I have been have been playing this for almost a year now with some of the guys at my wargames club. We all downloaded the free pdf and got started really quick, the last time we played D&D was about 8 years ago. ( That was an all drow campaign. Which ended in a large tabletop battle. ) i agree the torch mechanic is great fun....but also the xp only for gold changes the game a lot. And rolling to cast spells ! We are now around level 6 . We are having fun with it.

@NerdLNerd

6 ай бұрын

Awesome that it got you guys back into the hobby!

I thought I was the only one who was a sucker for a bookmark ribbon. Good to know that I’m not alone.

I agree about the annoyance my table experience with resource management.

thanks for a suggestion of a book you love for more than art (XDM)

@NerdLNerd

Ай бұрын

That book changed my entire perspective on running games!

Putting the weapons on the inside covers is a far better use of the space. That's the stuff you're going to need to access during a session. Also, I've read this book once, and I don't need to access the rules anymore, because we all know the rules. She simplified 5e to make it more like 1e, but the rules are a known entity. Why would you be reading rules in the middle of a session anyway? I've been playing D&D since 1981, and I've tried to figure out how to make 5e playable for a long time. Kelsey did exactly what I thought about and never acted upon, and she made it work. This is 5e for Old School games. It does exactly what it's supposed to do, and it does it well.

@NerdLNerd

6 ай бұрын

Thanks for the feedback. To each their own I say! I prefer the inside cover layout of games like OSE and Mork Borg. As a DM I reference procedure constantly during a session and I’ve grown accustomed to having that quick access. I have yet to find any game that is “perfect” and tend to take bits and pieces from everything I read and use it at my table.

Big agree. I use Shadowdark consistently for the encounter tables and the art. But for that type of game, I prefer and borrow actual mechanics from 5 Torches Deep and Lamentations of the Flame Princess.

@StoryboardsbyStuffPOP

6 ай бұрын

I do think that ~10 months and periodic PDF updates is relatively a very quick delivery for a Kickstarter. I forget what the original goal date was, tho, and if it was "late."

@NerdLNerd

6 ай бұрын

I think this may the INDY gateway for those 5e players coming over to Shadowdark. They’ll realize there’s a great big world of awesome games.

@AceneDean

6 ай бұрын

Are the random tables better than Knave 2e?

@StoryboardsbyStuffPOP

6 ай бұрын

@@AceneDean I use both. Shadowdark has good encounter tables that are more put-together than Knave and have a lot of personality. Knave's are more "encyclopedic," I might say.

@AceneDean

6 ай бұрын

@@StoryboardsbyStuffPOP awesome! Thanks. I might have to pick this up then.

The free Gm and Player guides live in my travel kit...very nice small rpg with monsters and equipment and rules and spells *everything you need) for vacation travel.

@NerdLNerd

5 ай бұрын

That’s a great idea!

Honestly, I think the criticism that Shadowdark doesn't offer anything new or innovative is unfair, because the creators have never claimed to be offering anything new or innovative. The pitch of Shadowdark is "Old School Gaming, New School Rules", and the goal as far as I understand it is essentially streamlining the OSR experience with the use of more "modern" TTRPG mechanics (e.g. ascending AC). That streamlining of OSR games *is* the innovation of Shadowdark. Other than that I liked your review :) One thing that does confuse me though: if Carousing is the main way to spend gold, what do you do if you want your character to not be an alchoholic binge-drinker? 😂

@NerdLNerd

6 ай бұрын

Thanks so much for the feedback! Admittedly I am at a place in my DM journey where I take a bit of everything from every game I buy. I suppose its made me a bit apathetic when it comes to rule sets.

@ScottBaker_

6 ай бұрын

I agree. I've been at this for so long that I look at all of the stuff that people say is so great and go, "That's not new," or, "I can do/have done that myself." Just like they say about Shadowdark. That said, I like Shadowdark. I'm not affiliated with it except as a backer. I also have shelves of other games and encourage everyone to play what suits them. And to play lots of different games to figure out what they like.

@oscardunn8060

6 ай бұрын

@@NerdLNerd Yeah that’s fair enough, I can totally understand where you’re coming from. I’m a newish DM myself so I’m more easily intrigued I guess haha.

@rjbarnett1116

6 ай бұрын

Getting new to OSR players playing DCC or OSE is not easy. Getting them to play ShadowDark is super simple. You can change the game mindset without making it a completely new game. I think that was the goal. OSE isn’t new either, it’s a clone. And it’s cool, but honestly, those mechanics are terrible, they’re the 1st or second try at playing this game. Why do we have so many tables? Save tables, AC tables, skill tables…. Just to learn what your bonuses are. You have to read about what classes get what bonuses or limitations, it takes so long to just play. I think that’s what’s good about SD, make a character and play in like 5 minutes. It’s more than a rules lite system, but it still keeps that speed. But you can easily go a lot deeper also.

@AceneDean

6 ай бұрын

This just makes it sound like a worse Knave 2e...

I generally agree with you. The book looks beautiful and is well organized, for the most part, with concise page spreads, optional rules, roll tables, etc.; but as you also pointed out, there's very little here that's new or innovative. I already have and play games like OSE, DCC, and The Black Hack 2e, so ShadowDark was offering me virtually nothing that I didn't already have (and some things that I didn't want). The target audience that would most benefit and enjoy this game RAW is 5e players looking for a more 'old school' experience. (And what a great recommendation of XDM - such a great, game-altering book!)

@NerdLNerd

6 ай бұрын

Couldn’t have said it better myself!

One needs not ever to run a game as it. Shadowdark is the game I was already hacking toward it before I saw it. So it's the second D&D retro-clone I have and will ever need with Old School Essentials. I will be running one shot with Shadowdark and the campaign I will be discussing which style of play the players want at session 0, with both books. In any system I run, I always hack the fighter class with d6+2 instead of d8 for HP's. I will also only be using B/X healing rules while playing Shadowdark.

@NerdLNerd

4 ай бұрын

I couldn’t agree more. My game is a mix of basically everything I’ve ever read. I’ve even been known to roll death saves on occasion. Thanks for the comment!

I kind of disagree with you about the end paper usage in the book. If I'm gonna play a game (particularly one light on rules), I'm going to know the basic rules of the game. I'm gonna know how to do combat and have people determine initiative order and things like that. What I want in those quickly accessible end papers then would be the stuff I *don't * constantly use. Which means that Kelsey's choices for end papers are not perfect, but things like weapon prices are more in line with what I'd put there than a random name generator. Especially since I've got one on the GM screen. I think you're right that Shadowdark is a good intro game for people who haven't played a TTRPG before (far better than 5E is honestly) and a good intro to a more old-school style of play for people coming from 5E. But I have pretty much decided that Shadowdark is THE game I'll run from now on because I'm not going to need the book aside from session prep and a couple of those laminated cards. And the DM screen which is amazing, of course.

@NerdLNerd

5 ай бұрын

Thanks for the comment! I think I had high hopes for this game and it fell a bit short for my personal taste. I am still happy to own the book and will take little bits and pieces from it.

you don't like managing torches, but saying it matches real world time suddenly made it fun enough to do? This doesn't make sense. You could just say a torch lasts for one delve or a torch lasts for one vertical level or anything... its still just a tick mark on a resource where the reality of simulating how long it would "really last" is abstracted to something easy to note just occurred.

@NerdLNerd

Ай бұрын

I just thought the real world torch burn was a neat mechanic that I had never seen before. I take little things from most things I read and use them in a big home brew system that’s ever changing. Thanks for the the feedback and comment!

VERY nice read through. We have our copy too and frankly anyone who wants it can have it for the cost of shipping. What is NEW in this game? Timers? NO see ICRPG what DC's have any relationship to the capabilities of the player characters?...NONE and we would argue that there is no relationship to OSE or most OSR (of the D and D milieu) where ability rolls etc are 'roll under' and rely on the development of the player character and not the machinations of a DM's 'vindictiveness' or morbidity/wish for TPK's. The ART is superb and the simplicity of layout is almost insulting for anyone with more than half a brain, but has to be good for new players as an introduction. Chaosium BRP Universal system -(skill based too so roll under) is our ttrpg of choice. All this said, thank you for your in depth analysis of the game which will surely help further the ttrpg hobby. Stay well, stay safe, Helen with Katarin Juska-Law and Terri with Robyn (Eastern UK Fenlands) Subbed too BTW - nice balanced Channel with much interesting content.

@NerdLNerd

5 ай бұрын

Thanks for the feedback and the sub!

@commandershepard9920

6 күн бұрын

If it's still available for shipping only I'll take it, heh.

@helenandKatarinjuska-law3351

6 күн бұрын

@@commandershepard9920 Am sorry but it went withing hours of my post. Helen and Katarin Juska Law, stella and Terri with Robyn

@commandershepard9920

5 күн бұрын

@@helenandKatarinjuska-law3351 Oooh, so close! Ah well, thanks anyway!

I hate that real time torch mechanic so much. I don't want to worry about my torches burning out if I have to use the restroom or get a drink of water. I don't want to feel like I'm wasting time if I'm trying to think of a plan. I vastly prefer Knave 2e's hazard-die mechanic. Great video though. Someone needed to combat the hype.

@NerdLNerd

6 ай бұрын

I will have to check out that Knave mechanic. I’m a kickstarter backer and just waiting on the book. I’ll admit I’m not a PDF guy. Thanks for the support 🙏🏻

@AceneDean

6 ай бұрын

@NerdLNerd Same! I've been using a self-printed copy of the PDF, but I cannot wait to have the real book in hand. PDFs are a great backup, but they just aren't what I want to run a game with.

@NerdLNerd

6 ай бұрын

@@AceneDean agreed

Shadowsdark is fine. But not very ambitious for sure.

@NerdLNerd

6 ай бұрын

Very well put. I expected more.

Shadowdull; aka yet another set of house rules cribbed from other, superior games. Amazing so many people fell for this.

Lame review. Next time play 10 - 20 game sessions before you give your 2 cents.

@NerdLNerd

2 ай бұрын

valid point but after running countless games on other systems, you can tell when something doesn’t reinvent the wheel

@TheWizard10008

2 ай бұрын

@@NerdLNerd I don’t think it’s trying to reinvent the wheel. It’s 5e BASIC. It’s streamlined some of the basic mechanics of crunchier systems like 5e and focused on ease of play reminiscent of old school fantasy. I’ve played numerous systems as well (started in 1978) and having recently gone to GaryCon and played some pretty basic OSR type games, I realized how unnecessary and muddy the newer editions of D&D, PF2e, Hero etc are. The crunch doesn’t necessarily make for a better game. And in the quest for the next best shiny thing, newer editions of well establish systems and gimmicky kickstarters have really lost sight of what makes for fun narrative game play. In my opinion, Shadow Dark has managed to upgrade old-school gaming without overly fancy concepts or unnecessary crunch that slows the fun down, all while maintaining the flavor we all generally love along with the breadth of a more advanced system at the same time. It’s done this in a deceptively simple yet effective way that I think is easily overlooked and underestimated. Play with a GM who loves the system and I imagine it will grow on you. That’s my two cents.