. definitely want a nice table saw for other reasons but man. I just want some angled cuts on 2x and 1x material.

@astronemir

2 жыл бұрын

Yeah these jigs mean I can’t cut any proper wood with my circular saw. I probably should buy a bigger one but then why not just get a miter saw for same money, better repeatability and ease of use?

If a circular saw scares you, perhaps this isn't the hobby for you? Wrong If a spinning blade doesn't instill fear in yuh ou THIS IS NOT THE HOBBY FOR YOU

@PeninsulaMediaGroup

3 жыл бұрын

i heard him say that and thought, what a dick.

@nickbailey202

3 жыл бұрын

Correct. Respect the blade. Allow the potential of losing a finger (or worse) to stay safety conscious.

This video has convinced me to get a miter saw.

I think it boils down to individual preferences. There's many ways to accomplish cuts and details and I enjoy the accuracy and reasons of your methods. But having my woodworking foundations built upon trim carpentry first I find myself using a miter saw a lot for all sorts of builds because I've used it a lot. It is replaceable as you've demonstrated but it can be quite versatile when experimented with. Guess thats the fun part of woodworking theres a million ways to do/learn to accomplish stuff. Hence why I like your videos. Thank you for your wisdom.

I love the dramatization of getting interrupted by someone else's cut request. From the perfect micro set up to the reaction to getting interrupted had me rolling.

I like having a miter saw just because it's twice the saws! I can have the miter saw set up at a certain angle and the table saw set up for something different, if i'm going back and forth between, say, ripping length-wise and cutting to length.

I’m a DIY beginner and really considering what I should buy within tight budget. I saw tons of DIY youtube video and all of them used table saw. So I almost to buy a table saw, but found “Miter saw”. I did not know anything about miter saw, and decided to buy miter saw after watching comments of this video. Thanks guys!

I have a deltax5 cabinet saw and wanted to upgrade my ryobi 12” miter to the Bosch. But recently my older bandsaw took a crap so now I’m shopping around for that. Then I see this video, and have all the capabilities to get these cuts as you mentioned. NOT GETTING A NEW MITER, BUT A BETTER BANDSAW.

Can I just ask, how in anyway does a good mitre saw take up more space than a table saw? Or cost more? Or is more dangerous given the blades spins down and away?

Wrong, wrong, wrong. Don't get a pencil, buy a whole blooming box of them as they like to hide all the time!

@heyimamaker

3 жыл бұрын

I did that, and I left them all over the shop. Still not quite enough 😁

@AJB2K3

3 жыл бұрын

@@heyimamaker Yeh I've lost 2 boxes in the shed!

@heyimamaker

3 жыл бұрын

@@AJB2K3 I tried those pencils that Adam Savage likes... And I hate them. The lead extends by twisting the bottom and that requires me to use two hands. I think I will just get a few more boxes of wood pencils. Or use a shop apron and just have a nice one on me at all times.

@Battle_eye

3 жыл бұрын

I swear, everytime I put down a pencil it gets teleported to another dimension!

@heyimamaker

3 жыл бұрын

@@Battle_eye This is why I bought a box of 30 and put handfuls all over the place. Are they where I need them? Nope!

Thanks for the info. I have been woodworking about a decade now & never had a miter saw, but constantly see it on people's lists of must have tools for woodworking. I also only have a jobsite saw & never used a circular saw either.

Oh, thanks for this video. I came out the same answers for me as you did. I've started with miter saw as all have it, now, after i have purchased good table saw, I decided to wait and not to place a miter saw at a new workshop layout. So, one year later I still didn't come back to miter saw. But for now, I have the same question: do I need a bend saw? I'm almost out of space, I do have jointer and thickness planner. Will be super happy for such video.

"if that money could be better spent somewhere else."... lol, like that wall of Woodpeckers squares and rulers? Don't get me wrong, they are really nice and I am envious but god they are expensive.

@shermanjones1417

3 жыл бұрын

yea between that and the gd kreg adaptive cutting system (on sale now for $896 on amazon) that takes up a ridiculous amount of space and money to buy i just about found another video to watch. I did make it to the end though just to learn what I could from the material presented. I appreciate the videos, but I feel like the mark is really missed her. I guess when you have endless amounts of money to spend on "other tools that do the job" you can say I don't need a miter saw. I mean, i'm fairly certain I could buy a basic 10" ryobi miter saw for nearly the cost of the material that it cost him to make that GIGANTIC crosscut sled.

@chaseweeks2708

3 жыл бұрын

@@shermanjones1417, probably not an endless supply of money as much as either a sponsorship or demo units sent for free. If it wasn't for the fuss of building a KZread channel big enough to get that kind of love I'd be happy to get that sort of deal

In our shop the miter saw is the single most used powertool, so much so that it surprasses the table saw, jointer, planer, bandsaw and drillpress combined, with only the belt sander getting to the same order of magnitude of use. The thing is, we don't build fuirniture. It's pretty much small decorative items like cahdle holders, knife handles and wooden jewlery or on the other hand it's big practical projects for the old farm. We are talking making 200 fence boards the same lenght, outdoor storage boxes, framing for a small greenhouse and similar. For the first the miter saw is great for cutting out the small bits before hand shaping and for the seccond it's just the best thing in the world. We even have a 2m ruler on it so you can cut to a couple of mm precition without any setup or extra measuring tools. So it really depends of what you need to do. As with most tools, they are good for some things and not for others. I Also don't like the "these are the tools you need" videos and lists, simply because it's impossible to tell what someone needs in their shop without knowing what kind of work they will be doing.

Nice video! I own an old contractor table saw and a miter saw. I definitely use the miter saw more which I primarily use to cut down 2x4's for construction projects and that just seems to work out nicely. Also I'm super short on space. My table saw is on casters and gets tucked away in the garage. The miter saw is nice because I can set up the saw on a stand outside my garage for quick cuts without moving cars around. So for me I'll keep my miter saw - but this might have just made me question upgrading to a sliding saw. I have been watching videos on making table saw sleds recently but my saw just isn't big enough to cut 2" off the end of a 2x10 accurately...

I have a foldable miter saw. Takes up minimal space and can set it up in a minute, part. Outside. Great to have for DIY project eg installing flooring. Wouldn't want to do it with any other saw.

When I started with woodworking I bought a rather large miter saw, mostly because I was too afraid to use a table saw tbh. I got a table saw later and sold the miter saw. It took too much space. I got a small entry level miter saw without a depth rail later. It's light and mobile and very handy to make quick and precise cuts. I would recommend to get such a small one rather than building a large miter saw station.

@MAGAMAN

2 жыл бұрын

You can literally store the miter saw on a shelf, in a cabinet or even under your table saw while you are not using it.

@cionheart

2 жыл бұрын

@@MAGAMAN Nah, of course I went for the big boy instantly.

Great advice! I love it when people turn conventional thinking on its head. I'm revamping my garage shop and you just changed my thinking. I'll skip the fancy built-in miter saw table (for the miter saw I already have for DIY projects.) And use the space for my jointer...which I was considering downsizing to a portable jointer.

Great video! I am actually the target viewer for this video: I am just a DIY guy and these days I was wondering if a miter saw could be right for me (that's why I landed on this video) and honestly I don't have a lot of space nor money. Thanks to this video I am more conscious that probably I was just running on the wings of enthusiasm and was just focused on the pros of having such a tool rather than actually thinking about its practical applications (at least for me).

All good points. Under that rationale, I'll sell all my tools and just go with a CNC machine. Let the computer do all the cutting, drilling, etc...

@68zayne

2 жыл бұрын

Aaaaàaaahahaha

In my experience a compound glide miter saw (with really good rigidity, tuning, and a quality 12" blade) rivals a table saw + sled for crosscutting precision. It doesn't really take up that much space because the crosscut station uses workbench space right and left as support surfaces for long pieces. It's great to have in a small shop, where maneuvering around a table saw is tight.

Thanks guys, very valuable video to me. I was asking myself exactly this question but now I guess I continue working without a miter saw. Side note, I rough cut lumber with hand tools, I find this often quicker than setting up a power tool.

@karl_alan

3 жыл бұрын

I frequently do the same. Glad to know I'm not the only one.

I use my mitre saw for rough cutting, rough lumber to length . That’s about it. I barely trust it to make 45’s but I do find it very useful particularly making shop furniture and anything framing related it.

I think that a track saw (with a jig for smaller stuff) can do all that a mitre saw can, and not the reverse. Plus, it's safer. As they cost the same and the track saw uses less space and can be stowed away, that's what I chose.

I'd love to hear from both of you an equipment list in order of priority. I have now reached a point where I have to choose between a bandsaw, spindle sander or drill press. And also, how much quality should I invest in each one of them... I might get a cheap harbor freight sander and spend more on a drill press? Or less on the drill press and more into the bandsaw? Great video!

@edualbergaria10

3 жыл бұрын

I am in the same situation!

@clayvansickle1

3 жыл бұрын

It will depend entirely on what you are building on a daily basis. For a general answer, I would suggest a quality bandsaw as large as you can manage.

thank you for sharing knowledge

Love the burgundy flannel and D-fitted, Chris! Thanks for sporting our gear.

I think the most important case opposing your view is for those with jobsite-size table saws, either by constraint of money or space. A $300 double bevel sliding mitre saw will cut upwards of 20 inch boards (or 4x4s or all sorts of awkward things), of essentially whichever length you desire. I expect a novice woodworker with something like a Dewalt job site saw is gonna see a ton gain in that purchase. If I had a full size Euro table saw with a sliding table, I might think differently about my mitre saw, but that would be a huge swing in cost, portability, and space occupancy. Just an alternative view, don't really disagree with any of the points you made. Cheers.

@EPortillo5000

3 жыл бұрын

As you say many people (like me) only have a small table saw and a mitter say and use the table say to make a cross cut have the same problems as the mitter saw, to make thing worse in my case in my country there are not many options to buy tools if you want a table saw there are only 4 options and import something like the kreg system is too expensive and a cheap sliding compound mitter say cost just $188.

@karl_alan

3 жыл бұрын

I can see your point, but personally I have been using a jobsite saw the last 10 years & have never had a miter saw or a circular saw. I think a lot of it depends on what you're making & how.

@EPortillo5000

3 жыл бұрын

@@karl_alan Indeed if you work more with sheet materials a miter is almost useless in the other hand if you are a framer and spend the day doing cross cuts on 2x4 a miter is what you need. anyhow you do what you can with what you have, I started with a jig saw as my only power tool to cut sheets of plywood. There is an spanish tv show that also has a channel here called Bricomania (that traslates to something like "diymania") and the host only uses jig saws no circular saw nor miter saws and was enough to keep him in the air for more than 20 years.

@bifurcated

3 жыл бұрын

@@karl_alan I wholeheartedly agree that it's definitely a matter of what you're doing. To be honest, you can look at period furniture from hundreds of years ago and see than NONE of this is strictly necessary lol. That said, I don't think I'm a rare case. Even as a beginner, I've been doing a fair amount of large casework and I wouldn't relish counting on circular saw cuts of 15 inch wide by 5 foot long pieces of panel being straight or consistent enough to yield a good square box whose internal dados still line up after I'm done cutting the box joints or dovetails in each edge. And obviously even a much nicer table saw is going to struggle with crosscutting those lengths safely. So yeah, I really see the table size on a job site saw as a pretty severe limitation on my work, but again, different (saw) strokes for different (woodworking) blokes. Cheers!

@karl_alan

3 жыл бұрын

@@bifurcated Cheers Doug. I really appreciate that perspective & wordplay.

LOL "maybe this isn't the hobby for you... " Scared my wife when I laughed randomly over coffee this morning... ty

I've been helping a cabinet maker friend for a while now. In the last two years, he used the miter-saw once. On a job site. Of course, having an SCM Sliding Table Saw - mid range, I believe under $40.000 - makes any cuts rather easy.

This is probably the best video I've seen as guidance for to or not to purchase a miter saw and what are some options to explore further. Words do not do enough to represent my gratitude for your video. Thank you so much! Subscribed!

I just don't get why people dislike this type of video. There are a lot of good points, especially usefulness vs space. I am not an expert woodworker, I like all DIY fields and in my case space is so limited that I can't buy almost anything to fit in my workspace. I need to even make my own tools with specific dimensions lol. This argument of usefulness vs space is probably the most valid of them all.

@GrumpysWorkshop

3 жыл бұрын

Buyer's bias. If you have convinced yourself into a $300+ tool, set aside a bench, or built a dedicated workspace for it, anyone telling you that it wasn't worth it is going to ruffle feathers. For many DIY shops, a miter saw is one of the first tools you talk yourself into.

For a hobbyist, if they are nervous about a powertool, especially something for cross cutting boards. consider whether you need the speed of powertools or if you can just use a hand saw. They work well, they are faster than you think and with practice more accurate than you think. you'll still need to refine the cut but you need to do that with a miter saw too.

@EPortillo5000

3 жыл бұрын

A miter box and a japanese pull saw will do the trick, I think we need to consider each case I will not cut a 1/4" dowel with niether a table saw not a miter saw, if you are not confortable with power tools get a rioba and start looking for japanese woodowrking videos 😁

@scottm9605

3 жыл бұрын

@@EPortillo5000 well put. I'm nearly 100% handtools after selling off my power tools to move and I discovered I don't miss them. I have a thickness planer and I'll be getting a big band saw for ripping and resawing, which admittedly is a big scary powertool, though imo inherently way safer than a table saw or circ saw.

@EPortillo5000

3 жыл бұрын

​@@scottm9605 All depend on your skils in my case no matter how much I try to be carefull all my hand cuts end up crocked but with a miter box that is solved most of the times.

@scottm9605

3 жыл бұрын

@@EPortillo5000 I cheat and shoot my end grain with a handplane. super clean, super accurate.

@user-qg6fy4yp8t

3 жыл бұрын

In the last year i have started to use hand tools. And both of you are right!! But for me woodworking is an hobby so I'm looking at it from different angle. I build my English jointer bench using hand tools only, cutting and jointing 2*8s, didn't use my power tools( only drill).

Its a good video; Especially the ending, where you clarify how and why to use it. I am up for buying probably a Metabo KGS 254m (10 inch), although a 10 inch without slide might be better for me (smaller footprint). So still looking. My case is exactly as you stated, for the occasional DYI. I have a just shy of 9x9 foot space, which is used for everything, including motorbike storage, couple of bicycles, car jacks & car stuff like a bicycle carriage, ladder storage, and all tools for anything in and around the house. This means that I have to set up such a way that for daily use, it's a bike storage and (work)stuff is not in your way. When I want to work on a project, I can accept that I have to put the bikes and motorbike outside/back yard, so I can do my project. With Netherlands having enough days of cold, wet or high wind, working outside is something you can't rely on. So I have a small table saw, that I use only when I'm outside, and I prefer to rely on the "homedepot" type shop to pre-cut my sheets to specific sizes, instead of cutting it all myself at home. This means that when I work indoors, my main cutting jobs will be sizes up to 2x4 beams, or sheet materials widths up to maybe 8 inches. For this, a 10 inch mittersaw with or without slider (without limiting the sheet width, width eating up more space for the slide action) seems to be a best "fixed" installed solution for me. It can allow me to keep the wooddust throughout the space to a minimum and can do some simple projects indoors. For anything big, I am making a mobile worktable about 4x8 feet, in which I build a table-saw and/or use a handheld circular saw, with a good fence/jig/clamp option and a spot to also put the mitter (long beam work or off-site work). This allows me for normal non-workspace use daily, for (limited) indoor workspace at home for quick jobs, and mobility for outside or offsite work on bigger parts (once a year?). Within that set up, to me atleast, as a beginner, the mitter seems to have a good place in the workshop. But I agree => If I could have the whole 9x9 or bigger as a dedicated workshop, I would more likely go for a big table/table saw setup first, before buying other stuff.

BRAVO! Absolutely great analysis. I have - and very often use - a miter saw, but I'm considering just ditching my super duper triple spiral double gainer sliding miter-on-a-luge saw and just going with a 12" fixed (non-sliding) saw to 1) simplify the non-stop re-cal maintenance, and 2) save space. I (so far) *always* want a miter saw in my shop - and I use it. However, I don't know if I use it because I Have it...? Or I have it because I "need" it. I admit to not really knowing that. Being that I'm a garage-woodworker and everything is on rolling stands, having fewer overall tools and more focus on *necessary* tools is a very appealing bit of rethinking.

Well you guys just had to open that box, didn’t you! Anyway, that’s why I have 2 table saws, 2 band saws, and 2 lathes. I can jump around without changing set ups. Yes I’m old and spoiled. Forgive an old man, will ya? Love you Guys, and Chris, take it easy on Shawn please.

Hmm, is it just me or is Chris usually the 'bad guy' in these dramatic sequences? Hmm.

Perfect timing. I was, once again, thinking of a miter saw. Been here before and came to a less comprehensive but similar conclusion as you. You have reaffirmed my previous thoughts. Really really appreciate the depth and metered (non negative) approach here. Very instructive and uncanny about the timing. Really! Are you doing that Facebook thing off listening to my conversations ! ? Hehehe. I’m still thinking I’ll get a miter saw, but rather than getting a very expensive big one to try and get more value from the purchase for multiple projects, I might instead consider something small and simple for a specific project. It will get used again but I won’t get annoyed if it’s not often. It’s a curious dynamic where someone gets something and then has to use it all the time to justify the things existence. Please do try another video where you look at the value, utility, necessity metrics (best effort) for tools you have and how you use them. Possibly even adding (as you did here) the depth where you can to say how others in other situations may rate it differently. Thanks again guys.

I have been wrestling with this issue as I am setting up a small shop in a new home. I need a mitre saw for trim work as I renovate my home but for my furniture shop; I was struggling with giving up the space for this tool. Thanks to your thoughts, I will keep the saw I have but just use it in the driveway or garage with a portable stand and not take up the space in my shop. Your videos are always great by the way.

Personally the mitre saw is kinda essential to me for small segmented pieces and I wouldn't feel safe making these on a table saw. However if I ever switch to making mostly furniture, this advice is invaluable.

@olbilldoor

3 жыл бұрын

the smaller the piece the less safe i feel with a miter saw, but with a table saw i can make a jig quickly plus it ups my accuracy

@naturaIIydifferent

3 жыл бұрын

I do small segments on my table saw with a stop block and miter gauge. It's way less sketchy than on my chop saw. Try it, you might like it!

I just bought one and I hope I won't regret it 🤣

@pascalklinker295

3 жыл бұрын

Falls es so ist, ich nehm SIe :D

@hannabruggemann5465

3 жыл бұрын

Hahah ich werde dich informieren wenn ich mich entschieden habe 😂

@pascalklinker295

3 жыл бұрын

@@hannabruggemann5465 Frauen brauchen immer solange wenn es um Entscheidungen geht :b

I think this video has convinced me even further a miter saw is essential. Not willing to make trade offs because it's a little slower and inconvenient at times to use.

Great video. For me, I have a shed to store my tools and I have to work in the yard or my deck when doing a project. So the miter saw on a good stand works perfect for me. I haven't need a table saw yet. For ripping I just use my circular saw.

Yes. It’s essential

“If that scares you maybe this isn’t the hobby for you” should be on a T-Shirt!

@will0ughby

3 жыл бұрын

Honestly, I almost left a dislike for that comment. It's one thing to say something is low risk, it's another to gatekeep or shun someone interested in a hobby.

@wayneford2958

3 жыл бұрын

I think it’s just a bit of humor tbh. I’m a beginner and all power tools scare me...

@will0ughby

3 жыл бұрын

@@wayneford2958 That's possible. I still think it's an area to avoid when you're talking to new people. If you want a community to grow don't tell nervous newbies where to door is haha

@Mitrasmit

3 жыл бұрын

@@will0ughby I see your point, but the truth is, if you're going to be intimidated by tools you control yourself, that's something to figure out before you develop the hobby. Being afraid of your tools is only going to cause accidents (wearing gloves with spinning blades because you're afraid of your hands, stuff like that). Respect your power tool, but don't be afraid of it. Otherwise don't use power tools at all.

@will0ughby

3 жыл бұрын

@@Mitrasmit I don't disagree! But I've been doing woodworking casually for a year or two now. A couple months ago, I purchased a table saw and was scared of it (because most of us in this hobby/side business know someone with < 10 fingers due to that tool). I got over that fear by easing into and using it in a safe manor. And had I been too scared to use a power tool like that, the solution isn't to be shamed out of a fun hobby but to be encouraged to use an alternative like a handsaw (like you said at the end of your comment).

The can kick at the end of the re-enactment sold me!

I got mine because my shop is too small for a table saw and I needed it to build some simple furniture for my apartment. I really want to do more now that I've been seeing a lot of the limitations on my saw.

Mid-Century furniture doesn't feature a lot of moldings, but other furniture, cabinets, built-ins, etc do, and a mitre saw is the perfect tool for this.

Damn. I just went out and threw a blanket over my mitre saw. I don’t want my neighbors to laugh at me. 😳

Guys, thank you for this video. It makes sense especially when you are short of money and space. I am a beginner wood worker looking to get into furniture making for a living, like you guy. I am just starting to buy good tools and I am trying to make wise decisions.

I use my miter saw all the time. Repeat cuts are easy with a stop block. My 12" Bosch with laser on a gravity stand takes up less room than my table saw plus the slide out wings support long boards. It's very portable as I've taken it in my trailer where I've installed trim, decks, framing etc. It is my most used corded power tool in an collection of table saw, belt sander stand, lathe, band saw, circular saw, trac saw, drill press, jointer and planer. Back when I first started woodworking, one of my first buys was a miter saw. Table saws and circular saws can be dangerous if you don't use proper techniques, which beginners don't get. I know a guy who lost three fingers with a circular saw (hand placed behind the saw as it kicked back) and another person who's finger was lost using a table saw (no guard). Tough to do on a miter saw, unless your trying to lose fingers.